Teen Found After 8 Days In Wrecked Car;Thank Volunteer's Dream;Mother Already Gave Up

[LostAngeles]

Thankfully, that wasn't CNN's headline. (http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/10/11/wa.found.alive.ap/index.html)

...
Sha Nohr, whose daughter is a friend of Hatch, found the teen Sunday in a wooded area, where 200 volunteers had searched unsuccessfully the day before.

She said she had dreamed about a wooded area and went out to look Sunday with her daughter.

Along the way, Nohr said, she prayed: "I just thought, 'Let her speak out to us."' She barely managed to discern the wrecked car in some trees after climbing over a concrete barrier and down an embankment.
...

"We had already given her up and let her be dead in our hearts," the girl's mother, Jean Hatch, told KOMO-TV.

Really, which pisses me off more, I can't say.

[Grammatron]

The Volonteer found her earlier didn't tell anyone went back to claim all the glory.

[Regnad Kcin]

A "wooded area?" In the northwest U.S.? Whoa!

[jj]

Originally posted by Regnad Kcin
A "wooded area?" In the northwest U.S.? Whoa!
Trees? Here? That couldn't be!

I'm glad the person is found. I just find the excuses, well, annoying. It's how you find anyone who's lost, by luck.

[armageddonman]

Last week I found our cat, 8 days after he vanished. He was trapped in a shed but luckily he survived without any lasting damage. He's very skinny now, though.

Before we found him, my girlfriend called a pet "psychic" (actually it was cold reading, what else?) and he told her our cat was living happily with some other family and that he had wandered off because he didn't feel appreciated enough. After that, my girlfriend wanted to stop looking for him and if I had stopped, he would be dead by now.

Not many things are worse than giving people false hope.

Don't know if this really relates to the topic but I thought I might share it.

[Grammatron]

Originally posted by armageddonman
Last week I found our cat, 8 days after he vanished. He was trapped in a shed but luckily he survived without any lasting damage. He's very skinny now, though.

Before we found him, my girlfriend called a pet "psychic" (actually it was cold reading, what else?) and he told her our cat was living happily with some other family and that he had wandered off because he didn't feel appreciated enough. After that, my girlfriend wanted to stop looking for him and if I had stopped, he would be dead by now.

Not many things are worse than giving people false hope.

Don't know if this really relates to the topic but I thought I might share it.

I hope this incident taught your girlfriend just what kind of charlatans these "psychics" are.

I'm glad your cat is ok :)

[RSLancastr]

Originally posted by armageddonman
Before we found him, my girlfriend called a pet "psychic" (actually it was cold reading, what else?) and he told her our cat was living happily with some other family and that he had wandered off because he didn't feel appreciated enough.You should call him and tell him what really happened. Start the conversation with something like "Listen up, you fraudulent sack of crap..."

[Art Vandelay]

Originally posted by LostAngeles
Thankfully, that wasn't CNN's headline. (http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/10/11/wa.found.alive.ap/index.html)



Really, which pisses me off more, I can't say.
What pisses you off?

[thaiboxerken]

It's amazing that people will attribute their investigative instinct to "Gawd" or psychic phenomena.

"Nohr said something drew her to stop and clamber over a concrete barrier and more than 100 feet down a steep, densely vegetated embankment where she barely managed to discern the wrecked Toyota Camry in some trees."

I'm sure the concrete barrier has some marking of an accident on it. I bet that there are other physical clues that can be seen from the road as well.

[LostAngeles]

Originally posted by Art Vandelay
What pisses you off?

The "ooh she had a dream" and the "We figured she was dead" attitude. It just seems, well, premature for a parent to give up hope that quickly. It's pragmatic, yes, but... it seems out of character to me for a parent.

[JPK]

A few things to keep in mind about this story.

1. The girl was last seen at a party.

2.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[i] from CNN

The initial search was slowed because there had been underage drinking at the party, and the young people who attended would not say where it had been held, sheriff's Sgt. John Urquhart said.

On October 6, detectives learned the party had been in a neighborhood east of Lake Washington and searched along her likely route home, Urquhart said. But prospects dimmed as the days passed.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So while the police were stalled from the start...


3.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[i] from CNN

Sha Nohr, a church member and mother of a friend of Hatch's, said she had dreams of a wooded area and heard the message, "Keep going, keep going."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Humm. Is it possible this friend of the girl knew about the where this party was held? Perhaps told her mom instead of police? That could have not only given this women a location to search but a 4 day head start.

4. Besides for sounding like the parents gave up pretty early, there is this...

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[i] from CNN
family and friends indicated "the most likely scenario was that she was a runaway."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

There is more to this story that will never come out. That is of course it is featured on a respectable investigative show like Psychic Detectives. [/sarcasim]

JPK

[Art Vandelay]

Originally posted by thaiboxerken
It's amazing that people will attribute their investigative instinct to "Gawd" or psychic phenomena.

"Nohr said something drew her to stop and clamber over a concrete barrier and more than 100 feet down a steep, densely vegetated embankment where she barely managed to discern the wrecked Toyota Camry in some trees."

I'm sure the concrete barrier has some marking of an accident on it. I bet that there are other physical clues that can be seen from the road as well.
I don't see anything in that quote ascribing the events to supernatural powers. Perhaps she was, but just from that quote it looks like you're leaping to conclusions. Of course, there's a lot of people who would leap instead to the conclusion that there were supernatural powers involved, and it seems to me that your real beef is with those who foster this sort of mindset. "Intuition" is often used as a codeword for "physic abilities", but that doesn't mean we should attack everything ascribed to intuition.

[thaiboxerken]

They eluded to dreams and prayer as being keys to finding the girl.

[Art Vandelay]

Yes, but was there anything supernatural about how dreams and prayers helped them? We skeptics need to get over our aversion to these sort of things, and take them back from the woo-woos. Fact is, prayers and dreams do sometimes help, and insisting that that they don't just reduces our credibility.

PS It's "alluded".

[armageddonman]

Originally posted by Grammatron
I hope this incident taught your girlfriend just what kind of charlatans these "psychics" are.

It did. At last. :)

[Renfield]

Originally posted by Art Vandelay
Yes, but was there anything supernatural about how dreams and prayers helped them? We skeptics need to get over our aversion to these sort of things, and take them back from the woo-woos. Fact is, prayers and dreams do sometimes help, and insisting that that they don't just reduces our credibility.

PS It's "alluded".

"We" skeptics need to get over our aversion to prayer and dreams helping?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA.

Pause. Deep Breath.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Sure, maybe we need to get over our "aversion" to creationisim, miracles, John Edward, etc too while we're at it.

I hope there was some irony intended in your post, and it just got lost in the typing, as is sometimes the case on the "internets".

[Art Vandelay]

Originally posted by Renfield
"We" skeptics need to get over our aversion to prayer and dreams helping?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA.

Pause. Deep Breath.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Sure, maybe we need to get over our "aversion" to creationisim, miracles, John Edward, etc too while we're at it.

I hope there was some irony intended in your post, and it just got lost in the typing, as is sometimes the case on the "internets".
This is just the arrogant attitude that puts people off skeptics. How are prayer and dreams the same as creationism? The latter is by definition supernatural, while the former are not. Should we ignore Kekulé's insight into the structure of benzene because it came to him in a dream?

[shanek]

Originally posted by thaiboxerken
They eluded to dreams and prayer as being keys to finding the girl.

Well, in a way, the dream might have been. The woman might have subconsciously known that statistically she's most likely in or on the other side of a wooded area, and the dream could have been her subconscious mind giving her the drive to go forward and keep looking where she might have given up before. It's not paranormal by any means, but it's still psychologically useful.

[JPK]

It's is getting fun watching this story grow from:
Teen Who Survived Car Crash Alert (http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/F/FOUND_ALIVE?SITE=CASDT&SECTION=HOME)

1 Girl last seen at a party where there was underage drinking.
2 Girl a probable run a way according the friends and family,
3 Police search hampered by no one telling the the location of the party for 4 days.
4 Mother of a friend of missing girl has a dream about woods, in WA state no less.
5 Dreaming lady from that point on described as church member
6 Details about her dream are getting better with more news reports.
7 Now the story is on this site:
Laura Hatch - The Real Story (http://www.prophecies.us)

What's next? When is this case going to on Psychic Detevtives?

JPK

[Beerina]

Originally posted by Renfield
"We" skeptics need to get over our aversion to prayer and dreams helping?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHA.

Pause. Deep Breath.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.


Actually, if the dream were taken not as something supernatural, but as just another thought process via near-freeform associational thinking, there might be a nugget or two to pick up.

You'd have to be careful, though, with how loaded and fraudulent dream analysis is in practice, with its childlike, cloying concepts such as "you were under the rock means you feel trapped in your marriage."

[varwoche]

Originally posted by jj
Trees? Here? That couldn't be! To flog a dead horse, for members unfamiliar with this green part of the world: Trees were invented here. (Virtually) everything "bad" that happens, and good things too for that matter, happens amidst trees. Lots of trees (than you Neo).