Can We Get Copies of Applications?

[Beady]

Is there a publicly-accessible collection of applications and their outcomes? I assume these things aren't confidential, since Kramer is posting selected ones for everyone to see.

[KRAMER]

The complete file on ALL applications, tests and test results remain here at JREF and open to the public.

Hundreds of applications were received, though only a tiny portion of those applicants ever agreed to a protocol, and most of those backed out of testing and disappeared.

Some of the actual tests were videotaped, and those tapes are also on file here and available for viewing in our library. We do not make copies.

You'd need to pay us a visit here at The JREF to see what it all looks like.

[Hawk one]

So just to clarify, is it time and budget constraints that is hindering you from putting all the applications up online? Just curious.

[KRAMER]

Originally posted by Hawk one
So just to clarify, is it time and budget constraints that is hindering you from putting all the applications up online? Just curious.

To post each and every claim received since the inception of the Challenge would take years. I've posted every claim submitted since the Applications forum was opened a few months ago.

When no new applications come in, I post the most recent older ones, in the hope that someday, perhaps, all the claims we have on file will be here in the forum for all to see.

There are presently no interns here to help with this task.

Randi has his work cut out for him, and is often at his desk 7 days a week to see it done. Linda works tirelessly in the front office, and Dave spends 100% of his time in the "AV" department maintaining and digitizing the massive video library for future generations. This will take years.

And I'm the Challenge Guy, among other things (including the initial work on the forthcoming JREF website database - a kind of online version of Randi's Encyclopedia of Frauds & Hoaxes, but much more advanced and in-depth...this will be an invaluable tool for both the professional researcher and the student/novice, and we consider it to be of far greater value to the public than a forum thread that details the deluded meanderings of people who believe - against all evidence to the contrary - that they are gifted with powers that make them tower above their fellow man).

I'm doing my very best.

[B.S]

Originally posted by KRAMER



I'm doing my very best.

And thank you, for doing that.

[Hawk one]

Kramer: Yeah, that is more or less what I suspected was happening. I should of course have included that lack of interns, etc. could also be a cause for you not being able to do more than what the current staff is capable of.

And I completely understand that although you wish to digitalise all the archive and put it up on the net, it simply cannot be your highest priority. Like B.S. I'll just compliment you (the entire staff, that is) on the job you are doing to the best of your abilities, and being grateful for you doing so. Keep up the good work!

[KRAMER]

Thanks, everyone.

[Ashles]

Not that I want to turn this into the 'Kramer is Kool' thread or anything but...

What you do is very important.

I live in the UK and often get into discussions about the paranormal with friends/work colleagues/strangers etc. because I find it a fascinating subject, and I am constantly surprised at how many paranormal beliefs most people have.

The JREF prize was described recently on another (believer) forum as a kind of 'crucifix against vampires', i.e. something held out when nothing else works.

And in a way I think it is sort of true. I feel I can personally argue against most of these beliefs in a logical way, but when faced with anecdotal evidence there is not a lot the average person can do to disagree. I can't prove they don't have the ability to predict future events, I merely think it is incredibly unlikely that they actually can.

The JREF challenge allows us average people to have a way of examining these claims.
'Prove it and win a million dollars' is an extremely powerful incentive, and it seems that these claims fade in the face of those words.

I have the utmost respect for whatever anyone wants to personally believe, but when those beliefs are touted as actual fact to me I have no real way of demonstrating that they aren't true. But I do have a way of asking them to demonstrate to me that their claims are true. The JREF challenge.

It's not a war between believers and sceptics ( as it is sometimes portrayed on other websites and publications) it is an attempt to find out what is real and what is fantasy.
If telekinesis is proven to exist I will sign up on the courses the next day. But until then I will retain my belief in the physical system that appears to exist at the moment.

Keep up the good work Kramer, and pass my best wishes onto the man himself. I hope to be in Florida sometime soon so maybe I'll stop by.

[Beady]

Maybe I should have explained why I asked, in the first place.

As Ashles has said, it can be difficult to argue about paranormal claims. That I've been able to do so is because of all the reading I've done, and I'm gradually finding out that there's a lot less than before that I can't counter (such as CIA investigations of Remote Viewing - the people who bring this up as a validation almost always seem to be unaware that the CIA subsequently dropped it as "unpromising").

I subscribe to the Skeptical Inquirer, and read Skeptic and Fortean Times (hey! It gives me something to be skeptical about), as well as these boards, but now I'm also beginning
to look for original source material. While it's good to know that all of this is freely available at JREF, I'm in Vermont and have a steady job; I honestly can't see spending a week's vacation to sit in the JREF library. I was kind of hoping there was a way the library could come to me.