The Nicholas Berg Conspiracy Theory Thread

[Mr Manifesto]

Nicholas Berg Conspiracy Theory (http://marc.perkel.com/archives/000233.html)
15 Anomalies Surrounding the Death of Nick Berg (http://www.rense.com/general52/anom.htm)
More on the Killing of Nick Berg (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2004/5/16/15271/7374)

To me, it's easier to believe that Nicholas Berg was decapitated as a 'publicity stunt', to draw attention to the cause of insurgents/terrorists/cause d'jour in Iraq. I am prepared to accept he may have been dead prior to the decapitation.

However, my understanding of the issue is only from what I've read in news articles, left-leaning blogs, and conspiracy sites such as the above. I know others using this forum may have come across other information/theories/rebuttals on the Nicholas Berg decapitation.

So, this thread is meant to be a discussion- was Berg killed by terrorists, or someone else?

[Nasarius]

We'll probably never really know. Just like the bin Laden video (http://www.awitness.org/news/december_2001/osama_nose_job.html) where the guy looks nothing like bin Laden...

[American]

Perhaps he was a CIA agent or other informant of sorts.

[Fordama]

This will be the next burgeoning internet conspiracy topic. While there may be some legitimate questions, some of the "anomalies" are quite amateurish.

For instance, do people really feel that the Unitied States is the only nation capable of figuring out that bright orange jumpsuits are a great way to mark a prisoner. Must be our great technological advantage.

I saw the videotape. For an alledged dead guy, he sure struggled pretty well.

Oh, and who are these "Videotape cognoscenti" the author of the website refers to? I've done a little bit of editing myself, and if they did dub it in they did a great job matching the quality with the rest of the audio.

Not to mention, if one was going to dub a tape in such a way, why on earth would they dub it with a woman's voice?

I swear sometimes people like that website's author don't read what they write!

Fordama

[Mr Manifesto]

The first website I posted had a few choice bloopers. One of them being, "Muslims are forbidden from wearing gold rings". Yet the photo he posts of Danny Pearl has a Muslim wearing... A GOLD RING! HOW ABOUT THAT?!?

But thanks for your input, Fordama, it's precisely that sort of input that I'm looking for. I haven't read American's post, but I suspect it may be an example of what I'm not looking for.

Oh, and Nausarius, I was thinking just as I hit 'submit' when I posted this thread that we'll probably never know 'for sure' unless they either manage to capture those involved, or the 'conspirators' come forward.

[Nasarius]

Originally posted by Fordama
This will be the next burgeoning internet conspiracy topic. While there may be some legitimate questions, some of the "anomalies" are quite amateurish.

For instance, do people really feel that the Unitied States is the only nation capable of figuring out that bright orange jumpsuits are a great way to mark a prisoner. Must be our great technological advantage.

I saw the videotape. For an alledged dead guy, he sure struggled pretty well.

Oh, and who are these "Videotape cognoscenti" the author of the website refers to? I've done a little bit of editing myself, and if they did dub it in they did a great job matching the quality with the rest of the audio.

Not to mention, if one was going to dub a tape in such a way, why on earth would they dub it with a woman's voice?

I swear sometimes people like that website's author don't read what they write!

Fordama

Hm, good points. I'd still say that the lack of blood and the al-Zarqawi inconsistencies are indicators that something is not quite right.

[peptoabysmal]

I find it intriguing that Berg was running loose around Iraq with an Israeli stamp on his passport, that his email address was used by one of the 9/11 terrorists, that he had no equipment or degree for telecommunications work and that Berg's father belongs to A.N.S.W.E.R.

I just have more questions than answers about Berg right now without even considering the conspiracy theories.

- edited to remove weird character gremlin. must have unwittingly done a magic key combo.

[a_unique_person]

Those white chairs are everywhere, I can buy some here for you, if you want. They also come in a 'garden green' too.

[richardm]

Yes, Muslims never wear gold rings. Never. Nope.

http://www.repubblica.it/online/esteri/settembresei/virtuale/storico003194fdcxw200h165c00.jpg

Squint, squint. Perhaps it's silver.

And those are supposed to be bulletproof vests, are they? I think not. Qwality interpretation, there.

[shemp]

Manny, even I have to say, I think you've lost your marbles.

[Jocko]

I refuse to weigh in until KOA shares his views of this diabolical coverup. I know when I'm outclassed on a subject.

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by shemp
Manny, even I have to say, I think you've lost your marbles.

Good gravy, et tu Shemp? Did you read my frickin' OP??? :mad:

[Mr Manifesto]

Well, okay then, maybe it wasn't that clear. I'm not buying into the conspiracy theories, I'm going for the more mundane line that he was killed by terrorists or whatever. I used the term 'publicity stunt' because of the manner in which they killed him. I mean, if they wanted to discourage contractors, why not just kill him and leave him in the street?

[shemp]

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto


Good gravy, et tu Shemp? Did you read my frickin' OP??? :mad:

Yeah. My assessment has nothing to do with this thread. :D

[Mr Manifesto]

Is that right, shempy boy? Let's see how they like your rapier wit on the moon...


<marquee=left>http://www.computerpannen.com/cwm/contrib/blackeye/AR15firing.gif :D</marquee>

[hammegk]

One of the first thoughts I had when the beheading hit the newswires was: How conveeenient and well timed; Mossad? or CIA? or ???.

j/k, sorta ....

[Ladewig]

We'll probably never really know. Just like the bin Laden video where the guy looks nothing like bin Laden...


Yeah. I noticed that when it first came out and I don't understand why it was so readily accepted.

[Brian]

Am I to understand that there is not a great deal of blood in the video? That would seem odd. Is there anything to this at all?

[UnTrickaBLe]

Originally posted by Brian
Am I to understand that there is not a great deal of blood in the video? That would seem odd. Is there anything to this at all?

What? There is a huge purple puddle spreading under his neck area when they saw off his head.

[Jeff R]

A few weeks ago, by accident, I saw a report on ESPN about an NHL hockey goalie who's carotid artery was severed by the skate of another player. The guy lived, but you wonder how. He lost a tremendous amount of blood in just a few seconds after the accident. Really very horrific, and I'd rather not have seen it at all.

I don't have the nerve to watch the Nick Berg video myself. Could someone who did see it comment on the amount of blood, or lack of it?

From news reports I had gathered that Berg was forced to make some statements on camera just before he was killed. Did I get this wrong? If he did make statements, were the statements and killing in one single video segment or were they separate shots spliced together?

[HarryKeogh]

sadly, morbid curiosity got the better of me and I watched the video last week. After it was done I wished I hadn't. It is horrible. It is quite clear in the video that Nick Berg is alive and well and seconds later his head was sawed off. Plenty of blood and struggling. Again, if you havent seen it don't. I felt pretty cheap and ashamed that I used someone's death to fulfill my curiosity.



These conspiracy theories are so ridiculous. Obviously they were started from deep within the Democratic party (probably under orders from Kerry himself) to make Bush look bad.

pssst, yeah...I'm being ironic.

[Brian]

Originally posted by HarryKeogh
sadly, morbid curiosity got the better of me and I watched the video last week. After it was done I wished I hadn't. It is horrible. It is quite clear in the video that Nick Berg is alive and well and seconds later his head was sawed off. Plenty of blood and struggling. Again, if you havent seen it don't. I felt pretty cheap and ashamed that I used someone's death to fulfill my curiosity.



These conspiracy theories are so ridiculous. Obviously they were started from deep within the Democratic party (probably under orders from Kerry himself) to make Bush look bad.

pssst, yeah...I'm being ironic.
You don't need to feel bad. That curiosity is normal. I got all the way to downloading it, watched five seconds of him talking, and quit. I doubt seeing it would do me any good.

[Fordama]

Originally posted by UnTrickaBLe


What? There is a huge purple puddle spreading under his neck area when they saw off his head. I saw that too. Makes me wonder why people are saying there wasn't a lot of blood! People don't spray blood like you see in Kill Bill or like the Black Knight in The Holy Grail.

Fordama

[UnTrickaBLe]

Let me knock a few of these softballs out of the park... :D


15 Anomalies Surrounding
Death Of Nick Berg
What Really Happened.com Letters
5-14-4

Zaraqawi was missing one leg and had been outfitted with an artificial leg that did not fit or function properly. He was unable to walk or stand normally with his ill-fitting limb. No man in the group showed evidence of such an infirmity.

Maybe he got a new one? :rolleyes: People can and do run marathons with artificial legs.


Numerous indigenous sources have said Zaraqawi was killed by a US helicopter attack months ago when he was unable to move quickly enough to escape the targeted house. While others managed to exit the house in time to survive, he died in the collapsed building.

I guess he has been issuing threats and carrying out his terror plots from the grave, then? How is Zarqawi continuing to issue AUDIO TAPED THREATS (http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=520406) if he is dead?


As any surgeon will testify, the alleged beheading was a fake. A beheading would result in a tremendous amount of spurting blood. There would have been blood everywhere had an actual beheading taken place. When the executioner holds up Berg's head immediately following what is represented as an actual decapitation of a living person, there is no significant blood flow from the neck or blood splatters showing anywhere on the executioner. Furthermore, the cut was simply too neat to have been done crudely and with such amazing speed by a man wielding a knife. Anybody who has ever carved a turkey knows there is something wrong with the supposed beheading. The suspended head looks more like Berg had been neatly beheaded by a guillotine.

Totally FALSE.

No significant blood?? You've got to be kidding me! There is blood EVERYWHERE... (graphic photos)...

http://www.620ktar.com/pics/simons/beheading/mark5.jpg

In this one, the man is standing in a huge pool of blood.

http://www.620ktar.com/pics/simons/beheading/mark6.jpg

For anyone who has ever seen a Muslim Eid celebration, they always slaughter a goat or cow, and it looks and sounds EXACTLY like this video.


The orange jumpsuit was standard US military issue to men in custody. It is unlikely Berg would have continuing wearing a US custodial uniform if he had been released by the military as they claim. The fact he was still wearing the suit is both anomalous and suggestive. One is forced to speculate as to whether there was an immediate transfer of Berg from the US military to unknown persons, thusly preventing Berg from discarding his US prison garb.

Or maybe these kidnappers just bought an orange suit and made him wear it? Maybe they thought the jumpsuits were humiliating or something? Who knows.


Several of the men in the film were fat by Iraqi standards. If they were Feyadeen or mujahadeen, they probably have been living underground since the first days of the occupation. Tens of thousands of Iraqis have been shown on news stories as they have marched and demonstrated. One would be hard pressed to point out a single fat man among these thousands.

Another laughable attempt. These men are specifically NOT Iraqis. They are foreign Al Qaeda terrorists.

Living "underground" keeps you skinny? No fat Islamic militants? Tell that to Sheikh "Ron Jeremy" Khalid Mohammed, the Al Qaeda 911 planner who was caught hiding in Pakistan.

http://www.foxnews.com/images/83349/4_21_mohammed_khalid_shaikh.jpg

:rolleyes:


Some men had what can only be described as pasty-white hands. Once again, one would be hard pressed to find Arab men with pasty-white hands.

This is just flat out wrong. The hands are not any whiter in these photos than in any other showing Al Qaeda terrorists. They must have only had 14 "anomalies," so they had to toss this turkey in to make it a better-sounding number. :rolleyes:


The lack of spurting blood suggests Berg was already dead at the time of the alleged decapitation. It is possible Berg's dead body was displayed with his head already partially or totally severed. In any case, he almost certainly was killed before the staged beheading. If so, it suggests the captors had no stomach for an actual beheading of a living person, and they opted to fulfill their assignment quietly and with the least amount of gore.

False. This is exactly what it looks like when people cut the throats of animals like cows and goats. Does blood spray on people's faces when they kill an animal to eat it? No. It just runs onto the ground, exactly as it does in this video.

http://eny.dioceseny.org/0303/afghan2.jpg


The scream that is heard has been interpreted as a woman's scream by many viewers. Videotape cognoscenti have further said the scream was amateurishly added to the tape.

No hard evidence of any kind is presented here.


The U.S. government translation of one statement made on the film is: "Does al Qaeda need any further excuses?" This is a falsification. The actual statement urged fellow insurgents to get off their hind ends and do something. One assumes the translator being used by the US military is a native speaker of Arabic, so this cannot be explained as an innocent flub. This suggests the US government wanted to inject an alleged al- Qaeda group into the murder of Nick Berg.

Mistranslation? I suppose it's possible, but has nothing to do with the beheading taking place.


Iraqis who have seen the videotape on Arabic news broadcasts are universally saying the men in the film are not Iraqis. Are they saying this partly because the speaker does not employ an Iraqi dialect? Where does their certainty come from?

Of course it's not Iraqis. These are Al Qaeda terrorists. Another "anomaly" that is no anomaly at all.


Firearms experts have stated the AK-47 carried by one man was a "Gilal." This actually is an Israeli-made weapon that improves on the famous AK- 47. Feyadeen and other insurgents almost universally use AK-47s.

These are not "Feyadeen" (sic) or insurgents, they are Al Qaeda--not Iraqis.


The man in the videotape who is purported to be Zarqawi is wearing a gold ring. This is absolutely proscribed by Islamic law.

:rolleyes:

http://sic.sapo.pt/images/articles/3764/kadafi.450x378.jpg

http://www.mathematik.net/homepage/islam/jihad4.jpg

http://www.september11news.com/Nov3OsamaTVSpeech.jpg

OWNED.


As for the "military issue" chair, that looks like the chairs in my backyard. More like "Wall-Mart" issue.

This is one of the most pathetic conspiracy theories I have ever seen. Not even a single point stands up to scrutiny.

[Fordama]

Fine post, UnTrickaBLe.

Fordama

[Mr Manifesto]

No sockpuppets in my thread, please.

[peptoabysmal]

Originally posted by HarryKeogh
sadly, morbid curiosity got the better of me and I watched the video last week. After it was done I wished I hadn't. It is horrible. It is quite clear in the video that Nick Berg is alive and well and seconds later his head was sawed off. Plenty of blood and struggling. Again, if you havent seen it don't. I felt pretty cheap and ashamed that I used someone's death to fulfill my curiosity.


These conspiracy theories are so ridiculous. Obviously they were started from deep within the Democratic party (probably under orders from Kerry himself) to make Bush look bad.

pssst, yeah...I'm being ironic.

The mainstream Democratic party isn't that far removed from reality yet. Some of these things just take on a life of their own.

[Nasarius]

Totally FALSE.

No significant blood?? You've got to be kidding me! There is blood EVERYWHERE... (graphic photos)...

I retract my earlier comment. I only watched the video briefly (after reading this stuff) and really didn't want to look too closely...I missed the pool of blood on the floor.

[Questioninggeller]

Off topic, but oh well:

I just got an email from a good friend who is in the Air Force stationed over seas. The email said, "Don't know if you've seen this, but here." It was a video of the Berg execution, which I did not watch because I have no interest in seeing someone be killed.

What strikes me is this friend, who was never interested in current events nor politics, sent me this email outraged at "those people." He reads no news, watches TV, and reads no books, yet feels Bush is doing the right thing. I guess my friend view is limited by the spectrum of how he views his choices.

You send that guy something anti-Iraq war, and he writes back, "Fu*k that guy. I don't want someone's opinion who knows nothing." So one can tell, we don't discuss politics, but I just hope his limited view isn't what makes up the majority of the U.S. forces.

[Skeptical Greg]

Originally posted by Questioninggeller

.......................

You send that guy something anti-Iraq war, and he writes back, "Fu*k that guy. I don't want someone's opinion who knows nothing." So one can tell, we don't discuss politics, but I just hope his limited view isn't what makes up the majority of the U.S. forces.

Last time I checked, U.S. Service personel don't get to pick and choose their wars...

[demon]

From The Sidney Morning Herald...it's the first I've seen in the mainstream querying Berg`s death.

quote:
Who killed Nick Berg?
May 29, 2004

Page Tools
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Conspiracy theories about how the kidnapped American died in Iraq are flying around the world. Richard Neville explores the explanations.

Iraq in flames, Washington an object of disgust. What to do? At this pivotal moment, CNN and Fox News are tipped off to a clip of an American citizen being beheaded. The victim is a 26-year-old idealist from Pennsylvania, Nick Berg. Despite the perpetrators being masked, the vile deed is deemed the work of al-Qaeda.

The clip was first "discovered" on an Islamic website in Malaysia. Its Arabic title reads "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi shown slaughtering an American". al-Zarqawi is a 38-year-old Jordanian militant who fled to Iraq in 2001 after reportedly losing a leg in a US missile strike. al-Zarqawi's face is widely known and he credits himself with the deed, so why a mask?

The timing of the video was brilliant for the West. Media pundits judged the crime a deeper evil than the systemic torture of innocent Iraqis. But some people sensed a rat. But if it was not al-Qaeda, who? Surely not Uncle Sam. That's too dark, even for the CIA.

While this video shows a human body having its head chopped off, it does not necessarily portray an act of murder. Berg's headless body was found dumped on a Baghdad roadside on Saturday, May 8.

Three days later, the "live beheading" clip was uploaded from London to the Malaysian website http://www.al-ansar.biz. The statement in the video is signed with al-Zarqawi's name, dated May 11. After Fox News and CNN had downloaded the video, it disappeared from the site.

As no autopsy is available, little is known about the state of the body. No time of death, no forensic analysis. On April 6, a month before the discovery of the corpse, Berg had been released from custody. But whose custody?

Dan Senor, adviser to the US Presidential Envoy in Iraq, has said Berg was never held by the Americans. Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, the Coalition's deputy head of operations, claimed he was in the custody of Iraqi police from March 24 to April 6. However, the Iraqi police chief, Major-General Mohammed Khair al-Barhawi, told Associated Press "the Iraqi police never arrested the slain American".

Berg's family are certain his jailers were the US military. His father, Michael, had been told so by the FBI. He has produced an email from a US consular official in Baghdad, Beth Payne, confirming that his son was in the hands of the US. (Later, another official said this was an error.) On April 5 in the Philadelphia office of the US Supreme Court, the Berg family had launched an action against the US military for false imprisonment. The following day, Berg was released.

The issue of custody is significant; in his final moments on screen Berg is wearing an orange jumpsuit of the kind familiar from Guantanamo Bay. The official reasons for Berg's arrest were "lack of documentation" and "suspicious activities". He carried sensitive electronic equipment for which he lacked documents. In custody, he was visited three times by the FBI. Such interviews are bound to have been recorded but no transcripts have been produced.

After his release, Berg travelled to Baghdad and the $30-a-night Al-Fanar Hotel. A fellow hotel guest told Newsday that Berg recounted how Iraqi police had quickly handed him to US authorities in Mosul and that he had been held the entire time in a jail where his guards were US soldiers.

Berg was in Baghdad to win contracts for his family firm, Prometheus Methods Tower Service, a provider of communications facilities. He often "worked at night on a tower in the neighbourhood of Abu Ghraib", according to The New York Times.

The family last heard from him on April 9, when he said he was planning to leave Iraq via Kuwait as soon as it was safe. Berg was last seen walking with his bags the following day, apparently hoping to find his way through the turmoil engulfing the city and make it to the border.

On March 7, 2004, two weeks before his arrest in Mosul, an "enemies list" had been posted on a conservative website, Free Republic.com. The list was compiled from signatories to an anti-war petition, and its implied purpose was to encourage readers to harass those it named.

Berg's father was on that list, as was the family firm, Prometheus. This information may well have triggered the arrest of Berg in Iraq.

Berg's politics are not clear. His father, Michael, has described his son as a "staunch supporter" of US President George Bush. Friends said Nick believed he could help rebuild Iraq "one radio tower at a time". According to The New York Times, he was attracted to the Hebrew concept of tikkun olam - healing the world through social action.

The first few seconds of the video shows Berg sitting on a white plastic chair in an orange jumpsuit. He speaks directly to the camera in a relaxed way: "My name is Nick Berg . . . I have a brother and sister, David and Sara. I live in Philadelphia." His white chair is identical to those in the photographs of the Abu Ghraib prison tortures, but such chairs are probably common in Iraq. It is highly likely that this segment is edited from the interrogation of Berg during his 13 days of custody.

In the next scene, Berg is sitting on the floor with five masked figures standing behind him. We do not see the figures enter. Berg looks lifeless, though his body appears to make slight movements. A man reads a lengthy Arabic statement in a passionless monotone. He is identified as "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi", a Jordanian associate of Osama bin Laden who is tied to dozens of terrorist acts.

Yet a leaflet recently circulated in Falluja, by no means a reliable source, claims that al-Zarqawi was killed in the Sulaimaniya mountains of northern Iraq during a US bombing. A US military report last month has claimed al-Zarqawi was killed in the bombing of Falluja.

Also, the US Secretary of State, Colin Powell, has said that al-Zarqawi was fitted with a prosthetic leg in a Baghdad hospital, yet the tape shows no evidence of a limp. CNN staff familiar with al-Zarqawi's voice have been quoted as saying the voice does not sound like his.

Among the many curiosities raised on the web about the fanatical five are:

 They are well-fed, fidgety, and reveal glimpses of white skin.  Their Arabic is heavily accented (Russian, Jordanian, Egyptian).

 An aside in Russian had been translated as "do it quickly".

 One character wears wears bulky white tennis shoes.

 The man on the far left stands in the familiar "at ease" military posture.

 The men's scarves are worn and tied by people who "haven't a clue", says conspiracy theorist Hector Carreon, like actors in Hollywood movies.

 There is even a voice at the end that seems to ask in English, "How will it be done?" [ http://www.aztlan.net/nick-berg-how-done.htm]

None of this proves a grand conspiracy, but it does raise questions. In the final segment of the tape, Berg is thrown to the ground, but doesn't move. During the decapitation, starting at the front of the throat, there is little sign of blood. The scream is wildly out of sync, sounds female, and is obviously dubbed.

Dr John Simpson, executive director for surgical affairs at the Royal Australasian College of Surgeons, told Ritt Goldstein of the Asia Times, "I would have thought that all the people in the vicinity would have been covered in blood, in a matter of seconds . . . if it [the video] was genuine".

Simpson agrees with other experts who find it highly probable that Berg had died before his decapitation.

But there is still the problem of Berg's slight body movements while sitting on the floor, before the beheading. According to a blogger (internet diarist), Nick Possum, "this footage was subsequently modified frame by frame to make Berg's body move very occasionally". Apparently, this can be achieved with "commonly available software". [www.brushtail.com.au/nick-berg-hypothesis.html]

Possum believes "the available evidence surrounding the case suggests that it was a 'black operation' by US psychological warfare specialists . . . to provide the media with a moral relativity argument to counter the adverse publicity over torture at Abu Ghraib". The use of FBI footage in the opening sequence, if confirmed, suggests the involvement of high-level US Government operatives.

I do not know who killed Nick Berg, or how he died. But there's something fishy about this video.

In the end, the question is: who killed Nick Berg, and why?

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/05/28/1085641717320.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Fordama]

Originally posted by demon
From The Sidney Morning Herald...
None of this proves a grand conspiracy, but it does raise questions. In the final segment of the tape, Berg is thrown to the ground, but doesn't move. During the decapitation, starting at the front of the throat, there is little sign of blood. The scream is wildly out of sync, sounds female, and is obviously dubbed.
This "analysis" is so subjective and doesn't ring true to me. I suspect that the author didn't actually see the video but is using information given to him.

I thought Berg struggled, I didn't think the voice sounded dubbed and doesn't sound like a woman (not to mention the ridiculousness of dubbing in a female voice in the first place--what, none of the guys around could have figured out how to howl?)

I saw blood pooling on the floor and dripping from his head when they lifted it.

Fordama

[demon]

To be honest, this is not a subject that I have followed very closely but I have asked a few times if anyone knows if a post mortum has been carried out and if they actually found the head...I know they found the body.

I posted the above article mainly because I was intrigued that the mainstream press had finally got around to actually questioning the official line...doesn`t happen very often.

[SFB]

Originally posted by Diogenes


Last time I checked, U.S. Service personel don't get to pick and choose their wars...


Last time I checked, U.S. service personnel do get to pick and choose their opinions - informed or otherwise.

[HelPick2]

Nick Berg's couragous father said:

"Donald Rumsfeld said that he took responsibility for the sexual abuse of Iraqi prisoners. How could he take that responsibility when there was no consequence? Nick took the consequences."

"What cost my son his life was the fact the U.S. government saw fit to keep him in custody for 13 days without any of his due process or civil rights and released him when they were good and ready. It goes further than Donald Rumsfeld. It's the whole Patriot Act, it's the whole feeling in this country that rights don't matter any more because there are terrorists about. Well, in my opinion `terrorist' is just another word like `communist' or `witch' and it's a witchhunt and this whole administration is just representing something that is not America."

Of his son's involvement in the anti-war movement, Nick Berg's dad said: "It is something that I am not ashamed of. I am proud of it. I think stopping the war and ending racism are extremely important things that this world has to do right now. I am proud to be a member of ANSWER and I plan to be at the march on June 5. I know it is considered a radical group. But I want to ask: Radical as compared to what? The Bush administration? I'll be radical."

[HelPick2]

Originally posted by Fordama
This "analysis" is so subjective and doesn't ring true to me. I suspect that the author didn't actually see the video but is using information given to him.

I thought Berg struggled, I didn't think the voice sounded dubbed and doesn't sound like a woman (not to mention the ridiculousness of dubbing in a female voice in the first place--what, none of the guys around could have figured out how to howl?)

I saw blood pooling on the floor and dripping from his head when they lifted it.

Fordama
I never saw any of this, and I watched the video clip many times.

In the video, we see:

-the orange jumpsuit

-the yellow Abu Graib prison walls

-the government issue white plastic chair

- the miss-match between the face and the build of the man in the video and Bergs family's snap shots of their missing son.

-the men in black, fat and lazy, well-fed and insolent.

-the one on the far left standing at military parade rest.

-that this is a tape made with at least two cameras, one on standard time, one on the 24 hour clock.

-the light tone of the skin of the hands of some of the men.

-the wedding ring on the left hand, the sinister hand, the hand that Islam reserves for toilet functions.

-We notice the voices in the background not sounding like Arabs.

-We have read of the death last year of the man being blamed for doing this foul deed.

-We are aware that once you have someone's voiceprint, you can digitise it, and run it through a voice generating software program, and put any words into their mouths you want.

-We have heard native speakers of Arabic tell us that the voice on the tape does not have the accent they would expect from the man who is being blamed.

-I have seen other decapitation video clips. There were not "drips of blood". The amount of blood was most excessive; indeed I thought it surprising.

EDITED TO ADD:
Now, the U.S. can kill 10,000 "dirty arabs" and it is okay, nobody says anything; but when they kill just one yank, all the country takes his hands to the head, fill everything with american flags, freak out, and read Bible's passages to feel comfort. Hilarious!

[Fordama]

Originally posted by Ixabert

I never saw any of this, and I watched the video clip many times. You can even see it in the photographs posted earlier in this thread.
Originally posted by Ixabert

In the video, we see:

-the orange jumpsuit
So? Not something that is exactly too high-tech, too rare, and only of American origing.


Originally posted by Ixabert

-the yellow Abu Graib prison walls
No, you see yellowish walls. Not exactly an unusual or uncommon color.

Originally posted by Ixabert

-the government issue white plastic chair Government issue? It's patio furniture. Cheap patio furniture. I have the beige version of that chair. Made in China.

Fordama

[Nihilanth]

Now, the U.S. can kill 10,000 "dirty arabs" and it is okay, nobody says anything; but when they kill just one yank, all the country takes his hands to the head, fill everything with american flags, freak out, and read Bible's passages to feel comfort. Hilarious!

Um....I'm not sure if you're aware of this or not, but apparently there are a lot of people protesting the war and the killing of 10,000 "dirty arabs". In the US, even. In fact, considering how much of the public is against the war...I really don't understand you when you say "nobody says anything". Is this some kind of Bizzaro speech from Bizzaro world and, if so, can you teach us any of your technology?

Hello.