Israel funded terrorist group Hamas

[Wayne Grabert]

Though I am going to have to withdraw from the board again, I had to share this surprising bit of information. (http://www.upi.com/print.cfm?StoryID=18062002-051845-8272r)
Israel and Hamas may currently be locked in deadly combat, but, according to several current and former U.S. intelligence officials, beginning in the late 1970s, Tel Aviv gave direct and indirect financial aid to Hamas over a period of years.

Israel "aided Hamas directly -- the Israelis wanted to use it as a counterbalance to the PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization)," said Tony Cordesman, Middle East analyst for the Center for Strategic Studies.

Israel's support for Hamas "was a direct attempt to divide and dilute support for a strong, secular PLO by using a competing religious alternative," said a former senior CIA official.

(snip)

But with the triumph of the Khomeini revolution in Iran, with the birth of Iranian-backed Hezbollah terrorism in Lebanon, Hamas began to gain in strength in Gaza and then in the West Bank, relying on terror to resist the Israeli occupation.

Israel was certainly funding the group at that time. One U.S. intelligence source who asked not to be named said that not only was Hamas being funded as a "counterweight" to the PLO, Israeli aid had another purpose: "To help identify and channel towards Israeli agents Hamas members who were dangerous terrorists."

In addition, by infiltrating Hamas, Israeli informers could only listen to debates on policy and identify Hamas members who "were dangerous hard-liners," the official said.

In the end, as Hamas set up a very comprehensive counterintelligence system, many collaborators with Israel were weeded out and shot. Violent acts of terrorism became the central tenet, and Hamas, unlike the PLO, was unwilling to compromise in any way with Israel, refusing to acquiesce in its very existence.

But even then, some in Israel saw some benefits to be had in trying to continue to give Hamas support: "The thinking on the part of some of the right-wing Israeli establishment was that Hamas and the others, if they gained control, would refuse to have any part of the peace process and would torpedo any agreements put in place," said a U.S. government official who asked not to be named.

(snip)

According to former State Department counter-terrorism official Larry Johnson, "the Israelis are their own worst enemies when it comes to fighting terrorism."

"The Israelis are like a guy who sets fire to his hair and then tries to put it out by hitting it with a hammer."

"They do more to incite and sustain terrorism than curb it," he said.

[a_unique_person]

But even then, some in Israel saw some benefits to be had in trying to continue to give Hamas support: "The thinking on the part of some of the right-wing Israeli establishment was that Hamas and the others, if they gained control, would refuse to have any part of the peace process and would torpedo any agreements put in place," said a U.S. government official who asked not to be named.

(snip)

According to former State Department counter-terrorism official Larry Johnson, "the Israelis are their own worst enemies when it comes to fighting terrorism."

"The Israelis are like a guy who sets fire to his hair and then tries to put it out by hitting it with a hammer."

"They do more to incite and sustain terrorism than curb it," he said.



I have wondered about this myself. While I don't believe the 9/11 attacks were the work of some Israeli/US secret organisation, the use of terror has suited Ariel Sharon down to the ground. Already, step 1 or the 'roadmap' is the end of the roadmap, as it depends on an end to terrorism. That isn't going to happen. Maybe he just reads to many stories about Joshua.

[Cleopatra]

These are old but accurate news... I " asked" once and I was surprized that none responded to this comment " Why Arafat is still alive"...

My problem with the Arabs is exactly this: That they legitimize Sharon's Policy.

That is the reason we have to resist to any form of Terrorism: Terrorism gives the opportunity that various States seek, to exercise control to their people, to distract the interest of the citizens from other vital problems...

It's terrorism that keeps the Arabs slaves too...

[Baker]

I don’t see anything to validate the story until there is more prove it’s just an anecdote.

[DialecticMaterialist]

Yes it's true, the US funded the Soviet Union. Just a few years before the US went against them in a Cold War. The funded leader Stalin killed almost 20 million of his own people! America gave the Soviets money and then called them the "Evil Empire" what hypocrites! The US even gave the USSR weapons that were used on civilians and in war.

The proof is right here:


lend-lease
Related: United States History

arrangement for the transfer of war supplies, including food, machinery, and services, to nations whose defense was considered vital to the defense of the United States in World War II. The Lend-Lease Act, passed (1941) by the U.S. Congress, gave the President power to sell, transfer, lend, or lease such war materials. The President was to set the terms for aid; repayment was to be “in kind or property, or any other direct or indirect benefit which the President deems satisfactory.” Harry L. Hopkins was appointed (Mar., 1941) to administer lend-lease. He was replaced (July) by Edward R. Stettinius, Jr., who headed the Office of Lend-Lease Administration, set up in Oct., 1941. In Sept., 1943, lend-lease was incorporated into the Foreign Economic Administration under Leo T. Crowley. In Sept., 1945, it was transferred to the Dept. of State. Lend-lease was originally intended for China and countries of the British Empire. In Nov., 1941, the USSR was included, and by the end of the war practically all the allies of the United States had been declared eligible for lend-lease aid.

I put the key part in bold.

the USSR received over $11 billion.


All from:

http://encyclopedia.com/html/l1/lendleas.asp

[Baker]

Originally posted by DialecticMaterialist
Yes it's true, the US funded the Soviet Union. Just a few years before the US went against them in a Cold War. The funded leader Stalin killed almost 20 million of his own people! America gave the Soviets money and then called them the "Evil Empire" what hypocrites! The US even gave the USSR weapons that were used on civilians and in war.

The proof is right here:



I put the key part in bold.




All from:

http://encyclopedia.com/html/l1/lendleas.asp




We are discussing Israel funding Hamas besides we gave the Soviet’s war aid we where on the same side at the time that is hardly funding them.

[DialecticMaterialist]

See above.

[Wayne Grabert]

Originally posted by DialecticMaterialist
Yes it's true, the US funded the Soviet Union. Just a few years before the US went against them in a Cold War.
If you're trying to make a parallel, you've failed. The US did not set up and fund the USSR or Stalin's regime. The US and the USSR during WWII were allies against a common, very dangerous enemy. What Israel did to fund Hamas was done to torpedo the peace process.

Originally posted by Baker
I don’t see anything to validate the story until there is more prove it’s just an anecdote.
What are you, an anti-Semite? It does not matter whether it is true or not. There is nothing the beloved Jewish state could do that would be wrong or shameful. If it is true, then it shows how clever the Likud, under prime minister and former Irgun leader Begin, was. Do the Palestinians have a state? No. Will the so-called "roadmap" lead anywhere? Of course not! And if the story is not true, then the Arabs are still a bunch of filthy, subhuman, irredeemable terrorists!

[aerocontrols]

Originally posted by DialecticMaterialist
Yes it's true, the US funded the Soviet Union.

That's nothing. Marx was a British agent. See my signature.

[Baker]

Originally posted by Wayne Grabert

What are you, an anti-Semite? It does not matter whether it is true or not. There is nothing the beloved Jewish state could do that would be wrong or shameful. If it is true, then it shows how clever the Likud, under prime minister and former Irgun leader Begin, was. Do the Palestinians have a state? No. Will the so-called "roadmap" lead anywhere? Of course not! And if the story is not true, then the Arabs are still a bunch of filthy, subhuman, irredeemable terrorists!

I posted these same links in renata's "Conversation about Israel/Arab relations" thread it helps show what kind of view the Arab's have of Israel.
The links are from MEMRI (Middle East Media Research Institute)


At the H Street home of the Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI), five linguists can create a media stir simply by translating, accurately, Arabic-language news stories on their black Dell computers.

From its nine-room office, which looks more like the corporate headquarters of a small Saudi oil company, MEMRI distributes, via e-mail and fax, translations of comments about America in mainstream Arabic-language newspapers and in speeches by Muslim leaders.

U.S. officials say the translated texts sometimes are unnerving.
http://memri.org/bin/media.cgi?ID=24202


Leave it to a Saudi professor to reveal why the Iraq war began when it did.
"The American war on Iraq started in March to concur with [the] Purim feast," Prof. Umayma Jalahma explained last week, according to a report by the Middle East Media Research Institute.

Why is Purim a good time for war?

Because, Jalahma wrote last year, on Purim, "the Jewish people must obtain human blood so that their clerics can prepare the holiday pastries . . . That affords the Jewish vampires great delight."
http://memri.org/bin/media.cgi?ID=47703





Following a lesson on the monotheistic faiths, Saudi Arabian schoolchildren are asked to discuss "With what types of weapons should Muslims arm themselves against the Jews?" That question is part of an official textbook for 8th grade students which also emphasizes that "Jews and Christians were cursed by Allah and turned into apes and pigs," and that "The hour [the Day of Judgment] will not come until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them."
http://memri.org/bin/media.cgi?ID=39202

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by Wayne Grabert

If you're trying to make a parallel, you've failed. The US did not set up and fund the USSR or Stalin's regime. The US and the USSR during WWII were allies against a common, very dangerous enemy. What Israel did to fund Hamas was done to torpedo the peace process.


Wait a sec, in the orginal article, it was stated Israel "wanted to use it as a counterbalance". Remember, back then, the PLO was a full-fledged terrorist organization (instead of the terrorist organization but with a thin coating of respectability it has now... HA). There was no "pease process" (as we recognize it) then.

Sounds to me that they were trying to dilute support for one terrorist organization by introducing another. A strategic move, which unfortuantely backfired. (Or appears to have. Who knows how things would have played out. Hamas may have still become strong. Or perhaps the PLO would have been in a stronger position that it is now.)

The only way you say that this was torpedoing the 'peace process' is if your concept of the peace process involved a strong PLO wiping Israel out.