Psychic Fair JREF Table?

[Anti_Hypeman]

Would the JREF be willing to sponser tables at psychic fairs? Would they even let you buy a table? I think it would be fun.

I would volunteer my time, I am not Penn & Teller by any means but I can recreate anything most psychics do. There are lots of possibillities just think about it.

[Phrost]

You've got brass ones. :)

[Blue Bubble]

I think that's a great idea :D

[jmercer]

Me too, as long as it's video recorded. :D

[SezMe]

I've tried it without success. On the west coast of the USA there is one organization that sponsors these one-day events in numerous cities and towns. In this circumstance, you have to have a product or service consistent with the Psychic fair to participate. I suppose other than claiming I was pushing BS, I couldn't honestly fit in.

So my mate and I went to one ($3 to park and $5 get in) and walked around passing out homemade flyers and left some on a table by the door. We then went out on the lawn to hear a pet psychic push her own brand of BS. During the Q&A session, I started to push her and some rent-a-cops politely noted that we were not welcome and asked us to leave - which we politely did.

It was actually fun. You don't need a sponsor or even money. If you can get a slot, just take a card table and some flyers printed on bright paper and pass 'em out and just talk to people. If you can't get a slot, just walk around with the flyers. If nothing else, you get to talk to some real moonbeams. :)

While yakking here, the funniest booth for me was the one offering "souind therapy." This guy who looked and dressed like a Jamaican witch doctor had this loooong (at least 4 meters) wooden horn that produced a very low, actually nice sound. The large "bell" end rested on a little prop so the opening was a couple of feet off the concrete. It had little wheels on it so the "operator" could move it easily.

Anyway, you paid your fee (forget how much) and then you sat on a chair in the middle of a large empty circle. Then this guy would point the horn at you and make "music" as he slowly rotate around and around you, the horn always pointing at the subject.

That's it. Don't know what it cured for the subject but it damn near put a permanent sh**-eatin' grin on my face. :)

[Bronze Dog]

Here's a thought that might fit with the events: Found a company devoted to testing psychics, sort of as a hiring consultant. But test them with Randi-esque protocols.

[Darat]

Originally posted by SezMe
I've tried it without success. On the west coast of the USA there is one organization that sponsors these one-day events in numerous cities and towns. In this circumstance, you have to have a product or service consistent with the Psychic fair to participate. I suppose other than claiming I was pushing BS, I
couldn't honestly fit in.

...snip...

I suppose you could take some books, like Flim-Flam!, the Psychic Mafia, Cold Reading and so on.... I'm sure many of the participants at these fairs would be interested in picking up a few pointers…

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

Why don't we invite some psychics to have a fair at TAM4?

~~ Paul

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Why don't we invite some psychics to have a fair at TAM4?

~~ Paul

They all telepathically send this message: "No!" :D

OTOH: Why not? There should be some locals in LV. It won't be a problem with me. I'll prepare some questions for them....

[Darat]

Originally posted by Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
Why don't we invite some psychics to have a fair at TAM4?

~~ Paul

Well if it is anything like last year then we'll be treated to some of the best psychics in the world... oh you meant fake ones ;)

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by Darat
Well if it is anything like last year then we'll be treated to some of the best psychics in the world... oh you meant fake ones ;)

Are there any real ones??

[Darat]

Originally posted by CFLarsen
Are there any real ones??

Yeah that guy whose name began with a "B" at the last TAM.

He knew my cat was called Boris and had been injured in a traffic accident. He didn’t need to do any bumbling around with guessing “something wit ha S or T or A or C or D� or whether it was a cat or a dog or even a couple of stabs at getting the type of accident right – he got it all in just a minute or two.

Compared to one of those fakes like John Edward he was superb.

[Bronze Dog]

Originally posted by CFLarsen
Are there any real ones??
Of course. That's why Bronze Dog Psychotronic Consulting performs some very simple tests to determine whether or not the psychic you're hiring is fact or fakery. We've helped dozens of psychic hotlines filter out fakes before being fired for not letting them hire any.

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by Darat
Yeah that guy whose name began with a "B" at the last TAM.

He knew my cat was called Boris and had been injured in a traffic accident. He didn’t need to do any bumbling around with guessing “something wit ha S or T or A or C or D� or whether it was a cat or a dog or even a couple of stabs at getting the type of accident right – he got it all in just a minute or two.

Compared to one of those fakes like John Edward he was superb.

Yeah. And able to read this forum... ;)

[Ririon]

Originally posted by BronzeDog
Of course. That's why Bronze Dog Psychotronic Consulting performs some very simple tests to determine whether or not the psychic you're hiring is fact or fakery. We've helped dozens of psychic hotlines filter out fakes before being fired for not letting them hire any.

:D

For real? Of so, YOU've got "brass ones"! Brilliant sceme if you could pull it off. And unlike entering a fair under false pretenses, you are home free. You would of course be fired pretty soon, but so what? How can they complain, since you've only done exactly what you stated you would do? Cool.

[Bronze Dog]

Originally posted by Ririon
:D

For real? Of so, YOU've got "brass ones"! Brilliant sceme if you could pull it off. And unlike entering a fair under false pretenses, you are home free. You would of course be fired pretty soon, but so what? How can they complain, since you've only done exactly what you stated you would do? Cool.
I wish it was real. But if somehow I wind up with loads of free time on my hands, I might just try it.

[Ririon]

Originally posted by BronzeDog
I wish it was real. But if somehow I wind up with loads of free time on my hands, I might just try it.

Oh, well. Brass on bronze would look funny. :)

[Bronze Dog]

Just thought of something that might be fun, profitable, and maybe legal, depending on how gambling laws are set up: Set up a Bronze Dog Psychotronic Consultants table, tent, whatever. Main feature is going to be a "Test Your Remote Viewing" Contest. I will have a number of boxes with objects (I'm thinking maybe dice) that are completely identical except for color. The goal of the contest will be for them to guess which box contains which color. I, of course, won't know the answers. After everyone puts in their guesses (for, say, $5 an entry), I publicly open the boxes. Whoever guesses a statistically correct number wins a big prize. If no one wins, the best guessers get some useless magically charged trinket or something.

[Bronze Dog]

Home from work, now. Since I'm not rushing out any doors, and had a few moments to dream up the scenario, here's some slightly more thoughts:

Grand prize (For achieving statistically significant results, probably p<.0001): $300 plus some bronze pendants of my artistic design, including some limited edition ones. (No magic claims. Just some claims anyone with a highschool chemistry education should be able to recognize as true and unimpressive.)

Prize for best guessers: Bronze pendant.

Think I should get around to installing and learning some 3D modelling software I picked up a while ago.

[Dr. DRE]

Bronze Dog,

It all depends on whether it is a "game of skill" or a "game of chance" Carnivals get away with giving away prizes because supposedly they run "games of skill."

The nice spin here is that to complain, the psychics would have to complain that you were running a "game of chance" i.e. have to admit they are frauds.

Of course the Po-lice could still arrest you.

[Bronze Dog]

Originally posted by Dr. DRE
Bronze Dog,

It all depends on whether it is a "game of skill" or a "game of chance" Carnivals get away with giving away prizes because supposedly they run "games of skill."

The nice spin here is that to complain, the psychics would have to complain that you were running a "game of chance" i.e. have to admit they are frauds.

Of course the Po-lice could still arrest you.
Yeah, I figured as much. Think I'd have to reference specific gambling-related laws to look for loopholes. Anyone who can get away with it in their state/country, please do so. I'd appreciate any subtle homages.

[davefoc]

Anti_Hypeman.
I think this sounds like a great idea as long as I'm not the one doing it.

I'd love to read how it goes for you.

I think the idea of setting up a booth with Skeptic type books and magazines is a good one. I woudn't be surprised if JREF and maybe people like Shermer would support you with access to their books and magazines at wholesale. Heck you might even make the evening news.

My guess though is that you're not going to get a booth at a psychic fair to sell skeptic type books, but I'm not sure. Even if you don't get a booth it will be interesting to read of the people's reaction to you.

If you do get a booth and the fair is some place near me I'd be willing to stop by and say hi. I'll go even farther: I'll donate my extra copy of Flim Flam to the cause if you get a booth.

[Ducky]

Originally posted by BronzeDog
I wish it was real. But if somehow I wind up with loads of free time on my hands, I might just try it.


I completely volunteer my time to help this organization :) Do I have to submit a resume to become a Bronze Dog consultant? Where do I sign up?


Seriously, if I could get a table at a psychic fair I would just to debunk those f*****g EVPers.

They aggravate me to no end.

So consider this a formal declaration:

If possible, I would volunteer my time to help with any and all scheme thought out here for psychic fairs...

[Anti_Hypeman]

This is what I have found so far in my area please add to my list if you know of any. I live in Indanapolis but am willing to drive a fair bit. If you are interested in helping let me know

1. Local shop probally small but close and has events twice monthly

http://www.pyramid-of-enlightenment.com/psychicfair.html

2. Only 10 days away! Has promise

http://www.witchvox.com/vn/vn_detail/dt_ev.html?a=usin&id=37496

3. Biggest one yet lots of time to plan

http://www.fayrelady.com/exhibitors.htm

I could sign up for a table at the last one using a online form. A little creativity in my description and there should be no problems I would think but I dont want to really be deceptive. I will write them inquiring about a table just to see what the response is, you will know if I get one.

Another option is to setup a "legit" table with some kind of free service and only tell them they have been had afterwards. Maybe give them a flyer with a website on it that reveals the truth.

Any input is welcome.

BTW Where can I get a printable version of the application? I can only find the HTML sample on the site.

[Deetee]

Very worthy exercise IMO.
I'm not in a position to help, but you have my total moral support.

As an aside, I have been looking at "FayreLady's" list of contributors to the last Fayre.
It includes workshops and speakers. A lot of the 'side-show' stuff seems to be semi-religious mystical stuff like tarot, palm readings etc.
One workshop was on Wellness Tools - [Chi Machine Infrared
Dome (Hot House), Electro-Reflex-Energizer] :D Should have been interesting.


The registration/application form is in pdf - (over on the right hand column)
http://www.fayrelady.com/Exhibitor%20Registration%20Form.pdf

I liked this bit:
Refund Policy: All space sales are final. No refunds will be given if Exhibitor cancels. In the event that any outside force, beyond the control of the Promoter, such as war, work stoppage, fire or acts of God/dess prevents the Fayre from taking place, then the Promoter reserves the right to retain Exhibitor payments for expense compensation. Credit toward the next show may be given.

[Anti_Hypeman]

The registration/application form is in pdf - (over on the right hand column)
http://www.fayrelady.com/Exhibitor%20Registration%20Form.pdf
[/B]

Thanks but I was looking for the JREF 1,000,000 challenge application on this site so I could print some out.

[sackett]

Originally posted by Anti_Hypeman
Would the JREF be willing to sponser tables at psychic fairs? Would they even let you buy a table? I think it would be fun.

I would volunteer my time, I am not Penn & Teller by any means but I can recreate anything most psychics do. There are lots of possibillities just think about it.

I can't contribute anything but free advice. Here it is:

HIRE SOME MUSCLE.

I wish I was kidding.

[Bronze Dog]

Originally posted by sackett
I can't contribute anything but free advice. Here it is:

HIRE SOME MUSCLE.

I wish I was kidding.
Note to self: See about hiring thaiboxerken and Phrost.

[Anti_Hypeman]

I have sent the following email to all the fairs I have found so far within driving distance, I will post any responses that come in.


-----------------------------------------------------------

Hello, I am inquiring about the possibility of setting up a table at your fairs in support of the James Randi Educational Foundation. Let me explain my intentions before you decide.

The James Randi Educational Foundation offers a one million dollar prize to anyone who can show, under proper observing conditions, evidence of any paranormal, supernatural, or occult power or event.

Indiana is full of psychics but none of them are taking the challenge why is that? I don't believe its because they are all frauds, I believe that they either don't know about it or have commonly held misconceptions.

I would like to inform them about the challenge, answer any questions, clear up any concerns, and guide them through the application process. For example one lie often told by Sylvia Browne is that the money does not exist, I can provide proof that it in fact does.

I simply want to educate Indiana's finest on the challenge and remove any doubts they may have about its authenticity. My sincerest hope is that one of them will step up to the challenge and claim the prize.

[Spektator]

Originally posted by Dr. DRE
Bronze Dog,

It all depends on whether it is a "game of skill" or a "game of chance".....

From an old movie:

Gullible patsy: "Is this a game of chance?"

W.C. Fields: "Not the way I play it, no."

[ceo_esq]

As an initial matter, I'd hesitate to agree to indemnify the organizers in the event they are sued by third parties as a result of my participation. Another vendor could complain of some business tort and you might end up paying the organizers' legal fees even if the case is dismissed or settles.

However, if I were going to do something like this, and time and money were no object, I might go about it in the following way. First, I'd pick a specific woo-woo discipline or phenomenon that I knew would be represented at the Pyschic Fair. For the sake of example, let's say "Reiki".

I'd buy a Reiki Master's correspondence course (complete with diploma) for a couple hundred bucks. With the aid of my Reiki course materials and outside skeptical sources, I would then develop a short skeptical lecture on the subject of Reiki, with appropriate accompanying literature or visual aids. I'd fill out a Psychic Fair application indicating, quite truthfully, that I was a certified Reiki practitioner interested in renting a booth in order to raise awareness about this fascinating discipline. Where the application says you must either offer a free workshop/seminar or else donate a door prize, I'd obviously mark down the first option - since the freebie seminar might be the first, best and only opportunity to speak.

On the day of the Fair, I'd show up (possibly in my special Reiki shirt!), hang my diploma in the booth for credibility, and get to work. I'd deliver my pitch in a calm and discreet manner, starting off with a legit-sounding overview of the history of Reiki or some such thing, before warming to my real subject. I'd repeat the process as many times as possible before getting kicked out.

I'd also be careful to display a consistently courteous attitude toward the public, other vendors, and the promoter's representatives.

[Tricky]

This thread reminds me of a discussion many months past about licensing psychics. It seems the established psychics didn't want any competition from "amateurs", but their licensing consisted of showing that you had read and understood the major writings of believers about the paranormal. There wasn't a test section.

[Anti_Hypeman]

I got one response!!! Here it is

------------------------------

My business associate and I have discussed your request and I have personally researched the James Randi Educational Foundation challenge.

We decided that your presence would not fit well and is not in the best interest of our business or personal goals. Our one rule is that EVERYONE "play nice" with each other during our event because we support people from all paths.

This challenge is fraught with controversy and does not do anything to promote peace anywhere in the universe. Furthermore, we feel that you may simply be antagonistic toward our readers, patrons and vendors and disrupt the positive energy and attitudes we try to foster.

So, unfortunately, we will not be able to have you as a vendor. My apologies if I have misunderstood you or your goals; no offense was intended. Please feel free to contact me if you wish to discuss this further.

Peace,
Betsy Cox
Sky Wilson
The Ladies of Fayre Lady Fayres

------------------------------------

Well I am still working it guys but it does not look good. I will try to find out what controversy the JREF is fraught with.

[Perpetual Notion]

Originally posted by Anti_Hypeman
I got one response!!! Here it is

------------------------------

My business associate and I have discussed your request and I have personally researched the James Randi Educational Foundation challenge.

We decided that your presence would not fit well and is not in the best interest of our business or personal goals. Our one rule is that EVERYONE "play nice" with each other during our event because we support people from all paths.

This challenge is fraught with controversy and does not do anything to promote peace anywhere in the universe. Furthermore, we feel that you may simply be antagonistic toward our readers, patrons and vendors and disrupt the positive energy and attitudes we try to foster.

So, unfortunately, we will not be able to have you as a vendor. My apologies if I have misunderstood you or your goals; no offense was intended. Please feel free to contact me if you wish to discuss this further.

Peace,
Betsy Cox
Sky Wilson
The Ladies of Fayre Lady Fayres

------------------------------------

Well I am still working it guys but it does not look good. I will try to find out what controversy the JREF is fraught with.

So now the JREF and the Challenge are threatening peace throughout the Universe? Oh, man! We totally kick a$$!!

:jedi:

[Anti_Hypeman]

Here is my resonse in a attempt to ease the "Ladies of Fayre Lady Fayres" fears. Any advice on how to deal with these people? How am I doing?

I dont understand what they are so afraid of. I am willing to rent a table, I could just show up as a normal attendee if I just wanted to antagonize psychics.

I am offering to pay $125 for a table out of my own pocket just to disucuss the challenge with them and they still wont do it.

----------------------------------------------

Thank you for the response, if you don't mind me asking I would like to know specifically what controversy the challenge is fraught with. Clearing up these controversies is precisely my goal. Many psychics quote common misconceptions as a reason for not taking the challenge I simply want to clear up the unfounded lies that seem to be out there.

For example I can prove that the money exists and can be verified by anyone. I can provide records proving that those who have taken the challenge were treated professionally and all agreements were kept. There are no controversies surrounding the challenge that cannot be shown to be false as far as I am aware.

I can assure you that I play nice. I made no mention of debunking nor will there be any. I have no intention of attending the lectures or activities much less disrupting them. If I wanted to antagonize anyone I would just buy a ticket seeing as if I do disrupt others you are well within your rights to eject me without refunding the table cost. I simply wish to dispel all the lies people seem to believe about the challenge. I Imagine the psychics attending would be interested in talking to me, would they not be interested in one million dollars?

I can provide hard proof that the challenge is in fact legitimate and upon completing it they will be awarded one million dollars. That is my only intention and I cannot imagine a fair full of psychics not being interested.

[rustypouch]

So these people "support people from all paths?" But they will not tolerate anything different than that which they believe in?

I am confused...

[vbloke]

Originally posted by Tricky
This thread reminds me of a discussion many months past about licensing psychics. It seems the established psychics didn't want any competition from "amateurs", but their licensing consisted of showing that you had read and understood the major writings of believers about the paranormal. There wasn't a test section.
brought this up several months ago.
there have been a couple of cases in the UK with faith healers being investigated for "unusual" practices.
I've written to my local MP suggesting that all psychics, faith healers and other "esoteric" should have some sort of licence to practice and that these licences should be awarded by an impartial, independent body.
All they have to do to get a licence is to demonstrate their ability in front of a panel to show their supernatural power.
Anyone who isn't licenced can then be arrested for fakery.

[ptimkey]

I am a new member and I found this thread facinating. My local resort is holding it's "first annual" psychic fair in August of 06 in Western New York State. Is anyone from this forum willing to meet me there? Any advise?
Glad to be part of this community, I should have joined sooner. timkey2@novocon.net

[Mr. Skinny]

So now the JREF and the Challenge are threatening peace throughout the Universe? Oh, man! We totally kick a$$!!

:jedi:
I believe you misread, PN. They said "This challenge ...does not do anything to promote peace anywhere in the universe."

ETA: Now that I re-read my response, I'm not sure what you meant. ???

[Mr. Skinny]

Anti Hypeman, those are good emails. Polite and to the point.

I think their email response to you was rather polite as well.

Maybe you can find a common ground.

[T'ai Chi]

I suppose you could take some books, like Flim-Flam!, the Psychic Mafia, Cold Reading and so on.... I'm sure many of the participants at these fairs would be interested in picking up a few pointers…

And non-tracts.

[mac]

Anti Hypeman, can you get municipal permission to hold an information booth outside the premises?... as in just out the door? Some protesters have done that around here, just outside visiting exhibits, and some have worked out quite well. Organizers have no say as to who cas set up just on the sidewalk heading into or out of the exhibition hall, but you'd need permission from city hall (perhaps your local police station could give you more info).

[T'ai Chi]

Instead of handing out stuff, it is much more effective to do demonstrations. Let people take away things in their brains, not by their hands.

[ObscureReferenceMan]

Well done, Anti Hypeman! Keep us posted if you received another reply!

And when/if you do get into the fair, remember to bring "The Demon Haunted World" and "Why People Believe Weird Things". As well as info on cognitive and logical fallacies, memory, optical illusions, etc. Good luck!

[ObscureReferenceMan]

Another approach might be to book yourself as a psychic. Do some readings, get some feedback from customers, then reveal yourself as a fake. Like Kari Coleman did (http://www.randi.org/swift/current/psychic.html). It would probably help if you videotaped your readings so you could play them back for people to show them where they gave away info, or filled in the blanks.

[Bradk3]

Another approach might be to book yourself as a psychic. Do some readings, get some feedback from customers, then reveal yourself as a fake. Like Kari Coleman did (http://www.randi.org/swift/current/psychic.html). It would probably help if you videotaped your readings so you could play them back for people to show them where they gave away info, or filled in the blanks.
It would probably be best to wear loose clothing and good running shoes when attempting this...

[ptimkey]

The fair hits my resort town in mid AUG and want to go but don't want to go alone. I was thinking maybe saying I want to get into the biz. Where can I get certified? . I'm still a rookie here and would love tp hear from WNY state.

[ptimkey]

Still a rookie here. The "first annual fair" is this weekend and I still have two questions:

Is it OK to hand out million dollar applications at fairs? (or is that asking for trouble?)

I am going alone, how should I play these people? pete

[canadarocks]

I am a new member and I found this thread facinating. My local resort is holding it's "first annual" psychic fair in August of 06 in Western New York State. Is anyone from this forum willing to meet me there? Any advise?
Glad to be part of this community, I should have joined sooner. timkey2@novocon.net

Where in Western NY? What are the dates? My in-laws are in Binghamton NY and we go up often. Maybe the planets would align and I could potentially go!

[Starthinker]

Have you ever heard the term "china whispers?" You get 10 people to walk around in pairs and as they come up to groups of people they say things like "Did you see that table? They are the clearest thinking, most logical table here. They make the most sense out of anyone here. Man, they changed my whole way of thinking." etc. etc.. Pretty soon your table will have a crowd!

People tend to think that it's important to be with the "in" crowd so the fact that they "overheard" what some in the crowd are thinking they will think they are acting on secret, privelidged information. It may not change anyone's belief system but it's a great social experiment and if you do draw a large enough crowd you can tell them what happened and how they were swayed.

[ObscureReferenceMan]

ptimkey,

If you're going to walk around "shilling" for the JREF prize, be as nice and polite as possible. Let them know you are there to inform, not argue or be combative. And that you (I assume) really would like any genuine psychics (or mediums, dowsers, etc.) to win and therefore be vindicated. But be prepared to be called closed-minded (I find that saying something along the lines of, "If you could show me some convincing evidence, I would change my mind. But if I could show you your "powers" were not real, would you change your mind?" is a pretty strong convincer.) or cynical (have definitions memorized, or handy).

Keep us apprised. Good luck!