Scientific impossibilities in music

[This Guy]

Anyone else bothered by songs that have lyrics that display a total lack of basic science knowledge?

There's a popular song playing on our local stations that has a line that goes - "When you hear the rolling thunder, you turn around before the lightning strikes" or something very close.

I've tried to catch enough of the song to see if there's some explanation in the rest of the song, but haven't understood one. Not sure what the title or who the singer is.

I think what bothers me most is that I generally like the sound of the song, but this glaring impossibility drives me wild (figuratively speaking;-)

Anyone familiar with this song know if the rest of the song offers an artistic reason for the miraculous ability of the person being sung about?

Any other examples out there anyone would like to share?

[Dogdoctor]

That was Sheryl Crow and the song is "Good Is Good". That lyric bothered me but once I allowed for poetic license it's not so bad. Here is an analysis of the lyrics http://blogcritics.org/archives/2005/11/09/071035.php

[Outhere]

Sheryl Crow's lyric has nothing to do with meteorology, though she is from southern Missouri where violent storms do occur, with continuous thunder and lightning so you can't tell which came first. It's not a good idea to be outdoors then, though.

Then again, she may have used substances that cause confusion between cause and effect and time frames.

[WildCat]

Does making a cannon out of an alligator count? :D

[This Guy]

That was Sheryl Crow and the song is "Good Is Good". That lyric bothered me but once I allowed for poetic license it's not so bad. Here is an analysis of the lyrics http://blogcritics.org/archives/2005/11/09/071035.php

Thanks for the link and the info!

Yea, it's a good song. I just get this little tick everytime I hear the chorus lol

[This Guy]

Does making a cannon out of an alligator count? :D

If your talking about Andrew Jackson at the battle of New Orleans, that's fact not fiction! ;)

OK, maybe my Tennessee roots are showing a bit :)

/ETA - I pass his home on the way to and from work 5 times a week :-)

[Morrigan]

Haha... I am now reminded of this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nine_Million_Bicycles#Controversy

And this thread about Megadeth and calculus o_O :
http://metal-rules.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=40432

[kevin]

I'm confused. I see nothing wrong with the lyric. I'm not a meterologist (my dad is, so I've grown up around this) and I live in Missouri so I know a bit about thunderstorms here.

Obviously light moves faster than sound so you would expect for a single thunder clap you've already seen the lighting (assuming you were facing the right way). However we get bolt after bolt after bolt.

Most storms in Missouri start a ways off, it isn't unusual (especially here on the Kansas border) to see storms way off. You see lightning but hear nothing.

Once you hear the the thunder rolling in it means the storm is damn close and it's a good time to head inside....

So yes typically you see lightining before you hear it, but hearing it means the lightning is very close and it's a good time to move before you get hit by lightning

[bruto]

On the other hand, I've always liked this little song:

NaCl (SODIUM CHLORIDE)
Kate McGarrigle, Garden Court Music ASCAP

Just a little atom of chlorine
Valence minus one
Swimming thru the sea, digging the scene
Just having fun
She's not worried about the shape or size
Of her outside shell
It's fun to ionize
Just a little atom of Cl
With an unfilled shell

But somewhere in that sea lurks
Handsome Sodium
With enough electrons on his outside shell
Plus that extra one
Somewhere in this deep blue sea
There's a negative
For my extra energy yes
Somewhere in this foam
My positive will find a home

Then unsuspecting Chlorine
Felt a magnetic pull
She looked down and her outside
Shell was full
Sodium cried "what a gas be my bride and
I'll change your name from Chlorine to Chloride"

Now the sea evaporates to make the clouds
For the rain and snow
Leaving her chemical compounds in the abscence
Of H2O
But the crystals that wash upon the shore
Are happy ones
So if you never thought before
Think of the love that you eat
When you salt your meat
Think of the love that you eat
When you salt your meat.

[El Greco]

So yes typically you see lightining before you hear it

Not if you're travelling backwards in time.

See, there's a logical explanation for everything.

[to.by]

I can't say it bothered me much, but there is a song by the Swedish songwriter Cornelis Vreesvijk (The ballad of Fredrik Åkare and Cecilia Lind) where it says in the first verse that the moon is full. Thenin the last verse when Fredrik and Cecilia has danced and walked to where Cecilia lives, the moon is new. For the life of me I can't think of a reason that dancing and walking home should take about a fortnight.

[bobdroege7]

But Marty Robbins gets the science right

I see the white puff of smoke from the rifle,
I feel the bullet go deep in my chest.

from El Paso

[jj]

Does making a cannon out of an alligator count? :D

Well, don't fire your cannon 'till the barrel melts down then :)

[Shrike]

I pass his home on the way to and from work 5 times a week :-)

Shouldn't that be ten times a week?
Or do you
A) work two-and-half days?
B) go home via a different route?
:)

[jj]

Another point: "rolling thunder" can also, I recall, be used (by older folks) to mean "nearly continuous thunder" in which case (Yes, I've seen it in the midwest) the basement can look pretty cozy.

[Hawk one]

I can't say it bothered me much, but there is a song by the Swedish songwriter Cornelis Vreesvijk (The ballad of Fredrik Åkare and Cecilia Lind) where it says in the first verse that the moon is full. Then in the last verse when Fredrik and Cecilia has danced and walked to where Cecilia lives, the moon is new. For the life of me I can't think of a reason that dancing and walking home should take about a fortnight.

Well, considering that outside the big towns in Sweden (and Norway) population can be -very- thinly spread, I don't see it as that unlikely. :p

By the way, this is the first time I've noticed that error. And now it'll probably annoy me whenever I hear it. Thanks a lot.

[This Guy]

Shouldn't that be ten times a week?
Or do you
A) work two-and-half days?
B) go home via a different route?
:)

OK, I pass his home 10 times a week, but I go to work 5 times in the same period ;-)

[This Guy]

Sheryl Crow's lyric has nothing to do with meteorology, though she is from southern Missouri where violent storms do occur, with continuous thunder and lightning so you can't tell which came first. It's not a good idea to be outdoors then, though.

Then again, she may have used substances that cause confusion between cause and effect and time frames.

I think one reason this error strikes me so strong (no pun intended) is because I learned back when I was like 12 (that was around 1966) that you could judge the distance of a storm by measuring the time between the lightning and the thunder, and multiplying it by what ever the speed of sound in miles/min is (that was the way the article in the science mag I read it in showed it I believe). I remember talking my Mom into buying me a stop watch so I could do that (yes, I've been a geek since the 60's lol).

I also spent a good deal of time trying to explain this fact of nature to my otherwise fairly intelligent ex-wife. I finally had to break out the encyclopedia to prove that's the way it works (no, that had nothing to do with her becoming an Ex).


Just got home from work (yes, I passed Jackson's home on the way;-) and I asked 6 folks at work which came first. 5 knew, the one that didn't is a 68 year old lady who thought the thunder caused the lightning. But when I explained that the lightning basically created a vacuum, that was then rapidly filled with air (with a quick demo using my hands clapping together) she said, OH, that makes sense!

[This Guy]

Haha... I am now reminded of this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nine_Million_Bicycles#Controversy

And this thread about Megadeth and calculus o_O :
http://metal-rules.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=40432

hehe

Well, I liked the first link. I got lost at about the 3rd sentence of the second.

Never have understood that calculus stuff. I'm not sure it's not all fiction! ;)

[aggle-rithm]

Anyone else bothered by songs that have lyrics that display a total lack of basic science knowledge?

There's a popular song playing on our local stations that has a line that goes - "When you hear the rolling thunder, you turn around before the lightning strikes" or something very close.

I've tried to catch enough of the song to see if there's some explanation in the rest of the song, but haven't understood one. Not sure what the title or who the singer is.

I think what bothers me most is that I generally like the sound of the song, but this glaring impossibility drives me wild (figuratively speaking;-)

Anyone familiar with this song know if the rest of the song offers an artistic reason for the miraculous ability of the person being sung about?

Any other examples out there anyone would like to share?

As a former music major, I was intrigued by your thread title -- but then I found that what you really meant was "Scientific impossibilities in lyrics".

A scientific impossibility in music would be a high C played by a contrabassoon.

Oh, well.

[Meffy]

The Beatles' song "Eight Days a Week" sounds uncomfortably like "110%" (ick ick ick) but it works if we go back to ancient Rome, when the civil week was eight days long.

[This Guy]

As a former music major, I was intrigued by your thread title -- but then I found that what you really meant was "Scientific impossibilities in lyrics".

A scientific impossibility in music would be a high C played by a contrabassoon.

Oh, well.

Dang! Guess I screwed up another thread title.

hehe Sorry for the confusion, but thanks for the input :)

[TV's Frank]

Isn't a "scientific impossibility" just an "impossibility"?

[This Guy]

Isn't a "scientific impossibility" just an "impossibility"?

LOL Now your just nit picking!

But erm...Would not being able to scratch your right elbow with your right hand be a scientific impossibility, or a physical impossibility? Or Both?

OK, it's not from a song, but best I could come up with on short notice. :)

[TV's Frank]

But erm...Would not being able to scratch your right elbow with your right hand be a scientific impossibility, or a physical impossibility? Or Both?

I think it would be an impossibility! I guess I just don't dig the "scientific" qualifier...if something is impossibile, it's just plain ol' impossibile. I wonder: what would be a "religious impossibility"?

[Hawk one]

Oh, it's not impossible at all.

Just cut of your right hand, then grab it and use it to scratch the right elbow. :p


A tad more seriously, I'd say that it's practically impossible for me or anyone else to do the trick properly, but as far as I'm aware, there is no science that says it could -never- happen (for example by evolving short underarms and long and more flexible hands). I'd say that there's a difference here, I just don't know what to call this difference. You know what I mean anyway, I hope.

[kevin]

I think one reason this error strikes me so strong (no pun intended) is because I learned back when I was like 12 (that was around 1966) that you could judge the distance of a storm by measuring the time between the lightning and the thunder, and multiplying it by what ever the speed of sound in miles/min is (that was the way the article in the science mag I read it in showed it I believe).

Yep I learned the same thing. The hard part is making sure you match the correct lighting flash with the correct thunder. When the thunder is rolling in due to bolt after bolt after bolt it's a bit difficult to be sure, thunder from the back of the storm that rolls over you just as lighting from the front of the storm flashes can make the front of the storm seem closer than it really is.

[Meffy]

Isn't a "scientific impossibility" just an "impossibility"?
Scientific impossibilities wear white lab coats and thick eyeglasses. They're commonly found near microscopes or arrays of glassware filled with brightly colored water. When you meet them on on the tennis court you'd never know they were scientific.

[tkingdoll]

Talk about bah humbug. Artists use artistic license.

[This Guy]

Talk about bah humbug. Artists use artistic license.

I love music, and I allow for artistic license. But the line from the OP being in the chorus, and repeated so often in the song, plus the blatant error, just really caught my ear, so to speak. Just got me to wondering how many other boo boos were being sung out there also.

And again, I basically like the song! I like a lot Sheryl Crow's music. Didn't know it was her till it was pointed out though :)

[Ziggurat]

Think of the love that you eat
When you salt your meat.

Is that a euphemism?

[Jon the Geek]

Maybe I'm too much of a geek, but I assumed the out-of-orderness in the lyric was intentional, to talk about something being off. I haven't listened to the lyrics closely enough to see if that makes sense, though...

[Forty-Two]

The Beatles' song "Eight Days a Week" sounds uncomfortably like "110%" (ick ick ick) but it works if we go back to ancient Rome, when the civil week was eight days long.
I think their days are 21 hours long.

[gnome]

Billy Joel spoke of Billy the Kid being a legend in his time "east and west of the Rio Grande". Bit of a problem since the river doesn't go north and south.

[Meffy]

Is that a euphemism?

Nope, it's a metal halide. (badda-BOOMP tsssh)

I think their days are 21 hours long.

Mine too, or so it seems sometimes. :-S

[This Guy]

Billy Joel spoke of Billy the Kid being a legend in his time "east and west of the Rio Grande". Bit of a problem since the river doesn't go north and south.

Been a fan of Joel since he first hit the radio. I've heard (have it on CD somewhere I think) that song, but never realized that, or just never made the connection. Good catch :)

There's probably a lot of little things like that that we hear, and either don't notice, or don't think about.

[ZirconBlue]

Billy Joel spoke of Billy the Kid being a legend in his time "east and west of the Rio Grande". Bit of a problem since the river doesn't go north and south.

Well, it does Northwest/Southeast along most of the Texas/Mexico border, even turning North/South in some places. So, he could be referring to Texas and Mexico. Or something.

[Ririon]

As a former music major, I was intrigued by your thread title -- but then I found that what you really meant was "Scientific impossibilities in lyrics".

A scientific impossibility in music would be a high C played by a contrabassoon.

Oh, well.
A low C (in the contrabassoon range) on a clarinet is scientifically impossible. A high C played by a contrabassoon is just practically impossible. :p

[rwguinn]

Billy Joel spoke of Billy the Kid being a legend in his time "east and west of the Rio Grande". Bit of a problem since the river doesn't go north and south.
Y'all aint from New Mexico, then, air ya?
Rio Grande flows from its source in Colorado, South into New mexico, wanders a lottle bit East and West, and at Albuquerque, runs pretty much due South to El Paso, where it turns E-Se, to Big Bend, where it goes North East a little, then back to SE to the Gulf.
Please look at a map before spouting off about things you know nothing about..
Billy was raised in Silver City, did his dirty deeds in Lincoln County, and Died just East of the Pecos....All in the State of New Mexico

ETA the All in New Mexico

[aggle-rithm]

A low C (in the contrabassoon range) on a clarinet is scientifically impossible. A high C played by a contrabassoon is just practically impossible. :p

True. Thanks for the correction.

[aggle-rithm]

A low C (in the contrabassoon range) on a clarinet is scientifically impossible. A high C played by a contrabassoon is just practically impossible. :p

A while back I saw an ad for a little flute-like instrument in a magazine. The ad claimed that it had a range of 10 octaves.

Not even a piano has 10 octaves! But I guess even that isn't scientifically impossible; it's just that the top 8 octaves would be inaudible to humans....

[gnome]

Y'all aint from New Mexico, then, air ya?
Rio Grande flows from its source in Colorado, South into New mexico, wanders a lottle bit East and West, and at Albuquerque, runs pretty much due South to El Paso, where it turns E-Se, to Big Bend, where it goes North East a little, then back to SE to the Gulf.
Please look at a map before spouting off about things you know nothing about..
Billy was raised in Silver City, did his dirty deeds in Lincoln County, and Died just East of the Pecos....All in the State of New Mexico

ETA the All in New Mexico

Happily stand corrected...

However, if I've been spouting, I'm in good company since I got the info from Billy Joel himself, in an interview admitting the error.

Maybe it wasn't so much an error after all... but his point was he hadn't done his homework, which is clearly the case.

[SuperCoolGuy]

How the heck can you be in Louisiana AND be a mile from Texarkana?

http://www.sing365.com/music/Lyric.nsf/COTTON-FIELDS-lyrics-Creedence-Clearwater-Revival/60C593B0E94EA53F48256AAB0030DEAA

Someday we'll know why the sky is blue? Rayleigh scattering anybody?

http://www.mp3lyrics.org/n/new-radicals/someday-well-know/

[rwguinn]

How the heck can you be in Louisiana AND be a mile from Texarkana?

http://www.sing365.com/music/Lyric.nsf/COTTON-FIELDS-lyrics-Creedence-Clearwater-Revival/60C593B0E94EA53F48256AAB0030DEAA

Someday we'll know why the sky is blue? Rayleigh scattering anybody?

http://www.mp3lyrics.org/n/new-radicals/someday-well-know/

When you work dem ol cotton fields, geography is the least of your worries?

[rwguinn]

Happily stand corrected...

However, if I've been spouting, I'm in good company since I got the info from Billy Joel himself, in an interview admitting the error.

Maybe it wasn't so much an error after all... but his point was he hadn't done his homework, which is clearly the case.

Ah.
As in many things, his errors canceled out that time. :D

[gnome]

This just in... anyone remember the song:

"Would you like to swing on a star,
Carry moonbeams home in a jar?"

It turns out that swinging on stars and canning moonbeams are scientifically impossible! What a maroon!

[Meffy]

o/~ If I could save time in a bottle... o/~

Silly, of course you can't put time into a bottle! A cube, yes. =@.@=

[This Guy]

o/~ If I could save time in a bottle... o/~

Silly, of course you can't put time into a bottle! A cube, yes. =@.@=

At least Jim said IF ;)

[Ladewig]

I suspect the most notable example would be Pink Floyd's
"I'll see you on the dark side of the moon. "

Mixed metaphors bother more that incorrect science in music. I laugh everytime I hear Cher sing "Just Like Jesse James" because the chorus includes: "Tonight you're gonna go down in flames just like Jesse James."

[GreyPilgrim]

I vote for The Darkness "One Way Ticket To Hell And Back".

stupid stupid stupid.

[brettDbass]

A low C (in the contrabassoon range) on a clarinet is scientifically impossible. A high C played by a contrabassoon is just practically impossible. :p
As a bassoon player (of some 23 years) I gladly verify this statement.


And if anyone out there wants to buy me a contrabassoon so I can prove it, that'd be just lovely.

[This Guy]

I vote for The Darkness "One Way Ticket To Hell And Back".

stupid stupid stupid.

hehe yea, don't think that works either

[pchams]

Re: Topic title

I think this is a mainstay.
Take your socks off and stay a while. :D

[Stormraven]

I suspect the most notable example would be Pink Floyd's
"I'll see you on the dark side of the moon. "

Mixed metaphors bother more that incorrect science in music. I laugh everytime I hear Cher sing "Just Like Jesse James" because the chorus includes: "Tonight you're gonna go down in flames just like Jesse James."

To their credit, on the album, they do give the correct information - it's a spoken piece at the end of that song.