PDA

View Full Version : Conformity research question, Thanks in advance


Skeptic Ginger
17th December 2011, 10:44 AM
I'm looking at conformity from the aspect of the group that exerts the pressure, not from the aspect of the person who conforms and I'm having no luck with a dozen different search strings. Everything retuned regardless of how I've been wording the search has been about why people conform or why they give in to peer pressure. What I'm looking for is why do the peers exert pressure?

I can guess, but I'd like other points of views from researchers.

Anyone have any sources or suggestions what to search for?

Thanks

Childlike Empress
17th December 2011, 10:57 AM
Maybe Collective narcissism?

Skeptic Ginger
17th December 2011, 11:52 AM
That's great, there's a ton of stuff on that page I can use or launch from.

Childlike Empress
17th December 2011, 12:05 PM
Nice, good luck with your research.

The following paragraph reminded me of inflationary accusations of "trolling" on a certain forum with a certain prevalent mind-set. ;)

It is common for narcissistic ingroups to have an unstable high group self-esteem. Because of this instability, narcissistic groups are especially prone to perceived negativity towards themselves. The members of a narcissistic ingroup are likely to assume threats or negativity towards their ingroup where threats or negativity were not necessarily implied or exhibited. It is thought that this heightened sensitivity to negative feelings towards the ingroup is a result of underlying doubts about the greatness of the ingroup held by its members. These perceived threats result in a damaged collective self-esteem, which is associated with increased intergroup aggression.

jiggeryqua
17th December 2011, 12:22 PM
Nice, good luck with your research.

The following paragraph reminded me of inflationary accusations of "trolling" on a certain forum with a certain prevalent mind-set. ;)

A 'certain' forum not a million cyber-miles from this one? ;)

Childlike Empress
17th December 2011, 12:23 PM
:p

Skeptic Ginger
17th December 2011, 12:56 PM
I'm not sure there isn't a different dynamic to the frequent perception a post is a personal attack when it may not necessarily be the case. There's something about the written word and no face to face contact to dampen the exchange that I think is also a variable.

People do have some innate need to be believed. I'm convinced a lot of people falsely claiming first hand knowledge of an urban myth is the result of wanting to be believed. That probably carries over into wanting people to believe you are right in a debate.

Ryokan
17th December 2011, 01:04 PM
Nice, good luck with your research.

The following paragraph reminded me of inflationary accusations of "trolling" on a certain forum with a certain prevalent mind-set. ;)

Stop trolling!

:)

jiggeryqua
17th December 2011, 01:09 PM
I'm looking at conformity from the aspect of the group that exerts the pressure, not from the aspect of the person who conforms and I'm having no luck with a dozen different search strings. Everything retuned regardless of how I've been wording the search has been about why people conform or why they give in to peer pressure. What I'm looking for is why do the peers exert pressure?

I can guess, but I'd like other points of views from researchers.

Anyone have any sources or suggestions what to search for?

Thanks

I am, by the by, sincerely interested in any results or conclusions of your research. I've always viewed the topic from the point of view of the conformer, to ask why we are expected to conform is one of those obvious inversions that we generally remain blinded to.

Elaedith
17th December 2011, 01:23 PM
I'm looking at conformity from the aspect of the group that exerts the pressure, not from the aspect of the person who conforms and I'm having no luck with a dozen different search strings. Everything retuned regardless of how I've been wording the search has been about why people conform or why they give in to peer pressure. What I'm looking for is why do the peers exert pressure?

I can guess, but I'd like other points of views from researchers.

Anyone have any sources or suggestions what to search for?

Thanks

In standard conformity research 'the group' does not necesssarily deliberately exert any pressure. It might be more productive to look for material on behaviour toward deviant ingroup members.

Childlike Empress
17th December 2011, 02:29 PM
I'm not sure there isn't a different dynamic to the frequent perception a post is a personal attack when it may not necessarily be the case.


Accusations of "trolling" are not the same as accusations of "personal attacks", we are on the collective level here.

Stop trolling!

:)


QED. ;):D:)

gumboot
17th December 2011, 02:32 PM
I'm looking at conformity from the aspect of the group that exerts the pressure, not from the aspect of the person who conforms and I'm having no luck with a dozen different search strings. Everything retuned regardless of how I've been wording the search has been about why people conform or why they give in to peer pressure. What I'm looking for is why do the peers exert pressure?

I can guess, but I'd like other points of views from researchers.

Anyone have any sources or suggestions what to search for?

Thanks



The only thing I can think of like that is specifically with regard to warcrimes, as covered in "On War: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society" by Lt Col D. Grossman.

It covers the dynamic by which the warcrime group pressures new members to participate in their warcrimes. The same dynamic is supposed to function in organised crime groups as well.

Basically, as I understand it, the logic is that the non-offending new arrival highlights the crimes of the group by their own lack of crime. So the group forces the new arrival to offend to reinforce the group's distorted world view that the offending is OK. Leaving a non-participant in their midst would force them to confront what they've done, which is incredibly psychologically damaging.

theprestige
17th December 2011, 05:03 PM
Basically, as I understand it, the logic is that the non-offending new arrival highlights the crimes of the group by their own lack of crime. So the group forces the new arrival to offend to reinforce the group's distorted world view that the offending is OK. Leaving a non-participant in their midst would force them to confront what they've done, which is incredibly psychologically damaging.

"The logic is..."? Why not, "the research shows..."?

Anyway, I can think of another logical reason to make sure the new guy offends as soon as possible: it makes him an accomplice. There's no good reason for a group of criminals to be accompanied by an innocent witness to all their criminal enterprises.

Skeptic Ginger
17th December 2011, 09:54 PM
In standard conformity research 'the group' does not necesssarily deliberately exert any pressure. It might be more productive to look for material on behaviour toward deviant ingroup members.I'll try some different search strings with that in mind but if the group is reacting to the deviant how is that not the group 'necessarily' deliberately exerting pressure? It may not be with overt awareness but it is definitely deliberate.

But regardless the suggestion looks useful. Thanks.


Edited to add, I still come up with what the group does and how the deviant reacts. I don't get anywhere with 'why' the group behaves thusly and that's the same problem I had before.

For example, I did find this:The authors predicted that derogation of group deviants depends on the extent to which in-group norms or values are validated or undermined in a social context. In Experiment 1 participants were less tolerant and derogated in-group deviants more when other in-group members opposed the norm. In Experiment 2 participants derogated in-group deviants more than out-group deviants and than noncategorized individuals, but only when normative in-group members lacked uniformity. In Experiment 3 participants derogated in-group deviants more when there was uncertainty about in-group superiority. These results are consistent with previous research on the black sheep effect (J. M. Marques, V. Y. Yzerbyt, & J. -P. Leyens, 1998) and with the model of subjective group dynamics (D. Abrams, J. M. Marques, N. J. Bown, & M. Henson, 2000; J. M. Marques, D. Abrams, D. Paez, & C. Martinez-Taboada, 1998). (PsycINFO Database Record (c) 2010 APA, all rights reserved)So the dynamic and the what are revealed, but still not the why or the initial motive.


Edited to add again, I am finding different search strings so following this lead is productive after all. Thanks.

Skeptic Ginger
17th December 2011, 10:00 PM
The only thing I can think of like that is specifically with regard to warcrimes, as covered in "On War: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society" by Lt Col D. Grossman.

It covers the dynamic by which the warcrime group pressures new members to participate in their warcrimes. The same dynamic is supposed to function in organised crime groups as well.

Basically, as I understand it, the logic is that the non-offending new arrival highlights the crimes of the group by their own lack of crime. So the group forces the new arrival to offend to reinforce the group's distorted world view that the offending is OK. Leaving a non-participant in their midst would force them to confront what they've done, which is incredibly psychologically damaging.Not what I'm looking for. I'm looking for motive and you've described a generated motive.

For example, if kids make fun of an outcast or exclude other kids that aren't like them, I'm looking for the psychological reasons behind it. I can imagine creating an us against them allows some of the kids to get status from the relationship. But I'd like something more than just my speculation.

Gender role conformity is one thing I'm looking at. Why do the girls put pressure on masculine girls to be feminine and why would guys put pressure on feminine guys to conform? Why do they need to pound the nails down in order to feel better about their own pounded nail?

Skeptic Ginger
17th December 2011, 10:18 PM
Bingo!

"Shared judgmental norm"