Are you isolated with your atheist or agnostic beliefs?

[dingler44]

I'm not asking how many atheists or agnostics you've met or know online... I mean from your day to day, personal life. Friends? Family? Aquaintances? Co-workers? whatever...

I'm very isolated with my beliefs - which is a big reason I ended up finding randi.org and these forums.

How about everyone else?

[dingler44]

One is a good friend but he lives a thousand miles away and we don't keep in touch much. Anyway we've never actually discussed our beliefs with each other.

The other is just an aquaintance who also lives in another city. Where I live and work now, as far as I know, it's just me.

Last week, a guy I have befriended recently wanted to ask me why I didn't believe in God. (he had heard from a common friend that I had "different" views on the matter)

The discussion was a lot of fun... but it reminded me of how alone I always am in defending my beliefs whenever disccusions like this come up - it's especially awkward in larger groups of people.

[hgc]

I live in New York, so no, I'm not isolated. But if I lived anywhere else in America...

[Mercutio]

Surrounded by them (all my family, for instance, and many co-workers). But more importantly, here in New Hampshire, the "live free or die" attitude applies to keeping your nose out of other people's religion or lack therof. So I really don't know how many atheists are around me, because very few people here make a big deal out of any of these labels.

On the other hand, on a job search in the bible belt, I would often get "hi there, I'm Bob, glad to meet you, what's your church?" I actually told one of these guys (giving me a tour of the local community) not to bother pointing out the various churches, cuz I'm an atheist, and he said "we don't say that around here." Hmm...didn't get that job...

[dingler44]

Originally posted by Mercutio
Surrounded by them (all my family, for instance, and many co-workers).

That's really interesting... do you know how far back in history your family's atheist beliefs go?

I haven't actually come clean with my family yet. I've been dropping hints for years but they're not getting it.

I'm trying to be as sensitive as possible about it... as the first time I questioned some of my mother's views, she broke down in tears she was so shocked. I'm utterly petrified of attempting another discussion!

[tamiO]

Just me and my kids and my husband.

I don't have any family besides my kids, but my husband's family is all about new age.

[SRW]

Three that I know of, but as I keep missing the atheist church services I do know know who else attends.

[Number Six]

I feel isolated due to my non-belief. There is one person I know that is a non-believer (that I know of..maybe there are more). It feels good now and then to have someone that will understand what you mean instead of thinking you're crazy or evil if you make a statement that points out the silliness or contradictions of certain beliefs.

I sometimes wonder if there are other people I know that are closet disbelievers. It's like being a spy...you never know who you can trust or who you can take into your confidence. Since becoming a non-believer I better understand The Outspoken Athiest-type person because it seems the options are to stay silent all the time or else speak and annoy people and it doesn't surprise me that some people just refuse to hold it all in their whole lives. There is just no nice and polite way to express your opinion on the matter. No matter what you say believers get mad.

People of non-mainstream religions in the US have it much more easy IMO. Sure, they're looked at as those people with the wacky religious beliefs but that can so easily be bridged with a "We may have different ways of expressing it but let's remember that we all believe in God." That is such a big common denominator and its one that non-believers can't share by definition.

Here's another thing...it seems that some non-believers in conventional religion are believers of other sorts, New Age or whatever. That is, I think some non-believer are simply rebelling against conventional belief but they just replace it with non-conventional belief. I wonder what percentage of non-believers would be considered skeptics. I bet a significant percentage are not.

[Number Six]

Originally posted by dingler44


That's really interesting... do you know how far back in history your family's atheist beliefs go?

I haven't actually come clean with my family yet. I've been dropping hints for years but they're not getting it.

I'm trying to be as sensitive as possible about it... as the first time I questioned some of my mother's views, she broke down in tears she was so shocked. I'm utterly petrified of attempting another discussion!

That is a whole other thread that interests me and I may start a thread on it sometime. That is, "coming out" so to speak. If the options are to greatly upset people that you respect and love or else say nothing and suffer in silence, well, there's really no good option, is there? And I think that the fact that the whole thing is so unpleasant is one of the reasons religion propogates from generation to generation so well.

[dingler44]

Originally posted by Number Six
It feels good now and then to have someone that will understand what you mean instead of thinking you're crazy or evil if you make a statement that points out the silliness or contradictions of certain beliefs.


Yes... it sure can be relieving.


I sometimes wonder if there are other people I know that are closet disbelievers. It's like being a spy...you never know who you can trust or who you can take into your confidence.


I love this point! It's been going on for years but it's only recently that I noticed exactly HOW tuned I am to others. I don't even do it consciously, but I notice things people say... that might reflect their beliefs - spiritual or not.


People of non-mainstream religions in the US have it much more easy IMO.


Are you not in the US? If not, where?

[Number Six]

I'm in the US. I meant to say that people of non-mainstream religions in the US have it better than non-believers in the US when it comes to expressing their opinions on religion. Non-mainstream religious believers are viewed as wacky, but at least they're believers. Non-believer are viewed as worse because they don't even belief. I don't know how it is in other countries.

[Andalyn]

I'm surrounded by religious folk, mostly christians.

My mom and sister, while not religious - believe in all kinds of spiritualism / ufo nonsense. My sister was convinced she had "powers". I've been trying to get her to apply for the JREF million (which I told her if she did in fact win, she would have to cut me in for a slice). For some reason, she seems hesitant to apply...

[Mercutio]

Originally posted by dingler44


That's really interesting... do you know how far back in history your family's atheist beliefs go?


I think I should have been more clear. Like tamiO, I meant my wife and kids are atheists. My 2 brothers are also (one radically, the other just got his kids baptised for a. his wife, and b. a better school system where he lives). My sister is relatively newly religous; I try to be sensitive to her beliefs, but will not defer to them. My parents (religious, but thinkers), when my kids were born, dropped maybe one hint about christening, but I was raised in an anabaptist church (church of the brethren), so baptising is not expected until the individual so chooses. My youngest is 11 now, and we have not had a comment about religion from my parents in probably 10 years. (parethetically, the church that was most influential to me happened to be one that welcomed, even encouraged examination of ones own beliefs. They had the courage of their convictions, and I have been tremendously influenced by some aspects of that church, even if I disagree on the fundamental issues. I would like to raise my kids with many of the values that church instilled in me, but I have no illusions that the fundamental belief system is a necessary part of that.)

I also dont (apostrophe key broken on this computer) hide my atheism at work; I dont go out of my way to proclaim it, but usually it comes up in a discussion at least once per class per semester. Typically, I will then have a handful of students approach me after class to talk religion. Rarely will they try to force me to convert (for those few I have a standard response: I used to be born again, now I am an atheist, and if you argue with me I will guarantee you that you will lose faith before I find it), sometimes they are looking for an excuse to lose their own religion, but usually it appears to be simple curiosity. I may be the first avowed atheist many of them have met, and they may be surprised at what a moral, upstanding and nice fellow I am :D. They also may be checking for cloven hooves, horns and a tail, but I do not get that impression.

[dingler44]

Originally posted by Andalyn

My sister was convinced she had "powers". I've been trying to get her to apply for the JREF million (which I told her if she did in fact win, she would have to cut me in for a slice). For some reason, she seems hesitant to apply...

haha! fantasmic... reminds me of a few others who thought they had the power

Early on in my undergrad days a couple friends of mine who were firm believers in telepathy talked me into doing a little experiment. One of us would look at a card and communicate it to the other who would then state which card the "transmitter" was looking at.

After about 50 consecutive misses even the believers were bored to death. Guess we just didn't have the ability. Or maybe we needed to train more!!

*oops* just went WAY off topic... and to further derail this post...

Andalyn, your avatar has always disturbed me. You don't, by any chance, have plans on changing it do you? :)

[Seismosaurus]

Wow. You guys should move the the UK!

I've only ever really known a handful of strongly religious people - and I consider anybody who goes to church once a week or more strongly religious.

Most folks seem to be "default theists" - they'll say they believe in god if you ask them, maybe go to church on special occasions like Xmas, but that's about it.

Growing up I've always quite enjoyed debating theists. I've rarely been shy to tell them my views, and never once had anybody get angry or upset about it. I even taught a few days in a catholic school and it didn't bother them at all.

The most religious person I knew was my grandmother, who was very Catholic. She knew we were atheists and worried about it, but didn't talk much to us about it. She asked her priest if we were going to hell once, and he told her that as long as her family were good people that's all god would care about.

[Nyarlathotep]

I know lots of atheists. My wife is an atheist and so are our kids. We are part of a local atheist group so I know quite a few.

[Peach Jr.]

Just my Mr., both of my bros-in-law, my sister, and my parents. Nobody outside of my family IRL.

[Azathoth]

My girlfriend and most of her family.
[I remember staying at a distant Aunt's house at Christmas, and they asked if we wanted to go sing at their Church:
My gf: "Well... we're atheists."
Aunt: "That's ok, hun, so are we."
So we went off to the Unitarian Church and sang carols.]

Also a fair number of the members of my local science fiction club/social group are atheist/agnostic.

[HarryKeogh]

it's pretty much just me. but i never feel isolated. when it comes up it usually makes for good friendly debate.

my family is cool with it. i'm even godfather to my cousin's daughter. he knows i'll help raise her with his catholic values even though i dont believe in them. plus it gives me a chance to put my 16 years of catholic education to some use.

[Captain_Snort]

Originally posted by Seismosaurus
Wow. You guys should move the the UK!

I've only ever really known a handful of strongly religious people - and I consider anybody who goes to church once a week or more strongly religious.


I am waiting for the first athiest Archbishop of Cantabury, but Durham comes close.

I agree, I know some people who hold there religion deeply, but in general most people I know are athiests, or honestly could give a flying fig about religion. The amount of closed down churches being convereted into housing or offices is proof of that.

The fact that we have a god bothering PM and the outmoded house of lords still has bishops of the church of england sitting doesn't show the reality.

[bjornart]

Half my friends, half my family, most of my closest family are atheists or agnostics. The ones that aren't (with a few exceptions) are what I'd like to call Norwegian-Christians. I.e. they go to church for christenings, weddings, funerals, or in extreme cases at christmas, easter and constitution day, and answer 'yes' when polled 'do you believe in god?' Other than that they have no religion.
In fact, for a while I thought they were all agnostics, at least, anything else seemed absurd... but subtle hints have lead me to believe I was mistaken.

[Marvel Frozen]

Really the only person I know who is an athiest is my brother. The rest of my familty, as well as pretty much everyone else I know is strongly religious. Nobody really knows my beliefs (or lack thereof) though, I imagine they all assume I'm a Christian.

[BrianT]

In the miserable small town I live in, I feel isolated in believing the world is round.

[Stig]

I've been brought up in an atheist family. My dad jacked in the religion as soon as he left home. He was Plymouth Brethren and I think this is a fairly hardcore bunch of nuts. My mother was a believer in a god but not a church goer. All but a couple of my friends are atheists/agnostic and my close co-workers are disbelievers too. My wife is an atheist and my daugther is only three so she doesn't really take much interest in religion.

Stig

[AmateurScientist]

What a great question.

I have several friends from school who do not believe. It was a comfortable environment and refreshing to be away from all the militant Christians.

I have one social friend in my city who doesn't believe and a guy at work whom I spotted pretty easily due to his attitudes and things he said. He has a new age spiritual bent, however. He tends to believe in mysterious "energy" and "karma" and crap like that. He seems very distrusting of science when it comes to big matters.

I have been disheartened (or encouraged, depending on how you look at it) to learn the in the US, we apparently are the exception in the Western world regarding belief. Just my luck to live in the one Western nation still obsessed with belief in a supernatural creator who tends to all our needs, but demands faithful worship in return.

I have never met an avowed female non-believer in real life. I wish I could.

AS

[Jeff Corey]

In addition to my wife and kids, this also includes my friends around town, at university and the New York Area Skeptics and the Long Island Secular Humanists.
Some of them could be considered more aquaintances than friends, but the total has to be above 40 or so.

[tygirwulf]

I am alone in my atheism here. In fact, I haven't met too many people who are even tolerant of a disbelief in god. I've told my mother, she was quite disappointed and then told me it was just a phase. No, now that I think about, my belief in god was just a phase, when I thought I had to fit in with other people in at least one thing. I've dropped hints to my father, but not my step-mother, she already thinks i'm a bad influence on young children because I don't go to church with them. I've been invited to church a number of times by different people, and I always decline. They don't press further, thankfully.

I don't wish to offend anyone here, but it seems to me telling people close to you that you're atheist, especially in the Bible Belt, is a lot like telling them you're gay, from the coming out stories I've heard/read, and then from my own mother's reaction to my telling her I'm atheist, they seem to be similar reactions. Disappointment, denial, being told it's just a phase, etc. And then you have the open-minded best friend who just shrugs and says, "Really? Cool."

[dingler44]

Originally posted by tygirwulf
[B]I've dropped hints to my father, but not my step-mother, she already thinks i'm a bad influence on young children because I don't go to church with them. I've been invited to church a number of times by different people, and I always decline. They don't press further, thankfully.


I've found myself in an interesting situation. It'd probably be better suited to a new thread... but anyway...

I mentioned in one of my first posts that I'd been dropping hints about my beliefs for several years and the family wasn't picking up on it. But this isn't quite true.

My 14 year old sister has picked up on it a little. Although I must admit I lay it on a little thicker when she's around. She did ask me once if I did not believe in God... and why... and I was caught off guard! Not because I didn't know how to explain my beliefs to her but because my beliefs differ so radically with my folks.

a. I would prefer my parents found out about my beliefs from me (as opposed to my little sister)

b. I love my little sister more than anyone in the world and naturally I would like to offer guidance

c. I feel uncomfortable offering her all the compelling evidence there is... when it can so brutally and swiftly undermine my mother's views

Do I abdicate to my mother?
Do I need come clean with my folks before I can offer my knowledge and beliefs to my little sis?

When my sister DID ask me about my views... I gave her a quick breakdown and emphasized that I just don't know and that I think examining all the possibilities and making your own decision is most important. I told her about the digression of my views from our mother's... and the milestone events that continue to solidify my stand.

I hope she stays curious... and I hope she asks me more. (she's about to turn 15, by the way)

Any thoughts?

[Luciana]

That's one advantage of leaving in a big city. I know lots of atheists. I also know lots of Baptists, Episcopalians, Catholics of all possible denomination, spiritualists, etc. Bottom line: I know tons of people of every possible belief system in the world. Or, better yet, living in a big city allows me to know tons of people, period.

I voted for more than 15. I must point out, though, that one's religion is not the first thing that enters a conversation, and that I might know somebody for years and not to know his religion. Fine by me