Loose Change - Part IV

[mrfreeze]

SirKnight: Have you told all of this to a psychiatrist, or someone else with a medical degree? I don't mean that as a jab at you, I just seriously think it would help to have someone you could tell all of this to who won't give you the amount of crap that comes with posting on this forum.

[Gravy]

I'm going to take a guess: Are your initials R.A.G.?

[Sir Knight]

:)

Your memory is very short.

Or do you mean that the patent itself was issued on a data tape or other electronic medium that they mailed to you, rather than on paper?


Hello, duh? Exactly how do you get the 12 years old? I didn't see that in your reply? I was issued a patent on SOFTWARE NOT HARDWARE, can't you read?

Your reponse to my asking HOW YOU GOT THE 12 YEARS OLD isn't there?

You got the 55, you got the 30 but how did you get to the 12 years old when I was isssued the patent? Can you read? I know when I was issued the patent and I wasn't 12 years old.

Geesh, you can't even respond intelligently. I see this is begining to look like an effort in futility. And if you can't get the math right you will never be able to understand everything else I know.

Sir Knight

[ghost707]

Well I wasn't going to respond to anything else but you struck a note. It just so happens that someone in the CIA I personal know, (who I used to think of as a friend) happen to visit certain spots just right before certain things happened. Just like clockwork. He told me many things but they would all be wasted on the likes of you. And this posting thing is probably not good for my personal well being. If I say one or two things there are people who would know exactly who I am. You people forget so easily when people get caught doing things and the truth comes out, like the Watergate affair and so many others, there is always a scape goat and someone else takes the fall. And I myself have had witnesses that knew truths and facts about my personal situations that up and disappeared over night, or CHANGED their stories because someone paid them a visit. Frankly in a way I am somewhat surprised that the people behind loose change is still alive. Sometimes fction is based on fact and the truth even stranger than fiction.

Hey I was told by IBM, the makers and designers of the PC that my company could NOT do something in particular with them, as they weren't designed to do it. LOL Hey they should know right, they were the experts, but you should have seen their faces when we told them we ALREADY HAD DONE IT. Experts are a dime a dozen and you can buy one to say anything you want.

One thing I see a real shortage of on here is LOGIC and WISDOM. Most of you sure don't know your history really well. And most of you don't know people in the CIA either, I can tell. But then again, maybe some of you who are telling us what we know is BS has something to do with the CIA.
See most of what I know had nothing to do with LOOSE CHANGE, and if it is pure fiction they stumbled upon the truth by accident. But the news clippings and other things they show, I saw for myself when they happened. I had a CIA agent under oath lying about me and to me. I had witnesses and evidence to support my case/side but it didn't matter at all.
The truth is irrelevant when it comes to our government. All is done under the guise of NATIONAL SECURITY. And the CIA guy I mentioned, oh he admitted to being CIA but he worked for the State Dept as a cover. And those incidents that just happened every time he had to take a trip to that particular part of the world, that must have just been a long series of co-incidents.

If I could prove anything to you, you guys wouldn't lift a finger to help.
So why waste my time?

I really should have known better, but one gets tired of fighting at times.

Well the war continues.........if I live through all of this there will be a book and movies, but it will just probably be labled fiction for NO ONE will want to believe it is the TRUTH.

Sir Knight

Wasted on the likes of me?
You don't even know me. I didn't insult you..I asked you some pertinent questions.

Am I supposed to be surprised that we have field agents in other countries?
Are you trying to tell me that the U.S. government is responsible for hundreds if not thousands of terrorist attacks?
Almost every country on the planet has seen a Islamic terroist attack of some kind on their soil. The U.S. government did this?

Edited for spelling.

[mrfreeze]

You did read my reply where I explained that right? That the first software patent was in 1962 to a british company?

[60hzxtl]

you will never be able to understand everything else I know.

Sir Knight


Its gonna be a looooong night!

You claimed the first software patent. THE first, or your first? As THE first was issued in 1962, according to what comes up as the first patent.

Your turn.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Hello, duh? Exactly how do you get the 12 years old? I didn't see that in your reply? I was issued a patent on SOFTWARE NOT HARDWARE, can't you read?

Your reponse to my asking HOW YOU GOT THE 12 YEARS OLD isn't there?

You got the 55, you got the 30 but how did you get to the 12 years old when I was isssued the patent? Can you read? I know when I was issued the patent and I wasn't 12 years old.

Geesh, you can't even respond intelligently. I see this is begining to look like an effort in futility. And if you can't get the math right you will never be able to understand everything else I know.

Sir Knight



The first software patent ever granted is probably a patent for a "computer having slow and quick access storage, when programmed to solve a linear programming problem by an iterative algorithm, the iterative algorithm being such that (...)" applied for in 1962 by British Petroleum Company ([2], see end of page 3). The patent relates to solving simultaneous linear equations.
source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_patent

[Pardalis]

SirKnight: Have you told all of this to a psychiatrist, or someone else with a medical degree? I don't mean that as a jab at you, I just seriously think it would help to have someone you could tell all of this to who won't give you the amount of crap that comes with posting on this forum.

@Sir Knight: I think Mr. Freeze is right. Maybe you should seek council, someone to talk to, instead of a forum dedicated to facts and logic. You obviously have been very impressed by the movie "Loose Change". Most of us here have not.

[Gravy]

Hello, duh? Exactly how do you get the 12 years old? I didn't see that in your reply? I was issued a patent on SOFTWARE NOT HARDWARE, can't you read?

Your reponse to my asking HOW YOU GOT THE 12 YEARS OLD isn't there?

You got the 55, you got the 30 but how did you get to the 12 years old when I was isssued the patent? Can you read? I know when I was issued the patent and I wasn't 12 years old.

Geesh, you can't even respond intelligently. I see this is begining to look like an effort in futility. And if you can't get the math right you will never be able to understand everything else I know.

Sir Knight

As has already been pointed out to you, the first software patent was issued in 1962. Please read carefully before criticizing other people's reading comprehension.

Now, what 9/11 facts would you like to discuss?

[chran]

And if anyone of you actually read my posts, especially the last one or two, maybe you could GET A CLUE to what I realy want or need. I think it is more of a need than want and maybe I am barking up the wrong tree. I just thought maybe there would be some real people here that gave a **** and would take a REAL interest in my plight. I don't care about you, your home, your software patents or your almost-blown-up cars!

Personally, I think you're a liar. You have all the markings of one ... whispering about conspiracies, claiming you have evidence, saying you would get killed if you revealed anything.

Put up, or shut up.

And please, talk about 9/11 or Loose Change - anything else than your boring life and your boring ex-friends.

And no, I'm not attacking the poster, I'm attacking his position

[Hellbound]

Not to add fuel to the fire, but hey delphi_ote...who do you work for again?

:D

;)

[Sir Knight]

SirKnight: Have you told all of this to a psychiatrist, or someone else with a medical degree? I don't mean that as a jab at you, I just seriously think it would help to have someone you could tell all of this to who won't give you the amount of crap that comes with posting on this forum.


You have to be the funniest reply yet. Oh my doctor that I was going to for the poisoning knows all about it, but he dissappeared suddenly. And since I have facts/evidence I mainly have been talking with lawyers and spending a ton of money to no avail. I am not the only one that knows about all of what I know, just that our group is growing smaller all the time. And it sure sounds like an insinuation that I have mental problems to even think about going to that kind of doctor. LIke I said, I wish I was crazy, I wish I was making all this up but I am not, sad but true.

Oh and my mechanic for years, that was like a friend to me, who found the cars being tampered with and to whom I owe my life. He just up and disappeared one day, no phone call to me or anything. His entire family gone without a trace. I went into his office and there were new people there. Now selling the place is one thing, but him not even calling me was another. Oh I have sworn statements from him, notarized etc.

So there are a lot of people who don't want me to talk to them about this stuff, can you understand why?

Sir Knight

[Pardalis]

You got to post 15, Sir Knight, congrats.

Now, can you post any evidence to back up any of what you said so far?

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

<snip>
So there are a lot of people who don't want me to talk to them about this stuff, can you understand why?

Sir Knight

Because they don't want to listen to your paranoid schizophrenic delusions?

[Gravy]

You have to be the funniest reply yet. Oh my doctor that I was going to for the poisoning knows all about it, but he dissappeared suddenly.
What's his name, where was the practice, and when did he "disappear?"

Oh and my mechanic for years, that was like a friend to me, who found the cars being tampered with and to whom I owe my life. He just up and disappeared one day, no phone call to me or anything. His entire family gone without a trace. I went into his office and there were new people there.
What's his name, and where did he work, and when did he "disappear?"

These things can be easily verified. If you want to show us that you're not lying, please provide this information now.

Then we can proceed to discussing 9/11 issues.

Okay? The ball is in your court. As others have said, put up or shut up.

[Hellbound]

Nice website, by the way, Sir Knight. Or should I say, Sir Michael Wayne?

http://jet-the-net.com/gaspoolingclub/

For someone hiding from the CIA, you don't seem to be doing a very good job.

But I could be wrong *shrug*.

[Mr. Skinny]

My cat went missing too. He didn't tell us he was leaving. Had nothing to do with Loose Change or 9/11 though.

[Sir Knight]

I don't care about you, your home, your software patents or your almost-blown-up cars!

Personally, I think you're a liar. You have all the markings of one ... whispering about conspiracies, claiming you have evidence, saying you would get killed if you revealed anything.

Put up, or shut up.

And please, talk about 9/11 or Loose Change - anything else than your boring life and your boring ex-friends.

And no, I'm not attacking the poster, I'm attacking his position

Hmmm, "and I quote, "Personally I think you are a liar".

I am pretty sure you are attacking me directly, and I don't think you are someone I would trust since you lied in your own posting.

Calling someone a liar is not going against his position, it is a direct attack, look up the words in a dictionary.

Sir Knight

[60hzxtl]

Oh my doctor that I was going to for the poisoning knows all about it, but he dissappeared suddenly.


I don't have any medical training, beyond first aid and CPR, but if I was a bettin' man, I'd go for heavy metal poisoning.

[SRW]

Sorry forgot to do the quote thing.

Here it is again.

You are so funny. I said I have been in computers for over 30 years, I am 55 years old, how do you come to I must have been 12? I think you math is faulty. I never said when I got the patent, did I give you a date and time? Now I know how the government thought they would get away with all this, you guys don't even know how to use a calculator. But in highschool I built my first computer from scratch, my electronics teacher told me I couldn't do it but I did. Also just for grins and giggles, everyone else built those crystal controlled radios in class, LOL, I was the only one that built an AM radio transmitter. I just had to be different. The other was just too simple.
You know that expression, "You don't have a clue" well that appears to be a pretty good slogan for this thread. I have boxes and boxes of court documents, testimony, sworn statements etc etc. It would take anyone of you a month or more to just read through all of it. you have it all wrong, it isn't I who needs to convince you, that is pretty much impossible at this stage, it is someone out there that would need to convince me they could help if what I said was true and factual. I guess I was looking for someone that did CARE or COULD DO something other that spout more inuendos and rumors via igorance. LOL you guys may have already started a rumor that I am BILL GATES. I didn't see the connection at all.
You guys can't even get a few simple facts I give to you straight.

And hey the 12 years old was some what entertaining, stupid but entertaining.

Sir Knight

What in the world ever became of sweet jane?
She lost her sparkle, you know she isnt the same
Livin on reds, vitamin c, and cocaine,
All a friend can say is aint it a shame?

Truckin, up to buffalo. been thinkin, you got to mellow slow
Takes time, you pick a place to go, and just keep truckin on.

Sittin and starin out of the hotel window.
Got a tip theyre gonna kick the door in again
Id like to get some sleep before I travel,
But if you got a warrant, I guess youre gonna come in.

Busted, down on bourbon street, set up, like a bowlin pin.
Knocked down, it gets to wearin thin. they just wont let you be, oh no.

Greatfull Dead

[Joytown]

Sir Knight -

You have seen Loose Change and think it tells the truth about 9/11.

We have seen Loose Change and find it to be lacking as a valid explaination for the events of 9/11.

Let's give each other the benefit of the doubt of not being complete idiots and assume we have valid reasons for having our respective viewpoints, shall we?

Perhaps you could share something specifically about Loose Change do you think is particularly compelling (and WHY) and let us calmly and logically evaluate the basis behind each other's reasoning?

Does this sound like a reasonable approach?

-Joytown

[chran]

[...] I don't think you are someone I would trust since you lied in your own posting. :eye-poppi :jaw-dropp

I. Don't. Care. About. You. I. Don't. Care. That. You. Don't. Trust. Me.

[Sir Knight]

It is amazing how simple that was but how much time that was wasted with everyone when I gave them something outright. And the website doesn't show where I am at all. And I never said I am hiding from the CIA did I? No but I did say there was someone out there trying to kill me. And what I said was the guy that worked for the CIA helped set me up.
And just because you know of that website how would you conclude that is me? Just because I used Sir Knight? Check out on the internet how many other people use that handle. I find it interesting how easy people draw some serously wrong concusions so quickly. I guess I should have used the link to microsoft then the Bill Gates thing would have been a shoe in if I had used like BG as a name.

You guys are so easliy mislead it is pathetic.

I could be anyone doing anything but unforunately my point is lost in this entire mess of things. But check out the site, there is some evidence of one of the conspiracies posted in there.

LOL too funny, everything I have told you is real. And as for the first patent on software, well maybe you are getting copyrights mixed up with patents. Because I have a letter from Microsoft and I have all the legal papers to show that I was the first at the patent on software andit wasn't when you say. And you didn't exactly post what patent you were referring to. (speaking about the other guy)

But to those that think they know I am sorry for, to those that admit they don't know I have hope for.

Sir Knight or whom ever you want me to be it seems

The Truth is Out There but it sure doesn't matter in here.

[delphi_ote]

It is amazing how simple that was but how much time that was wasted with everyone when I gave them something outright. And the website doesn't show where I am at all. And I never said I am hiding from the CIA did I? No but I did say there was someone out there trying to kill me. And what I said was the guy that worked for the CIA helped set me up.
Liar.

[Sir Knight]

Sir Knight -

You have seen Loose Change and think it tells the truth about 9/11.

We have seen Loose Change and find it to be lacking as a valid explaination for the events of 9/11.

Let's give each other the benefit of the doubt of not being complete idiots and assume we have valid reasons for having our respective viewpoints, shall we?

Perhaps you could share something specifically about Loose Change do you think is particularly compelling (and WHY) and let us calmly and logically evaluate the basis behind each other's reasoning?

Does this sound like a reasonable approach?

-Joytown

Thanks for the nice gesture, I do appreciate it. I genuinely do. If you check my other posts mainly my first one, you will see a few of the reasons I believe what I know. There are many reasons outside of the movie, it isn't based on that alone. But to talk about the movie isn't really why I came to this place. I was looking for something, maybe someone and I just don't think it was the right place to come I guess.

you see I need something beyond talking and arguing, and I don't think anyone on this site could or would do anything about anything even if it was proven beyond any reasonable doubt. What I know is not really up to dealing on a discussion level as it is really hard line facts.

And I have proven it to others around me and although they would like to do something they are not capable. I thought this forum would have a different aura to it I guess and a different base to it.

But I am just disappointed in general.

But thanks again for some logical decent attitude towards me, this place could stand to use more.

[Gravy]

Sir Knight, since you refuse to answer questions relating to your claims, it is reasonable to conclude that you are lying.

Last chance: prove that you aren't lying. Right here, right now.

[delphi_ote]

Sir Knight, since you refuse to answer questions relating to your claims, it is reasonable to conclude that you are lying.

Last chance: prove that you aren't lying. Right here, right now.
It's already proven that he is lying. Nobody that was running away from someone trying to kill him would post this much information about himself on the internet. Especially if the people had intelligence community connections. If his story were true, his killer would have no trouble at all tracking him down.

[Class]

Because I have a letter from Microsoft and I have all the legal papers to show that I was the first at the patent on software andit wasn't when you say. And you didn't exactly post what patent you were referring to. (speaking about the other guy)


Why don't you show them then, for crying out loud?

[Gravy]

It's already proven that he is lying. Nobody that was running away from someone trying to kill him would post this much information about himself on the internet. Especially if the people had intelligence community connections. If his story were true, his killer would have no trouble at all tracking him down.
I agree, but isn't it fun to call these people out?

Sir Knight, you have not behaved honorably. Your knighthood is hereby revoked.

[Stellafane]

...I did say there was someone out there trying to kill me. And what I said was the guy that worked for the CIA helped set me up...

Sir Knight, I have to tell you very bluntly that the above quote terrifies me. Because if it's true, I want absolutely nothing to do with your presence here, for fear that some posting of mine might in some way help lead your killers to you, and that's hardly something I want on my conscious. And if (as frankly I strongly suspect) that statement isn't true, I have to wonder about your reason for posting it. Either you're literally delusional and paranoid and to be avoided at all costs, or you're lying about an extremely serious topic, for some reason I can't possibly fathom.

In any case, that statement alone is enough to make me avoid replying to you in the future. I will not do so again.

[Earl The Tall]

Welcome Sir Knight,

Wow, I should have joined this board sooner. Everyweek it is another new fun character added.

[sat556]

sir knight are you going to say anything of substance AT ALL? You are simply repeating yourself.

[Hellbound]

Welcome Sir Knight,

Wow, I should have joined this board sooner. Everyweek it is another new fun character added.

Collect them all, and you get a free Whacky Wind-Up Woo Woo WatchTM!!

[MRWiffen]

Sir Knight,

I don't care about your past, present or future. This thread is to debate Loose Change. The only claim about Loose Change that you have made so far (that I have been able to discern) is that the government did it because they can. That is not proof this is just a statement. If you think that what you have gone through proves anything you have to post it, I am not going to take you on faith and I doubt you would take anything I say on faith. Gravy, MarkyX, etc. have written guides that explain alot of what is in the video or made videos. That along with my background makes me willing to accept the official story. If you can show me any proof(*) that I haven't seen I'll examine it, but until then I will continue to believe as I do.

(*) Proof for me would consist of some verifiable physical evidence. At this point in time it is too far away datewise for me to accept a story from someone who was there just remembering what happened.

[jhunter1163]

Sir Knight:

I'm not sure what you might have heard or read about James Randi, but when I joined this forum I expected it to be the major leagues of skepticism, based on what I knew about Randi from seeing him on various programs. And I haven't been disappointed. I had quite a lively discussion on another topic where I held the affirmative (non-skeptical) view. I presented my views and evidence as best I could, and was greeted with the skepticism that I expected. Another poster and I kicked the issue around a bit, came to an acceptable "middle ground", shook hands and walked away.

The point of this story is that this is a SKEPTICS' forum, and you'll not find a tougher audience anywhere if Randi's name is on it. The responses you got, while maybe unkind, were not unexpected, at least not by me. "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" would be carved on a wall here, if the forum had walls.

That being said, if you want to talk about Loose Change, I for one remain all ears.

[Hellbound]

LOL

Nice, changed the website now.

Sorry, but the claims seem too similar for that not to be you...or, at least, for that not to be the person you based your delusions on. But I'd bet that's you.

And while it may not say where you are, the whois information does. major security breach, there. Of course, anyone who's worked with computers (such as myself) would understand the securoty risks in whois info, and how to mitigate them. Such as using a general name such as "Administrator" instead of a real name, and using a PO Box contact address instead of a physical address, and not using a personal phone number.

But that's just me, I've only been working with computers 10 years or so, what would I know?

Think this pretty much puts paid to the idea that you're being "hunted". Anyone with basic computer knowledge and an extra five minutes could track you.

[Sir Knight]

source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_patent

Sorry you loose, you either don't know what PROBABLY means, nor did you read the whole thing, you did NOT finish your research, let me show you something, the balance of what you left off. Please read carefully. Please note the two words PROBABLY and the APPLIED for, just because you APPLY on a date that is NOT the date or even proof you will GET the patent. But below please note when it was issued, 1980 quite a few years later, so maybe they were the first patent to be APPLIED FOR but not necessarily the first one issued. I applied for mine and it took 3 years to get it. Now that I have done your home work and research, let me clarify something, what they patented is quite different from what I patented, and the patent relates to solving simultaneous linear equations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_equation). which really isn't necesarily a sofware process if you read the whole article, it could be done with a mechanical device such as an old type of adding machine. Mine was a complete software process and mine was in the U.S. so maybe to make things more fair, mine was the first Patent for sofrtware in the U.S. But based on what I can find on this I think what my patent attorney told me and Microsofts attorney's told me is more correct. But PROBABLY doesn't mean ABSOLUTELY. The definition of SOFTWARE is problamatic at best in this particular circumtance. And you took the PROBABLY to be a CERTAIN but if that is how you do your research and draw you conclusions on anything I can see where you don't know your UP's FROM your DOWNs. Please read my larger cut and paste completely which addresses more than you suggested.

And I quote:

The first software patent ever granted is probably a patent for a "computer having slow and quick access storage, when programmed to solve a linear programming problem by an iterative algorithm, the iterative algorithm being such that (...)" applied for in 1962 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1962) by British Petroleum Company (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BP) ([2] (http://www.cippm.org.uk/pdfs/JILT%20kretschmer%2011_03.pdf), see end of page 3). The patent relates to solving simultaneous linear equations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linear_equation).
The USPTO (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Patent_and_Trademark_Office) has traditionally not considered software to be patentable because by statute patents can only be granted to "processes, machines, articles of manufacture, and compositions of matter". In particular patents cannot be granted to "scientific truths" or "mathematical expressions" of them. This means that most of the fundamental techniques of software engineering have never been patented.
The USPTO maintained this position, that software was in effect a mathematical algorithm, and therefore not patentable into the 1980's. The position of the USPTO was challenged with a landmark 1981 Supreme Court (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_Court_of_the_United_States) case, Diamond v. Diehr (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamond_v._Diehr). The case involved a device that used computer

I rest my case,

Sir Knight

[sleahead]

But to talk about the movie isn't really why I came to this place. I was looking for something, maybe someone and I just don't think it was the right place to come I guess

Here's a novel idea, Sir Knight. Why don't you state specifically what or who you're looking for?. Then we'll be able to tell you if it or he/she is here or not.

[Gravy]

I rest my case,

Sir Knight
Your reading comprehension and interpretation skills are terrible. "Probably" includes the possiblilty that there were software patents issued prior to 1962.

Now, since you've rested your case based on the positon of the USPTO in the 1980s, please tell us where the 1962 BP patent was issued.

Once you've done that, please give the names, workplaces, and approximate dates of disappearance of the doctor and mechanic you referred to, so that I can verify their existence and disappearance.

Fair enough?

Then we can proceed to discussing 9/11 issues, which is why you came here, correct? Or are you just howling at the moon?

Edited to add: Never mind. I read above that you're just howling at the moon. Please seek professional help. There are lots of non-disappearing psychiatrists out there. http://www.nmha.org/infoctr/FAQs/treatment.cfm

[Sir Knight]

LOL

Nice, changed the website now.

Sorry, but the claims seem too similar for that not to be you...or, at least, for that not to be the person you based your delusions on. But I'd bet that's you.

And while it may not say where you are, the whois information does. major security breach, there. Of course, anyone who's worked with computers (such as myself) would understand the securoty risks in whois info, and how to mitigate them. Such as using a general name such as "Administrator" instead of a real name, and using a PO Box contact address instead of a physical address, and not using a personal phone number.

But that's just me, I've only been working with computers 10 years or so, what would I know?

Think this pretty much puts paid to the idea that you're being "hunted". Anyone with basic computer knowledge and an extra five minutes could track you.

Hello? I have been doing this 30+years now and I guarantee that you could NOT track me down using a computer. Oh if I was using a land line maybe, even DSL or CABLE, but not with me using satellite, guess again my friend. And I thought you knew so much, but as you said you only have been doing this for 10 years.

And I can be on different SAT very quickly and even the SAT company don't know where I am. LOL They have a post office box. And don't send me anything there anyway.

And you draw conclusions too easily for me. You are skeptical but gullible all at the same time, how do you do that and no choke to death?

Now you have been fun, or should I say funny.

Doing a battle of intellect with you is like dealing with an unarmed animal with me having a macine gun, it just don't seem fair. I must laugh now, and I have laughed hard with all of you saying that I am a liar and all of this isn't true, when I am setting back here with all the truth in the world, you have to admit it must seem funny to me.

Your powers over facts, evidence, research, detective skills and deductive reasoning just overwelms me. NOT! You are deluding yourself if you think you know anything about me. And the truth I speak of is just that, ALL TRUTH. But you are so busy labeling it on the NEG side you show no interest in really wanting to know the truth, you ask in doubt without concern or appreciation of my situation, what ever happened to "Innocent till proven guilty?" You have not proven me insane nor a liar, and I am sure glad you are not on any jury I have to be in front of, for I feel sorry for the person that you would pass judgment on.

So many of you on here, NOT ALL, please I am not insulting ALL of you, those who the shoe fits know it, profess to be such super sleuthers and be able to add two and two and come up with four have proven to me beyond a reasonable doubt that you don't know your head from the south end of a north bound horse.

I can't believe any of you (again that noted exception) ever really took the time to reasearch anything to draw any reasonable conclusion. It would take too much thinking that it might hurt you. If someone gives you one or two simple facts WANTING you to go there, you just do, like lambs to the slaughter. Why do you think I put the web address there? Because I didn't want anyone to see it? I knew you would, well I hoped someone would eventually, thought it would happen much sooner than it did. That was a big dissapointment that it took so long actually.

You are too easliy led down one path and given to draw conclusions on one simple fact or maybe two which when you have no connection between the two other than a slight reference you jump on it like ugly on an ape.

That my friends is not logic, reason or wisdom. It is shear foolishness which you endeavor to wallow in.

I came not to play mind games, nor have fun here, I came to find, and if I found something I was going to test it before TRUSTING IT, that is WISDOM. You never find out who you are dealing with by saying YES, but you quickly find out who you are dealing with by saying NO. Try it sometimes.

But tis not a surprise what I found here at all just a disappintment.

Oh and I do think there are some nice people here, just not the majority.

Sir Knight or you can call me Betty if you like LOL toooooo funny but tragic at the same time.

[Gravy]

Sir Knight or you can call me Betty if you like LOL toooooo funny but tragic at the same time.
http://www.nmha.org/infoctr/FAQs/treatment.cfm

[Sir Knight]

Your reading comprehension and interpretation skills are terrible. "Probably" includes the possiblilty that there were software patents issued prior to 1962.

Now, since you've rested your case based on the positon of the USPTO in the 1980s, please tell us where the 1962 BP patent was issued.

Once you've done that, please give the names, workplaces, and approximate dates of disappearance of the doctor and mechanic you referred to, so that I can verify their existence and disappearance.

Fair enough?

Then we can proceed to discussing 9/11 issues, which is why you came here, correct? Or are you just howling at the moon?

Edited to add: Never mind. I read above that you're just howling at the moon. Please seek professional help. There are lots of non-disappearing psychiatrists out there. http://www.nmha.org/infoctr/FAQs/treatment.cfm


No not howling at the moon but talking to you is like beating my head against the wall I am sure.

You have offered nothing to get me to want to give you any proof and based on your attitude and position you are not a person I would want to assist me in any way for anything. I am looking for someone real, obviously you are not that person. And everything I said before goes double now. Don't bother me again, this whole thing is pointless because if you were to sit down with me and go over the evidence you still wouldn't believe it. You are mesmerized by your own self worth but you are a dollar short and a day late. You have not even taken a minute to think about a person that might be in my situation for real, which is definitely the case here, and you have shown no compassion.

So I am not wasting another minute on the likes of you.

I am just trying to be prudent with my time and I have been forced to the simple conclusion you are a major waste of it.

[Hellbound]

Meaningless drivel

*chuckle*

No, I didn't spend much time researching, and I could well be wrong (I don't think so, but that's based on personal opinion rather than fact).

However, see how easy it is to jump to a conclusion? Just like many do after watching Loose Change, before they actually research the facts.

Of course, I bet if I go to a certain address on a certain street in a certain town in Florida, I'd find a person posting on a certain account.

And your talk about SAT and DSL and land line really has nothing to do with what I posted.

In any case, it's not really a subject that interests me, it's just funny to see someone as ignorant of the relevant issues claiming insider knowledge.

You call us all gullible, but then berate us for refusing to accept your word as gospel. Gotta love that.

So, if I drive to Carol Springs and knock on a certain door, tell me you won't be the one answering :)

[kevin]

gah, I usually don't complain about thread drift because i'm usually an instigator but this thread is freaking huge enough without trying to keep track of who's best in computers. We have a computer forum for that, could we shift the software patent and/or who knows computers better to that forum?

[Hellbound]

gah, I usually don't complain about thread drift because i'm usually an instigator but this thread is freaking huge enough without trying to keep track of who's best in computers. We have a computer forum for that, could we shift the software patent and/or who knows computers better to that forum?

It's not about who's best in computers. It's about showing up someone who is misrepresenting himself. I did nothign that takes any amountof expertise at all. Nothing I posted has any relation to the best in computers, in fact, it's all very basic information.

If I wanted to show who's best I'd ask questions and get technical, not that I'd expect any response.

IN any case, I'm simply working to disprove his claims, and having a bit of fun with it. I'm pretty much done now. Not much sport in it.

[Mr. Skinny]

gah, I usually don't complain about thread drift because i'm usually an instigator but this thread is freaking huge enough without trying to keep track of who's best in computers. We have a computer forum for that, could we shift the software patent and/or who knows computers better to that forum?
Agree.

Until Sir Knight decides to talk about Loose Change or 9/11, I think this portion of this thread, beginning with his first post in it, should be moved to the Abandon All Hope Forum.

[kevin]

I did nothign that takes any amountof expertise at all. Nothing I posted has any relation to the best in computers, in fact, it's all very basic information.

My comment wasn't directed at you. It was for sir knight, he's the one claiming to have taught a thing or two to Ada Byron. If he wants to argue about software patents, i'm perfectly willing to do so in the computer or science forums.

[SRW]

Let me tell you a little about myself before you write me off as a looney toon. I am 55 years old, an inventor, well educated, a writer, investigator, been in computers for over 30 years and I was issued the first patent issued on software. Now with that said I will get to WHY I came to this site and WHY I am posting here.

Sir Knight

For all of us concerned it might be simpler to tag your posts if you are saying things which are less than truthful. For example {what follows is a complete pile of horse manure} I was issued the first patent issued on software {end of horse manure}. Otherwise I will just have to use my current method of regarding everyting you say as the ravings a Loony toon.

Thank you ever so much,

By the way is there anything you have to offer new to the discussion of Loose Change or 9/11? If not why are you here?

Steve

[Hellbound]

My comment wasn't directed at you. It was for sir knight, he's the one claiming to have taught a thing or two to Ada Byron. If he wants to argue about software patents, i'm perfectly willing to do so in the computer or science forums.

Well, I participated in the drift a bit much myself, so I can't claim innocence anyway :P

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Sir Knight or you can call me Betty if you like LOL toooooo funny but tragic at the same time.

If I can call you "betty", maybe when you call me, you can call me "Al"?

[Gord_in_Toronto]

You are so funny. I said I have been in computers for over 30 years, I am 55 years old, how do you come to I must have been 12? I think you math is faulty. I never said when I got the patent, did I give you a date and time? Now I know how the government thought they would get away with all this, you guys don't even know how to use a calculator. But in highschool I built my first computer from scratch, my electronics teacher told me I couldn't do it but I did. Also just for grins and giggles, everyone else built those crystal controlled radios in class, LOL, I was the only one that built an AM radio transmitter. I just had to be different. The other was just too simple.
You know that expression, "You don't have a clue" well that appears to be a pretty good slogan for this thread. I have boxes and boxes of court documents, testimony, sworn statements etc etc. It would take anyone of you a month or more to just read through all of it. you have it all wrong, it isn't I who needs to convince you, that is pretty much impossible at this stage, it is someone out there that would need to convince me they could help if what I said was true and factual. I guess I was looking for someone that did CARE or COULD DO something other that spout more inuendos and rumors via igorance. LOL you guys may have already started a rumor that I am BILL GATES. I didn't see the connection at all.
You guys can't even get a few simple facts I give to you straight.

And hey the 12 years old was some what entertaining, stupid but entertaining.

Sir Knight

You know I can only judge a poster in this or any other group on the credibility of information of the posts he or she makes with respect to the things I have experience in. So I'll call you on this -- crystal radios are not "crystal controlled". They use a crystal (or these days -- 1945 onward in my experience) a simple diode to rectify the RF signal. I built one in grade school. I, too, built an AM transmitter when I was of highschool age. Making one with a Colpitts circuit requires a transistor, a tunable coil, two resistors and two capacitors and 15 minutes. ISTR I got the diagram from a copy of Popular Mechanics circa 1958.

[Sir Knight]

*chuckle*

No, I didn't spend much time researching, and I could well be wrong (I don't think so, but that's based on personal opinion rather than fact).

However, see how easy it is to jump to a conclusion? Just like many do after watching Loose Change, before they actually research the facts.

Of course, I bet if I go to a certain address on a certain street in a certain town in Florida, I'd find a person posting on a certain account.

And your talk about SAT and DSL and land line really has nothing to do with what I posted.

In any case, it's not really a subject that interests me, it's just funny to see someone as ignorant of the relevant issues claiming insider knowledge.

You call us all gullible, but then berate us for refusing to accept your word as gospel. Gotta love that.

So, if I drive to Carol Springs and knock on a certain door, tell me you won't be the one answering :)

Oh I am so sorry, but I almost fell out of my chair laughing at that.

Oh go for it, LOL, you will be in for a big surprise. No I am not even close to being there. Oh so funny I was laughing till it hurt.

And I never said anyone had to believe everything I said, but I would looking for some interest not BASHING. Judgement without a cause is what I have been getting. LOL And you just said I was IGNORANT of relevant issues, wow... I don't think I am the one ignorant here. This is why they think they will get away with it all, because anyone that purports to KNOW is laughed at and ridiculed. It appears you have all made me the ISSUE. I think you sum it up quite well when you said "based on personal opinion rather than fact" that is all I have been really finding here is just that. Everything that anyone has said about me mainly neg BS is just that no proof but it appears none is needed to condem someone. Because I talk of things you guys don't want to hear that makes me crazy? Excuse me but that proves my point I have been trying to make all along. You guys don't even consider that someone knows something more than you do, you guys must know it all right? And when someone comes along do you even give him a chance? You guys think you have given me a chance? If it is true should I just post it all over the place right now? Give my address and phone number out? Invite everyone that wants to come over for lunch? Who is the crazy one now?

And it isn't CAROL Springs it is CORAL SPRINGS. Entirely different town.

But no I am not there. And I know exactly why you think that I would be. That is what is so funny. Still not doing your homework, still going down the wrong line. What is so funny is I can tell you the truth all day and it doen't seem to matter at all. You don't pick up on the truth, you insist on making up UNTRUTHS and trying to prove that. And I do not berate you for NOT taking my word for gospel that isn't it at all. I have a hard time believing it, and I have lived it. I can prove it to anyone I choose to, but difficult over this medium to say the least. I want to share it with someone who would CARE. Here is a copy of a note I sent someone that might enlighten you to something about me.

Hey,

For one thing I like skeptics, I just don't like stupid people. I hate people who blindly believe what ever they are told. The problem here is that I find some of these people claim to be skeptics but they are just stupid people pretending to be skeptics. You see a skeptic I find is some one who with enough facts and evidence will come to a logical conclusion where stupid people CAN'T come to a logical conclusion even if their life depended on it. Knowledge without wisdom is stupidity, because if you have knowledge and don't know what to do with it you are stupid.

Well I have been trying to do something with the truth but I can't seem to find anyone in the government that cares, no matter what proof I have. It appears the more proof I have the less they want to hear about it. Opinions they can deal with FACTS they cannot.

So anyway I do appreciate the kind words and warning. These guys are not interested in sharing, they are only interested in TEARING.

Oh well, such is life. nothing new.

Please note I have left out a couple of things for specific reasons but the main part is there unfettered.

And to the guy that was trying to say PROBABLY was something else, I think they were trying to go for the oldest thing they could reach for and again, the patent wasn't issued then. If they could have found anything older they would have referred to that, but considering computers have only been around so long I don't think they stood much of a chance there.
And again you missed my entire point. You didn't post the whole thing just a very small portion, something you accuse others of doing, which makes you a hypocrite. And when did you ever get a patent issued at any time which might make you a expert? LOL

I am willing to prove everyting to anyone who is for REAL and would CARE.

But all I hear is I don't care and etc etc. So why are they here? I guess it is to bash those that might know something into submission.

Well that isn't going to happen with me, not today not ever.

Anyway, enough of this

[Class]

I am willing to prove everyting to anyone who is for REAL and would CARE.


I care! Please prove it to me in a PM. I swear I won't pass it on to any FBI agents.

[Joytown]

you see I need something beyond talking and arguing, and I don't think anyone on this site could or would do anything about anything even if it was proven beyond any reasonable doubt. What I know is not really up to dealing on a discussion level as it is really hard line facts.

And I have proven it to others around me and although they would like to do something they are not capable. I thought this forum would have a different aura to it I guess and a different base to it.

Thanks Sir Knight - I think civility is the paragon of intelligent discourse.

Unfortunately you don't give us much to discuss. Don't look at it as an antagonistic situation. If your facts are, in fact, the truth - they will withstand the crucible of inspection. This forum is one of rational thought, of enlightened discourse. You are making references and allusions to information that could very well change the way we see 9/11 and beyond.

So please do share something of substance so that we can engage in something resembling a conversation!

Thanks.

-Joytown

[Sir Knight]

You know I can only judge a poster in this or any other group on the credibility of information of the posts he or she makes with respect to the things I have experience in. So I'll call you on this -- crystal radios are not "crystal controlled". They use a crystal (or these days -- 1945 onward in my experience) a simple diode to rectify the RF signal. I built one in grade school. I, too, built an AM transmitter when I was of highschool age. Making one with a Colpitts circuit requires a transistor, a tunable coil, two resistors and two capacitors and 15 minutes. ISTR I got the diagram from a copy of Popular Mechanics circa 1958.


Well well, someone who can read, shucks etc. LOL you are absolutely correct, I mispoke but I haven't used the term crytal radio in so many years I accidently reverted to something I have used many times out of habit over the past many years. I sit corrected. And the radio transmitter I built was not as simple as yours my friend. What was the range on your unit? 50 feet? Maybe 20? Mine was very sophisticated had about 10 transistors if I recall correctly. You have to understand I do not have a photographic memory so I don't have the diagram in my head right now. But I had a range on mine of about 1/4 mile and it came with a really nice case external antennae and a nice microphone, and ir worked off of 110 volts.. It took about 2 weeks to built part time and had lots of parts ot it. I remember we had a problem with it initially and I couldn't find out why it wasn't working and my eletronics teach had to go over it part by part with me testing every part and even he couldn't find out why it wasn't working. I recall it ended up being some bad solder joint that didn't appear be done incorrectly but that is really unimportant. I really hope you don't base you entire judgement of me on the one little mispoken term. Anyway, I never expected things to remain on this message board level if I found someone I trusted. I am not stupid by any means. I don't think I have even used the term crystal radio for over 40 years. But I have used crytal controlled enumerable times along with radio controlled.

So pardon my mistake and let it not be an inference that I am ignorant of the difference or that it made me a liar or way shape or form. I really didn't stop to think when I wrote that, and it came out wrong, there are some other things that happened in a similar manner today but I caught them before posting them. That is one I just sent without really reviewing it first, which is my mistake. And the radio is controlled by the crystal for without it there would be nothing to it but granted not in the way the term is normally used.

Have a good day

[Gravy]

Judgement without a cause is what I have been getting. LOL
No, you've been getting judgments based on the evidence of your behavior here.

As you have nothing to discuss about 9/11, please take your persecution complex elsewhere.

[Belz...]

Hey I was told by IBM, the makers and designers of the PC that my company could NOT do something in particular with them, as they weren't designed to do it. LOL Hey they should know right, they were the experts, but you should have seen their faces when we told them we ALREADY HAD DONE IT

So they were wrong. It happens to ME, so it can happen to anyone else. Who knew, eh ? Oh, that's right. YOU can't be wrong.

One thing I see a real shortage of on here is LOGIC and WISDOM. Most of you sure don't know your history really well.

I don't see how past history helps us understand EVIDENCE of current history.

No I am not Bill Gates, I was around before him. He is a joke in many ways a good thief at best, and even a better liar.

Actually, he was a good programmer and, obviously, a fair businessman. I'm sorry you didn't fare as good as he did, but that's no reason to call him names.

I haven't written myself off, just you. Everything I told you is the truth and I could prove it but what difference would it make in your petty world or mine? You don't have room for the truth as you are just full of yourself.

Let me get this straight. You HAVE proof, but won't present it because I won't believe you anyway ? That's the oldest cop-out in the book. Try again.

You make doubting Thomas look good.

Why, thank you. I didn't think I had a compliment coming my way.

Another stupid pointless post, I was referring to being in CONSPIRACIES with the GOVERNMENT idiot. I WAS THERE, I KNOW THEY HAPPEN. I HAVE PROOF, all you can be an expert on is stupidity, BECAUSE YOU ARE THERE JUST BEING STUPID. You totally ignored what I was saying and hung onto the final word. Geeesh, you made my point about the majority on here. Bye....

Now he's talking to himself.

I don't mind skeptics at all, but stupid peole who jump to conclusion and lable people based on ignorance I do have a problem with. And again I came here willing to prove something to someone I guess but not under a hostile invironment. And for this being a skeptics board,

Considering how they're called SKEPTICS, you should expect them to be, well, skeptical.

But I can see it is more than just skeptics here, fringe loonatics more or less abound here.

Unfortunately, true. Lifegazer, HypnoPsi, Interesting Ian, Geggy, Christophera, Killtown, Childlike Empress, Jenabell, Iacchus, Iamme, and now you.

[Drysdale]

Maybe you could just skip the I'm Al Gore and I invented computer software spill and just get to why you are such a devout follower of LC.
You've only been asked to do this about 10 times.

[Sir Knight]

No, you've been getting judgments based on the evidence of your behavior here.

As you have nothing to discuss about 9/11, please take your persecution complex elsewhere.


I have not given any behavior I have been trying to introduce myself and find out who the hell is here BEFORE I show my stuff so to speak.

The only way you can even think the way you do is you must firmly believe there is no conspiracies WHAT SO EVER ANYWERE.

And so there is no risk and nothing to worry about. I was jumped on before I had a chance to do anything. Sheesh.

You guys really know how to impress someone and make them feel welcome. NOT! I wouldn't trust you with my dirty underwear along with the facts I know.

And that is the TRUTH

Oh I know how about I have you call up a Private Detective I know who is a witness to a lot of this stuff? No I don't think so. I will not risk my life and others to prove something to someone who really don't give a ****.

you guys are living in a bubble. If I do have something I would be CRAZY to just throw it around blindly. And since I am not crazy I need to learn a little trust about someone but that isn't happening around here.

You guys run the truth away before it has a chance to even begin to show itself.

And that is even more truth, but maybe that is your job.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

We need to get this guy and Christophera together.

(I'm a sick twisted bastard)

[kevin]

We need to get this guy and Christophera together.

(I'm a sick twisted bastard)

CAGE MATCH!

(see this is why I don't usually complain about thread drift)

[Hellbound]

I have not given any behavior I have been trying to introduce myself and find out who the hell is here BEFORE I show my stuff so to speak.

The only way you can even think the way you do is you must firmly believe there is no conspiracies WHAT SO EVER ANYWERE.

And so there is no risk and nothing to worry about. I was jumped on before I had a chance to do anything. Sheesh.

You guys really know how to impress someone and make them feel welcome. NOT! I wouldn't trust you with my dirty underwear along with the facts I know.

And that is the TRUTH

Oh I know how about I have you call up a Private Detective I know who is a witness to a lot of this stuff? No I don't think so. I will not risk my life and others to prove something to someone who really don't give a ****.

you guys are living in a bubble. If I do have something I would be CRAZY to just throw it around blindly. And since I am not crazy I need to learn a little trust about someone but that isn't happening around here.

You guys run the truth away before it has a chance to even begin to show itself.

And that is even more truth, but maybe that is your job.

Well, gee, if you have such a low opinion of everyone here, and so little trust, why are you here? I mean, it's pretty obvious you can't tell us your big secret, right?

[Sir Knight]

I care! Please prove it to me in a PM. I swear I won't pass it on to any FBI agents.


LOL, well sorry but that didn't have a ring of sincerity.

And the FBI already know about some of it, but again they didn't seem to do anything or get back to me although they NEVER said I was wrong, but they didn't seem to NEED or WANT all the proof I had. I offered but they declined.

And if I was to trust you on such a meaningful note then I would be truly crazy and a liar. How about you sending me a private message giving me a reason why I should trust you with anything.

You see, you claim there is nothing to be had or known, so there is nothing to worry about then. I say something quite different so the outcome is quite different. PM me and give it your best shot. I really don't care for this public aspect of it right now anyway. We can talk PM and we shall see.

Sir Knight

[Belz...]

LIke I said, I wish I was crazy, I wish I was making all this up but I am not, sad but true.

If you WERE crazy, you couldn't tell the difference, Knight.

But I am just disappointed in general.

I'm sorry. That was mispelled. I think you meant to say "dissapointing".

Hello? I have been doing this 30+years now and I guarantee that you could NOT track me down using a computer.

This isn't the movies, Knight. Plus you've given enough information that someone wouldn't NEED a computer to track you down. Plus, you're obviously lying. Why would your enemies remove your mechanics and your psychologist instead of just removing YOU ?

Oh go for it, LOL, you will be in for a big surprise. No I am not even close to being there. Oh so funny I was laughing till it hurt.

You seem to be doing little except "LOL"ing, over here. As someone once said to me, simple minds are amused easily.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

CAGE MATCH!

(see this is why I don't usually complain about thread drift)

I got 20 bucks on the guy wielding the 3" rebar on a 4' center.

[Belz...]

The only way you can even think the way you do is you must firmly believe there is no conspiracies WHAT SO EVER ANYWERE.

By definition, a conspiracy is a crime perpetrated by two or more individuals. I think it's safe to argue that there ARE conspiracies. The problem with conspiracy THEORIES is that they tend to get unwieldingly huge, both spatially and temporally, making them impossible, humanly speaking.

[Belz...]

I got 20 bucks on the guy wielding the 3" rebar on a 4' center.

See ? THAT, Sir Knight, is comedy.

[Gravy]

You guys run the truth away before it has a chance to even begin to show itself.
In your earlier posts you stated that you will not divulge what you know. Yet you blame us for not letting the truth show?

Stop. Step back for a moment. Take a deep breath. Look at your behavior here.

This is a discussion forum about 9/11. You brought up one issue, Loose Change, in your first post. You were provided with resources that will help you determine the validity of the claims in that video.

Since then you haven't discussed a single issue related to 9/11. Every post has been about how poor Sir Knight has been misunderstood for making wild, unrelated claims and refusing to provide substantiation.

You are behaving badly. Please stop. I provided you with a link to mental health resources in the U.S. Please avail yourself of them.

[T.A.M.]

Sir Knight:

It is obvious you have yourself in so much of a tizzy, that noone is going to get anywhere with you here, whether it relates to your personal situation, which is important to you, but not neccesarily to others here, or in relation to your "Loose Change" arguments. When you initially came here, you made statements about LC, and why we should accept it, and you called people who didn't stupid, so don't go acting all "Victim" like, and innocent. And if you are so intelligent, I would have thought you would have "lurked" here for a while, and this would have easily told you what you were in for based on what and how you presented it.

Really though, if you don't have anything productive to contribute, discuss, or debate, I gave you references to sites that hold your same views on the video, and they will welcome you, and your plight, with open arms...I am sure they are far more intelligent then us village idiots, and your supreme intellect would find a much better home there...

[Gravy]

I really don't care for this public aspect of it right now anyway.
It's a good thing you didn't bring it up on a public internet forum, then!

Oh, wait....

[Sword_Of_Truth]

LOL, well sorry but that didn't have a ring of sincerity.

And the FBI already know about some of it, but again they didn't seem to do anything or get back to me although they NEVER said I was wrong, but they didn't seem to NEED or WANT all the proof I had. I offered but they declined.

Knight, consider the following:

1.) Class (and everyone else here) thinks you're crazy.

2.) It is illegal to submit a false report to the police or federal law enforcement agents.

Class is sincere because he believes that if he does send your info to the feds, it will be him who gets busted.

[Sir Knight]

Well, gee, if you have such a low opinion of everyone here, and so little trust, why are you here? I mean, it's pretty obvious you can't tell us your big secret, right?


Well not like you think. Anyway, I know the bible quite well also, and it states, "neither cast your pearls before swine lest they trample them under their feet and turn again and rend you." so you might say I am testing the waters, making sure I separate the men from the swine, you figure out who is who. LOL

I am wise and not stupid, knowledgeable and not ignorant but if you would put yourself in my position for even one minute and ask yourself what would you do if what I was inferring was correct. What exactly would ou do? Think about that REALLY think about that. I do every day.

[Mancman]

Well not like you think. Anyway, I know the bible quite well also, and it states, "neither cast your pearls before swine lest they trample them under their feet and turn again and rend you." so you might say I am testing the waters, making sure I separate the men from the swine, you figure out who is who. LOL

I am wise and not stupid, knowledgeable and not ignorant but if you would put yourself in my position for even one minute and ask yourself what would you do if what I was inferring was correct. What exactly would ou do? Think about that REALLY think about that. I do every day.

I click on a thread about 9/11, and I see pages of you talking about yourself.

What issues do you have with 9/11?

Everyone, save yourself an evening and refrain from entertaining the ramblings of this guy.

[Hellbound]

Well, I definately wouldn't be posting openly on internet forums and leaving easily followed clues to my identity and location.

But call me a rebel :D

[Gravy]

I was jumped on before I had a chance to do anything. Sheesh.
I wonder what he planned to "do?"

[Gravy]

Well, I definately wouldn't be posting openly on internet forums and leaving easily followed clues to my identity and location.

But call me a rebel :D
And Sir Knight, if you seek anonymity, I suggest not speaking at City Council meetings. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA1hyqA6UTY&search=helicopter%20pilot

[T.A.M.]

He was not jumped on. I have been here since the first post, and answering to it. I welcomed him, and told him that his views would be allowed here, even if not accepted.

He gave a spiel about Loose Change, stating how excellent it was, and how it had solidified in his mind what he alread knew, and how those who didn't see it this way must be stupid.

We pointed him to some legitimate sources, and then he goes completely snaky, when a few people call him out on a few things....

[Sir Knight]

By definition, a conspiracy is a crime perpetrated by two or more individuals. I think it's safe to argue that there ARE conspiracies. The problem with conspiracy THEORIES is that they tend to get unwieldingly huge, both spatially and temporally, making them impossible, humanly speaking.


Hey great post, first really intellectually sound thing I have seen here. Ok,now if there IS a conspiracy and someone really knows something where exactly would you think he should go to?

And if he did show up on a site such as this what would he to do to convince someone?

You see, I am not in a tizzy, I am in a connundrum, a paradox of a sort.
Between a rock and a hard place for sure. You see my personal situation and the 9/11 incidents are tied together in such a weird way. But my situation goes back before 9/11. I am a victim in more ways than one. Remember Atta, I think that is the spelling, the supposed main hi-jacker? I met him, didn't like him much. Met him right before 9/11. Not a friend or a buddy or anything.

Anyway, I have not posted anything major on here for many serious reasons and I have been checking out the place, like someone else said I should. But sitting back and listening or reading posts didn't do anything for me, it told me nothing. I have found out more in a few hours than I thought possible about this place.

I really found that the truth really isn't welcome here, not really. This is just more or less a big joke to most of you. I know others who think different. If you only knew.....maybe if you more inviting.

Fine, so be it.

[T.A.M.]

Is that lunatic David Thompson really Sir Knight. How did you deduce that?

[Sir Knight]

Knight, consider the following:

1.) Class (and everyone else here) thinks you're crazy.

2.) It is illegal to submit a false report to the police or federal law enforcement agents.

Class is sincere because he believes that if he does send your info to the feds, it will be him who gets busted.


Oh again too funny. Well I have not been busted for making false police reports, not by the FBI or anyone else for that matter. And it is so nice for you to speak for CLASS.

And giving FBI or the Police information isn't filing a false police report.
Saying there is a crime when there isn't might be. So what is my crime?
You say I am speaking BS, well if BS is a crime then half of you guys should get life. LOL

Gee such a joke...

[Gravy]

Anyway, I know the bible quite well also, and it states, "neither cast your pearls before swine lest they trample them under their feet and turn again and rend you."
I also know the Bible quite well, and can't figure out why God hates my pillows. (Ezekiel 13:20)

You've spent many posts telling us that you won't be telling us anything. Do you believe this to be rational behavior?

[Gravy]

Is that lunatic David Thompson really Sir Knight. How did you deduce that?
I'm not saying he is, and i'm not saying he isn't. [/Sir Knight mode]

[T.A.M.]

well if Sir Knight is the guy in that video, than above all else that has gone on here, that man needs a good stiff dose of Olanzapine...

[Sir Knight]

Is that lunatic David Thompson really Sir Knight. How did you deduce that?


Well like the guy said, I have had all the fun I can stand.

you will have to look for someone else or continue on without me.

This is not even a skeptical forum from what I can see, don't know what is really it's purpose but it doesn't feel real at all.

So I am REALLY out of here. But don't think I am leaving on a note that says what I said wasn't or isn't true.

Be happy in your bubble, most of you will be happy for some reason I am sure.

Sir Knight

[HopperUK]

Wow, it *was* him? That is - either scary or sort of awesome.

[Gravy]

Some hilarious news from the LC forum. DJLegacy has been banned, and some members believe he was a gubmint shill all along. That's why he wouldn't debate here!

[Sword_Of_Truth]

I also know the Bible quite well, and can't figure out why God hates my pillows. (Ezekiel 13:20)

You've spent many posts telling us that you won't be telling us anything. Do you believe this to be rational behavior?

"Thy breasts are like the two young roes that are twins that feed among the lilies."
- Song of Solomon, Old testament

I don't know about the rest of y'all... but I'm all about a great set of hooters. :D

[Gravy]

So I am REALLY out of here.
Can't argue with that assessment.

[Gravy]

"Thy breasts are like the two young roes that are twins that feed among the lilies."
- Song of Solomon, Old testament

I don't know about the rest of y'all... but I'm all about a great set of hooters. :D
Roe? Solomon was either at the wrong end, or dealing with a mermaid.

[Sir Knight]

I also know the Bible quite well, and can't figure out why God hates my pillows. (Ezekiel 13:20)

You've spent many posts telling us that you won't be telling us anything. Do you believe this to be rational behavior?


Hmmm one parting note: Rational behavior, making up scripture sure isn't rational behavior and on a real note that pertains to 9/11 you should look up Ezekiel 13:10 for that is exactly is what is going on with the world. Too bad you quote that one. LOL I guess you don't quite understand the bible either. He did explain about pillows thing and it isn't your pillows unless you have trouble sleeping due to a bad conscience or someting. It is more of a figure of speech type of thing.

And I never said I wasn't going to tell or share with someone, never said that, just not doing it openly, but even if I convinced 2 or 3 of you offline of what I know, and then they should come back online they would be subject to the same ridicule as I have been. so what is the point to prove anything to any of you? I see none.

Well that about wraps it up....

[Hutch]

Awww, Sir Knight has left the building and I never got to say hello? :(

Whoever he was, that was an education to any readers of this thread on what Gravy/Markyx/Brainster/others who take on these challenges directly face. I salute you gentlemen's patience and forbearance.

Some hilarious news from the LC forum. DJLegacy has been banned, and some members believe he was a gubmint shill all along. That's why he wouldn't debate here!

Woah! DJLegacy was one of the strongest supporters of LC, at least he always impressed me as one. Could it be with all the skeptics banned, the Revolution has begun to feed on itself?? I really wonder how long Russell Pickering (the only LC member I believe we could have a civil discussion with over here) will last in the New LC Order? If not, he has a standing invitation from me to come over to the Dark Side...

And DJ Legacy, your account here is still good, if you'd like to take Gravy up on the debate, I'll gladly bump the thread...

[T.A.M.]

Ya...that guy needs a little...RAAAMMMMOOOONNNNEEEE!!!!!!

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Gravy - I think "roe" also refers to a deer or gazelle. Either way, old Sol was burning up alot of oxygen just to say "nice rack".

Of course, that's just my interpretation. ;)

Hutch - Yes, I'm afraid you've missed Knights 6th, maybe 7th departure from the boards. His 8th, 9th and 10th departures will likely occur within the next hour so stick around.

[Gravy]

Hmmm one parting note: Rational behavior, making up scripture sure isn't rational behavior
Ahem.

"Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD Behold I am against your pillows wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly and I will tear them from your arms and will let the souls go even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly." Ezekiel 13:20 (KJV/Strong's Hebrew)

[Gravy]

Gravy - I think "roe" also refers to a deer or gazelle. Either way, old Sol was burning up alot of oxygen just to say "nice rack".

Of course, that's just my interpretation. ;)
I know...just having fun with it. :)

[defaultdotxbe]

I know...just having fun with it. :)

"How beautiful you are and how pleasing, O love, with your delights! Your stature is like that of the palm, and your breasts like clusters of fruit. I said, 'I will climb the palm tree; I will take hold of its fruit.'

i always liked that one, lol

[delphi_ote]

I agree, but isn't it fun to call these people out?

Sir Knight, you have not behaved honorably. Your knighthood is hereby revoked.
Yea. I just thought it was some real zen **** that his own story unraveled itself. If it were true, he would be dead and therefore unable to tell us the story.

[Submersible]

I've done my 'homework' , and come to the conclusion that the majority of you need to locate and identify with the "freak amino ACID" in your refridgerator and take a long hard look at how it got there.

To be honest with you, besides avoiding a known source of cancer (IGF-1)my ability to believe my own eyes has greatly improved over the last 5 or 6 months.
The "truth" about 9-11 is the good news compared to the fact that most of you have no eartly idea what the USG is and has been injecting into our food supply, but it does explain why most of you here are more than willing to mock or insult others who keep questioning the evidence, when very little if any remains.

I'm certainly not claiming that I know what happened unlike many of you, but common sense will tell you that teeth don't "evaporate" and besides the many questions about tower 7, there is 1 image that shows a body inside the pentagon and nothing to prove that flight 93 contained passengers.

Google the quoted phrase and after you've done a little bit of homework on the contents of your food, think about the chemical constitution of your thoughts before so many of you keep standing so close to the USG's claims on 9-11.

I know that "we the people" are not on the same team, that's all I'm going to say.

[T.A.M.]

(1) somehow, SUB, I doubt that is all you will have to say.
(2) What does the things placed in foods have to do with 9/11...oh wait, wait...I know...the NEW WORLD ORDER...MOLACH...THE BOHEMIAN GROVE.....
Wait...here he comes.....>RAAAAMMMMMMMMOOOOONNNEEEE!!!!!!!

(3) You didn't do any real homework did you. Tell me the number of scientific papers you read, TRUELY PEER REVIEWED (So that takes out all the Scholars for 9/11 Studies articles), versus the number of bogus "Videos" you watched that told you the real "Truth".

So you read the implosionworld paper...not good enough...so you read the MIT Civil Engineer Paper on 9/11....nto good enough...all govt shills eh?...yup, no doubt.

If you don't like the preservatives in your McNuggets, that buy organic. If you don't like organic, than move to northern europe, buy a farm, and live off the land.

What the govt puts in food...give me a break.

Oh wait...and ASPARTAME CAUSES BRAIN CANCER...right...waht a crock of SHAITE!!!

Sorry, I am a little course, but I have to go to work in the real world tomorrow...some of us have real jobs...

[kevin]

Is that lunatic David Thompson really Sir Knight. How did you deduce that?

is this his patent?
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-adv.htm&r=16&p=1&f=G&l=50&d=PTXT&S1=Thompson-David.INNM.&OS=in/Thompson-David&RS=IN/Thompson-David

[T.A.M.]

Posted August 13th on LC forum by user "Beached"

The 911myths site is just nonesense, and in fact I know it's run by imdb's propagandist in chief for their United 93 and World Trade Center message boards. He goes by the username of PhillyPhreak13. Sometimes i'll post on the imdb just to see if i can get the attention of any of the skeptics. Once you start leaving the skeptics speechless he usually butts in and tries to "debunk" everything you are saying by copy/pasting links to his site and large portions of Popular Mechanics and the 9/11 Comission Report.

However, his analysis are nothing more than propaganda - with his perverse physics he's a champion to skeptics in the same way Fred Leuchter was a champion to Neo-Nazi's! He will either skirt around the issue, or in the case of one showing how ridiculous his analysis is of the colapse of the WTC, he will have your posts removed! I remember i posted numerous pictures of the construction of the WTC clearly showing the core colums with a link to an analysis by Prf. Steven Jones. Not long after that post was promptly removed! I rest my case!!!

So Mike is the chief Propagandist for "United 93" movie on IMDB...interesting...never knew.

Apparently LC forum gurus do not like the 911myths site very much...who would have guessed...:)

[Sir Knight]

is this his patent?
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-adv.htm&r=16&p=1&f=G&l=50&d=PTXT&S1=Thompson-David.INNM.&OS=in/Thompson-David&RS=IN/Thompson-David


Yep that is me, boy you guys finally tracked me down. Darn it.
Yeah the gov is trying to steal my computerized software driven
fishing line dispenser to use on the next moon shot.

And just imagine I thought you guys were a joke.

Good job researching that.

Dave

[defaultdotxbe]

So Mike is the chief Propagandist for "United 93" movie on IMDB...interesting...never knew.

Apparently LC forum gurus do not like the 911myths site very much...who would have guessed...:)

they just cant grasp the concept that more than half a dozen intelligent people disagree with them

[mrfreeze]

Now they have Ted Turner on their side because TNT is showing A few good men, the patriot, and runaway jury in a row. Since those are "Anti-Government" movies, Ted must believe in the CT.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Well like the guy said, I have had all the fun I can stand.

you will have to look for someone else or continue on without me.

This is not even a skeptical forum from what I can see, don't know what is really it's purpose but it doesn't feel real at all.

So I am REALLY out of here. But don't think I am leaving on a note that says what I said wasn't or isn't true.

Be happy in your bubble, most of you will be happy for some reason I am sure.

Sir Knight
Snicker.

[tsig]

[QUOTE=Sir Knight;1861481]Hey great post, first really intellectually sound thing I have seen here. Ok,now if there IS a conspiracy and someone really knows something where exactly would you think he should go to?

And if he did show up on a site such as this what would he to do to convince someone?



..maybe if you more inviting.

Fine, so be it.[/QUOTE/]

So if we kissed you it would change the facts.

[MarkyX]

they just cant grasp the concept that more than half a dozen intelligent people disagree with them

With the emails I've been getting, I would say with confidence that a huge number of them do.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

From the unexplained-mysteries forum (thanks tk0001 for the intro a while back); someone brought BYU's Jones into the debate. I countered. After reading their response I didn't feel I really needed to add anything



Jones' paper does not have the backing of the academic or professional communities:
Critiques of Jones' paper by experts in the field:

"The structural engineering faculty in the Fulton College of Engineering and Technology do not support the hypotheses of Professor Jones." - The College of Engineering and Technology department

"But jet fuel wasn't the only thing burning, notes Forman Williams, a professor of engineering at the University of California

"There's nothing to debunk," says Zdenek P. Bazant, a professor of civil and environmental engineering at Northwestern University and the author of the first peer-reviewed paper on the World Trade Center collapses.

"It's a non-issue," says Sivaraj Shyam-Sunder, a lead investigator for the National Institute of Standards and Technology's study of the collapses.

Ross B. Corotis, a professor of civil engineering

Thomas W. Eagar is one scientist who has paid some attention to the demolition hypothesis — albeit grudgingly. A materials engineer


why would you need the backing of people that do not have the credentials or mathamatical background to contest his hypothesis?-- experts in the field of engineering do not have the credentials to debate the mathamatical aspect of the collapse-- is there not one physics dr willing to debate him on the issue?-- of course not because its an open and shut case it does not take an expert to determine the story surrounding bldg 7 is a complete fabrication to the point of being comical-- just like if youve ever been skateboarding with a friend and he fell and broke his arm to the point where the bone was protruding through the skin and blood was spilling out it would not take a doctor to determine the fact that it would have been a "compound" fracture-- whats worse is that there are people that would be trying to claim its only a sprain even though there was blood,bone and a right degree angle in the center of the tibia and fibia-- how are the engineers going to dismiss the box column??? c'mon people can you not add 2 and 2?-- bush's executive order w199i,pnac calling for a "new pearl harbor",the rush into iraq on fake evidence and the current price of gas all scream inside job even if you disregaurd the obvious evidence in the videos of the collapses themselves--9/11 WAS AN INSIDE JOB!! just ask Lt Col Robert Bowman or someone from bush's first administration like Morgan Reynolds who was chief economist in the labor dept during W jr's entire first term who proclaims demolition charges and the fact that it was an inside job-- please tell us why should we listen to you over these people??
-9/11 WAS AN INSIDE JOB!!

[Sir Knight]

[quote=DHR;1861988][quote=Sir Knight;1861481]Hey great post, first really intellectually sound thing I have seen here. Ok,now if there IS a conspiracy and someone really knows something where exactly would you think he should go to?

And if he did show up on a site such as this what would he to do to convince someone?



..maybe if you more inviting.

Fine, so be it.[/QUOTE/]

So if we kissed you it would change the facts.[/quote

Yeah quite a bit, in fact I would run from you and not stop.

Inviting meaning nice, receptive and hospitable was what had in mind.

I am not sure you are even trying to be real here. You guys treat everyone here like they are liars, don't believe a word they say rip them apart. A lot of what I was doing in the beginning was introducing myself like I saw in other posts, but boy I get bushwacked.

Being real is many things and only a few on here came across as real, and they are those that didn't make snide remarks and gave a little benefit of the doubt.

You others are just crass individuals. To even think that everyone is just going to believe anything I say would be stupid on my part, but to think that anything and everything I was going to say would be torn apart was not really a what I thought would happen. A lot of you guys went extreme

But it is your loss not mine........ Too late to kiss and make up. LOL

[Gravy]

Yep that is me, boy you guys finally tracked me down. Darn it.
Yeah the gov is trying to steal my computerized software driven
fishing line dispenser to use on the next moon shot.

And just imagine I thought you guys were a joke.

Good job researching that.

Dave
Dude, do you even have a sense of humor? Do you know what a JOKE is?

And what happened to being "really gone?" You can't even tell the truth about something as simple as that?

If you do return to this thread, Sir Benighted, please make it to discuss 9/11 issues, which we take seriously around here.

ETA: What? You're back already? Okay, chief, yes or no: are you going to discuss 9/11?

A simple yes or no, please, and stick to it.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

[quote=DHR;1861988][quote=Sir Knight;1861481]Hey great post, first really intellectually sound thing I have seen here. Ok,now if there IS a conspiracy and someone really knows something where exactly would you think he should go to?

And if he did show up on a site such as this what would he to do to convince someone?



..maybe if you more inviting.

Fine, so be it.[/QUOTE/]

So if we kissed you it would change the facts.[/quote

Yeah quite a bit, in fact I would run from you and not stop.

Inviting meaning nice, receptive and hospitable was what had in mind.

I am not sure you are even trying to be real here. You guys treat everyone here like they are liars, don't believe a word they say rip them apart. A lot of what I was doing in the beginning was introducing myself like I saw in other posts, but boy I get bushwacked.

Being real is many things and only a few on here came across as real, and they are those that didn't make snike remarks and gave a little benefit of the doubt.

You others are just crass individuals. To even think that everyone is just going to believe anything I say would be stupid on my part, but to think that anything and everything I was going to say would be torn apart was not really a what I thought would happen. A lot of you guys went extreme

But it is your loss not mine........ Too late to kiss and make up. LOL


I thought you were leaving?

[Levantine]

[quote=DHR;1861988][quote=Sir Knight;1861481]Hey great post, first really intellectually sound thing I have seen here. Ok,now if there IS a conspiracy and someone really knows something where exactly would you think he should go to?

And if he did show up on a site such as this what would he to do to convince someone?



..maybe if you more inviting.

Fine, so be it.[/QUOTE/]

So if we kissed you it would change the facts.[/quote



Yeah quite a bit, in fact I would run from you and not stop.

Inviting meaning nice, receptive and hospitable was what had in mind.

I am not sure you are even trying to be real here. You guys treat everyone here like they are liars, don't believe a word they say rip them apart. A lot of what I was doing in the beginning was introducing myself like I saw in other posts, but boy I get bushwacked.

Being real is many things and only a few on here came across as real, and they are those that didn't make snike remarks and gave a little benefit of the doubt.

You others are just crass individuals. To even think that everyone is just going to believe anything I say would be stupid on my part, but to think that anything and everything I was going to say would be torn apart was not really a what I thought would happen. A lot of you guys went extreme

But it is your loss not mine........ Too late to kiss and make up. LOL


I thought you were leaving. I suppose you must have a great deal of time to post on message boards while you're running for your life though, so no big surprise here.

Edit: GRRRR beaten like a 911 denier! Curse your fast reflexes. This isn't the end Wolfshade! :catfight:

[Sir Knight]

[quote=Sir Knight;1862011][quote=DHR;1861988]


I thought you were leaving. I suppose you must have a great deal of time to post on message boards while you're running for your life though, so no big surprise here.

Edit: GRRRR beaten like a 911 denier! Curse your fast reflexes. This isn't the end Wolfshade! :catfight:

Do you know the difference between the word running and the word hiding? I never said I was running, HIDING yes. Posting on here (now I am in a different location anyway, can you tell?) takes up little time actually. And this was Sunday so I did nothing much today. Unfortunately I get emails from this site, and I got one or two nice ones, not necessarily agreeing with me, but NICE people, but you wouldn't know the meaning of that word either, just like the words RUNNING and HIDING are the same to you.

Grow up or drop dead pick one quickly and don't ask me to suggest one in particular. This isn't your place and if I am invited back nicely I can come back. Too bad it isn't as easy to get people like you to leave though.

Sir Knight

[Levantine]

[quote=Levantine;1862022][quote=Sir Knight;1862011]

Do you know the difference between the word running and the word hiding? I never said I was running, HIDING yes. Posting on here (now I am in a different location anyway, can you tell?) takes up little time actually. And this was Sunday so I did nothing much today. Unfortunately I get emails from this site, and I got one or two nice ones, not necessarily agreeing with me, but NICE people, but you wouldn't know the meaning of that word either, just like the words RUNNING and HIDING are the same to you.

Grow up or drop dead pick one quickly and don't ask me to suggest one in particular. This isn't your place and if I am invited back nicely I can come back. Too many it isn't as easy to get people like you to leave though.

Sir Knight


It has been said before in this thread, but I feel it bears repeating: You do realize that very little of what you say makes sense, right? I'm not even sure what your last paragraph means.

I'm sure you know, but obviously I'm not nice enough to know the TRUTH. Now please indicate what any of what came after your first post has to do with the 9/11 conspiracy and the credibility of Loose Change in general.

[Sir Knight]

[quote=Sir Knight;1862038][quote=Levantine;1862022]


It has been said before in this thread, but I feel it bears repeating: You do realize that very little of what you say makes sense, right? I'm not even sure what your last paragraph means.

I'm sure you know ,but obviously I'm not nice enough to know the TRUTH. Now please indicate what any of what came after your first post has to do with the 9/11 conspiracy.


Well right after I posted that I saw a typo but I didn't even have time to fix it before you jumped on it. That is what has been going on every since I got here. I have been so busy defending my introduction about myself for the most part I haven't been able to even think much about other stuff. If you go back and read my post you will see I fixed the word that now makes what I said more clear and understandable.

you are too busy jumping on the littlest thing to even be concerned what I am really about.

I believe in the old addage, the best defence is an offence, and you guys have been offending me constantly since I got here, throwing off of why I came. Also you guys are good at another thing. If you can't dazzle them with your brilliance, baffle them with your Bull ****.

I think some of you are scared I just might share some things here and you rather run me off.

I will share with whom I think I can safely and in a manner I want to, and I don't need the likes of you telling me how to do it. It isn't your life at stake anyway so why should you care? I have been told many times that certain people on here don't care about me my life etc. Well why are they are here? What is the point of all of this is you don't care just go away and leave it for people who do care about something. I care about the FACTS but I also care about PEOPLE. I know an attrocity has taken place and a lot of innocent people died. It wasn't the first time and it won't be the last time, but these things happen because people do NOT care to STOP them from happening. But the reason things happened to me are the same reasons 9/11 happened. The gov is corrupt, there are conspiracies going on right now doing even worse things around the world.
Most of them in the name of God and Country.

So if I am to be considered a liar and not a valid person, don't beat on me, leave me alone. You are nothing more than a bully.

[Pardalis]

So many words, so little meaning. :rolleyes:

[Sword_Of_Truth]

[quote=Levantine;1862042][quote=Sir Knight;1862038]
So if I am to be considered a liar and not a valid person, don't beat on me, leave me alone. You are nothing more than a bully.

/foreheadsmack

[Levantine]

[quote=Levantine;1862042][quote=Sir Knight;1862038]

I think some of you are scared I just might share some things here and you rather run me off.

There seems to be little danger of this happening. You have yet to share *anything* of substance and you're still here. Your thoughts?



So if I am to be considered a liar and not a valid person, don't beat on me, leave me alone. You are nothing more than a bully.


No one's keeping you here. Feel free to take leave at any time. Or heck, maybe make a point and stop dodging. That'd be novel, hm?

[Dog Town]

Do you know the difference between the word running and the word hiding? I never said I was running, HIDING yes. Posting on here (now I am in a different location anyway, can you tell?) takes up little time actually. And this was Sunday so I did nothing much today. Unfortunately I get emails from this site, and I got one or two nice ones, not necessarily agreeing with me, but NICE people, but you wouldn't know the meaning of that word either, just like the words RUNNING and HIDING are the same to you.


Uhhem! I may not have a Phd., but I know pare..aaaa...noid when I read it."What in the wide,.. wide.... world O' sports... is go'en on here? I sent you boys out ta build a railraod, I find you danc'in roun like a bunch o'"(well,...you know)!? Doesn't mean we ain't after ya! Hehe!

DT

[Gravy]

So if I am to be considered a liar and not a valid person, don't beat on me, leave me alone.
Leave YOU alone? You came HERE with your ridiculous drivel.

For the last time, this is a thread about 9/11. Take your personal problems elsewhere!

[Sir Knight]

Leave YOU alone? You came HERE with your ridiculous drivel.

For the last time, this is a thread about 9/11. Take your personal problems elsewhere!

FYI, my personal problems are YOUR personal problems but you are too stupid to add 2 and 2 together. Loss of CIVIL RIGHTS due to 9/11 is pertinent. And so many of you say so little but convey too much stupidity.

When I do bring out specific items or mention something that should peak your interest you avoid it. Answer it with THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN ADDRESSED. BS, I see people reposting things on here all the time, and if you think I am or anyone is going to read all 4 volumns to get everything that is posted then you are dummer than a post.

I am here about 9/11 and about many things that either came out of it or had to do with it and many other related things.

But you at too stupid to figure that out or just don't care.

you are a simple minded individual and I am surprised you even can figure out how to use a computer....

Do not use personal insults.

[Dog Town]

Where's the Saint RM when ya need em?

DT

[Regnad Kcin]

:popcorn1

[Gravy]

I suggest to the Mods that these Sir Knight's posts be moved elsewhere. He has continually derailed this thread.

[Belz...]

Well not like you think. Anyway, I know the bible quite well also, and it states, "neither cast your pearls before swine lest they trample them under their feet and turn again and rend you."

BIBLE THUMPER!!! We're off the deep end, now.

[Belz...]

Hey great post, first really intellectually sound thing I have seen here. Ok,now if there IS a conspiracy and someone really knows something where exactly would you think he should go to?

I think you misunderstood my post. Bank robbers are part of conspiracies. Often, one of them talks while having sex with a prostitute while drunk, and the police get word of it, and they get arrested. Now, if this robbery was performed by 4 people and this got out, imagine a conspiracy of THOUSANDS...

I really found that the truth really isn't welcome here, not really. This is just more or less a big joke to most of you. I know others who think different. If you only knew.....maybe if you more inviting.

It's all about the evidence here, Knight. All about the evidence.

[Belz...]

Some hilarious news from the LC forum. DJLegacy has been banned, and some members believe he was a gubmint shill all along. That's why he wouldn't debate here!

Link ?

[Belz...]

The "truth" about 9-11 is the good news compared to the fact that most of you have no eartly idea what the USG is and has been injecting into our food supply, but it does explain why most of you here are more than willing to mock or insult others who keep questioning the evidence, when very little if any remains.

So, what ? Do they put "mock enzymes" in our food ? Oh, wait!! I'm not even an American!!

[Belz...]

It isn't your life at stake anyway so why should you care?

I repeat: if the government killed your psi and your mechanic, why didn't it kill you just as easily ?

[kevin]

I repeat: if the government killed your psi and your mechanic, why didn't it kill you just as easily ?

tin foil hat saved him.

[Gravy]

Link ?
Sorry, a little sock puppet told me. I can't view the site.

[chipmunk stew]

FYI, my personal problems are YOUR personal problems but you are too stupid to add 2 and 2 together. Loss of CIVIL RIGHTS due to 9/11 is pertinent. And so many of you say so little but convey too much stupidity.

When I do bring out specific items or mention something that should peak your interest you avoid it. Answer it with THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN ADDRESSED. BS, I see people reposting things on here all the time, and if you think I am or anyone is going to read all 4 volumns to get everything that is posted then you are dummer than a post.

I am here about 9/11 and about many things that either came out of it or had to do with it and many other related things.

But you at too stupid to figure that out or just don't care.

you are a simple minded individual and I am surprised you even can figure out how to use a computer....If you knew everything that I know based on my dangerous experiences and many intelligence contacts and encounters with the CIA (100% verifiable and factual) that I can't tell you about unless you prove yourself to be super gullible and easily awe-struck by my awesomeness, you'd know that you are full of crap. By the way, I was the lead engineer on a secret weapons program that the public knows nothing about (I can't say any more about it otherwise I'll "disappear") so don't write me off. My opinion counts for something.

{ignore mode: ON} *plonk!*

[gumboot]

Here's an experiment for you. Set a bowling ball on your foot. It exerts a force equal to the weight of the ball. Now pick that ball up and drop it on your foot.


:D

That's my favourite. I grin like a loon every time I read it.

-Andrew

[NDBoston]

Dylan's going to Washingon DC!!

I think he's watched "All the Presidents Men" a few too many times too.

We're embarking on a massive research trip. We'll be staying very close to the Pentagon, and interviewing a number of people, people you can't even guess. Just want to put the word out, we're gone from the 21st to the 27th or so, so you don't hear from us after that, be concerned. Because we're going to be stepping on some serious toes down there...

Is every person in the CT movement mentally ill?

[Darat]

Dylan's going to Washingon DC!!

I think he's watched "All the Presidents Men" a few too many times too.



Is every person in the CT movement mentally ill?

I don't know but they all sound exactly the same whether they are CTists regarding UFOs, JFK, 9/11 or why their mum bought brown bread last week instead of her customary white bread.

[Hellbound]

I don't know but they all sound exactly the same whether they are CTists regarding UFOs, JFK, 9/11 or why their mum bought brown bread last week instead of her customary white bread.

BROWN BREAD IS THE WORK OF SATAN!!!!!!!


:D

[Gravy]

Dylan's going to Washingon DC!!
I think he's watched "All the Presidents Men" a few too many times too.
Is every person in the CT movement mentally ill?

We're embarking on a massive research trip. We'll be staying very close to the Pentagon, and interviewing a number of people, people you can't even guess.
We can't guess who the people are because they're totally insignificant. I wonder if he'll also be talking to eyewitnesses to the crash and first responders.

Ha Ha! No, I don't wonder that.

Careful down there, Dylan. You don't want a repeat of when you and Phil Jayhan were detained by Pentagon security. You're in their database now, and I hear that some of the former Abu Ghraib guards are working the Pentagon brig. The three of you will not look good in a naked pyramid.

[realitybites]

We're embarking on a massive research trip. We'll be staying very close to the Pentagon, and interviewing a number of people, people you can't even guess. Just want to put the word out, we're gone from the 21st to the 27th or so, so you don't hear from us after that, be concerned. Because we're going to be stepping on some serious toes down there...
Who wants to bet that at 00:00:01 on August 28th the Loosers start spreading word that Dylan's been silenced by The Man. He's taking an awful risk of being disappeared before the anniversary. Whoever will his flock follow if he's in some concentration camp?

or why their mum bought brown bread last week instead of her customary white bread.
In the CTers/ists defense though, that is pretty effed up.

[gumboot]

And Sir Knight, if you seek anonymity, I suggest not speaking at City Council meetings. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA1hyqA6UTY&search=helicopter%20pilot


That's one of the funniest things I have ever seen in my life.

-Andrew

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Snicker.
Like I saId.

[Hutch]

We're embarking on a massive research trip. We'll be staying very close to the Pentagon, and interviewing a number of people, people you can't even guess. Just want to put the word out, we're gone from the 21st to the 27th or so, so you don't hear from us after that, be concerned. Because we're going to be stepping on some serious toes down there...

I wonder (if he is still in the region) if LTC Hal Bidlack might give them an interview (it would be one they wouldn't forget!!!)

Naah, Hal has way to much class for those characters.

[Brainster]

Amidst the discussion (http://alternet.org/story/40476/?comments=view&cID=182172&pID=182160#c182172) of the Looser Than Words crew's burgeoning empire (offices in LA and London!), we learn that we might as well give up finding the errors in their film. Why? Because they were left in there on purpose!

ROWE: What I encourage people to do is go out and research it themselves. We don't ever come out and say that everything we say is 100 percent. We know there are errors in the documentary, and we've actually left them in there so that people discredit us and do the research for themselves -- the B52 (remarked to have flown into the Empire State Building), the use of Wikipedia, things like that. We left them in there so people will want to discredit us and go out and research the events yourself and come up with your own conclusions. That's our whole goal, to make Americans think. To wake up from the 16 amps of your television to watch something and get a passion in something again.

When I was a kid, there was a neighbor of mine who whenever she made a bad play in a game, would immediately say, "Oh, I meant to do that!", like she was setting up one of those six-jump moves in checkers. It was, shall we say, one of her less endearing qualities, but she was also about 8 years old.

[gumboot]

Amidst the discussion (http://alternet.org/story/40476/?comments=view&cID=182172&pID=182160#c182172) of the Looser Than Words crew's burgeoning empire (offices in LA and London!), we learn that we might as well give up finding the errors in their film. Why? Because they were left in there on purpose!


Disengagement manoeuvre?

-Andrew

[chipmunk stew]

Amidst the discussion (http://alternet.org/story/40476/?comments=view&cID=182172&pID=182160#c182172) of the Looser Than Words crew's burgeoning empire (offices in LA and London!), we learn that we might as well give up finding the errors in their film. Why? Because they were left in there on purpose!
Rowe claims that they've been turning down seven-figure offers left and right.
“I’ve got four movie studios [including Paramount and Miramax] beating down my door to make the final cut,” says Rowe, who’s now got offices from California to London to handle his growing company.
This ought to be verifiable.

[Darth Rotor]

"A tale, tole by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing"
-Shakespeare-
Is there no end to the troll food some here (to include me) keep in their pockets?

*Gollum voice*

"What has it got in its pockets, precious? Nasty, nasty troll food, we wants fish!"

Sorry, Gollum, the only fish here is in the aroma of Sir Knight's assertions.

DR

[realitybites]

“I’ve got four movie studios [including Paramount and Miramax] beating down my door to make the final cut,” says Rowe, who’s now got offices from California to London to handle his growing company.

That's so weird. I just had a similar experience....

A couple weeks ago, I was singing through some Billy Joel (Scenes From An Italian Restaurant if you must know) while I was on the throne. Unbeknownst to me, two guys had broken into my apartment with the intent of stealing the Ikea coffee table we have. Oddly enough, one of the guys was a record exec at Sony. He heard my a cappella renditions (which admittedly were a little rough, but the accoustics of the bathroom covered up most tuning issues) and came running down the hall towards the bathroom like he'd just discovered "the next big thing".

Luckily, I had just pulled up my pants when he burst through the door, contract in hand.

Long story short, if you wanna get famous, it helps if you're taking a dump.

[DavidJames]

That's so weird. I just had a similar experience....

A couple weeks ago, I was singing through some Billy Joel (Scenes From An Italian Restaurant if you must know) while I was on the throne. Unbeknownst to me, two guys had broken into my apartment with the intent of stealing the Ikea coffee table we have. Oddly enough, one of the guys was a record exec at Sony. He heard my a cappella renditions (which admittedly were a little rough, but the accoustics of the bathroom covered up most tuning issues) and came running down the hall towards the bathroom like he'd just discovered "the next big thing".

Luckily, I had just pulled up my pants when he burst through the door, contract in hand....If I had a nickel for every time that happened...

[Gravy]

Long story short, if you wanna get famous, it helps if you're taking a dump.
You've touched the very fiber of my soul.

[MortFurd]

You see, I am not in a tizzy, I am in a connundrum, a paradox of a sort.
Between a rock and a hard place for sure. You see my personal situation and the 9/11 incidents are tied together in such a weird way. But my situation goes back before 9/11. I am a victim in more ways than one. Remember Atta, I think that is the spelling, the supposed main hi-jacker? I met him, didn't like him much. Met him right before 9/11. Not a friend or a buddy or anything.

Anyway, I have not posted anything major on here for many serious reasons and I have been checking out the place, like someone else said I should. But sitting back and listening or reading posts didn't do anything for me, it told me nothing. I have found out more in a few hours than I thought possible about this place.

I really found that the truth really isn't welcome here, not really. This is just more or less a big joke to most of you. I know others who think different. If you only knew.....maybe if you more inviting.

Fine, so be it.
First off, this makes it look like you are from Coral Springs, so Huntsman may well be right in your identity. Atta lived in Coral Springs during the months before the WTC attacks. Giving you the benefit of the doubt, of course. If you didn't know Atta, then you are a liar - and still may live in Coral Springs.


The TRUTH is welcome here anytime. It usually shows up with a couple of facts to vouch for it, and is warmly welcomed by all.

[realitybites]

You've touched the very fiber of my soul.
I've seen you're soul. It's dark and rotten. I don't wanna touch that.

[kevin]

Long story short, if you wanna get famous, it helps if you're taking a dump.

I've been looking for a new sig line and I do believe that is it. damn brilliant.

[Sir Knight]

[quote=Brainster;1862730]Amidst the discussion (http://alternet.org/story/40476/?comments=view&cID=182172&pID=182160#c182172) of the Looser Than Words crew's burgeoning empire (offices in LA and London!), we learn that we might as well give up finding the errors in their film. Why? Because they were left in there on purpose!

Hello,

Thanks for the reference because I got to read the whole article, which most on here wouldn't do.

You quoted just one small part of it, doing what you say they do, and when I read the whole article I came away with an entirely different thing than you were trying to spoon feed me.

Anyway, back to 9/11, which this thread it suppose to be all about, or so I have been told so many times. I have been reading a lot of the posts since I started on here, those that have nothing to do with me and it appears there hasn't been too much said about 9/11. So don't pin all this junk on me.

Now here is something which I have been trying to tell everyone, and it directly started on 9/11. We lost our civil rights directly due to the Presidents actions immediately after and because of this incident we refer to as 9/11. The President has used and abused his supposed authority to interfer in our lives. (One of the reasons given for the 9/11 conspiracy in loose change is for the President and others to grab power over us). And I referred to people knowing their history in one of my posts, and let me show you one or two of the things I was referring to.

SPY POWERS
Can the president eavesdrop on private citizens without a judge's ok? The high court said 'no' in 1972 Wiretaps: Ruling requires warrants for spying at home

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2006/01/08/MNGHGGK8OC1.DTL

So they couldnt' get away with it back then, but then 9/11 comes along and guess what.........they do it again. History is repeating itself but WHY?

DETROIT - A federal judge on Thursday struck down President Bush (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=President+Bush)'s warrantless surveillance program, saying it violated the rights to free speech and privacy, as well as the separation of powers enshrined in the Constitution.

Bush is using 9/11 to elminate many of our civil rights, even the Courts are seeing that, why can't some of you?

And it isn't just the phone tapping, check this out.
High Court Rejects Detainee Tribunals

5 toCurb 3 Ruling s President's Claim Of Wartime Power

The Supreme Court yesterday struck down the military commissions President Bush established to try suspected members of al-Qaeda, emphatically rejecting a signature Bush anti-terrorism measure and the broad assertion of executive power upon which the president had based it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/06/29/AR2006062900928.html

And this also

FEINGOLD CALLS ON ADMINISTRATION TO RECONSIDER ILLEGAL WIRETAPPING PROGRAM FOLLOWING SUPREME COURT’S HAMDAN DECISION
Supreme Court’s Ruling Directly Undercuts the Administration’s Arguments In Defense of Illegal NSA Wiretapping Program

http://www.feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/statements/06/07/20060717htm.htm

So even a governor isn't happy with the wiretapping. Not just me.

Now for some of you who I need to connect the DOTS for, 9/11 has lead us to WAR, and he is using the WAR to take away our civil rights. And he is upset because the Courts RULE we have civil rights and he doesn't have the right to take them away.

Here,

Bush Condemns Court Ruling Against Wiretap Program
By Jim Malone
Washington
18 August 2006

In-Depth Coverage (http://www.globalsecurity.org/intell/library/policy/national/index.html)
President Bush says he strongly disagrees with a federal judge's decision that the administration's eavesdropping program aimed at suspected terrorists is unconstitutional.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/intell/library/news/2006/intell-060818-voa01.htm

See the real problem here is the word SUSPECTED. No proof has to be found. So if someone accuses you of being a terrorist then you have no civil rights. I met Atta, supposedly the mastermine behind 9/11, does that make me a terrorist. Wow I was in his vicinity for 10 minutes and oh boy I actually talked to him on the phone once and met with him. Had to do with an ad I had selling something. Ok boys, this guy gets no civil rights any more ..poof gone. And you think we are living in a free society? I have no criminal record, never done anything wrong besides a speeding ticket. What happened to innocent till proven guilty? No, now we have guilty by accusation, guilty until proven innocent. And if they are wrong just like the President was on the WMD, well you might get an apology but don't hold your breath, and due to the WAR on Terrorism these mistakes are expected to happen and you will NOT be able to sue them over it. Oh you live is GONE, things have changed but you CANNOT DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT because we are at WAR. Don't know about you but I think my civil rights are MORE important when we are at war NOT less. What, because we are at war we become a MILITARY STATE? The Supreme Court doesn't agree and neither do I.

I remember something along these lines a long time ago in the past, it was called the INQUISITIONS. People were hanged, burned at the stake, they were accused of being witches or heretics ..... all killed in the name of God and Country. If you weren't aligned with the powers that be, they would crush you.

Now if 9/11 was conspired by people in our own government to gain power, they did just that and they did it quite well. Gain power that is.

Now another dot or two for you guys, all of the above (loss of civil rights) has affected me, including the TRIBUNAL problem. I have been deprived of so many civil rights it isn't funny but due to the WAR ON TERRORISM, it doesn't matter. I and my civil rights are NOT important anymore, now why you all SHOULD be concerned is you can fall into the TRAP in a heart beat.

And what is terrible about this, is that my civil rights was just torn up and thrown away, and I was DEPRIVED of a written explaination which I was legally entitled to, but since I WAS NOT GIVEN THAT, I can't even appeal to the SUPREME COURT which would give me relief, just like it has ruled on this other matters IF THEY GET THERE! But please note: If there is NOTHING put in WRITING, there is NOTHING to APPEAL. You need a ruling in WRITING TO APPEAL. So if they don't give you something in writing what are you going to do?

So, and this is just a small portion of the REAL problem, which most are totally ignoring, our civil rights are being quickly and easily stripped from us under the GUISE of being at WAR. War supposedly instigated by the 9/11 attacks.

And in the movie Loose Change, referring to Sept 2000, The Project for New American Century Report, "Rebuilding America's Defenses" a NEW Pearl Harbor is needed and guess what we got it. In fact in the news it was often referred to as just as bad as Pearl Harbor was. If someone thinks we need more DEFENCES you would need to have MORE Enemies to justify it but what if you do NOT have any enemies to justify it? Well then maybe we should just go out there and convince the public we do, even if you have to make them up. Just like the part of the movie where it refers to Operation Northwoods. This is another reference I made where if you do NOT learn from the past History will repeat itself.

Look at Iraq and the Weapons of mass destruction, they weren't any. The story was made up so we could go in there after him. Oops. Now we are in a War on terrorism. What if there was NO real terrorism to go to war over, what if it hadn't changed from what it was before 9/11? See fighting terrorism is not a problem for me but going to WAR over an imaginary threat is a problem for me. And one thing I know about any branch of the service, is if they can plan it, they WILL DO IT. Take Operation Northwoods, does that sound right to you? How many other clandestine operations have we done in the name of God and Country? There have been many in the news over the past years, and many that were not. And many told to us by the news didn't happen exactly like it was said. Some truth comes out but it is usually too little too late and most always never makes the headlines.

And all of this is WITHOUT "Loose Change", and what you might consider inside information.

Wake up, smell the rotten fish, and it isn't in Denmark this time.

Sir Michael

[negativ]

And Sir Knight, if you seek anonymity, I suggest not speaking at City Council meetings. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zA1hyqA6UTY&search=helicopter%20pilot

If that guy had his own TV show / radio show, I would never be able to stop watching / listening.

(Yeah, I know about Alex Jones) :p

[realitybites]

I've been looking for a new sig line and I do believe that is it. damn brilliant.
I'd like to say I'm honored, but the fact is, people have offered me in upwards of 7 figures to use my line in their signature.

I've turned them all down of course....

:cool:

[kevin]

I'd like to say I'm honored, but the fact is, people have offered me in upwards of 7 figures to use my line in their signature.

I've turned them all down of course....

:cool:

I'll offer you 8 figures for the copyright on it. All the figures are zeros, and I'm including the 2 after the demical point, but hey it's the thought that counts.

[Belz...]

Look at Iraq and the Weapons of mass destruction, they weren't any. The story was made up so we could go in there after him. Oops. Now we are in a War on terrorism. What if there was NO real terrorism to go to war over, what if it hadn't changed from what it was before 9/11? See fighting terrorism is not a problem for me but going to WAR over an imaginary threat is a problem for me. And one thing I know about any branch of the service, is if they can plan it, they WILL DO IT.

And, pray tell, what was their objective in Iraq ?

[Sir Knight]

First off, this makes it look like you are from Coral Springs, so Huntsman may well be right in your identity. Atta lived in Coral Springs during the months before the WTC attacks. Giving you the benefit of the doubt, of course. If you didn't know Atta, then you are a liar - and still may live in Coral Springs.


The TRUTH is welcome here anytime. It usually shows up with a couple of facts to vouch for it, and is warmly welcomed by all.


Well the truth may be welcome here, but I doubt if it would be recongized, BECAUSE YOU GUYS DON'T READ THINGS VERY WELL AT ALL. Never said I NEVER lived in Coral Springs, just in case you didn't know it, THERE ARE A WHOLE BUNCH of people that live there. All I said was I WAS NOT THERE NOW. I said I am a long way from there. And for good reason. Geesh, you guys could not figure out the answer to a multiple choice question if there was only one answer posted. You would figure it was a trick question and make up your own. READ WHAT I SAY not what you THINK I SAID or refer to someone ELSE'S INTERPRETATION of what I said. I know what I said and I know WHY. You just don't have a clue even when I spell it out for you.

Stop wasting everyone's time with incorrect assumptions that are based on innuendo's and conjecture.

Again you guys depress me with your billiant powers of deduction.
And listen, I said I met him, talked with him, KNOWING is a whole different level. I don't KNOW the man, KNOW OF HIM yes. You may meet a person but not KNOW him. Learn the definitions of the words and try to use them properly. And please stop bashing me for stupid nonsense which doesn't have an ounce of sense to it. Yeah, like no one would know without you telling them that if I WAS LYING I WOULD BE A LIAR. That was just an eye opening experience that I am sure everyone really enjoyed.

NOT!

[Brainster]

Thanks for the reference because I got to read the whole article, which most on here wouldn't do.

You quoted just one small part of it, doing what you say they do, and when I read the whole article I came away with an entirely different thing than you were trying to spoon feed me.

DOH! My mistake for putting in the link; if I hadn't you would have eaten your peas without the apple cobbler!

Bush is using 9/11 to elminate many of our civil rights, even the Courts are seeing that, why can't some of you?

Because I am not terribly concerned about losing my right not to have my phone tapped when I take phone calls from Al Qaeda operatives abroad.

So even a governor isn't happy with the wiretapping. Not just me.

Feingold is a senator, not a governor, and he's probably the administration's fiercest critic in that body. He's also the only senator to vote against the Patriot Act.

And in the movie Loose Change, referring to Sept 2000, The Project for New American Century Report, "Rebuilding America's Defenses" a NEW Pearl Harbor is needed and guess what we got it. In fact in the news it was often referred to as just as bad as Pearl Harbor was. If someone thinks we need more DEFENCES you would need to have MORE Enemies to justify it but what if you do NOT have any enemies to justify it? Well then maybe we should just go out there and convince the public we do, even if you have to make them up. Just like the part of the movie where it refers to Operation Northwoods. This is another reference I made where if you do NOT learn from the past History will repeat itself.

Ah, finally a reference to 9-11 and Loose Change. Now, what did the PNAC actually say about a new Pearl Harbor? Did they say one was needed? Can you point out the page to me?

(Rest of paranoid nonsense snipped)

[gumboot]

Now here is something which I have been trying to tell everyone, and it directly started on 9/11. We lost our civil rights directly due to the Presidents actions immediately after and because of this incident we refer to as 9/11.


Sir Knight,

This is my first post directed at you. I hope you will display me more respect than you have previously displayed to this forum as a whole.

You may be surprised to find that not everyone here who thinks Loose Change is garbage are Americans. Of those that are from the USA, quite a few are rather strongly opposed to the current administration. I don't know what the percentage would be, but it wouldn't surprise me if it was a majority.

It would be unfortunate if you were to confuse rejection of Loose Change with blind trust and obediance to the US Government. That is the sort of reaction I would expect from a person with an extremist position on this subject matter. Extremist views are seldom (if ever) right, and as such are not looked upon fondly here.



Now for some of you who I need to connect the DOTS for, 9/11 has lead us to WAR, and he is using the WAR to take away our civil rights. And he is upset because the Courts RULE we have civil rights and he doesn't have the right to take them away.


Two things. If the US courts are prohibiting the US Administration from carrying out certain actions, the administration isn't doing a very good job of establishing a police state, is it? Seems to be the system is working rather well.

Secondly, some here will agree with your assertations above, others won't. But I think you'll find all of us would concur that these points above in no way prove that the US administration in any way orchestrated the September 11 attacks.

It is possible to exploit or profit from an event without having been involved in the event itself - the media do this every day.




I met Atta, supposedly the mastermine behind 9/11, does that make me a terrorist.


Have you been accused of being a terrorist?



Now if 9/11 was conspired by people in our own government to gain power, they did just that and they did it quite well. Gain power that is.


Bush appears to have been slapped in the face by the US courts on numerous occasions, from your assertations. You consider this power? What do you think would have happened if a German court told Hitler he was not legally allowed to detain Jews in camps?




Now another dot or two for you guys, all of the above (loss of civil rights) has affected me, including the TRIBUNAL problem.


Are you saying you were captured in Afghanistan and detained in Guantanamo Bay as an "illegal combatant" (to use the admin's pet phrase)?




If someone thinks we need more DEFENCES you would need to have MORE Enemies to justify it but what if you do NOT have any enemies to justify it?


Do you not consider radical islamic terrorists an enemy of free western society?



Just like the part of the movie where it refers to Operation Northwoods. This is another reference I made where if you do NOT learn from the past History will repeat itself.


Do you believe Operation Northwoods is evidence that the government would carry out something like September 11?

Because I don't, for two reasons.

1) Operation Northwoods did not involve killing American citizens or destroying private American property.
2) Despite this, Operation Northwoods was thoroughly rejected by the US Administration.

I see no logic by which a US government would be happy to kill thousands of American citizens and destroy billions of dollars worth of private property, but would reject a plan to PRETEND to kill American citizens and destroy private property.



What if there was NO real terrorism to go to war over, what if it hadn't changed from what it was before 9/11?

Are you saying terrorism does not exist?



And one thing I know about any branch of the service, is if they can plan it, they WILL DO IT.

That would make the US defence force unique amongst all the defence forces of the world. Officers are quite often called upon to workshop operations that will never be executed.

The United States, for example, had plans for an invasion of Great Britain prior to World War Two. Last time I checked these plans were never carried out.

I had hoped you were returning to the topic of this thread, but I am disappointed. Please be honest with us, so we can avoid wasting our time (I can't speak for everyone else, but I value mine). Do you ever intend to discuss any aspects of the crocumentary "Loose Change"?

-Andrew

[Sir Knight]

And, pray tell, what was their objective in Iraq ?

Duh, money, power and control = OIL. Why did pick on that little thing when what I was attempting to show you was it was A LIE. The point was there was NO WMD, and they had to finally admit it, so what the ADMIN/GOV tells you is NOT always the truth, mostly FAR FROM IT.

Why can't you stay on point? So many agendas so little time. So many topics but so little minds.

And I guess nothing else I posted in the whole legthy post was worth discussing, just IRAQ. Geesh......give me a break. I gave you NEWS, FACTS ....... NEW CURRENT STUFF and you ask me about what is the GOV's agenda. Oh it probably the WAR ON TERRORISM if you believe them. I have learned the HARD WAY, NOT to believe them. You stand a better chance of getting to the truth.

Here is one possible motive you might check out.

A government document Titled

NPC oil and gas outlook report pleads for help to combat low prices

http://www.osti.gov/energycitations/product.biblio.jsp?osti_id=6631740

Well considering our Government's war's in the middle east has boosted oil prices from $30 a barrel to now $70 I guess they got the help with low prices huh?

I have the answers and facts, problem is you guys don't know what to do with them or even like them.

Combat LOW OIL PRICES. Geesh such a problem for the world. I think we are not at war on Terrorism as much as we are at WAR on LOW OIL PRICES, that war I know we are winning.

Sir Knight

[juryjone]

[Now here is something which I have been trying to tell everyone, and it directly started on 9/11. We lost our civil rights directly due to the Presidents actions immediately after and because of this incident we refer to as 9/11. The President has used and abused his supposed authority to interfer in our lives. (One of the reasons given for the 9/11 conspiracy in loose change is for the President and others to grab power over us). And I referred to people knowing their history in one of my posts, and let me show you one or two of the things I was referring to.

[snip articles about wiretaps and whining about how it all affects Sir Knight]



Thank you for finally posting something even tangentially related to 9/11. Please enlighten me - how is any of this proof that 9/11 was planned by the government, and not just taken advantage of by the government?

No proof of LIHOP or MIHOP. Par for the course.

ETA: Now it's gas prices?!?! Back up, bunky, and address LC, will you?

[negativ]

And, pray tell, what was their objective in Iraq ?

Well, they need someplace to set up the Haliburton death camps once the Bill of Rights has been revoked, don'tcha know.

[gumboot]

Duh, money, power and control = OIL. Why did pick on that little thing when what I was attempting to show you was it was A LIE. The point was there was NO WMD, and they had to finally admit it, so what the ADMIN/GOV tells you is NOT always the truth, mostly FAR FROM IT.


You assert that war was enabled by the September 11 attacks. You may recall that it was actually Afghanistan that was invaded in response to these terrorist attacks. Is is a whole different country.

What, in your estimation, was the US Government's motivation for invading Afghanistan? (Assuming it was not to disperse, destabilise, and hopefully eradicate Al Qaeda).

-Andrew

[realitybites]

Well, they need someplace to set up the Haliburton death camps once the Bill of Rights has been revoked, don'tcha know.
I just got back from doing a concert at one of them. They're really nice.

[Pardalis]

Sir Knight, what was the cost of the 9/11 attacks on the American economy?

ETA: And what is the cost of the operations in Iraq?

If you add them up, do you really think the US government is out for money?

[gumboot]

Well, they need someplace to set up the Haliburton death camps once the Bill of Rights has been revoked, don'tcha know.

Did I say death camps? I meant happy camps.

-Andrew

[Sir Knight]

LOL, I thought I have and did. Motive, I quoted the PLAN you so quickly dismissed. Geesh, you didn't even read what I posted correctly at all.

And what you asked me when you said:

"Are you saying terrorism does not exist?"

Just proves it. That is such a rediculous question that it doesn't merit a response because you refuse to READ WHAT I SAID. We were against it BEFORE we went to WAR. It is the WAR DECLARATION that is the problem, the EXCUSE to rob us of rights that was tied to 9/11.

There is no use me posting anything when people don't even read or address what I write.

And just because there is a ruling doesn't mean they are not still doing it, and have done it before and will continue to do it. It appears that the administration doesn't necessarily adhere to the law when it was RULED against in 1972 for the same acts.

You also failed to refer to the report in my post that directly refers to the Loose Change Documentary. The one calling for a new Pearl Harbor. But I guess all those reference to the MOVIE must not be a reference CAUSE YOU DON'T READ THEM. I don't know what you want, I refer to the movie and you ignor the references. I give movations you and ignor them.

Repect? How can I give you repect when you trashed me with such a stupid question and totally ignored all my reference TO THE MOVIE when you stated and I quote:

Do you ever intend to discuss any aspects of the crocumentary "Loose Change"?

That would make it look like to anyone who didn't read my post in it's entirety that I didn't even refer to the movie which is NOT true at all.

It is a misleading question that actually insults my intelligence. I am trying to bring up specific parts of the movie and connect them to 9/11 which is what I thought this forum is about, or do you want to talk about the angles or speech quality of the movie? The mechanics of putting it together? Geesh ask me something intelligent not something that insults me.

[Sir Knight]

Did I say death camps? I meant happy camps.

-Andrew

Now who is making fun of the dead? Sick joke.

And by the way, the title of this Thread and I copied and paste it from above is:

Conspiracy Theories A place to discuss alternative interpretations, theories and explanations of historical and current events.

And anyone with a brain and who can read will see that is exactly what I have been trying to do in my posts EXPLAIN with THEORIES.

Sir Knight

[Hellbound]

Now who is making fun of the dead? Sick joke.

And by the way, the title of this Thread and I copied and paste it from above is:

Conspiracy Theories A place to discuss alternative interpretations, theories and explanations of historical and current events.

And anyone with a brain and who can read will see that is exactly what I have been trying to do in my posts EXPLAIN with THEORIES.

Sir Knight

Um, no Mr. "I built computers and know more about software than anyone", the title of this thread is Loose Change - Part IV. THe title of this SUBFORUM is conspiracy theories.

But knowing that would require reading, rather than ego-stroking.

[Sir Knight]

Sir Knight, what was the cost of the 9/11 attacks on the American economy?

ETA: And what is the cost of the operations in Iraq?

If you add them up, do you really think the US government is out for money?


LOL, boy are you short sighted. You are asking the WRONG questions. Who is making money off of the WAR over there? Or don't you think that every time a gun is fired or a missle is launched that someone isn't making money? the GOV is run by powerful people, it isn't for the people and by the people anymore. If so why weren't the people asked to give up the rights of privacy instead of it just being taken away?

And 9/11 has costs the people money yes, but there are people making money off of it and with control and power you make even more money. 9/11 gave power to the wrong people.

And so much of what I was posted was just ignored. No one wants to believe it. I don't either, but that doesn't change the facts what certain people can do with their power.

[Hellbound]

And so much of what I was posted was just ignored.


Has nothing to do with wanting to believe it or not.

It does have to do with every single statement you've made here being entirely unsupported by evidence, and many directly contradicted by evidence. Especially considering you aren't James Diehr.

[gumboot]

LOL, I thought I have and did. Motive, I quoted the PLAN you so quickly dismissed. Geesh, you didn't even read what I posted correctly at all.


Please correct me if I am wrong...

Your claim is the US government orchestrated 9/11 so they could justify a war (invading Afghanistan) which allowed them to restrict civil liberties and spend more money on defence research...yes?

Then they invaded Iraq so they could gain lots of oil.

Okay, now what? Why do they want lots of oil and restricted civil liberties? What is their super objective?



Just proves it. That is such a rediculous question that it doesn't merit a response because you refuse to READ WHAT I SAID. We were against it BEFORE we went to WAR. It is the WAR DECLARATION that is the problem, the EXCUSE to rob us of rights that was tied to 9/11.

You said (my bolding):

What if there was NO real terrorism to go to war over, what if it hadn't changed from what it was before 9/11?

Many people would argue that the US (and the rest of the world) did not treat terrorism seriously enough Pre 9/11. Some people would argue the west STILL doesn't treat the threat seriously.



And just because there is a ruling doesn't mean they are not still doing it, and have done it before and will continue to do it. It appears that the administration doesn't necessarily adhere to the law when it was RULED against in 1972 for the same acts.


If this is all true, 9/11 is rather irrelevant, isn't it?




You also failed to refer to the report in my post that directly refers to the Loose Change Documentary. The one calling for a new Pearl Harbor. But I guess all those reference to the MOVIE must not be a reference CAUSE YOU DON'T READ THEM.

I didn't respond to the PNAC point because it is not, IMHO worth bothering to respond to. There are others here who will no doubt give a far more extensive rebuttal than I could anyway.

I did, however, respond to your Operaiton Northwoods reference.

However these were only brought up as supporting evidence in your non-Loose Change orientated discussion. I am only interested in discussing Loose Change in this thread. If you wish to discuss violation of civil liberties or other political issues there are plenty of people in the politics forum who will eagerly contribute.




I don't know what you want, I refer to the movie and you ignor the references. I give movations you and ignor them.

Repect? How can I give you repect when you trashed me with such a stupid question and totally ignored all my reference TO THE MOVIE when you stated and I quote:

Do you ever intend to discuss any aspects of the crocumentary "Loose Change"?

That would make it look like to anyone who didn't read my post in it's entirety that I didn't even refer to the movie which is NOT true at all.


No, it would make it look like you didn't discuss the film. Which you didn't. I will repeat, do you intend to discuss Loose Change? Not refer to, not allude to, not reference. Discuss. That means the subject of your post is Loose Change itself.



It is a misleading question that actually insults my intelligence. I am trying to bring up specific parts of the movie and connect them to 9/11

I can't see how it could be seen as an insult. I simply want to know if you intend to discuss Loose Change? Do you? Yes or no?

The subject of your thread was the US government's power trip post 9/11. The subject of Loose Change is the 9/11 attacks. I am not interested in discussion the government's power trip post 9/11 in this thread. I am interested in discussing Loose Change (other theories on the September 11 attacks themselves are also acceptable).

Obviously it is inevitable that the US government's actions post 9/11 will be referred to and referenced in the process of discussing the September 11 attacks. This is understandable. But if you wish to primarily discuss that subject matter, you are posting in entirely the wrong forum.

-Andrew

[Sir Knight]

Um, no Mr. "I built computers and know more about software than anyone", the title of this thread is Loose Change - Part IV. THe title of this SUBFORUM is conspiracy theories.

But knowing that would require reading, rather than ego-stroking.

Hello you have stated a BLATANT LIE on here, you quoted me saying that I said, "....and know more about sotware than anyone?" Please for us people who can't read, show us the post I made that says that. You see I don't recall ever saying that, and it disturbs me greatly that you quoted something that I don't ever recall THINKING alone posted on this forum.

And again you have ignored all my references to the movie and what I was refering to was how I have used the subtitle and in reference to the movie in question.

Now you can't even twist what I say, you must now just make it up. You must work for the government, only logical explaination I can come up with and anyone who can go back and read my posts will see I never said that. Again you insult or try to insult my intelligence but I know the truth, and I actuall don't think I know everything about software, far from it. so why not ask me what I think instead of telling me what I said, when I didn't say that at all? Oh maybe that is what you feel, but say that, don't lie to everyone and quote me, quote yourself.

If this is the best of this forum has then it is in really bad shape.

Quotes which are a OUT and OUT LIE could give someone just getting in on this a really bad idea about me. But maybe that was your intention?

[gumboot]

Now who is making fun of the dead? Sick joke.


It's actually a quote from a film.

-Andrew

[kevin]

Now who is making fun of the dead? Sick joke.

And by the way, the title of this Thread and I copied and paste it from above is:


that's the title of the forum, not the thread. the thread title is "Loose Change - Part IV".

For a small fee I can teach you to actually use a computer.

[Hellbound]

Apparently, sarcasm is not easily recognized, nor exaggeration for comedic effect.

*sigh*

You, with your high intelligence, still were unable to understand the difference between a thread and a forum.

I don't have to try to give anyone a bad opinion of you. You've done a good job of that already :)

By the way, I do work for the government..one weekend a month, two weeks every year (with the exception of two years getting my a$$ shot at from 2003-2004, and in 2005).

[gumboot]

By the way, I do work for the government..one weekend a month, two weeks every year (with the exception of two years getting my a$$ shot at from 2003-2004, and in 2005).


Is that standard Reserve service in the US?

(I am guessing Reserve... unless it's National Guard? I never had the difference between them explained to me...:confused: )

-Andrew

[Sir Knight]

It's actually a quote from a film.

-Andrew


Well that was not the way you used it, and you were correcting yourself if you read the post you made and there was no mention of the movie at all.

[gumboot]

Well that was not the way you used it, and you were correcting yourself if you read the post you made and there was no mention of the movie at all.

:confused:

I'm pretty good with the English language, but you've lost me.

-Andrew

[ryanebelhar]

By the way, I do work for the government..one weekend a month, two weeks every year (with the exception of two years getting my a$$ shot at from 2003-2004, and in 2005).


I tried to join the reserves once. They said I was too big and had to lose weight :(

[Sir Knight]

[quote=Huntsman;1863226]Apparently, sarcasm is not easily recognized, nor exaggeration for comedic effect.

Quoting someone isn't funny when it isn't true, it gives out FALSE information. And I didn't see anything funny or comedic in what you said.
You could have said it in many ways that would possibly be an attempt to conform to what you are saying now, but there was no JOKING or JK put at the end. It was a QUOTE and UNQUOTE plain and simple.

And I do read sarcasm, that wasn't the problem, and exaggeration is another word for LIE. And again if are you a comedian, don't they have a board for that? But don't give up your day job.

[Hellbound]

Is that standard Reserve service in the US?

(I am guessing Reserve... unless it's National Guard? I never had the difference between them explained to me...:confused: )

-Andrew

Yep. You do one weekend a month, and a two week stretch sometime during the year (usually summer).

Reserves and Guard pretty much follow the same schedules and do things in a similar manner. The difference is the NAtional Guard is state-controlled, while the Reserves is Federal. For NG soldiers, the Governer of the state is (typically) the Commander-In-Chief. NG troops can only be called up for federal service if the governer of the state authorizes it.

I tried to join the reserves once. They said I was too big and had to lose weight :(

Yeah, they have fairly strict weight standards. I'm actually over my weight (for my height), but it's because of muscle mass. My body fat is between 15% and 20%...a bit high, but not too bad. If you are overweight, they go by body fat percentage. I don't know if they'll do body fat calcs for entering, though, I think only after you're in.

[Hellbound]

[quote=Huntsman;1863226]cluelessness removed.

So you also don't understand that quotation marks have uses beyond direct quoting?

Fair enough. If you dislike me so much, quite responding :) The weather's nice in Coral Springs today, go outside for a walk. You'll feel better.

Go read about MHz *snicker*

[gumboot]

Yep. You do one weekend a month, and a two week stretch sometime during the year (usually summer).


You guys do quite a bit more than us. Our minimum is 20 days a year... although I am told most of the officers do a minimum of 70 days a year, and that doesn't include additional training courses (voluntary).



Reserves and Guard pretty much follow the same schedules and do things in a similar manner. The difference is the NAtional Guard is state-controlled, while the Reserves is Federal.


Cool. I thought it was something like that. Thanks for clarifying.

-Andrew

[Drysdale]

You know, I think like most truthers you are so vastly overrating your own intelligence you cant see the forest for the trees.
I personally think you are just a very bitter man. You feel Gates got the millions you rightly deserve and probably lost some judgements in court so now the judicial system and govt are conspiring against you in your mind.
And that's believing you did actually do what you claim.
I have my doubts especially since you threw I knew Atta out there.
IF you did'nt know him and only met him I'm curious to how?
Were you introduced to him? If not how do you know it was him?
Ahhh, I know, he was also being setup by the govt and told you huh?
As others have pointed out if you were that important why kidnap your mechanic and psychologist? Why not just kidnap you?
What the hell kinda sense does that make?
This is just like a movie plot. You know CIA agents, knew one of the terrorists, are being stalked by govt etc.,etc.

Unbelievable.

[Darth Rotor]

A few comments, Sir Knight.
Who is making money off of the WAR over there?Directly, those who sell gas, food, services, maintenance contracts, ammunition, shipping services, and spare parts to the US Military and other nation building efforts in Iraq.

Aside: Defense contracting scams were a big deal in WW II as well. Back in the banana wars, Smedley Butler came to the conclusion that he was fighting for a bunch of New York bankers, and it made him somewhat bitter. See his "War is a Racket" essay. This dynamic is not new, nor is it news. It is part and parcel the influence brokering in Washington, and elsewhere.

Indirectly, the instabiilty in the World's Gas Pump has helped drive up the price of crude, along with other market forces, which means anyone selling gas, such as Hugo Chavez in Venezuela, the Sultan of Brunei, or any Canadian oil concern is pulling in some nice returns without any additional investment thanks to market fluctuations.

Add to that the "nicely orchestrated" hurricane :rolleyes: or two last fall which damaged US refinery capacity a bit, and you have a price increase with modest expense increase. So, are those gents responsible for the attacks as well? Is it possible that an opportunity was seized upon? But wait, some companies lost a bunch of infrastructure in the Gulf of Mexico, and lost production, so they had to eat some red ink. Over all, the global cost increase benefitted anyone pumping oil.

I think that another party making money are media organs -- if it bleeds it leads -- and perhaps they can sell their ad spots at a higher premium. Or not. Don't have any figures in front of me.

Also making money are those who invested in gold, since its price has roughly tripled since 2000.
the GOV is run by powerful people, it isn't for the people and by the people anymore.
I don't completely disagree with you there, but this problem wasn't invented by the GW Bush administration. It goes back to the 16th Amendment where Federal Income tax became a reality, followed by the welfare state induced by the Great Depression, then FDR's creation of a warfare state in 1940. (The Draft and other initial moves that became the War Production Board.) Things scaled up unevenly.

The US turned into a genuine world power, which some folks now call "empire" and that makes for a very different environment than pre WW I politically, in both domestic and foreign matters. The current president wasn't the first to play in that new role. FDR set the Imperial, globalist standard, following in Woodrow Wilson's internationalist footsteps. Each successor has had to deal with that role, with varying results.

How does all that make GW Bush and his cronies party to attack on New York and the Pentagon? It doesn't. Is it possible that some folks had foreknowledge of the attacks? Yes. Do you think any of them would admit it now? I don't. How else does one prove a conspiracy? It's tough in court, though it can be done, and it usually takes insider information.

As to 9-11, loopholes in security have been around for some years, as have the lax and evadable immigration policies. All an enemy needed to do was try to be as clever as possible, and pull off the stunt they did. Given thirty years of airline policy that dictated "play along, get the plane on the ground, and let the experts negotiate with hijackers" a surprise attack occurred. Check under "principles of war" and you will find "surprise" as a standard method where achievable. Those hijackers chose to change the rules of the game. I guess from their perspective, if you aren't cheating, you aren't trying. Per earlier comments with John, the habit of suicide car and boat attacks was already established. A plane was just a bigger, slightly more complex vehicle for delivering a standard attack mode by a particularly dedicated group of people.
If so why weren't the people asked to give up the rights of privacy instead of it just being taken away?
This is a constitutional republic we are talking about. Check Political Theory 101 for how a constitutional republic works, and what its shortcomings can be. The duly elected representatives of the people either didn't hear from the people on the Patriot Act, heard from them and mostly heard "Baaaa, Baaa," or chose to act and see if they were called on it. So far, there is some dissent. The active opposition to GWB and friends playing fast and loose with FISA, and with "signing statements," have garnered political opposition. This battle is not over. Keep writing to your friends, and Senators, and Congressmen, and keep the pressure on. That is what you can do. The Navy lawyer who led the charge on challenging the Gitmo method had what motive, I ask you? Rule of law?
And so much of what I was posted was just ignored. No one wants to believe it. I don't either, but that doesn't change the facts what certain people can do with their power.
Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power tends to corrupt absolutely. As to what you wrote, and credibility, it is poorly structured, filled with emotion, and unfocused.

If you stick to the topic of this thread, instead of ranging all over the map with your scattergun prose, you'll find some decent discussion here.

DR

[Drysdale]

A thought just occured to me.
Is this Johndoexx?

Only now instead of just a pilot he's being chased by the govt?

[Sir Knight]

[quote=gumboot;1863205]Please correct me if I am wrong...

Your claim is the US government orchestrated 9/11 so they could justify a war (invading Afghanistan) which allowed them to restrict civil liberties and spend more money on defence research...yes?

NO NOT AT ALL, SPENDING MONEY ON MILITARY BUILDING A BIGGER BETTER MILITARY LIKE WAS REFERRED TO IN THE MOVIE

Then they invaded Iraq so they could gain lots of oil.

Okay, now what? Why do they want lots of oil and restricted civil liberties? What is their super objective?

GAIN CONTROL, AND THEY WILL WANT EVEN MORE CONTROL. AND I AM CONCERNED MORE AT WHAT THEY HAVE DONE SO FAR THAN WHAT THEY WILL DO, CAUSE SOONER OR LATER IT WON'T MATTER.

You said (my bolding):
What if there was NO real terrorism to go to war over, what if it hadn't changed from what it was before 9/11?

YOU TOOK OUT ONLY ONE PART OF WHAT I SAID, THE IMPORTANT PART "TO GO TO WAR OVER" IT WASN'T ALL THAT BAD FOR US, WE NEEDED SOMETHING WORSE TO HAPPEN TO GIVE REAL CAUSE TO GO TO WAR. AMD THE SECOND SENTENCE REFERS TO TERRORISM BEFORE 9/11.

SO WHY ASK ME IF I DONT THINK THERE IS ANY TERRORISM?

Many people would argue that the US (and the rest of the world) did not treat terrorism seriously enough Pre 9/11. Some people would argue the west STILL doesn't treat the threat seriously.

If this is all true, 9/11 is rather irrelevant, isn't it?

NO NOT AT ALL, BECAUSE THE POWERS THAT BE HAD TO SHOCK THE PEOPLE INTO FEARING THINGS GREATLY FOR THEM TO GRAB POWER WITHOUT TOO MANY OBJECTIONS. IT IS LIKE "MARTIAL LAW", THERE MUST BE CONDITIONS THE WARRANT IT. THERE WEREN'T SO THEY WERE MADE UP JUST LIKE IT WAS STATED IN THE ONE REPORT I REFERRED TO IN THE MOVIE, WHICH EVERYONE KEEPS IGNORING LIKE I DIDN'T SAY IT OR REFER TO IT. IT IS ABOUT THE MOVIE.

I didn't respond to the PNAC point because it is not, IMHO worth bothering to respond to. There are others here who will no doubt give a far more extensive rebuttal than I could anyway.

I did, however, respond to your Operaiton Northwoods reference.

However these were only brought up as supporting evidence in your non-Loose Change orientated discussion. I am only interested in discussing Loose Change in this thread. If you wish to discuss violation of civil liberties or other political issues there are plenty of people in the politics forum who will eagerly contribute.

No, it would make it look like you didn't discuss the film. Which you didn't. I will repeat, do you intend to discuss Loose Change? Not refer to, not allude to, not reference. Discuss. That means the subject of your post is Loose Change itself.

OK, BASED ON WHAT YOU SAID I AM LIMITED TO SAYING WHAT I THINK OR FEEL ABOUT THE MOVIE. I CAN'T DISCUSS RELATED THINGS THAT ARE ATTACHED TO THE MOVIE IN AN INDIRECT MANNER OR A TANGENT?
NOTHING THAT WOULD SUPPORT THE PREMISE OF THE MOVIE, OR SUPPORT THE MOTIVES MENTIONED IN THE MOVIE ETC?

IT APPEARS ALL YOU LET ME SAY IS THAT I EITHER AGREE OR DISAGREE WITH THE MOVIE. WELL IT ISN'T THAT SIMPLE AS THERE ARE PARTS I CAN DEFINITELY AGREE WITH AND SOME PARTS I DONT' HAVE TO AGREE WITH OR WON'T FOR WHAT EVER REASONS.

FOR WHAT I CAN DETERMINE THE MOVIE WHICH I HAVE SEEN IT SEVERAL TIMES NOW, DISCUSSES ALL KINDS OF THINGS AND SHOWS VIDEOS OF THINGS, DOCUMENTS ETC. SO IN REFERRING TO THOSE DOCUMENTS AND THEN RELATING THEM TO CURRENT EVENTS I AM NOT DISCUSSING THE MOVIE?

AND YOU KNOW I HAVE MY FIRST POST WHICH SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSED AND QUOTED SOMEONE THAT HAD POSTED A PICTURE ABOUT THE PENTAGON ALONG WITH A STATEMENT REFERRING TO THE MOVIE LOOSE CHANGE, AND NO ONE HAS EVEN BOTHERED TO RESPOND TO THAT IN SPECIFIC, JUST THAT SOMEONE ELSE HAD REBUTTED IT SOMEWHERE ELSE WITH NO REFERENCE LINK OR ANYTHING ELSE.

BUT I HAVE SEEN TONS OF THINGS POSTED ON HERE THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH LOOSE CHANGE BUT NO ONE IS JUMPING ON THEIR ASS ABOUT IT. HEY CHECK OUT THE POSTS SEE FOR YOURSELF, BUT NO ONE HAS JUMPED ON THEM ONCE FOR POSTING SOMETHING THAT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH LOOSE CHANGE.

SO I GUESS I AM JUST THE LUCKY ONE........

AND TO SUM UP EVERYTHING YOU SAID I WILL USE A REAL QUOTE FROM YOU:

"No, it would make it look like you didn't discuss the film. Which you didn't"

WELL YOU OBIVOUSLY HAVE NOT READ MY FIRST POST OR SEVERAL OF OTHERS I HAVE POSTED. BECAUSE WHAT YOU HAVE SAID ABOVEE IS A TOTAL LIE. YOU ARE NOT REFERRING TO ONE POST BUT HAVE SAID IT LIKE IT WAS AN ABSOLUTE FACT. I HAVE TALKED SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THE MOVIE, PICTURES/SCENES AND VARIOUS PARTS OF IT. FOR THAT QUOTE FROM YOU IS NOTHING MORE THAN YOU STATING A BLANTANT LIE.

YOU ARE JUST TRYING TO USE SMOKE AND MIRRORS TO MAKE ME LOOK LIKE SOMETIHNG I AM NOT. YOU HAVE NO INTEREST IN THE IMPORTANCE OF THE MOVIE OR IF THERE IS ANY TRUTH TO IT AT ALL.

AND ONE FINAL NOTE WHERE YOU SAY WHEN REFERRING TO MY STATEMENT THE THE GOVERNMENT DOESN'T NECESSARILY LISTEN TO THE LAWS AND I QUOTE:

If this is all true, 9/11 is rather irrelevant, isn't it?

THAT SOUNDS LIKE IT IS COMING FROM THE GOVERNMENT ITSELF.
BECAUSE, IF 9/11 GIVES THEM AN EXCUSE WHICH A LOT OF PEOPLE WILL ACCEPT IT IS NOT IRREVELANT. AND I THINK THAT CONCLUSION IS THE MOST STUPID THING I HAVE SEEN ON THIS SITE YET.

EVERYTHING I HAVE SAID HAS TO DO WITH 9/11 ONE WAY OR ANOTHER AND THE MOVIE LOOSE CHANGE TIES IN WITH IN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER.

THE GOVERNMENT HAS ALWAYS USED COVER STORIES, ALWAYS LIED TO COVER UP THE TRUTH, BUT MAYBE IT WASN'T THE TWIN TOWERS THAT WENT DOWN BUT MAYBE IT WAS A WEATHER BALLON. IT REALLY IS AMAZING THAT THE GOVERNMENT CAN TELL US ONE THING ONE DAY, AND WE BELIEVE IT, AND THEN THEY WILL TELL US SOMETHING DIFFERENT THE NEXT DAY AND WE WILL BELIEVE IT, EVEN WHEN THE LATTER DIRECTLY CONTRADICTS THE FIRST THING THEY SAY. JUST LIKE IN THE MOVIE WHERE THE ONE GOVERNMENT GUY STATES "THE MISSLE HIT THE BUILDING".

I SURE WISH SOMETIMES I COULD GO LIVE IN A BUBBLE LIKE A LOT OF YOU OUT THERE.

[ghost707]

Damn that President Bush for lowering my taxes and trying to stop terrorism!

[Sir Knight]

Thanks but if you check my posts most of them have been defending attacks on me with little focus on anything important that I have said. you are most probably the first that has said anything intelletually in a decent detailed manner. I have wanted to stay on point but if you have lived my life for the past couple of years you would find it hard to not be emotional about some of this stuff. I have not lied about one thing on here, avoided things for good reason, but too much smoke and mirrors for the most part played out by others. I really appreciate what you have said in DETAIL as that was exactly what I was referring to. But as far as the red ink, well everyone of the oil companies registered monster profits, I didn't see any company loosing money for any reason. All I saw in the news and on the internet was PROFITS in the BILLIONS. Oh, maybe they didn't make as much as they could, boo hoo. I am not worried about that one bit.

But again thanks sincerely.......

Sir Knight

[Sir Knight]

Damn that President Bush for lowering my taxes and trying to stop terrorism!

Taxes are taxes and I don't see taxes going down. Check out how much you are paying on a gallon of gasoline.

It is a magic act, looky looky over here while he does something over there where you are NOT looking.

Nothing is going down but the money in our wallets.

Oil and the price of it affects the price of everything we buy just about.

The sound of the POP! is the sound of your LOWER TAXES BUBBLE bursting.

Sir Michael

[ghost707]

Taxes are taxes and I don't see taxes going down. Check out how much you are paying on a gallon of gasoline.

It is a magic act, looky looky over here while he does something over there where you are NOT looking.

Nothing is going down but the money in our wallets.

Oil and the price of it affects the price of everything we buy just about.

The sound of the POP! is the sound of your LOWER TAXES BUBBLE bursting.

Sir Michael

Sir Knight,
You may want to try reading your own posts - your "logic" is self-defeating.

[gumboot]

NO NOT AT ALL, SPENDING MONEY ON MILITARY BUILDING A BIGGER BETTER MILITARY LIKE WAS REFERRED TO IN THE MOVIE


PNAC was referred to in Loose Change. PNAC calls for an increase in spending of defense research. It states that such a change in funding is unlikely unless some significant event occurs like a new Pearl Harbor.



YOU TOOK OUT ONLY ONE PART OF WHAT I SAID, THE IMPORTANT PART "TO GO TO WAR OVER" IT WASN'T ALL THAT BAD FOR US, WE NEEDED SOMETHING WORSE TO HAPPEN TO GIVE REAL CAUSE TO GO TO WAR. AMD THE SECOND SENTENCE REFERS TO TERRORISM BEFORE 9/11.

SO WHY ASK ME IF I DONT THINK THERE IS ANY TERRORISM?


Okay, I'm going to assume you do think terrorism exists. Now please answer my first question. Do you think Radical Islamic Terrorism is an enemy of western civilisation?




NO NOT AT ALL, BECAUSE THE POWERS THAT BE HAD TO SHOCK THE PEOPLE INTO FEARING THINGS GREATLY FOR THEM TO GRAB POWER WITHOUT TOO MANY OBJECTIONS.


Without too many objections? You yourself said they got told by US courts that what they were doing was ILLEGAL! You can't get a much stronger objection than that!



IT IS LIKE "MARTIAL LAW", THERE MUST BE CONDITIONS THE WARRANT IT.


You said yourself that the US courts determined that their actions were NOT acceptable, and that they just do it anyway because they don't care! If they don't care about abiding by the LAWS of the United States why do they need to stage an elaborate event to "justify" their actions? Given that the elaborate event has been shown to NOT justify their actions.



OK, BASED ON WHAT YOU SAID I AM LIMITED TO SAYING WHAT I THINK OR FEEL ABOUT THE MOVIE.


Nonsense. I am simply not interested in hearing your political rant. I'm quite frankly sick to death of American politics, which is why I keep out of the politics subforum on this website most of the time.




AND YOU KNOW I HAVE MY FIRST POST WHICH SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSED AND QUOTED SOMEONE THAT HAD POSTED A PICTURE ABOUT THE PENTAGON ALONG WITH A STATEMENT REFERRING TO THE MOVIE LOOSE CHANGE, AND NO ONE HAS EVEN BOTHERED TO RESPOND TO THAT IN SPECIFIC, JUST THAT SOMEONE ELSE HAD REBUTTED IT SOMEWHERE ELSE WITH NO REFERENCE LINK OR ANYTHING ELSE.


No one has responded to your very few direct references to Loose Change for several reasons:

1) From the outset you displayed an irrational and highly antagonistic stance towards anyone who does not accept the so-called facts of Loose Change.

2) If the others are like me, they can't be bothered digging your Loose Change references out of the dreary mountain of paranoid political schlock that amounts to the vast majority of your posts.

What many of us HAVE done, REPEATEDLY, is asked you to identify specific parts of the documentary which you wish to discuss. You have failed to do this over and over again.



WELL YOU OBIVOUSLY HAVE NOT READ MY FIRST POST OR SEVERAL OF OTHERS I HAVE POSTED. BECAUSE WHAT YOU HAVE SAID ABOVEE IS A TOTAL LIE. YOU ARE NOT REFERRING TO ONE POST BUT HAVE SAID IT LIKE IT WAS AN ABSOLUTE FACT.


How do you know what I am "referring" to? Do you claim to be psychic? Because that will go down like a lead balloon here.



YOU HAVE NO INTEREST IN THE IMPORTANCE OF THE MOVIE OR IF THERE IS ANY TRUTH TO IT AT ALL.

I am already fairly confident that the movie is entirely unimportant and has no truth in it whatsoever. If you wish to provide some evidence otherwise, I will be glad to discuss it with you. But please be aware myself and others here are pretty familiar with all aspects of the film.



THAT SOUNDS LIKE IT IS COMING FROM THE GOVERNMENT ITSELF.
BECAUSE, IF 9/11 GIVES THEM AN EXCUSE WHICH A LOT OF PEOPLE WILL ACCEPT IT IS NOT IRREVELANT.


Are you saying Americans will accept their government doing something which their courts have determined is illegal?




IT REALLY IS AMAZING THAT THE GOVERNMENT CAN TELL US ONE THING ONE DAY, AND WE BELIEVE IT, AND THEN THEY WILL TELL US SOMETHING DIFFERENT THE NEXT DAY AND WE WILL BELIEVE IT, EVEN WHEN THE LATTER DIRECTLY CONTRADICTS THE FIRST THING THEY SAY.

Well, if you want to do that, fine. But I don't take what my own governments says at face value, so I certainly don't plan on taking what the government of a foreign country says at face value.

Those that blindly choose not to believe everything their government tells them are as bad as those that blindly believe everything their government tells them.

-Andrew

[Belz...]

Duh, money, power and control = OIL.

That just sounds like a very simplistic explanation, considering how bad things are in Iraq now, and how high gas prices have gotten, for everyone INCLUDING Americans.

The point was there was NO WMD, and they had to finally admit it, so what the ADMIN/GOV tells you is NOT always the truth, mostly FAR FROM IT.

Not to defend the Bush administration but did you ever consider that they could simply have been wrong ?

Also, beign lied to by politicians is pretty much tautological.

Why can't you stay on point? So many agendas so little time. So many topics but so little minds.

I simply asked a question. Calm the hell down. I don't need to adress all your points. This IS a free country, isn't it ?

Well considering our Government's war's in the middle east has boosted oil prices from $30 a barrel to now $70 I guess they got the help with low prices huh?

Post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy ?

I have the answers and facts, problem is you guys don't know what to do with them or even like them.

I must've missed them.

[Belz...]

Quoting someone isn't funny when it isn't true, it gives out FALSE information. And I didn't see anything funny or comedic in what you said.
You could have said it in many ways that would possibly be an attempt to conform to what you are saying now, but there was no JOKING or JK put at the end. It was a QUOTE and UNQUOTE plain and simple.

And I do read sarcasm, that wasn't the problem, and exaggeration is another word for LIE. And again if are you a comedian, don't they have a board for that? But don't give up your day job.

Sheesh. I'm the one obsessed with honesty and even I don't mind exaggeration for comic effect. Get a life.

[Mancman]

The wheels on the bus go round and round.....

[T.A.M.]

OMG, go away for 14 hours, and there are 3.5 pagesof post....damn thats a lot of reading...

Sir Knight:

If you are asserting, which I think you are, that the US govt are the ones who put together and carried out 9/11, a complex and multilocationed event, and that they were powerful enough to keep anything significant about their role in it from leaking, than don't you find it, as we do, completely insane, that they could not then do something as simple as planting a few weapons of mass destruction in the large country of Iraq, to affirm in the eyes of the american people, the justification for the war?

Seriously. Since the war began, and no WMDs were found, Bush has fallen lower than any president in terms of approval. His entire admin is under the gun for it, and they may lose the next election as a result.

Yet, with all that, even now, NO WMD have turned up...compared to the skill, preparation, and deceit required for them to carry out 9/11, don't you think to plant a few of these things wouldn't be that hard????

[realitybites]

Avery, on his trip to Washington
i'll put it to you guys this way.

we're settling the pentagon issue once and for all.

I'm reminded of that line from Aliens, where Hudson reacted to Gorman's statement that he's coming in:
He's 'coming in'.... I feel safer already.
Of course, Vasquez's follow up is probably even more apropos:
Pende*o j***off.

ETA: Just realized that my Spanish sucks and I really have no idea what "pendejo" means, so I apologize if I've inadvertantly breached Rule 8.

ETA Part II: My English is pretty solid though, and upon review I'm fairly certain that the second word of that phrase was a violation. Edited.

[twinstead]

pende*o is a relatively mild curse word, akin to english a@@hole, but probably still a violation. ;)

[Class]

A thought just occured to me.
Is this Johndoexx?

Only now instead of just a pilot he's being chased by the govt?

I personally think it's Alex Jones.

[SRW]

Sir Night,

I have one question, how much do you pay the guy to follow you around banging coconuts so they sound like horses hooves?

I always wondered if that was a good gig or not.

[gumboot]

I personally think it's Alex Jones.

And he hasn't even commented on the thread I created in his honour...:(

How rude...:mad:

-Andrew

[Pardalis]

Sir Knight is a sweetheart compared to Alex Jones.

[Joytown]

Sir Knight -

Let me posit this theory for you to ponder: The Bush Administration came into office with Saddam/Iraq squarely in its sights - perhaps for the reasons you've put forth, perhaps not. Terrorism and specifically al Quaeda, while certainly a concern, was not high on their agenda. As such 9-11 blindsided them - no conspiracy, no inside job, just good old fashioned Gov'tl FUBAR and misplaced priorities.

However, being the good PR folks they are, Bush then went after the culprits in Afghanistan almost immediately (what choice did he have really?) - however in short order they re-focused the "war on terror" to include their original target all along - Saddam/Iraq (not enough high value targets in Afghanistan - kinda hard to bomb a place back to the stone age that's pretty much already there) - leading us to where we are now: No closer to Bin Laden, token nods to changes to airport security, border security, port security, chemical and nuclear plant security - a 9/11 commission that stopped short of holding anyone responsible for missing the clues leading up to 9/11, 1000's of lives and billions of dollars into Iraq - saddled with torture in Iraqi prisons, Gitmo, the Patriot Act, and illegal wiretapping, etc etc etc.

In other words, is it possible that Bush hijacked 9-11 for his own purposes, giving us the outcome you observe now without having actually caused it to occur?

Does this theory not also fit the facts without a huge conspiracy?

I'm not necessarily saying this is the way it went down, but I'm pointing out that there are many possible alternative explainations that don't involve rediculous claims of mass-murder and controlled demo and no planes and no hijackers and pods and holograms and the rest of it.

-Joytown

[Sword_Of_Truth]

I'm sneaking into Sir Knights house and leaving the following rant pretyped on his screen to see if he'll hit the "submit reply" button.

Hello,

See the real problem here is the word SUSPECTED. No proof has to be found. So if someone accuses you of being a terrorist then you have no civil rights. I met Atta, supposedly the mastermine behind 9/11, does that make me a terrorist. Wow I was in his vicinity for 10 minutes and oh boy I actually talked to him on the phone once and met with him. Had to do with an ad I had selling something. Ok boys, this guy gets no civil rights any more ..poof gone. I'm wearing a pink satin teddy with white lace trim because it makes me feel beautiful and sexy. And you think we are living in a free society? I have no criminal record, never done anything wrong besides a speeding ticket. What happened to innocent till proven guilty? No, now we have guilty by accusation, guilty until proven innocent. It's so hard to find decent slinky lingerie in mens size 44 these days. And if they are wrong just like the President was on the WMD, well you might get an apology but don't hold your breath, and due to the WAR on Terrorism these mistakes are expected to happen and you will NOT be able to sue them over it. Wearing lace trim kinda sucks though becauae your chest hairs get tangled in it and you turn into human velcro when you try to take it off. Oh you live is GONE, things have changed but you CANNOT DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT because we are at WAR. Don't know about you but I think my civil rights are MORE important when we are at war NOT less. What, because we are at war we become a MILITARY STATE? The Supreme Court doesn't agree and neither do I.

Wake up, smell the rotten fish, and it isn't in Denmark this time.

Sir Michael

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Well. Not true actually. Or maybe they just kept the knowldege from us?

The schedual for Friday, August 18, 2006, at 8:30 a.m. (EDT) for the CBC Radio show "The Current" says:
"Conspiracy theories still swirl about the events of September 11th. This morning, The Current looks at what those theories say about U-S politics and culture."

The Current is non-Woo and is usually pretty good. It is not a phone-in show and has researchers who actually try and find the truth (whatever that may be).

The show's website is <ht tp:/ /ww w.cbc. ca/the current/ > (without the spaces, of course).

It is available via the i'net and on Sirius (the satellite radio service -- I don't know about availability on the star).

The promo I heard implied that some of the "Scholars for Truth" would be interviewed.

Gord


If any of you missed it the 911 Conspiracy segment of The Current, it is now available on line at:
<h ttp://w ww.cbc.ca/the current/20 06/200 608/200 60818.ht ml> (without the spaces)
Note that, "Due to various rights issues some segments may be edited for internet use" and this includes the clips from Loose Change that appeared in the show.

To listen click on: Listen to The Current: Part 1 in this page.

The description of the piece is as follows:

Conspiracy Theories

We started this segment with a survivor stumbling through the haze of gypsum dust that used to be one of the World Trade Center towers. Nearly five years after September 11th, 2001, many Americans are still searching for clarity in the chaos of that day.

Not since the assassination of President John F. Kennedy has a story attracted so many different conspiracies about who was really behind the event. And over the years, 9/11 theories have become internet staples, inspiring groups such as the Scholars for 9/11 Truth---a group of U.S. academics who are trying to address questions they say were unanswered by the 9/11 Commission Report. We aired a part of their debate over whether the World Trade Center was brought down by a controlled demolition planted by the U.S. government.

A recent poll found that over a third of Americans believe that the U.S. government either sat back or assisted in the 9/11 attacks. Its reason: to spark a war in the Middle East. Here to help us put these new theories into a larger historical context, we're joined by Mark Fenster. He's written about conspiracy culture in the U.S., and he's a law professor at the University of Florida. He joined us from Gainsville, Florida.

Mark Fenster is the author of the book Conspiracy Theories: Secrecy and Power in American Culture.


The show is really about conspiracy theories per se but uses the 911 CT as the prime example. It is worth listening to for that reason (IMHO). Fenster says of the 911 truth scholars, " I don't happen to find them creditable" because they are not the right sort of experts. He explains how CTs are difficult to argue with because they switch topics. He uses the sulfur issue as an example.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

http://www.cbc.ca/thecurrent/2006/200608/20060818.html

URL Decoded by AAron in Edmonton. :)

[tsig]

Welcome Sir Knight,

Wow, I should have joined this board sooner. Everyweek it is another new fun character added.

The names change, but the actions never do.

Claim secret knowledge

Refuse to provde proof of claims

demand claims be accepted on face value

gets mad when we do not agree

displays persecution complex

Still there's just enough variation to keep me looking. Some of the best fition is being written by the CT's.

[tsig]

Well not like you think. Anyway, I know the bible quite well also, and it states, "neither cast your pearls before swine lest they trample them under their feet and turn again and rend you." so you might say I am testing the waters, making sure I separate the men from the swine, you figure out who is who. LOL

I am wise and not stupid, knowledgeable and not ignorant but if you would put yourself in my position for even one minute and ask yourself what would you do if what I was inferring was correct. What exactly would ou do? Think about that REALLY think about that. I do every day.

I just put myself in your position and I suddenly see the brillance of your plan.

You are "hiding in plain sight". A high tech version of "The Purloined Letter".

My hat and the top of my head are off to you.

[Brainster]

http://www.cbc.ca/thecurrent/2006/200608/20060818.html

URL Decoded by AAron in Edmonton. :)

Good stuff, although he seemed a little squishy on LIHOP.

[Sir Knight]

The names change, but the actions never do.

Claim secret knowledge

Refuse to provde proof of claims

demand claims be accepted on face value

gets mad when we do not agree

displays persecution complex

Still there's just enough variation to keep me looking. Some of the best fition is being written by the CT's.

I guess you must be the board psyco something.

You have judged me as a liar and made more statements that are not true.
I never demanded that anyone believe me on face value, show me where I said that? And I have not gotten mad when people disagree, not true, I have gotten upset when people create lies about me, quote me when I didn't say something or just generally accuse me of doing something that I didn't. Again I say READ MY POSTS. What you have said is a long list of lies. And if you are not a doctor who makes you an expert on what I am displaying?

And I NEVER said I wasn't prepared to share people the FACTS, just that I will be careful with whom I share them. You my dear latecomer will not be one of them I can assure you, but hold your breath just the same.

Geesh! you are the fiction. And I think I had a post somewhere where I put up a challenge.....no one seems to be taking me up on it.

Bye...

[Sir Knight]

I just put myself in your position and I suddenly see the brillance of your plan.

You are "hiding in plain sight". A high tech version of "The Purloined Letter".

My hat and the top of my head are off to you.

Being on here has nothing to do with my hiding.

Geesh, this does not show where I am or anything what so ever.

No even who I am.

Although you may think you know, you know nothing.

Still I have found real people here, surprised me actually. But once you cut through the BS there are some real people here, good thing there are private message cababilities on there. don't have to post things for all to see, just those that I find to be real.

And again you have shown just to be a real nothing.

[Sir Knight]

A recent poll found that over a third of Americans believe that the U.S. government either sat back or assisted in the 9/11 attacks. Its reason: to spark a war in the Middle East. Here to help us put these new theories into a larger historical context, we're joined by Mark Fenster. He's written about conspiracy culture in the U.S., and he's a law professor at the University of Florida. He joined us from Gainsville, Florida.

Wow, now I am included in 1/3 of the people in the U.S. Well thanks for that post, at least I may be labled crazy but I am not the only one. LOL

[T.A.M.]

Sir Knight;

Unfortunately, things here went to hell when you became so defensive. Likely because you didnt realize you had walked into a SKEPTICS forum.

That being said, your continued negative rhetoric is not helping, but by now me thinks you is beyond caring of it.

With respect to that poll, the break down actually ended up with only about 6% believing strongly that the US govt had a direct hand in planning 9/11. the rest of that magic 1/3rd was made up of people who (a) though maybe they had a role in planning, (b) believed strongly they allowed it to happen but didnt actively cause it, and (c) thought maybe they let it happen.

But still, atleast 6% of the population is in your boat which is about 15 Million People in the US...if you feel you can extrapolate what the entire country thinks from that single poll (which I believe had a sample size of about 1000).

[Sir Knight]

Sir Knight -

Let me posit this theory for you to ponder: The Bush Administration came into office with Saddam/Iraq squarely in its sights - perhaps for the reasons you've put forth, perhaps not. Terrorism and specifically al Quaeda, while certainly a concern, was not high on their agenda. As such 9-11 blindsided them - no conspiracy, no inside job, just good old fashioned Gov'tl FUBAR and misplaced priorities.

However, being the good PR folks they are, Bush then went after the culprits in Afghanistan almost immediately (what choice did he have really?) - however in short order they re-focused the "war on terror" to include their original target all along - Saddam/Iraq (not enough high value targets in Afghanistan - kinda hard to bomb a place back to the stone age that's pretty much already there) - leading us to where we are now: No closer to Bin Laden, token nods to changes to airport security, border security, port security, chemical and nuclear plant security - a 9/11 commission that stopped short of holding anyone responsible for missing the clues leading up to 9/11, 1000's of lives and billions of dollars into Iraq - saddled with torture in Iraqi prisons, Gitmo, the Patriot Act, and illegal wiretapping, etc etc etc.

In other words, is it possible that Bush hijacked 9-11 for his own purposes, giving us the outcome you observe now without having actually caused it to occur?

Does this theory not also fit the facts without a huge conspiracy?

I'm not necessarily saying this is the way it went down, but I'm pointing out that there are many possible alternative explainations that don't involve rediculous claims of mass-murder and controlled demo and no planes and no hijackers and pods and holograms and the rest of it.

-Joytown

Not that I haven't looked at that possibility but truly that wasn't what happened. there are many individual pieces of simple facts that don't play into that. Huge conspiracy? Unfortunately those in the military do what they say for the reasons they are told. And a lot of people won't tell the truth because of FEAR. It works on the majority of people. I have received private notes that have to do with that on here, and I understand how fear controls the masses.

Show me where I can go and view the plane plowing into the Pentagon? All I have found is a few seconds of film which should have shown the whole plane plowing into it but it didn't, only flash and flame.

And where are all the bodies? Even at 9/11 the towers, that was what was asked in the recent movie that was released which was also referenced in the Loose Change movie. WHERE ARE ALL THE BODIES?
Vaporized? I don't think so and there is so much more. You see if ONE thing of the government story doesn't pan out then I can't believe anything they say. No then, take in what I personally know outside of the public news and the conversation I had with someone this afternoon and I just can't buy it for a dime.

It was an inside job. But that isn't the only thing on the plate.

Sir Knight

[delphi_ote]

I never demanded that anyone believe me on face value, show me where I said that?
Then show us proof.
And I NEVER said I wasn't prepared to share people the FACTS, just that I will be careful with whom I share them. You my dear latecomer will not be one of them I can assure you, but hold your breath just the same.
Then show us proof.
And I think I had a post somewhere where I put up a challenge.....no one seems to be taking me up on it.
Challenges are not proof. Show us proof.

[Eos of the Eons]

Sorry if this was posted elsewhere, but I love it:

http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=911_morons

if his documentary is true, and we've established that the government has no ethical qualms about killing thousands of its own people, then why wouldn't the government kill Avery and his friends as well? What's a few more lives to them to ensure the success of this conspiracy? ]

A bunch of idiots created the conspiracy, and I can't believe it's being discussed so much. I'm disgusted it is even talked about. Well, I'm more disgusted with the vaccine conspiracy theories, but to suggest 9/11 is anything but what it was?? Oy.


There is no conspiracy. Eat my (#$&, losers.

Heh. The guy doesn't hold back. Love it.

[Dog Town]

Show me where I can go and view the plane plowing into the Pentagon? All I have found is a few seconds of film which should have shown the whole plane plowing into it but it didn't, only flash and flame.


You know most investigations are solved w/out video! Right? Do you not like the hundreds of eyewit? Detectives use that most!

BTW 150 yards to 9,1st Q, Cowboys 10 New Orleans O!

[Sir Knight]

Sir Knight;

Unfortunately, things here went to hell when you became so defensive. Likely because you didnt realize you had walked into a SKEPTICS forum.

That being said, your continued negative rhetoric is not helping, but by now me thinks you is beyond caring of it.

With respect to that poll, the break down actually ended up with only about 6% believing strongly that the US govt had a direct hand in planning 9/11. the rest of that magic 1/3rd was made up of people who (a) though maybe they had a role in planning, (b) believed strongly they allowed it to happen but didnt actively cause it, and (c) thought maybe they let it happen.

But still, atleast 6% of the population is in your boat which is about 15 Million People in the US...if you feel you can extrapolate what the entire country thinks from that single poll (which I believe had a sample size of about 1000).

LOL, all I said was I wasn't alone, didn't care about the figures. Geesh.

Listen, I posted this and will say it again. I don't mind skeptics, it is mindless skeptics I have a problem with.

Listen after the conversation I had today with someone, and it was all afternoon, there is nothing anyone can say on here or anywhere that will change my mind about anything. Of course it wasn't going to happen before either since I do know what I know.

But I digress, I was just THANKING you for showing I was not the only one. Plain and simple or so I thought. And the validity of my compaint about people here not paying attention to what I say correct is more than valid. What I find here is that more people do exactly what they accuse others of doing, making themselves hypocrites.

But I am letting this go, and to a certain extent you are correct, I am beyond all of this and I am comfortable with myself and what I know. And I will find what I am looking for inspite of what I have found to be detrimental for the most part. Maybe I will prove something to someone on here that has been here for a while (so you won't say it was a conspiracy) with the understanding they will confirm I am not a liar but not necessarily divulge all to you in detail. Wouldn't that be a pisser? LOL You guys would just die wanting to know.
But you make your bed and you must LIE in it. LOL

[Sir Knight]

[quote=Dog Town;1864608]You know most investigations are solved w/out video! Right? Do you not like the hundreds of eyewit? Detectives use that most!

Well why show 5 frames of a film when it was running BEFORE those 5 frames? That doesn't make sense, and what is the mystery, according to you guys the film would show the PLANE, well SHOW ME THE PLANE! LOL

[defaultdotxbe]

All I have found is a few seconds of film which should have shown the whole plane plowing into it but it didn't, only flash and flame.

on what do you base this claim? i assume this means you know the framerate of the camera vs how long the plane was in frame? the resolution of the camera? at what point it was focuses? if it was auto-focus of fixed-focus? without this information you cant say if it "should have" shown the plane or not

WHERE ARE ALL THE BODIES?
Vaporized? I don't think so and there is so much more.
imagine jumping out of plane 30,000 feet in the air with no parachute, how much do you think will be left of you when you hit the ground?

the terminal velocity of a human body is about 120 mph, so thats how fast you would be going when you hit the ground after jumping out of an airplane with no parachute

the planes hit their targets (or the ground in the case of 93) going roughly 4 times that speed, how much do you think "should" have been left of them?

[Dog Town]

LOL, all I said was I wasn't alone, didn't care about the figures.

You might wanna go with UFO cover up, the numbers were three times better.
Besides more than 40mil think the earth is 10,000 years old! Go figger! One word Dinosaur!
DT

[Sir Knight]

LOL, I am not stupid enough to show it to everyone. I have said that but you don't pay attention it seems. I will not share it with someone just because they DEMAND.

And I sure would not show it to you cause you can't read it appears.

[Dog Town]

I will not share it with someone just because they DEMAND.

We all have a price. What's yours, and what are you share'en?

[Matthew Best]

Well why show 5 frames of a film when it was running BEFORE those 5 frames?

What do you think you would see in the frames before those 5?

[Sir Knight]

You might wanna go with UFO cover up, the numbers were three times better.
Besides more than 40mil think the earth is 10,000 years old! Go figger! One word Dinosaur!
DT

See how this goes, we are off topic except I am the target. I am not looking for a BIG NUMBER, don't need it, even if I was the ONLY one that knew or suspected etc. it wouldn't matter. I guess you are trying to make up for doing me a nice thing? The only thing that makes sense now.

Throwing up more smoke and mirrors to get off what you all say we should be talking about. I respond to this garbage just to show what is going on.

[Dog Town]

Throwing up more smoke and mirrors to get off what you all say we should be talking about. I respond to this garbage just to show what is going on.
OK..... what are we share'en?
Topic OK?

[Matthew Best]

imagine jumping out of plane 30,000 feet in the air with no parachute, how much do you think will be left of you when you hit the ground?

You'd be dead, but you'd definitely be recognisable. I've seen someone fall out of the sky without ever opening his parachute at a dropzone in South Africa and he wasn't in such terrible shape - apart from being dead, of course.

[Sir Knight]

What do you think you would see in the frames before those 5?


Well it sure wouldn't be a big a** plane. could be many things but if they SHOWED US WHAT IT WAS maybe we would not be having this dumb discussion don't you think? That is the problem if there was nothing to hide why would they hide it?

Another pointless question and answer session, it was all rhetorical for the most part. You knew both.....such a waste more smoke and mirrors once again. you avoid my question by asking one. Usual plan for the gov etc.

[T.A.M.]

Sir Knight;

It would be more convincing to most of us if you told it to someone in here that most people respect and trust, in terms of validating or refuting your claims, such as gumboot, or Gravy, or many of the others. If they come on here, after you have told them everything, and they have had a chance to verify it, or you have verified it for them, and then they finally come here, and tell us the scenario, without divulging details, and they tell us they believe it...it would go along way.

[Matthew Best]

I really don't understand what you expect the camera to have seen in the seconds or minutes BEFORE the plane arrived on the scene.

[T.A.M.]

um, have you looked at any of the moussaoui trial pictures of "remains" of jumpers. Theses people fell, likely to maximum velocity, then hit pavement/concrete.

small mounds of unrecognizable, bloody flesh was all that was left. And this was only 25% the speed that the plane was going, and it was not reinforced concrete...

Those pics are a somewhat better idea of what would be left...

[Dog Town]

Well it sure wouldn't be a big a** plane. could be many things but if they SHOWED US WHAT IT WAS maybe we would not be having this dumb discussion don't you think? That is the problem if there was nothing to hide why would they hide it?
Why don't you call, or go to the Sheraton Hotel and ask them. They watched it more than once. The other tapes showed little to nothing ,I would bet! Only they could show it to you anyway. See Zapruder!

[Sir Knight]

We all have a price. What's yours, and what are you share'en?


First of all I DO NOT HAVE A PRICE, the TRUTH is for FREE, but I have learned to be careful whom I share it with. Learned that the hard way.

But the attitude you show, is shared with most and if you changed the EVERYONE TO MOST you would be correct. But then again I am NOT everyone, I am me and I do NOT have a price.

And also that idea that everyone has a price is what leads people to think they can get away with murder.

And I know of stories where people fell from a long way up and survived it to walk another day. Surviving it is a rarity but not an impossiblity.

TK

[Matthew Best]

um, have you looked at any of the moussaoui trial pictures of "remains" of jumpers.

No. And I don't intend to.

[T.A.M.]

Yes, I think the whole "plane hit the pentagon" issue could be solved once and for all by talking to the hotel employees who watched the "tape" in horror.

Now if they watched a plane hit, they would be horrified. If they watched a missile hit, I think, out of all of them, knowing the whole world had the wrong story, that one of them would have come forward and said..."you are all wrong, it was a missile!!" but no, not one did.

[Dog Town]

And I know of stories where people fell from a long way up and survived it to walk another day. Surviving it is a rarity but not an impossiblity.
Point?

BTW Cowboys score again! 17 to doughnutttt!

[Sir Knight]

Sir Knight;

It would be more convincing to most of us if you told it to someone in here that most people respect and trust, in terms of validating or refuting your claims, such as gumboot, or Gravy, or many of the others. If they come on here, after you have told them everything, and they have had a chance to verify it, or you have verified it for them, and then they finally come here, and tell us the scenario, without divulging details, and they tell us they believe it...it would go along way.


Well that was my original intention actually, but you miss one very important point, it isn't who you trust, it would be who I can trust. It is my life on the line and not yours. When your life is on the line I will let you choose. Fair?

[T.A.M.]

sorry Matthew, but in the field I work in, I have seen worse...trust me.

[T.A.M.]

fair...but if you choose to tell someone, and it is someone who is also not trusted in here, then you cannot expect it to hold much weight. Likewise, if they cannot give us anything more than "I believe him" no details, no back up evidence, than it will not likely carry much weight here.

[Class]

Why don't you call, or go to the Sheraton Hotel and ask them. They watched it more than once. The other tapes showed little to nothing ,I would bet! Only they could show it to you anyway. See Zapruder!

I still don't see how any camera from the Sheraton National Hotel could have picked up the crash at the Pentagon. I've stayed at this hotel and I could see no cameras on the side facing the Pentagon. If they were there, I don't see what they would point them at, besides the small bus parking lot across the street, but that would not capture the Pentagon.

[Dog Town]

And also that idea that everyone has a price is what leads people to think they can get away with murder.

Dramatic aren't we? Thesbian perhaps, work much?/sarcasm.
Have you called the Hotel yet?

[Sir Knight]

Yes, I think the whole "plane hit the pentagon" issue could be solved once and for all by talking to the hotel employees who watched the "tape" in horror.

Now if they watched a plane hit, they would be horrified. If they watched a missile hit, I think, out of all of them, knowing the whole world had the wrong story, that one of them would have come forward and said..."you are all wrong, it was a missile!!" but no, not one did.

I wish it was that simple, but if someone saying he was from the Gov visited you and told you that this had to do with national security and you could not talk to anyone or you would pay, would you talk? And if you did everyone might lable you are a nut case anyway SINCE THEY TOOK THE TAPE so you would have NO PROOF to back up your claims. Think about it, we do not live in the perfect world where the truth remains supreme.
I could be one of those people who saw the tape and you would say well show me the tape and I don't have it. There you go.....

[Matthew Best]

In that case:

imagine jumping out of plane 30,000 feet in the air with no parachute, how much do you think will be left of you when you hit the ground?

It depends what you land on.

[Dog Town]

they caught the fly bye! From what I've read, not crash!

[Class]

Dramatic aren't we? Thesbian perhaps, work much?/sarcasm.
Have you called the Hotel yet?

Thesbian.

My high school principal made that mistake on the loud speaker.:D

[Dog Town]

My high school principal made that mistake on the loud speaker.
Frustrated thesbians are the worst!

[T.A.M.]

Sir Knight:

I agree, that IF they were told not to speak about what they saw to anyone, that there would be pressure not to speak, but (a) I have seen no proof that they were all told this, and (b) Whistleblowers under equal pressure come forward all the time, yet not one has come forward from that group of employees.

[Sir Knight]

fair...but if you choose to tell someone, and it is someone who is also not trusted in here, then you cannot expect it to hold much weight. Likewise, if they cannot give us anything more than "I believe him" no details, no back up evidence, than it will not likely carry much weight here.

Well you missed my point once again. When it comes to my life I will do the choosing and you haven't given me a reason to feel otherwise. I have asked on here if there was anyone who could actually do something to help me or have contacts etc and I get nothing. So if what I say is true what good would me exposing myself to anyone of you do me but take a bigger risk that I already have? And I am not sure that YOU are qualified to tell me who to trust for it would be just your opinion at this point and I would have to take a poll to find out the person who would be the best one. Which would be a joke on here I can assure you of that.

[T.A.M.]

A poll would be a good start, but it is moot, since I assume you have already found someone to talk to on the matter (since you said you found some caring people via PMing them).