Mormons and The Davinci Code

[RSLancastr]

(A SPOILER ABOUT THE DAVINCI CODE FOLLOWS. SKIP THIS THREAD IF YOU DON"T WANT TO KNOW.)

One of the premises of The Davinci Code, taken from Holy Blood, Holy Grail (and other places) before it, is that Jesus was married, and had progeny.

What many people don't realize is that this is also part of Mormon doctrine.

One of the "proofs" they have of this goes something like this: in order to be a Rabbi, you had to be married. Jesus is called "Rabbi" many times in the New Testament. The Pharisees gave him crap about all sorts of other things, surely they would have given him crap about this as well, had he not been married.

Yet another "fun fact" about Mormons.

[RSLancastr]

Apparently, a stunningly unpopular thread!

Ah, well. They can't all be winners. :)

[gfunkusarelius]

i think it is pretty interesting but i dont know anything about mormons so i dont have anything to add. it makes me want to read up. do they think there is a direct bloodline? i am assuming not since then they would have some sort of leader. of course, i suppose the blood wouldnt be pure anymore anyway unless he was hopelessly inbred. maybe there is a horrifying mutant jesus hidden away by the pope. meh

[bluess]

i think it is pretty interesting but i dont know anything about mormons so i dont have anything to add. it makes me want to read up. do they think there is a direct bloodline? i am assuming not since then they would have some sort of leader. of course, i suppose the blood wouldnt be pure anymore anyway unless he was hopelessly inbred. maybe there is a horrifying mutant jesus hidden away by the pope. meh

Now THERE is a cool band name - Horrifying Mutant Jesus.

Of course, they could never get any radio play.

[ImaginalDisc]

(A SPOILER ABOUT THE DAVINCI CODE FOLLOWS. SKIP THIS THREAD IF YOU DON"T WANT TO KNOW.)

One of the premises of The Davinci Code, taken from Holy Blood, Holy Grail (and other places) before it, is that Jesus was married, and had progeny.

What many people don't realize is that this is also part of Mormon doctrine.

One of the "proofs" they have of this goes something like this: in order to be a Rabbi, you had to be married. Jesus is called "Rabbi" many times in the New Testament. The Pharisees gave him crap about all sorts of other things, surely they would have given him crap about this as well, had he not been married.

Yet another "fun fact" about Mormons.

Wasn't that a popular idea at the time John Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, just like the idea that black skin was the Mark of Cain?

[Dicon]

Now THERE is a cool band name - Horrifying Mutant Jesus.

Of course, they could never get any radio play.

My current favorite band name -- that I actually did hear on the radio -- is Oops, I Stepped in Jesus.

[bluess]

My current favorite band name -- that I actually did hear on the radio -- is Oops, I Stepped in Jesus.

:D What was the name of the song?


I just read Slate's review of the movie. It bolstered my resolve to NOT read the book and NOT see the movie.

[RSLancastr]

Wasn't that a popular idea at the time John Smith wrote the Book of Mormon, just like the idea that black skin was the Mark of Cain?Not that I'm aware, but it could be.

[Nex]

[ derail ]

My current favorite band name -- that I actually did hear on the radio -- is Oops, I Stepped in Jesus. Is this (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=11620882) them?

[ /derail ]

[bjb]

When I lived in Houston, I read a local paper that had a short write-up of every local band. One band was called 'Jesus Penis', and featured J. Penis on guitar. This was a few years before that Jesus Lizard band appeared, and I always wondered if there was a connection.

There are other theories about Jesus being married, something about all Jewish males having to be married by age 30, not just rabbis. It's not really proof, but then you have to wonder why he wasn't married.

Here's a related article, but I don't know how accurate it is:

http://www.thesleaze.co.uk/christshorn.html

[Dicon]

[ derail ]

Is this (http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=11620882) them?

[ /derail ]

Yeah, it's probably the same band... the dj probably twisted the name up a bit. The song clip on their myspace page isn't really what I was expecting; I thought they'd sound like Celine Dion.

[Scot C. Trypal]

Due to the hubbub around the movie, the LDS church let out this statement:


"The belief that Christ was married has never been official Church doctrine. It is neither sanctioned nor taught by the Church. While it is true that a few Church leaders in the mid-1800s expressed their opinions on the matter, it was not then, and is not now, Church doctrine."


They are backing off of the idea of a married Jesus. Still, they are not denouncing it as false, and they probably shouldn’t as marriage is a requirement to get into their highest heaven.

[RSLancastr]

They are backing off of the idea of a married Jesus. Still, they are not denouncing it as false, and they probably shouldn’t as marriage is a requirement to get into their highest heaven.Interesting!

I will run that by my Mormon friend - who believes that it IS official church doctrine - and see what he has to say.

[RSLancastr]

Due to the hubbub around the movie, the LDS church let out this statement:By the way, what is your source for that statement? My Mormon buddy finds it hard to believe the church said that.

[wolfgirl]

By the way, what is your source for that statement? My Mormon buddy finds it hard to believe the church said that.This was from MSNBC's news page: Dale Bills, a spokesman for The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, said in a statement released Tuesday:
"The belief that Christ was married has never been official church doctrine. It is neither sanctioned nor taught by the church. While it is true that a few church leaders in the mid-1800s expressed their opinions on the matter, it was not then, and is not now, church doctrine."

[Psi Baba]

One of the "proofs" they have of this goes something like this: in order to be a Rabbi, you had to be married. Jesus is called "Rabbi" many times in the New Testament. The Pharisees gave him crap about all sorts of other things, surely they would have given him crap about this as well, had he not been married.

Yet another "fun fact" about Mormons.
Well, they also believe that Jesus was actually in North America. I want to know how we got there.

[RSLancastr]

This was from MSNBC's news page:Thanks! After asking, I Googled the quote and fuond several references to it, all going back to that one spokesman.

My Mormon buddy is puzzled by this, as it is something he was taught even back in Sunday school.

Well, they also believe that Jesus was actually in North America. I want to know how we got there.I assume you mean how he got there?

IIRC, it was supposed to be during the time after his death. So the question would be more like "how did he appear anywhere?"

[Spidey13]

i think it is pretty interesting but i dont know anything about mormons so i dont have anything to add. it makes me want to read up. do they think there is a direct bloodline? i am assuming not since then they would have some sort of leader. of course, i suppose the blood wouldnt be pure anymore anyway unless he was hopelessly inbred. maybe there is a horrifying mutant jesus hidden away by the pope. meh

So you've read Preacher, huh? ;)

[bjb]

My Mormon buddy is puzzled by this, as it is something he was taught even back in Sunday school.

Ask your friend if he has any hard copies of this doctrine. I don't doubt that he knows what he's talking about. He's confused now, but maybe this can be proof that that his church will lie to protect itself from criticism.

[RSLancastr]

Ask your friend if he has any hard copies of this doctrine. I don't doubt that he knows what he's talking about. He's confused now, but maybe this can be proof that that his church will lie to protect itself from criticism.He's looking into it.

I think the problem is, it is easy to infer this from things which are definitely LDS doctrine, and it has been taught by a lot of Mormons over the years (evidently including some people pretty high up in the church hierarchy), but is it "official" doctrine?

When I told my friend about this, he said "How could it NOT be doctrine? I've been hearing it ever since Sunday school as a child!"

I reminded him that he had also once told me that some LDS Sunday schools (incorrectly) teach that Mormon doctrine prohibits the drinking of Coke and Pepsi. He sadly agreed, and said he was determined to look into it.

Here's a quote from (I kid you not) Mormonism For Dummies (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0764571958/sr=8-1/qid=1148623374/ref=pd_bbs_1/103-1337136-5465450?%5Fencoding=UTF8):

Was Jesus married?

Mormons view marriage as an eternal covenant that all men and women must make in order to be exalted, or become like God (for more on Mormon marriage, see Chapter 7). In addition, Mormons believe that Jesus Christ set a perfect example in all things. According to this logic, the Savior must’ve gotten married at some point.

Some early Mormon leaders speculated that the marriage at Cana, where Jesus turned water into wine, was actually his own wedding, which would help explain why he was trying to be a good host. Additionally, some Mormons believe that Jesus married Mary Magdalene and had children, and they reject the notion that Magdalene was a reformed whore. However, modern Church leaders pretty much publicly avoid this subject altogether.

[Ryokan]

Well, they also believe that Jesus was actually in North America. I want to know how we got there.

Silly question. He walked across the Atlantic, of course :p

[Psi Baba]

Silly question. He walked across the Atlantic, of course :p
Naturally! :eusa_doh:

(and of course I meant "he" not "we"--I have a pretty good idea how we got to North America).

[RandFan]

I'm Mormon and served a mission. I'm not an expert and I don't speak for the church (no kidding since I'm convinced Joesph Smith was a fraud and that there is no god).

There is a lot of Mormon philosophy that is not official doctrine. Many if not most believe that God (Heavenly Father) is married. In fact there is a popular Mormon song that is in the Hymnals that speak of a Mother-in-heaven.

Families are sacrosanct to Mormons and like baptism marriage is a requirement for eternal salvation. The family is simply the logical extension of our heavenly family. Mormons believe that we were first conceived as spirits in heaven by our heavenly parents. It logically follows that such an important requirement would have been fulfilled by Jesus who was also baptized for the remission of sins even though he had no sins in order to "fulfill all righteousness".

It is also popular to believe that Mary and Joseph had many children, siblings of Jesus.

Their are in fact many popular Mormon beliefs that the church will not take the time or effort to disabuse its members from.

[RandFan]

Well, they also believe that Jesus was actually in North America. I want to know how we got there. According to Mormon mythology Christ simply descended from heaven shortly after his crucification when he visited the Americas. He's a god doncha know.

[Kopji]

There are several attempts to associate Jesus with the doctrine of polygamy in the Journal of Discourses during the 1800's. That Jesus would have had children by any of his wives seems to carry the stigma of 'unpure' though.

Orson Hyde - "It will be borne in mind that once on a time, there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee; and on a careful reading of that transaction , it will be discovered that no less a person than Jesus Christ was married on that occasion. If he was never married, his intimacy with Mary and Martha, and the other Mary also whom Jesus loved, must have been highly unbecoming and improper to say the best of it." Journal of Discourses, vol. 4, p. 259 (1857)

http://www.irr.org/MIT/WDIST/wdist-polygamy.html


(irr are highly advanced nutties)

[tumnus]

So you've read Preacher, huh? ;)

Oh yeah, I was just about to add this when I saw your comment! A long running thread of The Preacher is an organisation called the Grail, whose aim is to preserve the bloodline of jesus. They're really hardcore, all wearing white suits and red ties, controlling most of the world governments etc. When the descendant of jesus is revealed, he is a young kid, a hopelessly inbred buffoon in t-shirt and shorts, who goes around saying "I'm the messiah! Humperty-doo!" through his deformed teeth.

In think in reality they just bred thousands of similar kids and deposited them all around the middle america, which may explain Bush's second term :p I jest of course

[Elind]

Apparently, a stunningly unpopular thread!

Ah, well. They can't all be winners. :)

What would have been really interesting is if the author, what's his name Brown, had known this and woven some Mormons into the plot. The more the merrier eh what?