Help me debunk healers

[Anti_Hypeman]

I found the following ad in a local paper today

Want a natural way to prevent and treat disease? Find out about naturopathic medicine, a complementary approach to better health using nutrition, herbs, homeopathy, and other natural therapies along with modern diagnostics and holistic assessment. Bring your questions and learn how you can benefit. Free of charge, healthy refreshments provided.

Here is their site www.thehealingpowerofnature.com

I am thinking about taking them up on their offer. Its not often someone advertises homeopathy and invites the public to "bring your questions".

Any advice on what questions to bring? I know the basics of homeopathy but have never heard the term "naturopathic medicine". Help me out, drop some knowledge on me yo.

Are there any interviews with similar people I can read to see how they respond to questions? What kinds of challenges would the JREF accept from them?

After recently trying to invite myself to similar events and failing I am quite egar to accept this gracious offer.

[Alkatran]

Start by yelling at them about how they shouldn't use any 'modern' techniques because they are pure EVIL. Only ancient Chinese medicine which has been approved by GOD is acceptable!

[Nex]

You should spend some time at the Science, Mathematics, Medicine, and Technology forum (http://www.randi.org/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=13). Or do a search here on homeopathy, naturopathy, etc. Or you could PM one of the members of the Anti-Homeopathy Illuminati. :D

There's also Quackwatch (http://www.quackwatch.org/index.html) and its Recommended Links (http://www.quackwatch.org/index.html#links).

I hope that helped you some. Remember to be nice. Read the link in my sig if you haven't already. And good luck.

[Skeptical Greg]

.....and other natural therapies along with modern diagnostics and holistic assessment..... Ask them " Why bother with the ' modern diagnostics ' part ?"

This is called CYA ...

In other words.. Along with our natural therapies and holistic assessment, it would still be a good idea to check with your doctor..


Guess which part you could do without alltogether?

[Timothy]

Look up the laws where you live. Find out what regulations exist regarding making claims about diagnosing and treating illness. Listen politely to the presentation. Allow the presenters to say anything they want about methods to make you feel better, increase energy, etc., but as soon as they make any claim about being able to diagnose a medical problem, or treat a medical problem, ask the presenter if he (or any of his staff) are doctors and are licensed to practice medicine. I'll assume that they don't. Remind them (if applicable to the laws of your area) that they are not licensed to diagnose or treat individuals, and that it is a criminal offense to do so (a felony in the US). Continue to do this at every statement regarding diagnosing or treating illness ... asking "Are you a licensed physician in ....". If you held up a little digital recorder each time you asked the question, that might unnerve the speaker as well. Take as much information as you can, and file a complaint with local, federal and state authorities.

Remember that licensing is done on some practices like accupuncture, but the licensing applies to the person having been trained how to use needles and not casue infection, not a validation of the effectiveness of the accupuncture.

[topaz9000]

Go in as a person who is willing and open to be taught. Never "jump" them and just assault them with questions no one can answer. You might want to ask about the success rate, published in a respected medical journal, and why, if this is so successful, hasn't the medical profession discovered this wonderful treatment. You might want to also ask them to tell you what specific chemicals in the treatments are effective and why. But the whole "diagnose and treat and illness" and that being a felony without a medical license, is probably the most effective approach. Don't doubt for a minute that they will tell you that there is, at least, one doctor among them. Doctors can make a ton of dough, without having to deal with insurance companies or malpractice insurance companies, by doing this sort of stuff instead.

I think that once they are at the production and product distribution stage, they believe their propaganda and no amount of questioning will help the people who sell, but maybe the people who are also there will witness their befuddlement and choose not to waste their money.

[Red Siegfried]

Originally posted by Alkatran
Start by yelling at them about how they shouldn't use any 'modern' techniques because they are pure EVIL. Only ancient Chinese medicine which has been approved by GOD is acceptable!

Yeah, that'll work :)

[Red Siegfried]

Timothy and topaz both have good ideas. I would doubt, however that you'll have any luck talking the perveyors out of it unless you're willing to take them to court or get the govt to take them the court.

When I hear acquaintances mentions stuff like this, I do the whole, "let's sit down and have a long talk" thing.

[Timothy]

Originally posted by Red Siegfried
Timothy and topaz both have good ideas. I would doubt, however that you'll have any luck talking the perveyors out of it unless you're willing to take them to court or get the govt to take them the court.

The main idea is not to talk the purveyors out of it ... it's to point out the fraud to the attendees. Getting the audience to hear time and again that the purveyors are claiming to do things that only licensed doctors are legally allowed to do hopefully changes their minds about fluffy medicine. The complaints to regulatory agencies may have an effect if enough people do it without having to personally take it to court.

[Gr8wight]

Be aware that homeopathy and naturopathy are two different things. Not saying that either of them is more or less valid than the other, only that they are not the same.

[Anti_Hypeman]

Originally posted by Gr8wight
Be aware that homeopathy and naturopathy are two different things. Not saying that either of them is more or less valid than the other, only that they are not the same.

Yes if the ad didnt mention Homeopathy specifically then I would probally just have skipped it. I can question them on specific things such as water memmory and hopefully make some of their marks think twice.

As far as their Naturopathy is concerned as far as I can tell they just give you crap to use along with the traditional treatments and then give all credit to the magic pills if something gets better. Thats a tougher one to take on.