william rodriguez

[bonavada]

Sorry for jumping into this thread so late and stirring up the dregs, but I noticed a lie Docker told which has gone uncontested:
Docker is citing this source (http://st12.startlogic.com/%7Exenonpup/underground/underground_explosions.htm).
The actuall quote was "I was thinking maybe a car fire was upstairs". This is a far cry from "He claims the kerosene was from a car fire".
Why do you so blatantly lie, Docker?


ditto

theories using mike pecararo's story as a pivot/crutch for CD in the WTC1 basement have been comprehensively debunked. i pointed this out with more detail on a previous page. (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=2031275#post2031275)

i ask docker now. can you explain why the firedoor was found where it was if CD "explosions" originated on that level or lower levels??

carefully selected quotes (and cynical misquotes like yours) from mike pecararos account of that day are widely used by other CT'ers when putting forward evidence of basement "bombs". however, to the contrary, after reading the whole of mike's story, what he recalls shows positive evidence that, almost certainly, the blast originated ABOVE the lower sub-levels (at level B or above). can you show i'm wrong?

i'm all ears


BV

[Crazy Chainsaw]

PS. I forgot to mention also that in fires hydraulic oil reservoirs are known to explode since they are filled with flammable hydraulic oil basically a ten weight petrol Oil, similar to kerosene.
The tanks are not designed to be pressurized, only to store the oil to work the mechanism.

[Arus808]

No bell, I just be bothered digging out accounts for a man I know has seen them.

translation: no bell, I am not going to do one iota of research since there are no sources to back my claims, so Im making them up as I go along.

[Docker]

For all the sick creeps in this forum who say Rodriguez is changing his story:

He turned down a massive sum off money from the victim compensation fund. Please bear that in mind before maligning this true hero.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

For all the sick creeps in this forum who say Rodriguez is changing his story:

He turned down a massive sum off money from the victim compensation fund. Please bear that in mind before maligning this true hero.

What bearing does his acceptance, or refusal, of compensation have on whether his story has changed or not? Blatant argumentum ad misericordiam.

[Docker]

What bearing does his acceptance, or refusal, of compensation have on whether his story has changed or not? Blatant argumentum ad misericordiam.

The suggestion has been he is after money and fame

[Pardalis]

Why do you call him a hero?

[gumboot]

Why do you call him a hero?


I believe he rescued a number of people from the buildings/elevators and risked his own life in the process.

-Gumboot

[Pardalis]

I believe he rescued a number of people from the buildings/elevators and risked his own life in the process.

-Gumboot

Then he is a hero. :)

Carry on.

[Docker]

I believe he rescued a number of people from the buildings/elevators and risked his own life in the process.

-Gumboot

Indeed. He was ordered to leave the building by his boss and he refused. Instead he climbed the towers helping fireman open doors and find people. He personally pushed 52 people out of the doors and remained until the tower collapsed. He was found under a truck. Bush declared him a national hero.

This is the man that some sick creeps in here have been accusing of lying to get fame and money.

Hang your heads in shame

[Pardalis]

Indeed. He was ordered to leave the building by his boss and he refused. Instead he climbed the towers helping fireman open doors and find people. He personally pushed 52 people out of the doors and remained until the tower collapsed. He was found under a truck. Bush declared him a national hero.

Trully impressive. (no sarcasm)

[gumboot]

This is the man that some sick creeps in here have been accusing of lying to get fame and money.


Well, I don't know about anyone else... but I'm merely saying his account of what he heard at the time of the first aircraft impact has changed.

Which it has.

-Gumboot

[Docker]

Well, I don't know about anyone else... but I'm merely saying his account of what he heard at the time of the first aircraft impact has changed.

Which it has.

-Gumboot

Fair enough but some people have insinuated more.

His first account was in a time of shock. This man has no motive to change story. He genuinely feels 9/11 is a cover up and refused millions because he refused to be silenced

[Gravy]

This is the man that some sick creeps in here have been accusing of lying to get fame and money.

Hang your heads in shameName one person who has made that accusation, or retract it.

Oh, and why do you constantly lie, Docker? Is it that you cannot, or will not, stop?

[Docker]

Gravy stop wasting your time. Your on ignore. Get used to the fact that while i'm here you don't control these forums. I will never be one of your stepfor wives style puppets.

[Gravy]

Gravy stop wasting your time. Your on ignore. Get used to the fact that while i'm here you don't control these forums. I will never be one of your stepfor wives style puppets.I guess 'Ignore" isn't working too well.

(Psst! I know when you're checking my posts, Docker. And it's "Stepford.")

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

The suggestion has been he is after money and fame

By whom? Link the post please.

[Redtail]

Gravy stop wasting your time. Your on ignore. Get used to the fact that while i'm here you don't control these forums. I will never be one of your stepfor wives style puppets.


What's with this hatred of Gravy? I mean it seems that if someone doesn't agree with your line of thinking, after a few post you start accusing them of getting all of their info from Gravy and such.

[Docker]

What's with this hatred of Gravy? I mean it seems that if someone doesn't agree with your line of thinking, after a few post you start accusing them of getting all of their info from Gravy and such.

I was told that was the case before I joined this forum. I don't hate gravy, I don't know the man. I just refuse to be bullied by him.

[Redtail]

I was told that was the case before I joined this forum. I don't hate gravy, I don't know the man. I just refuse to be bullied by him.

Ah.

[gumboot]

Fair enough but some people have insinuated more.

His first account was in a time of shock.


You keep making this claim. It wasn't.



This man has no motive to change story. He genuinely feels 9/11 is a cover up and refused millions because he refused to be silenced


Are you aware of "memory bias" and "false memory"?

If a person determines that a certain event happened a certain way, they will often subconsciously alter their memory of that event to better reflect their interpretation.

In other words, because he believes it was an inside job, it is highly likely he has subconsciously altered his memory of that event to include explosions when there were none.

This does not mean he is "evil" or "dishonest". He wouldn't even know that this has happened, and he would genuinely believe his current memory was ALWAYS his memory of the event.

This is a very well documented and established phenomenon.

Personally, I don't take his account of an explosion to bear much weight. What, to me, bears FAR MORE weight is his account of what he saw when he went to investigate that sound.

His account of the blown elevator, skin hanging off arms, white smoke, etc is completely in keeping with an explosion caused by ignited jet fuel which had poured down elevator shafts. It is NOT in keeping with a bomb (for example, a bomb capable of blowing elevator doors outwards, away from the elevator car, would obliterate all remains of anyone inside the elevator car, not leave survivors bearing flash burns).

-Gumboot

[Beleth]

The human ear is excellent at determining the direction of sound on the horizontal axis, but appalling at determining it on the vertical axis.
The evidence I have collected indicates otherwise.

What more would you have me say?

[osmosis]

The evidence I have collected indicates otherwise.

What more would you have me say?

Uhm, how about showing some of this "evidence"? Seems reasonable to me.

[Garb]

The evidence I have collected indicates otherwise.

What more would you have me say?

That is damning evidence, I must say.