Implanted Microchip in Man's Hand

[Roadtoad]

Okay, now this is just creepy... (http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060106/tc_nm/technology_implants_dc)

Graafstra was drawn to RFID tagging to make life easier in this technological age, but Sklar said he was more intrigued by the technology's potential in a broader sense.

In the future, technological advances will allow people to store, transmit and access encrypted personal information in an increasing number of wireless ways, Sklar said.

Wary of privacy issues, Sklar said he is developing a fabric "shield" to protect such chips from being read by strangers seeking to steal personal information or identities.

One advantage of the RFID chip, Graafstra said, is that it cannot get lost or stolen. And the chip can always be removed from a person's body.

"It's kind of a gadget thing, and it's not so impressive to have it on your key chain as it is to have it in you," Sklar said. "But it's not for everyone."

Okay, forgetting about the Book of Revelation and other religious silliness, this worries me. We've already had numerous abuses of privacy, not to mention an incredible number of near misses, so why would I want to place myself in deeper jeopardy? I'm against this, period. No one should be placed in such a vulnerable position.

[Diamond]

It's a matter of time before they start tagging people, starting with pedophiles.

[Melendwyr]

I wouldn't be surprised if they started with infants, to ease identification and make it harder for people to steal them.

[Roadtoad]

A pedophile has broken the law, and most of them have generally made it clear they will continue to break the law. But what about the rest of us? There's no way I'd go with this. My activities, my income, my purchasing habits, are my business, no one else's.

[Melendwyr]

A pedophile has broken the law, and most of them have generally made it clear they will continue to break the law. But what about the rest of us? There's no way I'd go with this. My activities, my income, my purchasing habits, are my business, no one else's. So you don't pay your taxes? You don't have a credit card? You've never taken out a major loan?

Most of the information you're talking about is already publically available. Although the Bush Administration has been working on computerized databases that would make it easier to access, technically the government can deduce almost everything you do already, just by examining receipt records from businesses.

Once electronic money comes on the scene... everything you purchase, and most places you go, will be easily trackable and monitorable.

[Boo]

The other side.......

Battle field troops located by GPS for faster evac, medical information i.e. Blood type and allergies, house arrest- instead of bulky anklets that can be removed, screw a device into the bone.

There are potential uses as well as abuses. Make it temporary and voluntary(for some) and limit the information placed.


Boo

[Roadtoad]

Well, considering we already have electronic money, given that we have ATM cards and such.

What I'm talking about is within reason. Yes, there's going to be some information out there, but as George Will pointed out, the most important words when you're talking about rights are found in the phrase, "...up to a point."

In other words, just why does the Government need to know if I drink Tabby Porter, or Red Tail Ale? WHY is that important to anyone, save for the brewers of this world? If I choose to drink something else, what happens then? Whose watch list do I find myself on?

Who gives a rat's @$$ what color I paint the walls of my house? It's no one's business, save my own and the paint manufacturer. (BTW: We went with a pale green. Appropriate, given the handle.) At what point do we stop and say, "Enough"?

[Soapy Sam]

Between GPS and RFID, I don't know what things are coming from.

[Roadtoad]

The other side.......

Battle field troops located by GPS for faster evac, medical information i.e. Blood type and allergies, house arrest- instead of bulky anklets that can be removed, screw a device into the bone.

There are potential uses as well as abuses. Make it temporary and voluntary(for some) and limit the information placed.


Boo

That makes real sense, right there. The problem is that once the Feds have their hooks into something, they generally don't let go.

How much longer, for example, are we going to keep the Tennessee Valley Authority going, even though the original purpose for it, rural electrification, has long ago been fulfilled? Apply this to programs for security and technical advancement that date back to even before WWI in some cases, which should have been shut down years ago, and you have evidence right there to keep our Government's power limited. And, no, I'm not trying to replace Shanek, but for crying out loud, isn't there some area of my life which doesn't need to be scrutinized with a proctoscope?

[Capsid]

It's already being used. (http://technology.guardian.co.uk/online/story/0,3605,1234827,00.html)

[Roadtoad]

Scary. For something as trivial as being able to consider yourself a VIP in a dance club.

[Amapola]

As the article says, this is being used in livestock. It is supposed to help control movement of livestock, check disease in livestock and prevent stolen animals from being sold, but the problem is, hardly any one in the USA has a reader. Many of the livestock auction places DO NOT have a reader and can not check the chips, even if they are there. The other problem is, even when you KNOW you put a chip in the d@mn animal, you sometimes can't find it even when you DO have a reader. Apparently the chips can migrate at least a little. The technology will need a lot of work before it will perform very well.

I am also unsure that the idea will recieve public approval. Here in the US animal owners are being told that at some point in the future we will be required to microchip all our animals, and many people are adamantly against this. The program is called NAIS, National Animal Identification System, and is being promoted as a way to keep our food supply "safe". People who are against it point out that at present, the way the NAIS proposal is written, owners of a single chicken will be under more government scrutiny than owners of a hand gun. As I understand it, each animal would be given a 15-digit number and the owner of the animal would be registered and the location of the animal pinpointed with GPS. If the animal has offspring, if it is sold, moved, dies etc. the owner must notify authorities within 24 hours or be subject to "enforcement" (they don't say what that will be). Also third parties will be required to report "sightings" of animals. So if a vet came to my place, for example, that person would be required to report my owning all the animals I own, and that information would be checked against the database. If I had animals I had not reported I would again be subject to "enforcement". This just sounds a little draconian and so I feel either the proposal will be re-written or it simply won't go through. Even so I am against it and quite happily sign petitions etc. when I can.

And to do all this with humans???? Yikes.

[Dogdoctor]

I wouldn't get too excited about this. It's best use would be to provide medical information in the case of unconsciousness or in emergencies upon admittance to a hospital.

[Zep]

What about the dogs and cats! Who will speak up for all the dogs and cats!

[Boo]

What about the dogs and cats! Who will speak up for all the dogs and cats!
We're already microchipping dogs and cats.

Lizards are next.

:eek:



Boo

[Zep]

We're already microchipping dogs and cats.

Lizards are next.

:eek:



BooGreat! That means they will be bypassing me...

[Dogdoctor]

Great! That means they will be bypassing me...
I wouldn't count on it biologists use microchips to study wild aquatic animals. I have heard your pretty wild, so watch out for any biologists around.

[luchog]

isn't there some area of my life which doesn't need to be scrutinized with a proctoscope?
Only if you have something to hide. Do you have something to hide, citizen? Are you not happy in our glorious utopia, citizen? Failure to be happy is treason. Treason is punishable by summary execution.

Are you a mutant, citizen?

[luchog]

We're already microchipping dogs and cats.

Lizards are next.

Nope, snakes. Most high-end snake breeders chip all of their animals.

[alfaniner]

Nope, snakes. Most high-end snake breeders chip all of their animals.

What happens then, if a chipped snake eats a chipped cat or dog?

[supercorgi]

We're already microchipping dogs and cats.

Lizards are next.

:eek:



Boo
Yep. The Supercorgi is already microchipped (the dog not myself!). Most of the purebreed dog owners I know have their dogs chipped. These chips don't involve GPS but transmit an ID number when scanned. Makes recovery much better if they get lost/stolen.

Woof!
:run:

[Ladewig]

My science knowledge is a bit limited so forgive the question, but won't microchips in people's upper arms mean that they can't have MRIs?

[love]

I think you are all a load of paranoid conspiracy theorists.

Micro-chipping is:
A) absurd
B) can't be done
C) will never happen

[Ladewig]

I think you are all a load of paranoid conspiracy theorists.


That's a mighty strong accusation from someone who said ...

...it's fluoride salts that keep people compliant and unquestioning. Fluoride was tested and used for this reason in German and Russian concentration camps during WWII.

Unless, of course, you don't actually believe that. In which case, we'll have to find a title for people who post things they don't believe with the sole purpose of evoking responses from other posters.

[supercorgi]

I think you are all a load of paranoid conspiracy theorists.

Micro-chipping is:
A) absurd
B) can't be done
C) will never happen
Thank you for your well reasoned input. :woo

[ungoliant]

I'm against this, period. No one should be placed in such a vulnerable position.

although in theory i agree with you, we both gotta just get used to the new society. privacy is a thing of the past.

[Zep]

...it's fluoride salts that keep people compliant and unquestioning. Fluoride was tested and used for this reason in German and Russian concentration camps during WWII.That would have been BROMIDE. Which was also given to servicemen to prevent them thinking untoward and inappropriate thoughts about their foxhole buddies and the enemy troops raining fire down upon them.

[Roadtoad]

I think you are all a load of paranoid conspiracy theorists.

Micro-chipping is:
A) absurd
B) can't be done
C) will never happen

Micro-chipping is:
A.) Proven.
B.) Being Done.
C.) Happening.

Read the f***ing opening post, and get your head out of your @$$ for once, Love.

[love]

It's funny how ideas only the nuttiest conspriacy theorists held only 20 years old are now accepted facts.

I wonder what will become accepted and obvious in 20 years time.

[Roadtoad]

Troll.

[clarsct]

Back on topic:
Wasn't it in PopSci a while back that a guy has a chip in his arm that he was using to move a robot arm in another part of the country?

I wouldn't mind the chip, but the government can keep their noses out of it. If I wanted a chip to coordinate my cell phone, computer, and PDA, all by just thinking about it, then cool(Look for these to pop up in about ten years, according to the experts.), But Big Nanny Government can keep their damned hands off.

What would happen if someone hacked you, though?

[Dogdoctor]

deleted due to lack of content

[Roboramma]

It's funny how ideas only the nuttiest conspriacy theorists held only 20 years old are now accepted facts.

Hmm. Maybe it's because 20 years ago it couldn't be done and now it can. If you believed that there were airplanes 2000 years ago I'd call you deluded. If you believed there weren't airplanes today I'd call you deluded.

Or to put it another way - if you said you had a chip in your head that allowed you to speak 50 different langauges fluently I'd call you deluded. If you said that one day such chips would be possible i'd think you were probably (though not necessarily) right.

See the difference?

Okay, now let's get back to intelligent discussion.

[ysabella]

I think this would be more fun for personal use if you could reprogram it yourself, essentially changing your password. I guess that's not how transponders are, though.

You can have ferrets microchipped, but it'll wander around their bodies. They are baggy-style critters.

[supercorgi]

You can have ferrets microchipped, but it'll wander around their bodies. They are baggy-style critters.
Really?! Ferrets are really furry snakes, also known as "carpet sharks.":ferret: :shark:

[jj]

I think you are all a load of paranoid conspiracy theorists.

Micro-chipping is:
A) absurd
B) can't be done
C) will never happen


Do you get out much? It may be absurd, from an ethical viewpoint, but that's not what you appear to be saying.

It can, and is done. Your statement is controverted by the present technology, no advances are required.

As to happening, yes, it is happening to animals already, as somebody has said.

[ysabella]

Really?! Ferrets are really furry snakes, also known as "carpet sharks.":ferret: :shark:
Also, "land eels." Although Richard Bach refers to them as "land dolphins."

It's $50 to microchip a ferret. But if few rescues have a reader for them, maybe it's not money well spent anyway.

[KingMerv00]

Am I the only one who sees this company as a bad business investment? Don't you think Christians will fill the streets in protest of the "Mark of the Beast"?

I'm not sure they have a bright future.

[luchog]

Really?! Ferrets are really furry snakes, also known as "carpet sharks.":ferret: :shark:
With an insatiable appetite for dirty socks.

[Ladewig]

My science knowledge is a bit limited so forgive the question, but won't microchips in people's upper arms mean that they can't have MRIs?

What will happen if a microchip is near an operating MRI machine?

[Thing]

Back on topic:
Wasn't it in PopSci a while back that a guy has a chip in his arm that he was using to move a robot arm in another part of the country?

Could this be the publicity-ravenous Captain Cyborg, a.k.a. Kevin Warwick of Reading University? He claimed to have turned himself into a cyborg and that implanting him and his wife would make them telepathic. After the Soham murders he offered to chip a couple's children for their protection to some oprobrium . I don't believe he ever followed through.

[supercorgi]

With an insatiable appetite for dirty socks.
They steal and hide EVERYTHING. It was amazing what large things my ferrets could drag under the couch. Not to mention hiding caches of food everywhere.
I'm a thief!
:ferret:

[Roadtoad]

Am I the only one who sees this company as a bad business investment? Don't you think Christians will fill the streets in protest of the "Mark of the Beast"?

I'm not sure they have a bright future.

I was thinking of the possible abuses of privacy, and that people would choose to avoid losing what's left of same. But, hey, whatever works.

[Belz...]

Okay, forgetting about the Book of Revelation and other religious silliness, this worries me. We've already had numerous abuses of privacy, not to mention an incredible number of near misses, so why would I want to place myself in deeper jeopardy? I'm against this, period. No one should be placed in such a vulnerable position.

Actually, I've been asking for this for over a decade, now. Yes, implant a microchip into my arm so I can buy stuff without my credit card, have any allergies checked by a doctor even if I'm unconscious, have the police track me if I kill someone, and have a computer tell the ambulance that I'm having a heart attack even before I know it.

Clean conscience. No need to run anyway.

[TjW]

I think this would be more fun for personal use if you could reprogram it yourself, essentially changing your password. I guess that's not how transponders are, though.

You can have ferrets microchipped, but it'll wander around their bodies. They are baggy-style critters.

There are reprogrammable tags. Atmel makes one.
You can also set a bit to "lock" the data so it's no longer reprogrammable.

[ysabella]

Oho! Thanks, TjW. That's a fun bit of knowledge. :)