Ho Hum, Crop Circles Yet Again.

[shemp]

Circular Sightings Tough to Explain (http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/story?id=2374926&page=1)

Sure, they're tough to explain if you don't bother letting pesky skeptics get in your way.

Aug. 31, 2006 — For centuries they've puzzled people by their curious appearance.

They crop up in fields across the globe, in patterns ranging from the simple circle to the DNA double helix.

Right now in America, it's that time of year again.

That's right, it's crop circle season.

This year they're popping up all over the Midwest, with recent sightings in Geneseo, Ill.; Sandyville, Ohio; and Huntingburg, Ind.

And the list goes on.

"But the real question that comes up is, what exactly are they?" said Stan Friedman, a nuclear physicist and author of the book "Crash at Corona: The Definitive Study of the Roswell Incident."

Well, he's a noo-cu-lar fizzicist! He must know! Who we gonna believe, him or someone who actually makes crop circles?

"There's still a massive amount of people out there who really believe that these things are made by aliens," said John Lundberg, a world-renowned crop circle architect from the United Kingdom.

"The crop circle phenomenon obviously feeds off other cultural mythologies."

Lundberg has been building crop circles for more than a decade in southern England.

Trained in fine art, he says he began building circles as an extension of his artwork.

"When I first went out to start making them, I also sort of thought there might be some extraterrestrial explanation," he said.

Nah, he don't have no degree! They must be made by aliens!

[Loss Leader]

For centuries?

I thought they started in the 1970s.

[Alareth]

I'm getting really tired of people attributing my long range telekinetic art projects to aliens.

It's so disrespectful.

[Loss Leader]

Here is the email I just sent to support@abcnews.go.com:

Madams and Sirs -

Your recent article on crop circles by Bede Moore is one of the most poorly researched examples of journalism I have encountered from your newsroom. The very first sentence, "For centuries they've puzzled people by their curious appearance," is demonstrably untrue. Crop circles first came to public consciousness in the 1970s and those first circles were admitted hoaxes. Subsequently, some poorly educated souls have looked for evidence of crop circles before the 1970s, finding perhaps one woodcut from the 17th century. Whether the woodcut shows an authentic crop circle or not, the fact is that it went unnoticed for over three hundred years, puzzling nobody by its curious appearance. The rest of the article is as poorly researched.

In current journalistic fashion, the article does not take a stance but presents "both sides" of the crop circle argument. I would suggest to your organization that such a stance is morally and intellectually dishonest. There is no "debate" regarding the origin of crop circles. There are those with no evidence whatsoever other than their beliefs and there are those who have proven through experiment and research that crop circles are entirely man-made afairs. To cast this issue as debatable is to lower the standard of discourse in this nation.

Please make greater strides towards accuracy in the future.

[shemp]

I'm getting really tired of people attributing my long range telekinetic art projects to aliens.

It's so disrespectful.

Yes, I think you should contact the author and demand an apology.

[shemp]

Here is the email I just sent to support@abcnews.go.com:

I'm glad you sent that. Unfortunately, I'm also pretty certain it will fall on deaf ears.

[c4ts]

Those people who go out and make crop circles are such fakers. Let's not forget that a giant doily is the only plausible explanation for the ones they didn't make.

[Brainache]

The author says that they "crop up in fields across the globe".

Surely they crop down don't they?

[Loss Leader]

Here is ABC News' long-awaited answer to my email:


Thank you for contacting us.

We appreciate your comments and are considering your opinion. Thanks for writing in.

Thanks for logging on to ABCNews.com.

Regards,

Ashley
ABCNews.com

[Ashles]

Wow, they really went overboard with that response.

[Psi Baba]

I must concur with whichever well-known skeptic (it was either Joe Nickell, Benjamin Radford, or Michael Shermer) who was interviewed in National Geographic's Is It Real? installment on crop circles and said, "I'd like to see a crop circle three counties wide, or a crop circle in a Christmas tree farm. Now that would impress me."

[Aoidoi]

I must concur with whichever well-known skeptic (it was either Joe Nickell, Benjamin Radford, or Michael Shermer) who was interviewed in National Geographic's Is It Real? installment on crop circles and said, "I'd like to see a crop circle three counties wide, or a crop circle in a Christmas tree farm. Now that would impress me."Well, Tunguska was pretty impressive...

[Alareth]

Well no one ever associates crop circles with Tunguska size blasts.

As a matter of fact, one of the "amazing" trails of crop circles is the apparent lack of damage to the plants. A trait Tunguska most definitely does not share.

[c4ts]

I must concur with whichever well-known skeptic (it was either Joe Nickell, Benjamin Radford, or Michael Shermer) who was interviewed in National Geographic's Is It Real? installment on crop circles and said, "I'd like to see a crop circle three counties wide, or a crop circle in a Christmas tree farm. Now that would impress me."

You will have your crop circle three counties wide. All I need is a small army with chainsaws and Robert Smithson. Now all you need to do is bring him back to life as a zombie...

[Axiom_Blade]

Crop circles are like pyramids---to some, they're just too awesome and perfect to be possibly made by human hands. So, instead of rejoicing in the amazing things that their fellow humans can do, crop circlists (?) try to find some deep, magical meaning from the space gods.

I think that skeptics should embrace crop circles as a genuine human art form, perhaps even giving demonstrations of how it's done. (Is somebody already doing this?) The art world is full of woos. This might be a way to demonstrate that rationalism and art aren't mutually exclusive.

Many skeptics (myself included) fall into the trap of negativity. It's easy to say "Ha, ha, what a load of crap!" Why not say, "Ha, ha! What a load of crap! Seriously, you're missing the really cool thing here. These designs were made by humans, and you can make them, too!"

Remember, kids, always get the farmer's permission first!

[Stray Cat]

I think that skeptics should embrace crop circles as a genuine human art form, perhaps even giving demonstrations of how it's done. (Is somebody already doing this?) The art world is full of woos. This might be a way to demonstrate that rationalism and art aren't mutually exclusive.

I believe that Peter Sorenson does Crop Circle making demonstrations to people each year here in the UK. I came across an advert he had on eBay attempting to sell crop circle holidays to gullible... errrr sorry, I mean interested parties which included crop circle making demonstrations in which the suckers.... errr sorry, I mean punters could participate.

This year's Peter Sorenson crop circle however was commissioned by Scott Flansburg, who is in the Guinness book of world records as the fastest human calculator and can be seen here: (http) ://cropcircleconnector.com/Sorensen/2006/magicnumbers2006.html
Sorry, I'm not allowed to post active links yet
It has to be noted that most of the photographs released for this formation are heavily 'photoshopped' as some rows of numbers were not 'stomped' due to a tramlinee running through the centre of the formation.

Although no one does regular demonstrations of crop circle making, the guys at circlemakers.org (including John Lundberg) get involved at least once a year with TV production companies (Nat Geo, BBC etc) to demonstrate their art. These 'demonstrations' are not accepted by those who follow the 'Church of the Blind Faith' and preach from the Gospel according to Glickman however and no amount of evidence will ever sway them from their un-ending belief in the ridiculous.

[The Atheist]

and no amount of evidence will ever sway them from their un-ending belief in the ridiculous.

You paid shemp to start this thread just so you could come in and say that didn't you?? Thought I'd find you in here!

That phrase above sums up the lot of them.

Cheers, well put.

[Stray Cat]

Hey Atheist - I got no money to pay people to start threads. :)

Seriously though, It's not the hard core believers we can do anything about and in reality, because nothing will sway them they are no more than a fly in the soup. But their words, articles and websites promote BS and this influences other people (who may be diverted away if offered true information) to then spread the same BS as fact and before you know it the MYTH has built into religion and the religion is followed by many tree hugging, spiritually enlightened gurus who in turn collect vacant minds and fill the gap they have been longing to fill with the word and the word was 'Crop Circle' ............. well it was two words then.

When I first started looking seriously into crop circles I was told by 'fundamentalist croppies' that:
1. The designs were too complex for humans to make
2. It was impossible to make these designs in the night time hours available during summer
3. No human had ever been seen or caught making crop circles
4. Evidence of human involvement was rarely found
5. Doug and Dave were liars
6. Hoaxers claims did not stand up to close examination

All of which I have subsequently found to be completely false... As you know this is one of my hobbyhorses (or high horses), I would be more than willing to discuss it further. Thanks

[fromdownunder]

OK, for the sake of the discussion, I will assume that Crop Circles were not made by people.

While I realise that this subject has probably been discussed here many times before, from all the shows I have seen on National Geographic, the Science Channel, the Discovery Channel, and even the History Channel, I have yet to find a Crop Circleist (is that a word?) explain why this particular method of communication (if that's the word I'm groping for) is the desired method to "explain" the unknown.

Some (many?) Crop "Circleists" think these "messages" come from aliens. Let's take a look at this briefly, and for this part, I can live with Einstein.

Beta Centauri (the closest star to our mudball) contains habitable planets with advanced life forms. So, these life forms, for whatever reason, are willing to take a nine year round trip to planet earth to....make crop circles? And just head for home, leaving an enigmatic pointless message that will be ignored by 99.99% of people on this planet, and the message will vanish as soon as the farmer crops his..uumm...crop.

I have never ever heard a believer explain exactly what or why crop circles are somehow the message of choice for aliens (or whoever else is actually making them). I have never even heard viable speculation as to why "they" would choose crop circles. I would appreciate being enlightened along these lines.

As the old saying goes, why don't they just land on the Whitehouse lawn?

Norm

[Stray Cat]

OK, for the sake of the discussion, I will assume that Crop Circles were not made by people.

Well that's what the very small 'croppie' community do... they assume they are not made by people. Then they go out and find gaps in our (or more accuratley THEIR) understanding and fill them with pseudo-scientific, metaphysical or conspiracy theory to pad out their hollow beliefs.

As for how they 'rationalise' (ironic use) the Alien Communication thing - You got to understand that these Aliens don't want to communicate with just anyone.... no they only want to speak to those who want to listen and therefore use these complex designs to force us to think (along the same lines as: For god to speak to you, you have to believe in his existance!!!!)

Take all the very valid points one by one and the Church of the Blind Faith will answer them with the same enthusiasm (and same logic) as a preacher would if you were asking questions about his god. It invariably comes back to the unverifiable or leap of faith required and apparently only obtainable by the chosen few :rolleyes:

Why not on the Whithouse Lawn???... Well for starters they keep cutting it so it's too short to flatten.

[SusanB-M1]

There was a book with excellent aerial photos of crop circles which made a good Christmas present a few years ago. As far as I remember, it did NOT promote any non-human designers or makers.

[Stray Cat]

There was a book with excellent aerial photos of crop circles which made a good Christmas present a few years ago. As far as I remember, it did NOT promote any non-human designers or makers.

That would most likely be Steve Alexandra's Crop Circle Yearbook. If it's the one I'm thinking of, it's just a photo album of crop circles and doesn't promote anything except Steve Alexandra's photography.

[exarch]

"The fact that people can fake [crop circles] doesn't mean that there aren't real ones. It's in my gray basket."

I guess there will always be a few circles that can never be confirmed to be made by human hands (because the makers are already dead or something), so the believers will be able to hang on to their belief indefinitely.

[exarch]

This year's Peter Sorenson crop circle however was commissioned by Scott Flansburg, who is in the Guinness book of world records as the fastest human calculator and can be seen here: http://cropcircleconnector.com/Sorensen/2006/magicnumbers2006.html

It has to be noted that most of the photographs released for this formation are heavily 'photoshopped' as some rows of numbers were not 'stomped' due to a tramlinee running through the centre of the formation.

Although no one does regular demonstrations of crop circle making, the guys at circlemakers.org (including John Lundberg) get involved at least once a year with TV production companies (Nat Geo, BBC etc) to demonstrate their art. These 'demonstrations' are not accepted by those who follow the 'Church of the Blind Faith' and preach from the Gospel according to Glickman however and no amount of evidence will ever sway them from their un-ending belief in the ridiculous.

No sh:eek:t !
When Simmie and I were there the day after completing it we encountered a group of Germans who politely challenged us that no one could not have made such a complex crop circle. After much discussion someone who had videoed us working on the numbers from up on Woodborough Hill came forward and showed them his shots. Although filmed from far away, one could plainly see Ripley flattening the numbers. But the German who could speak English best then shook his head in frustration and told me that he was inclined to believe that that the video was computer animation (!).
[Those who know me well will appreciate the irony!!!]

Their ignorance knows no bounds :confused:

[Stray Cat]

Their ignorance knows no bounds :confused:

Hahahaha..... Yes I know what you mean... there has been a full article written by these Germans in regard to Peter Sorenson's crop circle. Claiming that Sorenson didn't make it, couldn't possibly have made it and is a Hoaxer claiming a 'genuine' crop circle.
Of course they can't tell the difference between Peter's and one of 'unknown origin' - because there is no difference.

[Cuddles]

Beta Centauri (the closest star to our mudball)

*cough* Proxima Centauri *cough*