Biggest PC slow-downs (other than hardware)?

[bigred]

OK presuming a "good" system hardware-wise and no viruses (and disregarding which OS you're running, not interested in digressing into another one of those battles) - ie I'm thinking more sort of "maintenance" type things one can do to improve performance.

There are 2 or 3 biggies I can think of offhand:

1 - "Junk" running in the background that isn't really doing anything for you (viewed via Task Manager) ie "pct.exe" and such

2 - Highly fragmented HD

3 - Low on HD space

Others?

[gnome]

OK presuming a "good" system hardware-wise and no viruses (and disregarding which OS you're running, not interested in digressing into another one of those battles) - ie I'm thinking more sort of "maintenance" type things one can do to improve performance.

There are 2 or 3 biggies I can think of offhand:

1 - "Junk" running in the background that isn't really doing anything for you (viewed via Task Manager) ie "pct.exe" and such

2 - Highly fragmented HD

3 - Low on HD space

Others?

Excessive spyware/adware--these will show up in the task manager but may not be obvious.

Tools such as Spybot and Ad-Aware are useful for improving performance under such circumstances.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Background indexing from either Google Desktop, MS Desktop, or the Windows file indexing.
Memory resident programs with memory leaks (Yahoo! messenger does this to me).
Large background file copying.
File compression.

[Almo]

Windows.

:dl:

But seriously. Scheduled virus scans are a killer. If you can be disciplined enough to do a scan once a week by hand, turn off scheduled scanning. Can't tell you how many times Trena's scanner has started right when she's in the middle of a hot game of Warcraft III. :eye-poppi

Not enough RAM for the OS. I know someone with a 128 MB laptop with... <drum roll> Windows XP! :eek: THAT runs horribly. Plus it has a software modem... so it disconnects alot since the CPU is so busy hitting the page file all the time.

Registry cleaners are allegedly useful. Registry Mechanic is what dad uses. I'm not sure personally.

[RayG]

Biggest PC slowdowns? Anything that hogs resources (like Norton, trojans, or viruses), runs in the background (screensavers, startup programs, Windows services), or consumes bandwidth (spyware/scumware).

Sometimes default settings can slow a RAM stressed system. For example, by default ALL the visual effects options are preset in Windows XP. Instead, try:

Start > Right-click on My Computer > Properties > Advanced tab > Performance Settings button > Visual Effects tab > click button next to Adjust for best performance, then scroll down and ensure only the bottom three boxes are checked.

RayG

[jimlintott]

MS Windows - When you see how much snappier and responsive Linux is on the same hardware you wonder what Windows is up to.

Things that I have found to slow down Windows:

Clicking an icon - Maybe it's launching maybe it isn't. Should I click it again or wait. Too long, click again. Great, now I have two copies of Excel running.

Murphy's law - The sooner you need something done the more likely Windows will refuse to cooperate.

Printing - nothing brings a windows box to a crawl faster than clicking print.

Reboots - nothing slows down getting work done like waiting for reboots.

Lost files - Windows apps can be bad for saving files in places where you can't find it again. This is getting better but has a long way to go to be as good as Unix.

Virus scanning - If the system was secure from the ground up we wouldn't have the virus problems we have. Background scanning eats lots of CPU. Luckily we can get dual core processors so that one core can be dedicated to virus scanning. Poor MS that anti-trust thing has almost got them between a rock and a hard place. If they deliver an OS that is very secure then the third party security suppliers will get upset. The whole anti-trust thing was bogus in my opinion.

Honestly I don't find running Windows to be a big hassle. It works, XP is quite stable. I just prefer the *nix way of doing things.

More appropriate to the OP is bad BIOS settings. I have seen a few machines underperform because someone tweaked the BIOS. BIOS tweaks can result in speed when done properly.

Old video drivers can slow things up. Most noticable while playing games.

[AK-Dave]

My experience, as a former computer tech, is that the biggest slowdown for most PCs is the loser user sitting in front of it. And the 30 browser toolbars that user installed. And the 3-5 IM clients. And the keyloggers they installed (without knowing it). Beyond that, considering just the hardware and default software, the biggest slowdowns I've seen were the indexing services previously mentioned, insufficient/low-quality RAM, and slow (low RPM) hard drives (slows down virtual memory operations).

And [start flamewar]not being on a Mac[/start flamewar].

[Soapy Sam]

Two finger typing.

[kevin]

i know we're not supposed to mention hardware, but not enough memory is a real killer. I used to think 1GB was plenty, but I'm thinking of bumping my mac up to 2GB.

[rockoon]

As someone already mentioned, turn off all the visual bells and whistles. This frees up memory AND its more efficient.

Also, make sure full video acceleration is enabled (if not, enable it.. if that causes problems, find out why) as well as write combining.

If its an AGP video card, try different AGP aperature sizes (its a bios config option on agp systems) .. usualy smaller is more responsive but for heavy applications (games) then larger is better.

Also if possible, consider overclocking the system bus (not the cpu speed) .. worst case scenario is a ram chip overheats.. best case scenario is that you've improved one of the more common application bottlenecks (memory bandwidth)

[a_unique_person]

Two finger typing.

Touch tpying all the way, here.

[Tez]

I have 2 GB of Ram in my laptop (Fujitsu Tablet PC) - but it seems to me the computer never gets anywhere close to using all that (as monitored via the task manager thingy). This is true no matter how much stuff I set running. And sometimes it seems Windows will be using the page file despite having plenty of RAM free. So I wonder if there's any point in having more than 1GB of RAM?

[a_unique_person]

The windows paging annoys me the way it does that. Is there some way to make it actually use what it has before it decides to start paging things out?

[BPSCG]

But seriously. Scheduled virus scans are a killer. If you can be disciplined enough to do a scan once a week by hand, turn off scheduled scanning. Can't tell you how many times Trena's scanner has started right when she's in the middle of a hot game of Warcraft III. :eye-poppi Why doesn't she schedule the scan for some ungodly hour of the morning when she's certain to be asleep?

[gnome]

Why doesn't she schedule the scan for some ungodly hour of the morning when she's certain to be asleep?

Or, a Godly hour when gamers are asleep :)

[Mongrel]

Double post. :(

[IllegalArgument]

Disk fragmentation is can cause a lot loading lag.

If you are running programs that need to load data regularly or need to load a large chunk of data like graphics-video-games, fragmentation can really have an impact.

[Mongrel]

Or, a Godly hour when gamers are asleep :)

Gamers.....Sleep.....

?!?!?!

Seeing some problems here :p

Having met enough Americans who are still awake come mid-day GMT and are willing to play for a 6 hour stint. Gamers don't mind seeing sunrise, they just see it from the wrong side :)

[ShowMe]

"Legacy USB" setting in some BIOS systems. If you don't need it, turn it off.

[bigred]

Also, make sure full video acceleration is enabled (if not, enable it.. if that causes problems, find out why) as well as write combining.

Also if possible, consider overclocking the system bus (not the cpu speed) .. worst case scenario is a ram chip overheats.. best case scenario is that you've improved one of the more common application bottlenecks (memory bandwidth)
I know this will probably draw a little "ire" but can you splain how to do these, or is it too involved to post? (alternatively PM would be appreciate if you're so inclined) Thx

Edit: oh yeah and what about this "indexing" thing y'all speak of....clue in the IT manager who draws comparisons of Dilbert and pointy hair.... :)

[Zep]

I have 2 GB of Ram in my laptop (Fujitsu Tablet PC) - but it seems to me the computer never gets anywhere close to using all that (as monitored via the task manager thingy). This is true no matter how much stuff I set running. And sometimes it seems Windows will be using the page file despite having plenty of RAM free. So I wonder if there's any point in having more than 1GB of RAM?

The windows paging annoys me the way it does that. Is there some way to make it actually use what it has before it decides to start paging things out?Windows (based on NT) will expand processes to consume as much memory as is available...eventually. You keep running IE for hours on end, it will g-r-o-w. The simple/dumb/immediate solution is to close and open it again. The BEST solution is for it to shrink whenever necessary. Ask Bill to do it in the next release - I'm sure he'll agree that even though he has shares in Intel you don't need to buy the next greatest CPU just because IE is a memory hog.

Note also that Windows processes are supposed to "co-operate" with each other in sharing resources. So if one refuses to play nice or hogs the limelight, all the rest will suffer. And if this bad apple is a background (detached) process, it is often difficult for the average Windows user to discover and deal with. (Being an alien from another (better) OS world where processes are efficiently marshalled by a plenipotent OS, this always seemed a foolishly selfish design.)

So let's start a checklist of known things to do to make Windows go better/faster. I'll start with the obvious:

1) DEFRAG your disk(s) regularly!
2) Real memory is to virtual memory as Coke is to Pepsi - the real thing is better, so get more.
3) Do not waste cycles running anything you do not need right now.
4) Don't install stuff "just in case I might want it" or because "that sounds good". Install only what you need.
5) Don't use Outlook Express for ANYTHING.

[DickK]

Windows (based on NT) will expand processes to consume as much memory as is available...eventually. You keep running IE for hours on end, it will g-r-o-w. The simple/dumb/immediate solution is to close and open it again. The BEST solution is for it to shrink whenever necessary. Ask Bill to do it in the next release - I'm sure he'll agree that even though he has shares in Intel you don't need to buy the next greatest CPU just because IE is a memory hog.

Note also that Windows processes are supposed to "co-operate" with each other in sharing resources. So if one refuses to play nice or hogs the limelight, all the rest will suffer. And if this bad apple is a background (detached) process, it is often difficult for the average Windows user to discover and deal with. (Being an alien from another (better) OS world where processes are efficiently marshalled by a plenipotent OS, this always seemed a foolishly selfish design.)

So let's start a checklist of known things to do to make Windows go better/faster. I'll start with the obvious:

1) DEFRAG your disk(s) regularly!
2) Real memory is to virtual memory as Coke is to Pepsi - the real thing is better, so get more.
3) Do not waste cycles running anything you do not need right now.
4) Don't install stuff "just in case I might want it" or because "that sounds good". Install only what you need.
5) Don't use Outlook Express for ANYTHING.Hmm, dunno about your cooperative take on Windows Zep. Windows has been preemptive for 32 bit images since 92, when NT first appeared. Prior to that it was, of course, cooperative multitasking. And while IE may expand to rule the known universe, this isn't a general rule. I can write networking daemons for 32-bit Windows that'll run for months without using any more memory than they start up with. The other side of that coin is that the same daemons compiled for Unix might leak memory due to bugs in the IP stack.

Just an observation.

[AK-Dave]

Also, reboot the computer on occasion. Many applications and processes have memory leaks which cause the memory allocated to that process to slowly creep up. Restarting will remedy this. One sign of memory leaks is your computer starts getting sluggish the longer it's left on, and it starts paging out to the hard drive more and more often.
-David

[Project86]

Everything that has been said has been good advice. One thing I will add that I didn't see mentioned: Re-installing your OS every once in a while. With heavy use, especially installing and removing drivers and applications, Windows tends to get bogged down. It shouldn't, but it does. You can keep a lid on things by using a registry cleaner/optimizer, but eventually you will still slow down.

And as long as you are reinstalling the OS, you might as well reformat your HD if it is feasable. Some people partition a small part of their HD to be used only by the OS and it's supporting components; that way they can reformat and re-install without losing most of their stuff.

[a_unique_person]

However, as the IBM engineer once said about their mainframes, there's no performance problem you can't fix by throwing more iron at it.

[bigred]

Everything that has been said has been good advice. One thing I will add that I didn't see mentioned: Re-installing your OS every once in a while. With heavy use, especially installing and removing drivers and applications, Windows tends to get bogged down. It shouldn't, but it does. You can keep a lid on things by using a registry cleaner/optimizer, but eventually you will still slow down. I've heard this but am leery about such things as obviously they can be dangerous. Anyone have suggestions for a "good" (safe) one? ie assuming the operator of said program isn't a total fool?


And as long as you are reinstalling the OS, you might as well reformat your HD if it is feasable. Some people partition a small part of their HD to be used only by the OS and it's supporting components; that way they can reformat and re-install without losing most of their stuff.Interesting idea. What would you consider a "safe" minimum space needed for a typical XP Home install?

[Project86]

I've heard this but am leery about such things as obviously they can be dangerous. Anyone have suggestions for a "good" (safe) one? ie assuming the operator of said program isn't a total fool?


I've always been pleased with RegCleaner. It is freeware, and it seems to work very well. I'd give you a link, but I can't post URL's yet, so just search for it and I'm sure you'll find dozens of plases to download it.

It's a very small program, and very easy to use. I just go up to "tools", then "registry cleaner", and then select "do them all" (it lists a few different cleaning options). It will do the rest for you. It also makes a backup of the original, in case anything happens. I have never had a single problem using this, and never even had to use the backup file. There are other good programs out there I'm sure, but this has served me well for a long tim.


Interesting idea. What would you consider a "safe" minimum space needed for a typical XP Home install?

I've done it with only 3 GB, some people use even less. I'm not sure what the smallest amount should be... that depends on what XP components you end up using. But if you used 5GB, I'm sure that would be plenty to cover your install and all your updates. With hard drive prices being so low per GB, that shouldn't cause any problems.

[Zep]

Hmm, dunno about your cooperative take on Windows Zep. Windows has been preemptive for 32 bit images since 92, when NT first appeared. Prior to that it was, of course, cooperative multitasking. And while IE may expand to rule the known universe, this isn't a general rule. I can write networking daemons for 32-bit Windows that'll run for months without using any more memory than they start up with. The other side of that coin is that the same daemons compiled for Unix might leak memory due to bugs in the IP stack.

Just an observation.True, with NT-based Windows, apps are supposed to be capable of being pre-emptively managed. And indeed many apps will comply. Unfortunately not all do, and will lock, leak or consume resources such that they can hang systems. Sometimes these unco-operative apps are 32-bit, and not always the ones you would expect would be ill-behaved.

Windows has gotten a lot better - my observation is that whatever they did to the internals of Win2K onwards was a vast improvement. Rogue processes seem to be much better managed now.

Yep, I have used a Win2K Pro desktop at work that I had running literally non-stop for months with no issues at all. Although strangely, a cow-orker had to reboot his almost identical PC daily...no-one knew why the difference. :boggled: But it can be done.

[DickK]

Zep,

Good points, and agreed. It always feels like I've been sucker-punched when I end up making a case for Windows. It's not a develpment platform I'd choose to work on, frankly. And you're right, XP Pro on my company laptop works fine, always. My colleague's, with the same standard image but probably a few too many Google/Yahoo toolbars, Firefox extensions and YouTube movies in his cache, won't start up, won't shut down, stalls, hangs, spontaneously reboots and generally might as well be running DOS for all the good XP has done him.

On the other hand, during a foray into Linux (SuSE), installed on an old and seemingly unreliable Pentium 600, I could not get it to go wrong. A beautiful setup.

None of which helps bigred and his quest for Windows slickness. Sorry bigred. Therefore I add: Get as much memory as you can into the machine. 32-bit Windows can't use more than about 3.4GB due to the way that devices are mapped into the space just below 4 GB (which is the max. addressable for 32 bits) so 2-3 GBs is good. The empirical message here is that the less stress on the page file and the disk sub-system the better. Having said that, XP (and I guess all NT lineage builds) will always use some page file (it has to do with the age of unused processes in memory, not the amount of memory in use) so don't expect to do without it, just minimise its use.

[rats]

Not sure whether anyone’s mentioned it, but a very simple thing is to make sure you don’t save stuff to that My Documents area. Keep all your files elsewhere.

I’m not a computer whiz, so please excuse if this is an obvious one!

[gnome]

Not sure whether anyone’s mentioned it, but a very simple thing is to make sure you don’t save stuff to that My Documents area. Keep all your files elsewhere.

I’m not a computer whiz, so please excuse if this is an obvious one!

That really matters?

[rats]

That really matters?
I’ve found it helps keep things running quickly. Though obviously it won’t if your disc is all fragmented etc.

I work heavily on my home and work Windows computers, running high CPU calculations, often with significant Office files in the foreground.

One day I’ll grow up and stick to Linux & IDL :o

[I less than three logic]

Or, a Godly hour when gamers are asleep :)
So around noon then?

[Nevermore]

Some other things you may want to consider:

- If you have more than one hard drive installed, place your page file on a different drive than the one Windows is installed on
- Rather than allowing Windows to dynamically manage the size of the page file set it to a consistant amount 2.5 times your system RAM
- Get a can of compressed air and blow out all those dust bunnies inside your case and on your fans
- Make sure your computer is adequately ventilated

[a_unique_person]

Zep,

Good points, and agreed. It always feels like I've been sucker-punched when I end up making a case for Windows. It's not a develpment platform I'd choose to work on, frankly. And you're right, XP Pro on my company laptop works fine, always. My colleague's, with the same standard image but probably a few too many Google/Yahoo toolbars, Firefox extensions and YouTube movies in his cache, won't start up, won't shut down, stalls, hangs, spontaneously reboots and generally might as well be running DOS for all the good XP has done him.

On the other hand, during a foray into Linux (SuSE), installed on an old and seemingly unreliable Pentium 600, I could not get it to go wrong. A beautiful setup.

None of which helps bigred and his quest for Windows slickness. Sorry bigred. Therefore I add: Get as much memory as you can into the machine. 32-bit Windows can't use more than about 3.4GB due to the way that devices are mapped into the space just below 4 GB (which is the max. addressable for 32 bits) so 2-3 GBs is good. The empirical message here is that the less stress on the page file and the disk sub-system the better. Having said that, XP (and I guess all NT lineage builds) will always use some page file (it has to do with the age of unused processes in memory, not the amount of memory in use) so don't expect to do without it, just minimise its use.

You mean he's been checking out all the sucker porn/smiley/cursor sites that load his machine down with malware, spyware and viruses. They are the most common reason I have seen for a machine to become functionally useless, and the hardest to cure, short of formatting the thing and starting fresh.