Lying to Psychics-What do you think?

[Clairvoyant_Kyle]

I have found that “psychics� are pretty easy to set up, prove they are lying, and point out they are attempting to fool people. The key is to take the low ropes and lie to them first. This is nothing new or special, I’ll admit, but I think it could be a good tool in debunking fakes. I have seen this done before and I am sure you have herd stories of it to.

Here is my story: Once upon a time, I and several friends of mine, along with a bunch of people I don’t know in my town, called a “free live call in psychic show� and messed with the psychic until he was kicked off the air. It was really funny. (I almost have all the video edited and of course I will be posting a link of it here when it is completed) Anyways, this taught me a very valuable lessen about how to deal with psychics that are not will to test their claim against science. Setting them up is a good solid strategy. Now I do understand that this is easier said then done, when it comes to messing with the big names, but I do see it possible. For example, remember how Michael Jackson was set up by that one reporter who acted like there was nothing wrong with Michael’s behavior until the last time they had an interview then confronted him with it all in the end? I believe something similar could be done with a “psychic�. Or I was even thinking that when old Larry “Moron� King retires the “psychics� will need a new place to try to find victims. Maybe some show, could act like they respect “psychics,� invited them in to take live calls and then have every caller be a “ringer� who lies, gets a reading, and then tells the whole audience: “I was lying about my dead brother (or what ever), and a real psychic should of known that.� And of course make sure the host probes bit more into why the “psychic� got it wrong. Unlike, King does when “psychics� bomb out on his show. This would be very entertaining and would for sure be proof to many people that whatever “psychic� we caught in out trap was a big fraud.

I could think of several other ways to prove these science dodging “psychics� are fakes. Money and publicity would be the bait to catch these frauds. So what does everyone think? Would this be something wroth attempting? Is it even possible? Does our “community� have the resources to pull something like this off? Does anyone have any other ideas of how to debunk “psychics� that will not be tested?

[jambo372]

3 points:
a) Some mediums refuse payments.
b) Some don't want publicity.
c) You're not supposed to tell a medium anything anyway whether or not you're lying , the ones I've been to tell you not to give them information, the medium is supposed to pass on a message to you not vice versa.

[patnray]

I’ve often thought that one way to catch JE and others warm reading the audience would be to have a group of people go dressed in ways that stand out. Not exactly loud clothes, but distinctive enough to be noticed. Then, before the show, talk loudly about their non-existent deceased relatives with unusual names who died from fake diseases or under very bizarre circumstances. If, during the show the host mentions the names, play along with him. Get him to name the disease or circumstance. Get him to say the spirit by that name relayed these facts to him. Then tell everyone that there is no such person and no such disease.

But it would be edited out of the show. And, because of the stringent non-disclosure agreement they force guests to sign you could be sued if you published the truth.

It would be fun though…

[Clairvoyant_Kyle]

The ones who do not want publicity would not be a target anyways, but I haven's seen a "psychic" that doesn't. Thats the whole game, the more your known the more your worth. Other than that its just someone trying to be cool and impress there frends or something. And your right you should not have to say anything to them, but all readings I have seen consist of a general inquery by the victim, and then a questions that lead to answer by the reader. Well atleast on Larry King. So if you lie, you through them off of their routine. This shows they know jack, all they can do is go off of what you give them.

[SRW]

In the first episode of BS Penn & Teller tried but were mostly thwarted because of the disclaimers on the shows. What they were able to do was turn tables and use a fake Psychic (Ok they are all fake) to show how easy it was to fool and audience. They also exposed the fact that one Psychic just happened to read people who were friends of her publicist.

I don't think any of the major players would allow them selves to go anywhere that they do not have some control.

[Clairvoyant_Kyle]

How much control do you think they have on Larry King though? I am asking because on September 10th 2001 John Edwards made a compleate ass of himself. He did not get hardly anything right, and although Larry did not ask him much about getting so much wrong, him did laugh at him. It was great.....So back to my original question: How much control do you think they have on Larry King Live?

[SRW]

Originally posted by Clairvoyant_Kyle
How much control do you think they have on Larry King though? I am asking because on September 10th 2001 John Edwards made a compleate ass of himself. He did not get hardly anything right, and although Larry did not ask him much about getting so much wrong, him did laugh at him. It was great.....So back to my original question: How much control do you think they have on Larry King Live?

Ratings, they bring in viewers. Randi has formally asked Larry King to help with the Sylvia Browne test and look how far that has gone. They many look stupid on LK but they keep returning.

[Clairvoyant_Kyle]

Very true, that was kind of my point. Larry is old and leaving t.v. soon, so I am guessing that the "psychics" will be looking for a new night time show to gain new victims on. I know its a long shot and most likely will not happen, but for sure it won't if we do not try. Where is a good show like the Johnny Carson show when you need it? :D

[Mojo]

Originally posted by jambo372
Some don't want publicity.
I suppose that they must be the genuine ones. That would explain why all the "psychics" ever heard of appear to be fakes: the real ones are hiding.

[Clairvoyant_Kyle]

Thats right....haven't you ever seen that one X-Files about psychics? The real ones hate their powers and and are hiding away not telling anyone. Meanwile the fakes are out for glory.

[Temporal Renegade]

I've no problem in lying to a 'psychic'; after all, if they're really psychic, they'd know you're lying, right?

So, if they in fact point it out, and then give the correct information, you're the one who looks foolish, not them.

So, what's the problem?:D

[LTC8K6]

c) You're not supposed to tell a medium anything anyway whether or not you're lying , the ones I've been to tell you not to give them information, the medium is supposed to pass on a message to you not vice versa.

Can you link us to a transcript of a reading done by a medium where the subject* doesn't give the medium information?

*victim

[Xeriar]

Originally posted by Temporal Renegade
I've no problem in lying to a 'psychic'; after all, if they're really psychic, they'd know you're lying, right?

So, if they in fact point it out, and then give the correct information, you're the one who looks foolish, not them.

So, what's the problem?:D

They still might not be psychic. You might just be a liar so horrible your face tells the truth.

[TheERK]

It's not okay to lie to psychics to make a point for other people, simply because you're doing more harm than good by doing it. Part of the reason people don't listen to skeptics is because they're biased against them and think most of them are arrogant and rude. Being an open liar isn't going to help that image. So don't do it.

[Temporal Renegade]

Originally posted by Xeriar
They still might not be psychic. You might just be a liar so horrible your face tells the truth.

Never had a problem before....

I mean, I've heard some people haven't had a problem before. :biggrin:

[Temporal Renegade]

The best way to deal with them is probably just sitting with a blank look on your face; just staring at them, only acknowledging them when they do get a 'hit', and ignoring all else.

[jj]

Well, yes, I've gotten a "psychic" to tell me about the history of my younger brother. (I'm an only child.)

I did encourage him.

The rest of the audience went from surprised, to amused, to giggling out loud. (This was in college, most folks knew me well enough to know the issues at hand.)

Since then, I've been hard put to be patient enough to do that.

Since I do look like a fat old redneck, though, I suppose I'd be willing to pick up my old W.Va. accent (yes, I can still produce it just fine) and act as dumb as I look if somebody's got a psychic coming around the Seattle area.

But, I'm in Hong Kong this week.

[Gremdel]

One of my favorite online comics (PvP) did a series on lying to psychics, it starts
here (http://www.pvponline.com/archive.php3?archive=20020401).

I'm sure some of you remember it when it came out in 2002. For those who don't want read the whole thing, I'll skip to the payoff (but you should read the whole thing, it's very funny):

J Edward: I'm being drawn to someone over here who had an authroity figure cross over. Maybe a boss or a teacher.

Brent: *Gasp* A teacher?

JE: He died quickly, right? Or did he linger?

Brent: Quickly, it was very sudden, unexpected.

JE: I'm getting he wishes he could have taught you more. And there's someone else in the family he wishes he could have taught.

Brent: My sister?

JE: Right, she has similar talents?

Brent: Yes. That's correct. All the Skywalkers are very strong in the force.