Saddam's Sons are WASTED

[Jedi Knight]

Breaking news------> Saddam's sons, according to leftist media reports, have been Killed in Action.

YAY

Mess with the United States and get sent into a body bag!

JK

[Bjorn]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight
according to leftist media reports .... Can't really be true, then ... :p

[Upchurch]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight
Breaking news------> Saddam's sons, according to leftist media reports, have been Killed in Action. Source?

edit:

found this (http://www.msnbc.com/news/870749.asp?0cv=CA01)

[Mr Manifesto]

From Commie News Network (http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/07/22/sprj.irq.main/index.html)

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- U.S. troops are investigating whether Saddam Hussein's sons Uday and Qusay were among those killed or captured during a firefight with American troops in the northern Iraqi city of Mosul, Pentagon officials told CNN.

A U.S. official told CNN Pentagon Correspondent Barbara Starr that no people were captured at the house raided in Mosul, and that four people were killed. Further details were expected shortly.

Meanwhile, a U.S. soldier was killed Tuesday and another was wounded in a convoy ambush north of Baghdad, the U.S. military said...

Well, those soldiers will be the last ones. As soon as word gets around, hostilities will cease, the big celebration welcoming the troops that we've all been waiting for will commence, and Iraq will incorporate the Stars and Stripes in the Iraqi flag.

[American]

YYEEEEE HA!

I'm not some blood thirsty animal, but god damn I just cracked a big smile for the first time in weeks.


(I know certain others will be upset and pout about it. Good.)

[Tmy]

Shoudl we openly cheer the deaths of human beings! What will the children think, that violence is OK!! WONT SOMEONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!!


(ps I'm waitin for some real proof of their deaths)

[renata]

It is of course possible they were killed. And, if they have, I will not shed tears for them. But let's invoke the 48 hour rule, remember we killed Saddam twice already.

[Upchurch]

Originally posted by renata
But let's invoke the 48 hour rule, remember we killed Saddam twice already. Way to skeptic, renata.

[Tricky]

Originally posted by American
I'm not some blood thirsty animal, but god damn I just cracked a big smile for the first time in weeks.


(I know certain others will be upset and pout about it. Good.) [/B]
I'm not sure who you think will react this way. Even those of us who were against the war didn't like Hussein and his "entourage". I think we all want to see an end to the killing, and getting rid of the warlords (hopefully without also offing a bunch of civilians) is positive thing.

I hope the news is true, but like others, I think there has been a real credibility problem with reports out of Iraq.

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight
Mess with the United States and get sent into a body bag!
JK

That's disgusting. Insert "Iraq" for "United States" and it sounds like something the Iraqi guerillas would say after killing an American soldier. We're better than that.

[Jedi Knight]

Hey you know who is a sexy Muslim chick? Rym Brahimi. I am watching her on TV right now and she is pretty sexy.

I love Lebanese-looking women anyway.

http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2002/WORLD/meast/11/08/iraq.resolution.brahimi.otsc/story.rym.jpg

JK

[Tmy]

I find is strange that both sons would be together. Wouldnt they be split up just like with dad.

Right now the reports are from "unknown sources". Could be Bushites trying stir up a distraction for all we know.

[Jedi Knight]

Originally posted by Hexxenhammer


That's disgusting. Insert "Iraq" for "United States" and it sounds like something the Iraqi guerillas would say after killing an American soldier. We're better than that.

No, we are warriors and it is perfectly acceptable to celebrate the diversity of the destruction of our enemies. You should learn to be more tolerant of war-hawks like me that enjoy the destruction of the Baath regime in Iraq. Learn some tolerance and respect for some multiculturalism and diverse opinions like mine, since they are arch-conservative opinions and rare in the nation-state.

It is a hate-crime to not respect the opinions of war-hawks like me. I am a minority in America and deserve tolerance.

That said, I am so happy Saddam's sons are dead I could throw a block-party and dance in the streets.

JK

[Segnosaur]

I won't believe this until its been confirmed by FoxNews.

[richardm]

The BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3087121.stm) are reporting this as well.

So far all that has been officially acknowledged is that several "High-Interest personalities" have been captured. There's local speculation that Saddam's sons were in the building, but nobody knows whether they've been killed or captured.

And I'm prepared to bet that we won't know today, either. Maybe tomorrow?

[Yahweh]

Saddam's Sons are WASTED
Wasted is a good word. Not like its euphemistic cousins like "perished" and "fatally wounded". It has a better ring than "killed" and "slaughtered". And its certainly funnier than "bit the dust" and "croaked"...

[ceptimus]

I wonder why the Americans didn't just arrest the sons and question them on where the WMD could be found? ;)

ceptimus.

[no one in particular]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight


Learn some tolerance and respect for some multiculturalism and diverse opinions like mine, since they are arch-conservative opinions and rare in the nation-state.

It is a hate-crime to not respect the opinions of war-hawks like me. I am a minority in America and deserve tolerance.
This response, Jedi, is why you rise to the top of trolldom. This is absolutely brilliant in its idiocy. Now, isn’t there a language award around here somewhere? No, I am too ashamed of myself for enjoying this post to nominate it.

[HarryKeogh]

i hope this is true and i hope that they suffered before dying.

[Checkmite]

Originally posted by ceptimus
I wonder why the Americans didn't just arrest the sons and question them on where the WMD could be found? ;)

ceptimus.

The incident was described as a firefight. Since it wasn't "discovered" (I use the term loosely) that two of the bodies may have been Saddamites until after they were dead and the firefight was over, I'd assume that interrogation would encounter some ontological difficulties.

Of course, as of now we have video of the aftermath of the fight, but that's it; there's absolutely no evidence that any of the bodies were related to Saddam (HINT: A news report attributing an "unknown source" is really just a rumor).

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight


No, we are warriors and it is perfectly acceptable to celebrate the diversity of the destruction of our enemies. You should learn to be more tolerant of war-hawks like me that enjoy the destruction of the Baath regime in Iraq. Learn some tolerance and respect for some multiculturalism and diverse opinions like mine, since they are arch-conservative opinions and rare in the nation-state.

It is a hate-crime to not respect the opinions of war-hawks like me. I am a minority in America and deserve tolerance.

That said, I am so happy Saddam's sons are dead I could throw a block-party and dance in the streets.

JK

Note how I'm not taking the bait.

[Crossbow]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight


No, we are warriors and it is perfectly acceptable to celebrate the diversity of the destruction of our enemies. You should learn to be more tolerant of war-hawks like me that enjoy the destruction of the Baath regime in Iraq. Learn some tolerance and respect for some multiculturalism and diverse opinions like mine, since they are arch-conservative opinions and rare in the nation-state.

It is a hate-crime to not respect the opinions of war-hawks like me. I am a minority in America and deserve tolerance.

That said, I am so happy Saddam's sons are dead I could throw a block-party and dance in the streets.

JK

And while you are demonstrating your vaunted war virtues during your party, share some of your ideas on how humans came from Mars, how gravity works, and the origins of the universe.

[HarryKeogh]

they are confirmed DEAD!!!!!!

WOO HOO!!!!!!!!!!!!

[renata]

Originally posted by HarryKeogh
they are confirmed DEAD!!!!!!

WOO HOO!!!!!!!!!!!!

I saw that on CNN. It is unfortunate from the intelligence perspective they were not taken alive, but it is good they have been located. They were very bad people, and I am not sad to see they are gone.

Am I the only one who finds the CNN headline "Trumped" in bad taste?

[Brown]

From the Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A26854-2003Jul22.html?nav=hptop_tb) (registration may be required):The two sons of fomer Iraqi president Saddam Hussein were killed today by U.S. troops in a firefight in the northern Iraqi city of Mosul, Gen. Ricardo Sanchez announced this afternoon in a press briefing in Baghdad.

[Tricky]

Well, that's good. Hopefully this will bring a quicker end to the guerrilla resistance, but hard to say. Depends if the guerrillas see martyrdom, or a look at their own futures.

Um... did they happen to be carrying any WMDs?

[Brown]

Originally posted by renata
Am I the only one who finds the CNN headline "Trumped" in bad taste? I find it in poor taste, too.

It is a banner headline showing the men's heads on playing cards, with the word "TRUMPED" in all caps between the heads.

This is what you'd expect from a tabloid. I had thought CNN had higher standards than that.

[roger]

Originally posted by renata
Am I the only one who finds the CNN headline "Trumped" in bad taste?
Well, what else do you expect from the leftest media? :)

[JAR]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight
Hey you know who is a sexy Muslim chick? Rym Brahimi. I am watching her on TV right now and she is pretty sexy.

I love Lebanese-looking women anyway.

http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2002/WORLD/meast/11/08/iraq.resolution.brahimi.otsc/story.rym.jpg

JK
I've noticed that Lebanese women are often very attractive too.

[Aoidoi]

Well, you know kids. Bush's daughters got caught getting wasted too.

... oh, wait.

Nevermind.

:D

[Brown]

Originally posted by renata
Am I the only one who finds the CNN headline "Trumped" in bad taste? Compared to the extremely tacky title of this thread, "Trumped" is almost dignified.

[renata]

Originally posted by Brown
Compared to the extremely tacky title of this thread, "Trumped" is almost dignified.

Good point. I can't wait to see what bastions of journalism like NY Post will do...

[Tmy]

I was always bothered by how are laeders can be so cavalier when talking about killing Saddam and the like.

Its just weird that these rich well educated powerful people are so easily carrying on about "bombing this building" "hope that so and so was killed". Even though we are talking about killing scrum, they are still people. Country leaders to boot!

Then these same politicians will hoo and haw about local gang violence ect,.... and they turn around and behave the same way.

[mjv]

Originally posted by Tmy
I find is strange that both sons would be together.

Same here. Strikes me as very convenient of them to be in the same place at the same time.

I just watched a documentary on them last night. I recall it featured a former body double of Uday and I would be suprised if Qusay didn't as well. I vaguely recall there being mention of more than one for Sadam, so maybe the sons had more than one as well.


From what I watched last night, nobody is going to mourn them, but I hope everyone is not just getting excited over a couple of body doubles.

[Brown]

Originally posted by renata
Good point. I can't wait to see what bastions of journalism like NY Post will do... Well, here's what ABC News (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s907893.htm) did ("A" apparently standing for "Australian"): "US claims scalps of Saddam's sons." That's tasteless on multiple levels.

[SteveW]

Sorry, I think it is deplorable to cheer the killing of anyone.

Were they sitting on the locations of the non-existent WMD's? Or maybe they had the uranium contracts in their pocket.

I sort of know now what Germans felt like in 1939.

[renata]

Originally posted by Brown
Well, here's what ABC News (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s907893.htm) did ("A" apparently standing for "Australian"): "US claims scalps of Saddam's sons." That's tasteless on multiple levels.


:eek: :eek:

We should have a contest for the most inappropriate headline on this.

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by SteveW
Were they sitting on the locations of the non-existent WMD's? Or maybe they had the uranium contracts in their pocket.


No WMD, but Saddam's sons were killed during a gun battle when American forces went to do a search.

Now, if American soldiers are faced with gunfire, it does make sense that they would shoot back.

[Brown]

Weren't these guys supposed to have looted a BILLION (with a "b") dollars before going into hiding?

Where's the money? Inquiring minds want to know.

[renata]

Originally posted by Brown
Weren't these guys supposed to have looted a BILLION (with a "b") dollars before going into hiding?

Where's the money? Inquiring minds want to know.


They found most of it, I think. Can't find the links now, but at some point US troops were finding caches of hundreds of millions dollars at a time. Some US soldiers tried to steal some, and got caught, as I recall.

[Jedi Knight]

Originally posted by HarryKeogh
they are confirmed DEAD!!!!!!

WOO HOO!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yep, two of Saddam's primary biological weapons have been destroyed.

JK

[Jedi Knight]

Originally posted by no one in particular
This response, Jedi, is why you rise to the top of trolldom. This is absolutely brilliant in its idiocy. Now, isn’t there a language award around here somewhere? No, I am too ashamed of myself for enjoying this post to nominate it.

lol, you have to admit it is brilliant. :D

JK

[crocodile deathroll]

YEE HAAAA All you America troops can remove your flack jackets and throw your helmets into the air now.

Some very lucky Iraqi is going to get $$$$$$RICH! RICH! RICH! $$$$$$$$

[Ed]

Excellent, excellent news. Those were two bastards that richly deserved dying.

PS. Even my real commie, NY Jewish, limosene liberial, whining, bleeding heart, gun control favoring, horrendous black person behavior excusing, Bush hating, Cuomo quoteing, Hillary voting, Ozone decrying, endangered animal snuggling, bilingual education favoring friends are cheering.


Com'on, JK, you big lug, give us a hug :rub: :wink8:

[HarryKeogh]

Originally posted by Brown
Well, here's what ABC News (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s907893.htm) did ("A" apparently standing for "Australian"): "US claims scalps of Saddam's sons." That's tasteless on multiple levels.

I find the rape, torture and murder of your fellow countrymen infinitely more tasteless.

Glad to see were looking at the big picture here...the tackiness of news headlines.

[arcticpenguin]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=574&ncid=721&e=1&u=/nm/20030722/wl_nm/iraq_usa_sons_dc

The younger son, Qusay, emerged as political heir to his father. Uday, the eldest, was feared throughout Iraq for his cruelty and fell from favor after beating to death one of his father's favorite servants.

The United States had offered a $15 million reward for information leading to the capture of each son and a $25 million reward for Saddam. Sanchez said he expected that rewards would probably be paid out for the information leading to the location of Saddam's sons.

[Roadtoad]

I think Renata had the right idea. I say give it 48 hours. Personally, I want to wait at least a week. I can only hope this is the beginning of the end.

But, considering how many people in Iraq owe their livelihoods to the Husseins, I'm not betting the rent. Not yet. If anything, I'm expecting one hell of a backlash.

[Richard G]

Baghdad celebrates news of deaths ...


http://thescotsman.co.uk/international.cfm?id=796092003

[American]

I think the lefties need to trade lives with this guy.

Alaa Hamed, who was regularly beaten with cables and clubs when he worked as a producer for Uday’s television station, said: "I don’t want him dead. I want to torture him first."

What's the biggest problem in San Francisco? What color iMac to buy?

[Frank Newgent]

Originally posted by Jedi Knight
I am so happy Saddam's sons are dead I could throw a block-party and dance in the streets.

JK

Heard that Little Joe got away.

[peptoabysmal]

Originally posted by renata



They found most of it, I think. Can't find the links now, but at some point US troops were finding caches of hundreds of millions dollars at a time. Some US soldiers tried to steal some, and got caught, as I recall.

Reminds me of one of my favorite movies: Kelly's Heroes.

I still think Saddam is at the bottom of a million tons of rubble in a bunker somewhere and we'll never see him again, except on videotape.

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by American
I think the lefties need to trade lives with this guy.



What's the biggest problem in San Francisco? What color iMac to buy?

Oh no! The "If you are against the American occupation you must be for Saddam" argument has reared its head again!

[Tmy]

Too bad they didnt catch them alive. Parading them around couldve set an example for other despots.

I guess one their 14 yr old sons were killed also.

What happens to them now? Do they get a funeral? Burial plots?

[Supercharts]

Dental records confirm that they are, indeed, Sodom Hussaine's sons.

[Skeptical Greg]

Originally posted by Tmy
Too bad they didnt catch them alive. Parading them around couldve set an example for other despots.




Oh, I would say ' dead ', is a pretty good example..

[Tmy]

Originally posted by Diogenes



Oh, I would say ' dead ', is a pretty good example..

Oh the "dead" part woudl come later. After a big trial in Iraq were a parade of witnessess cound confront the wonder twins about their misdeeds.

Or even the old Musulini drag thru the streets, thats a classic.

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by Tmy


Oh the "dead" part woudl come later. After a big trial in Iraq were a parade of witnessess cound confront the wonder twins about their misdeeds.


Then you'd have people complaining how barbaric the death penalty is.

[richardm]

Originally posted by Tmy
Too bad they didnt catch them alive. Parading them around couldve set an example for other despots.

It would also allow them to be shown on television, which would prove that they were really caught. There appears to be a good deal of scepticism in Iraq that they are really dead, at the moment, and the seems to be a lot of squeamishness about showing their bodies in order to prove it.

Maybe "squeamishness" is the wrong word, but there is certainly reluctance. Frankly, I think a lot of Iraqis will remain unconvinced unless they do.

[PygmyPlaidGiraffe]

Several things cause me to doubt that the two b*st*rds were killed....

Bush makes a statement merely hours later, stating they are dead. Where is the confirmation, the proof? How can we be sure the bodies are not body doubles. Did they do DNA tests? Tests have been mentioned but what kind of tests

The body count was 4, apparantly 4 individuals holed up in a villa and all they had were small arms. THe Regime's #2 and #3 together with two bodyguards? Sounds unlikely.


If there were only 4, why was the complex attacked by gunships with 20 missiles?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3088991.stm

How Battle Unfolded (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3088509.stm)

[richardm]

Originally posted by PygmyPlaidGiraffe
Tests have been mentioned but what kind of tests


Checks on dental records, mostly, plus identification by other Ba'ath party officials. Both of which could be faked, either by old party officials wanting to make the doubles perfect, or by the USA pretending that they records match.

But presumably DNA evidence could be faked as well. If they really look alike, then dead doubles would look the same on television. There would be no way of proving that the bodies are who they're said to be if you don't accept any of the evidence.

So I don't think it's a very productive line of reasoning!

[Gem]

The Iraqui informant who gave the tip away just got a tip back.
About 30 million US dollars.

I think he's happy now..

Gem

[richardm]

Originally posted by Gem
The Iraqui informant who gave the tip away just got a tip back.
About 30 million US dollars.

I think he's happy now..

Gem

Ah, they've given him the whole lot, have they? Good. The BBC were saying that he'd probably get just part of it, which would have been a shame.

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by PygmyPlaidGiraffe
The body count was 4, apparantly 4 individuals holed up in a villa and all they had were small arms. THe Regime's #2 and #3 together with two bodyguards? Sounds unlikely.


I thought one of the people that was killed was supposed to be one of their sons (so there would only be one body guard).

Of course, the likelyhood that both sons would be together with such limited protection depends on what their tactics were. A smaller number of body guards makes it easier to hide (since they won't draw as much attention to themselves as they would if they wandering about with dozens of men.) And even if they decided to use more guards, the amount of protection they would provide would be limited, given America's tactical superiority. (All the bodyguards in the world would not be able to protect them from an air strike.)

[Ed]

Originally posted by PygmyPlaidGiraffe
Several things cause me to doubt that the two b*st*rds were killed....

Bush makes a statement merely hours later, stating they are dead. Where is the confirmation, the proof? How can we be sure the bodies are not body doubles. Did they do DNA tests? Tests have been mentioned but what kind of tests

The body count was 4, apparantly 4 individuals holed up in a villa and all they had were small arms. THe Regime's #2 and #3 together with two bodyguards? Sounds unlikely.


If there were only 4, why was the complex attacked by gunships with 20 missiles?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3088991.stm

How Battle Unfolded (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3088509.stm)

I suspect that we have DNA, fingerprints and so on for most important people in the world. Easy to obtain and might come in handy. like now. I suppose anything could be faked, even the moon landing. I am not sure how productive evolving a conspiracy theory is at this point.

Regarding the size of the attack. You are joking right? Why would you not have overwhelming force?

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by Ed


I suspect that we have DNA, fingerprints and so on for most important people in the world. Easy to obtain and might come in handy. like now. I suppose anything could be faked, even the moon landing. I am not sure how productive evolving a conspiracy theory is at this point.

Regarding the size of the attack. You are joking right? Why would you not have overwhelming force?

Does anybody read articles here any more?

injuries on one of the bodies matched those on Uday's X-ray records, taken after an assassination attempt crippled him.

So, unless they also crippled his body double, its a pretty good indication that they got at least ONE of the sons.

[Blue Monk]

Originally posted by Ed


I suspect that we have DNA, fingerprints and so on for most important people in the world. Easy to obtain and might come in handy. like now. I suppose anything could be faked, even the moon landing. I am not sure how productive evolving a conspiracy theory is at this point.

Regarding the size of the attack. You are joking right? Why would you not have overwhelming force?

I agree.

The #1 reason for not faking their deaths........

How the hell could you prevent them from popping up later and exposing the whole sham?

And I agree with you on the use of force. The point is to get the job done, not prove some macho nonsense. The greater the force, the greater chances of not sustaining casualties yourself.

All cops do it. If they have a problem they call in every available cop. It only makes sense.

[richardm]

Originally posted by Segnosaur


Does anybody read articles here any more?

injuries on one of the bodies matched those on Uday's X-ray records, taken after an assassination attempt crippled him.

So, unless they also crippled his body double, its a pretty good indication that they got at least ONE of the sons.

.. And indeed:

The leader of US-led coalition ground forces in Iraq said dental records and independent positive identifications by four former regime officials showed that two bodies recovered from the villa were Qusay and Uday Hussein.

I think PygmyPlaid's inplication was that the Americans might be pretending to have killed them, and have just said that the records matched, in the hope of quieting things down.

But as Ed says, they wouldn't do that, since there is then an excellent chance that they'll pop up later, very much alive.

[Ed]

Bump because I want to hear what you say about the lack of the pictures. Is showing them the same as the Iraqis showing pictures of dead US soldiers? I sorta think not.

[Ed]

Originally posted by richardm




But as Ed says, they wouldn't do that, since there is then an excellent chance that they'll pop up later, very much alive.

I just would sorta like to believe our military when they make a flat out statement. Call me old fashioned.

C'mon, JK, give us a celebratory hug :rub: , you know you want to.:D (sorry to all for this. I just find the concept amusing)

[ImpyTimpy]

I don't think body double theory is as shoddy as people try and make it out to be. What better way to stop worrying about being hunted by U.S. then stage your own death by using body doubles and dental/medical records left behind of the body doubles.

The thing which seems very strange is that they were both together with only two body guards. Rather then surrender they decided to fight back even though they had no hope of winning...

Something's fishy here and it doesn't take a genius to see it.

[Ed]

Originally posted by ImpyTimpy
I don't think body double theory is as shoddy as people try and make it out to be. What better way to stop worrying about being hunted by U.S. then stage your own death by using body doubles and dental/medical records left behind of the body doubles.

The thing which seems very strange is that they were both together with only two body guards. Rather then surrender they decided to fight back even though they had no hope of winning...

Something's fishy here and it doesn't take a genius to see it.

I have read that the best form of gross identification is the shape of the ear. Because of the cartalige you can't just surgically make two peoples ears match. So, for a body double theory to work, it would mean that the real guys were never photographed. I sorta give credit to the powers that be to make an ID.

Regarding the second point. Would a hired hand really die for Saddam a la Butch and the Sundance Kid? Maybe, maybe not. It makes sense that they were slithering around incognito.

[WildCat]

According to NBC News tonight, Special Forces stormed the house and found the 4 (the 2 sons, grandson and bodyguard) in a safe room. Special Forces took fire from the 4, who were behind bulletproof glass, and 3 were injured. They retreated and pounded the house w/ heavy machine guns and RPG's and were still taking fire from the house, so they called in the helicopter gunships. Even after this there was still fire coming from the house, apparently the safe room was very heavily reinforced. Finally, they shot 10 TOW anti-tank missles into the house and then went inside, only to take fire from Qusai's 14 year old son , who was then killed. The NBC correspondent said he was shown pics of the bodies and it was quite gruesome. Also, not only were they identified w/ dental records and people who knew the 2, but Udai has a titanium hip as did one of the bodies.
Just found this story here. (http://www.msnbc.com/news/943232.asp?0cv=CA01)

[renata]

Just heard US will be releasing the photos of the dead bodies, apparently they are graphic.

On the one hand, it may be sufficinet proof for some that they are dead (although if they think US can fake the deaths, why can't we fake photos also?). On the other hand, I remember the uproar when photos of dead US soldiers were released and broadcast. Are there circumstances when releasing photos of dead bodies are appropriate, and times when it is not?

[Doubt]

Originally posted by ImpyTimpy
I don't think body double theory is as shoddy as people try and make it out to be. What better way to stop worrying about being hunted by U.S. then stage your own death by using body doubles and dental/medical records left behind of the body doubles.

The thing which seems very strange is that they were both together with only two body guards. Rather then surrender they decided to fight back even though they had no hope of winning...

Something's fishy here and it doesn't take a genius to see it.

Okay Impy,

Put yourself in the position of the people in that house.

You are trying to fight a guerilla war in an urban setting. Do you:

a.) Keep a low profile and avoid concentrating your people so as not to attract attention.
b.) Keep a large entourage of bodyguards around, even though you are hiding in a populated area with a multi million-dollar reward hanging over your head.

You’re not going to win a firefight like that even if you have 20 bodyguards. The idea is to avoid detection first and fight only to make an escape. Guerillas only concentrate their forces when it is to their advantage. Since these two clods were not battlefield commanders, it would never make sense to build a concentration around them.

Most of what they would need to do could be handled through a runner, which may have been why the 14-year-old was around. The bodyguard would have been quite useful to drive them around while they hid in whatever vehicle was being used.

Having more people around just would have made them easier to detect. Also, if they were working in a cellular format, the fewer people who know where they are, the better. That would include friendly forces.

Could it be faked? Sure, but what would be the point? All that would happen is that the next tape from Saddam showed up it would also include the voices of the two sons, and the whole thing turns into a waste of time.

[peptoabysmal]

Originally posted by ImpyTimpy
I don't think body double theory is as shoddy as people try and make it out to be. What better way to stop worrying about being hunted by U.S. then stage your own death by using body doubles and dental/medical records left behind of the body doubles.

The thing which seems very strange is that they were both together with only two body guards. Rather then surrender they decided to fight back even though they had no hope of winning...

Something's fishy here and it doesn't take a genius to see it.

It doesn't take a genius to wrap tinfoil on his head to keep the government spy satellites from reading his thoughts, either.

Seen any black helicopters lately?

[crocodile deathroll]

It is good to see the demise of such SOBs but I suspect it will not solve the problems in the long run as Iraq descends onto just another chronic Jihadi resistance front like Afghanistan.

In years to come Saddam Hussein would be long forgotten, but there will still be emergent political problems case by this Jihadi Resistance movements in that region which Donald Rumsfeld had never dreamt of.

[The Fool]

Originally posted by peptoabysmal


It doesn't take a genius to wrap tinfoil on his head to keep the government spy satellites from reading his thoughts, either.

Seen any black helicopters lately?
I saw them just this morning, riding in a limo with Elvis.

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by Ed


I have read that the best form of gross identification is the shape of the ear. Because of the cartalige you can't just surgically make two peoples ears match. So, for a body double theory to work, it would mean that the real guys were never photographed. I sorta give credit to the powers that be to make an ID.

Regarding the second point. Would a hired hand really die for Saddam a la Butch and the Sundance Kid? Maybe, maybe not. It makes sense that they were slithering around incognito.

Also, keep in mind that one of the bodies was identified by comparing the injuries to ones sustained earlier... Would a body-double really be willing to have himself disabled just to play the part of one of Saddam's sons?

[PygmyPlaidGiraffe]

Originally posted by Segnosaur


Does anybody read articles here any more?

injuries on one of the bodies matched those on Uday's X-ray records, taken after an assassination attempt crippled him.

So, unless they also crippled his body double, its a pretty good indication that they got at least ONE of the sons.

thanks for pointing that out


I initially read those articles over 2 times each, searching for references to tests... didn't see for looking I guess.:rolleyes:

I was looking for information on how they could identify these bodies after hearing Bush's address which touched on the matter.

[Larspeart]

I'm not better then that (cheering that they are dead).

/em cheers, whoops and hollars!

I also feel that I can say things like 'I am better then them. my country is better then theirs. Their culture sucks. . .' the list of things I can say go on and on.

Lucky for me I don't care when people say 'that makes you a cocky american cowboy, ad nauseum'.

:p

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by Larspeart

I also feel that I can say things like 'I am better then them. my country is better then theirs. Their culture sucks. . .' the list of things I can say go on and on.

Lucky for me I don't care when people say 'that makes you a cocky american cowboy, ad nauseum'.




Except that you don't know anything about Iraqi culture and, until CNN and FOX put the map of the Middle East on every two minutes during the second gulf war, you couldn't even point to Iraq on a map. Maybe you still can't.

Just out of curiosity, without goggling (remember, you're only cheating yourself...), what's the capital of Australia?

[ImpyTimpy]

Ok, I'm going to address the replies to the body double theory in one post here.

Why the hell were they still in the country? Unless the two were morons they would've fled the country along with Saddam same way Osama did when the fighting started. That's why I'm thinking this is possibly a set-up - we're dead, don't look for us anymore. Of course this is only a theory of mine.

Another possibility is that Saddam left them behind so that they would be killed. Given Saddam's nutty nature that wouldn't surprise me.

[ImpyTimpy]

Ooh, I know this one.. It's America isn't it..

:p

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto



Except that you don't know anything about Iraqi culture and, until CNN and FOX put the map of the Middle East on every two minutes during the second gulf war, you couldn't even point to Iraq on a map. Maybe you still can't.

Just out of curiosity, without goggling (remember, you're only cheating yourself...), what's the capital of Australia?

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by ImpyTimpy
Ooh, I know this one.. It's America isn't it..

:p



The other capital. :p

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by ImpyTimpy
Ooh, I know this one.. It's America isn't it..



Silly, the capital of Australia is 'A'.

[Segnosaur]

Originally posted by ImpyTimpy
Ok, I'm going to address the replies to the body double theory in one post here.

Why the hell were they still in the country? Unless the two were morons they would've fled the country along with Saddam same way Osama did when the fighting started.

The question is, what country would be willing to have them?

Bin Laden has a lot of terrorist support around the world, so while most countries are not willing to 'officially' host him, he at least has terrorist cells to rely on. Saddam and his sons don't have the same type of international 'network' of followers, and I doubt any sane leader would be willing to give them protection.

[Larspeart]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this fellow knows his geography. There isn't a country on the globe I can't point to in less then 2 seconds. Even those crap-hole ones that come and go on a decade-to-decade basis. Sorry Mr.

Oh, and even though I have NO idea why you decided that Austrailian geography had anything to do with this thread. . .

Your capital is Canberra (no googling).

Well, at least that is what England lets you think. . .

:rub:

[peptoabysmal]

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto


The other capital. :p

I was going to say Melbourne, but isn't it Canberra or some such? I don't happen to believe that a knowledge of geography translates to a knowledge of people. I work in a university where there are people from any corner of the globe. What I notice more than the differences are the similarities. As generalizations, I can say that I get along with asians better than any other group and I find middle easterners to be very rude and pushy. But that's just me :D

[rikzilla]

Hey Jedi!!! Come on back and tell us what you think about Saddam's capture and the effect it will have on the lefties!

:D :D :D

[Upchurch]

Originally posted by rikzilla
Hey Jedi!!! Come on back and tell us what you think about Saddam's capture and the effect it will have on the lefties!

:D :D :D ???

rik, JK got himself banned, what was it? a few months ago? The only way he can come back is in sockpuppet form, and that'll only get him re-banned.

[rikzilla]

Originally posted by Upchurch
???

rik, JK got himself banned, what was it? a few months ago? The only way he can come back is in sockpuppet form, and that'll only get him re-banned.

Where ever he is....he's smiling.

-z

Sic Semper Tyrannis

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by rikzilla


Where ever he is....he's smiling.

-z

Sic Semper Tyrannis

For once, something that JK and I can agree on, wholeheartedly.

(Thank God, or whoever you choose, we got the bastard.)

[Paladin]

I'm sure there's enough Jedi material on these boards for someone to cut-and-paste a JK response...

:halo:

[The Fool]

Originally posted by rikzilla
Hey Jedi!!! Come on back and tell us what you think about Saddam's capture and the effect it will have on the lefties!

:D :D :D
Rik...Jedi got chucked for being a F*ckwit.... do you miss him that much? feeling lonely?