Warning: Jackchit threatens Gravy!

[The Doc]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it wasn't even Gravy who reported it, was it?

The truthers have a level of disturbing hatred towards Gravy and to be honest, I've never seen him do anything that would warrant it. It must just really annoy them watching Gravy demolish every argument they have.

Those who can't speak with facts, speak with threats.

[Darat]

I am reviewing this thread and it may be removed from view after that review.

In the meantime remember what this Forum is about - it's summed up neatly in the header "a place to discuss skepticism,critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly and lively way"

It is not a Forum for post by post commentary on what is said on other Forums, as I often say attack the argument not the arguer. Specifically this section is NOT a "JREF Forum v 'Loose Change' Forum". That of course is not to say that you should not, if there are claims and arguments made on other Forums regarding Conspiracy Theories, reference those claims and arguments on other Forums and discuss and tear to shreds those claims and arguments.

I have mentioned in the past there have been concerns raised by the JREF specifically regarding this section of the Forum, most of the concerns are summed up in the paragraph above. I will re-visit the concerns with the JREF and if necessary draw up (as we once had to do for the '"Politics..." section) additional guidelines to ensure this section is as it should be.

I will also place the gist of this Mod box in an announcement in this section.

[Oliver]

I am reviewing this thread and it may be removed from view after that review.

In the meantime remember what this Forum is about - it's summed up neatly in the header "a place to discuss skepticism,critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly and lively way"

It is not a Forum for post by post commentary on what is said on other Forums, as I often say attack the argument not the arguer. Specifically this section is NOT a "JREF Forum v 'Loose Change' Forum". That of course is not to say that you should not, if there are claims and arguments made on other Forums regarding Conspiracy Theories, reference those claims and arguments on other Forums and discuss and tear to shreds those claims and arguments.

I have mentioned in the past there have been concerns raised by the JREF specifically regarding this section of the Forum, most of the concerns are summed up in the paragraph above. I will re-visit the concerns with the JREF and if necessary draw up (as we once had to do for the '"Politics..." section) additional guidelines to ensure this section is as it should be.

I will also place the gist of this Mod box in an announcement in this section.


Sorry, it's my fault. I thought it could be serious and I let you
Guys in here know before something happens - no matter if
off-topic or not.

[westprog]

Sorry, it's my fault. I thought it could be serious and I let you
Guys in here know before something happens - no matter if off-topic or not.

I think that it is a serious matter, and for the most part it's been discussed here in a serious and restrained manner. There have been one or two unfortunate statements - such as the "I've got a gun, come and get me" post - but mostly this has been a very civilised discussion.

There is a real issue here which relates directly to JREF and the conspiracy forum. Jackchit issued threats against somebody who posts here because he posts here.

It's certainly of interest to everybody posting on this forum if the mere act of posting here opens one up to threats of this kind. It's relevant to the degree of anonymity one would require. I for one am relieved to be informed of what's going on, and I would hope to hear about any further developments.

Any forum on any subject is inherently the right place to discuss matters relating directly to the forum. This discussion is confined to this thread, and hasn't appreciably contaminated the general discussions.

[gumboot]

Didn't this guy lose his job for being a nutjob?

How is he going to afford a trip to NYC? :confused:

-Gumboot

[gumboot]

I agree with what he, jackchit, ought to do. I also seem to recall the exact wording being dialogue in a movie. (The bit about looking into my eyes and that being the last thing you see) I just can't recall the movie reference.

DR



It's a pretty common cliche line, it's probably in about 100 films and books. Truthers are incapable of original thought, so steal their entire reality from films. "Loose Change" is just a mismatched combination of all the die hard films.

-Gumboot

[Oliver]

Didn't this guy lose his job for being a nutjob?

How is he going to afford a trip to NYC? :confused:

-Gumboot

I guess Dylan will pay for the "expenses" of his America tour. :eek:

:p

[Obviousman]

I think it is a serious matter, too, on a couple of levels.

Do i think this bloke is going to carry out his threat? Probably not. Probably not. Then again, who would have thought a crazed fan would kill John Lennon? We cannot predict the actions of someone - especially when that persons actions do not appear normal to many of us here.

So what do we do? I think the sensible and prudent things to do are:

1. Report it to Invision. They can see if it breeches their ToS and take what action they feel is required.
2. Report it to US authorities. I think this would be FBI in this case, but US citizens can correct me on that. Simply report the matter to them, so that a record has been made. If the authorities feel further action is warranted, then they can initiate it.
3. Report it to UK authorities. Once again, purely to ensure that it has been reported, and the authorities can decide what action - if any - is required.

You basically have to leave it up to the law enforcement authorities in the respective countries. Take a hypothetical - let's say this person has previously made threats against other people. Let's say they are at least suspected of having assaulted someone on the basis of these threats.

Wouldn't it be prudent to report this matter then?

Let's say he has never done anything like this, and the threat is nothing more than piss & wind. Wouldn't knowing it had been reported provide a very good example to him as to why such threats should never be made? That they are taken quite seriously, internet or no?

Let's now say that the person has made the idle threat with no intention of doing anything more than typing on a keyboard. However, something happens to Gravy. An assault.

Wouldn't that person now at least be considered by the police? They would examine if perhaps the threat was carried out by proxy, that the person got a friend in the US to carry out the threat on his behalf. Perhaps they would examine if another LC member has decided to carry out the threat on his behalf, even though the person has no knowledge of the members actions nor did they request them to carry out any such actions.

All this because of a stupid comment. Yes, it makes a fine object lesson about making threats against other people.

[chillzero]

I don' think that the person who reported JC to Social Services should 'own up'. I think they would be placing themselves in a very dangerous situation.

I doubt that the report came from a poster here, but we allowed a thread on the matter to wander on for several pages - knowing that JC would read it.

If you seriously believe that something needs to be done about a situation such as this, why on earth would you post your intention publically when that very publicity would impact the outcome of those intended actions?

If you are a critical thinker, why take all this information at face value in the first place?

My own opinion is this:
this conversation can bring nothing constructive, and should be halted. Gravy has been alerted to the threat, and we need do no more about that here in the domain of the JREF. Privately - if you feel things warrant reports to whichever auhorities, then you should tackle that: privately. If the original concerns about JC and his family had not been so publically aired, we would not be in this situation.

[CFLarsen]

My own opinion is this:
this conversation can bring nothing constructive, and should be halted. Gravy has been alerted to the threat, and we need do no more about that here in the domain of the JREF. Privately - if you feel things warrant reports to whichever auhorities, then you should tackle that: privately. If the original concerns about JC and his family had not been so publically aired, we would not be in this situation.

Taking these kinds of threats public will not only document these threats, but perhaps also make those who make these death threats stop and think for a moment. It should definitely make those who support those who make the threats stop and think.

Whether it should be done on this forum is another issue.

[westprog]

I don' think that the person who reported JC to Social Services should 'own up'. I think they would be placing themselves in a very dangerous situation.


I doubt that the report came from a poster here, but we allowed a thread on the matter to wander on for several pages - knowing that JC would read it.


If you seriously believe that something needs to be done about a situation such as this, why on earth would you post your intention publically when that very publicity would impact the outcome of those intended actions?


I think that's a very valid point and should be born in mind in the future. There's no undoing the original action but in future


If you are a critical thinker, why take all this information at face value in the first place?


I don't think anyone does. The consensus is that this is almost certainly a totally empty threat. It's still a serious matter.



My own opinion is this:
this conversation can bring nothing constructive, and should be halted. Gravy has been alerted to the threat, and we need do no more about that here in the domain of the JREF. Privately - if you feel things warrant reports to whichever authorities, then you should tackle that: privately.


I still think that any actions should be taken by the person most affected. And it should be his choice what to do, if anything.

If the original concerns about JC and his family had not been so publically aired, we would not be in this situation.

That's a useful lesson, but there's no undoing that at this stage. The fact that you've brought forward that suggestion is an example of this thread serving a useful purpose.

[MarkyX]

and that's why religious fanatics are amazingly dangerous. they are taking orders from god. who cares what goes on here compared to the duty to god? it's a scary mindset, and the threats that these folks make are very real, and sometimes acted upon.


The next step below that is taking orders from your Mein Fuhrer, or in this case, Dylan Avery/Alex Jones

[TK0001]

Totally agreed with Darat, and I was going to post something similar when I finally waded through the entire 7 pages.

This whole huge debate is starting to turn into a Sharks v. Jets rumble, and I think it's really getting rather disconcerting.

When I started reading this thread, it got me to thinking about all the people I've debated with, and the fact I really have no idea who they are. I went to my favorite debate grounds (UM) and strangely enough I had received a PM out of the blue from one of my more vocal adversaries. Weirdly, he just wanted to chat. So I took the opportunity to let him know that even though I disagree with him on certain issues, I don't think he's a bad person, and if he ever felt I was attacking him personally and not the issue, I apologize. He replied in kind, thankfully.

I'd like to consider yesterday to be the peak of the hostilities between the two boards. From here on out the JREFers really need to not stoop to a us v. them mentality and return to some semblence of rational debate. We really need to pass the peace pipe and calm down, and while we're at it we should look in the mirror and see if we've become what we're supposedly fighting against. Because I really don't think it can escalate from here without someone getting hurt.

[uk_dave]

I tend to agree with CFLarsen.

If you don't want people to report you for threats of violence, then don't make the damned threat in the first place.

As far as I can see much of what is posted on this forum is almost like a proxy moderation of the LC forum (and others).

The truthers can bitch about being accused of anti-semitism but it is the people here who highlight the fact that a known holocaust denier is a keynote speaker at an upcoming 'truther congress'. Without that glare of publicity how bothered were the truthers about the anti-semitic speaker? But after the publicity they soon change their plans.

So Jackchit, known for his wierd dealings with the police and the beckhams security, high profile enough to put out his true identity, prepared to spend the time on a myspace page designed to ridicule a poster on this forum, prepared to state that the death of his wife was a blessing, makes a threat against that same poster which despite his being an obvious fantasist is still a credible threat given the ease of travel from the uk to new york, and the LCF completely fails to moderate this person (yet again).

I think that is justification for the comments made on this thread.

Would the LCF moderators have closed the threat thread had we not shown them that it deserved outrage? I think not.

[Foolmewunz]

Darat,
I don't know.... I think you're taking a rather secular view (which of course, is your mandate, so I'm not holding that up as improper). If you look at the posts here that sound threatening, almost to a word, they are quotes from the other side, not JREF Forumites.
Unless I missed it, I haven't seen anyone from the JREF taking up the gauntlet and calling other members to arms. I think most of the reaction here started with Oliver and continued - we're shocked and a bit worried.
There are a lot of words bandied about between LCF and here, but no one here has come even close to threatening someone with physical harm, that I know of. And assuredly, as I follow the CT forum rather closely, no one ever remotely suggested killing someone at LCF. If anyone was to do so, even in a misguided moment of black humor, there would be fifty posters on him/her in a heartbeat.

As a whole, I think the posts here are a normal reaction to an almost incomprehensible development.

To the other members of the forum:
I do think, however, that we may have a rather unhealthy fixation with LCF.
(I'm not excluding myself...) They are the bottom-feeders of the Truth Movement, and are such an easy target that they're hard to pass on, I'll admit. And with Dylan's incessant cry for media attention, they make themselves even more so. But they're far from the most intelligent of opponents.

There have to be others far more deserving of the attention of the skeptical community here. Look at the terrific discussions that Greening has started. I'm not even close to capable of handling the math/science of Greening and Mackey and a few others, but I do appreciate a meaty debate with someone who knows what they're addressing (even if it is a friendly debate amongst posters who probably ultimately have the same overall conclusions).

[eddyk]

Meh, I recive death threads all the time...from people in my own town.

I havn't been murdered yet.


Why the frick would some idiot spend 100s and fly accross the atlantic?
He's just trying to look tough infront of his twoofah buddies.

[chillzero]

Taking these kinds of threats public will not only document these threats, but perhaps also make those who make these death threats stop and think for a moment. It should definitely make those who support those who make the threats stop and think.

Whether it should be done on this forum is another issue.

I would like to point out that I was referring not to the threats from JC, but the comments from posters here, that I feel should remain private information. Report people to social services or the police if you really, honestly see fit. Just have some common sense and keep it to yourself, and don't go on about it in a public forum where the person you intend to report can see it and decide to take action about it.

I'm sorry I didn't make myself as clear as I thought I had.

On the flip side, threats such as those made by JC - actual threats of physical harm to another person - are better out in public view, so that the person under threat has notice, and the rest of the internet community can see what kind of person the threatener is (and also weight up the 'merit' of the provocation).

The people who keep those threats private, are probably far more dangerous.

[The Silver Shadow]

Somebody has made threatening e-mails to JC. Seriously, whoever sent that e-mail is just stupid. I don't think it was any of us, but as usual, we are being framed for it...

[uk_dave]

....we are being framed for it...

Yep, by avery himself.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Somebody has made threatening e-mails to JC. Seriously, whoever sent that e-mail is just stupid. I don't think it was any of us, but as usual, we are being framed for it...
Not trying to be snarky, but, evidence?

[The Silver Shadow]

Unlike twoofers, I produce evidence!
http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6855

[Firestone]

Not trying to be snarky, but, evidence?From Dylan Avery (http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6855&view=findpost&p=13018099) himself!
("One less tard on the Earth" is a quote from the email.)

"One less tard on the Earth"

Hey, JREF. Real mature.

Your lackeys are now insulting the dead. Directly.

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Unlike twoofers, I produce evidence!
http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6855

From Dylan Avery (http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6855&view=findpost&p=13018099) himself!
("One less tard on the Earth" is a quote from the email.)

Danke & danke.

[A W Smith]

Sorry darat I don't agree at all. A member of another board has conspired to injure or murder another forum member. Therefore it belongs in this sub forum. I also feel that the attempt to pigeon hole the 911 discussion as an us vs them forum war and to control content is draconian.

[chipmunk stew]

@tonicblue:

"Gravy is now flying the british flag in his avatar as a clear piss take."


Can you think of any other reason--say, oh I don't know, a major news item involving British citizens--why he might wish to fly the British flag? A display of solidarity, perhaps?

[Hokulele]

@tonicblue:

"Gravy is now flying the british flag in his avatar as a clear piss take."


Can you think of any other reason--say, oh I don't know, a major news item involving British citizens--why he might wish to fly the British flag? A display of solidarity, perhaps?


I think Gravy just realized that the Mets have no hope this season. :p

[chipmunk stew]

From Dylan Avery (http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6855&view=findpost&p=13018099) himself!
("One less tard on the Earth" is a quote from the email.)
This came just after a Roxdog post that implicates a former JREF member who was banned here for making threats.

Posted (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=2218155#post2218155) on 31 Dec 2007:
troy in wv has been banned for breaches of his/her Membership Agreement and for threatening another Member via PM. The content of the posts and PM have been removed from public view but a copy has been kept.

Yes, Dylan. The JREF forum is, in fact, "real mature". The mods here ban people who make threats against others.

[Pardalis]

From Dylan Avery (http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6855&view=findpost&p=13018099) himself!
("One less tard on the Earth" is a quote from the email.)

Hey Dylan, if you're reading this:

TROY IN WV IS HAS BEEN BANNED FROM JREF SINCE DECEMBER!

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=71555

ETA: oh, Chipmunk beat me to it. I'll leave my post as is, perhaps Avery can read bigger letters.

[NickUK]

I've posted that over at LCF (http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=6855&view=findpost&p=13019661), Pardalis :)

[Hutch]

I am reviewing this thread and it may be removed from view after that review.

In the meantime remember what this Forum is about - it's summed up neatly in the header "a place to discuss skepticism,critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly and lively way"

It is not a Forum for post by post commentary on what is said on other Forums, as I often say attack the argument not the arguer. Specifically this section is NOT a "JREF Forum v 'Loose Change' Forum". That of course is not to say that you should not, if there are claims and arguments made on other Forums regarding Conspiracy Theories, reference those claims and arguments on other Forums and discuss and tear to shreds those claims and arguments.

I have mentioned in the past there have been concerns raised by the JREF specifically regarding this section of the Forum, most of the concerns are summed up in the paragraph above. I will re-visit the concerns with the JREF and if necessary draw up (as we once had to do for the '"Politics..." section) additional guidelines to ensure this section is as it should be.

I will also place the gist of this Mod box in an announcement in this section.


People, I suggest you re-read this and reflect upon a few facts.

Darat is the Chief Mod for the Forum. He mentioned that he's reviewing this thread, which means the mods are watching closely.

He also notes that there have been concerns raised by the JREF about the CT Sub-Forum. That means Randi, or at least somebody on the JREF staff, is wondering if all this 9-11 hoo-hah really is worth the problems that it generates (the majority of suspensions/bannings in the past few months have been from this Forum, IMHO-but I bet I can justify it if I have to). James Randi seldom posts in the Forum, but he knows it is here (with over 120 posters at TAM5, he can't very well miss it). And if Mr. Randi ain't happy, then we aren't going to be happy...

So my advice to everyone is CALM DOWN. Take a couple of deep breaths. Gravy is on notice, the threats have been reported to the proper authorities, the ravings on LC remain ravings, and nothing is left to be gained.

Let's stay on target (the debunkification of woo) and try to keep the personalities out of it.

Blind'em with Science, not Tabloid-writing.

IMHO as always.

[flameowl]

Well, it didn't take long for them to lock that topic off...

[NickUK]

LOL, indeed not!

LCF admins are going to have a busy night if they're going to remove EVERY thread where Dylan makes an arse of himself, though.

[Horatius]

@tonicblue:

"Gravy is now flying the british flag in his avatar as a clear piss take."


Can you think of any other reason--say, oh I don't know, a major news item involving British citizens--why he might wish to fly the British flag? A display of solidarity, perhaps?



Nope! Their first idea is their only idea! That's their strength!

[T.A.M.]

so now how are Tarpley and the rest of the idiots going to justify their "USA is gonna invade Iran on Good Friday" crapalooza...

lol...oh the morons, the morons.

TAM:)

[negativ]

I have no doubts, that they will go postal at some point. I see the next eco-terrorist, or weather report underground what ever, coming from their ranks!

Heh. I don't know if you were trying to be funny, but I got a chuckle out of that. It would make for an... interesting ideology.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_Report

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weatherman_%28organization%29

[A W Smith]

Heh. I don't know if you were trying to be funny, but I got a chuckle out of that. It would make for an... interesting ideology.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weather_Report

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weatherman_%28organization%29

now that I have the jazz fusion song 'Birdland" stuck in my head for the rest of the afternoon. ENJOY!
pqashW66D7o

[Pyrrho]

Threatening content is explicitly prohibited by the InvisionFree terms of service.

http://invisionfree.com/index.php?p=tou

[boloboffin]

I have to disagree with you, boloboffin. It wasn't a matter of "busybodies", nor a matter of "unintended consequences", nor a matter of Rawkarma engaging in "self-serving conscience salv[ing]." It appears from your posts in this thread that you have presumed facts not in evidence, that you have accepted unsubstantiated assumptions as facts, and that you have leapt to conclusions without any basis in fact, even while you have purported to chastise others for committing the same (or lesser) errors. I suspect that you'll recognize that when you think about it.

Yes, I am taking Jackchit's word for it that he was visited by Social Services. I am also taking Jack's word for it that he has an ex-wife who died and that her death removed a barrier to raising his children as he saw fit, for which he was grateful. I am taking his word on it that he was grateful, as well.

I'm also taking people at their word that they were going to call Social Services when they said they were going to. I'm also taking Jack's word for it that he means to inflict serious harm on a poster here who hasn't the remotest connection to the entire spectacle.

Taking people's word for what they are doing is the only thing we can do on the Internet. I have zero reason to doubt anybody's word in this affair, even the crackpot conspiracy theorist.

So I retract nothing.

[Obviousman]

Actually, you got a point there....

[LashL]

Yes, I am taking Jackchit's word for it that he was visited by Social Services. I am also taking Jack's word for it that he has an ex-wife who died and that her death removed a barrier to raising his children as he saw fit, for which he was grateful. I am taking his word on it that he was grateful, as well.

I'm also taking people at their word that they were going to call Social Services when they said they were going to. I'm also taking Jack's word for it that he means to inflict serious harm on a poster here who hasn't the remotest connection to the entire spectacle.

Taking people's word for what they are doing is the only thing we can do on the Internet. I have zero reason to doubt anybody's word in this affair, even the crackpot conspiracy theorist.

So I retract nothing.

I did not ask you to "retract" anything, bolo. That said, your response to my post seems to be a convoluted way of saying, "Yes" you did indeed presume facts not in evidence, that you have accepted unsubstantiated assumptions as facts, and that you have leapt to conclusions without any basis in fact, even while you have purported to chastise others for committing the same (or lesser) errors.

It is good of you to acknowledge that.

You are, of course, perfectly entitled to your opinion that those who were concerned in the other thread are "busybodies" just as I am perfectly entitled to my opinion to the contrary.

And while we're on the topic of opinions: in my opinion, your allegation that Rawkarma was engaging in "self-serving conscience salv[ing]" was uncalled for and unsubstantiated as well.

I noticed that you did not address these latter two points from my prior post/ I recognize that the first is of little import and arguing over it would be useless and would serve no purpose. The second, however, I have to say that I am surprised that you did not address it, being the accusation that it is against another member here.

ETA: I just saw and responded to your post as I was about to log out and go to bed so I will be unable to discuss this further tonight (this morning) should you choose to respond. Just a head's up.

[Orphia Nay]

I've only read the first page or so of this thread, and am wondering something.

Making a threat to kill is a serious offence in Australia, and I assume it would be in England too. Has anyone notified the police yet?

[skepticalcriticalguy]

so now how are Tarpley and the rest of the idiots going to justify their "USA is gonna invade Iran on Good Friday" crapalooza...

lol...oh the morons, the morons.

TAM:)

If it happens on Saturday or Sunday, are they still the morons, the morons? How about next week?

[skepticalcriticalguy]

I've only read the first page or so of this thread, and am wondering something.

Making a threat to kill is a serious offence in Australia, and I assume it would be in England too. Has anyone notified the police yet?

Nope, just family services, apparently.

Somebody, please notify the authorities. Fox News Police can be reached at www.foxnewspolice.com (http://www.foxnews.com)

[skepticalcriticalguy]

Nope! Their first idea is their only idea! That's their strength!

Like the 19 + Osama (+KSM) myth is yours.

[uk_dave]

If it happens on Saturday or Sunday, are they still the morons, the morons? How about next week?

How about in 10 years time?

[skepticalcriticalguy]

How about in 10 years time?

How about... 9 years time?

[uk_dave]

How about... 9 years time?

They'd still be morons :D

[skepticalcriticalguy]

Back to the topic; if murder has been threatened, why hasn't action Bin Taken? Come on! This is serious!

The threatened isn't too busy or lazy to take legal action, I hope!

[Oliver]

Back to the topic; if murder has been threatened, why hasn't action Bin Taken? Come on! This is serious!

The threatened isn't too busy or lazy to take legal action, I hope!


Well, I know this will cost my life but since "Mr. Dylan Irresponsibly"
didn't care about probable legal consequences of his administration
and for his firm, I wrote a letter to InvisionFree.

Watch out, Jackchit: InvisionFree is comming for ya!!!11!!OMG!1!!! :D

...I wrote to God Molech himself and he will send out his NWO
Troops to hunt and sacrifice them in Boo!-hemian Grove... http://209.85.12.231/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif

[Gravy]

Back to the topic; if murder has been threatened, why hasn't action Bin Taken? Come on! This is serious!

The threatened isn't too busy or lazy to take legal action, I hope!

Present your evidence that action hasn't been taken, fool.

[jhunter1163]

now that I have the jazz fusion song 'Birdland" stuck in my head for the rest of the afternoon. ENJOY!
pqashW66D7o

I have the Manhattan Transfer version stuck in my head. I like that one better.

[westprog]

I've been trying - largely for their own good - to tell Jackchit, Avery and their cheering pack to calm down and to consider what they are doing. Naturally I've been banned.

They now seem to be trying to forget the whole thing ever happened. Jackchit keeps digging though.

[Rawkarma]

Yes, I am taking Jackchit's word for it that he was visited by Social Services. I am also taking Jack's word for it that he has an ex-wife who died and that her death removed a barrier to raising his children as he saw fit, for which he was grateful. I am taking his word on it that he was grateful, as well.

I'm also taking people at their word that they were going to call Social Services when they said they were going to. I'm also taking Jack's word for it that he means to inflict serious harm on a poster here who hasn't the remotest connection to the entire spectacle.

Taking people's word for what they are doing is the only thing we can do on the Internet. I have zero reason to doubt anybody's word in this affair, even the crackpot conspiracy theorist.

So I retract nothing.

I did find your comment about my motives somewhat petty in light of the errors in your post. The one part you should consider retracting is taking the leap of faith required in rationalizing JC's actions and blaming people from here [with no evidence] for it ricocheting onto Mark.

JC picked Mark as he is a prominent figure within the JREF conspiracy forum and has debunked many Cters claims that of which JC clings to. There is no rational behavior in justifying a threat of harm to Gravy or anyone from a thread in which he did not participate in -- yet more endearing character traits from JC.

I have zero reason to doubt anybody's word in this affair, even the crackpot conspiracy theorist.

You do know that JC has a tendency to go around forums telling lies and indulging in defamation: MRGS on myspace as an example?

He has lied on more than on occasion about people being dead over at LCF.

I would say you have more reasons to doubt the word of someone like JC, than to believe them. JC is clearly unstable and known for telling lies and engaging in defamation of character with yet more falsehoods.

Very trustworthy, eh?

You're entitled to your own opinion and as we did in the original thread, it looks like will have to agree to differ on this it would seem.

ETA: I should also note boloboffin, that in the original thread about JC, I never said I believed what was allegedly wrote by JC, only that if true I think he provides an unhealthy and inappropriate environment for kids imo. His latest behavior in issuing death threats on anyone he chooses and justifying it with yet more irrational behavior, does nothing to change my opinion.

I appreciate your words LashL.

[Mobyseven]

So, I'm trying to figure out why he blames Gravy?
Someone else started that thread here.

I don't know who started the thread, but I'd say that next to Gravy I'm one of the next most likely in line. The difference beng of course that he doesn't know my real name or where I live, so I don't feel at all threatened.

I was one of the people who was vocally for social services visiting this man. I stated then that if they found everything to be in order there that I would be satisfied that everything was in order, as they are the professionals in this area.

After seeing this, I would like to admit I was wrong. Jackchit may be a very persuasive person in the flesh, enough to convince social services of his fitness as a parent.

Quite frankly, whoever it was who anonymously suggested SS pay him a visit in the first place, I would highly recommend forwarding this to them. This man is highly disturbed. Simple as that. Something must be done.

And Mark, I doubt you have anything to be worried about. But be careful nonetheless.

[Mobyseven]

Tonicblue, who was recently suspended here (mysteriously), weighs in:

Jackchit it was Mobyseven behind the social services call. I argued about it with him at jref.

I also sent an email to James Randi himself in which I told him what his forum was planning to do. I recieved no reply from Randi and was promptly suspended at JREF without reason.

I am 100% behind you on this. Gravy is scum. The world would be better without him.

I can only wonder what was contained in that email to Mr. Randi, if he's the sort of person who is willing to openly advocate the murder of a private citizen on an internet forum. Classy.

Well...as I said.

Though I'm actually a bit surprised Jackchit hadn't already mentioned me in that thread. As I said - it's probably because he's all talk and it's hard to sound big when you don't know someone's real name or location.

[Mobyseven]

Dylan is a complete scumbag and Jackchit needs to face the police and lots of bullets from the police.

Don't lower yourself to their level. It isn't worth it.

ETA - And don't forget that there are children involved here.

[Mobyseven]

Yeah, gee. He doesn't think somebody is going to call Social Services again? And this time they have real justification and evidence.

Can I please point out that it isn't as though there wasn't any cause for concern last time?

It's not like the issue came up because someone said, "Hey, this guy says he has kids - lets screw with him!"

The issue came up because there was a genuine concern for the welfare of the children, one that in my opinion has not at all subsided.

[stateofgrace]

Like the 19 + Osama (+KSM) myth is yours.

You forgot this guy.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/6242867.stm

opps, you forgot this guy also

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4782524.stm

Hey,infact you forgot all about these guys also.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/2780525.stm

Maybe it slipped your mind.

[pagan]

What is the matter with you guys?

One of the kooks in the truth movement makes some internet threats against one of your heroes. And you make a big deal out of it?

[Mobyseven]

Someone mentioned his user name over there. What else can be found out about him?
Anyone else besides me grabbing screencaps?

Er...can I have a look at those screenshots?

As far as I've seen in the screenshots so far I'm the only other name that has been mentioned, and I'd be curious just to know if it's me they're talking about there.

[CptColumbo]

As far as I know, TB was suspended because he was dishonest in his registration and later banned for using a sock puppet.

I doubt anyone here called Social Services. Is there any actual proof he has children, because from his posts and antics online he seems very immature? I would place his mental age around 13, and that's being generous.

[The Doc]

What is the matter with you guys?

One of the kooks in the truth movement makes some internet threats against one of your heroes. And you make a big deal out of it?

Would you make a big deal if a clearly insane person threatened to kill someone you knew?

[Mobyseven]

This chemtrail kook is now an admin over there?

How exactly does one become an admin with only 154 posts and no discernable link to Loose Change other than being a member of the forums?

[Mobyseven]

Correction.

"A truther..... from another continent."

A truther from another continent...who has explicitly stated that he plans to go to New York.

Also don't forget that there are people there egging him on, one who offered him a gun. While I cannot say for sure, as the number of people there who are condoning or offering to assist grows the probability that one of them is from America gets larger and larger.

[Mobyseven]

The law of unintended consequences continues to hold true. I said over and over again for the busybodies who contacted Social Services not to do so. And now their asinine behavior has ricocheted onto Mark, who I can't even recall posting in that thread.

You cannot reasonably expect people who are legitimately worried about the welfare of children in the care of their biological father to not at least make enquiries about it. There is no moral high ground in leaving children in a potentially dangerous situation simply because it would be frowned upon to be a 'busybody'.

[Mobyseven]

I have just found my new signature.

The plot thickens.

ETA - Meant not in reference to your comment, but to the chilling collection of quotes. This worries me.

[Mobyseven]

Well, this has been an interesting read. Thanks for your support, all.

After having progressed further into this thread, I have to say - please be careful, Mark.

I'm sure that you can take care of yourself. But I must say that this worries me more than just a little bit.

[Mobyseven]

After reading through the entire thread here (and Darat's comments) I would suggest that maybe we should leave this topic alone for a while. All that can be done, has been done, and we should no longer dwell on this.

Having said that, whoever has the screenshots of the entire thread at LCF (HeyLeroy? Pardalis?), could you please send me them as an attachment to mobyseven@gmail.com? I am a bit concerned that the other person they are looking for information about may be me, and would like to see the quotes posted here in their original context.

Thankyou.

[westprog]

Jackchit provides a perfect example for why anonymous tips should remain anonymous. If he is serious then he'd go after anyone he feels is "against" him, whether they took real action or not. Giving such a nutbar the person who actually took action (assuming there is one, of course) could only inflame him further.

Let's look at what's happened to the man. He's had a serious legal case against him. His wife left him, and was killed. He's had brain surgery for a tumour. (This all by his own account). He overreacts to any disagreement, and has pursued vendettas against a number of people, including fellow members of CT forums.

He's not somebody to be prodded just for the fun of it. While his behaviour is inexcusable, I've more sympathy for him than for the friends who've been cheering him on. It's like teenagers daring a friend to take another drink before he drives home. I don't think he's susceptible to reason, but I felt it necessary to try (as, to their credit, did one or two LC members, who were abused for their trouble).

[HyJinX]

Would it be in poor taste (no pun intended) to send Mr. Chit a box of this? This way he can add a little water...make his own Gravy...and yell at it in his own kitchen. Whatcha think?

[defaultdotxbe]

Would it be in poor taste (no pun intended) to send Mr. Chit a box of this? This way he can add a little water...make his own Gravy...and yell at it in his own kitchen. Whatcha think?
i wouldnt be surprised if it provokes him to post a picture of it skewered on a large knife

[T.A.M.]

Pagan:

You say "internet threats" as if making them online makes them less wrong. Tell that to the people in montreal who were shot at by a guy who threatened violence repeatedly ONLINE prior to carrying it out.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kimveer_Gill

TAM

[boloboffin]

You cannot reasonably expect people who are legitimately worried about the welfare of children in the care of their biological father to not at least make enquiries about it. There is no moral high ground in leaving children in a potentially dangerous situation simply because it would be frowned upon to be a 'busybody'.

Of course not. My question is to the legitimacy of the concerns in this case, which I find to be exceedingly illegitimate. The way I see it, a couple of people decided to stir up a pot of [rule8] for no good reason, the pot of [rule8] was well and thoroughly stirred, and now some people don't like me pointing out who had spoons in their hands.

[Darth Rotor]

You cannot reasonably expect people who are legitimately worried about the welfare of children in the care of their biological father to not at least make enquiries about it. There is no moral high ground in leaving children in a potentially dangerous situation simply because it would be frowned upon to be a 'busybody'.
You have leapt to a number of conclusions. I've flamed people for less, on forums, for making such leaps of assumption about something casually thrown out in a forum conversation.

I think you were a big guy to admit a mistake and apologize for part of some of the misunderstandings -- tip of the cap to you -- but I find your stance as internet psychologist to be a load of bollocks.

That Jackchit posts in the mode of mentally useless isn't significant of much. Perry Logan posted like a deranged maroon, but I'd not consider that a sign that he does not, or would not, love his kids.

DR

[ihaunter]

What is the matter with you guys?

One of the kooks in the truth movement makes some internet threats against one of your heroes. And you make a big deal out of it?

I can only speak for myself, but who the threat was made against is not the issue. If some "kook" had made a similar threat against Dylan Avery, Alex Jones or any other CTist, I would be equally concerned. I suspect I would not be the only one on this board that feels this way.

[gumboot]

Let's all just remember how seriously some people take their online incidents...

The "theft" of virtual items in games has led to real people being murdered.

I think there is a mentality of thinking things online aren't significant or serious. I totally disagree. Do people think it's not a big deal if an adult make chats in a sexual manner with a young female online? Of course it's a big deal. It's a massive deal.

Yet, while "sexual grooming" is seen as serious, for some reason expressing intentions of murder is not? What is with that?

Were this nutjob to actually carry out his threat, Dylan Avery would be arrested and likely imprisoned as an accessory to murder. That is NOT a small deal.

Providing an information or material that can aid a person in an expressed desire to commit murder is a serious crime, and Dylan Avery has committed it. Such behaviour is absolutely 100% unacceptable.

Once again we have to remind the 9/11 CTer children, THIS IS NOT A GAME. This is real life. We are talking about real living breathing human beings.

-Gumboot

[gumboot]

That Jackchit posts in the mode of mentally useless isn't significant of much. Perry Logan posted like a deranged maroon, but I'd not consider that a sign that he does not, or would not, love his kids.



I don't see how that's even remotely relevant.

Parents have murdered their children out of "love" before.

The question anyone investigating child abuse asks is "is this child safe?" not "is this child loved?".

-Gumboot

[Obviousman]

I see the entire thread on LC has now been removed.

Better late than never.

[Mobyseven]

Of course not. My question is to the legitimacy of the concerns in this case, which I find to be exceedingly illegitimate. The way I see it, a couple of people decided to stir up a pot of [rule8] for no good reason, the pot of [rule8] was well and thoroughly stirred, and now some people don't like me pointing out who had spoons in their hands.

The post that started all this was one where Jackchit expressed his belief that God killed his wife to remove an obstacle in his path and so that he could raise his children in the manner he sees fit.

Sure, he seems to love them, but that it appears he wasn't granted custody in the first place sets the scene for me. That he sees the death of his wife as an act of God allowing to continue his 9/11 research unhindered sets off alarm bells in my head.

Even if you thought it was not good cause to do so, there are many people here who were genuinely concerned.

As it is, Jackchit now says that he has been visited by social services. In response to this, he has made a death threat against a man who was hardly involved in the issue at all, and has made clear an intention to travel to NYC already now has another purpose.

Does this not set off more alarm bells? Does it not seem as though the original concern may have been justified?

[Obviousman]

Is this bloke the same one from here?

http://www.beckhamcoverup.com/

[Dog Town]

Is this bloke the same one from here?

http://www.beckhamcoverup.com/

GOOOAAALLLL!

[Gravy]

And Mark, I doubt you have anything to be worried about. But be careful nonetheless.Thanks for your concern. Unlike the truther al Qaeda apologists, when someone says they're going to harm me I take the threat seriously. But since the matter is in the hands of the appropriate people, there really isn't anything to be careful about. There's little I can do if a determined crackpot wants to off me. Luckily for mankind most crackpots aren't that determined.

[westprog]

since the matter is in the hands of the appropriate people

Glad to hear it. Will restrain comment accordingly.

[De_Bunk]

Quote from Jackchit

"BTW if any of the j-ref from the uk are man enough to face the person they accuse then e-mail me admin@beckhamcoverup.com (http://stealth.co.in/nph-stealth.cgi/111110A/687474702s61646q696r406265636o68616q636s7665727570 2r636s6q) and we can dance...."



I dunno....

Me, personally, would rather have a good ol' fight...

But hey...each to their own...

DB

[8den]

This from the loose change forum



As for my own situation I have just visited NYC and as it was my first visit I have enjoyed myself greatly, the people were friendly, the food great and the sights fantastic. However the best part was when I sought and confronted Mark Roberts tour guide, like I told him he knew my eyes when they met his gaze but the best sight was him wetting himself without me having to say a word, his last words to me suggested i wouldn't get out of manhatten, well marky I did and now i'm back in Britain... I suggest you are being set up by your operatives because they clearly don't give a **** about you. ha ha ha...... now try to be a big girl and don't make me come back for you.


Any of this true? I mean aside from the food/people bit?
http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8003

[Oliver]

This from the loose change forum

Any of this true? I mean aside from the food/people bit?
http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8003


I also was curious about this one. Even if I didn't want to dig
up this controversial Issue in public. So is it true and you
was (were?) scared to death, Gravy? :D

[uk_dave]

I think even the 'truthers' realise that jackchit is an embarassing fantasist.

Note how the three posts after jackchits do not reference what he said about gravy. They don't believe him any more than we do.

It's sad but strangely compelling to watch someones mental illness played out for all to see.

[Redtail]

This from the loose change forum



Any of this true? I mean aside from the food/people bit?
http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8003

I'm gonna go out on a limb and throw the BS flag on this due to the fact that IF JC sacked up and did it.

1. He wouldn't bring his children.
2. If he's 1/2 the parent he clams he wouldn't leave the country without his kids so soon after social services visited to investigate him.
3. The drama queen that he is, he would have taped the encounter and dashed to an internet cafe to put it online before he left America.
4. He made no mention of going to ground zero with "Dylan and the troof crew".

[~enigma~]

I'm gonna go out on a limb and throw the BS flag on this due to the fact that IF JC sacked up and did it.

1. He wouldn't bring his children.
2. If he's 1/2 the parent he clams he wouldn't leave the country without his kids so soon after social services visited to investigate him.
3. The drama queen that he is, he would have taped the encounter and dashed to an internet cafe to put it online before he left America.
4. He made no mention of going to ground zero with "Dylan and the troof crew".
Nor did Gravy mention this most likely fictional encounter.

ETA - Besides, didn't our NWO buddies put Jason on the no fly list?

[Gravy]

I have neither met Jason Holmes nor communicated with him except for a couple of emails a couple of months ago, regarding his homophobic Mark Roberts Gay Spy Myspace page. The only time I've seen truthers at Ground Zero recently was on April 11. Mr. Holmes was not there (I'd know him from his photo on his website).

[~enigma~]

I have neither met Jason Holmes nor communicated with him except for a couple of emails a couple of months ago, regarding his homophobic Mark Roberts Gay Spy Myspace page. The only time I've seen truthers at Ground Zero recently was on April 11. Mr. Holmes was not there (I'd know him from his photo on his website).Just as I thought. Mr. Holmes has lost all touch with reality and he is now claiming you "threatened" him saying he will not get out of Manhatten. I really liked him better when he wore a hockey mask and carried a machetti :)

[uk_dave]

The 'truthers' will probably start claiming jackchit is a 'disinfo' agent.

There are no stupid/mad/psychotic people in the 'truth' movement. Only fearless warriors for truth, and disinfo agents.

:rolleyes:

[8den]

I have neither met Jason Holmes nor communicated with him except for a couple of emails a couple of months ago, regarding his homophobic Mark Roberts Gay Spy Myspace page. The only time I've seen truthers at Ground Zero recently was on April 11. Mr. Holmes was not there (I'd know him from his photo on his website).

Figured as much, was just curious to see if this David and Golaith* encounter occured.


*Sans slingshot technology.

[Redtail]

ETA - Besides, didn't our NWO buddies put Jason on the no fly list?

Yeah but Silverstien slipped on the "pull it" quote and we had to pay off all of the demo companies.

Cheney tells them how we shot down 93.

Then Kerry blabs it it the book store... <sigh> We give them billions and they screw it up.:mad:

Next meeting I'm demanding that from now on all of our agents are like Reagan. He slipped with our secret bombing of the USSR but was able to not only talk his way out of it but convince the commies that the real reason the empire collapsed was that communism failed.

[The Doc]

Jack Chit a liar? Never saw that one coming :rolleyes:

[Comsat Angel]

FYI, and for what it's worth, I took the printed transcripts of jackchit's ranting around to the police station. The desk constable took them off and had a long consult with another officer, who came back and said she didn't really know what to make of it - I did emphasise the information was all third hand and likely coming from a complete fantasist. However, they would send the information on to their Internet team to make of it what they will. So far no phone calls back from them so they may not be taking it any further.

[MRC_Hans]

I think this gives some food for thought. We have regularly been confronting people who have ... alternative mentality, and we must all remember that this is not entirely without danger.

One part of the JREF mission is to confront people with their lunacy. Some of these people entertain lunacies from lack of knowledge,but are basically sane. They may act hostile, but will pose no danger.

Others are bona fide lunatics, and we must realize that their reactions (as we have also seen on several past occasions) can be highly irrational, and potentially dangerous.

While this certainly should not stop us, a certain vigiliance is wise.

Hans

[tim]

Hans is correct. I'm not saying we should run scared, but sometimes it's as well to be aware when you're in a vulnerable position, i.e. dark alleys.
You cannot always judge other people's potential actions by they way you would behave in those circumstances.............

[Gravy]

FYI, and for what it's worth, I took the printed transcripts of jackchit's ranting around to the police station. The desk constable took them off and had a long consult with another officer, who came back and said she didn't really know what to make of it - I did emphasise the information was all third hand and likely coming from a complete fantasist. However, they would send the information on to their Internet team to make of it what they will. So far no phone calls back from them so they may not be taking it any further.
Thanks much! His local police detectives also have the complaint.

[chipmunk stew]

I have neither met Jason Holmes nor communicated with him except for a couple of emails a couple of months ago, regarding his homophobic Mark Roberts Gay Spy Myspace page. The only time I've seen truthers at Ground Zero recently was on April 11. Mr. Holmes was not there (I'd know him from his photo on his website).
That kills my theory. I'd been wondering if he was one of your muggers.

[Darat]

Please folks consider your posting and contributions to this thread carefully. Whilst I won't say it is out of bounds you are discussing serious issues that could affect members of this Forum as well as involving people totally uninvolved in this issue (e.g. children) in the real world. Sometimes saying nothing is the best policy.

[T.A.M.]

All threats, Internet or Real World MUST be taken seriously. We all know what CAN happen when people ignore signs.

TAM;(

[Obviousman]

I am seriously glad I don't live in the same country as these people:

http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8039

[Alt+F4]

I am seriously glad I don't live in the same country as these people:

http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8039

They're comparing their gun shopping lists and where you can get cheap ammo.....buy in bulk and save!

Since I do live in the same country as these people I'm going to make a fortune with two new products: the bullettproof Wonderbra and Kevlar book covers.

[T.A.M.]

I am seriously glad I don't live in the same country as these people:

http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8039

OMG...

There has to be a way that we can create a site dedicated to putting the outrageousness that the truth movement gets on with up on public display.

TAM:)

[Mobyseven]

Methinks that this topic should be left alone now...Jackchit is even more disturbed than I thought, and I certainly hope he is paid another visit by social services and the police soon (if in fact his claim that he has children is true).

But it seems that these things have now been passed on to the authorities, and until a resolution is reached we should stay mum.

[The Doc]

Methinks that this topic should be left alone now...Jackchit is even more disturbed than I thought, and I certainly hope he is paid another visit by social services and the police soon (if in fact his claim that he has children is true).

But it seems that these things have now been passed on to the authorities, and until a resolution is reached we should stay mum.

I agree.

I would also have to say that Jack claiming he went to New York and saw Mark, when in reality he did nothing of the sort, is a pretty good sign that he doesn't have any real intentions to go to New York.

That being said, I would still remain alert but not alarmed.

[westprog]

I am seriously glad I don't live in the same country as these people:

http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8039

I pity the poor fool who knocks on my door.

Dear me.

[westprog]

To really tell the truth I kinda want it all to happen just so I can laugh at all the retards who willingly get on the bus or the retards who cant defend their family when swat team rolls up with dragonskin and mp5s

I am in anticipation of when I get to unleash meh rage on the baddies


It's beyond satire. It's not that they are queueing up to revel in their idiocy. It's the way that when someone intervenes and says "You know, this makes us look bad" they jump on him.

Would someone please escort this non-gentile ******* out of here.

[qarnos]

They're comparing their gun shopping lists and where you can get cheap ammo.....buy in bulk and save!

Since I do live in the same country as these people I'm going to make a fortune with two new products: the bullettproof Wonderbra and Kevlar book covers.

Kevlar book covers??? Pffft.

Everyone knows a bible in your breast pocket will stop all bullets.

[Gravy]

Kevlar book covers??? Pffft.

Everyone knows a bible in your breast pocket will stop all bullets.Sorry. See Mythbusters episode 16. ;)

[Darat]

Sorry. See Mythbusters episode 16. ;)


They're not True ChristiansTM...

[Mashuna]

Or as Woody Allen says,

Years ago, my mother gave me a bullet...a bullet, and I put it in my breast pocket. Two years after that, I was walking down the street, when a berserk evangelist heaved a Gideon bible out a hotel room window, hitting me in the chest. Bible would have gone right through my heart if it wasn't for that bullet.

[flameowl]

Pah, Bibles are so last generation... everyone knows that it's the 20G ipod is the way to go!

world wide web flickr.com/photos/tiki/445618364/in/pool-appleusers/(pardon the spaced out link... still not at my requisite 15 posts)

[Comsat Angel]

Ahh, Woody pinched that joke from "Castle Keep".

[jackchit]

well i can now put to bed the conspiracy theory that lc members or former members cannot be registered here.
I'm not here for a fight but i think so many things have been posted here about me that I should have the right to reply.
Firstly I love my children and do not push my own beliefs upon them but encourage them to think for themselves and never accept what they are told but to make up thier own minds based upon the evidence.
This is hard with a 9 y/o and a 14 y/o who have other more important (to them) issues other than 911 and the NWO.
I have never disscussed any of these issues with my kids and prefer to shield them from the reality of the state of the world they will inherit.
For you to decide they should be removed from their surviving parent is arrogant to say the least from mostly childless individuals.
As for the death threats....well that is a little dramatic but then again what is not a big drama on this forum?
enough for now, I have issues with both this and the LC forum (which i now no longer post) but the posters on this forum are without doubt the most hateful i have come across. No offence

[HyJinX]

None taken. I've seen your posts...and they define hate. No offense.

[jackchit]

None taken. I've seen your posts...and they define hate. No offense.

Hate? link please.

[HyJinX]

Apologize to Mark Roberts.

[Oliver]

well i can now put to bed the conspiracy theory that lc members or former members cannot be registered here.
I'm not here for a fight but i think so many things have been posted here about me that I should have the right to reply.
Firstly I love my children and do not push my own beliefs upon them but encourage them to think for themselves and never accept what they are told but to make up thier own minds based upon the evidence.
This is hard with a 9 y/o and a 14 y/o who have other more important (to them) issues other than 911 and the NWO.
I have never disscussed any of these issues with my kids and prefer to shield them from the reality of the state of the world they will inherit.
For you to decide they should be removed from their surviving parent is arrogant to say the least from mostly childless individuals.
As for the death threats....well that is a little dramatic but then again what is not a big drama on this forum?
enough for now, I have issues with both this and the LC forum (which i now no longer post) but the posters on this forum are without doubt the most hateful i have come across. No offence


Well, Jason - I remember it this way:

You talked about how you were happy that you lost your
wife to have more time with the "9/11 Truth".

Now this alone sounds pretty ugly if you try to slip into the
mind of a neutral person who doesn't care about debunkers
or 9/11 truther.

Someone in here asked the English social security if this is
problematic - but we still don't know if someone called the
social service on you - from this forum. Maybe it was Troy,
the guy who is no JREF'er because he was banned here
after the first 20 messages.

The next thing that happened was that you accused Gravy
who had nothing to do with all these things - and so you
threatened him without any motive beside that you think
he's a leader or something.

You missed that the one who started the whole CT-Subforum
talking about Loose Change was the Guy in this thread:

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=53102

The Thread-Starter was "Delphi_ote" - and he also had nothing
to do with the problems you had. Gravy joinded this thread some
weeks after it was posted.

Then you said you visited NY which also seems to be
exaggerated.

Let me assure you that no one in here wants you to die or
something - which is the big difference between here and
other CT-Fora. You may not like the Idea but the one person
who reported you, wasn't representing the rest of people
in here. This is a simple misunderstanding.

I also watched your and William Rodriguez's back - this way
I found out that the Emails to you and him were from a
person we both know. I asked you posing as Mrs. Wallace
to get the Email-headers to the Emails you got - and I
apologize for my subreptitious behaviour - I didn't know
if it could have been you who invented these Emails - at
this time.

So what's your point?

[HyJinX]

Hate? link please.

It's very well documented in this thread. If you don't have anything intellectual to offer to this forum...you should go. You've set a tone with people with your "jump the gun" attitude and your inate ability to accuse without proof. I don't speak for anyone here but myself, but you've proven, through your posts, to be a very angry person without the ability to rationalize that anger with proof.

You're on my ignore list. Period. Nothing you have to offer is acceptable to me. Once you apologize to Mark Roberts for wrongful accusations...you don't exist here to me.

Take care. Get help.

[tsig]

well i can now put to bed the conspiracy theory that lc members or former members cannot be registered here.
I'm not here for a fight but i think so many things have been posted here about me that I should have the right to reply.
Firstly I love my children and do not push my own beliefs upon them but encourage them to think for themselves and never accept what they are told but to make up thier own minds based upon the evidence.
This is hard with a 9 y/o and a 14 y/o who have other more important (to them) issues other than 911 and the NWO.
I have never disscussed any of these issues with my kids and prefer to shield them from the reality of the state of the world they will inherit.
For you to decide they should be removed from their surviving parent is arrogant to say the least from mostly childless individuals.
As for the death threats....well that is a little dramatic but then again what is not a big drama on this forum?
enough for now, I have issues with both this and the LC forum (which i now no longer post) but the posters on this forum are without doubt the most hateful i have come across. No offence

Hateful people need love the most.

One day you ill find a pair of eyes looking at you

They will be yours looking in the mirror.

[Stellafane]

well i can now put to bed the conspiracy theory that lc members or former members cannot be registered here.
I'm not here for a fight but i think so many things have been posted here about me that I should have the right to reply.
Firstly I love my children and do not push my own beliefs upon them but encourage them to think for themselves and never accept what they are told but to make up thier own minds based upon the evidence.
This is hard with a 9 y/o and a 14 y/o who have other more important (to them) issues other than 911 and the NWO.
I have never disscussed any of these issues with my kids and prefer to shield them from the reality of the state of the world they will inherit.
For you to decide they should be removed from their surviving parent is arrogant to say the least from mostly childless individuals.
As for the death threats....well that is a little dramatic but then again what is not a big drama on this forum?
enough for now, I have issues with both this and the LC forum (which i now no longer post) but the posters on this forum are without doubt the most hateful i have come across. No offence

Hi jackchit. I have two children, almost the same ages as yours (mine are 8 and 14). I have no interest in interfering with your family life, any more than I'd want you to interfere with mine. And I suspect that the vast majority of posters in this forum feel the same.

But as one father to another, do you really think that posting death threats on the internet against a specific individual is in the best interest of your children? You may think it's nothing worse than a "little dramatic," but people have every right to take it seriously. As you probably know, there have been more than enough examples of people following through on such threats that they cannot be simply shrugged off. Surely you can see how such actions could ultimately impact your ability to care for your children? I don't mean to lecture you on how to be a good father -- we must all struggle to do our best with whatever cards we've been dealt -- but can we agree that such behavior just isn't constructive or healthy?

[jackchit]

Well, Jason - I remember it this way:

You talked about how you were happy that you lost your
wife to have more time with the "9/11 Truth".

Now this alone sounds pretty ugly if you try to slip into the
mind of a neutral person who doesn't care about debunkers
or 9/11 truther.

Someone in here asked the English social security if this is
problematic - but we still don't know if someone called the
social service on you - from this forum. Maybe it was Troy,
the guy who is no JREF'er because he was banned here
after the first 20 messages.

The next thing that happened was that you accused Gravy
who had nothing to do with all these things - and so you
threatened him without any motive beside that you think
he's a leader or something.

You missed that the one who started the whole CT-Subforum
talking about Loose Change was the Guy in this thread:


The Thread-Starter was "Delphi_ote" - and he also had nothing
to do with the problems you had. Gravy joinded this thread some
weeks after it was posted.

Then you said you visited NY which also seems to be
exaggerated.

Let me assure you that no one in here wants you to die or
something - which is the big difference between here and
other CT-Fora. You may not like the Idea but the one person
who reported you, wasn't representing the rest of people
in here. This is a simple misunderstanding.

I also watched your and William Rodriguez's back - this way
I found out that the Emails to you and him were from a
person we both know. I asked you posing as Mrs. Wallace
to get the Email-headers to the Emails you got - and I
apologize for my subreptitious behaviour - I didn't know
if it could have been you who invented these Emails - at
this time.

So what's your point?

So it was you acting as a member of the wallace family for me to forward the offending e-mails, I can understand why you did it but you can now confirm that I was not making them up, also I accept your apology.
I know more than most that this stuff can get out of hand and as you tried to expose me as a liar you can now confirm that in your experience that i am not.
You need to call off the dogs demonising me.

[slingblade]

well i can now put to bed the conspiracy theory that lc members or former members cannot be registered here.

That's always good to do. Cool.


I'm not here for a fight but i think so many things have been posted here about me that I should have the right to reply.

Absolutely! I think you'll find that the JREF forums want to extend you that right, asking only that you take on a few responsibilities with it. They ask us all to take on those responsibilities, and when we break the rules, even the "cool kids" get reprimands.

enough for now, I have issues with both this and the LC forum (which i now no longer post) but the posters on this forum are without doubt the most hateful i have come across. No offence

Eh....not all of them, honest. We have good and bad apples here. It's the price of a free but responsible society.

Please remember that the CT sub-forum is just that: one of many avenues under the JREF banner. Believe it or not, there are lots of people on this forum who have never even looked at the CT sub. Not once. And there are some people who read/post only in the CT sub and never visit our other areas.

All I'm saying is that you don't even have to look hard to find jerks in every sub-forum we have. But it is really worth it to look for the great people we have here as well.

There is a lot more I can say, but I'll just end here by welcoming you. I think everyone deserves a chance to defend themselves. I'm glad you took it. I really hope we find out you're a good but misunderstood person. Because I hope that about everyone...

[Mr. Skinny]

As the father of three myself, I think you probably misspoke when you made the comments you did about your ex-wifes death. What would your children think if they read that kind of talk in regard to their mother?

On the surface it seemed insensitive, and may not have represented what you really meant to say. However, you said it, and posted it on a forum for everyone (including your kids) to see.

Regarding the threat to Mark Roberts, I think you were totally out of line and should apologize, as he had nothing to do with the entire matter.

You over-reacted to what you thought was a threat to you and your children when someone mentioned calling social services, but that person was not Mark Roberts.

I'll be much more inclined to listen to what you have to say if you can be man enough to apologize to Gravy.

[jackchit]

So gravy was not the person who made the call to social services and for me to make the comments i did was out of line (they were not death threats) but if they were taken that way then i will be the bigger man and apologise.
Anyone with kids will realise i was upset that my parenting was questioned since one of my children is not even my biological child i thought that the encounter was crass and as a result made a play for the figurehead of this forum.
My comments were misplaced and foolhardy with hindsight.

[Oliver]

So it was you acting as a member of the wallace family for me to forward the offending e-mails, I can understand why you did it but you can now confirm that I was not making them up, also I accept your apology.
I know more than most that this stuff can get out of hand and as you tried to expose me as a liar you can now confirm that in your experience that i am not.
You need to call off the dogs demonising me.


At this time I did not know if you're playing the "attention wh*re"
or saying the truth. So I tried to get the Email headers with the
IP of the guy who sent these emails. That's why I asked you this
way - I weren't sure if you would gave me the Emails if I would
have said that it was me, Oliver.

I made it clear that you had nothing to do with these Emails and
I started a Thread at SLC where the responsible person confessed.
So yes - it wasn't your fault.

Nevertheless - the hate campaign against each other is nothing
that I would support and I also hate misunderstandings. If you
think that people at JREF are the scum of the world, you're
simply wrong. People in the CT-Subforum understand the events
different to you, that's all.

I hope that there will be a dialogue between both sides of the
story and I also hope that we can find the truth together with-
out any immature beef. Russel Pickering was a good example
about how to take the High-Road and I still hope that my
friend Jarroyo, which has a different opinion about 9/11 then
me, will start to post in here after signing in.

So open your mind, Jason - no one in here is about to defend
the real perpetrators of 9/11. You just may not see this right
now.

Cheers,
Oliver

[Oliver]

You need to call off the dogs demonising me.

I will. :)

@Dogs: Calm down - ask (PM) me if you feel angry about
something concerning this issue.

[jhunter1163]

This is quite encouraging. Jack has proven to be man enough to apologize, and I'm sure Mark will be man enough to accept. Hopefully now we can all shake hands and come out debating.

[Mr. Skinny]

So gravy was not the person who made the call to social services and for me to make the comments i did was out of line (they were not death threats) but if they were taken that way then i will be the bigger man and apologise.
Good deal

Anyone with kids will realise i was upset that my parenting was questioned since one of my children is not even my biological child i thought that the encounter was crass and as a result made a play for the figurehead of this forum.

I was not particularly fond of that whole "situation" myself. I personally did not think your comment was deserving of the "social services" thing.

Apparently, others felt otherwise.
My comments were misplaced and foolhardy with hindsight.
OK. My ears are open now - as promised.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

I know more than most that this stuff can get out of hand and as you tried to expose me as a liar you can now confirm that in your experience that i am not.
Correction: He can confirm that you weren't lying about those emails. That's all. He can't confirm that you're not lying about anything else.

By the way... how'd your encounter with Mark go again?

[mrfreeze]

Well I for one would like to welcome Jackchit to this forum. Stick around, check out the place etc. We're not that awful. Really. I promise.

[HyJinX]

Only Mrfreeze is. He covers well even though he's a true deviant. :D

[Oliver]

Well I for one would like to welcome Jackchit to this forum. Stick around, check out the place etc. We're not that awful. Really. I promise.


I seconded the welcome to Jason. Welcome on Board, Jackchit. :)

[jackchit]

Correction: He can confirm that you weren't lying about those emails. That's all. He can't confirm that you're not lying about anything else.

By the way... how'd your encounter with Mark go again?

My encounter with Mark? I'll take it you are refering to the comments attributed to me at LC forum.
I have not posted there in over a month in fact I have been IP banned there for that period.

[WildCat]

Well I for one would like to welcome Jackchit to this forum. Stick around, check out the place etc. We're not that awful. Really. I promise.
Seconded. jackchit, stick around, a little dialogue can't hurt. There's other sub-forums here too.

[Mr. Skinny]

By the way... how'd your encounter with Mark go again?
Well, that was going to be my second question to jackchit.

Jack, was that just some internet keyboard bravado?

ETA: Just saw your post above. So you are denying that you went to New York and saw Gravy then?

ETA (again): Seriously, jackchit, Gravy is not the "figurehead of this forum". Shoot, I'm the forum god, and nobody gives me much attention!

[Stellafane]

...Anyone with kids will realise i was upset that my parenting was questioned since one of my children is not even my biological child ...

Same with me. Let me guess, the kid's a handful, right? From what I can figure out, it's part of the package. Good luck!

[Stellafane]

My encounter with Mark? I'll take it you are refering to the comments attributed to me at LC forum.
I have not posted there in over a month in fact I have been IP banned there for that period.

In other words, someone faked postings under your name??

[mrfreeze]

So wait, jack is saying he has been banned at LC for a month? Then who the hell has been posted all that stuff as him?

[jackchit]

So wait, jack is saying he has been banned at LC for a month? Then who the hell has been posted all that stuff as him?

I made the so called threats to Mark, since then i have been ip banned.
I'm off to bed its late and i need to get up with my kids in the morning, I'm glad i've joined this forum and look forward to some debate that isn't hate filled.

peace.

[Calcas]

Edit. redundant.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

My encounter with Mark? I'll take it you are refering to the comments attributed to me at LC forum.
I have not posted there in over a month in fact I have been IP banned there for that period.
What is your explanation for this post (http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8003&view=findpost&p=13282833), then?

[Oliver]

What is your explanation for this post (http://z10.invisionfree.com/Loose_Change_Forum/index.php?showtopic=8003&view=findpost&p=13282833), then?


Let it go for today, Cl1mh4224rd. It's 2 o'clock in the morning
in England and 3 o'clock in germany. I'm sure he will respond
tomorrow (today :D) when he's online again.

- Oliver :)

[Mr. Skinny]

I made the so called threats to Mark, since then i have been ip banned.
I was just looking for a denial from you that you posted the "I went to New York" comment on LCF. Haven't seen that yet.

I'm off to bed its late and i need to get up with my kids in the morning, I'm glad i've joined this forum and look forward to some debate that isn't hate filled.

peace.
Sleep well.

And not everyone that disagrees with you hates you. They just disagree.

Peace to you as well.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Let it go for today, Cl1mh4224rd. It's 2 o'clock in the morning in England and 3 o'clock in germany. I'm sure he will respond tomorrow (today :D) when he's online again.
Uhh... I asked him a question. He answered. I asked him another question that he can answer when he's next online. I did not demand, nor do I have an expectation, that he should answer the question immediately, especially after stating he's going to bed.

So what makes you think I'm pushing this? Don't get overzealous in your defense of this man.

[Oliver]

Uhh... I asked him a question. He answered. I asked him another question that he can answer when he's next online. I did not demand, nor do I have an expectation, that he should answer the question immediately, especially after stating he's going to bed.

What makes you think I'm pushing this? Don't get overzealous in your defense of this man.


Well, I saw that others asked similar questions - that's why I
responded to your message. But never mind - I'm too tired to
think clearly anymore. :D :p

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Well, I saw that others asked similar questions - that's why I responded to your message.
Actually, I can see your point. No harm, no foul.

[jackchit]

I am really really tired, I have come to this forum and have tried to straighten out what has been warped previously.
As I said I have been ip banned from lc forum for a month. I have tried to make you understand why i posted what i posted but cannot be responsible for what has been posted in my name since.
I hardly expected the good wishes I have been afforded when i joined and expect that not all you people will be over the moon at my presence.
But i truly seek "truth" so like it or not i'm here (which is more than most truthers would be prepared to do).
I am not prepared to be brainwashed i do seek the truth.
now i am really off to bed as it is dead late.

[T.A.M.]

It is late, so you can address this, if you wish, in the morning.

I think, if you wish to clear the air here, that you address the comments that started all this, namely, the comments about your ex? wife's unfortunate passing, and the comments made about how this affected your "seeking of the truth". Perhaps some further clarification on how you felt might make us better understand all that took place after.

TAM:)

[~enigma~]

It is late, so you can address this, if you wish, in the morning.

I think, if you wish to clear the air here, that you address the comments that started all this, namely, the comments about your ex? wife's unfortunate passing, and the comments made about how this affected your "seeking of the truth". Perhaps some further clarification on how you felt might make us better understand all that took place after.

TAM:)
Better yet just answer one question about that post Jason. How would it make you feel if in a few years your children came across that post where you more or less thanked god for their mother's death. How would that make you feel?

[Björn Toulouse]

...snip...As I said I have been ip banned from lc forum for a month. I have tried to make you understand why i posted what i posted but cannot be responsible for what has been posted in my name since...snip....


Someone has your password then?

[~enigma~]

Someone has your password then?
Was the password password?

[WildCat]

Enigma and T.A.M., that stuff is really his own personal business. You can think what you will about it, but IMHO we'd be better off discussing 9/11 than making soap opera drama.

[The Silver Shadow]

Welcome JC. I, personally, don't hate you, nor does anyone else, according to their posts. We discuss the flaws in certain conspiracy theories, which we're not even allowed to mention on LCF. Opposition is always welcome, because it helps both the learned learn. Sleep well
:)

[Gravy]

This is quite encouraging. Jack has proven to be man enough to apologize, and I'm sure Mark will be man enough to accept. Hopefully now we can all shake hands and come out debating.Of course, once Mr. Holmes provides evidence that someone (who uses British spelling) has been using his LC account and password, and when he removes any "Mark Roberts Gay" internet sites he has created.

Remember that he appeared here the day after I posted that his local police detectives have my complaint against him. Until he clears these things up and demonstrates that he is being honest, the matter remains with them and I will not be discussing it.

[~enigma~]

Enigma and T.A.M., that stuff is really his own personal business. You can think what you will about it, but IMHO we'd be better off discussing 9/11 than making soap opera drama.Didn't say it wasn't his business and didn't say I wouldn't accept if he didn't answer. He says he wants rational debate...ok...all I want is him to answer a simple question so i can see where he stands. Nothing insidious Wildcat and I am pretty sure Jason knows he will be asked some questions about this.

[T.A.M.]

Enigma and T.A.M., that stuff is really his own personal business. You can think what you will about it, but IMHO we'd be better off discussing 9/11 than making soap opera drama.

He said he wanted to clear the air about the whole thing, and we all know the impitus for the "whole thing" were those comments. I am not telling him he has to answer...I am not even asking him because I personally want to know. I am merely stating that the best way he might clear the air is to clarify what he meant by the comment, or if he misspoke out of anger etc...

but thanks for the concern...honestly.

TAM:)

[Björn Toulouse]

If someone posted on a message forum with my screen name, I would certainly report it, and would also post a message about it on the same forum and I would wonder that if I had been IP banned, that the purpose of doing so by the mods or admins would have been to ban the poster they had targeted from that IP and if that particular poster's screen name had popped up posting messages or starting threads in the past 10 days or more, then those same mods or admins must have been asleep at the switch. That is my conspiratorial mind at work.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

IP bans are also notoriously easy to get around.

[beachnut]

I am really really tired, I have come to this forum and have tried to straighten out what has been warped previously.
As I said I have been ip banned from lc forum for a month. I have tried to make you understand why i posted what i posted but cannot be responsible for what has been posted in my name since.
I hardly expected the good wishes I have been afforded when i joined and expect that not all you people will be over the moon at my presence.
But i truly seek "truth" so like it or not i'm here (which is more than most truthers would be prepared to do).
I am not prepared to be brainwashed i do seek the truth.
now i am really off to bed as it is dead late.
A possible C on the CT sub forum? What is the "official story". Choose one of the following possible Theories:
1. Someone is posting as jc at jref and he is not the real jc.
2. jc is posting here and at LCF and thus he is not telling the truth.
3. jc was banned but now Dylan is posting just to get Gravy upset, and jc is here, and Dylan made all the fake posts, or someone Dylan knows.
4. pdoh has decided to step in with fake jc posts here and his cover story is he is jc.
5. jc was posting at lcf as he says, banned, but now someone is posting as him. Think lcf can fix this?
6. so, will the "real" jc speak up? or is this pdoh, dylan, or even jdx?

[Björn Toulouse]

IP bans are also notoriously easy to get around.



But - using the banned screen name?

[qarnos]

But - using the banned screen name?

I find it hard to believe the LCF admins would ban someone's IP, but not their screen name. That just doesn't make sense.

[The Silver Shadow]

They think that we live in basements pondering on how to take over the world while they sit in their basements on how to stick it to the man!

[qarnos]

They think that we live in basements pondering on how to take over the world while they sit in their basements on how to stick it to the man!

Well, they're dead wrong on that. I don't live in a basement.

[Oliver]

Well, they're dead wrong on that. I don't live in a basement.


Well guys - let's wait until "tommorow". I spoke to two Admins at
the Loose Change Forum and Jason will tell us the truth if he's
online again. :")

[WildCat]

Well guys - let's wait until "tommorow". I spoke to two Admins at
the Loose Change Forum and Jason will tell us the truth if he's
online again. :")
Oliver, do you ever sleep? ;)

[Oliver]

Oliver, do you ever sleep? ;)


*lol* I did sleep - even if it was less than three hours this night.
Well, there was a lot of trouble in america today - so from time
to time it's okay to stay awake to "save the world". :p

[NobbyNobbs]

Was the password password?

No, the password is "1, 2, 3, 4, 5".


Just like on my luggage.

[Oliver]

No, the password is "1, 2, 3, 4, 5".


Just like on my luggage.


No way! My Luggage also has the combination 1,2,3,4,5.
Damn, I love this movie. :D

[uk_dave]

It seems all too easy to claim someone posted in your name when in the cold light of (sober) day you realise you just made a complete fool of yourself.

Are we to believe that mysterious, highly accomplished hackers managed to steal Jackchits identity? Or perhaps the LCF mods are using it themselves? Or was he just a little bit too free and easy with his password and gave it to someone else (you know, like mates do...... apparently)? Or was he silly enough to choose something easily guessed (in jackchits case I'd guess 'Beckham' as the password)?

Or does he just continue to lie, just as he claimed that the original posting on the UK 911 forum was by an imposter too.


But what the hell, who cares anyway?

C'mon Jackchit, tell us why you believe in a 9/11 conspiracy.... all this soap opera is getting tedious.

[Oliver]

It seems all too easy to claim someone posted in your name when in the cold light of (sober) day you realise you just made a complete fool of yourself.

Are we to believe that mysterious, highly accomplished hackers managed to steal Jackchits identity? Or perhaps the LCF mods are using it themselves? Or was he just a little bit too free and easy with his password and gave it to someone else (you know, like mates do...... apparently)? Or was he silly enough to choose something easily guessed (in jackchits case I'd guess 'Beckham' as the password)?

Or does he just continue to lie, just as he claimed that the original posting on the UK 911 forum was by an imposter too.


But what the hell, who cares anyway?

C'mon Jackchit, tell us why you believe in a 9/11 conspiracy.... all this soap opera is getting tedious.


Well, I know how Invision- and Invisionfree -boards work. And I have
the replies from the LooseChange Admins to answer this question - but
I will let Jason talk for himself to clarify this issue.

[Dog Town]

*lol* I did sleep - even if it was less than three hours this night.
Well, there was a lot of trouble in america today - so from time
to time it's okay to stay awake to "save the world". :p


GOT CRACK? Olie does...Pathetic!

[Oliver]

GOT CRACK? Olie does...Pathetic!


I don't even know what Crack is - I tried cannabis some years ago.
But I guess it wouldn't help me right now - so tired I feel ... http://www.freesmileys.org/emo/sleep023.gif

[hellaeon]

what the hell, I thought this was the conspiracy forum, not Days of our lives.

Welcome JC

Come on guys, let him and Mark sort it to themselves, I am guilty of possibly (cannot remember) insinuating something about JC's behaviour in the past, and frankly its none of my business. The proper people take interest in due course.

Cheers and scotches

[Foolmewunz]

Oliver,
With your little bag of internet magic tools can you determine this is really Jason(JackChit)?

Something seems just a tad too patent, here. Occam's razor is getting all distorted, mangled and bent out of shape, so I may have to put back in the pyramid for some recharging.

(Or, alternately.... just ignore me as I'm getting paranoid in my old age.)

[Mobyseven]

Jackchit, welcome to the JREF Forums.

I will be first to admit (as it as not as though you cannot find the threads here) that I was in favour of contacting social services when the issue was raised.

To make it clear: My feelings on the matter were that if there was an issue it could be dealt with, and if there was no issue it would serve to show that any fears were unjustified.

I have seen many situations where people have been unsure about their concerns and have decided not to report or take action, which have led to tragic consequences. In one such situation a friend of mine's sister ended up dead. As such, it is my view that concerns should be taken to those who are better trained to judge a situation.

I apologise if you were somehow offended by my actions. You were judged to be a fit parent according to your account of the social services visit - feel free to lord that over me for the rest of my natural life.

I would certainly like to point out that it was not me who contacted social services, and that as far as I am aware we do not know if it was anybody from here who did (beyond someone saying that they were going to ask some questions).

I was concerned when you reacted so violently after the social services encounter, especially towards someone who was not at all connected to the issue, however you have joined here with what seems to be a quite cool head and have apologised to Mark and so I feel that your post at LC was probably just 'venting'...I would advise you that on the JREF forums a post like that could easily get you banned, so if you ever feel angry enough to write something like that here, do what a lot of us do: Write out the post, wait five minutes, delete it and then write another (calmer) reply. It has saved many of us here from posting things that we'd rather not say in hindsight.

Just to clarify - you've been banned from Loose Change since the issue of the threat to Mark Roberts? Do you know who (or why) someone would have posted the message that other people here have linked to in your name? (The one about visiting NYC) Disgraceful behaviour if someone has done that in your name.

Welcome to the JREF forums. I hope you find some answers for your questions here.

Peace Out

Mobyseven


ETA: I would like to point out though that, as per Mark's post above, you should provide evidence for the claims that you are making here. Consider my above welcome post provisional pending evidence. Also, if there is a MRGS site up again, I would strongly recommend to you once more that you take it down. Cheers.

[scissorhands]

I am really really tired, I have come to this forum and have tried to straighten out what has been warped previously.
As I said I have been ip banned from lc forum for a month. I have tried to make you understand why i posted what i posted but cannot be responsible for what has been posted in my name since.
I hardly expected the good wishes I have been afforded when i joined and expect that not all you people will be over the moon at my presence.
But i truly seek "truth" so like it or not i'm here (which is more than most truthers would be prepared to do).
I am not prepared to be brainwashed i do seek the truth.
now i am really off to bed as it is dead late.


posted by jackchit on LCF 3 days ago......

As for my own situation I have just visited NYC and as it was my first visit I have enjoyed myself greatly, the people were friendly, the food great and the sights fantastic. However the best part was when I sought and confronted Mark Roberts tour guide, like I told him he knew my eyes when they met his gaze but the best sight was him wetting himself without me having to say a word, his last words to me suggested i wouldn't get out of manhatten, well marky I did and now i'm back in Britain... I suggest you are being set up by your operatives because they clearly don't give a **** about you. ha ha ha...... now try to be a big girl and don't make me come back for you.



Are you saying that this wasnt written by you, Jason?

[Darat]

This thread is being closed. If there is any legal and/or official authorities taking an interest in anything posted on this Forum they will contact the JREF.

Remember this is a section of the JREF Forum for discussing Conspiracy Theories not for discussing your personal problems/issues and so on.

As I have said before this section is not for an apparently post-by-post commentary of another Forum. If you are that interested in discussing everything that happens on or is posted on the LC Forum then I suggest you join that forum.

I am of course not saying you cannot quote from the LC Forum, cannot pass comments on it and so on but that should be limited to what relates directly to the JREF, JREF Forum and CT section goals.