Airports give in to homeopathy

[Eos of the Eons]

http://www.homeowatch.org/policy/screening.html

This is outrageous! It is about time homeopathy was publicly denounced as the Scam that it is, and get the airports to stop wasting their time on crap.

the U.S. Transportation
Security Administration (TSA) has permitted passengers who fear that their medication will be damaged by x-ray screening to request that it be inspected visually instead.

Under the guise of "treat passengers with dignity".

Put up signs saying that the stuff has to work before considering giving it any special treatment. Or they have to prove that scanners and xrays ACTUALLY do affect it. Otherwise, it will be treated the same as any other 'treatment' substance like headache remedies (aspirin) and shoved through the scanner.

Where is the sanity????

[Benguin]

This is outrageous when they will not come up with a consistent policy on film scanning. There is actual evidence of the damage xray scanners can do to certain types of film prepared my the manufacturers of the same machines, no less.

Perhaps developing exploding homeopathy remedies would scupper this nonsense ....

[El Greco]

Hmmm... not that outrageous, I'd say. When Health Departments and State Prosecutors all over the world leave homeopaths undisturbed, it's not the airports' business to debunk them. Airports want calm and relaxed passengers and they couldn''t care less whether they are loons or woowoos.

[Benguin]

I'm not calm and relaxed when they've just put 40 rolls of pushed 1600 ASA colour trannies through the xray.

I take your point though. It's difficult to see how sugar pills and small water bottles will conceal something an x-ray will find.

[El Greco]

Originally posted by Benguin
I'm not calm and relaxed when they've just put 40 rolls of pushed 1600 ASA colour trannies through the xray.

Well, then I guess the problem lies in that skeptical photographers are less contending and fussy than sick woo-woos. :D

[geni]

Originally posted by Benguin
I'm not calm and relaxed when they've just put 40 rolls of pushed 1600 ASA colour trannies through the xray.

I take your point though. It's difficult to see how sugar pills and small water bottles will conceal something an x-ray will find.


Probably because the testing they did showed that modern machines din't affect photos to a noticeble degree

[Rolfe]

And anyone has done testing that shows that the machines affect homoeopathic remedies to any noticeable degree?

Wouldn't calm and happy photographer passengers be just as desirable as calm and happy homoeopaths?

Though really, I expect they just thought it was such a tiny request (not that many of these loonies about), and they didn't want to be sued if anyone then blamed the worsening of an illness on their scanners, so they just gave in.

The fact that this concession will be added to the list of "proof" that science recognises the validity of homoeopathic claims wouldn't even make it on to their radar screen.

Rolfe.

[richardm]

Originally posted by geni
Probably because the testing they did showed that modern machines din't affect photos to a noticeble degree

Aha, well, it's not as simple as that. In fact, airport X-ray machines can indeed fog film. It is likely to be most affected if it goes through the cargo scanning machine, that uses much more power than the carry-on machines, but now many airports are apparently upgrading to devices that use more concentrated X-rays to help automatically detect explosives in carry-on bags. Obviously if you're using 1600ASA then it's going to be even more susceptible, but any film can be affected.

Don't take my word for it, ask Kodak (http://www.kodak.com/cluster/global/en/service/tib/tib5201.shtml). It's one of the reasons I moved to Digital. Not worth the risk.

Edited to add: Just to be clear, the machines won't affect photos; it's unprocessed film that's at risk.

[Benguin]

Originally posted by geni
Probably because the testing they did showed that modern machines din't affect photos to a noticeble degree

Wrong. And the link to evidence has been given.

1600 ASA colour pushed one or two stops is very susceptible.

The policy they use is that normal holiday makers have (quite correctly) nothing to be concerned about. They are supposed to conduct hand searchs when requested to do so by someone with a justifiable reason.

In fairness about 50% of the officers, I found, were polite and complied with my request. The problem with the others wasn't just their refusal but their downright arrogance and refusal to check their own operating procedures when requested.

What I found most amusing was that the most stubborn and rude officer I ever encountered insisted on xraying my films and yet completely missed the large pocket knife I had forgotten I had in one of the pockets of my jacket. That was late in 2001, let's hope they've got their act together now.

[Benguin]

Originally posted by Rolfe
The fact that this concession will be added to the list of "proof" that science recognises the validity of homoeopathic claims wouldn't even make it on to their radar screen.


Sadly, I think you are right. I hadn't thought of that.

Airport security do not scan homeo remedies in case they damage them, therefore the authorities agree they must have some potency in the first place to be susceptible.

May be one of us should rush to patent a 'Homeo safe' xray machine on the basis we can prove it doesn't affect the efficacy one iota ....

[geni]

Originally posted by Benguin
Wrong. And the link to evidence has been given.

1600 ASA colour pushed one or two stops is very susceptible.

The policy they use is that normal holiday makers have (quite correctly) nothing to be concerned about. They are supposed to conduct hand searchs when requested to do so by someone with a justifiable reason.


Intresting. About ten years back they conclueded that the modern machines were not a problem. (by modern they meant those is the US and europe for the msot part).

[Capsid]

David Bailey reluctantly transferred from film to digital because he got tired of his films being fogged by airport X-ray machines. He couldn't be bothered to argue with the officials anymore.

[Benguin]

Originally posted by geni
Intresting. About ten years back they conclueded that the modern machines were not a problem. (by modern they meant those is the US and europe for the msot part).

The conclusion was accompanied by the caveat 'below 400ASA' IIRC.

[richardm]

Originally posted by Capsid
David Bailey reluctantly transferred from film to digital because he got tired of his films being fogged by airport X-ray machines. He couldn't be bothered to argue with the officials anymore.

Aye, me and David Bailey, so similar in so many ways :D

Funnily enough, Lord Lichfield was on the radio today, talking about digital and the decline of film. He says he hasn't taken a photograph on film in 5 years, which did surprise me a little, and that as a result the quality and quantity of his output has gone up. He also had something to say about the exciting new direction Olympus are taking with digital technology - plus ca change...! ;)

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

You can jostle those homeopathic preparations around in trucks until the cows come home, but don't run them through an X-ray machine!

~~ Paul

[wollery]

Surely all the gullible idiots (sorry homeopathic pill poppers) have to do is take a couple of pills out of the bottle and put them back in after the bottle has been through the x-ray scanner. The grafting effect will have potentised the rest of the bottle by the time they have to take their next dose, won't it?

:(

[Rolfe]

Originally posted by Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
You can jostle those homeopathic preparations around in trucks until the cows come home, but don't run them through an X-ray machine!Well, doncha know that's what the sugar pills are for?

As I understand it, Hahnemann believed that it was possible to make a remedy too potent, by over-succussing it.A long experience and multiplied observations upon the sick lead me within the last few years to prefer giving only two shakes to medicinal liquids, whereas I formerly used to give ten.(As an aside, how this squares with the modern practice in some homoeopathic pharmacies of using an electrical vortex mixer I really don't know. These things produce a very vigorous agitation of the liquid. And so close to an electric field/current, too!)

Anyway, H. was concerned that further shaking of liquid remedies in transit could be dangerous by making them too powerful. So he had the idea of "fixing" the potency by dropping the liquid remedy on a sugar pill and letting it evaporate. Why on earth he should have imagined that the virtue of the magic water would be thus retained and preserved I have no idea, but there you go. So, if the products are in sugar pill form, trucking them around should be perfectly safe.

Rolfe.

[anonimouse]

Do homeopaths allow their remedies to be checked as baggage? If so, aren't they worried that contents from other people's luggage will graft onto their preparations and contaminate them somehow?

[Benguin]

If Xrays can magically nullify the magic water how about various other normal devices with evil 'rays' eminating from them?

Bar code scanners
Store security scanners (the pillars by the doors)
Mobile phones
Remote keys for cars
Burglar alarm movement sensors
TV/CRT radiation
Microwaves
Magnets
Radio receivers

I see a fun game, here ...

[Deetee]

Maybe you've just come up with the explanation as to why the wonderful, curative homeopathic meds fail all independent tests - no-one controlled for all possible EMR sources...

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

And don't even let's get started about homeopathic users who live under high-tension wires. It's just too scarey!

Benguin, I think I see the fun game, too. "Uh, ma'am, are you sure you want to let the cashier run that preparation under the barcode scanner?"

~~ Paul

[LostAngeles]

Obvious Joke Time:

When I saw the thread I figured it had to be a health plan bit. After all, I've brought my water through airport security plenty of times.

RIMSHOT

[marting]

I once traveling about 20 years ago with a briefcase which had a 3 ring notebook and linear calipers tucked away such that the juxtaposition created an image of a largish weapon. After X-raying it, they immediately had me stand way over to the side, called all the other nearby guards, then asked permission to open the briefcase. With puzzled expressions, they removed folders with papers and the notebook, briefly glanced at the calipers in a sleeve, and carefully repacked it identically. Then, they passed it through the machine again. Same result. After about ten more minutes with no progress (they hadn't let me near the machine so I had no idea st first what concerned them), I suggested they X-ray the briefcase without the notebook inside. Suddenly it no longer looked like a gun and we were on our way.

Since then I've thought about puting lead foil smiley faces inside book covers just for the entertainment value. Never did though and after 9/11 it might have brought more than smiles and wouldn't have been very amusing.

[Soapy Sam]

I bought a bottle of water at Heathrow in August. I think it had told in it, to judge by the price.

I do wonder what the security men expect to detect when visually examining a vial of water. Essential gullibility?

[Rolfe]

"gold"?

Rolfe.

[Zep]

Ahem. Ladies and Gentlemen. The next steps are plainly obvious if you will just step outside the box for a moment.

Since the scanning procedures involving "treating passengers with dignity" seem to allow anything with the adjective "homeopathic" attached to be passed by visual inspection alone, demand the following concessions in order. As each one is granted, move on to the next:

1) Homeopathic film - must be inspected visually and NOT passed thru X-ray.

2) Homeopathic briefcases - ditto.

3) Homeopathic weapons - ditto.

4) Homeopathic pipe-bombs - ditto.

The nonsense will collapse on itself shortly thereafter.

[Eos of the Eons]

Thing is, if xrays are soooo damaging to magic water, those aspirin in my suitcase must surely be at risk. I must take those out first...now where did I stash those? Not this pocket, or this one, or ...

Oh, and my exzema cream that I put in the other smaller suitcase, and....

Are you sure those nasty xrays won't linger in my suitcase after??


Heh, writing article on how xrays within 100 km of homeopathic remedies drastically reduce their effectiveness. Thus, one must take the bus from now on.

[Benguin]

Well given woos seem to think the mere presence of a sceptic will intefere with their 'science' surely my just being near the potions risks nullifying them?

I think I should perform the moral duty of informing shopkeepers as I leave that their homeo remedies over there will now be destroyed and re-stocked because I unwittingly wandered near them.

I wonder if they'd start paying me not to come in their shops?

[Zombified]

Originally posted by Benguin
I think I should perform the moral duty of informing shopkeepers as I leave that their homeo remedies over there will now be destroyed and re-stocked because I unwittingly wandered near them.
I'm picturing going into a homeopathic shop wearing a shirt reading "SKEPTIC" in big letters and wandering the aisles glaring balefully at the merchandise...