Honest question: Why Atheist, not atheist?

[BrianSI]

I'm know I'm missing something, but why do some capitalize the leading 'a' in atheist? I understand if it is referring to a specific organization's title, but doesn't it play too much into the hands of someone who would claim it's just another form of religion? Or is it a pride thing? Not a statement, just an honest question. Thanks for any help.

[Complexity]

I capitalize it if it is the first word in a sentence; otherwise, I don't.

Don't believe there's a good reason for capitalizing it otherwise.

Many people are simply odd.

[BrianSI]

Okay. Thanks. That's they way I was leaning.

[Tricky]

A lot of belief systems are capitalized because they are based on a proper name, like Christ or Buddha. So I'm guessing that for some stupid unbelievers, there is a toggle in their tiny little brains that says, "capitalize your belief system". We smarter ones never capitalize Atheist.

[UserGoogol]

Also, it makes us seem more important.

[El Greco]

It's simple: Those who don't use capitals are communists.

[FireGarden]

Everyone knows the proper spelling is "A-theist"

[PogoPedant]

Everyone knows the proper spelling is "A-theist"
A-thiest, surely?

[slingblade]

No, A-theist, and don't call me Shirley.

[cyborg]

I'm the athi-est around here.

</groan>

[the_bgma]

It's in the title, that's why!

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The Bible of the Good and Moral Atheist

[Marquis de Carabas]

I prefer to capitalise the last five letters to better emphasise that not only do I not believe in God, but I'm also going to be stealing an arseload of diamonds.

[Iacchus]

A lot of belief systems are capitalized because they are based on a proper name, like Christ or Buddha. So I'm guessing that for some stupid unbelievers, there is a toggle in their tiny little brains that says, "capitalize your belief system". We smarter ones never capitalize Atheist.So were the Masons founded by some guy named Mason? Shouldn't a proper title deserve proper respect? Why not Atheist? Of course at the same time I see no reason to capitalize theist, albeit Deist maybe, but whatever.

[Nyarlathotep]

So were the Masons founded by some guy named Mason? Shouldn't a proper title deserve proper respect? Why not Atheist? Of course at the same time I see no reason to capitalize theist, albeit Deist maybe, but whatever.

Because atheist is simply a descriptive word, not a title. Now if you were talking about an actual organization of athiests, i.e. American Atheists, then capitalization would be correct.

[di Malebranche]

Exactly. Where as Catholicism, Christianity, Islam and all the other fun religions/perspectives get a capital letter (ESPECIALLY Scientology), atheism is a bit more broad in terms of what it encompasses. It's not a religion, and not an organized sect. It's quite simply a disbelief in the theological, hence "atheism".

[Iacchus]

And what happens when the Atheist movement becomes official?

[Nyarlathotep]

And what happens when the Atheist movement becomes official?


As I said, any organization that uses the word atheist in the title would capitalize it. This has nothing to do with atheism being "official" or not, it simply has to do with the rules of English. Islam, Christianity, the Masons, etc. identify specific organizations, thus they are proper nouns, thus they are capitalized. Atheism denotes a specific philosophy, like solpsist or utilitarian, these are not proper nouns, thus they are only capitalized if they occur at the beginning of a sentence.

[Iacchus]

As I said, any organization that uses the word atheist in the title would capitalize it. This has nothing to do with atheism being "official" or not, it simply has to do with the rules of English. And, if it were a movement that wished to be officially recognized, it's only step away from becoming an organization don't you think? How does Atheist Fundamentalism sound?

[Mercutio]

And, if it were a movement that wished to be officially recognized, it's only step away from becoming an organization don't you think? And if it were not, it can just be what it already is.
How does Atheist Fundamentalism sound? Oxymoronic. With the emphasis on "moronic".

[UserGoogol]

Hmm... looking at the Oxford English Dictionary, atheist was actually generally spelled with a capital A when it was first popularized. Of course, that was in the days when capitalization was pretty haphazard, and they would capitalize any adjective which seemed important enough.

[Nyarlathotep]

And, if it were a movement that wished to be officially recognized, it's only step away from becoming an organization don't you think? How does Atheist Fundamentalism sound?


What Mercutio said.

[c4ts]

A-thiest, surely?

From "theos," so it would be "ei."

[Jeff Corey]

I prefer to capitalise the last five letters to better emphasise that not only do I not believe in God, but I'm also going to be stealing an arseload of diamonds.
That's a sh!tload of diamonds!
A load of carrots, too.

[Iacchus]

And if it were not, it can just be what it already is.I suppose, but it looks to me like a lot a-theists (at least on this board) are fundamentally squared off with the Christian Fundamentalists. Almost as if each merits a similar form of attention. A very vocal group you have here in fact. ;)

[PogoPedant]

From "theos," so it would be "ei."
But... but...

Surely, I'm not the only one that has noticed that the foaming-in-the-mouth fundies routinely misspell atheist? I feel alone and misunderstood :( I'm gonna go drown myself in self-pity and freshly brewed coffee now.

[LotusMegami]

If their was an official Athiest Organization, all athiests would not have to join it.

Many unorganized religions capitalize, but they all share certain beliefs. Wiccans might think that capitalizing honors the god and goddess. There is nothing to be honored for athiests - no higher power that we must show respect to.

[Iacchus]

There is nothing to be honored for athiests - no higher power that we must show respect to.Not even high gurus of the craft, such as James Randi or Daniel Dennett? After all, if these folks could usher in a new era, replete without superstition or, a God, how can we not help but offer up the highest praise and accolades in their regard? Indeed, maybe we could even make them into some sort of demi god? ;)

[arthwollipot]

But... but...

Surely, I'm not the only one that has noticed that the foaming-in-the-mouth fundies routinely misspell atheist? I feel alone and misunderstood :( I'm gonna go drown myself in self-pity and freshly brewed coffee now.

In my experience, it is only those who can spell who are open-minded about religion. Although it might be the other way around.

[Shevek-72]

I'm know I'm missing something, but why do some capitalize the leading 'a' in atheist?

As a german I always feel the subconscious urge to capitalize nouns. Apart from that - no clue.

[Timothy]

Adherants to a particular philosophy traditionally are capitalized, with the words tending to lose their status of capitalization as the word is used to describe similar people, but with less formalized precision. Christian/Jew/Muslim/Buddhist/Taoist have for the most part retained capitalization in proper usage. So have Republican/Democrat/Tory/Libertarian when applied to particular organizations, although "republican" is probably the most frequently used instance to lose the capitalization when referring to someone who adheres to the principle of establishing a republic. The labels of Stoic/Epicurean/Skeptic/Cynic still retain their capitalizations when referring to someone who is a strict adherant to the original schools of philosophy, but all have acquired an uncapitalized version with a more generic definition.

"Atheist" traditionally acquired capitalization as a nod to its structured philosophy, and not with any intent of marking it as a religion. (I'm not suggesting what should have happened, just what did.)

While by no means universal, I have seen usage (which I find handy) that discriminates between the two by using "atheist" to mean "one who does not believe in a (any) God", and "Atheist" to mean "one who believes that a (any) God does not exist" ... in other words, positive atheism.

For what it's worth, the AP stylebook uses lowercase for all instances.

- Timothy

[cyborg]

Not even high gurus of the craft, such as James Randi or Daniel Dennett?

No.

After all, if these folks could usher in a new era, replete without superstition or, a God, how can we not help but offer up the highest praise and accolades in their regard? Indeed, maybe we could even make them into some sort of demi god? ;)

No.

Idiot.

[c4ts]

But... but...

Surely, I'm not the only one that has noticed that the foaming-in-the-mouth fundies routinely misspell atheist? I feel alone and misunderstood :( I'm gonna go drown myself in self-pity and freshly brewed coffee now.

I often mispell it too, because I overlook typos on message boards. It doesn't make me right.

[Upchurch]

I often mispell it too, because I overlook typos on message boards. It doesn't make me right.
I have a tendancy, sometimes intentional sometimes not, to spell and punctuate words like they were spelled and punctuated in the post I'm responding to. I do that partially because I'm lazy and don't want to look up spelling any more than I have to, but it is also so that there is no confusion as to what I am referring.

I'll also adopt terminology that I might not otherwise use for the same reason.

[Marquis de Carabas]

I have a tendancy, sometimes intentional sometimes not, to spell and punctuate words like they were spelled and punctuated in the post I'm responding to.
Unfortunately, I, too, possess such a tendancy.

[SPQR]

I consider atheism a way of thinking.

One does not often see liberal, conservative, or skeptic for that matter, capitalized. What makes atheism special?

[ntech]

I never capitalize any religion; christian, jewish, muslim.
What annoys me is that the spell checker tries to capitalize them for me. The spell checker does not try to capitalize atheist.

[GreedyAlgorithm]

I never capitalize any religion; christian, jewish, muslim.
What annoys me is that the spell checker tries to capitalize them for me. The spell checker does not try to capitalize atheist.
Heheh. It tries to capitalize them because it's proper grammar to do so. You can leave them uncapitalized if you like, but than u dun hafta grammeticalize nothin neither.

[the_bgma]

I consider atheism a way of thinking.

One does not often see liberal, conservative, or skeptic for that matter, capitalized. What makes atheism special?


Skepticism describes more of a philosophy of asking questions, I guess.

Atheism (the strong kind) on the other hand, describes more of a taking of that next logcial step. Christians take Pascal's Wager for their next step, Atheists take the Epicurean Paradox for their next step.

Plus, it looks silly to say "Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, or atheist?" Looks much better if they are all capitalized.

And one more thing: Atheism has been much maligned in the US since the Red Scare of the 1950s. The phrases relating to Atheists that comes to mind first for most Christians are "godless communist" and "godless heathen". Language is a powerful tool, and so some of us would like to reclaim that word for ourselves, and use it as a strong counterpoint to the foolishness of religion.

"Atheist"

Even better, how about a whole phrase, a new meme, to replace "godless communist". Maybe something like "Good and Moral Atheist"? ;)


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The Bible of the Good and Moral Atheist (http://www.freewebs.com/thebgma/index.htm)

[c4ts]

I hate neologisms.

[Deus Ex Machina]

I hate neologisms.


well I hate neologians

especially fundamentalist neologians...

[Piscivore]

Even better, how about a whole phrase, a new meme, to replace "godless communist". Maybe something like "Good and Moral Atheist"? ;)


"Godless Capitalist"

"Godless Constitutionalist"

[SPQR]

Plus, it looks silly to say "Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, or atheist?" Looks much better if they are all capitalized.
With all due respect, who cares what it looks like? don't we, atheists, want to distance ourselves from organized religions?

It does not make much sense to claim atheism is not a religion, and then capitalize the word like it is one.

[the_bgma]

With all due respect, who cares what it looks like? don't we, atheists, want to distance ourselves from organized religions?

It does not make much sense to claim atheism is not a religion, and then capitalize the word like it is one.

I'd say that depends if your goal is to distance yourself from organized religions, or replace organized religion.

The point of giving an alternative to organized religion is that it serves MORE than just a religious purpose. Religion gives comfort, teaches kids about the world, serves as instant community, gives a way to measure time and celebrate holidays and occasions, and provides an organization for charitable works.

If you merely quit religion, you are left with a void. If you *replace* religion, you will be much more successful in your aims.


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The Bible of the Good and Moral Atheist (http://www.freewebs.com/thebgma/index.htm)

[the_bgma]

<dup post>

[SPQR]

I'd say that depends if your goal is to distance yourself from organized religions, or replace organized religion.

The point of giving an alternative to organized religion is that it serves MORE than just a religious purpose. Religion gives comfort, teaches kids about the world, serves as instant community, gives a way to measure time and celebrate holidays and occasions, and provides an organization for charitable works.

If you merely quit religion, you are left with a void. If you *replace* religion, you will be much more successful in your aims.

I certainly agree with all these points, it just seems, to me anyway, that the capitalization of "atheist" is too self-important.

We want people to feel comfortable with our alternative to religion. We would not want to scare anyone away by having our title, "atheism", resemble the titles of that thing to which some are seeking alternatives.

[arthwollipot]

If you merely quit religion, you are left with a void. If you *replace* religion, you will be much more successful in your aims.

Void? What "void" is there that religion fills? I find it a totally unnecessary burden.

[the_bgma]

Void? What "void" is there that religion fills? I find it a totally unnecessary burden.

Religion, for many people, fills the need for community, charitable outlets, solace in times of trouble, a way to mark taime and events, and so on. That's one of the reasons it continues to be successful. Parents who aren't sure they believe in religion still go to get their kids baptized or bar-mitzvahed, because they have a community in their congregation. It's a meme that continues to propagate.

Even if *you* find such things unnecessary, the majority of people apparently need such a community. If you take it away from them without a replacement, they will merely re-build the original.

For atheists, there are many such outlets. The ones I have come across that most resemble current religious congregations are Secular Humanism, Unitarian Universalism, and Humanistic Judaism. For those who like a little less structure, there are many meetup groups, and of course online forums like these!

(You can find them all in the Book of Resources.)



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The Bible of the Good and Moral Atheist (http://www.freewebs.com/thebgma/index.htm)

[BrianSI]

I thought this thread was dead and buried a month ago. Thanks for the responses. I lean towards the lowercase 'a' however, for the reasons accordingly stated by others in this thread.