Taking the fight to the psychics...

[pdw709]

Given that we know that certain psychics, Sylvia Brown for example, have been exposed as frauds, liars and cheats, then why doesn’t someone - the JREF for example take the fight to them?

Would it not be a good idea to take out full page adverts in major newspapers and/or on TV and actually call these people the frauds that we know they are. History has shown that these people shy away from confrontation in court, because they know that they have no proof, and would easily lose. And if they do think that they could win, then let them have a go - Uri Geller certainly thought so!

If they JREF have some money, then I would much rather see it being put to use proactively. If it doesn’t have enough, them I’m sure people would be more than happy to donate to such a worthy cause. Why not set up a separate fighting fund for example?

It just seems frustrating that while Sylvia and her cronies can carry on de-frauding people, the truth is out there and on OUR side.

Just a few thoughts.......It would be good to get a lawyers perspective though!

Phil (A frustrated skeptic)

[jimtron]

I'm not sure that ads like this would do much good. The psychics will likely ignore the ads or use them to show how they are being persecuted. I think in-depth, investigative TV shows and print articles would be more effective.

[pdw709]

I think in-depth, investigative TV shows and print articles would be more effective.

Great idea - Could'nt the JREF create a range of such documentaries, focusing on different topics, psychics or critcial thinking etc. These could then be given free to schools and colleges. Why not try to get them shown on network TV?

Rather than wait for some investigative reporter to do the job, then why not do it ourselves. History has shown that the vast majority of TV stations cannot be trusted to create a balanced program.

Phil

[jimtron]

It seems that most TV networks are more interested in that of the woo. Non-critical shows about the paranormal may well get better ratings than skeptical ones. But I agree, it's a good idea.

[Almo]

What TV station would want to show a program with no "what if...?" People just eat that paranormal stuff up.

Edit:
The filter didn't like the other word I used for "stuff." :)

[pdw709]

What we need is some publicity. Why can't the JREF hold a live press conference and publicly state a list of indivudals who are fakes, or offer them to take part in the Million Dollar Challenge. We need to get people talking. The more aggressive and potentially liablus the statement then the bigger potential audiance. Play them at their own game.

A high profile court trial will at least get people debating the issues. Perhaps then people will start to actually LOOK at the evidence.

[Bone_Vulture]

I'm not sure that ads like this would do much good. The psychics will likely ignore the ads or use them to show how they are being persecuted. I think in-depth, investigative TV shows and print articles would be more effective.

Agreed, and I believe that the internet is the most cost effective method of distributing information about psychics and other frauds. And yeah, it'd be grand if some TV show could be persuaded to take Browne and her kin under scientific scrutiny on some episode.

[pdw709]

Why for example, could'nt the JREF simply sue a high profile psychic?

[Almo]

Sue them for what? Giving advice and making predictions are not illegal. You'd have to catch them pulling some slander or libel. Let's take Sylvia Browne for example. What could she be sued over?

[The Odd Emperor]

Given that we know that certain psychics, Sylvia Brown for example, have been exposed as frauds, liars and cheats, then why doesn’t someone - the JREF for example take the fight to them?

Would it not be a good idea to take out full page adverts in major newspapers and/or on TV and actually call these people the frauds that we know they are. History has shown that these people shy away from confrontation in court, because they know that they have no proof, and would easily lose. And if they do think that they could win, then let them have a go - Uri Geller certainly thought so!

If they JREF have some money, then I would much rather see it being put to use proactively. If it doesn’t have enough, them I’m sure people would be more than happy to donate to such a worthy cause. Why not set up a separate fighting fund for example?

It just seems frustrating that while Sylvia and her cronies can carry on de-frauding people, the truth is out there and on OUR side.

Just a few thoughts.......It would be good to get a lawyers perspective though!

Phil (A frustrated skeptic)
Isn’t there already a program on TV that does just this….. I can’t remember the name but a couple of stage magicians host it. ….:D

[Ducky]

Watch out you don't end up in court on a libel case in front of a sympathetic judge.


Edited to add:

I meant that the psychics could sue you for libel and the sympathetic judge to their cause could screw you up bad.

[alfaniner]

From Fox News' entertainment critic Roger Friedman today, after making his Oscar predictions:

"Now, look, if I'm wrong, I'll take the Sylvia Browne psychic out: I didn’t say it. I always meant the opposite, I just didn’t have time to tell you."

I hope that is becoming more the default position people hold.

Link:
Friedman column (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,181554,00.html)

[Jon.]

Sue them for what? Giving advice and making predictions are not illegal. You'd have to catch them pulling some slander or libel. Let's take Sylvia Browne for example. What could she be sued over?

Giving advice and making predictions is illegal (http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/C-46/42972.html#section-365) in Canada if done for "a consideration" (ie. payment of some kind). Whether that section of the Criminal Code would stand up to a Charter challenge is another question entirely, but perhaps someone would like to bring charges against their local psychic?

[AnotherSillyAlias]

Giving advice and making predictions is illegal (http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/C-46/42972.html#section-365) in Canada if done for "a consideration" (ie. payment of some kind). Whether that section of the Criminal Code would stand up to a Charter challenge is another question entirely, but perhaps someone would like to bring charges against their local psychic?

The problem with this is that, here anyway, most ads for psychic "services" usually include, in extremely small type, that their service is for entertainment purposes only. Nothing illegal about entertaining people for money!

[Anti_Hypeman]

We cant win the media battle they get tons of coverage for free. I see woos on the local morning news with increasing frequency prophets, pet accupuncture, homeopaths, psychics, they all get plenty of uncontested time and have their butts licked by the interviewer.

Its disgusting but I dont know what can be done about it. Maybe a infomercial for Flim-Flam or another book? people love those so much. Secrets the psychics dont want you to know.

[Solus]

There are some things we have to "accept" in this world. People with crazy beliefs is one of those things. It's human nature I'm afarid. but maybe I'm too cynical?

[eri]

It's too easy to get sued by the psychics. Penn & Teller have been sued at least 40 times for their show, and they never even said 'fraud'. The psychics will always have the upper hand, it seems. So many people aren't even interested in the truth.

I do advocate local talks on critical thinking, however. The Bad Astronomer did a great one in my neighborhood last year.

[Starthinker]

Maybe you could afford an infomercial. The "Anti-Psychic Friends Network."

[Zep]

No, there's a better way. Don't fight the torrent, go with it.

We should develop a "super-psychic" who can out-psychic all of the waffle-heads like Sylvia Brown. AND he/she would be super handsome, speak melifluously, and be kind to animals, etc. And all the predictions would be 100% all the time, no cold-reading at all! (At least, that is what the pre-prepared blurb that reaches the media will say!)

Then make the claims get more and more outrageous - able to talk to aliens, can dowse for water with his bare hands, etc, etc. And ask for money - lots more money!

Then, on David Letterman, in the company of Sylvia Brown and all the other wannabe heads-on-TV, expose each and every trick that they use, one by one, in detail.

However I think some fast-talking white-bearded little magician has done this before...! ;)