Insane Debate

[pomeroo]

If your blood pressure is under control and you have a strong stomach, check out what passes for debate on 911researchers.com (go back four or five pages). These are the depths to which the fantasy movement has sunk. I see it with own eyes and I am amazed. Amazed and deeply saddened.

http://911researchers.com/node/19#comment-189

[The Doc]

Wow... just wow.

I honestly just lost all faith in humanity.

[T.A.M.]

Ron:

They seem to have great affection and admiration for you...lol.

As I said to you before, these guys are actually scary. In particualr this Peggy, and Fred. these two, I think if pushed, would be the ones we'd be reading about in the morning paper. Peggy seems a push or two away from launching her own attacks on someone...her anger is pallatable.

I think you annoy them so much because they cannot rattle you. they cannot provoke you to anger, and that must gaul them.

I think they are also angry with you because you keep throwing the obvious, but to them painful, truth back at them...that despite 5 years of research, they have essentially not one grain of solid proof on any of their theories.

Sad really...just sad.

TAM

[pomeroo]

But, TAM, the truth is, they HAVE angered me. I can't remain cool in the face of such aggressively stupid, paranoid, vicious moral idiocy.

[T.A.M.]

Fair enough, then I guess it is the way you control and exhibit your anger. You don't simply "Fly off the handle" which is what they want. Your coolness even in dealing with this utmost frustration...frustrates them IMO.

TAM

[Bell]

I really can't push myself to reading all that deniers bullsh!t...

But this remark, from page 2, caught my attention:

I thought so.

btw, Judy Wood has NEVER said that the weapons must have originated from outer space

Stooped Pomeroo! Everybody knows that those all destructing death beams are airborne and carried on sekrit gubmint holographic airplanes.

[LashL]

If your blood pressure is under control and you have a strong stomach, check out what passes for debate on 911researchers.com (go back four or five pages). These are the depths to which the fantasy movement has sunk. I see it with own eyes and I am amazed. Amazed and deeply saddened.

http://911researchers.com/node/19#comment-189

Unbelievable. I truly did not think that it was possible for people to be so incredibly misguided, woefully misinformed, pitiably inadequate, inexplicably hostile, morally vacuous, and outrageously stupid, and still be able to breathe, but Peggy and Fred have proven otherwise.

[jhunter1163]

That "debate" underwhelmed my lowest expectations.

[ConspiRaider]

But, TAM, the truth is, they HAVE angered me. I can't remain cool in the face of such aggressively stupid, paranoid, vicious moral idiocy.
Good responses over there, Ron, as usual.

But of course it will have no effect upon them, and will serve only to frustrate you.

I spent a solid year on another board, more than 3,000 posts, attempting to thwart the output of misfiring synapses concerning all things 9/11. Many different paths of reason attempted I, from common sense to hypotheticals to hardcore evidence to witness testimony to forensics interviews to audio recordings to personal experience and so forth. Nothing works, I am sure of that now.

Make them come to us. Anytime a new theory is proposed, it has to run a withering gauntlet in the world of science. And that is what happens here. You almost feel sorry for 'em, watching how easily they are busted up at the JREF forum.

Kind of neat how if you leave them alone in their little cozy sanctums - they self-destruct eventually. Scholars and Loosers are great examples. They HAVE TO self-destruct. Super-inflated egos drive the twoofers, and once they start colliding...

[Pardalis]

But, TAM, the truth is, they HAVE angered me. I can't remain cool in the face of such aggressively stupid, paranoid, vicious moral idiocy.

You shouldn't let them upset you, they're not worth it. You should take a break from these nuts and enjoy the New Year. :)

[NickUK]

To quote you yourself, Ron:

Jee-sus H. Christ

Every time,,,and I mean EVERY HORSE-[RULE8]ING TIME I think that I've seen a zeitgeist in the era of truther idiocy, another thread pops up.

I honestly *literally* believe that there are a sizeable portion of truthers that will believe and argue ANYTHING in favour of their fantasy.

[Loss Leader]

I can't take the numerologists. I can take almost anything else - dental technicians with space lasers, discredited mormon physicists, anything - but I cannot take the numerologists.

[Pardalis]

Numerologists and solipsists are the worst.

[JimBenArm]

I can't take the numerologists. I can take almost anything else - dental technicians with space lasers, discredited mormon physicists, anything - but I cannot take the numerologists.

Sounds like Blazing Saddles;

"OK, the n*****s can stay. But we don't want the Irish!"

[Kiwiwriter]

I can't take the numerologists. I can take almost anything else - dental technicians with space lasers, discredited mormon physicists, anything - but I cannot take the numerologists.

I remember a nutter who used to hang around outside the library at NYU peddling a tract, that used 8-point type and study of the Jewish Kabbalah to prove that since the 1981 World Series was a statistical reverse of the 1978 World Series, the numerology in it proved the Messiah was coming.

I mentioned that to Lou Piniella two years later, when I was covering the Yankees for United Press, and he asked for a copy of the flier. I didn't have one. Too bad. He couldn't believe his ears.

I got no use for them, either. I remember hearing that some Satan-worshippers went down to the 18th Street station of the New York Subway's East Side line, which was abandoned in 1945, to hold rituals. Why? 6+6+6 is 18, and 666 is the "number of the beast."

I said that if the Transit Cops raided the ritual, they'd have to hold the whole crew, including sacrificial rabbit and sacrificial virgin, for not paying their fare. Half price for rabbits, I think.

And a pal of mine pointed out that this proved the New York Subway was run like h*** and going to the Devil!

[ConspiRaider]

Sounds like Blazing Saddles;

"OK, the n*****s can stay. But we don't want the Irish!"
"My name is Jim, but most folks call me ... Jim."

[Firestone]

I have a question about this reaction (http://911researchers.com/node/19#comment-201): Mr Wieck, do you sleep with the light on?Is this a threat, or is this some innocent English expression I just don't know?

[quixotecoyote]

In that context it is a threat. It can be used to suggest someone is paranoid, but here it is a threat.

[Firestone]

In that context it is a threat. It can be used to suggest someone is paranoid, but here it is a threat.Thanks.

So they not only utter incredibly insane theories, they also threaten people like Ron Wieck because they bring sanity and facts to the debate.

Some researchers! :rolleyes:

And respect for Ron Wieck and others for confronting them in the open!

[troy in wv]

Is it against the law to murder these dingbats?

[njslim]

Is it against the law to murder these dingbats?

Only if you get caught - hide the bodies well!

[T.A.M.]

Shag that. I say sentence them to an eternity of explaining themselves to Alice Hoglan and other family members of flight 93 Heroes.

TAM:)

[JimBenArm]

"My name is Jim, but most folks call me ... Jim."

"More beans, Mr. Tagert?"

"I think you boys have had enough!"

I love this movie!

[troy in wv]

Is it against the law to murder these dingbats?

Only if you get caught - hide the bodies well!


If there weren't consequences I'd do it. I don't know how you folks can go to Ground Zero and restrain yourself from shattering someone's nose and cheek bones.

[delphi_ote]

Shag that. I say sentence them to an eternity of explaining themselves to Alice Hoglan and other family members of flight 93 Heroes.
Only if we give the family members ear plugs and baseball bats.

[SirPhilip]

Good responses over there, Ron, as usual.
Make them come to us. Anytime a new theory is proposed, it has to run a withering gauntlet in the world of science. And that is what happens here. You almost feel sorry for 'em, watching how easily they are busted up at the JREF forum. Fah. I was "busted up" on this forum for just suggesting Bush behaved in an unethical or deceptive manner (lack of criminally implicating evidence) and, facing a volume of words comparable to a Robert Jordan novel in the form of reductions and rationalizations, I had to admit some giants of unbiased discourse exist here. But seriously, the only scientific thing about politics is: If you have dubious people in office, dubious behavior follows, as do dubious motives about what they are doing. Bush is either profoundly in denial, or profoundly morally insane. Or both. Simple incompetence doesn't justify it.

[Pardalis]

http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php?p=1763746&postcount=51

Keep in mind that I'm a card-carrying Republican who voted Bush in the second time

[ConspiRaider]

Fah. I was "busted up" on this forum for just suggesting Bush behaved in an unethical or deceptive manner (lack of criminally implicating evidence) and, facing a volume of words comparable to a Robert Jordan novel in the form of reductions and rationalizations, I had to admit some giants of unbiased discourse exist here. But seriously, the only scientific thing about politics is: If you have dubious people in office, dubious behavior follows, as do dubious motives about what they are doing. Bush is either profoundly in denial, or profoundly morally insane. Or both. Simple incompetence doesn't justify it.
There are many subjective elements to the 9/11 events, all of which can support a broad spectrum of hypotheses and speculations. I don't think any serious member here at JREF would deny that. It's the absurd leaps of "logic" promulgated by the conspiracy theorists that get slam-dunked in this particular forum. The ones that are apolitical. Those claims which violate the tenets of common sense, natural law, human interactions, event logistics and current technology.

It's one thing to say that Bush is a moron with dubious motives. Quite another to insist that non-existent beam weapons pulverized the WTC complex, or that the planes were holograms, or that Flight 77 did not hit the Pentagon, or that Flight 93 never crashed in Pennsylvania.

[ConspiRaider]

"More beans, Mr. Tagert?"

"I think you boys have had enough!"

I love this movie!
"What did you expect? Welcome sonny? Make yourself at home? Marry my daughter? You gotta remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know - morons."

[pomeroo]

"Right now, even as we speak, Louis Pasteur over in France has developed a vaccine for smallpox, cowpox, and anthrax..."

"Never mind that sh-t: Here comes Mongo!"

[pomeroo]

These people can't be real. How would they feed themselves or cross a street without getting killed?



Does Ronald Wieck Worship Josef Gobbels ? (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-202)
Submitted by Fred on Sun, 2006-12-31 06:48.
We should get you a brown shirt and some jackboots to go along with your BIG LIE.




according to the documentation on (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-201)
Submitted by CB_Brooklyn on Sun, 2006-12-31 06:47.
wtc.nist.gov,
the North Tower collapsed in 11 seconds, and the South Tower in 9 seconds.
Freefall in a vacuum would be 9.22 seconds.
Therefore, in the atmosphere, both Towers collapsed at *faster* than freefall speed.
Silverstein said "er, fire commander". "Er" meaning he knew the person by a different title. No one claims that the FDNY blows up buildings. Controlled Demolitions Inc is on record as saying that "pull it" means "pull down". And we know that pull down means to bring down in a controlled demolition. It doesn't really matter though.. anyone with a brain can tell WTC 7 was a controlled demolition just by watching the video.
Mr Wieck, do you sleep with the light on?



What "We" Know (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-205)
Submitted by Ronald Wieck on Sun, 2006-12-31 18:07.
Yes, "we" know something that everyone in the demolition industry does not know. But, "we" are irrational morons whose beliefs are unfalsifiable. "We" know many things about branches of science that "we" have never studied, things that real scientists say are untrue. "We" haven't the slightest idea of what possible use the bringing down of WTC 7 could be to the Impossibly Vast Conspiracy. "We" believe that Islamic fundamentalism does not exist, that it is no factor at all in shaping the world. "We" are the dumbest, blindest, most ignorant jackasses alive.

[ConspiRaider]

"Right now, even as we speak, Louis Pasteur over in France has developed a vaccine for smallpox, cowpox, and anthrax..."

"Never mind that sh-t: Here comes Mongo!"
“I want rustlers, cutthroats, murderers, bounty hunters, desperados, mugs, pugs, thugs, nitwits, half-wits, dimwits, vipers, snipers, conmen, Indian agents, Mexican bandits, muggers, buggerers, bushwackers, hornswagglers, horse thieves, bull dykes, train robbers, bank robbers, a**kickers, s**tkickers, and METHODISTS!”

[Loss Leader]

"The little bastard shot me in the @ss!"

[SirPhilip]

http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php?p=1763746&postcount=51 Your point?

[SirPhilip]

There are many subjective elements to the 9/11 events, all of which can support a broad spectrum of hypotheses and speculations. I don't think any serious member here at JREF would deny that. It's the absurd leaps of "logic" promulgated by the conspiracy theorists that get slam-dunked in this particular forum. The ones that are apolitical. Those claims which violate the tenets of common sense, natural law, human interactions, event logistics and current technology.

Well stated. No disagreement.


It's one thing to say that Bush is a moron with dubious motives. Quite another to insist that non-existent beam weapons pulverized the WTC complex, or that the planes were holograms, or that Flight 77 did not hit the Pentagon, or that Flight 93 never crashed in Pennsylvania. That's just out-of-the-ballpark paranoia that's not even worth discussing. Then again, I can't imagine a more ripe time to invent and sell silly theories about people who pull strings on Capital Hill.

[ConspiRaider]

"The little bastard shot me in the @ss!"
"Friggin' thing is warped! How come I always get a warped one?!?"

[JimBenArm]

"Friggin' thing is warped! How come I always get a warped one?!?"

"I didn't get a 'harumph' out of him!"

"Give the Governor a 'harumph'"

"Harumph!"

"You better watch your ass!"

[Loss Leader]

"Friggin' thing is warped! How come I always get a warped one?!?"

"Give these out to the men ... in lieu of pay."

[Kage]

Does Ronald Wieck Worship Josef Gobbels ? (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-202)
Submitted by Fred on Sun, 2006-12-31 06:48.
We should get you a brown shirt and some jackboots to go along with your BIG LIE.



Another perfect example of Godwin's Law, which states, "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of someone invoking hitler approaches 1."

[eddyk]

Why was 'troy_in_wv' banned may I ask?

[ConspiRaider]

"Give these out to the men ... in lieu of pay."
"Gentlemen! Gentlemen! This bill will be a giant step forward in the treatment of the insane gambler! Thank you, thank you, thank you Hedy!"

"That's Hedley! Hedley Lemarr!"

"What are you worried about? This is 1874 - you'll be able to sue HER!"

[Loss Leader]

"It's alright, Taggart. It's just a man and his horse ... being hung."

[Horatius]

Why was 'troy_in_wv' banned may I ask?


troy in wv has been banned for breaches of his/her Membership Agreement and for threatening another Member via PM. The content of the posts and PM have been removed from public view but a copy has been kept.

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=2218155#post2218155

[ConspiRaider]

"(I'm not used to public speaking) ... WE, THE WHITE, God-fearing citizens of Rock Ridge wish to express our extreme displeasure with your choice of sheriff! Please remove him immediately! The fact that you have sent him here, just goes to prove that you are the leading a**hole in the state!"

[Brainache]

"He rode a blazing saddle
He wore a shining star
His job to offer battle
To bad men near and far....

He conquered fear and he conquered hate
He turned dark night into day
He made his blazing saddle
A torch to light the way..."

[njslim]

Is it true what they say about you people? <zipper being unzipped>

ITS TRUE! ITS TRUE!

[Dave_46]

What cracks me up about that film is the first time you see Hedley Lamarr's office, on the wall is a picture of a bride and groom. Back view. Totally irrelevant to anything else, but I find it funny.

Dave

[kitakaze]

(snip) Peggy seems a push or two away from launching her own attacks on someone...her anger is pallatable.(snip)I usually stay out of these threads as 'truthers' make me feel icky but I couldn't help a little friendly linguistic nit-pick. I think you meant to say Peggy's anger is palpable. Pallatable would be to say you could eat her anger as opposed to feeling it very vividly.
Oh look! A box! :boxedin:

[Loss Leader]

"Not in the face!"

[T.A.M.]

I usually stay out of these threads as 'truthers' make me feel icky but I couldn't help a little friendly linguistic nit-pick. I think you meant to say Peggy's anger is palpable. Pallatable would be to say you could eat her anger as opposed to feeling it very vividly.
Oh look! A box! :boxedin:

Kitakaze:

Thank you. The word I was looking for was one to express that you could almost taste here anger, but Palatable does not seem to indicate that either, so palpable, meaning you could almost feel it physically, will have to do.

according to Dictionary, Pallatable would mean here anger was tasty, or delicious, which it was not...lol

TAM:)

[Grundar]

"Drive me off this picture."

[ConspiRaider]

"No thank you! Fifteen is my limit on schnitzengruebens!"

"Baby! I am not from Havana!"

"You are making a German spectacle of yourself! Auf Wiedersehen, baby..."

[kitakaze]

Kitakaze:

Thank you. The word I was looking for was one to express that you could almost taste here anger, but Palatable does not seem to indicate that either, so palpable, meaning you could almost feel it physically, will have to do.

according to Dictionary, Pallatable would mean here anger was tasty, or delicious, which it was not...lol

TAM:)Ho ho! Touche! And now I understand pallatable better, thanks to you. If you do find an appropriate adjective I'd love to hear it. I thought of acrid but that's not quite right either.

[delphi_ote]

So we're making Blazing Saddles references now? How about random Space Balls references?

[njslim]

So we're making Blazing Saddles references now? How about random Space Balls references?

Ludicrous speed anyone?

[Horatius]

So we're making Blazing Saddles references now? How about random Space Balls references?

I'll comb the desert for some (http://img469.imageshack.us/img469/6549/spaceballscap11nd.jpg)....

[kitakaze]

So we're making Blazing Saddles references now? How about random Space Balls references?Dink dink... dink dink dink dink dink dink... Oh wait... May duh shwartz be vit chu!

[ConspiRaider]

"Excuse me while I whip this out!"

[pomeroo]

Forgive me for returning to the topic of the thread. Here the debate rests:

Of course Wieck dismisses (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-210)
Submitted by CB_Brooklyn on Mon, 2007-01-01 04:51.
Of course Wieck dismisses the Illuminati and numerology with a simple wave of the hand. He can't handle the idea that they're both very real. Hell, he's so brainwashed he thinks all those 9/11s are coincidences!

[delphi_ote]

I'll comb the desert for some (http://img469.imageshack.us/img469/6549/spaceballscap11nd.jpg)....
Ugh... you ******** have no class. We were supposed to be discussing the lunatic ramblings over at 911Researchers.com, not bad comedy movies!

How many ******** we got in this thread anyhow?

[ConspiRaider]

Forgive me for returning to the topic of the thread. Here the debate rests:

Of course Wieck dismisses (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-210)
Submitted by CB_Brooklyn on Mon, 2007-01-01 04:51.
Of course Wieck dismisses the Illuminati and numerology with a simple wave of the hand. He can't handle the idea that they're both very real. Hell, he's so brainwashed he thinks all those 9/11s are coincidences!
Good stuff, Ron.

Numerology = It's in the numbers, man, they control everything, there's nothing you can do about it.

Illuminati = They run the whole planet, man, they control everything, there's nothing you can do about it.

Numerology + Illuminati + Rothschilds + Jooos + Bush + Banks + New World Order + Cheney + Embedded Code + Rumsfeld + Beam Weapons + PNAC + Northwoods + Condi + Peak Oil + NORAD = Why Have A Life When There's Like No Way To Beat These Guys Like EVER!

[T.A.M.]

Forgive me for returning to the topic of the thread. Here the debate rests:

Of course Wieck dismisses (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-210)
Submitted by CB_Brooklyn on Mon, 2007-01-01 04:51.
Of course Wieck dismisses the Illuminati and numerology with a simple wave of the hand. He can't handle the idea that they're both very real. Hell, he's so brainwashed he thinks all those 9/11s are coincidences!

And in here lies the reason why we will NEVER convince these nut jobs that 9/11 happened as it did, via 19 Arab Hijackers. oh yah, numerology, astrology, psychics. Keep it up folks, and you will make our jobs 1000 times easier.

TAM:)

[Horatius]

Forgive me for returning to the topic of the thread. Here the debate rests:

Of course Wieck dismisses (http://www.911researchers.com/node/19#comment-210)
Submitted by CB_Brooklyn on Mon, 2007-01-01 04:51.
Of course Wieck dismisses the Illuminati and numerology with a simple wave of the hand. He can't handle the idea that they're both very real. Hell, he's so brainwashed he thinks all those 9/11s are coincidences!

The real killer is that he posted that just after this:

Wieck knows he's too ignorant to understand basic scientific principals.

Wieck knows he must side with the government because the alternative scares him.

Wieck does NOT know that he's lacking in simple common sense.


So numerology is basic science now? Did I miss a memo?

[T.A.M.]

I have noticed that they are really insulting over there. It seems the more rational you are with them, the more angry they get. I think if Ron actually went over there and started screaming and yelling, cussing and the lot, they would probably treat him more kind.

NUTS

TAM

[pomeroo]

You know, TAM, they sort of made their point. I have to throw in the towel in that nuthouse. I know when I'm licked.

Now, for the debate at 911blogger.com...WHEE, DOWGIE!

[pomeroo]

Sorry, I forgot to provide a link. You want comedy, here's comedy:

http://www.911blogger.com/node/5327#comment

[JimBenArm]

So we're making Blazing Saddles references now? How about random Space Balls references?

"Thank you for pressing the self-destruct button"

[Poetry Hound]

Keep up the good work, Ron. The 911blogger forum is very much like the debates under the 911 videos on YouTube, where there's a lot of traffic and unfortunately a lot of naive people to read the CT posts and become influenced by the CT idiocy. I believe in "debating" the CTers so that naive readers can see the debunking.

[jhunter1163]

"Never underestimate the power of the Schwartz!"

[Ducky]

I'm reading the link (in the OP) thinking to myself:

"I don't own enough deodorant to read this load of s***."

[ConspiRaider]

"You'd do it for Randolph Scott!"

RAN-DOLPH SCOTT!

[Polaris]

So we're making Blazing Saddles references now? How about random Space Balls references?

Ludicrous speed anyone?

In the case of Alex Jones, I'd prefer:

"Ohhhhhhhhh, oh, ohhhhh, Ahhhh ahhh ahhh, Owwwww!"

[T.A.M.]

Keep up the good work, Ron. The 911blogger forum is very much like the debates under the 911 videos on YouTube, where there's a lot of traffic and unfortunately a lot of naive people to read the CT posts and become influenced by the CT idiocy. I believe in "debating" the CTers so that naive readers can see the debunking.

Welcome, Poetry Hound, to the Forum. I can only promise rational debating on our side of the debates here, but you will get lots of debate if you want it...lol

TAM

[JimBenArm]

Ugh... you ******** have no class. We were supposed to be discussing the lunatic ramblings over at 911Researchers.com, not bad comedy movies!

How many ******** we got in this thread anyhow?

How many do you want? I can get as many as you'd like.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Ugh... you ******** have no class. We were supposed to be discussing the lunatic ramblings over at 911Researchers.com, not bad comedy movies!

How many ******** we got in this thread anyhow?

Did I hear my name called?

"Oh, no! They've gone Plaid!"

:cool:

[njslim]

Ugh... you ******** have no class. We were supposed to be discussing the lunatic ramblings over at 911Researchers.com, not bad comedy movies!

How many ******** we got in this thread anyhow?

Excuse me while I whip this out!

[JimBenArm]

Ugh... you ******** have no class. We were supposed to be discussing the lunatic ramblings over at 911Researchers.com, not bad comedy movies!

How many ******** we got in this thread anyhow?

Excuse me while I whip this out!

Oh, lawdy, do what he say! Do what he say!

[Regnad Kcin]

As chairman of the Welcoming Committee, it is my privilege to extend a laurel and hearty handshake to our new...

[JimBenArm]

As chairman of the Welcoming Committee, it is my privilege to extend a laurel and hearty handshake to our new...

Noticed where you're posting from. I think you mean the Same Old Place. It's right out back. Here's the key. (#clink#)

[ConspiRaider]

Ohh! A wed wose! How womantic!

[NoZed Avenger]

Shag that. I say sentence them to an eternity of explaining themselves to Alice Hoglan and other family members of flight 93 Heroes.


But who is really being punished in that scenario, and what have the families done to deserve it?!

Marylin's punishment."]







Oh, and (not directed at you, TAM) please all no talk about hurting people in anything approaching the general vicinity of the nearest neighbor to a real way. It does not help the (sane) position and certainly doesn't help the JREF.

[T.A.M.]

Oh, and (not directed at you, TAM) please all no talk about hurting people in anything approaching the general vicinity of the nearest neighbor to a real way. It does not help the (sane) position and certainly doesn't help the JREF.

Agreed.

TAM

[A W Smith]

edit; wrong thread

[Kage]

Numerology can be seen as baisic scientific principles, provided you forget to read the Harry Potter books as fiction