John Lennon committed suicide...

[dc1971]

I had a discussion many years ago with a friend of mine (lets call him Bob for the sake of anonymity) about John Lennon and the recording of the Double Fantasy album. At a point in our discussion, Bob says "How did John Lennon die?" Of course my answer was Mark Chapman shot him 7 times in the back right outside of his apartment building. To which Bob tells me "No, he killed himself."

Bob went on to tell me that he wrote a research paper in high school that "proved" how he killed himself. Some of what he told me was rather compelling however Bob had something to learn about how to "prove" something if he's going to make such a bold claim.

There were a few things he pointed out to me such as in the song "Just Like Starting Over" you hear a indecipherable distorted voice appear toward the end of the song (Yoko?). Bob told me that was a voice saying "John Lennon will die on December 8, 1980". To this day, no one really knows for sure what the distorted voice is saying.

Bob also told me that the Double Fantasy album was compiled so that Yoko's songs would follow John's and if you listen to the context of each song it's as if they're arguing with each other (I agree with this part of his claim - read the lyrics to each song on Double Fantasy - Yoko seems rather bitter). Bob told me that their marriage was not going well at this point and it's possible Yoko was even thinking of divorcing John and this was devastating to him. Thus, reason for him to commit suicide.

So I ask why would John go through the trouble of writing an album saying he's going to kill himself, hire an assassin, put his family through such grief and misery, pay out all of this money to have his death publicized when all he had to do was just commit suicide? I even asked these questions to Bob and he really did not have an answer.

I also asked Bob how he thinks a big name like John Lennon, who knows a lot of people and is a connected personality in the name of entertainment would be able to keep such a thing secret? It just doesn't make sense!

So now I ask the JREF - Has anyone else ever heard this particular conspiracy theory?

[MG1962]

no

[Greediguts]

That's a negative Ghost Rider.

[dc1971]

However, writing up this thread influenced me to break out my vinyl copy of Double Fantasy and listen to "Starting Over"... that voice toward the end of the song is rather spooky! However, for the life of me I cannot figure out what is being said!!!

[MG1962]

However, writing up this thread influenced me to break out my vinyl copy of Double Fantasy and listen to "Starting Over"... that voice toward the end of the song is rather spooky! However, for the life of me I cannot figure out what is being said!!!

Its an airline announcement

[dc1971]

Its an airline announcement

That's what I told Bob.

[MG1962]

That's what I told Bob.

I just checked with John, bit of a wait on the Ouija board but got through eventually. He was also a bit suprised Larry King retired, but other than that he seemed pretty happy

[dc1971]

I just checked with John, bit of a wait on the Ouija board but got through eventually. He was also a bit suprised Larry King retired, but other than that he seemed pretty happy

Tell him that I'm sorry about not really digging his music until 1989!!

[BobHaulk]

i think John Lennon killed Mark Chapman but before he did it he swapped bodies like that film Big. He was sick of being famous,you can tell this is true because if you play Cold Turkey backwards Lennon clearly says i want to be free, a line he also sings on the Queen song of the same name. You can tell that Queen really are the Beatles. Mcartney faked his death and returned as the bass player in Queen. Just ask George Harrison he'll tell ya. Oh he's not dead either he plays the ginger guy in CSI spin off show Miami Vice

[MysteryMammal]

i think John Lennon killed Mark Chapman but before he did it he swapped bodies like that film Big. He was sick of being famous,you can tell this is true because if you play Cold Turkey backwards Lennon clearly says i want to be free, a line he also sings on the Queen song of the same name. You can tell that Queen really are the Beatles. Mcartney faked his death and returned as the bass player in Queen. Just ask George Harrison he'll tell ya. Oh he's not dead either he plays the ginger guy in CSI spin off show Miami Vice

Psh. What a load of crap. Everyone knows that George Harrison is Susan Boyle. The ginger on CSI is Mike Nesmith of the Monkees. Geez. :rolleyes:

[Dave Rogers]

So now I ask the JREF - Has anyone else ever heard this particular conspiracy theory?

No, but as soon as dvictr reads this he'll believe it's all true.

Dave

[applecorped]

A better conspiracy would have Yoko planning to have John killed because he was thinking about getting the Beatles back together.

[timhau]

Wake up sheeple! Suicide by a deranged Holden Caulfield fan -- how much more obvious can you get?

[BobHaulk]

A better conspiracy would have Yoko planning to have John killed because he was thinking about getting the Beatles back together.

More like he was gonna have her killed to prevent her screaming over any more of his tunes but Chapman was a **** shot and hit him instead.

[dc1971]

A better conspiracy would have Yoko planning to have John killed because he was thinking about getting the Beatles back together.

The butchered babies album cover explains it all. John Lennon was fascinated with death!

[dc1971]

Psh. What a load of crap. Everyone knows that George Harrison is Susan Boyle. The ginger on CSI is Mike Nesmith of the Monkees. Geez. :rolleyes:

I thought the Ginger on CSI is the same Ginger from Gilligan's Island? :D

[CptColumbo]

Let me guess, Paul and Ringo wrote "A Catcher in the Rye."

[timhau]

Let me guess, Paul and Ringo wrote "A Catcher in the Rye."

They did, and it's full of subliminal messages. Take the beginning, for example:

If you really want to hear about it, the first thing you'll probably want to know that John Lennon is a jerk John Lennon is a jerk is where I was born, and what my lousy childhood was like, and how You must kill him kill kill kill my parents were occupied and all before they had me...

[Macgyver1968]

I think Yoko Ono possibly has the most annoying voice on the planet..too bad the shooter didn't shot her.

(WARNING: Please remove all animals and children from the room before clicking link...also have your mouse positioned over the "close" button to prevent hearing damage)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GMHl7bmlzw

[CptColumbo]

Let me guess, Paul and Ringo wrote "A Catcher in the Rye."

They did, and it's full of subliminal messages. Take the beginning, for example:

Or maybe John wrote it for Ringo.

[Alferd_Packer]

I think Yoko Ono possibly has the most annoying voice on the planet..too bad the shooter didn't shot her.

(WARNING: Please remove all animals and children from the room before clicking link...also have your mouse positioned over the "close" button to prevent hearing damage)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GMHl7bmlzw

There's also a tape floating around of Linda Mcartney singing back up on "Hey Jude."

[applecorped]

There's also a tape floating around of Linda Mcartney singing back up on "Hey Jude."


Singing?!? You're way to generous.

[dc1971]

I think Yoko Ono possibly has the most annoying voice on the planet..too bad the shooter didn't shot her.

(WARNING: Please remove all animals and children from the room before clicking link...also have your mouse positioned over the "close" button to prevent hearing damage)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GMHl7bmlzw

I will probably hear about this later, but... I actually think Yoko's material on Double Fantasy is better than John's!

[fromdownunder]

John definately commited suicide. The guilt he felt about being part of the cover-up to Paul's death in 1966 finally got the best of him, and he cound not go on any longer.

Norm

[AnnoyingPony]

BAHAHA no.

My dad thinks he was killed by an assassin who was brainwashed by MKULTRA.

[dc1971]

John definately commited suicide. The guilt he felt about being part of the cover-up to Paul's death in 1966 finally got the best of him, and he cound not go on any longer.

Norm

It wasn't Paul who died in 1966, IT WAS JOHN!! There are a lot of clues that "prove" this! You notice how on the Sgt Pepper album, John grew a moustache, started wearing glasses, lost a lot of weight and later on grew his hair? Well that's because that was not really John Lennon! The Beatles had a contract to fill so they found someone who looked, acted, sounded, and was even as great of a musician as John to stand in and fulfill their obligation as a band.

Think about it, the death of John finally led to the Beatles break-up, and the doppelganger gets assassinated 10 years later which finally puts to rest any talk of the Beatles reuniting nor will anyone find out that John Lennon was not really John Lennon!

:D :p ;) :) :rolleyes:

[Dog Town]

Let me guess, Paul and Ringo wrote "A Catcher in the Rye."

Nope! W. Axl Rose did. Minus the "A" of course.

[beren]

This is reminding me of "The Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul"

[Dog Town]

There's also a tape floating around of Linda Mcartney singing back up on "Hey Jude."

Reminds me of an old joke.

What's a dog with wings?

[zaphod2016]

in the song "Just Like Starting Over" you hear a indecipherable distorted voice appear toward the end of the song (Yoko?). Bob told me that was a voice saying "John Lennon will die on December 8, 1980". To this day, no one really knows for sure what the distorted voice is saying.

Here's a TED talk from Michael Shermer. The whole thing is excellent, but skip ahead to about 9:30 for the relevant section (the Led Zeppelin example).

8T_jwq9ph8k

I love hidden messages in songs, back-masking, etc. And having wasted more time than I care to admit searching for hidden truths in the lyrics of 70's rock albums, I can say with confidence that 99% of these things really are simple weirdness for the sake of being weird. Either total coincidence, or a musician playing around with the new technology of the day.


Bob also told me that the Double Fantasy album was compiled so that Yoko's songs would follow John's and if you listen to the context of each song it's as if they're arguing with each other


Makes sense.


Yoko was even thinking of divorcing John and this was devastating to him. Thus, reason for him to commit suicide.


Here you lose me. I'm afraid of losing my wife, so I kill myself? It would be one thing if she actually divorced him, but this sounds a bit extreme to me. John Lennon had already survived one divorce by that point, would he really consider suicide in response to a potential divorce that hadn't even initiated yet?

I fight with my wife sometimes, sometimes I even make songs about it. I do that as opposed to getting violent or self destructive. I'm no John Lennon, but I'd imagine its not too different- using music to cope with different pain so that we can resist the urge to jump off the roof sometimes.

What your friend is suggesting- he was so distraught that even after making the album he still couldn't resist suicide- hard to buy.


So I ask why would John go through the trouble of writing an album saying he's going to kill himself, hire an assassin, put his family through such grief and misery, pay out all of this money to have his death publicized when all he had to do was just commit suicide? I even asked these questions to Bob and he really did not have an answer.


So Bob thinks Lennon hired Chapman? Well, that makes more sense than explaining how Lennon shot himself in the back several times.


I also asked Bob how he thinks a big name like John Lennon, who knows a lot of people and is a connected personality in the name of entertainment would be able to keep such a thing secret? It just doesn't make sense!


Nope. Not much sense at all.

You lose me at motive.

Interesting theory, had not heard this one before.

[I Ratant]

It wasn't Paul who died in 1966, IT WAS JOHN!! There are a lot of clues that "prove" this! You notice how on the Sgt Pepper album, John grew a moustache, started wearing glasses, lost a lot of weight and later on grew his hair? Well that's because that was not really John Lennon! The Beatles had a contract to fill so they found someone who looked, acted, sounded, and was even as great of a musician as John to stand in and fulfill their obligation as a band.

Think about it, the death of John finally led to the Beatles break-up, and the doppelganger gets assassinated 10 years later which finally puts to rest any talk of the Beatles reuniting nor will anyone find out that John Lennon was not really John Lennon!

:D :p ;) :) :rolleyes:
.
I'd heard one producer found a near-as-dammit lookalike for John Beatle... unfortunately named Mark Chapman. Bummer...

[I Ratant]

...
So Bob thinks Lennon hired Chapman? Well, that makes more sense than explaining how Lennon shot himself in the back several times.
...
.
Any number of unfortunate blacks have been found trying to escape captivity by swimming across rivers and lakes carrying concrete blocks chained to the body, in the Deep South.

[shalomsteph]

I think Yoko Ono possibly has the most annoying voice on the planet..too bad the shooter didn't shot her.

(WARNING: Please remove all animals and children from the room before clicking link...also have your mouse positioned over the "close" button to prevent hearing damage)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GMHl7bmlzw

I love how the audience is trying really hard not to laugh.

[Gypseagirl]

I have never heard of this conspiracy.

[dc1971]

I have never heard of this conspiracy.

I only ever heard this conspiracy from ONE person ever in my life before sharing it here on JREF!

[Howie Felterbush]

I had a guy once tell me that "Frampton Comes Alive!" was recorded entirely in a studio and the audience sounds were added later.

Oddly enough, his name was Bob.

[Brainster]

I love how the audience is trying really hard not to laugh.

After listening to that, the suicide theory starts to make sense.

[Aitch]

I have never heard of this conspiracy.

Neither had I. Mind you, I did hear of a 'Jimi Hendrix was murdered' story recently; not new - according to a Hendrix obsessive friend of mine it's also known as the 'wacked for the insurance money' theory. :eek:

[Alareth]

No no no no no.

It was Stephen King. (http://www.lennonmurdertruth.com/)

[Gypseagirl]

Neither had I. Mind you, I did hear of a 'Jimi Hendrix was murdered' story recently; not new - according to a Hendrix obsessive friend of mine it's also known as the 'wacked for the insurance money' theory. :eek:

I hadn't heard that one. I need to move from under the rock i've been under:p

[Aitch]

I hadn't heard that one. I need to move from under the rock i've been under:p

More (off-topic) info (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/news/hendrix-murdered-by-his-manager-says-former-aide-1693583.html) for you. Should you want it. :eye-poppi

[CptColumbo]

No no no no no.

It was Stephen King. (http://www.lennonmurdertruth.com/)

I love the letter Stephen King wrote to him. You can just hear King letting out a long sigh before begining.

[Accidental Martyr]

No no no no no.

It was Stephen King. (http://www.lennonmurdertruth.com/)

I read about two pages of that. Now my head hurts.

[Black Hole]

This is no different than the "Paul McCartney is dead" conspiracy. Such silly things people believe in.

[Accidental Martyr]

This is no different than the "Paul McCartney is dead" conspiracy. Such silly things people believe in.

This a good book about the Paul McCartney death hoax.
The Walrus Was Paul - R. Gary Patterson
http://rgarypatterson.com/_the_walrus_was_paul__19662.htm

[dc1971]

After listening to that, the suicide theory starts to make sense.

Well this could split off into another thread but I thought I'd go ahead and address the Yoko bashing for a moment here.

During several interviews throughout the 70's, John expressed his opinion of Yoko's art and how she fit into his style of songwriting. To most people, Yoko's style is rather annoying yet they forget that that's what rock music is all about. It's not about conforming to sounding like Chuck Berry or Little Richard necessarily. Yoko's whole intention was to annoy, irritate, and maybe even anger some of her audience.

This is how art works. Certain styles are meant to invoke certain emotions. Most people think that art is only supposed to be pleasing to the eyes or in the case of performance art (which is Yoko's trade) it should be pleasing to the eyes and ears. Not so!

As I mentioned previously, the material that was written by Yoko for the Double Fantasy album is music I find to be more palatable to my tastes than John's material. The same reason I like Yoko's material is the same reason I'm a fan of punk rock (incl. proto-punk, and post punk along with the many subgenres), there's something different going on when you listen. There's an obnoxious sound followed by some obnoxious or even out-of-tune vocals that just add to the downright nastiness of the song. Yoko's music on Double Fantasy has that "post-punk" appeal to it. As well, I can see where Bjork got some of her early influences from.

[dc1971]

I hadn't heard that one. I need to move from under the rock i've been under:p

If there is any theory that might hold water it's that Allen Klein killed John Lennon basically for the same reason he allegedly killed Brian Jones. Once Allen Klein has your soul, you cannot back away! I don't buy the theory but it would probably make a good movie!

BTW, Allen Klein has been dead for quite some time now!

[bumlet5]

No no no no no.

It was Stephen King. (http://www.lennonmurdertruth.com/)

I saw this guy on the freeway today on my way back from San Diego. Once I Googled the website I knew there had to be a thread about it. His van was packed to the brim with stuff. It looked like he lives out of it, which wouldn't surprise me from what he says on the website. It was almost as bad (both crazy and poorly laid out) of a website as the Time Cube page.

[BaaBaa]

There's also a tape floating around of Linda Mcartney singing back up on "Hey Jude."

I have this. As horrifying as it is to hear, I have also heard it was fake.

[BStrong]

No no no no no.

It was Stephen King. (http://www.lennonmurdertruth.com/)

Beat me to it.

I have met the CT'er in question, and he was/is a whole sack o' nuts.

[Myron Proudfoot]

Its an airline announcement

So John Lennon knew about 9/11?? OMG!11!!! Injide Jbo! This is HUGH! ;)

[BazBear]

I have never heard of this conspiracy.
Same here. Just when I thought I'd heard everything...but with the CTists imaginations (delusions?) I should know better than that by now.

No no no no no.

It was Stephen King. (http://www.lennonmurdertruth.com/)
Wow...just wow. :tinfoil