Constantine, christianity and a vision

[Pauliesonne]

I was just curious what the consensus on this subject is from the viewpoint of people here who aren't christians?

[kellyb]

He was either insane, or his advisers figured out a plan to rule more effectively. Maybe a mix of both.
That's my take.

[The Atheist]

Definitely a cynical means of gaining spiritual superiority over the masses.

Worked well, still does.

[prewitt81]

It could also have been propaganda. Constantine's mother Helena was Christian so he was at the very least sympathetic to the religion, and possibly a believer at the time of the "vision".

[Agammamon]

Great movie - 1/2of it spent staring down Rachel Weisz' shirt, other 1/2 fighting demons.

[fuelair]

Great movie - 1/2of it spent staring down Rachel Weisz' shirt, other 1/2 fighting demons.

Definitely my kind of response to a serious (?) religious/historical thread!!!!!:D :D :)

[kurious_kathy]

I was just curious what the consensus on this subject is from the viewpoint of people here who aren't christians?
And why aren't Christians invited to respond to this thread? Seems a bit prejudice in my opinion.

I myself think Constatine is in big trouble for calling himself a Christian, I really do not believe he was and the church got really messed up becasue of him. This is of course just my humble opinion, only God knows a persons heart.

But then again we can judge someone by their actions and anytime someone kills in the name of God I have a problem with it. Yes in the OT they did it, but Jesus taught us to turn the other cheek and pray for our enemies, not kill or be killed. This whole world has been sin sick from the beginning and only Jesus can turn it around. I guess I just can't wait for heaven myself.

[RandFan]

...but Jesus taught us to turn the other cheek and pray for our enemies...Yes, he also taught his followers to be kind to slaves. I guess Jesus didn't get the memo that owning another human being was immoral.

[RandFan]

I guess I just can't wait for heaven myself.That's just too easy. :cool:

[qayak]

But then again we can judge someone by their actions and anytime someone kills in the name of God I have a problem with it.

BS! People kill in the name of god every freakin' day and you don't do a god damned thing except preach to us about how great the myth is.

[Paulhoff]

And why aren't Christians invited to respond to this thread? Seems a bit prejudice in my opinion.
Because they don’t what a delusion view on the subject, it is simple to understand, don't you.

Paul

:) :) :)

[l0rca]

Yes, he also taught his followers to be kind to slaves. I guess Jesus didn't get the memo that owning another human being was immoral.

Actually, although Kathy probably doesn't know this, "turning the other cheek" was a Jewish gesture of sarcasm. To turn the other cheek was to consider a person unintelligent, and one who would easily resort to violence. Sort of like raising your chin to gesture you are above an altercation or fight.

I don't see anything wrong with Kathy's approach. I think it closely represents the most intelligent opinion a Catholic could have on the subject.

[Paulhoff]

You must be new to KK.

Paul

:) :) :)

[Foster Zygote]

I was just curious what the consensus on this subject is from the viewpoint of people here who aren't christians?

I think that Constantine was looking for a religion that could give his empire greater unity. His 'vision' was a political device.

[l0rca]

You must be new to KK.

Paul

:) :) :)

I know she can be very dense an unbending. But her opinion on this is still intelligent, given her religion. Sort of like how Bobby Fisher owns at chess, but hates Jews.

[Foster Zygote]

And why aren't Christians invited to respond to this thread? Seems a bit prejudice in my opinion.

Your melodramatics are unwarranted. At no point in the OP does Pauliesonne state that Christians are not welcome to respond. He only states that he is interested in the views of non-Christians regarding the subject. Might I suggest that you owe him an apology for implying that he has shown prejudice?

[Foster Zygote]

I know she can be very dense an unbending. But her opinion on this is still intelligent, given her religion. Sort of like how Bobby Fisher owns at chess, but hates Jews.

:D

Or how Henry Ford was a mechanical genius but, errrrm... hated Jews.

[joobz]

I myself think Constatine is in big trouble for calling himself a Christian, I really do not believe he was and the church got really messed up becasue of him.

As a person of greek orthodox origin, I'd say the "church" got really messed up when it started using statues and other false idols. remember, 2D dipictions = acceptable, 3D = false idol.

When will people ever learn:rolleyes:

[Paulhoff]

But her opinion on this is still intelligent, given her religion.
Well I must say, you sure see something that I don't. She is just dogmatic and can't see that she is her own worst enemy by being delusional about her idea on a so-called god.

Paul

:) :) :)

[Paulhoff]

:D

Or how Henry Ford was a mechanical genius but, errrrm... hated Jews.
You do know that his first car was to big for the door in the garage and he had to knock out the doors side walls the get it out.

Paul

:) :) :)

The jew hating started later in his life, or at least started to show.

[RandFan]

I'm with Paul on this one. I'm not familiar with anything intelligent that she has said. AT best she fairly accurately regurgitates typical Christian dogma and propaganda. Sadly her repertoire is very shallow. She has not read more than a few pamphlets or listened to more than a few sermons. I doubt very much that she has read the bible and could answer anything beyond rudimentary questions. She so far has demonstrated that she is incapable of any in depth discussion.

I have zero respect for her and that has nothing to do with her religion. I do know Christians who have taken the time to learn and understand their religion and have read the bible and are capable of intelligent discussion. Kathy is not one of those.

[The Atheist]

I guess I just can't wait for heaven myself.

Yeah, I agree, the world's a terrible place. To be expected since Satan owns it, so do yourself a favour and go to heaven immediately.

I often wonder why people like you just don't jump off the nearest 20-storey building and go to heaven without having to wait until you die of natural causes.

Do not advocate suicide. It is against forum rules.

[The Atheist]

I don't see anything wrong with Kathy's approach. I think it closely represents the most intelligent opinion a Catholic could have on the subject.
Eh? Do you know any catholics?

Kathy's babble is straight out of fundy bible-school, nothing to do with catholicism.

[The Atheist]

But her opinion on this is still intelligent, given her religion.:dl:

Sort of like how Bobby Fisher owns at chess, but hates Jews.Or, maybe nothing at all like that, his mum's Jewish. (http://www.chessmaniac.com/Bobby_Fischer/Bobby_Fischer_Articles29.shtm)

[The Atheist]

As a person of greek orthodox origin, I'd say the "church" got really messed up when it started using statues and other false idols. remember, 2D dipictions = acceptable, 3D = false idol.

When will people ever learn:rolleyes:Psssh!

The church got messed up at the first three words of the bible.

[l0rca]

Or, maybe nothing at all like that, his mum's Jewish.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Fisher#Radio_interview_after_the_September_1 1.2C_2001_attacks

pwned?

http://forums.randi.org/images/smilies/doglaugh.gif

I'm with Paul on this one. I'm not familiar with anything intelligent that she has said. AT best she fairly accurately regurgitates typical Christian dogma and propaganda. Sadly her repertoire is very shallow. She has not read more than a few pamphlets or listened to more than a few sermons. I doubt very much that she has read the bible and could answer anything beyond rudimentary questions. She so far has demonstrated that she is incapable of any in depth discussion.

I'm talking about her regurgitation. It's the response I would expect from the Catholic church on the issue. She's ashamed of Constantine's violence, and prays for a world without violence. In this issue, it is about as intelligent as it gets for a Christian, no?

[The Atheist]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Fisher#Radio_interview_after_the_September_1 1.2C_2001_attacks

pwned?Ah, not at all, I'm well aware that he's strongly anti-semitic. The point was that comparing him to KK was dumb for that reason. You just don't get it do you? Jesus, the link I gave you even mentions his anti-semitism! DUH!
I'm talking about her regurgitation. It's the response I would expect from the Catholic church on the issue. She's ashamed of Constantine's violence, and prays for a world without violence. In this issue, it is about as intelligent as it gets for a Christian, no?Wrong again, catholics are quite different to Kathy.

Like to try that post again?

[l0rca]

Ah, not at all, I'm well aware that he's strongly anti-semitic. The point was that comparing him to KK was dumb for that reason. You just don't get it do you? Jesus, the link I gave you even mentions his anti-semitism! DUH!

Your post had no indication that you readily knew this. You said Bobby Fisher and KK had no likeness at all, and in the same sentence, mentioned his mother was Jewish, seemingly for evidence that he wasn't anti-semetic. I thought your article was just a recount of this fact, which anyone could make the mistake of by just reading your sloppy reply.

I challenge anyone on this thread who's been following this argument to truthfully claim that after reading your reply to mine, but not following the link, they knew what you meant, despite the terrible wording and no indication.

In fact I don't even know why you mentioned his mother was Jewish. It almost seems like you didn't read the article yourself, and just lucked out.


Wrong again, catholics are quite different to Kathy.

That's a cute opinion, but it's not an argument. More huffing, please.


Like to try that post again?

Ow, "ZING!" right? A big zinger! Nice one.

[The Atheist]

In fact I don't even know why you mentioned his mother was Jewish. It almost seems like you didn't read the article yourself, and just lucked out. Well, double DUH!

I mentioned it because almost every other anti-semite has no Jewish blood. Being a rabid anti-semite means that he's offering hate opinions against his own mother and her family. You don't find that unusual?

I don't usually find the need to explain myself so fully, but hey, there are all levels of comprehension represented here.

[l0rca]

I know. The best one was Randy's. So I argued myself on that.