StopSylviaBrowne: Email - A Request For a Refund

[RSLancastr]

A new article on the site:

Email: A Request For a Refund (http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/articles/email_requestforrefund.shtml)

Sorry for the relative drought in articles recently. Work and home taking precedence over the site. I hope to have a couple of other new articles up this week.

[Ersby]

Amazing how low they'll stoop. $450 for a seven minute reading.

btw, is Pam Meyer the same Pam who ran Friends of John Edward, and sometimes posted on tvtalkshows? Does anyone know? Just wondering.

[logical muse]

Great article! I especially liked your exposition of the regulation of the legal and psychiatric professions. You made some excellent points.

It sounds like the lady is not going to pursue her claim for a full refund. Perhaps drawing SB's attention to this article might help?

[Richard]

Wow.. I take my hat off to you. You are out there good what you can and I respect that. Are you joining us on the cruise?

[Rasmus]

After all, he isn't psychic.

Bravo!

[Jeff Corey]

Amazing how low they'll stoop. $450 for a seven minute reading.

btw, is Pam Meyer the same Pam who ran Friends of John Edward, and sometimes posted on tvtalkshows? Does anyone know? Just wondering.

That Pam was Pam Blizzard. I think she had a crush on Claus.

[CFLarsen]

Sylvia Browne says that all dogs go to heaven and never have to reincarnate because their souls are so perfect in the eyes of G-d.
Source (http://www.joanriversblog.com/blog/BlogComments.aspx?blogID=54)

When I bought "Life on the Other Side", I was eager to read it and discover how wonderful the other side really is. The book was easy to read and exciting, yet when I was all through with it I was left with a feeling that it was a little too sugar coated to be accurate. As time went by I started realizing that several things she said did not make sense. Of the top of my head, she said when you pass on all the pets you ever had in past lives would be waiting to greet you. This makes no sense at all to me, for I am sure the pets, if they reincarnate would be busy living a new life or what about all the other masters they had before?
Source (http://www.amazon.com/gp/cdp/member-reviews/A11TZ2AGK9B0V5?ie=UTF8&sort_by=MostRecentReview)

Hmmm.....

[CFLarsen]

That Pam was Pam Blizzard. I think she had a crush on Claus.

A deadly one, yes.

[Reno]

As RSL's www.stopsylviabrowne.com site grows, so does my desire for Browne and her progeny to contract a deadly disease.

[Ersby]

That Pam was Pam Blizzard.

Oh yes, that was the name. Thanks.

I think she had a crush on Claus.

Just one of her many strange beliefs.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

A deadly one, yes.

She killed you? You must have gotten better.

[Stupendous Man]

Someone should alert Anderson Cooper to this.. Maybe he would do another follow up show in the future.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

What's the problem? After all, psychics, like other professionals, can't be right all of the time? Can they? ;)

Of course, as a skeptic, I would like them to be right once. I mean, it could happen by chance, couldn't it? :boggled:

[Moochie]

A new article on the site:

Email: A Request For a Refund (http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/articles/email_requestforrefund.shtml)

Sorry for the relative drought in articles recently. Work and home taking precedence over the site. I hope to have a couple of other new articles up this week.


What a horrid, despicable pair Ma and offspring Browne are! To liken themselves to professionals just about takes the cake. If they're professionals then Anna Nicole was Mama Teresa. Meh :(

M.

[CFLarsen]

She killed you?

No, she threatened to kill me.

[Jeff Corey]

No, she threatened to kill me.

Not directly. I believe there was a Marine sharpshooter, a whip and a prune danish involved in the plot.

[fuelair]

As RSL's www.stopsylviabrowne.com site grows, so does my desire for Browne and her progeny to contract a deadly disease.

Or make a prediction for the wrong people - a wrong prediction of course - and have a long stay in the desert outside of Las Vegas. Or elsewhere.

[Sherman Bay]

Robert, I hope you urge this lady to continue to pursue a refund, and maybe you can assist. Don't feel bound by the Sylvia crew's requirements, but be guided by common sense and past fraud cases. IANAL, but I believe there is an implied contract here since money was voluntarily exchanged based on reasonable expectations. Even if Chris says the statements he made are of no importance, they are presented in the reading as significant.

If he can't get present or past events right, what chance is there that future ones will be any good?

If you hired a plumber to fix a leak and he didn't know what a pipe was and couldn't perform as promised, you would have good reason to not pay him even if he claimed to be a dynamite plumber.

Even if you never get a refund, any dialogue is valuable for future reference and will serve as another nail in Sylvia's coffin.

[Blue Mountain]

I don't think there's any such thing a "true" psychic, and that all phone readers, tarot readers, card readers, palm readers, stool readers, tea-leaf readers and the like are simply cold readers.

Because they are simply cold reading, these so-called psychics can only go with the available information or educated (or lucky) guesses. But their fall-back in the case of something similar to this woman's is what we in the computer world call "GIGO" -- Garbage In, Garbage Out.

On two occasions, I have been asked [by members of Parliament], 'Pray, Mr. Babbage, if you put into the machine wrong figures, will the right answers come out?' I am not able to rightly apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question.

While I can appreciate this concept, to me the mark of an experienced professional is a good ************ detector. Go to a lawyer with some tall tale and she'll quickly find the holes in it. Go to a doctor complaining of mysterious symptoms, and after a round or two of unsuccessful treatment the doctor is likely to become skeptical that you're really suffering from them.

My understanding of the line the psychics give their marks is that their props--cards, tea leaves, crystal balls, whatever--are supposed to reveal the hidden truths. I'm not sure what Sylvia and Chris claim is the source of their ability to reveal that which is hidden, but to me it seems like it should be good enough to pick up the fact when a person talks about "losing the one I loved almost most of anything in this world," that prop or power should be able reveal she wasn't referring to her husband.

Failure to do that is pretty good evidence the prop doesn't work. Occam's razor then tells us the best explanation is cold reading.

[chran]

Uhh - I thought Sylvia Brown(e) didn't charge? So, how come Pam is talking about refunding fees?

That's curious ...

[FaisonMars]

Robert, you should send this in to Anderson Cooper. He's the only person so far in the media who has expressed some skepticism about Sylvia.

[grayman]

Not directly. I believe there was a Marine sharpshooter, a whip and a prune danish involved in the plot.

No, it was a Danish prude. :D

[CFLarsen]

Not directly.

It was very direct.

[RSLancastr]

Amazing how low they'll stoop. $450 for a seven minute reading.Actually Ersby, upon reviewing the tape, it was a bit longer. Something like 12 minutes, if I recall.

btw, is Pam Meyer the same Pam who ran Friends of John Edward, and sometimes posted on tvtalkshows? Does anyone know? Just wondering.Nope, that is Pam Blizzard. She still runs that site, though it has brnached out and isn't solely focused on Edward any more.

Where have we have heard Pam Meyer's name before?

She is most likely the same Pam Meyer whose signature can be read inthis Commentary (http://www.randi.org/jr/040502.html).

Great article! I especially liked your exposition of the regulation of the legal and psychiatric professions. You made some excellent points.Thanks LM, though I can't claim credit for all of the points in that section. I sought the opinion of Jordon Davis, the attorney who wrote the reply to Browne's attorney. I figured an attorney would have some strong opinions on being compared to a psychic, and I was correct.

It sounds like the lady is not going to pursue her claim for a full refund. Perhaps drawing SB's attention to this article might help?Or just the opposite. We'll see.

Wow.. I take my hat off to you. You are out there good what you can and I respect that. Are you joining us on the cruise?Thanks, Richard. Sadly, no plans to join the cruise.

Bravo!Thanks, Rasmus!

Someone should alert Anderson Cooper to this.. Maybe he would do another follow up show in the future.I send links to new articles to AC's people every few articles that go up. I don't want to be perceived by them as a pest.

Of course, as a skeptic, I would like them to be right once. I mean, it could happen by chance, couldn't it? :boggled:You'd think so, Gord!

What a horrid, despicable pair Ma and offspring Browne are! To liken themselves to professionals just about takes the cake. If they're professionals then Anna Nicole was Mama Teresa. Meh :(Agreed, Moochie. Sad thing is, a lot of people probably think the analogy is valid.

Robert, I hope you urge this lady to continue to pursue a refund, and maybe you can assist.Sherman_Bay (I can't call you "SB" - shudder...), the woman is dealing with a lot at this point. IANAL either, but as I understand it, part of the problem here is defining what "reasonable expectations" are when dealing with a psychic.

Failure to do that is pretty good evidence the prop doesn't work. Occam's razor then tells us the best explanation is cold reading.Makes sense to me, Blue.

Uhh - I thought Sylvia Brown(e) didn't charge? So, how come Pam is talking about refunding fees?Well, she claims not to charge for missing person cases.

Robert, you should send this in to Anderson Cooper. He's the only person so far in the media who has expressed some skepticism about Sylvia.It will go to him when there are a few more new articles, mf.

[TobiasTheViking]

No, it was a Danish prude. :D

Well, i certainly ain't a prude, so you must be talking about CFLarsen. :D

[Soapy Sam]

Simple question.
Why is Slyvia Browne's son named Dufresne?

[ChristineR]

Wow, Robert that one was really painful to read. For some reason it stung more than Shawn Hornbeck or Opal Jo Jennings--probably because those two are public tragedies and Browne is just another drop in the ocean.

I hope you ruin their careers and they end up in jail. :mad:

[RSLancastr]

Simple question.
Why is Slyvia Browne's son named Dufresne?Simple answer: One of Browne's ex-husbands' name is Gary Dufresne. He was her second husband, just before Dal Brown, who was convicted along with Sylvia in the mining stock scandal.

Wow, Robert that one was really painful to read. For some reason it stung more than Shawn Hornbeck or Opal Jo Jennings--probably because those two are public tragedies and Browne is just another drop in the ocean.I know what you mean, ChristineR.

[Minarvia]

Why does this lady have to jump thru all those hoops when the woman in an earlier article of yours not have to? She was surprised she got her money back, but she did. And now, suddenly, someone has to type out an entire tape and highlite things and give detailed instructions to Sylvia's staff on how they can prove that something did not occur?
Something is very wrong here.

[supercorgi]

A new article on the site:

Email: A Request For a Refund (http://www.stopsylviabrowne.com/articles/email_requestforrefund.shtml)

Sorry for the relative drought in articles recently. Work and home taking precedence over the site. I hope to have a couple of other new articles up this week.

Great article RSL! I love your level-headed approach when addressing the lawyer and psychologist point. Do you get many letters like this? I would think with the publicity that your site is gaining, that you'd be getting a lot of email. How much of it is critical of Slyvia and how much of it is condemning you as being mean?

[alfaniner]

I do not know of any cases in which Sylvia or Chris were 100% wrong, and would be amazed to find you are the first such case.

Um... I do!

[Rasmus]

Something is very wrong here.

It might be a good idea to be very careful when wording anythign that relies on third party accounts that have been related to you, RSL.

[Minarvia]

It might be a good idea to be very careful when wording anythign that relies on third party accounts that have been related to you, RSL.

I didn't mean with Rob's article! I meant that Sylvia's office is making one unsatisfied client do something that another did not and I'm wondering why.

[Rasmus]

Ah, okay. Well a lot is wrong with her office in any case (such that it exists and supports her and all that...)

I didn't mean to say that the article was wrong as such, just that Robert might be subject to attempts of manipulation that could leave him somewhat vulnerable. He does write fairly, of course, but I am not sure if the possibility has been taken into consideration.

[RSLancastr]

Why does this lady have to jump thru all those hoops when the woman in an earlier article of yours not have to?Yup, it doesn't seem consistent.

Of course, the other reading might have been so bad that they didn't even want to send the tape, so they just refunded.

Great article RSL!Thanks 'corgi!

I love your level-headed approach when addressing the lawyer and psychologist point.Again, credit for some of that passage goes to Jordon Davis.

Do you get many letters like this?Not a lot. I get more from people who have cancelled an appointment with Chris because of what is on my site.

I would think with the publicity that your site is gaining, that you'd be getting a lot of email. How much of it is critical of Slyvia and how much of it is condemning you as being mean?I generally get anywhere from ten to 20 emails per day, with spikes when there is press mention of the site. For a few weeks after the site was in the NY Daily News, the Stern Show, CNN and others, I was getting around a hundred emails per day.

I haven't counted how many are negative towards the site, but I would say that it is fewer than five percent.

Um... I do!:D

I didn't mean to say that the article was wrong as such, just that Robert might be subject to attempts of manipulation that could leave him somewhat vulnerable. He does write fairly, of course, but I am not sure if the possibility has been taken into consideration.I appreciate the concern Rasmus, but believe me, I take it into account with every email I receive.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

No, she threatened to kill me.

Wow, how exciting!

No one ever threatens to kill me. :(

[RSLancastr]

No one ever threatens to kill me. :(You mean, other than Rebecca.

[headscratcher4]

The one thing that struck me in the exchanges was the letter from Browne's people wherein they referred to Sylvia (and Chris?) as "professional" people. Huh? How so? How does one get to be a "professional" at an occupation/art/science that, for all intents and purpposes doesn't exist? Is she licenced? Does she have a degree in this stuff? How is she a professional, unless, of course, she is referring to being a con-artist and making her living from the con.

[skeptifem]

great job on your website. I've seen people linking to it and mentioning it at non skeptic websites so you are getting the word out to people. I really enjoyed that website as well as your other one about the 9/11 faker.

[Minarvia]

I'm now also wondering if Sylvia's office is having to deal with more people asking for refunds and they are upset about it and now want to make it really tough for the unsatisfied clients. Still, all in all, I would think they would not want to make the clients angry because an angry person is more likely to make their poor reading public, as we are now seeing. I think they are better off just keeping the tape and refunding the money. After all, there are still many believers and the money is still pouring in. Why tick people off?

[Fnord]

Has anyone considered a letter-writing campaign? Not just to Montel Williams, but to all of the show's Producers (http://www.montelshow.com/producers); Susan Henry, Kimberly Forman-Brechk, and Montel himself.

The sponsors of the show could also hear from skeptics and other disgruntled viewers, especially of each Wednesday's Sylvia Browne segment.

Believe it or not, this week's segment (07.02.28) is on "MURDER AND MYSTERY WITH SYLVIA BROWNE (http://www.montelshow.com/show/?showID=5093)" wherein she "will help unravel and give insight into mysteries..." like how fast she can cash their checks?

One guest believes that her daughter's imaginary friend saved the entire family from a fire. Four more guests want the witch to identify their loved ones' killers. Yet another wants her to tell him that a photo includes the image of a dead Civil War soldier. Finally, a mom and her kid claim that they are being haunted ("Mommy! Mommy! Make him stop!").

Great fun, eh? :rolleyes:

[Tricky]

Wow, how exciting!

No one ever threatens to kill me. :(
Not since you left the church anyway.:p

[RSLancastr]

How is she a professional, unless, of course, she is referring to being a con-artist and making her living from the con.Right. I decided not to delve into the whole "professional" thing in the article. In one sense, "professional" simply means someone who makes a living at something. So, rather than muddy it up with talking about that, I just talked about the differences between the "professions" mentioned.

great job on your website. I've seen people linking to it and mentioning it at non skeptic websites so you are getting the word out to people. I really enjoyed that website as well as your other one about the 9/11 faker.Thanks, N3J0. Yes, I've been really pleased with the positive mentions it is getting, even in some paranormal forums.

Has anyone considered a letter-writing campaign?I am seriously considering promoting such a campaign on the site.

[Kage]

What a horrid, despicable pair Ma and offspring Browne are! To liken themselves to professionals just about takes the cake. If they're professionals then Anna Nicole was Mama Teresa. Meh :(

M.

Anna is a better person in my view than that teresa woman.

[rjh01]

So, She is back with new shows. The end of repeats.

Does not take much to work out that she will say nothing truthful the guests do not know already.

[CFLarsen]

Wow, how exciting!

No one ever threatens to kill me. :(

It's not funny.

[Darat]

So, She is back with new shows. The end of repeats.

Does not take much to work out that she will say nothing truthful the guests do not know already.


Well I'm sure that she will now remember to preface each of her readings with a comment such as

"Remember that I'm only about 80% accurate so you can take some comfort that when when I say your child is dead and was brutally sexually assaulted before she was killed there's a one in five chance I'm wrong - now dear what was your question?"

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

Great article!

I have a question- since y'all are probably the closest thing in the world to experts on Sylvia Browne can someone explain something to me?

How is the world can you reconcile reincarnation and an afterlife?! Do you reincarnate on the Other Side?!

I've heard Sylvia say that you're reborn on the Other Side and can change genders and age and skin color...so is that reincarnation on the Other Side but something separate from reincarnation on Earth?!

Even more confusing when you add the dogs into the equation! :D

Could someone please give me a rundown of Sylvia's cosmology cause even this Sunday school graduate doesn't get it :D

[Fnord]

I'll try to answer your questions as best I can, based on my own experiences in the New Age movement and my cousin's Spiritualist church. For the record, I don't believe any of the crap I am about to tell you.

Q1) How is the world can you reconcile reincarnation and an afterlife?! Do you reincarnate on the Other Side?!

A1) According to one belief system (Google: "Messages From Michael" by Chelsea Quinn Yarbro), when you are 'between lives' you first assimilate the experiences of your previous life, and then choose the aspects, or "overleafs" of your next life's personality. These overleafs include traits like "self deprecation," "agression," and "idealism," and you choose them to help you in the next life to (1) burn off karma from your previous life, and (2) accumulate new karma for burning in the life after the next. These overleafs are also filters through which you perceive the universe.

For instance, in this life I am supposed to have the role of a Mature Scholar, my goal is Discrimination (Discernment), my mode is Aggression, my attitude is Idealism, my chief feature ("Fatal Flaw") is Self-Deprecation, and I operate from the Intellectual part of my Emotional center.

Pure, unadulterated woo.

Q2) Could someone please give me a rundown of Sylvia's cosmology cause even this Sunday school graduate doesn't get it
A2) I'm not certain that even she knows.

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

Ah, thank you Fnord. That really clears things up ;)

So you used to be into New Age? How did you come to become a skeptic, if I can ask?

[RSLancastr]

As I understand Browne's "cosamology," it is very similar to what fnord describes.

According to Browne, when you die, you go to the "Other Side," where you decide your "chart" for your next life. This includes what gender you'll be, who your parents will be, and all of the major events (good and bad) that you will experience. You choose a "chart" which will help you learn the lessons you still need to learn.

After you learn all of the lessons you are supposed to learn from living, you no longer reincarnate, and take up permanent residence on the other side.

[Fnord]

Ah, thank you Fnord ... How did you come to become a skeptic, if I can ask?

The Eternal Dance of Prey and Predator ... Or Host and Parasite, if you will.

It's really very complicated, with many other factors involved, but here is a simple, if somewhat incomplete, explanation:

The woo-woos I met in the New Age movement fell into two broad and overlapping categories:

1) The completely deluded. These people were so "out there" that they would fall for anything remotely woo-ish. I sold a bunch of modified wireless microphones ("bugs") to them on the premise that since they were crystal oscillators, and crystals are a prime focus of woo-forces ... well, I made a lot of money. Easy money. Like selling candy to a two-year old.

2) The completely corrupted. These people thought nothing of stringing along a stable of Seekers (there's one born every minute) for their own livelihood. Once I learned how to do cold readings with a tarot deck, I became to understand the contempt that a prostitute feels for her clients, and for herself for needing their money.

I felt so ... filthy.


-Fnord of Dyscordia-

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

Whoa. Not to pry but how exactly did you learn to cold read? Did a scammer show you or did you pick it up?

[wahrheit]

Great article, and I think other potential victims of $ilvia might find it an interesting read. Given your current google ranking not a very unlikely event.

The link at the end of the article (to Dufresne's bio) goes to your site, not saliva.org.

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

Thanks, Robert.

That's a very confusing mishmash of Christianity, Eastern religions and New Age that makes those beliefs look sensical.

So if humans can't reincarnate as animals and all dogs go to heaven cause they are so pure...where do dogs come from? Wouldn't no dog souls come back to Earth any more? As a matter of fact, wouldn't dogs die out in the first generation God put on earth?

[Dedicated]

RS, I have a question.

Sylvia has a website and she is a psychic, is that in a sense her company? So does she even get taxed? And if she doesn't, isn't that against the law?

[Geek Goddess]

.

This includes what gender you'll be, who your parents will be,

That settles it, I'm converting. I choose my parents to be someone with a simple last name, like...Gates. Morgan. Lodge. Rockefeller. I'm not picky.

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

You don't mind if I take Hilton then, do you :)?

Which brings me to the question, why would anyone ever choose to be born a homeless person, someone born with birth defects, someone born to abusive parents or have anything bad ever happen to them?

Ok, so maybe you have to pick bad life events you just have to choose which ones cause you got to learn your lessons before you have a permament home in the afterlife but surely the universe or God wouldn't require anybody to be born to two child abusers.

[Blue Mountain]

You don't mind if I take Hilton then, do you :)?

Which brings me to the question, why would anyone ever choose to be born a homeless person, someone born with birth defects, someone born to abusive parents or have anything bad ever happen to them?

Ok, so maybe you have to pick bad life events you just have to choose which ones cause you got to learn your lessons before you have a permament home in the afterlife but surely the universe or God wouldn't require anybody to be born to two child abusers.
Well, your choice of chart could be narrowed if you're either just starting out or your screwed up majorly the last time around. For example, if you were an abuser, "they" might arrange fo you to get charts that get you born into poverty, or blindness, or abuse.

(Disclaimer: I do not believe that which I just wrote!)

[Rasmus]

You don't mind if I take Hilton then, do you :)?

Which brings me to the question, why would anyone ever choose to be born a homeless person, someone born with birth defects, someone born to abusive parents or have anything bad ever happen to them?

For kicks, I guess.

It's probably like a reverse hangover. In this life, you go out drinking one night and you pay with the hangover the next morning. Sometimes, you do this because it's worth it to you.

So maybe it just works the other wayy around on the other side? You set up to go through a bad life for some benefits that you will gain upon your return on the other side. Maybe it's a status symbol? No bragging material better than a horrible, painful and preferably short live.

Explains the many victims of the holocaust, too. People must have been piling up to get signed on to that! And they are still laughuing at the suckers that didn't make the list, I suppose ... :pigsfly

[headscratcher4]

How do you know what lessons you need to learn? Sort of a loop of ignorance isn't it? And if you know what lessons you need to learn, do you really need to go through the whole prossess to learn them?

It sounds like she thinks the after life is a little like freshman class selection at a good state university.

[Lisa Simpson]

Explains the many victims of the holocaust, too. People must have been piling up to get signed on to that! And they are still laughuing at the suckers that didn't make the list, I suppose ... :pigsfly

No, no. In Sylvia's world, the victims of the Holocaust chose to die that way in order to show the world evil and the victims of 9/11 chose to die in order to show America we aren't prepared.

[headscratcher4]

No, no. In Sylvia's world, the victims of the Holocaust chose to die that way in order to show the world evil and the victims of 9/11 chose to die in order to show America we aren't prepared.

Seems rather short sighted for essentially immortal creatures...I mean whether the holocaust or 9/11, these are all essentially temporal events that are blips in the history of mankind....

Also, wondering what lessons the 60 million or so spirits who starved to death in China during Mao's reign figured they were going to learn...or maybe they chose that experience to teach mankind, again, that it is very difficult to live without food.

[Dedicated]

Sylvia is on Montel today (as usual, on Wednesday's)

I find it funny how they always do mystery shows, where its basically people seeing strange things at their house, hearing strange noises. Less work for her. She can basically say its anything since its a mystery and she would be right.

Why not do normal readings? Oh, maybe she doesn't want another Shawn Hornbeck.

[headscratcher4]

What's a normal reading when what you are "reading" doesn't exist?

[Ersby]

btw, the latest from alexa.com shows that stopsylviabrowne is beating the official site pretty much across the globe... need to do something about South Africa, though...

Stopsylviabrowne.com traffic rank in other countries:
Australia 24,565
United States 30,338
Canada 33,729
United Kingdom 116,488
Spain 124,614

Sylvia.org traffic rank in other countries:
United States 42,861
Canada 43,762
South Africa 46,934
Australia 136,074
United Kingdom 148,867

[Dedicated]

What's a normal reading when what you are "reading" doesn't exist?

True

[Fnord]

Whoa. Not to pry but how exactly did you learn to cold read? Did a scammer show you or did you pick it up?

My cousin the witch taught me. She ran an anglo equivalent of a "Botanika" in central Michigan. A brilliant woman ... wasted on woo.

[headscratcher4]

btw, the latest from alexa.com shows that stopsylviabrowne is beating the official site pretty much across the globe... need to do something about South Africa, though...

Stopsylviabrowne.com traffic rank in other countries:
Australia 24,565
United States 30,338
Canada 33,729
United Kingdom 116,488
Spain 124,614

Sylvia.org traffic rank in other countries:
United States 42,861
Canada 43,762
South Africa 46,934
Australia 136,074
United Kingdom 148,867

Unless you are using the word "beating" in a way I don't understand, it would appear that Sylvia.org is ahead. What am I missing?

[wahrheit]

Unless you are using the word "beating" in a way I don't understand, it would appear that Sylvia.org is ahead. What am I missing?

Rank 1 = You are the King (google)
Rank 2 = The Queen (eBay)
...
Rank 100 = A very, very popular site
...
Rank 50000 = A quite popular site


The smaller the number, the better.

[headscratcher4]

My bad...thanks for the clarification!

[The Central Scrutinizer]

It's not funny.

It is when the threat isn't credible.

[J. Arthur Hastur]

I charge clients $850.00 for a reading. I usually read them something from 'Disease and History'.

[Fnord]

I charge $200 down, and $500 per day, plus expenses (food, travel, etc.), to give a reading that tells people everything they already know!

I prefer the term "Consultant" rather than "Psychic." :D

[grayman]

You know, there's nothing worse than trying to give a reading after someone has attempted to read themselves. When will people learn that they need to leave this sort of things to professionals?

Clients come in with cracked chakras, stained auras, astro-flux out of allignment, and damaged quantum fields. I always hear, "I tried to fix it, but I think I made it worse". They don't say that, but I can hear it in my head.

Then they get upset when I tell them they're going to need to leave it in the shop for a day or two depending on when I can get the parts. Some of these new models are metric and things don't always fit; sometimes I need to get an adapter.

And then they stand over my shoulder, trying to give advice while I'm working, which really irritates the guardian angels that were standing there first.

So please, don't try this at home. We are trained professionals. Let us do the work God intended us to do. Good work ain't cheap, cheap work ain't good. Union labor is good labor.



That'll be $750.00 please.

[Fnord]

Don't you just hate it when a chakric node drops and rolls too far under a piece furniture for you to reach it? That's right about the time the customer walks in to ask why it's taking so long. :(

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

I'm really sorry to be asking all these questions but if your cousin knows cold reading is a technique that a person can learn how can she go on believing in woo? I mean, you usually either have scammers who know full well what they are doing or people who've managed to deceive themselves along with everyone else.

Does she know pyschic abilities are just cold reading but truly believes in everything else?

Again, sorry to ask.

[Fnord]

I'm really sorry to be asking all these questions but if your cousin knows cold reading is a technique that a person can learn how can she go on believing in woo? I mean, you usually either have scammers who know full well what they are doing or people who've managed to deceive themselves along with everyone else.

Does she know pyschic abilities are just cold reading but truly believes in everything else?

Again, sorry to ask.

Don't be sorry. It allows me to pull the curtain back a little more. Even if it does jack the thread for a moment.

1) Just as a priest might know that the Eucharist is a technique, and still go on believing that the wine and bread manifest as the blood and flesh of Jesus, he also knows that "techniques" are useful in distracting believers from the real purpose of the show-and-tell, which is to separate the faithful from their money.

2) Maybe at one time she believed that cold readings were so much showmanship and nothing more, but eventually even the sharpest of sharps eventually begin to believe their own lies.

It's a great way to make money. Tell people what they want to hear, take a few twenties as a "love gift," and see them again the next week. Some come back daily!

IMHO, most folks just want validation -- they want to know that they matter, even if only to the "Unseen Forces Of The Universe."

Why not just get married? You get your validation, and eventually find out all that was ever wrong with you, your family, your friends, etc.*

-Fnord-


(* - Everthing you say, and everything you do.)

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

Oh man, daily?! That's absolutely terrible. You're right, if everyone on Earth got enough attention, no one would be fleeced of their money by these scammers.

So if it was such easy money and so much of it, as bad as you felt about it, what finally made you stop taking these poor folks' money and after how long?

Btw, my own cousins and their mother, my aunt, are into woowoo. They believe in ghosts, some of New Age, astrology and fortune telling though, as far as I know, besides a few astrology books and a visit to one of those sites that proclaim to have a vortex, they haven't invested any money into it and not that much time and effort.

I can't fanthom how three people that intelligent can honestly believe this stuff but, hey, if scientists of Nikola Tesla and Isaac Newton's caliber could have fallen victim to woowoo.

My aunt's mother (not my grandmother, my uncle's mother-in-law) happens to be a skeptic as well and last summer, while we were both visting the family, she and I tried to explain about things like subjective validation to my aunt and cousins but as you can guess, it's like reasoning with a wall.

[Fnord]

Oh man, daily?! That's absolutely terrible. You're right, if everyone on Earth got enough attention, no one would be fleeced of their money by these scammers.

Yes, daily. Two or three daily clients at $20 per visit, and my rent was paid. But who decides how much attention is enough?

So if it was such easy money and so much of it, as bad as you felt about it, what finally made you stop taking these poor folks' money and after how long?

It was not honest work. Running people's lives for them just isn't right, especially when I found how ****** easy it was to take advantage of them financially and ... other ways. Like I said earlier, It made me feel filthy.

Also, call it the "Protestant Work Ethic," if you will, or any other philosophy that says a person should earn their money through labor, or at least put forth some kind of effort for pay. All I did was paraphrase everything they told me, and convince them by subtle implication that they could not manage their own lives without me, and they would come back the next day for more of the same.

Btw, my own cousins and their mother, my aunt, are into woowoo. They believe in ghosts, some of New Age, astrology and fortune telling though, as far as I know, besides a few astrology books and a visit to one of those sites that proclaim to have a vortex, they haven't invested any money into it and not that much time and effort.

It does not take any time or money to be taken in by woo. It takes only a step of faith. For some people ("Seekers") believing in something they don't understand is more important than understanding the truth about what they believe in.

I can't fanthom how three people that intelligent can honestly believe this stuff but, hey, if scientists of Nikola Tesla and Isaac Newton's caliber could have fallen victim to woowoo.

Sir Arthur Conan Doyle and Henry Ford also had interest in woo. Falling for pseudo-science or spiritualism does not mean that the person lacks intelligence, it only means that they refuse to examine their beliefs, and have stopped asking "Why?" Again, belief is more important than understanding.

My aunt's mother (not my grandmother, my uncle's mother-in-law) happens to be a skeptic as well and last summer, while we were both visting the family, she and I tried to explain about things like subjective validation to my aunt and cousins but as you can guess, it's like reasoning with a wall.

Belief versus Understanding. One can be rock-solid only in his or her beliefs, but those with understanding know that there are somethings they will never know, and that they will never know what those things are.

Faith is more comfortable, as it requires no effort.

"When you believe in things that you don't understand, then you suffer! Superstition ain't the way." -- Stevie Wonder; "Superstition" from the "Talking Book" album. (1972)

[Luke T.]

Well I'm sure that she will now remember to preface each of her readings with a comment such as

"Remember that I'm only about 80% accurate so you can take some comfort that when when I say your child is dead and was brutally sexually assaulted before she was killed there's a one in five chance I'm wrong - now dear what was your question?"

She claims 87 percent accuracy. Not 80.

[Luke T.]

Uhh - I thought Sylvia Brown(e) didn't charge? So, how come Pam is talking about refunding fees?

That's curious ...

SB certainly does charge. She even lists her and her son's prices on her site. She claims she doesn't charge the family members of missing people.

[rjh01]

SB certainly does charge. She even lists her and her son's prices on her site. She claims she doesn't charge the family members of missing people.

I have heard that claim several times. How about sending who has someone missing to her and see if they are asked for money:D? Get it on tape. If money is asked for, then none should be given. It will be another page in Robert's site.

[Darat]

She claims 87 percent accuracy. Not 80.

I know but I wouldn't have been able to use the "a one in five chance I'm wrong" phrase if I had her say that - so "about 80%" worked better. :p

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

Yep, you're right. That's totally true of my aunt: belief over any understanding.

When she was planning a New Age trip to Sedona, I tried to dissuade her by telling her that she doesn't need to believe in magic rocks for a sense of wonder and excitement as the real wonder and complexity of the natural world is much more amazing than any woowoo beliefs. You don't need magic rocks in Sedona when you got Sedona. Geology is much more interesting and mindboggling than New Age.

The only response I got for my trouble was "Did you just think of that now?"

You must have gotten this alot, Fnord, but kudos to you for doing the right thing. Abraham Lincoln once said "Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power" and if you had power over a group of helpless people and their wallets and you chose to walk away from it, I mean, my hat's off to you.

It makes me even angrier at the types that know full well what they are doing and still do it. It's something else if you're self-deluded but to be totally aware and have no scruples about it, you must be pure human filth.

[Temporal Renegade]

You have my support and best wishes in this, as well. Not a lot of people would go the extra mile or so, as you have. You're a better man than I am! :)

[Fnord]

It makes me even angrier at the types that know full well what they are doing and still do it. It's something else if you're self-deluded but to be totally aware and have no scruples about it, you must be pure human filth.
Hey! Watch your language! Sylvia Browne is far from being "pure." Otherwise, I agree. ;)