flat earth conspiracy

[defaultdotxbe]

ive been searching the web looking for any evidence to defend the "flat earth" position, but have come up short

is there even any pseudoscience to this or is it all just 100% faith-based nuttery?

[jhunter1163]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth_Society

Not much out there about this. Seems even religious wackos don't take it seriously.

[Trifikas]

Better Flat Earth Society:

http://www.tdolby.com/index_frameset.html

Trif

[defaultdotxbe]

by my calculations the ice wall guards must be defending about 35,000 miles of "border"

assuming a liberal half mile between guardhouses that gives up 70,000 guard stations (although i would think it would have to be more given the importance of keeping people from reaching the ice wall)

we would also need at least 3 people at each guard station so they can take shifts being "lookout" (again, this would likely be higher as well) this means 210,000 soldiers guarding the secret of the flat earth

assuming penguins were genetically engineered to feed the guards, we would need a conservative 1 penguin per station per day, this is 70,000 penguins consumed each day, or 25,000,000 per year (thats a heck of alot of birds)

an average penguin eats 3-5 pounds of fish and krill per day, this means the penguins consumed by the ice wall guards in one year, would have themselves consumed about 35 billion pounds of food per year (and thats just the penguins the guards eat, obviously there would have to be a generous amount of penguins still around for the guards to eat next year)

no wonder so many ocean species are going exstinct!

[GlennB]

ive been searching the web looking for any evidence to defend the "flat earth" position, but have come up short

is there even any pseudoscience to this or is it all just 100% faith-based nuttery?

Terry Pratchett writes about the flat earth all the time, and Nobby Nobbs posts on here. Case proven. (D'oh!)

[ryanebelhar]

My grandpa likes to tell me about his neighbor back in the 1960s came over to his house after the first moon landing and told him it was fake because the earth is flat and it was round in the pictures

[defaultdotxbe]

assuming penguins were genetically engineered to feed the guards, we would need a conservative 1 penguin per station per day, this is 70,000 penguins consumed each day, or 25,000,000 per year (thats a heck of alot of birds)
more research!

estimates for emporer penguin populations are 150,000-200,000 (clearly this must not include those designate to feed the guards ;) )

[defaultdotxbe]

My grandpa likes to tell me about his neighbor back in the 1960s came over to his house after the first moon landing and told him it was fake because the earth is flat and it was round in the pictures
i had a science teacher in HS who said the earth round, but round like a penny, and challenge us to prove him wrong

of course he didnt actually believe it was flat, he just used it as an excercise in critical thinking ("its round because our textbook says its round" was not an acceptable answer, lol)

[Josh Redstone]

Here's some info on the flat-earthers, if anyone is interested :)

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/flatearth.html

[gumboot]

The real question is, what gender is the turtle?

-Gumboot

[defaultdotxbe]

update: ive found pictures of ice wall guardstation, with its 25 million-penguin food supply!

http://xbehome.com/screwloosechange/pictures/outside.JPG

http://xbehome.com/screwloosechange/pictures/inside.JPG


ETA: i think im having entirely too much fun with this one

[Brainache]

Oh look everyone knows the Earth isn't flat. It's quite lumpy.

[Bell]

I never believed the Earth is round in the first place. Because else Brainache, Qarnos and Gumboot et al would fall off! The fact that they are posting here is proof the Earth is flat.

[defaultdotxbe]

by my calculations the ice wall guards must be defending about 70,000 miles of "border"

assuming a liberal half mile between guardhouses that gives up 140,000 guard stations (although i would think it would have to be more given the importance of keeping people from reaching the ice wall)

we would also need at least 3 people at each guard station so they can take shifts being "lookout" (again, this would likely be higher as well) this means 420,000 soldiers guarding the secret of the flat earth

assuming penguins were genetically engineered to feed the guards, we would need a conservative 1 penguin per station per day, this is 140,000 penguins consumed each day, or 50,000,000 per year (thats a heck of alot of birds)

an average penguin eats 3-5 pounds of fish and krill per day, this means the penguins consumed by the ice wall guards in one year, would have themselves consumed about 70 billion pounds of food per year (and thats just the penguins the guards eat, obviously there would have to be a generous amount of penguins still around for the guards to eat next year)

no wonder so many ocean species are going exstinct!
turns out my calculations were off by a factor of 2

50 million little tuxedoed birds eaten every year....:(

[Brainache]

I never believed the Earth is round in the first place. Because else Brainache, Qarnos and Gumboot et al would fall off! The fact that they are posting here is proof the Earth is flat.

That is a common European fallacy. Everyone in the southern hemisphere is fitted with suction cups on their feet at birth.

[Rob Lister]

You guys and gals are all nuts.

The earth is not so much flat (it's bumpy in places) but very, very limited. You pass a border and you fall off. Simple as that.

When SUV's get bigger and better, this will be obvious.

p.s. Yes, I've seen the faked pictures from outer space.

[Dave1001]

What if they're subsisting on penguin milk, rather than actual penguin?

[Bell]

What if they're subsisting on penguin milk, rather than actual penguin?

But what then do they put in the milk for breakfast?

I'll bet it's Pengo's (tm) grinded penguin cerials.

[defaultdotxbe]

What if they're subsisting on penguin milk, rather than actual penguin?
well penguins dont actually produce "milk" since they arent mammals

the males do produce a milk-like substance, but only for about 3 months out of the year while they are caring for a baby

not sure how the ice-wall guards could make use of this, or if its even capable of sustaining humans

kinda funny how these flat earth theories are completely un-thought out, i bet penguin meat is tough and stringy anyway

[logical muse]

Apparently, a literal reading of certain bible passages support the flat earth conjecture.

Matthew 4:8, in a section where the devil is taking Jesus on a field trip, says:

Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;

Well, no matter how exceeding high the mountain is, you could only see all the kingdoms of the world if indeed the earth was flat.

Oh, and btw, not only is the earth flat according to the bible, but according to the Vedas, the Moon is further away from the Earth than the Sun is!

The Vedas state that the moon is 800,000 miles farther from the earth than the sun.
http://science.krishna.org/Articles/2000/08/00082.html

The sphere of the sun lies 100,000 leagues from earth. The orb of the moon is also said to be 100,000 leagues from the sun.
http://baharna.com/karma/1_Evaluating.htm

[Soapy Sam]

The whole thing is a translation error.

When Philopides Ananananagnostopopolous (the Greek) of Athens translated the Minoan documents sold to him by Leonidas Dibbler in 1520BC, he used the word "Phlapdoodlopollos" meaning "flat" to translate the Minoan term "Squiggle, squiggle, hyphen (thing like a frying pan) dot Komma". Now any student of Aristarchus of Bognor Regis should have known that this does not mean "flat". It means "Flattened, oblate , off-centre or a bit squint, but good enough for government work."

What the ancients knew was that Earth is not spherical, but an oblate ellipsoid.

MARS is flat.

[Brainache]

MARS is flat.

This would explain why we have Mars Bars instead of Mars Balls.

[gumboot]

Apparently, a literal reading of certain bible passages support the flat earth conjecture.

Well, no matter how exceeding high the mountain is, you could only see all the kingdoms of the world if indeed the earth was flat.


That's just a mis-spelling.

They put "sheweth" but it was actually "shoe-ith"

It is referencing the ancient Biblical tradition of wishing love on a person or place. To "shoe-ith all the nations of the world" means to stamp your feet and clap your hands very fast while shouting the name of every nation.

-Gumboot

[qarnos]

The Vedas state that the moon is 800,000 miles farther from the earth than the sun.

Yes, but you are forgetting that the universe was much smaller back then, so a mile was less than one third its present-day value.

ETA: I miss-read the initial statement as "the Moon is 800,000 miles from Earth", so I guess this doesn't make a whole lot of sense now. Back to the drawing board...

[Zep]

But there's been a period of rampant inflation recently - the world economy has forced the moon further and further away. That's why NASA can't afford to go back there, just part-way, with the space-stations.

[William Rea]

The whole thing is a translation error.

When Philopides Ananananagnostopopolous (the Greek) of Athens translated the Minoan documents sold to him by Leonidas Dibbler in 1520BC, he used the word "Phlapdoodlopollos" meaning "flat" to translate the Minoan term "Squiggle, squiggle, hyphen (thing like a frying pan) dot Komma". Now any student of Aristarchus of Bognor Regis should have known that this does not mean "flat". It means "Flattened, oblate , off-centre or a bit squint, but good enough for government work."

What the ancients knew was that Earth is not spherical, but an oblate ellipsoid.

MARS is flat.

It is an oblate spheroid OR an ellipsoid not an oblate ellipsoid since an ellipsoid of Earthly shape is by definition oblate.

[Elizabeth I]

kinda funny how these flat earth theories are completely un-thought out, i bet penguin meat is tough and stringy anyway
I understand it's actually so fishy and oily it's almost impossible to eat. I suppose if you were starving you could choke it down.

But who would ever be able to kill a penguin? Too cute.
:bunpan

[Anti-sophist]

I will say though that their map is genius. When I first heard of it, and saw their map.. I had to just take a moment and laugh to myself.

[Bell]

I will say though that their map is genius. When I first heard of it, and saw their map.. I had to just take a moment and laugh to myself.

You mean a map made by real flat Earthers?

Link please, if you can.

[Anti-sophist]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/dogplatter/flatmap.jpg

[Bell]

That for real? Or out of a comic book? LOL

Are there really people who believe this? If so, why?

[Anti-sophist]

That for real?


I'm not sure. Here's their faq:
http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1324

[defaultdotxbe]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v499/dogplatter/flatmap.jpg
ive never seen that map, but heard it described, thats what i based my ice wall calculations on

also, if the sun really did orbit like that, wouldnt it grow in the western sky instead of rising over the western horizon?

heh, found it in their "unanswered questions"


Q: Why is NASA’s space shuttle runway curved?

Q: How does the atmosphere stay on the Earth?

Q: Explain the Coriolis force?

Q: Why does the hull of a ship disappear over the horizon before the mast does?

Q: if the moon is a spotlight, why can i see a "man" in the moon (shadows cast by the sun on the hills and mountains on it) last i checked a light can't contain shadows.

Q: Explain magnetism is there is no South pole.

Q: Explain fully the optical illusion causing sunrises and sunsets.

funny they couldnt answer the atmospshere one, since they have an explanation (and i use the term loosely) for gravity

[Bell]

I'm not sure. Here's their faq:
http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1324

I quickly skimmed trough their FAQ, looks like a spoof to me. Mind you, a good spoof. Or those guys are real idiots, even beyond Christophera's level of idiocity (but very close).

[defaultdotxbe]

I quickly skimmed trough their FAQ, looks like a spoof to me. Mind you, a good spoof. Or those guys are real idiots, even beyond Christophera's level of idiocity (but very close).
no, the folks on that site are for real, this ones the spoof
http://www.alaska.net/~clund/e_djublonskopf/Flatearthsociety.htm

ETA: the FAQ also lists that they do think the circumference of the earth is 78,000 miles

perhaps someone with military experience could speculate on the logistics of guarding a border that long for over a century with a perfect record :)

[Legalduck]

Do the flat earthers deal with any issues of distance in the southern hemisphere? Since the southern hemisphere is in the "outer ring" in diagram anti-sophist posted, distances would be noticably greater. For example, using a standard globe the distance between California and Japan is comparable to that of say Ecuador to Austraila. (I realize the difference in distances is significant; I'm just talking ballpark "comparable"). Using the flat earth diagram, the Ecuador-Austraila distance becomes far greater than the California_Ecuador distance (just eyeballing it, about 3 1/2 times greater at least)

This lead to one conclusion: all the airlines are in on it. They artifically adjust flight times to fool us:jaw-dropp

[qarnos]

I understand it's actually so fishy and oily it's almost impossible to eat. I suppose if you were starving you could choke it down.

But who would ever be able to kill a penguin? Too cute.
:bunpan

I went out clubbing the other night.

I got three baby seals.

[defaultdotxbe]

This lead to one conclusion: all the airlines are in on it. They artifically adjust flight times to fool us:jaw-dropp
they are way ahead of you, their FAQ addresses how GPS and airlines are all designed to fool us

[clarsct]

True, they could be eating seals and such, I suppose.

I was in a debate class where one side had to take flat earth and the other round earth. Fortunately, I got the round earth side. We slaughtered them. It wasn't even a contest. Me and this other kid took the facts and just pounded them.

We did this in seventh grade. While the other side wasn't adamant flat-earthers, it still speak volumes to me that a seventh grader's reasoning ability is enough to throughly debunk such things.

[defaultdotxbe]

I went out clubbing the other night.

I got three baby seals.
so the ice wall must be guarded by seal-clubbing, penguin-eating canadians

its the only logical explanation for their lack of armed forces!!!!!!

[qarnos]

so the ice wall must be guarded by seal-clubbing, penguin-eating canadians

its the only logical explanation for their lack of armed forces!!!!!!

So we are looking for seal-clubbing penguin-eating Canadians with no arms?

Looks like we're on the next flight to Canadia.

[defaultdotxbe]

Looks like we're on the next flight to Canadia.
no, we cant trust the airlines, what with their "great circle" routes...who do they think theyre fooling?

[c4ts]

ive been searching the web looking for any evidence to defend the "flat earth" position, but have come up short

is there even any pseudoscience to this or is it all just 100% faith-based nuttery?

Flat Earth society claims it isn't religious at all. They even support the statement with Bible quotes.

[skepticism]

The moon landing hoax shows the earth is flat. Just look at the flag in those pictures on the moon, the shadows don't match. The flag is flying as if a wind is blowing it.

Russia was into all kinds of pseudoscience, growing wheat in Siberia, telepathy, bending spoons, so naturally they were into space, among other things.

America was worried, it needed to pump up its science reputation, so it staged a moon landing. Round earth believers fell for it.

The Flat Earth map is right there on the United Nations flag, with the north pole as the center.

Ask anyone why they think the earth is round. They only use authoritarian arguments, they don't think. They just repeat the dogmas taught in our schools, and follow perceived experts.

Liberty of thought began in the Enlightenment, when people stopped obeying religion and government. Today, we've let a new Authority control our beliefs: experts, academics, universities, scientists. At best we just repeat, by rote a few arguments we've heard the experts say, but no one thinks anymore. Any dissent is an automatic target for ridicule.

We're into a group mind, checking to make sure we believe what is popularly accepted, before expressing any view. Thought control has gone beyond anything priests or kings hoped for. skepticism is reserved for any dissenting view. We have an official authorized version of facts and theories. That's the purpose of uniform education, teaching the official version.

If the world were flat, no one today would realize it. If you did realize it, you'd be afraid to admit your true beliefs. You'd join in with round earthers and pretend you too thought the flat earthers were ridiculous.

They had a psychology experiment like that. A student was the test guinea pig, and all the other students were the shills. They'd put lines on the board, and they'd vote on which was longer. All the shills would vote for the opposite of what was really on the board. The guinea pig student would be afraid to express his views, he didn't want to be different.

That's how Nazi movements grow. The Science Authority today has Nazi-like tendencies. It makes us all feel good to be part of the group that ridicules the outsider, makes us feel superior.

We make sure our language is politically correct, our ideas socially acceptable, our science in line with whatever is academically respectable. We don't think anymore. That's too hard.

[uk_dave]

I'm much more optimistic than you.

I think the ability for discovery of knowledge is greater today than it's ever been, simply because of changes in the mass media and internet.

Of course there is a lot of dross out there, but because of this we should be producing a new generation of critical thinkers who can seperate out the dross from the facts, or at least know how to go about finding the facts.

20 or 30 years ago how many countries had tv channels devoted to science or history?

How many school kids 20 years ago could access up to date information on a huge range of subjects at a moments notice?

For sure, the internet is responsible for crap such as loose change, and for giving psychos such as alex jones a platform from which to spout their nonsense, but it also produces the 'guide to loose change' and 'screwloosechange'. The truth really is out there. All we need is for people to know that it is their preconceptions which sometimes prevents them from knowing the truth.

[Redtail]

I just want to know how the Canadians got the penguins.:confused:

[maccy]

They had a psychology experiment like that. A student was the test guinea pig, and all the other students were the shills. They'd put lines on the board, and they'd vote on which was longer. All the shills would vote for the opposite of what was really on the board. The guinea pig student would be afraid to express his views, he didn't want to be different.

The describes conspiracy theory based movements very well to me.

The principles of science require validation through a community attempting to disprove them. The roundness of the earth is easily demonstrated from first principles. Later on, of course it's been observed from space many times. Plus satelites rely on the fact that they are orbiting a round planet.

Interesting links

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eratosthenes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_geodesy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geodesy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth
http://www.timelinescience.org/resource/students/flat/flat.htm

[Redtail]

The moon landing hoax shows the earth is flat. Just look at the flag in those pictures on the moon, the shadows don't match. The flag is flying as if a wind is blowing it.

So the Earth is flat and the rest of the planets are spherical?

You're right that the flag is flying as if the wind was blowing though.

[defaultdotxbe]

Ask anyone why they think the earth is round. They only use authoritarian arguments, they don't think. They just repeat the dogmas taught in our schools, and follow perceived experts.
persoanlly i like to point out the fact that withthe "popular" flat earth model, the sun would never dip below the horizon, and yet it does

other flat earth models that do put the sun below the horizon cant account for how it is always daytime somewhere, or account for how the sun moves acoss the world

so much for authoritarian arguments

[chacal]

How can someone who is intelligent enough to produce whole sentences actually think that the earth is flat? This is quite interesting in psychological point of view. Or mayby he's just kidding...?

mr skepticism could you elaborate on your beliefs some more please.

[Bell]

Skeptfacism is a troll, let's not feed it.

[defaultdotxbe]

Skeptfacism is a troll, let's not feed it.
:( you never let us have any fun

[TjW]

I just want to know how the Canadians got the penguins.:confused:

Put salt on their tails, of course.

[Bell]

:( you never let us have any fun

Sorry :(
Here you go, this make you happy again?

http://images.tribe.net/tribe/upload/photo/955/9c7/9559c70a-9f20-42bd-9c1e-96174d3cd725