So, Who's Got No Conscience?

[Pyrrho]

Apparently the disc jockey in this story thinks she has a conscience...

http://www.cleveland.com/cuyahoga/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/cuyahoga/1061112857277700.xml


Tuesday, a co-host on Extreme Radio WXTM/92.3 FM went to Public Square, paid three homeless people $10 each and gave them a $20 certificate for pizza if they would be shocked with a stun gun.

The co-host, identified as Duji, shocked them for five seconds, her co-host Shane Rover said. They twitched, and - their bodies numb - they had trouble walking for several minutes, Rover said.

He said about 13 homeless people lined up to get stunned, but Duji stopped after three.

"We couldn't stun-gun people all morning," said Rover, adding the majority of callers to the show thought it was funny.

"We had willing participants," he said. "I think [the accused teens] have no conscience, and I hope they get harsh penalties."

[tamiO]

I have to wonder, were they really homeless people or were they actors hired to play out a promotion?

I am the skeptical sort ;)

[American]

I'd get shocked for that!

I think things like that are OK as long as the person doing it gets it done to them also, to show it's not that bad.

[shanek]

On one episode of The Screen Savers, they were demonstrating a new Taser gun and they tasered Yoshi. I don't think he got paid anything extra for it. The guy who tasered him said that he had done it himself.

It's supposed to be harmless, and everyone knew what they were getting into and agreed to it. They even got some money they otherwise wouldn't have had. I don't see the problem.

[American]

Maybe the tazer was set really low.


They twitched, and - their bodies numb - they had trouble walking for several minutes, Rover said.

Don't a lot of homeless always walk with a limp? Or if you're in Cambridge, a FAKE limp while begging for wine money? (I seen that guy on the exit ramp walk when he really has to. When you go begging in traffic, you'd better be able to walk pretty good...)

[Nasarius]

According to my girlfriend, I have no morals. Is that the same thing? :D

[PygmyPlaidGiraffe]

What are the views on homeless people now?

There appear to be more and more media coverage of brutality and abuse done on homeless people. I am sure there have been many brutal, abusive criminal acts done on the homeless over many decades. Recent reporting does not indicate the true number of cases that may go unreported, and does not mean that beating homeless is a new phemomenon.

The video taping of the events recently seems to elicit greater revulsion than the abusive acts themselves. The exploitation is deemed worse than the acts of violence.

The videos are defended as art by some, sold as entertainment, deemed ethical because in some cases the homeless are paid. The homeless are easy targets. There are few complaints/reports made by homeless of abuse.

When homeless die in a beating, they are not missed. Homeless are tasered.. who cares unless it is taped and videos distributed.

Students in my classes over the years, grade 5 to grade 12, and some adults vist websites and rent or purchase videos (for $35 Canadian) displaying abuse and brutality done on homeless people, or between homeless men while they spit up blood, groan in pain, pass out, get concussions.

Paid to fight (http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2003/01/10/9934-ap.html)

L.A.P.D officers getting in on the action (http://www.metnews.com/articles/copp111402.htm)

Crimes against Homeless (http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Agora/7076/stophatecrime.html)

Calgary - the good ol' boys have a go Yeehah (http://calgary.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=ca_beating20030709)



Young Homeless: Perps or victims? (http://www.abc.net.au/rn/talks/lm/stories/s57439.htm)

N.C.H. (http://www.nationalhomeless.org/cr00hatecrimes.html)
Over the past several years, an increase in the reports of violence and hate crimes against people experiencing homelessness has come to the alarming attention of homeless advocates nationwide

[Mr Manifesto]

It's all part of the de-humanising of the homeless. We can forget the desperation of the homeless with humourous incidents like this (I trust I don't need to put the word 'humourous' in quotation marks). They're homeless, yeah, but it's their fault. They could get a job if they wanted to. Some of them can get paid good money to get tasered.

When you de-humanise the homeless, you forget about the inherent failures in the system that lead to so many homeless people being on the street in the so-called land of the brave and free. The nature of homelessness makes it difficult to put a hard-and-fast figure on it, but about 3 million (http://www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/features/july-dec02/homeless.html) can expect to be homeless at some time during the year, with 11 million at risk.

Yeah, but it's their fault.

They're loons.

They don't want a real job.

They take drugs.

Do you know that in the barbaric Middle-East countries, such as Algeria and Morocco (and in places like India and Pakistan) it is custom among many to help those who are in need, to invite those people into their homes for food and shelter for a short time? Naturally they can't help long-term, nor can they solve the crippling poverty problems in those countries, but they try to help as much as they can and recognise that other people need help. No wonder these countries are so backward.

[RPG Advocate]

In my interpretation, giving the homeless folks $10 and $20 in pizza gift certificates is a morality-neutral action. The homeless folks were free to refuse to be stunned. It's not the same as the unprovked attacks described earlier in the story.

I don't feel any particular need to protect the streetwalking homeless from themselves. Many of the vagrants you see begging on the streets spend the money they make on alcohol and/or drugs before they buy food and water. Why should I fund such illogical behavior? How they got to be where they are may not be their fault, but those who spend their money in this way have only themselves to blame for my disdain.

Oh, and Mr. Manifesto, go ahead and invite some streetwalking homeless into your home, but don't complain when all your money and valuables turn up missing. :rolleyes:

[Tony]

I cant believe people have a problem with this. The kids were wrong to attack the bums, but the DJ and the bums are well within their rights.

[Zep]

What would Charlton Heston do...

Make it legal to hunt the homeless as a sport. Then there would soon be no more homeless people, and so (a) they could not breed more homeless people, and (b) the place would be a lot cleaner and tidier.

Crisis over!


Can we have a smilie for extreme irony, please.

[Regnad Kcin]

Originally posted by RPG Advocate
I don't feel any particular need to protect the streetwalking homeless from themselves. Many of the vagrants you see begging on the streets spend the money they make on alcohol and/or drugs before they buy food and water. Why should I fund such illogical behavior? How they got to be where they are may not be their fault, but those who spend their money in this way have only themselves to blame for my disdain.A question. Do you normally make such sweeping generalizations at the center of your arguments?Oh, and Mr. Manifesto, go ahead and invite some streetwalking homeless into your home, but don't complain when all your money and valuables turn up missing. :rolleyes: The gentleman may correct me, but it seems he was citing an example of societies where it is customary to offer a hand to one's fellow man as a way of helping him up rather than a foot to trip him and cause him to fall.

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by RPG Advocate
In my interpretation, giving the homeless folks $10 and $20 in pizza gift certificates is a morality-neutral action. The homeless folks were free to refuse to be stunned. It's not the same as the unprovked attacks described earlier in the story.

I don't feel any particular need to protect the streetwalking homeless from themselves. Many of the vagrants you see begging on the streets spend the money they make on alcohol and/or drugs before they buy food and water. Why should I fund such illogical behavior? How they got to be where they are may not be their fault, but those who spend their money in this way have only themselves to blame for my disdain.

Oh, and Mr. Manifesto, go ahead and invite some streetwalking homeless into your home, but don't complain when all your money and valuables turn up missing. :rolleyes:


Classic dehumanising behaviour in action.

[American]

I don't think the homeless should be Tazered. There, I said it.


That said, if I ever make many millions, I'm going to buy homes right next door to liberal "homeless advocates" and their families (especially women with kids).

Then I'll allow random homeless people to move in and live there. There will be booze a-plenty for them (as long as they are over 21, and not on parole, pregnant, nursing, immuno-compromised, or taking medication).

[Ladewig]

In my interpretation, giving the homeless folks $10 and $20 in pizza gift certificates is a morality-neutral action. The homeless folks were free to refuse to be stunned.

Some homeless people suffer from extreme mental illness. If the participants in this exchange fell into that category, I could not describe it as morally-neutral.

[Tony]

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto



Classic dehumanising behaviour in action.


:cry: :cry: :cry:

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by Tony



:cry: :cry: :cry:

:s2: :s2: :s2:

[Tony]

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto


:s2: :s2: :s2:


:roll: :roll: :roll:

[RPG Advocate]

Classic dehumanization, perhaps, but also pragmatic. Not to mention supported by evidence.

Many people began to beg due to an absence of state benefits when they started to sleep rough. Although the majority did eventually secure benefits, they often continued to beg because this income was not adequate to support the expensive nature of life on the streets. For most, though not all, this was linked to their need to support their problematic substance misuse. (emphasis mine)
�ESource (https://www.jrf.org.uk/knowledge/findings/housing/510.asp)

People who waste any part of their low income on non-essentials like drugs or alcohol don't deserve our help. There should, of course, be services to help those homeless who are substance-free but still struggling.

As for the comment about letting them into your house, the probable result can be inferred from the quote below. Substance abusers (though drug users more than alcohol users, apparently) commit more "gainful" crimes (i.e. theft and robbery) in order to obtain drugs. Since there's no way to tell at a glance who uses and who doesn't, spontaneously inviting someone into your home would be very dangerous.

One of the more significant findings in this study was that alcohol-dependent inmates were twice as likely to have committed violent crimes as their most serious crime compared with those dependent on drugs (37% compared to 18%). They were correspondingly less likely to have committed a gainful crime. By contrast, drug-dependent inmates were more likely to have committed a gainful crime, often in order to obtain drugs.

�ESource (http://www.ccsa.ca/docs/crimehighlights.htm)