Trouble at mill? (Part 2)

[uk_dave]

So what's all this about?

It's a new day for this Brainster. For those of you who haven't heard already, James and I have decided to go separate ways. I wish him luck. We had a great run with Screw Loose Change, made a lot of waves, shook up the Internet, but, due a difference of opinion about approach, this is for the best.

I know this blog appears to be attacking my roots. Well, I guess it is, but not the mission of exposing the propaganda, but the MEANS we used. It seemed reasonable at first, all's fair in love and war, as they say. But then we lost our way, drifting from exposing "Loose Change" and it's distortions, that now even the creator's admit, to attacking any 911 truther for any reason whatsoever.

Two events were a water shed for me; the Arizona conference and Nico Haupt. At the twoofer con I couldn't help cringing at the mix of wackiness on parade. Chemtrails mixed with for more reasonable, if incorrect research, and it was abundantly clear to me that most participants also felt ambivalent about the diluting of their message. I remain grateful for Stephen's helping me get in, but, frankly, was embarrassed at his antics. I know this didn't come through when I blogged it, but then I had to adhere to guidelines, which I am not free to disclose at this point. And this is not to mention the push to all but invent the crisis of Holocaust denial among the twoof movement, though in fact, it is no more prevalent there than anywhere else.

In the same vein we were to tolerate Nico Haupt and I'd been explicitly advised to visit his news aggregator. At the time it seemed odd, but I then I saw so much that seemed to confirm the "truth" movement was a scam. I should have been more suspicious, but as this was where my head was at the time, I only saw it as validation. This was a point of contention between James and I: first I was supposed to push Nico's 911Blogger parody, that included Nazi imagery as amusing, then I was told I must acknowledge it's offensiveness but defend Nico's free speech rights.

I didn't get into this project to defend someone like Nico Haupt, and I said so. That was our first serious argument and, while avoiding the gory details, suffice it to say, it all went down hill after that.

So here I am, by myself, to expose how our efforts to educate the public were hijacked by other entities. I truly do wish James well; I have no personal animosity towards him or Screw Loose Change as a blog concept. But we made a Faustian bargain and this is the only way I can see out of it.

So fasten your seat belts, hombres: as soon as all my material is together, I'll be showing you what REALLY happened behind the scenes at Screw Loose Change over the last year.

Assuming THEY don't get me. Ha, ha!

http://screwloosechangeexposed.blogspot.com/

:confused:

[mrfreeze]

What the hell? Great now we are the ones who can't keep from this schisming bs.

[westprog]

So what's all this about?



http://screwloosechangeexposed.blogspot.com/

:confused:

This is, in fact, a positive thing. If inappropriate methods are used in debunking, they should be exposed and discussed.

It's always been the Truth movement that's concealed and distorted information. The only way to combat this is to have all the information on the table, all the time.

That's not to say that either side of the SLC dispute is wrong. I don't know enough to make a judgement in this case. However, integrity is absolutely essential. It's the basic tool of the job, far more than technical expertise or persistence.

[uk_dave]

What the hell? Great now we are the ones who can't keep from this schisming bs.

Well, looking at the real screw loose change website, there seems to be a feeling that this is a 'truther' scam.

If indeed it is the case, then the poor little children must be either bored or desperate. Either way it would not bode well for the public image of the 'truth' movement.

However, if this is a genuine parting of the ways of the screwloosechange creators, then they should do it with a bit more decorum.

[Unfit4Command]

I wonder what happened... :confused: We'll see with time. I wonder what will come of the Screw Loose Change blog now.

[westprog]

Well, looking at the real screw loose change website, there seems to be a feeling that this is a 'truther' scam.

If indeed it is the case, then the poor little children must be either bored or desperate. Either way it would not bode well for the public image of the 'truth' movement.

If it is a fake, then it will be entirely counterproductive. However, it doesn't seem like it at first glance. I can't see a CT fake being that subtle.

In any case, we'll know soon enough.

However, if this is a genuine parting of the ways of the screwloosechange creators, then they should do it with a bit more decorum.

It doesn't matter if there's a big squabble, or if there's infighting about methods. The important thing is that there is openness. That's what is lacking in the Truth movement, and that is how they are to be combatted.

[JAStewart]

Assuming THEY don't get me. Ha, ha!
Yeah. Its fake.

Who said ha ha a lot in the past? Stundie heh.

http://www2.blogger.com/profile/05060349239296193385 (http://www2.blogger.com/profile/05060349239296193385)

Yeah, its fake.

[Donal]

as soon as all my material is together, I'll be showing you what REALLY happened behind the scenes at Screw Loose Change over the last year.


Twoofer MO right there. Promise real big evidence that will rock our worlds some day soon.

And Pat posted twice on SLC since that went up.

This is just sad.

[John Blonn]

Complete fake, everyone. SLC is fine!

[apathoid]

Definitely fake. Pat's(real type) blogger ID ends in 385; the new fake Pat's ID ends in 463. The real question is who is the culprit?

Stundie and PD'oh are fine candidates, but Col. Jenny Sparks is my horse...

[gumboot]

Definitely fake. Pat's(real type) blogger ID ends in 385; the new fake Pat's ID ends in 463. The real question is who is the culprit?

Stundie and PD'oh are fine candidates, but Col. Jenny Sparks is my horse...



I have to say the english skills and intelligence, not to mention moderation, evident in the post pretty much cancels out all of the Usual Suspects. For a Troofer this is very subtle work indeed.

-Gumboot

[Donal]

Deffinatly knocks out pdoh.

Whoever it is, they hold onto their sanity up until the very end. They seem to lose it when they are closing up.

Maybe, someone tries really hard, then runs it through a word processor's correcting utility and then posts it.

[Stellafane]

It reads like something that some CTer's parents wrote for him. Then right at the end, the CTer, flush with excitement at the prospect of impending pwnage, quickly added a couple of sentences and saved it. Unfortunately, this little addendum gives the game away, like a note written in fountain pen sporting a finger-paint signature.

[gumboot]

It's true...

In one paragraph he uses "animosity" and "faustian" and in the very next he uses "hombre" and puts a word in ALL CAPS.

It's really kind of funny.

-Gumboot

[apathoid]

I have to say the english skills and intelligence, not to mention moderation, evident in the post pretty much cancels out all of the Usual Suspects. For a Troofer this is very subtle work indeed.

-Gumboot

"Pat" has been posting at SLC as well and the comments are a little less subtle.

Kinda like when pomeroo spends hours and days on twoofer sites trolling.

Yes, sad. We shouldn't need to be obnoxious or lie to make our point. And we should be able to call our own to account when they're out of line.

So what are ya gonna do about it, lavoisier?

Make that alot less subtle...

[Bandersnatch]

My bet is jackchit.

[R.Mackey]

The "Ha ha ha!! tell is common (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=2025139#post2025139) among the Deniers.

[LashL]

And, as usual, the idiots in the "truth" movement are too intellectually lazy to determine that the fake Pat and the fake blog are a hoax, and instead declare victory and validation of their pathetic existence.

What a bunch of morons.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/march2007/140307smeartactics.htm

[mortimer]

How long before they figure out it's a hoax by one of their own, and blame a JREFer for putting it up to make troofers look bad?

[Gravy]

Some errors and nonsensical bits from "Pat's" profile. Bolding mine.
I'm too damn old for these games anymore. I thank you all for your support over the years but James and I have come to a parting of the ways. I can't condone the underhanded methods we've tolerated, bit by bit, until it seems there is no honesty to debunking 911 truth. Why should we need to tolerate these shenanagins if our position is so strong? I hold nothing against James and wish him well. He must do what be feels is right. I expect he's told you already he is now the sole contributer of Screw Loose Change. And I expect he'll have a greater appreciation for how much work I did on the blog over the years. Unfortunately, it is only a matter of time before the shadiest methods of debunking become known. I feel it is better to confront and document these problems before the "twoofers" descend like jackals. In a simular vein the archive project, regrettably, has been abandoned, though I will try to salvage some of it here.

[skyking]

Pat has some legal grounds to go after the impersonator, not the least of which the impersonator has most likely violated Blogger.com's Terms of Service

Member agrees not to transmit through the Service any unlawful, harassing, libelous, abusive, threatening, or harmful material of any kind or nature. Member further agrees not to transmit any material that encourages conduct that could constitute a criminal offense, give rise to civil liability or otherwise violate any applicable local, state, national or international law or regulation. Attempts to gain unauthorized access to other computer systems are prohibited.


Member shall not interfere with another Member's use and enjoyment of the Service or another entity's use and enjoyment of similar services.
Pyra may, at its sole discretion, immediately terminate Service should Member's conduct fail to conform with these terms and conditions of the BTS.

...

You agree to not use the Service to: (a) upload, post or otherwise transmit any Content that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, tortious, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, invasive of another's privacy, hateful, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable; (b) harm minors in any way; (c) impersonate any person or entity, including, but not limited to, a Pyra official, forum leader, guide or host, or falsely state or otherwise misrepresent your affiliation with a person or entity;...

[westprog]

My bet is jackchit.

He's an idiot though. But then, which of them isn't?

He's unprincipled enough, certainly.

[Donal]

Dylan himself? Maybe he took a break from being wined and dined by all those big Hollywood execs to play this little prank.

[The Demon's Head]

Now what does this say about troofers if they are willing to impersonate others and break rules?

[Unfit4Command]

Dylan himself? Maybe he took a break from being wined and dined by all those big Hollywood execs to play this little prank.

I can't see Dylan doing this. Probably just some random Truther who needed some attention.

[chippy]

There's even an article about this on Prison Planet! Is it really THAT important? Holy crap, there's a guy who was being one-sided, realized it, and corrected his mistake. This should not be earth-shattering.

[Brainster]

The blogger is always the last to know. Guess I should start taking those meds again, because my other personality (Retsniarb) is starting to take control.:D

Looks like the person who started the fake (http://ewing2001.blogspot.com/) Nico Haupt blog is behind this.

James and I have no problems aside from his irrational support for the Seattle Seahawks over the greatest franchise in the history of the NFL, the Arizona Cardinals.

[Shrinker]

Did anyone get a copy of the original Prison Planet article? It's already undergone one 'scrub'. I sense another coming.

Should this turn out to be accurate, we look forward to Pat's future posts and any further light they shed on the duplicitous tactics that are being employed to smear the 9/11 truth movement which, for all its shortcomings, is an genuine attempt to get questions answered and find out the full truth of what happened on that fateful day.

the irony...

[westprog]

The blogger is always the last to know. Guess I should start taking those meds again, because my other personality (Retsniarb) is starting to take control.:D

Looks like the person who started the fake (http://ewing2001.blogspot.com/) Nico Haupt blog is behind this.

James and I have no problems aside from his irrational support for the Seattle Seahawks over the greatest franchise in the history of the NFL, the Arizona Cardinals.

How convoluted his thinking must be to decide that the only way to get the Truth out there is to carry out a disinformation campaign.

[Gravy]

"Duplicitous tactic" = explaining why denier claims are wrong.

Honest debunking = agreeing with denier falsehoods.

Prisonplanet = The source for accurate information in today's fast-paced world.

[Arus808]

Did anyone get a copy of the original Prison Planet article? It's already undergone one 'scrub'. I sense another coming.



the irony...

Yup, posted in its original entirety in this thread:


http://forum.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=messageboard.viewThread&groupID=0&page=24&EntryID=2239634&CategoryID=72&get=1&adTopicId=16&keyword=politics&xargstringp=&xargstringn=&lastpagesent=0&Mytoken=31C80B92-7726-405E-A55CF489BB8296398098577

the Unaltered passage:


This admission validates in part our continued efforts to rebut 9/11 debunkers and their ad hominem attacks and baseless hit pieces, from within both the mainstream and other media avenues.

It is also a damning indictment of how the holocaust card is continually played, most recently in the context of the global warming argument, in an attempt to silence debate and attack the messenger while refusing to evaluate the evidence.

We appreciate Pat for his honesty and though we will obviously never agree on all the issues, we look forward to his future posts and any further light they shed on the duplicitous tactics that are being employed to smear the 9/11 truth movement which, for all its shortcomings, is an genuine attempt to get questions answered and find out the full truth of what happened on that fateful day.

[Arus808]

haha the comments are priceless:


Kevin (http://www.blogger.com/profile/13924758468302004709) said... Pat,

We'd like you to come on The Alex Jones Show, how's 1pm CST, today 3-14-07. Let me know ASAP.

Thanks,

Kevin Smith
Producer, The Alex Jones Show
kevin@infowars.com
March 14, 2007 10:05 AM

[Donal]

The blogger is always the last to know. Guess I should start taking those meds again, because my other personality (Retsniarb) is starting to take control.:D

Looks like the person who started the fake (http://ewing2001.blogspot.com/) Nico Haupt blog is behind this.

James and I have no problems aside from his irrational support for the Seattle Seahawks over the greatest franchise in the history of the NFL, the Arizona Cardinals.


I am aware of one particularly annoying and verbose Twoofer that roots for the Seagulls. In fact, he does a pretty good job of making grammatically correct posts, until the discussion drags out and he breaks down into the usual gibberish.

It would be really stupid of him to leave this many calling cards, but then again, in their world, that is what master criminals do.

[Brainster]

I am aware of one particularly annoying and verbose Twoofer that roots for the Seagulls. In fact, he does a pretty good job of making grammatically correct posts, until the discussion drags out and he breaks down into the usual gibberish.

It would be really stupid of him to leave this many calling cards, but then again, in their world, that is what master criminals do.

No, James B, the real James B, not the guy who's impersonating me, roots for the Seahawks.

[Horatius]

Does this remind anyone else of the "Mike the EMT" story? A totally implausible list of twoofer wet dreams - admissions that debunkers make things up, a denial of the Holocaust deniers involved in the twoof movement, implications that they "made a deal" with some shadowy figure, and a take down of Nico Haupt, all in one nice package.

I think the faker tried for too much. And of course, a bunch of twoofers fell for it, because it confirmed their paranoia, and they didn't bother to do any fact-checking.

[WildCat]

James and I have no problems aside from his irrational support for the Seattle Seahawks over the greatest franchise in the history of the NFL, the Chicago St. Louis Arizona Cardinals.
Fixed that for ya. :p

[LashL]

Yup, posted in its original entirety in this thread:


http://forum.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=messageboard.viewThread&groupID=0&page=24&EntryID=2239634&CategoryID=72&get=1&adTopicId=16&keyword=politics&xargstringp=&xargstringn=&lastpagesent=0&Mytoken=31C80B92-7726-405E-A55CF489BB8296398098577

the Unaltered passage:

Good work, Arus!

I notice that Prison Planet is STILL lying in their story - even though they now admit that they were fooled by the hoax, they write Our original article is posted below in full. followed by - not the original article - but the first scrubbed version.

Lying liars telling more lies. How unsurprising.

[T.A.M.]

I am not a violent man, but these stupid, ignorant, obnoxious, intellectually retarded inviduals need to be put in their place somehow.

Ok, now that I have said that, who is game for a fake Dylan Avery Site or a fake Killtown site, or a fake Alex Jones site?

Lets see how they appreciate the tables turned...ya I know, lets not sink ourselves to their level (how could we without the use of a steel anchor).

Fine fine fine.

TAM:(

[Pardalis]

I am not a violent man


You got to be kidding, I would never have guessed! :D

[chipmunk stew]

I just entered the blog post into our Northrop Grumman Lingualyzer and ran some samples against it. The highest correlation ratio, at 97%, was scooby.

Due to a clause in the Patriot Act, the originating computers for both fake Pat and scooby are currently being traced, and we'll have an open connection to their hard-drives within the hour. Meanwhile, through a separate clause, agents are bypassing the warrant process and preparing to bring him in. Verification can take several months, but we should be able to extract some good actionable intelligence in the meantime, during his interrogation.

[Belz...]

The "Ha ha ha!! tell is common (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=2025139#post2025139) among the Deniers.

Well, at least it sounds better than "LOL" when spoken aloud.

I hate acroyms. ;)

[rwguinn]

...James and I have no problems aside from his irrational support for the Seattle Seahawks over the greatest franchise in the history of the NFL, the Arizona Cardinals.

So, you actually did have an untreated case of delusions of adequacy!

[MG1962]

I was interested in the blog comments to see someome from Alex Jones show asking for an interview.

And you damn debunkers.... No respect. Obviously the only franchise in the NFL worth considering is the Green Bay Packers

[JimBenArm]

I was interested in the blog comments to see someome from Alex Jones show asking for an interview.

And you damn debunkers.... No respect. Obviously the only franchise in the NFL worth considering is the Green Bay Packers
I spit on these pretend teams! Chiefs, baby!
Arrowhead rocks!

[The Silver Shadow]

Nothing beats out F1 :D

[CHF]

If anyone wants to know why twoofers are so desperate for news these days, look up 911truth.org or loosechange911.com on www.alexa.com

The truther ship in sinking fast.

[Alareth]

Go Jets!

[gumboot]

I spit on these pretend teams! Chiefs, baby!
Arrowhead rocks!


Why don't you namby pamby Americans take off all that girly padding and take on a rugby team? ;)

-Gumboot

[JimBenArm]

Why don't you namby pamby Americans take off all that girly padding and take on a rugby team? ;)

-Gumboot
Because we like to keep our brains inside our heads, thank you!

[hellaeon]

Pat has some legal grounds to go after the impersonator, not the least of which the impersonator has most likely violated Blogger.com's Terms of Service

Member agrees not to transmit through the Service any unlawful, harassing, libelous, abusive, threatening, or harmful material of any kind or nature. Member further agrees not to transmit any material that encourages conduct that could constitute a criminal offense, give rise to civil liability or otherwise violate any applicable local, state, national or international law or regulation. Attempts to gain unauthorized access to other computer systems are prohibited.


Member shall not interfere with another Member's use and enjoyment of the Service or another entity's use and enjoyment of similar services.
Pyra may, at its sole discretion, immediately terminate Service should Member's conduct fail to conform with these terms and conditions of the BTS.

...

You agree to not use the Service to: (a) upload, post or otherwise transmit any Content that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, tortious, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, invasive of another's privacy, hateful, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable; (b) harm minors in any way; (c) impersonate any person or entity, including, but not limited to, a Pyra official, forum leader, guide or host, or falsely state or otherwise misrepresent your affiliation with a person or entity;...

um...heh...whoops....

[Babbylonian]

So, um...is this "COINTELPRO?"

[hellaeon]

Why don't you namby pamby Americans take off all that girly padding and take on a rugby team? ;)

-Gumboot

Or the Adelaide Crows Aussie rules footy team

[GlennB]

...

Ok, now that I have said that, who is game for a fake Dylan Avery Site or a fake Killtown site, or a fake Alex Jones site?



How would anybody tell the difference?

[Horatius]

How would anybody tell the difference?




We could make them sound perfectly sane and reasonable. That's be a dead give-away!

[gumboot]

Because we like to keep our brains inside our heads, thank you!

Pish posh. You don't need those clunky helmets to do that. A couple of wraps of tape around the ears keeps the ole brains in nicely.

-Gumboot

[Unfit4Command]

I was just reading through some of the comments on Screw Loose Change EXPOSED. (http://screwloosechangeexposed.blogspot.com/)
Some of them are pretty funny.

"If this is legit, there may be attempts made to shut you up, including hacking or deleting this blog. If you ever need a place to host this let me know.

jim1 at zlonk dot com"

Yeah...all of the debunkers are going to shut this fake Pat up, and delete his blog.

" Pat,

We'd like you to come on The Alex Jones Show, how's 1pm CST, today 3-14-07. Let me know ASAP.

Thanks,

Kevin Smith
Producer, The Alex Jones Show
kevin@infowars.com"

Sweet, I wouldn't mind being on the Alex Jones show. :)

" Who is fooling who here?

A. Even if it is a fraud, the main point is still true. The 'Debunkers' have to resort to the dirtiest propaganda tricks. They cannot rely on Facts because they LOSE!

B.If it was an attempt to embarrass the 'Truth Movement' by the SLC people, I think it backfired horribly in your face.

C. If it's true, then the Screw Loose Change goose has been cooked.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it, Fools."

This one is probably my favorite. "They cannot rely on Facts" lmao! maybe he meant to say "The 'Truthers'"

"Just amazing. Please, if this is legit, tell us the story, before you get assassinated or paid off or something."

Pretty funny stuff. :)

I'm really surprised that people actually think that the SLC people made this blog rather than some random idiot Truther. If Pat wanted to make another blog, I'm pretty sure he would have just used his other profile rather than making a whole new one.

[mailman]

Or the Adelaide Crows Aussie rules footy team

You have to be a poof to wear shorts THAT tight! :eek:

Mailman

[Brainache]

You have to be a poof to wear shorts THAT tight! :eek:

Mailman

Just a tip Mailman: If you meet a professional AFL player it might not be a good idea to mention your theory. They tend to be a bit sensitive about it.

[Horatius]

http://screwloosechangeexposed.blogspot.com/


And they keep trying, now with the Mysterious Mr. Jordan!