Papal election

[I'll_buy_that]

so no new pope yet.

Black Smoke (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&u=/ap/20050418/ap_on_re_eu/pope_23)

Apparently God isn't a good communicator

"If you don't believe, you think this is like politics. But if you believe, as I do, in the power of prayer, you know they will be illuminated to make the right choice," said Annick Vandamme, who had traveled from Paris.

"I slept well, and now my ideas are clear," French Cardinal Paul Poupard said as he headed into the Mass. "I have realized the seriousness of the election. The Holy Spirit will do the rest."

The longest conclave took two years, nine months and two days. It ended with the election of Gregory X on Sept. 1, 1271.

[sackett]

French Cardinal Paul Poupard!

Hey, the subdivison where I live in Detroit was La Ferme Poupard back in French days! This cardinal's great-great-great-etc. uncle used to farm my yard! Coincidence? Hah! Try again, Mr. Skeptic!

[Beleth]

Originally posted by sackett
French Cardinal Paul Poupard!"Pardon me, but do you have any Pope Poupard?"

"But of course!"

[c4ts]

If the Pope is the only one who can talk to God then why do humans have to elect a new one, and why does it take so long?

[Brown]

Supposedly the Holy Spirit guides the selection. Well, one might think that He'd be able to do his guiding in a fairly prompt fashion, without all the distasteful politicking.

But there I go again, trying to apply logic to religion.

[spectacle]

do they custom make those pope hats for each new pope? maybe theres a really good canidate, but his head is too big so they dont vote for him

[Darat]

Originally posted by spectacle
do they custom make those pope hats for each new pope? maybe theres a really good canidate, but his head is too big so they dont vote for him

There was a brief piece on one the news reports that I caught today that says the Papal tailor has prepared three sizes of outfits, small, medium and large to cover all eventualities. Just hope it isn’t a woman...*



(*And before I’m told it couldn’t be – I beg to differ, whilst it is true the church does not have the power to create an ordained woman I’m sure the Holy Spirit can – after all everything is possible to God!)

[KillerBob]

Originally posted by Brown
Supposedly the Holy Spirit guides the selection. Well, one might think that He'd be able to do his guiding in a fairly prompt fashion, without all the distasteful politicking.

But there I go again, trying to apply logic to religion.


I've never understood how this can be rationalized. If they're all praying and "listening" for guidance from God, couldn't that one God come up with one answer?

Does Satan run interference causing the divergent messages they receive? If so, how do you know that the pope you come up with is aligned with the cloudwalker, not the pitmaster?

Of course, in the OT, God seemed really keen on burnt stuff, so maybe he just toys with them until they've put up enough smoke for his liking.



It's almost as if they were giving God credit when they actually just came up with the answers on their own biases. But obviously that can't be it...

[geni]

"Guided" is the term and trying to guid a bunch of old men is not exactly easy.

[Disco]

Like herding cats?

MHB

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

God used to be able to impart one answer, but what with all the damn cell phones everywhere, the communication is garbled.

~~ Paul

[Meadmaker]

Read an interesting article today in which Cardinal Ratzinger, widely hailed as a prime Pope candidate, said that looking back on history, he was pretty sure that the Holy Spirit hadn't always been responsible for Pope selection, as he was fairly certain that the Holy Spirit would not have picked some of losers from the past.

What he said was that the Holy Spirit was available to guide the selection process, if the Cardinals were listening, and that the Holy Spirit would protect the Church even if they got a bad Pope.

[Kopji]

I dunno. Used to be that the big guys would be locked in and made to live in these tiny little cells with pots as toilets. Very conducive to hurrying up and getting on with electing the pope.

Now they have nice hotel rooms, waiters, chefs and stuff. It could take a looooong time to elect a pope.

[jimmygun]

Pick-a-pope!

Toss the names of all the elligable cardinals in the air and which ever lands on the X gets to be pope! Or have a big Rock/Paper/Scissors play off and the remaining card is pope.

Print the name of each cardinal on a piece of paper and flush them all down the toilet. If any don't go down that is the new pope!

Assign each cardinal a number. Use the winners at 100 different race tracks and the odd to tally a number to co-incide with the new pope!

Musical thrones?

Shin kicking contest?

Spot dance?

Let Sylvia Browne pick one?

Have a talent contest?

Which ever way you chose to chose, God guided your hand and the new pope is the right pope!!!!

TADAAAA!

[Regnad Kcin]

It really is remarkable how much media attention this process is being given, not to mention all the top-level secrecy directed by the home office. Really, who--apart from the Vatican heirarchy--could possibly care?

The new pope will likely be...wait for it...one of their own: a nice old anonymous chap who prays a bit. It's not as if the college of cardinals are going to have some jolly fun by casting ballots for, say, Eminem, Lindsay Lohan, or Al Gore.

[Kopji]

forgive me father for I have sinned

yes, go on

I said bad things about the cardinals

tell me my child

I predicted Ratzinger would be the next pope

that is not a sin

It is sort of like a curse with these kind of things. I don't think he has a snowballs chance in hell of being pope, but I needed to help make sure.

10 hail mary's

Thank you father

...and five lashes

what was said about the cardinals?

I am so ashamed. Surely they are great men of God and being kept in five star accommodations must be like rubbing their wounds in salt. They truly know that each day spent in opulence undermines their vows of simplicity and poverty.

amen
10 more hail Mary's

Forgive me father I have sinned

more?

I am the chemical supplier for the Sistine chapel smoke.

you bastard...

[geni]

Originally posted by jimmygun
Pick-a-pope!

Toss the names of all the elligable cardinals in the air and which ever lands on the X gets to be pope! Or have a big Rock/Paper/Scissors play off and the remaining card is pope.

Print the name of each cardinal on a piece of paper and flush them all down the toilet. If any don't go down that is the new pope!

Assign each cardinal a number. Use the winners at 100 different race tracks and the odd to tally a number to co-incide with the new pope!

Musical thrones?

Shin kicking contest?

Spot dance?

Let Sylvia Browne pick one?

Have a talent contest?

Which ever way you chose to chose, God guided your hand and the new pope is the right pope!!!!

TADAAAA!

Theoreticialy there are over 400 million candidates. this is going to be one seriouly large lottery draw.

[Darat]

Pope Idol!


You know it makes sense....


Judge 1: Oh I luuved you, your sermon really came from the heart, it brought a tear to my eye.
Judge 2: Well if this was Vicar Idol you may have been OK but for Pope Idol we want someone with that X factor, I want to see someone who I could believe would be a martyr!
Judge 3: Terrible choice of sermon, but you do have a way with that incense that I find appealing.

[Meadmaker]

Originally posted by jimmygun
Pick-a-pope!

Toss the names of all the elligable cardinals in the air and which ever lands on the X gets to be pope! Or have a big Rock/Paper/Scissors play off and the remaining card is pope.

Print the name of each cardinal on a piece of paper and flush them all down the toilet. If any don't go down that is the new pope!

....


For all we know, that is what they do.

Here's a thought about media speculation. Today, I've heard pundits saying that the move to a fourth ballot probably means that Cardinal Ratzinger didn't have a lock on things and that if he didn't win by today, his chances were slipping as other alliances form.

Huh? How would these guys know?

Consider this. Karol Wojtyla came out of nowhere to become John Paul II. No one predicted him. That much is pointed out pretty commonly. However, is it really true that he came out of nowhere? Remember that just 6 weeks earlier, the exact same set of Cardinals had gotten together to elect John Paul I. It was exactly the same guys, except for the dear departed Holy Father of the Short Reign.

Is it conceivable that the archbishop of Krakow wasn't even considered the first time around? Or at least someone in a similar "voting bloc"? In other words, the election of JPII proves that the cardinals really can keep a secret, and that the speculation on the outside is truly uninformed.

[Darat]

He's been picked.... oh the suspense...

[Cthulhu]

Ratzinger.

Now Benedict XVI.

:rolleyes:

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by Darat
He's been picked.... oh the suspense...

You owe me a beer.

[Darat]

And I'll have to eat crow... I really didn't expect the enforcer to do it - he must have had his heavies lean on the other cardinals.

Oh well there goes any chance of any "progressive" thinking for probably 10 years at least.

[geni]

Originally posted by Darat
And I'll have to eat crow... I really didn't expect the enforcer to do it - he must have had his heavies lean on the other cardinals.

Oh well there goes any chance of any "progressive" thinking for probably 10 years at least.


You give him 10 years?

[Darat]

Originally posted by geni
You give him 10 years?

He's 78, I don't know of any health problems and he seems quite spry so I don’t think 88 is pushing it.

[I'll_buy_that]

he is going to push the catholic faith back 100 years, so 10 years is a good guess. I believe in round numbers just like god does.

"...warn the faithful about tendencies that he considered dangers to the faith: sects, ideologies like Marxism, liberalism, atheism, agnosticism and relativism — the ideology that there are no absolute truths.

"Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the church, is often labeled today as a fundamentalism," he said, speaking in Italian. "Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and 'swept along by every wind of teaching,' looks like the only attitude acceptable to today's standards. "

How come they have so much trouble seeing any middle ground? it's always adhear to centuries old tradition or throw everything to the wind and forget about it. You either know all "god does it and operates in mysterious ways" or you know nothing and let care go to the wind.

This guy has more problems than the last one. Why is it that the pope has to be so old?

[jmercer]

I'm feeling a sudden urge to become a lapsed Catholic...

[geni]

Originally posted by I'll_buy_that
he is going to push the catholic faith back 100 years, so 10 years is a good guess. I believe in round numbers just like god does.

No way would the church move that fast



This guy has more problems than the last one. Why is it that the pope has to be so old? [/B]

So he isn't around for as long.

[Meadmaker]

Originally posted by Meadmaker
For all we know, that is what they do.

Here's a thought about media speculation. Today, I've heard pundits saying that the move to a fourth ballot probably means that Cardinal Ratzinger didn't have a lock on things and that if he didn't win by today, his chances were slipping as other alliances form.

Huh? How would these guys know?
....
In other words, the election of JPII proves that the cardinals really can keep a secret, and that the speculation on the outside is truly uninformed.

As I was writing the above, Benedict XVI was getting ready to greet the crowds from the balcony.

If there is a God, he must want me to look silly.

[jimmygun]

Now that the cardinals have conclaved and voted and God has guided their hand in the selection of the pope...what if he turns out to be a bad pope? Is it going to be God's fault?

[I'll_buy_that]

No, they just weren't praying hard enough. they couldn't hear the lords call, they had all that electronic jamming equipment to keep snoops out, so god's voice was probably jammed to.

[Moon-Spinner]

Why don't they ever have a Warrior Pope anymore (such as Pope Julius II)? Now that would be more interesting, and newspapers would have something to actually write about.

[Meadmaker]

Originally posted by jimmygun
Now that the cardinals have conclaved and voted and God has guided their hand in the selection of the pope...what if he turns out to be a bad pope? Is it going to be God's fault?


Here's what I said up thread a few posts:


"Read an interesting article today in which Cardinal Ratzinger, widely hailed as a prime Pope candidate, said that looking back on history, he was pretty sure that the Holy Spirit hadn't always been responsible for Pope selection, as he was fairly certain that the Holy Spirit would not have picked some of losers from the past.

What he said was that the Holy Spirit was available to guide the selection process, if the Cardinals were listening, and that the Holy Spirit would protect the Church even if they got a bad Pope."


I wonder if he thinks the cardinals listened to the Holy Spirit this time.

[sackett]

Somebody here called him Pope Rat Zinger, and I cracked up with literally unholy glee!

Then somebody else called him Pope Ranziger! His Holiness Pope Rancider!

My mind has been poisoned forever! Thank you, thank you, thank you!