The Guardian: Bad Science vs. Far Out, and strange paranormal claims

[Tanja]

Since I moved to the UK two months ago, I have been enjoying the geeky "Life" supplement in the Guardian on Thursdays. I especially enjoy, of course, the "Bad Science" (http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/badscience/) column by Ben Goldacre, where he debunks various dodgy products and claims.

But, what surprises me, then is that just a page or so later there is the "Far out" (http://www.guardian.co.uk/life/farout/) column by Mark Pilkington. It is about "mysteries" in science an human knowledge, for example ancient batteries and near death experience.

This week's column (April 29th, the link I provided is to whichever is the newest weekly column) is about Russian and Ukranian people who can "make large metal objects stick to their bodies". The column starts as following:

Since 1987, one year after the Chernobyl disaster, 76-year-old Russian factory worker Leonid Tenkaev, his wife Galina, their daughter Tanya and grandson Kolya have all been able to make metal objects stick to their bodies. Leonid can hold individual objects weighing up to 23kg on his chest.

Doctors in Russia and Japan appear to have been convinced that the Tenkaevs' abilities are genuine. "There is absolutely no doubt that the objects stick as if their bodies were magnetic," an impressed Dr Atusi Kono told reporters in 1991.

I don't know if this field of paranormal has been investigated by Randi or discussed on this forum, but it sounds to me like something that might be eligible for the 1 million dollar prize.

What I find unusual is that there is no disclaimer, no mention of skeptical viewpoint on the subject, no suspicion about it whatsoever. So these two columns exist side by side in the same newspaper.

Anyone hear reads these columns and noticed how different in approach they are? Anyone knows anything more about the people who hold large metal objects on their chests?

[RichardR]

I know what you mean. I once emailed the Bad Science guy with an example of bad science from the Far Out guy's column. He didn't publish it.

[geni]

IT's been investigated. IT's due to unuals skin propeties that make flat object stick to the skin more effectivly than they would for most people.

[JimTheBrit]

Boy, this one's been around since the year dot. Research has found, oddly, that normal talcum powder exhibits powerful SkeptoNegaVibes that inhibit these 'magnetic' abilities. It wouldn't surprise me if the JREF classify claims of this kind under 'N' for 'No longer considered'.

[Tanja]

Originally posted by RichardR
I know what you mean. I once emailed the Bad Science guy with an example of bad science from the Far Out guy's column. He didn't publish it.

:)

I was tempted to do just the same! I might still send him an e-mail about this week's Far Out...

[Tanja]

Bumping my own little thread, hoping it will generate some more interest!

[Ed]

Dr Atusi Kono indeed.

Why is it that these creduloid doctors all seem to come from some malarial third world country? Japan, Sumatra, same thing. I suppose that they shop Dr's till they find one that is impaired.

Incidentially, Tanja (If that is your real name, somehow I doubt it) the best way to keep a thread going is to introduce Jews, guns, Uri Geller or Lucianarchy into the discussion.

What you might have reported is something like:

"Noted Zionist Jew and anti-semite, Uri Geller, was back in the news today. He claims that thru the power of his mind he is able to bend an AK-47 and make it adhere to noted creduloid Lucianarchy. Doctors are baffeled. Local Neuromagnitist Dr. Apu Panjeeret says "I don't know, by the name of our many armed Gods, how such a thing is possible." The Home Secretary, commenting on the arrest of M. Archy said "We whiney effete Brits will not have anything even remotely resembeling a firearm adhering to anyone".

This, dear heart, is how to write a post.:D

[Tanja]

Originally posted by Ed
Dr Atusi Kono indeed.

Incidentially, Tanja (If that is your real name, somehow I doubt it)

He he. What do you think my real name might be?

"Noted Zionist Jew and anti-semite, Uri Geller, was back in the news today. He claims that thru the power of his mind he is able to bend an AK-47 and make it adhere to noted creduloid Lucianarchy. Doctors are baffeled. Local Neuromagnitist Dr. Apu Panjeeret says "I don't know, by the name of our many armed Gods, how such a thing is possible." The Home Secretary, commenting on the arrest of M. Archy said "We whiney effete Brits will not have anything even remotely resembeling a firearm adhering to anyone".

If I had the skill to write posts like that I would not be reading the Guardian, I would be writing for the Daily Mail or the Sun.

[Exposer]

This would be very easy to debunk. I suggest putting the Tenkaev family in contact with the JREF. :D

[Goshawk]

What I find unusual is that there is no disclaimer, no mention of skeptical viewpoint on the subject, no suspicion about it whatsoever. So these two columns exist side by side in the same newspaper.

Anyone hear reads these columns and noticed how different in approach they are?
Well, yeah, but the Guardian is in the business of selling newspapers, not Fighting Ignorance and Spreading The Light Of Knowledge, and obviously they've found a formula that allows them to sell more papers. Kind of like Neapolitan ice cream.

[Tricky]

Another question about this "personal magnetism". Do only ferromagnetic objects stick to them? What about trying it with something that looked like it ought to be ferromagnetic, like a copper plate that had been painted to look like iron. I'll bet that would stick too!

[Tanja]

Originally posted by Tricky
Another question about this "personal magnetism". Do only ferromagnetic objects stick to them? What about trying it with something that looked like it ought to be ferromagnetic, like a copper plate that had been painted to look like iron. I'll bet that would stick too!

According to the author of the article, not all objects that stick are metallic:
Although people with the gift are usually referred to as magnets, many of them can also hold plastic, glass, wood and paper objects, with some stating preferences for specific materials.

The author actually thinks that the explanation is not magnetism, but telekinesis! Without a trace of skepticism. Since when is telekinesis a scientific fact? I would be interested in a magician's explanation of the "human magnet" phenomenon.

And in answer to Goshawk's comment: :( I know the Guardian is only selling newspapers, but the columns are in their Science supplement. I would expect them to be at least a little critical.

[JimTheBrit]

Originally posted by Tanja
I would be interested in a magician's explanation of the "human magnet" phenomenon.Would a psychologist's investigation be an acceptable substitute? Swift vol. 1 no. 1 (http://www.randi.org/pdf/swift1-1.pdf), pages 10 & 11, 'The Human Magnets'

[Tanja]

Thanks, Jim, sometimes I am just lazy to look myself!

(Now I know that in order to be a human magnet it helps to have sticky hands and a big belly!)