Thanks (and a little about brains and glands)

[GlennB]

Sincere thanks. I'm all better now. Just need to backtrack and check on a couple of people that I might have polluted during this short spell of madness, and get gently in touch with a couple of blokes who polluted me.

Tonight's session of reading here wrapped up all the loose ends, all those nagging doubts that try so hard to drag a person back into the assylum.

At the weekend I read an excellent essay in a UK paper. Don't have it to hand but the gist was :

When you use logic and reason to argue with a person who has strong, irrational beliefs, it isn't your brain versus theirs. It's your brain against a cat's-cradle of glands.

I'm trying to spot the point my glands took over. Glands are powerful chaps, after all. Maybe the brain rallied while I was asleep? Or maybe the glands take more long-term damage from cheap wine than the brain does? Does sex come into it? Dunno :)

Regards

GlennB

[chipmunk stew]

Glad you decided to take the Blue Pill (It was just a placebo, anyway...) :)

Three cheers for intellectual courage!!!

edit: I want to make sure you understand just how impressed I am. I believe that publicly declaring that you were mistaken, and actually going out of your way to THANK people for it, is just about the bravest thing a person can do without risking their life. Make that six cheers!!! And a gold star. And this paperclip I found in my pocket. I'd give you more, but that's all I've got right now.

[Pardalis]

Wow!

Cheers indeed. :)

May I ask what specifically changed your mind?

[KingMerv00]

:drool:

Holy crap! I've been on these boards for about 2 years now and I've never seen anyone actually come about like that. I was starting to get cynical.

Don't get me wrong, it is a good thing...I'm just amazed.

[Pardalis]

I think the proper smiley would be this one:

:shocked:

[Dave1001]

backstory, for those of us voyeurs?

[chipmunk stew]

backstory, for those of us voyeurs?
http://forums.randi.org/search.php?do=finduser&u=11682
:D

[KingMerv00]

Really not a lot to say. He just got ankle-deep exposure to the CT world. To be fair, he was actually very willing to admit mistakes in his posts. Not a huge turnaround (since he wasn't crazy to start with) but still nice to see.

[Dave1001]

Really not a lot to say. He just got ankle-deep exposure to the CT world. To be fair, he was actually very willing to admit mistakes in his posts. Not a huge turnaround (since he wasn't crazy to start with) but still nice to see.

Yeah, I just read through them. Some of the responses to him by the anti-CT'ers was a bit embarassing (heckling him for using red font?) but to be expected by any observer who has been here for more than a day.

[Pardalis]

Yeah, I just read through them. Some of the responses to him by the anti-CT'ers was a bit embarassing (heckling him for using red font?) but to be expected by any observer who has been here for more than a day.

Yeah, that remark wasn't very mature, I apologize. The red font reminded me of the annoying way "truthers" review other people's papers.

[TobiasTheViking]

Sincere thanks. I'm all better now. Just need to backtrack and check on a couple of people that I might have polluted during this short spell of madness, and get gently in touch with a couple of blokes who polluted me.

Tonight's session of reading here wrapped up all the loose ends, all those nagging doubts that try so hard to drag a person back into the assylum.

At the weekend I read an excellent essay in a UK paper. Don't have it to hand but the gist was :

When you use logic and reason to argue with a person who has strong, irrational beliefs, it isn't your brain versus theirs. It's your brain against a cat's-cradle of glands.

I'm trying to spot the point my glands took over. Glands are powerful chaps, after all. Maybe the brain rallied while I was asleep? Or maybe the glands take more long-term damage from cheap wine than the brain does? Does sex come into it? Dunno :)

Regards

GlennB
Thanks for giving us hope that things can get better.. It is very important.

And i'm happy that you feel confident enough to make this message, that says a lot about you and what person you are. And what it says is all positive. :)

[T.A.M.]

Cheers GlennB...welcome back to the land of the sane, we missed you while you were gone.

In all seriousness though, looking back at his posts, I would say he was more of a fencesitter who was leaning toward the CT side of it. We, and his own strong common sense, helped him pull back, and then over to the logical side.

Now go tell 4-5 of the truthers you have met...oh no wait, then they might try to brainwash you again...lol

TAM

[GlennB]

Wow!

Cheers indeed. :)

May I ask what specifically changed your mind?

I'm also truly amazed that others haven't had the same experience. Maybe a poll is in order.

Nothing "specifically" changed my mind, Pardalis. But you know how it goes .. the brain sometimes seems to work quietly in the background when you're not even aware of it.
It was watching WTC7 collapse for the first time (about 3 weeks ago) that really set me off. So 'clearly CD' that I suppose the glands kicked in bigtime. Then, as I recall, it was all reverse logic. If WTC7 was CD'd, what does that "tell" me about the rest of 9/11 ? Then you've made an emotional investment in the whole business and facts about WTC are easily dismissed. Actually, 'facts' about WTC7 in particular are very attractively promoted by the CT films and websites. It was only tonight that I read Gravy's LC critique, with the quotes from firefighters at WTC7, that set me straight finally. If anything, that would be the specific. If a building like that was creaking quite close to me I now realise that I might well "pull" the operation pd friggin' q.

Lurking there also, and a potent catalyst to all this, is a deep distrust - verging on hatred - of our leaders. In particular the vile pack of manipulative lies that took us into Iraq. The whole 9/11 nightmare - to me - was cynically used to give these lies credence. Meanwhile I was also reading the "New Pearl Harbour" business and suddenly 1+1=3. A subconcious desire to see this scum brought to book for one thing or another (or another..or another..) just added fuel to this new obsession. I wanted to believe the worst of that mob. 9/11 CT was about as bad as it could get and therefore really hit the spot.

fwiw -
I have an occasional fishing buddy who works on a TV "ghost" show. I've volunteered to be a subject for a haunted house experiment. So far the offer is unaccepted.
Any talk of homeopathy gets me close to anger.
The $1,000,000 will go unclaimed forever.

It can get to anybody. Belief+glands is a dangerous business :)

Stay calm

Glenn

[Brainache]

I would like to add my voice to the chorus.
Well done Glenn.

It is sometimes very easy to believe the worst about people in positions of power. Personally, I think GWB is a cretin, not an evil genius.

I am glad you have woken up to the CT lies.
I am also very impressed that you made the effort to let everyone know.
A lesser person might have just disappeared and denied ever falling for the BS.

One down, several million to go.
Keep up the good work JREF Ninjas.

[Pardalis]

Lurking there also, and a potent catalyst to all this, is a deep distrust - verging on hatred - of our leaders. In particular the vile pack of manipulative lies that took us into Iraq. The whole 9/11 nightmare - to me - was cynically used to give these lies credence. Meanwhile I was also reading the "New Pearl Harbour" business and suddenly 1+1=3. A subconcious desire to see this scum brought to book for one thing or another (or another..or another..) just added fuel to this new obsession. I wanted to believe the worst of that mob. 9/11 CT was about as bad as it could get and therefore really hit the spot.

This is very revealing. The Bush administration is alot to blame for the emergence of the CTs, because they have created so much resentment throughout the world, and within the US, that the CTs provided the perfect reason to make them appear as evil as possible.

But the facts show otherwise, at least as far as the MIHOP theories go, and most of the LIHOP's. Good thing you have been able to overcome your resentment and see the CTs for what they are: complete and utter lies.

[R.Mackey]

Good show, Glenn! It appears you are the rare "rational but dissenting" person to come here.

I always try to give people the benefit of the doubt when they have reasonable questions. It gets difficult to tell, though -- as you've seen, we have no shortage of punks who take a conflicting position out of sheer bravado, not to mention a few who are literally insane (e.g. Christophera) or borderline criminal (Killtown comes to mind). It's a pity, because some perfectly good questions get lost in the noise.

I understood at once what you said about "brains and glands," by the way. Biochemistry is a complex thing. I try not to post when I'm too pissed off...

For that matter, I've learned a few things from rabid CTers as well. Once in a while, something they've read actually turns out to be accurate. So far the interpretation has always been wrong, but I always try to check. Otherwise, I'm just as dogmatic as they are. This has been a learning process for me as well.

Anyway, enjoy your stay.

"Nobody is nobody. Everyone has something to offer." -- Buckaroo Banzai

[TK0001]

That's great news, Glenn.

As I read your two posts in here, my predominant emotion was relief. Relief because you seem like a very smart person, and yet you were sucked into the CT side....as well.

After watching Loose Change, I admit I bought it hook, line, and sinker. Prior to that viewing, I had no thoughts whatsoever that people actually entertained the idea that the government did it, so it had a powerful effect on me. When I first started watching it, I was skeptical, but after awhile I clearly remember thinking wait a minute, I hate the Bush administration, so why am I so willing to dismiss what this film is telling me?. After that, I believed everything it told me, under the condition that Bush = bad. I wanted to believe it, just so I could detest the president more.

But after digging and reading rational people's arguments, I started to doubt. Something in the back of my mind nagged at me that this just doesn't fit, but I was too proud to bring it to the forefront.

When I read Vanity Fair's article about what happened at NEADS that day, it finally broke. I could no longer accept this theory. After that I stumbled upon and read everything contained within Screw Loose Change (especially damning to the "truth" movement was this article (http://www.911myths.com/911TruthOrgCritiqueMay06.pdf)). I started to realize that Avery and Co. were not just mistaken, they actually intentionally misled people like me. Then I got pissed and have been 10 times more passionate about debunking than I ever was about proving the CT.

Short story long, it was a relief to see that a smart person such as yourself could also be duped. I feel truly embarrassed and irresponsible that I ever bought into that movement, and I'm certainly glad that the people on this side never rubbed my face in my mistake with a bunch of "I told you so"s.

[GlennB]

Thanks all for the very generous comments.
And TK0001, it wouldn't be all that nice to say I'm "glad" to hear of another person going through what sounds like a remarkably similar experience, but in fact it is ;)
I wonder how many other CT'ists had the self-discipline to lurk here (and elsewhere), read the important stuff and allow themselves to be put straight before jumping into the debate?

Anyway - there is lurking to do, any maybe sowing a seed of doubt here and there. Earning your right(?!) to post on the LC debate forum looks like quite a challenge ......

cheers

[Hellbound]

Just to add another voice to the choir:

Excellent to hear, Glenn.

I know we tend to get a bit, hmm, over-entusiastic at times (myself included), but I'm glad it didn't affect your understanding of the arguments and evidence.

And I also have to say, it takes a very big man to state he was wrong. Hat's off to you :)

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Thanks all for the very generous comments.
And TK0001, it wouldn't be all that nice to say I'm "glad" to hear of another person going through what sounds like a remarkably similar experience, but in fact it is ;)
I wonder how many other CT'ists had the self-discipline to lurk here (and elsewhere), read the important stuff and allow themselves to be put straight before jumping into the debate?

Anyway - there is lurking to do, any maybe sowing a seed of doubt here and there. Earning your right(?!) to post on the LC debate forum looks like quite a challenge ......

cheers

Just remember, science itself is a self correcting process. Sometimes it goes down the wrong path, but by continually reviewing where it has come from, how new information affects it, etc it can revise its path. That's part of the beauty of the methodology.