I'll pray for you!

[evildave]

I wonder how often these words are said, and then the person who says them promptly forgets all about it.

It's just one of those curiosity things. Like "How many people whistle while they whizz?"

I find it odd to think that some people might ACTUALLY go home and add "that guy I met today" to their prayers, assuming they routinely pray at all. It's a totally alien concept.

It seems like a "have a nice day" sort of thing. You don't have the power to actually set aside and make a nice day for someone, or otherwise transfer one from your own limited supply of them, but you say it anyway.

[EdwardG]

Originally posted by evildave
I find it odd to think that some people might ACTUALLY go home and add "that guy I met today" to their prayers, assuming they routinely pray at all. It's a totally alien concept.

I think it's creepy, kind of like a witch-doctor promising to add your likeness to his weekly cauldron of blood and urine.

Who was it that said something like "whenever you see a man approaching you with the obvious intention of doing you good, you should run for your life."

[FireGarden]

You think that it's odd, do you Dave, that another human being should care for you? That they could have compassion for some stranger they met? That they would not want you roasting in hell, far from the sight of holy Gott?

Anyway, you've misunderstood.
They mean that they will take over your praying chores. You're releaved of that burden as they will carry it for you. It's like getting a driving licence without having to sit the test because someone else will do it for you.

You ungrateful git.
I have loads of people praying for me, so I'll be in heaven a dozen times over. I think I'll start my own football team.

[TylerD]

The only people who actually say "I'll pray for you" are the biblical ultra-literal fundamentalist cult of Christianity. And yes, they are serious.

Scary huh?

[triadboy]

Originally posted by EdwardG

I think it's creepy, kind of like a witch-doctor promising to add your likeness to his weekly cauldron of blood and urine.


lol - I guess in the old testament days it would have been, "Hey, I'll slay a goat for you."

[rustypouch]

I've had people at work tell me that they prayed for me. Not wanting to be rude in the face of such a nice thought, I just politely thanked them.

[Tricky]

It depends on the situation. Normally, I would say "thanks" or I appreciate that and let it slide. Occasionally, I don't.

One time I remember was when I had had a letter published in the local paper slamming creationism. Since I don't keep an unlisted phone number, the next day I got a call from an infuriated fundamentalist who launched into an abusive tirade which I tried unsuccessfully to interrupt. The last thing she said was I'll pray for you. I replied, "While your at it, pray that your God makes you a nicer person". The next sound was her hanging up.

[Ruby]

Originally posted by evildave
I wonder how often these words are said, and then the person who says them promptly forgets all about it.

It's just one of those curiosity things. Like "How many people whistle while they whizz?"

I find it odd to think that some people might ACTUALLY go home and add "that guy I met today" to their prayers, assuming they routinely pray at all. It's a totally alien concept.

It seems like a "have a nice day" sort of thing. You don't have the power to actually set aside and make a nice day for someone, or otherwise transfer one from your own limited supply of them, but you say it anyway.

I have a very negative reaction to anyone telling me they will pray for me. I don't want anyone to pray for me. Sometimes, Christian say "I'll pray for you" as a means to produce guilt in you. They want to make you think there is something wrong with you, and they, the self-righteous a**hole, will be the one to set you free through their prayer.

Naturally, some Christians are being kind and really intend to pray for you when they say that to you. Still, I don't feel comfortable with it.

What's worse, is having someone pray for you on the spot...putting their hands on you and praying without asking permission. I had this happen in a church service. I was big and pregnant and could not stand during praise and worship. While sitting trying to mind my own business and sing, a lady behind me put her hands on my shoulders and started to pray. My hubby did not notice..otherwise he would have stopped her.....he was too busy singing. Anyhow, I felt trapped by this womans strong hands pushing on my shoulders as she was praying hard for me.....as if I was deathly ill or something. I sat their staring ahead and wishing she would stop and wondered how I could politely get her to stop. She prayed forever...digging in her hands.

That will NEVER happen again! Next time, I will put a stop to it. :mad:

[Ruby]

Originally posted by Tricky
It depends on the situation. Normally, I would say "thanks" or I appreciate that and let it slide. Occasionally, I don't.

One time I remember was when I had had a letter published in the local paper slamming creationism. Since I don't keep an unlisted phone number, the next day I got a call from an infuriated fundamentalist who launched into an abusive tirade which I tried unsuccessfully to interrupt. The last thing she said was I'll pray for you. I replied, "While your at it, pray that your God makes you a nicer person". The next sound was her hanging up.

Good response!!!!!:D

[Mercutio]

I have only had this happen to me twice, and they were related; I found it very interesting to see the different response I had to each.
First, a fundy student (really nice guy)--who had found out I am an atheist--was talking with me. On his notebook, I saw a note that said "pray for [mercutio]." He was embarrassed, and I told him not to bother but that I thanked him anyway. I was actually a bit irritated, but why ruin his day over it? Then, I was telling a friend about it, and she said "but I pray for you." My reaction should have been the same, but (maybe because I think the world of this person and she can do no wrong in my eyes) I was genuinely flattered. This time, I did not tell her not to bother.

So anyway, I do my best to take it as intended...that can be as a compliment or as a slap, and we usually can tell from context.

[chance]

“I’ll pray for you” is also one of my peeves runs a close second to “bless you” or “god bless you”

The only response I’ve been able to counteract that, is a quick retort of “Why would you want to pray for me?” And then get into a debate of who is really being perceived as the beneficiary of said blessings and prayers. As Rubystated in this quote I have a very negative reaction to anyone telling me they will pray for me. I don't want anyone to pray for me. Sometimes, Christian say "I'll pray for you" as a means to produce guilt in you it’s a form of inferred insult.

[Man of jade]

Evildave hit the nail on the head pretty good there, its largely a have a nice day thing. Many people will also go home and pray for that person afterwards. Mostly its not meant as an insult, but as "I hope that (insert topic here) works out for you!" Whether it helps or not is debatable of course, but it certainly helps to have the support as friends.

[Whoracle]

Yeah I hate it when some Christian finds out that I am an athiest and then they say "I'll pray for you." I just want to tell them I'll 'pray' that you'll get a clue.

[QuarkChild]

My mom says she'll pray for me when I have a big test coming up. Isn't that nice? If I pass my Quals, it isn't because I studied my butt off for them; it's because God made me pass. Gee, thanks.

Or sometimes my mother invokes this retroactively: (Complacently) "I knew you'd get that internship at the supercomputer center. I prayed that you would."
Oh, so my grades, programming experience, and hard work had nothing to do with it, I suppose.

Next time my Mom tells me she's praying that I'll pass the Quals, I'm going to ask, "So should I even bother studying?"

[evildave]

The answer to whether you should study at all: "God helps those who helps themselves".

[EdwardG]

Originally posted by evildave
The answer to whether you should study at all: "God helps those who helps themselves".

Anyone know the etymology of this phrase? Is it biblical?

[Ruby]

Originally posted by EdwardG


Anyone know the etymology of this phrase? Is it biblical?

It's from the book of opinions!!:p

I had to look up online to get info on that quote. This is what I found.....The saying comes from one of Aesops fables--"A Wagoner was once driving a heavy load along a very muddy way. He came to a part of the road where the wheels sank half-way into the mire, and the more the horses pulled, the deeper sank the wheels. So the Wagoner threw down his whip, and knelt down and prayed to Hercules the Strong. 'O Hercules, help me in this my hour of distress." But Hercules appeared to him, and said: 'Man, don't sprawl there. Get up and put your shoulder to the wheel. The gods help them that help themselves.'"

[Dancing David]

For years I have thought about getting a bumber sticker that reads
Don't Pray for Me, I'm Going Straight To Hell.


Peace

[Tricky]

Originally posted by evildave
The answer to whether you should study at all: "God helps those who helps themselves".
I believe this is what Jim Baker said right before he got caught in flagrante delicto with Jessica Hahn.

[Ruby]

Originally posted by Tricky

I believe this is what Jim Baker said right before he got caught in flagrante delicto with Jessica Hahn.

ROFL!!!!!:D :D :D

[arcticpenguin]

Originally posted by QuarkChild

Next time my Mom tells me she's praying that I'll pass the Quals, I'm going to ask, "So should I even bother studying?"
Why not offer to sacrifice a goat in her honor?

[QuarkChild]

Originally posted by arcticpenguin

Why not offer to sacrifice a goat in her honor?
I think there's enough misunderstanding of atheism in this world as it is.

[evildave]

There really isn't any point in battling your mom over this. It's just Star Wars versus Star Trek.

If she wants to believe in sky daddy and wonder boy, it's her right. She's done so all her life and you will probably never change her mind without some real and sincere trauma. You could start a "little feud" that permanently damaged your relationship with her.

Best not to scratch certain itches. So she says she's "praying" for you. Would it help matters if you simply interpreted it as wishing you "good luck"? Her lucky charm is a little plus sign? So what? She loves you, she's proud of you, and she's showing it in a manner that she's been socially conditioned to since early childhood.

[QuarkChild]

Originally posted by evildave
There really isn't any point in battling your mom over this. It's just Star Wars versus Star Trek.

If she wants to believe in sky daddy and wonder boy, it's her right. She's done so all her life and you will probably never change her mind without some real and sincere trauma. You could start a "little feud" that permanently damaged your relationship with her.
I know, I know. I'm sorry if I sounded a bit like Dark Cobra there for a minute. I don't even try to change her mind about Feng Shui or astrology, much less God. I was just venting.

[FireGarden]

Prayer is blasphemy (http://www.atheist-community.org/library/ill_pray_for_you.htm)
It's a short article, so I can't quote much of it without quoting it all!
He cannot commune, negotiate, manipulate, persuade, coerce, or otherwise induce his deity to treat his nonbelieving acquaintances differently, without indicating to that deity that he knows better than the deity what should be done with that nonbeliever._ Doing that, he commits blasphemy.

[NiteOwl]

Could one of you explain why you all seem to get so bent out of shape over someone saying that they'll pray for you? I mean really, even if you don't happen to believe that it will you any good, it certainly doesn't do you any harm.

I think you ought to take such an offer in the spirit that it was likely intended. They're trying to invoke benevolent spirits on your behalf. That their efforts may be in vain doesn't change the fact that there's some nice thought behind it. It's a mean enough world as it is that I'll take all the well wishing I can get, up to and including my image in a bubbling cauldron of blood and urine. (Providing of course the blood isn't human and I don't have stand downwind of the mess.)

I realize that such activities aren’t likely to influence events for or against me, but personally I find the thought that someone might be out their actively exhibiting a desire for my good fortune encouraging. Even if their version of good fortune includes joining them in their faith, their wishing and praying for it doesn’t hurt me, and it’s still a fair sight better than those who go home and start gleefully imagining a place warming for me in hell.

[QuarkChild]

Originally posted by NiteOwl

I think you ought to take such an offer in the spirit that it was likely intended. They're trying to invoke benevolent spirits on your behalf.
If all my mother wanted to do was invoke a spirit on my behalf, she could simply *do* so--why make a point of telling me about it? She knows I'm an atheist and that her promises of prayer annoy me, so she isn't telling me about it for my benefit. Under the circumstances, it just sounds self-righteous--"Since you're a godless heathen, I'll have to do your praying for you--at least I know what's good for you, even if you don't." Yes, I'm putting words in her mouth, but that is the intent that comes across.

I'm glad my mother wants me to do well on my tests, but I don't appreciate it when she turns it into an opportunity to tell me that she knows better than I do how to pass them.

(And I really don't appreciate it when she gives the credit for my hard-earned success to a magic spirit.)

I know my mother cares about me and wants me to do well. I appreciate her caring, and if praying for me makes her happy, I have no problem with that whatsoever. I haven't even asked her to stop. All I want is a safe venue (ie, this forum) where I can vent my frustration when I feel condescended to.

[NiteOwl]

Originally posted by QuarkChild
"Since you're a godless heathen, I'll have to do your praying for you--at least I know what's good for you, even if you don't."

If that is truly your mothers’ intent then I’d say you have every right to be annoyed, but I can’t help but observe that Christians tell each other that they’ll be praying for one another all the time.

I also kind of doubt that when you bring home an A she responds with, “God passed your test for you.” In fact I’m not certain on this but if you were able to get the answers through divination I think that might be cheating.

As for why she feels the need to tell you about it, while I can’t speak for your mother, I know that many Christians tell you about it because they’re hoping you’ll take some comfort at the thought. Also I’ve noticed people tend to find prayers more effective if they know they’re being said. I suspect this is because prayer is largely if not entirely a placebo effect and placebo’s are only effective when you know you’re taking something.

If you’re looking for a safe place to vent, then by all means vent away. If I seem a little combative, I assure you it’s nothing personal. I just love a good argument. My original post wasn’t aimed as a criticism specifically at you. I was just curious in general why so many got so actively hostile at being prayed for.

[003998]

Maybe there is one response that will at least dissuade those that prefet to belittle atheists (or agnostics and members of other religions, for that matter).

Christian: I will pray for you.
Atheist: Then I will think for you.

Of course, not the thing to tell someone who really feels for you and simply does express this in his way.

[ebola]

Quarkchild Wrote:

Next time my Mom tells me she's praying that I'll pass the Quals, I'm going to ask, "So should I even bother studying?"


I believe the correct response is: " I think I'll study anyway."

Good luck,

Eric

[Mercutio]

Originally posted by GoodPropaganda
Prayer is blasphemy (http://www.atheist-community.org/library/ill_pray_for_you.htm)
It's a short article, so I can't quote much of it without quoting it all!

quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
He cannot commune, negotiate, manipulate, persuade, coerce, or otherwise induce his deity to treat his nonbelieving acquaintances differently, without indicating to that deity that he knows better than the deity what should be done with that nonbeliever._ Doing that, he commits blasphemy.
------------------------------------------------------------------------



This would suggest an interesting response:

X: I will pray for you.

A: Wow...you would risk going to hell just to pray for little ole me? I am so deeply touched...You would blaspheme for me?....

[QuarkChild]

Originally posted by ebola

I believe the correct response is: " I think I'll study anyway."

Sounds better than my actual response, which was stunned speechlessness. :)

[QuarkChild]

Originally posted by NiteOwl


If that is truly your mothers’ intent then I’d say you have every right to be annoyed, but I can’t help but observe that Christians tell each other that they’ll be praying for one another all the time.
Of course. If I was a Christian, it wouldn't bother me a bit. What bothers me is the self-righteous aspect of a Christian telling that to someone s/he knows is an atheist.

I also kind of doubt that when you bring home an A she responds with, “God passed your test for you.” In fact I’m not certain on this but if you were able to get the answers through divination I think that might be cheating.
So far God hasn't gotten credit for my grades, only for my internship. As far as the cheating thing goes, I totally agree. The purpose of the qualifying exams is to weed out people who are too incompetent to be competitave in the field. If I can't pass the exams on my own, I shouldn't be passing them at all. I wouldn't like to live in a world where incompetent people can get degrees when their god pulls the right strings.

As for why she feels the need to tell you about it, while I can’t speak for your mother, I know that many Christians tell you about it because they’re hoping you’ll take some comfort at the thought. Also I’ve noticed people tend to find prayers more effective if they know they’re being said. I suspect this is because prayer is largely if not entirely a placebo effect and placebo’s are only effective when you know you’re taking something.

The question here is, why tell an atheist? Do you think I will be more likely to pass the exams now? (Hmm, I'm posting on the JREF forum instead of studying...think think) :)

[Ricomise]

I have a bumper sticker that reads "Don't pray in our schools, I won't think in your church." I sometimes find notes on my windshield, "Please change or you will go to hell" etc.

I got one the other day, though, that said "I will pray in school and I will pray for you." It had little hearts to dot the i, and semed to be written by a (probably female) teenager. (There is a Christian youth center in the plaza in which a had parked.)

I normally just have a laugh at the notes I get, but this one made me kind of sad. I'm not exactly sure why, but I suspect it was because I felt that this girl might be genuinely upset by me (Indirectly).

Don't get me wrong, I don't feel bad about not believing in prayer in school, or even for broadcasting that belief. Normally, like most of the posters here, I react to "I will pray for you" as I would any other statement, that is, according to the context in which it is made. In this case it just made me sad to think that a tennage girl, who probably has a lot of other worries, would also be worried about me.

[Captain Spaulding]

When I first became an atheist I would get a bit annoyed when I heard someone say this. But eventually I decided it was'nt worth it. The pious fundies take the anger as a sign of how lost you are while the genuinely well meaning get their feelings hurt. In other words I just it accepted it as their way showing they care for other people. And I really believe that some of them follow through with this promise. Some of them truly believe they must interscede with their God on your behalf. In the end is'nt that alot better than having some equally well meaning religious person damning you to hell.

[evildave]

I dunno, it's according to whether Hell has cable, or not. Obviously not satellite TV, seeing as it's allegedly underground. If the fundies even have that much right about it.

There's no reason to be bothered by the every-day goofiness of religion. So, some people want to let you know they'll be talking to their hands (a sign they know that talking to their god(s) will have no effect on you), and others want to dance in orange robes and bang on tamborines, and still others want to bang on your door and invite you to displace them as one of the "chosen few" for one of their regular impending doomsdays.

[LucyR]

Nobody has ever offered to pray for me! It's like I'm Satan's earthly conduit or something.

[evildave]

Well, I've been called "Satan's Mouthpiece" a couple of times by a couple of different people.

Oh well, making the right people MAD is always better than making the wrong people agree.