John McCain speaking at creationist event (Discovery Institute)

[Questioninggeller]

February 23, 2007
U.S. Senator John McCain in Seattle, WA
His Vision for the United States' Role in the World

Discovery Institute (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discovery_Institute) is pleased to co-present with CityClub of Seattle and the Seattle World Affairs Council a luncheon featuring U.S. Senator John McCain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_McCain).

What is the role of the U.S. in the global community? How should the U.S. position itself over the next decade? What are the challenges, and how should they be addressed? What are the future global impacts on Washington State? United States Senator John McCain will address these topics of global relevance and their relation to the Puget Sound region at the Westin Hotel in Seattle on Friday, February 23 from 12:00 to 1:30 p.m.


http://www.discovery.org/scripts/viewDB/index.php?command=view&id=271&program=Discovery%20Institute&isEvent=true

McCain has been working overtime trying to enhance his evangelical connections.

[TheGline]

This reminds me of something I've said to my friends repeatedly in the last couple of years: This country would sooner vote for a black lesbian amputee over a white man ... if she was Baptist, and he was an atheist.

(Note: not implying there's anything morally wrong with being black, Baptist, lesbian, or missing body parts... but you get the idea)

[Crazycowbob]

And thus, the solution to getting rational thought into the government is to find a skeptic, and have him/her pretend to be baptist and conservative, with leanings towards whichever party has the most support at the time. Sure it means we have a liar at the helm, but that's no different than any one before, and even evil rationality has got to be better than the most well intentioned irrationality... :D

[TheGline]

I think the main thing that needs to be combated is something that's been a persistent myth for a long time now: that without a spiritual / mystical belief system, people are amoral monsters who can't be trusted in positions of power. It doesn't matter that any number of people who've left office in total disgrace are believers of one kind or another; we've all seen how most people are more than willing to selectively ignore evidence to confirm their prejudices.

What's worse is that now there's this whole mentality that if you're not with "us" (i.e., if you're not Christian, or at least "spiritual"), then you're ... something else. Which is not "us", which is with "them".

Sigh.

[Bob Klase]

And thus, the solution to getting rational thought into the government is to find a skeptic, and have him/her pretend to be baptist and conservative, with leanings towards whichever party has the most support at the time. Sure it means we have a liar at the helm, but that's no different than any one before, and even evil rationality has got to be better than the most well intentioned irrationality... :D

I don't know if McCain is a skeptic, but considering some of his previous comments about Jerry Fawell/Pat Robertson types maybe he is someone pretending to be baptist and conservative.

[hilliag]

I doubt very much that McCain is a skeptic. He's been schmoozing with the far-right religious groups for a while now. It's funny to see how he has flip-flopped on creationism/intelligent design -- not that this conference is anything about that.

[desertyeti]

The guy's a tool.
He's a politician who got run over the coals by Bush's propoganda machine, and now he's trying anything to stay relevant.
Pathetic.

[T'ai Chi]

Some people from the skeptical movement should go speak there. Isn't that a good place to bring the good news afterall? Or is it better to preach to the choir?

[UnrepentantSinner]

He archives his speeches.
http://mccain.senate.gov/press_office/index.cfm?ID=78
I wonder if this one will make it.

[Juustin]

I think the main thing that needs to be combated is something that's been a persistent myth for a long time now: that without a spiritual / mystical belief system, people are amoral monsters who can't be trusted in positions of power.

Sadly, the mindset seems to be "Imagine how scary it would be if an Atheist was in charge of guarding the nuclear war button!", instead of "It's scary that our current leader believes a worldwide violent apocalypse is absolutely necessary before his saviour returns."

[ponderingturtle]

I don't know if McCain is a skeptic, but considering some of his previous comments about Jerry Fawell/Pat Robertson types maybe he is someone pretending to be baptist and conservative.

McCain is very much a concervative, he just is good at pertending to wink at the other side to make them think he does not really believe it.

[SusanB-M1]

An American on the BBC Radio 4 Today programme this morning was being asked about a Mormon Presidential candidate and he said that if the American people had to choose between a Mormon and a Jew, then they would overwhelmingly choose the Mormon. I had only been half-listening, but that caught my attention and, if I remember correctly, he was not challenged. I would have to go back and 'listen again' to check. The meaning was definitely that the choice would be made completely regardless of their qualities as people or politicians.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Some people from the skeptical movement should go speak there. Isn't that a good place to bring the good news afterall? Or is it better to preach to the choir?
Wow, last time I checked you had to be invited to such things.

[UnrepentantSinner]

An American on the BBC Radio 4 Today programme this morning was being asked about a Mormon Presidential candidate and he said that if the American people had to choose between a Mormon and a Jew, then they would overwhelmingly choose the Mormon. I had only been half-listening, but that caught my attention and, if I remember correctly, he was not challenged. I would have to go back and 'listen again' to check.

From my experiences listening to the vox populi I'm not sure that's completely accurate. Mormonism has a lot of cultural baggage, but anti-Semitism and anti-Israel sentiment is very pervasive. I can tell you that there would be very low turnout that year.

The meaning was definitely that the choice would be made completely regardless of their qualities as people or politicians.

Welcome to the madness that is American presidental politics. John Kennedy was a war hero who had served in Congress for almost 20 years and the biggest point of contention was his Catholicism.

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

I'd have to disagree. I think a Jewish President is perfectly conceivable. After all, the American public elected a Jewish vice president in 2000.

[hgc]

I'd have to disagree. I think a Jewish President is perfectly conceivable. After all, the American public elected a Jewish vice president in 2000.
Welcome aboard! :D

[PenguinWarrior]

I'd have to disagree. I think a Jewish President is perfectly conceivable. After all, the American public elected a Jewish vice president in 2000.

Isn't there some "I told you so" rule in the constitution which makes Gore President by now? And if not, damnit, WHY NOT?

I want an American president who's been in Futurama, surely that's the most important thing.

Also, it's got to be worrying when your supposedly "moderate right wing" candidate picks the reality deficient as his intended audience.

[Diamond]

My estimation of John McCain has plummeted over the last year. There's something about running for President that makes people forget every principle they ever held.

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

Isn't there some "I told you so" rule in the constitution which makes Gore President by now? And if not, damnit, WHY NOT?

Heck, if the part in the Constitution about becoming President by winning the election couldn't make Gore President...

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Take it to the Politics subforum.

[c4ts]

This country would sooner vote for a black lesbian amputee

Okay, now I'm turned on.

[Questioninggeller]

Just five days before this creationist event:

McCain: Roe v. Wade should be overturned
By JIM DAVENPORT, Associated Press Writer
Sun Feb 18, 2007

SPARTANBURG, S.C. - Republican presidential candidate John McCain, looking to improve his standing with the party's conservative voters, said Sunday the court decision that legalized abortion should be overturned.

"I do not support Roe versus Wade. It should be overturned," the Arizona senator told about 800 people in South Carolina, one of the early voting states.
...


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070219/ap_on_el_pr/mccain2008

[RichardR]

McCain is a reDiscovery Institute Intelligent Design Hall of Fame Member (http://www.re-discovery.org/active_1.html#jmc):

"...when I stand on the rim of the Grand Canyon and look at that grandeur, I detect the hand of God there in the time before time. I see no reason why students should not be exposed to all theories, recognizing that Darwin's theory's certainly one that is generally accepted in most of the scientific community. I think it's not inappropriate to say there are also people who believe this. Let the student decide." Intelligent Design is "a theory, just like evolution is a theory..."

[ponderingturtle]

My estimation of John McCain has plummeted over the last year. There's something about running for President that makes people forget every principle they ever held.

And he has been doing it for 8 years

[Questioninggeller]

He archives his speeches.
http://mccain.senate.gov/press_office/index.cfm?ID=78
I wonder if this one will make it.

Nope, his speech at the Discovery Institute didn't appear. However, his March 14, 2007 statement on Iraq did. Looks like they only selectively post his speeches.

[Mark A. Siefert]

And thus, the solution to getting rational thought into the government is to find a skeptic, and have him/her pretend to be baptist and conservative, with leanings towards whichever party has the most support at the time.

Then we watch as he loses his re-election on the grounds that not only is a filthy atheist, but he's a LYING filthy atheist to boot.

Oh well, at least I have LESS of a reason to vote for him than I had before. (http://www.reason.com/news/show/118937.html)

[varwoche]

Nope, his speech at the Discovery Institute didn't appear. However, his March 14, 2007 statement on Iraq did. Looks like they only selectively post his speeches. He didn't even put the appearance on his calendar (http://www.johnmccain.com/Informing/Calendar/Default.aspx).