French desecrate Allied war cemetary.

[clk]

How can someone desecrate the graves of the people who gave them their freedom???
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,5944-631671,00.html

I wouldn't mind seeing this happen: http://www.worth1000.com/view.asp?entry=35544&display=photoshop

[subgenius]

Originally posted by clk
How can someone desecrate the graves of the people who gave them their freedom???
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,5944-631671,00.html

I wouldn't mind seeing this happen: http://www.worth1000.com/view.asp?entry=35544&display=photoshop

I hope we can remember its only 1 in 3 french people that feel that way and not hate the other 2/3rds because of the minority.
That's the American way.

[iain]

This desecration is disgusting and I hope that those responsible are caught and punished.

I hope that no one believes the stupid actions of one or two people are in any way representative of the population of France as a whole. I have no doubt that France, like every other country, has its fair share of morons.

Edited to add

Here is the French Government take on this (from the BBC website) :

"It is indispensable to be vigilant against all displays of anti-Americanism, which would be unacceptable," spokesman Jean-Francois Cope quoted Mr Raffarin as telling parliamentary leaders at a meeting on Tuesday.

The government should also be on guard for any signs of racism, anti-Semitism or xenophobia in the frequent protests against the war, Mr Cope quoted him as saying.

"This violation of a burial place - scandalous in itself - is an attack on the memory of the sacrifice made by the British and American soldiers who contributed to the liberation of our soil," said the local member of parliament, former Socialist arts minister Jack Lang.

"Our disagreement with the British and American governments (on Iraq) can in no way justify any assault on the memory of men who sacrificed themselves for our country."

Mr Raffarin's warning was the latest in a series of comments apparently aimed at healing the deep rift with the US and UK which opened up over the Iraq crisis.
Mr Raffarin has already said that France is not an enemy of the United States, while the Foreign Ministry has issued a statement saying Paris hoped US-led forces would win the war in Iraq.

[HarryKeogh]

whether you are for or against the war how could you want saddam to win? if iraq won alot more people would die in the long run. i guess 1/3 of the french right now are very emotional as opposed to stupid. and some of course are both.

we change "french fries" to "freedom fries" and they desecrate a cemetery and a 9/11 memorial plaque. some people (key word:some) are such asses.

[iain]

Originally posted by HarryKeogh
whether you are for or against the war how could you want saddam to win? if iraq won alot more people would die in the long run. i guess 1/3 of the french right now are very emotional as opposed to stupid. and some of course are both.I agree, though America must share some of the blame for allowing Saddam to gain sympathy with its "you're either for us or for terrorism" type lines.

we change "french fries" to "freedom fries" and they desecrate a cemetery and a 9/11 memorial plaque. some people (key word:some) are such asses. [/B]I agree that some people are asses, but you don't quite give a fair comparison. The cemetary desecration was the work of a small number of idiots; the freedom fries thing was the work of the US Senate (no comment on the distinction between these two).

A better comparison would be with the French woman in New York who had abusive "go home" type slogans painted on her wall. Again, the work of an idiot and I'm sure not representative of most Americans.

[HarryKeogh]

iain, you've made some good points but i think the "freedom fries" thing was the work of two congressman, (as opposed to something that was put to a vote), who happened to be in control of what goes on in the white house cafeteria. so it was indeed the work of a small group of idiots. and for the record i found that act to be so trite and petty.

i may be wrong as to the origins of the freedom fry thing. if so, any corrections are welcome.

[billiefan2000]

I wonder if the French are against JEW BASHING and CHRISTIAN BASHING in France?


also:

JEW HATING FRANCE is calling Dead british Soliders NAZI'S.

If it wasnt for those dead soliders the French People would either be a bar of soap or speaking german right now.

[DanishDynamite]

I'm amazed how France bashing is still "in". The bashers often have the opinion that France is irrelevant and "who cares about them, anyway". And yet, new threads still appear almost daily.

Amazing how something so irrelevant can continue to be of so much interest. :)

[clk]

Originally posted by DanishDynamite
I'm amazed how France bashing is still "in". The bashers often have the opinion that France is irrelevant and "who cares about them, anyway". And yet, new threads still appear almost daily.

Amazing how something so irrelevant can continue to be of so much interest. :)

I never said that the French are irrelevant. Also, I never "bashed" them. I mearly posted a link that stated that their country could be invaded by two rednecks in under 13 minutes. There's a difference, you know. ;)

[HarryKeogh]

Originally posted by clk


I never said that the French are irrelevant. Also, I never "bashed" them. I mearly posted a link that stated that their country could be invaded by two rednecks in under 13 minutes. There's a difference, you know. ;)

would it take them 13 minutes to say "we surrender"?

[Jocko]

Originally posted by clk
How can someone desecrate the graves of the people who gave them their freedom???
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,5944-631671,00.html

I wouldn't mind seeing this happen: http://www.worth1000.com/view.asp?entry=35544&display=photoshop

And to think so many of you thought it was laughable and childish for that congresswoman to propose a subsidy to families wishing to have their loved ones exhumed from those cemeteries in France.

"Ridiculous!" some cried.
"Reactionary!" others yelped.
"Counterproductive French-bashing!" yet others bellowed.

I will accept your apologies now. You know who you are.

[Jocko]

Originally posted by DanishDynamite
I'm amazed how France bashing is still "in". The bashers often have the opinion that France is irrelevant and "who cares about them, anyway". And yet, new threads still appear almost daily.

I'm amazed by doe-eyed European amazement. I guess American memories are a little longer, and dare I say, a little clearer. The French are bashed because they keep coming up with new and exotic ways to DESERVE IT.

Amazing how something so irrelevant can continue to be of so much interest. :)

Ask French exporters how irrelevant it is. You may get a different answer.

[DrBenway]

Originally posted by iain
I agree, though America must share some of the blame for allowing Saddam to gain sympathy with its "you're either for us or for terrorism" type lines.

Hmm. I can understand the Dubya's style putting people off. But I think anyone who feels sympathy for Saddam is beyond hope, and probably was beyond hope prior to the current mess.

[DanishDynamite]

Originally posted by Jocko
I'm amazed by doe-eyed European amazement. I guess American memories are a little longer, and dare I say, a little clearer. I guess American memories don't reach beyond Sept 11, 2001. Given that most Americans couldn't find Iraq on a map, I'm not amazed though.
The French are bashed because they keep coming up with new and exotic ways to DESERVE IT. Fabulous. Ever hear of the pot, the kettle and the color black?
Ask French exporters how irrelevant it is. You may get a different answer. I expect I would. I'm fairly sure the French don't find themselves irrelevant.

[Tricky]

Originally posted by DrBenway
Hmm. I can understand the Dubya's style putting people off. But I think anyone who feels sympathy for Saddam is beyond hope, and probably was beyond hope prior to the current mess.
Oddly, the international community is not as single-minded as one would think. To many countries (some of which have their own dictators), what you do in your own country is your business. They can definately sympathize with a tiny country being told how to "run their business" by a giant one. Of course, we may disagree with their sympathy or their logic, but if we fail to recognize and understand it, then we are simply begging them to hate us.

I think that Iain was pointing out that the US's lack of empathy with any point of view other than there own is not serving us well. Like disease, it is better to prevent terrorism than to try to cure it.

[clk]

Originally posted by HarryKeogh


would it take them 13 minutes to say "we surrender"?

Hmm...good point. It would probably only take 5 minutes...they'd surrender once they found out that the rednecks were angry.

[clk]

Here's a picture of the damage. Damn weasels....they put a swastika on there! Are they trying to call Bush and Blair Nazis? After the US and Britain sacrificed so much to save France from the Nazis? This is appalling on so many levels.
By the way, the translation of what they sprayed is: "Dig up your rubbish, it’s contaminating our soil"

[Jocko]

Originally posted by DanishDynamite
I guess American memories don't reach beyond Sept 11, 2001. Given that most Americans couldn't find Iraq on a map, I'm not amazed though.

European memories apparently don't even reach back that far. For instance, France suffered complete amnesia between UNSC resolution 1441 and the onset of war 4 months later.

Phenomenal.

I would make a similar disparaging remark regarding the quality of education in Denmark, except it's so obscure and insignificant I doubt I could even scrape up the information.


Fabulous. Ever hear of the pot, the kettle and the color black?

Have Americans painted swastikas on memorials to your countrymen? I find your comparison insulting and naive. Maybe I should pop for a ticket to Denmark so I can personally validate your otherwise erroneous position. Got any sacred sites I could piss on, DD? I'd love to prove you right.

I expect I would. I'm fairly sure the French don't find themselves irrelevant.

You miss the point. I meant that the French will have to live with the consequences of their intransigence, and that includes a reasonably organized boycott of French goods. America is an importing nation, so the French have more to lose than we do.

You can call America arrogant, but when was the last time France saved the world, huh? Or Denmark for that matter?

[Jocko]

Originally posted by clk
Here's a picture of the damage. Damn weasels....they put a swastika on there! Are they trying to call Bush and Blair Nazis? After the US and Britain sacrificed so much to save France from the Nazis? This is appalling on so many levels.
By the way, the translation of what they sprayed is: "Dig up your rubbish, it’s contaminating our soil"

Someone call the Germans right f*cking now and tell 'em it's THEIRS.

[Barkhorn1x]

Originally posted by clk
Here's a picture of the damage. Damn weasels....they put a swastika on there! Are they trying to call Bush and Blair Nazis? After the US and Britain sacrificed so much to save France from the Nazis? This is appalling on so many levels.
By the way, the translation of what they sprayed is: "Dig up your rubbish, it’s contaminating our soil"

...that is VERY low. What the hell could drive someone to do that?? That is a national shrine that belongs to the French people as much as the US & Britain.

Disgusting! :mad:

Regards,
Barkhorn.

[Mike B.]

I believe the monument is to the British dead in World War I.

The line about their remains polluting the soil is particularily loathsome.

Chirac has apparently sent an apology to the Queen Elizabeth about this.

Good for him.

[Hypocolius]

Originally posted by clk
the translation of what they sprayed is: "Dig up your rubbish, it’s contaminating our soil"

Interesting they say "Our" soil. Inscribed at the gate of every Commonwealth war grave in Belgium that I visited (and I have no reason to suspect that it is different in France), is the phrase "The land on which this cemetry stands is the free gift of the Belgian people for the perpetual resting place of those of the allied armies wh fell in the war of 1914-1918 and are honoured here". Any one been to any cemetries in France and know if it's the same there?

[iain]

Originally posted by Hypocolius


Interesting they say "Our" soil. Inscribed at the gate of every Commonwealth war grave in Belgium that I visited (and I have no reason to suspect that it is different in France), is the phrase "The land on which this cemetry stands is the free gift of the Belgian people for the perpetual resting place of those of the allied armies wh fell in the war of 1914-1918 and are honoured here". Any one been to any cemetries in France and know if it's the same there? I think its a fairly safe bet that whoever did this lacked the intellect to appreciate such subtle distinctions.

The French have done the right thing - apologised and launched a full criminal investigation.

[DanishDynamite]

Jocko:European memories apparently don't even reach back that far. For instance, France suffered complete amnesia between UNSC resolution 1441 and the onset of war 4 months later. Apparently so did Russia, China and a majority of the Security Council.
I would make a similar disparaging remark regarding the quality of education in Denmark, except it's so obscure and insignificant I doubt I could even scrape up the information.My remark would have been disparaging if it wasn't true. (http://edition.cnn.com/2002/EDUCATION/11/20/geography.quiz/)
Have Americans painted swastikas on memorials to your countrymen?Not that I know of. What does that have to do with the French "coming up with new and exotic ways to DESERVE [being bashed]"? May I suggest you read Doubt's excellent opening post in "Reason, the war and this forum". Pay particular attention to point no. 1.
I find your comparison insulting and naive. As I do your contention that "American memories are a little longer, and dare I say, a little clearer" than Europeans.
Maybe I should pop for a ticket to Denmark so I can personally validate your otherwise erroneous position. Got any sacred sites I could piss on, DD? I'd love to prove you right.Come on over. You need to broaden your horizon. And you are welcome to piss on any sacred site you find. However, I would suggest you do it at night, as you might otherwise be fined.
You miss the point. I meant that the French will have to live with the consequences of their intransigence, and that includes a reasonably organized boycott of French goods. America is an importing nation, so the French have more to lose than we do.I got your point, I just found it too silly to respond to.
You can call America arrogant, but when was the last time France saved the world, huh? Or Denmark for that matter? "Saved the world"? I swear, only a right-wing American could say this with a straight face. Perhaps you should cut down on the "Rambo" movies and educate yourself about the real world.