"Real" vampires.

[Big Les]

http://www.drinkdeeplyanddream.com/realvampire/

No, nothing to do with anaemia, porphyria, or any other recognised medical condition (that I've heard of anyway) sometimes mistakenly linked with "real" vampirism, but a person who seems convinced that they aren't a "wannabe" or blood-fetishist, but "actually" a vampire. A vampire being a person that "needs" to drink blood.

I think they're nuts. Any thoughts?

ETA - this (http://www.drinkdeeplyanddream.com/realvampire/vampireguide301.html)has to be my favourite page. They seem to be cherry-picking from the traditional "powers" of the folkloric/literary vampire. Classic social inadequacy issues, surely?

[Elizabeth I]

I think it looks like some kind of performance art. Surely the creator(s) CAN'T be serious.

[thomps1d]

I think it looks like some kind of performance art. Surely the creator(s) CAN'T be serious.

Actually, one thing that I've learned from hanging out with way too many of the oddball types at my university is that people who really, truly want to call themselves vampires can become as deluded as any religious person or homeopath.

In fact, the latter is a good example. Many of the "real vampire" types have convinced themselves that a little bit of blood every now and then really does make them feel better, stronger, healthier, etc. I don't think that the obvious need be stated, but I'll do it anyway - the placebo effect can be very strong when somebody needs to beleive something.

[geni]

They can be:

http://www.vampires.nu/pages/Forums.cfm/PageID/10/action/view/Forum/5

[Miss Whiplash]

http://www.drinkdeeplyanddream.com/realvampire/

No, nothing to do with anaemia, porphyria, or any other recognised medical condition (that I've heard of anyway) sometimes mistakenly linked with "real" vampirism, but a person who seems convinced that they aren't a "wannabe" or blood-fetishist, but "actually" a vampire. A vampire being a person that "needs" to drink blood.

I think they're nuts. Any thoughts?

ETA - this (http://www.drinkdeeplyanddream.com/realvampire/vampireguide301.html)has to be my favourite page. They seem to be cherry-picking from the traditional "powers" of the folkloric/literary vampire. Classic social inadequacy issues, surely?

This subculture has been around for quite some time. It became more fashionable in the 80's with the advent of the Goths and is still going.

Like most subcultures that are embraced by the young, as soon as it becomes apperant they will age like everyone else, it will be abandoned like bondage pants from HotTopic.

I look at it more as a combination of fetishism and evolving folklore.

[mumchup]

I think they are self-deluded. I doesn't look like performance art to me, mostly because performance artists don't come up with gems like this:
"Our ocular nerves are more efficient at carrying low-grade light emissions to the brain. This means that there is less loss of resolution and contrast in low-light environments (we can see things more clearly in the dark than can humans)."
Hehe, that's a good one.
Having made jokes now; I gotta say that I wouldn't insult people like this in person, on purpose. They lack self confidence and so imagine themselves as different in a mysterious and powerful way. Picking on them won't get them to stop and it certainly doesn't make them feel better about themselves.
But that "efficient nerve" line is pretty funny though.

[Loss Leader]

I hope they're not really drinking human blood because damn.

[Miss Whiplash]

A little more:

A Vampire Church (http://www.vampire-church.com/)

Sean Manchester - Vampire Hunter (http://www.gothicpress.freeserve.co.uk/Vampire%20Research%20Society.htm)

And he is for real...

[Miss Whiplash]

I hope they're not really drinking human blood because damn.


Mostly, they prick each other's fingers and that small amount of blood sufices for "feeding."


Read Piercing The Darkness:Undercover with Vampires in America Today (http://www.amazon.com/Piercing-Darkness-Undercover-Vampires-America/dp/0061059455/sr=8-1/qid=1159732970/ref=sr_1_1/104-2970070-6115122?ie=UTF8&s=books) by Katerine Ramsland. It pretty much covers the subculture. If you're in a large city you will find a "vampire" bar or two. Then again, you can find a "spank me" bar if you look for them.

[blutoski]

I hope they're not really drinking human blood because damn.

It's a manifestation of the same mental illness as people who think they're Napoleon or Jesus.

It's a serious enough problem that most hospitals are aware that the blood storage needs extra security. When Vancouver had a riot in the early '90s, I was working in St. Paul's Hospital, and part of our code orange protocol was to put the blood under lock and key. This was especially important, because it was a level 4 lab, which meant that a lot of the blood was contaminated and if it was drunk, it would be an epidemiological disaster.

The two main targets for hospital breakins: narcotics and blood.

[clarsct]

Life imitating art.

I can tell you that looking like vampire can be very attractive to certain types of women.

I had fun in my younger days....

[Big Les]

I was aware of blood-fetishism and even self-deluded blood-drinking types, but this person seems to be disturbingly well aware of these phenomena and classifies herself and others as "actual" vampires with a real physical need for blood.

I guess it's the same delusion; you just don't usually see such "sensible" discussion verging on self-awareness of being a fraud! I suppose it's like psychics who despair at "fraudulent" psychics...

[mumchup]

I guess it's the same delusion; you just don't usually see such "sensible" discussion verging on self-awareness of being a fraud! I suppose it's like psychics who despair at "fraudulent" psychics...

That's kinda what I thought about it.

[Windom]

Thats what happens when kids play too much Vampire: the Masquerade :(

[Dustin Kesselberg]

Just a bunch of people who aren't satisfied with their lives, So they decide to read a lot of Ann rice novels and pretend they're vampires. It makes them feel like they have some power in their lives even though they don't.

They even make up nonsense such as "Energy vampires" who magically such peoples 'psychic energy'.

[mumchup]

They even make up nonsense such as "Energy vampires" who magically such peoples 'psychic energy'.

So... according to some of the failed Challenge applicants, Randi is an Energy Vampire. :D

[simonmaal]

I like the line: "We are (obviously) separate from the human race."

Sounds very similar to the kind of garbage spouted by followers of White Supremacist movements.

[Miss Whiplash]

Just a bunch of people who aren't satisfied with their lives, So they decide to read a lot of Ann rice novels and pretend they're vampires. It makes them feel like they have some power in their lives even though they don't.

They even make up nonsense such as "Energy vampires" who magically such peoples 'psychic energy'.


That's my thinking too. I've actually known a few. One day they grow up and realise they're getting old like everyone else and the pretense is shattered. Then, they'll drop the vamp bit and start dressing like Star Trek characters. Or become Jehovah's Witnesses.

It's really the same as when some teenage girl buys a book on witchcraft and suddenly becomes a "Wiccan." Someone dissatisfied with life and wants to feel a little "special."

[RenaissanceBiker]

I like the line: "We are (obviously) separate from the human race."

Sounds very similar to the kind of garbage spouted by followers of White Supremacist movements.


The white supremacists say that others are obviously separate from the human race or deserve to be.

Vampires suck.

[Miss Whiplash]

I think it looks like some kind of performance art. Surely the creator(s) CAN'T be serious.


This is a phrase I see here a lot. (Not to single you out - Others have posted the same thing on other threads.)

I don't think people realise just how many have spun off into the fringe in the last 15 years. It's mind-boggling. These websites aren't fiction or parodies-people actually believe all this stangeness. Vampires. Dispensationalism. Religious Nationalism. Bad photography as proof of ghosts. Reiki. Demons. "Scientific" ghost hunting. Even table tipping has made a comeback. This isn't just a few kooks out there. This stuff is now in mainstream society. Something is terribly wrong.

[simonmaal]

The following link is roughly related to the current conversation:

http://www.kontraband.com/show/show.asp?ID=2349&CAT=movies&NSFW=3&rtn=search-2349&Keywords=zombie

Note that Derren Brown has also demostrated table turning. He is a skeptic who uses psychological phenomena to disprove the paranormal.

[thomps1d]

I like the line: "We are (obviously) separate from the human race."

Sounds very similar to the kind of garbage spouted by followers of White Supremacist movements.


Actually, most of the "real vampires" that I've known tend to go more for the sort of line repeated over and over again in the old tv show Kindred. "I'm not quite human, but I am a part of nature."

Not quite the sort of thing that a white supremacist says, but definitely getting close.

Of course, most of them claim that they don't believe that they are inherently superior to other people...and then you get the whackjobs that claim they are hundreds of years old and are truly immortal beings, superior to all mankind. This was the case with a guy I grew up with. After high school, I didn't see him for a few years. Finally, I ran into him at university - he was enrolling just as I was finishing my undergrad work. Our conversation went like this:

thomps1d: "Hey, B---- (name deleted for privacy reasons)! How's it going? I see you've got the whole goth thing going on now."

B----: "My name is no longer B----. I have reclaimed my true name. I am Raziel Lestat, born in the year 1666 to a noble family. This is my true heritage, not the name I have thrown off."

thomps1d: "Uhhh...yeah....you see...I grew up with you, so I know that's complete BS."

B----: "I did not 'grow up', as you say. I merely assumed the guise of a child growing to adulthood to fool the hunters who have persecuted me through the years."

thomps1d: "My parents told me they had dinner with your parents just last week. You'd think they'd be aware of that sort of thing."

B----: "I used my vampire powers to cloud their minds. They genuinely believe that I am their son...deluded fools!"

thomps1d: "Vampire powers, eh? Something like 'these are not the droids you are looking for'?"

B----: "Wha? Shut up, that is totally not what I...uhhh...that is to say, I would never lower myself to the quaint trickeries of such debased entertainment. No, my power is from a far greater source."

thomps1d: "Does it rhyme with 'meth addiction'?"

B----: "..."

thoms1d: "Or does it rhyme with something more like 'I'm a freaking loser who needed to feel special, so I took a name comprised of one half video game character, one half poorly written pulp fiction vampire name'?"

B----: "I'm totally going to kick your ass."

thomps1d: "With your vampire powers? Oh, wait...I'm getting something now...some meddling in my head...these are not the droids I am looking for."

B----: "Jerk."

[Z]

Unfortunately, I know at least one who's in his late 40s, early 50s, and is aging rather poorly; but he still clings to the 'vampire' identity.

So, no, some people never snap out of the delusion.

[Gbob]

Well, they have testable claims. They claim to have better reflexes than us humans. I say we put them in the room and throw baseballs at them and see if they perform better than average. It may not discourage them, but at least we get to hurl objects at their heads.

[simonmaal]

LOL thomps :D

Such delusions as you reported are a feature of narcissistic personality disorder. Thus, these kind of statments are usually made by people who have a sense of superiority.

I once met someone who started going on about similar nonsense, that he's been around for thousands of years, been through hell etc, that Zeus has been killed :jaw-dropp. I made my excuses and quickly left...

[ponderingturtle]

LOL thomps :D

Such delusions as you reported are a feature of narcissistic personality disorder. Thus, these kind of statments are usually made by people who have a sense of superiority.

I once met someone who started going on about similar nonsense, that he's been around for thousands of years, been through hell etc, that Zeus has been killed :jaw-dropp. I made my excuses and quickly left...

That is almost as funny as the time I was dropping a patient off at a secure psychiatric facility, a woman walked up to me and said "they are holding me here against my will", my thought was "yea that is what they do here, that is why it is a secure facility" she did not confirm her sanity when she went on about the abuses they where putting her through, they made her drink from the drinking fountain and it had bubbles, instead of the sink at the nurses station that didn't. Why this mattered I have no idea.

[Loss Leader]

Well, they have testable claims. They claim to have better reflexes than us humans. I say we put them in the room and throw baseballs at them and see if they perform better than average. It may not discourage them, but at least we get to hurl objects at their heads.


A better test would be to give them a huge tumbler of human blood and if they drink it they can call themselves whatever they want. 'Cause I'll be out of there.

[simonmaal]

That is almost as funny as the time I was dropping a patient off at a secure psychiatric facility, a woman walked up to me and said "they are holding me here against my will", my thought was "yea that is what they do here, that is why it is a secure facility" she did not confirm her sanity when she went on about the abuses they where putting her through, they made her drink from the drinking fountain and it had bubbles, instead of the sink at the nurses station that didn't. Why this mattered I have no idea.

:D I like it.

Actually, you've made me think of something here. I wonder how many practitioners of the occult, weird therapies and other such rot are deluded rather than deliberately deceptive. You know, they believe the voices in their heads so much that they can come across as very persuasive; a paranoid schizophrenic can be absolutely convinced that God told them to kill someone. And then there's the story of Evangelist preacher Franck Kabele, who believed he could walk on water and proceeded to repeat the miracle after God told him to. I still don't think they've found his body.

[Cuddles]

Even table tipping has made a comeback.

I'm almost scared to ask - what? Please tell me this really isn't someone just tipping a table.

[Garrette]

I'm almost scared to ask - what? Please tell me this really isn't someone just tipping a table.Of course not. It's spirits tipping the table. It's only coincidental that people have to be touching the table for it to happen.

At least one magic couple (the Andersons? maybe? from Canada) do this extremely well as part of their act. Of course, there's a bit more to their bit than just having the table lean a bit or levitate three inches.

I don't think they're vampires.

[Big Les]

LOL thomps :D

Such delusions as you reported are a feature of narcissistic personality disorder. Thus, these kind of statments are usually made by people who have a sense of superiority.

I once met someone who started going on about similar nonsense, that he's been around for thousands of years, been through hell etc, that Zeus has been killed :jaw-dropp. I made my excuses and quickly left...

Considering this page (http://www.drinkdeeplyanddream.com/m/the-real-m.html), about the site-maker being so well-known and respected that people try to pass themselves off as her, I think you're spot on with the NPD diagnosis.

[Gargoyle]

I use this to rub salt in their wounds! :D

http://www.warehouse23.com/item.html?id=W23-1001S

[Yahzi]

Such delusions as you reported are a feature of narcissistic personality disorder.
I don't think that's quite accurate. NPD is more like what you see in the "Funny, fighting woo with more woo" thread over in the Science forum.

This vampire thing doesn't strike me as quite so identity-deficient. The vampire folks know who they are, they just aren't happy with it. Unlike the NPD victims, who need external authorities to construct an identity.

I emailed the vampire girl in the link about her page on Magick and the JREF challenge. Deafening slience, of course.

[simonmaal]

I use this to rub salt in their wounds! :D

http://www.warehouse23.com/item.html?id=W23-1001S

:cool: Magic, I might order one of these!

[simonmaal]

I don't think that's quite accurate. NPD is more like what you see in the "Funny, fighting woo with more woo" thread over in the Science forum.

I was thinking of the following criteria from DSM 4:

1. An exaggerated sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)

2. Preoccupation with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love

3. Believes he (sic) is "special" and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)

8. Is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him (sic)

Of course, any personality disorder does rely on social interaction style as a disgnostic tool. But you have to agree that the above 4 criteria are quite apparent.

[Yahzi]

Of course, any personality disorder does rely on social interaction style as a disgnostic tool. But you have to agree that the above 4 criteria are quite apparent.
Yes, they are. But you need to go read the thread I mentioned. It's the most blazing example I've ever seen. Kinda reset my calibration on the issue. :D

Vampire-girl seems too self-aware and functional to deserve the diagnosis. I would characterize her as merely pathetic, not crazy.

I am geninunely curious to see if your opinion changes after exposure to the other thread. Also, I don't have my DSM-IV anymore, so does it say anything about levels or stages? Is it possible to have mild form that causes you to act on web pages, as opposed to the full-blown form that causes you to wind up in court?

(Edit: I'm not sure Vampire-girl qualifies on #2 and #3. I didn't really see #2 there, just a desire to be unique. And she seems quite adamant that ordinary people can understand vampires, and shouldn't care very much about them.)

[fuelair]

I like the line: "We are (obviously) separate from the human race."

Sounds very similar to the kind of garbage spouted by followers of White Supremacist movements.


"Deutschland uber allelles!!"

[thaiboxerken]

They are LOSERS, that's all that's needed to understand why they believe what they beleive.

[fuelair]

I use this to rub salt in their wounds! :D

http://www.warehouse23.com/item.html?id=W23-1001S

Or.....Browning combat modified shotgun, 12 gauge , shells loaded with silver balls microetched with religious symbols and magnesium pellets blessed by legitimate priest of appropriate religion. Ingram or Uzi, 40 rd mag, cartridge cases loaded with oak and ash bullets, tipped with small inserted vial of holy water sealed with silver, modified spring for slower cycling with reduced powder content to be sure bullet stays in body. Just in case.:D :D

[Sanamas]

Well, they have testable claims. They claim to have better reflexes than us humans. I say we put them in the room and throw baseballs at them and see if they perform better than average. It may not discourage them, but at least we get to hurl objects at their heads.

A room full of jocks throwing balls at their heads probably helped send them along the vampire route in the first place.

[Big Les]

Or.....Browning combat modified shotgun, 12 gauge , shells loaded with silver balls microetched with religious symbols and magnesium pellets blessed by legitimate priest of appropriate religion. Ingram or Uzi, 40 rd mag, cartridge cases loaded with oak and ash bullets, tipped with small inserted vial of holy water sealed with silver, modified spring for slower cycling with reduced powder content to be sure bullet stays in body. Just in case.:D :D

Never mind the disco-guns, MP5K all the way. Your wooden bullet idea was done rather well in the Ultraviolet series on UK telly; you might've seen it; HK SOCOM .45s with graphite rounds and video cameras with flip-up translucent screens mounted on the tactical rail. Ho, momma. Of course, the whole wooden stake idea is pretty much a Buffy-era invention. Originally (c18th century) it didn't matter what the material, as long as it could pin the corpse into its grave securely.

You also wouldn't want to reduce the cyclic rate or cartridge case load if you were using wooden bullets; their reduced mass would already give you penetration problems (fnar fnar).

See, you can be a vampire fanatic without actually thinking you are one.

[RemieV]

Anyone want to speculate what they're taking donations FOR?

[fuelair]

Never mind the disco-guns, MP5K all the way. Your wooden bullet idea was done rather well in the Ultraviolet series on UK telly; you might've seen it; HK SOCOM .45s with graphite rounds and video cameras with flip-up translucent screens mounted on the tactical rail. Ho, momma. Of course, the whole wooden stake idea is pretty much a Buffy-era invention. Originally (c18th century) it didn't matter what the material, as long as it could pin the corpse into its grave securely.

You also wouldn't want to reduce the cyclic rate or cartridge case load if you were using wooden bullets; their reduced mass would already give you penetration problems (fnar fnar).

See, you can be a vampire fanatic without actually thinking you are one.

Actually, no I have not seen the Brit series, I came up with the idea on my own about two years after Vampire t. m. came out and I got to watch people (vamps,vics and other) maneuvering around blocking objcts because all the kill tools were close in weapons. So dumb..... but I admit a thing for HKs - especially the .45compacts (early, when you could get R or L hand versions - or both.)

[Zygar]

Of course, the whole wooden stake idea is pretty much a Buffy-era invention. Originally (c18th century) it didn't matter what the material, as long as it could pin the corpse into its grave securely.

Well, I wouldn't exactly call this a Buffy-era invention either. The 1931 Dracula movie with Bela Lugosi involved a wooden stake, and that has been the norm ever since. Although Van Helsing doesn't state that it is a wooden stake, it seems to have solidified the myth of a wooden stake in that scene. At least, I grew up "knowing" that it had to be a wooden stake, and that was long before Buffy came along.

[clarsct]

Heh.

I had an entire sorority house convinced I was a vampire/demon. It was pretty fun, and a good way to get laid, ironically enough. Seems that fear and attraction are linked.

Some cheap theatrics, good metabolism(very thin), my natural aversion to sunlight(bright things suck), and hair down to the middle of my back was all it took.

I actually heard stories that people saw me appear and disappear in the halls at night. I have no idea why. I didn't even prompt this, this grew on its own.

I wonder if I created any believers.:eye-poppi

Somewhat scary thought. I had fun, though. It was playacting, roleplaying. Seems that if they thought I was supernatural, they had no control over what they were feeling. >I< was doing it TO them. Some wierd form of 'rape fantasy'.

I never knew it was taken seriously until a few years later, when I began dating one of them(now married). She told me the stories. Was pretty funny.

Though now I wonder....

[Big Les]

Well, I wouldn't exactly call this a Buffy-era invention either. The 1931 Dracula movie with Bela Lugosi involved a wooden stake, and that has been the norm ever since. Although Van Helsing doesn't state that it is a wooden stake, it seems to have solidified the myth of a wooden stake in that scene. At least, I grew up "knowing" that it had to be a wooden stake, and that was long before Buffy came along.

Fair enough, by implication it's been the wooden stake for a long time. But I'm pretty sure Buffy has set that in stone by stating that it has to be wooden and no other material. Ultraviolet and others have as well of course, I suppose because culturally it was already "set" in our minds.

But the "original" stakings, assuming I've got my folklore correct, would have been using iron stakes, used to transfix the corpse in the grave so it could not rise as a vampire (as opposed to actually killing it). In Stoker it's fairly clear that the stake does not kill the vampire; you have to take its head, and indeed the folklore preceding largely agrees (for eastern european vamps anyway). In fact, usually the suspected corpses were also burnt, which I suppose is where the Rician/White Wolfian (!) idea of fire being so deadly, comes from.

Come to think of it, aren't metal stakes specified in Stoker?

[Miss Whiplash]

.

Come to think of it, aren't metal stakes specified in Stoker?

No. Dracula is killed with Quincy Morris' bowie knife. Lucy, with a wooden stake.

Metal stakes are mentioned in folklore, but wooden stakes were more commonly used in Eastern Europe. Ash was the preferred wood as well as, juniper buckthorn, whitethorn and hawthorn. Then the head was severed from the body, turned backward and the body re-interred. Or just simply burnt.

The vampire in folklore was never pale. It had a ruddy complexion, could move about day or night. It was not forever young as it continued to rot and was blamed for plagues.

Muslim gypsies living in what was once Yugoslavia believed melons and pumpkins could turn into vampires if kept to long. The term for those was mullo. The "turned' vegetables would roll after people growling.

Of course, the vampire lifestylists forget these things...

[Z]

Well, I wouldn't exactly call this a Buffy-era invention either. The 1931 Dracula movie with Bela Lugosi involved a wooden stake, and that has been the norm ever since. Although Van Helsing doesn't state that it is a wooden stake, it seems to have solidified the myth of a wooden stake in that scene. At least, I grew up "knowing" that it had to be a wooden stake, and that was long before Buffy came along.


LONG before Buffy, the wooden stake was considered the norm. Consider in Palladium Fantasy RPG, published in 1980, required the stake to be of wood for its mystical grounding significance. Buffy the Vampire Slayer didn't come out until 1992, and even then, the stakes, though wood, were never specifically mentioned that they HAD to be wood.

The wooden stake has been the most common available type of stake for centuries, so logically the wooden stake would have been the default weapon of choice.

[Big Les]

I bow to the superior vampire knowledge on display here! I remember now that I was thinking mainly of "Dracula's Guest" re the iron stakes and Stoker - the tomb in that has one through the lid/roof of it. Wood of course makes more sense as a portable "weapon", and you're quite right that it's described in "Dracula" itself:

a round wooden stake, some two and a half or three inches thick
and about three feet long. One end of it was hardened by charring in
the fire, and was sharpened to a fine point.

It does get on my nerves that the Buffy/Angel (and the silver ones in the Blade movies for that matter) stakes are so short and that they can be pushing into the chest so readily, even by those not endowed with any super-strength. Quite different from bashing away with a lump-hammer on one of the above!

I've been meaning to get back into reading up on the folklore for a while now; is it worth getting hold of Montague Summers' book? I'd also like to track down a copy of the Bill Ellis article in "Folklore" journal about the Highgate shenanigans as well, but can't find a run of that publication nearby and don't have access to JSTOR. Any tips?

[ponderingturtle]

Fair enough, by implication it's been the wooden stake for a long time. But I'm pretty sure Buffy has set that in stone by stating that it has to be wooden and no other material. Ultraviolet and others have as well of course, I suppose because culturally it was already "set" in our minds.


I can point to many refferences before buffy that specified wood, the ones coming to mind are gaming references, but wood was established before buffy came out, either the movie or the series.

[ponderingturtle]

No. Dracula is killed with Quincy Morris' bowie knife. Lucy, with a wooden stake.

Metal stakes are mentioned in folklore, but wooden stakes were more commonly used in Eastern Europe. Ash was the preferred wood as well as, juniper buckthorn, whitethorn and hawthorn. Then the head was severed from the body, turned backward and the body re-interred. Or just simply burnt.

The vampire in folklore was never pale. It had a ruddy complexion, could move about day or night. It was not forever young as it continued to rot and was blamed for plagues.

Muslim gypsies living in what was once Yugoslavia believed melons and pumpkins could turn into vampires if kept to long. The term for those was mullo. The "turned' vegetables would roll after people growling.

Of course, the vampire lifestylists forget these things...


How do they feel about counting mustard seeds?

[ponderingturtle]

I bow to the superior vampire knowledge on display here! I remember now that I was thinking mainly of "Dracula's Guest" re the iron stakes and Stoker - the tomb in that has one through the lid/roof of it. Wood of course makes more sense as a portable "weapon", and you're quite right that it's described in "Dracula" itself:



It does get on my nerves that the Buffy/Angel (and the silver ones in the Blade movies for that matter) stakes are so short and that they can be pushing into the chest so readily, even by those not endowed with any super-strength. Quite different from bashing away with a lump-hammer on one of the above!


This is adressed in From Dusk Til Dawn. there they point out that vampires are soft and it is easier to shove sharp objects into their hearts.

[Big Les]

I can point to many refferences before buffy that specified wood, the ones coming to mind are gaming references, but wood was established before buffy came out, either the movie or the series.

Yes, "point" taken, thank you. I've explained where my misconception about iron stakes came from (Stoker's short story "Dracula's Guest"). The more I think about it the less sense it makes that iron would have been used even for transfixing purposes, when wood is more readily available and more easily worked.

As for the "soft vampires" retrospective rationalisation for easy stakings, that (as well as the entire movie) was someone tongue-in-cheek. It could apply to the traditional "walking corpse" style vampires I suppose.

Getting back on track, I think its interesting how the site-maker goes to great lengths to "dispel the myths" surrounding fictitious vampires, and pushes the idea that "they" are suffering from some sort of disorder: And then goes on to list traits of exactly those vampires (enhanced strength, speed, vision, sharper teeth etc). Also that despite decrying the "popular misconceptions" spread by books and movies, they clearly love those products just as much as any more sane vampire fan might. It's pretty contradictory.

[Big Les]

Ooh, this (http://www.logoi.com/notes/vampires-eastern-europe.html) is good. The examples they use in this 1914 article (assuming it's faithfully transcribed) seem to point to sleep-paralysis/lucid dreaming as a factor in belief in vampires. I'm sure this factor's been discussed before, but I don't remember having read about it.

[Miss Whiplash]

Ooh, this (http://www.logoi.com/notes/vampires-eastern-europe.html) is good. The examples they use in this 1914 article (assuming it's faithfully transcribed) seem to point to sleep-paralysis/lucid dreaming as a factor in belief in vampires. I'm sure this factor's been discussed before, but I don't remember having read about it.

I think it was also in Vampires, Burial, and Death: Folklore and Reality (http://www.amazon.com/Vampires-Burial-Death-Folklore-Reality/dp/0300048599) by Paul Barber, but I could be wrong. I'd have to go look up my copy. (Yes I have a whole library full of such tomes.) :D

[Big Les]

I think it was also in Vampires, Burial, and Death: Folklore and Reality (http://www.amazon.com/Vampires-Burial-Death-Folklore-Reality/dp/0300048599) by Paul Barber, but I could be wrong. I'd have to go look up my copy. (Yes I have a whole library full of such tomes.) :D

Nothing wrong with that! I've let my zombie-related interests relegate my vampirey ones for a while now, but I'm keen to get back up to speed.

[SirPhilip]

I think the phenomena is largely associated with pheromone signaling, which may have an actual connection to sexual vitality; of course, like everything in human experience, it's romanticised. You may have heard women say: "I just want to jump on him and eat him up", although that particular person wasn't attractive to another. Men have this same odd "consumption" impulse as well when, for lack of a better term, the signals "match".

[SirPhilip]

Considering this page (http://www.drinkdeeplyanddream.com/m/the-real-m.html), about the site-maker being so well-known and respected that people try to pass themselves off as her, I think you're spot on with the NPD diagnosis. The power of boredom should never be underestimated.