Homegrown Terrorism: Impossible to defeat?

[Undesired Walrus]

As I understand it, and please correct me if I am wrong, but some of the suspects in the JFK airport plot are homegrown or at least US citizens are they not?
State-Sponsored terrorism is clearly a political situation, but homegrown, stateless terror?

It is not known yet if the London bombers (Less known on the 21st) were affiliated or aided by Al Qeada, but lets assume that they made their weapons in their bath tub in Leeds (Which they did) but without any outside help, a theory that is ongoing. How do you defeat this form of terror? I was amazed at the ability of the police to track down the 21st failed bombers within weeks. But how can the police possibly preempt this situation without completly alienating the Muslim community? If the Muslim community feels arguably patronised (As John Reid did in East London) into keeping an eye on their friends and neighbours, this not only strikes me as alienation, but creating a birth of hatred.

I see it as a complete new ballgame, one I fear governments have no control over.

[IXP]

Not much different than preventing other crimes is it? I think the thing that frustrates us so much about terrorists is that we can't put a suicide bomber on trial if he is successful.

IXP

[Undesired Walrus]

Not much different than preventing other crimes is it?

Yes. Because of that fact, I fear we are seeing it more as a political problem than what it arguably is, a social one. I think we are scared to realise how small this all is. Large on the scale of extremism, but small on the scale of the initial problem. We immediatly look to the government when this happens, but apart from some foriegn policy decisions that aided this hatred, this is really no different than a well-planned out spree-killing.

But then we have to think of the social unrest that can be created by having this as a major security concern. It is a loose-loose really. Stop the trans-atlantic liquid plotters, but also manage to make a load of locals in East and West London feel alienated by this negative press and police presence on their area.

[IXP]

Agreed. IIRC, Kerry make some comment about terrorism being a law enforcement problem and was raked over the coals by the media.

IXP

[Darth Rotor]

But how can the police possibly preempt this situation without completly alienating the Muslim community?
They can't, since they can't preempt all terrorist attacks on a reasonable budget. Indeed, not alienating the Muslim community is a key precursor to preempting a terror attack from within it, as tips are crucial to catching folks before they pull a stunt.

It would not, however, stop a pissed off Manchester United fan of standard Anglo Saxon blood, would it?
DR

[Upchurch]

Impossible to defeat? yes.
Impossible to fight? no.

[MilwaukeeMike]

You just have to try and limit their effectiveness, because there are always going to be terrorists.

[casebro]

They can't, since they can't preempt all terrorist attacks...
DR


Well, the FBI does seem to be doing just that.

[Darth Rotor]

Well, the FBI does seem to be doing just that.
Really? How do you know that the set of what they have found is the same as the set of all pending terrorist attacks?

You don't know that, I don't know that, so your statement is rubbish, unless you say

"Since 9-11, they have successfully done that, so far."

Tomorrow is another day.

PS: UW was posting about the UK

DR

[mr rosewater]

Well, the FBI does seem to be doing just that.

Yes, and I thank them for it!

[Undesired Walrus]

Surely Britain is the greatest threat to the United States rather than Iran and Iraq?

[Darth Rotor]

Surely Britain is the greatest threat to the United States rather than Iran and Iraq?

WTF?

DR

[Undesired Walrus]

Well, that may be an exaggeration, but think about it. 10 Airliners were within days of being destroyed by Extremist Londoners, British citizens can get into America without having to use different passports. A trip to Pakistan is seem as quite normal, and a very prominent and extremist hub of Western Islamic terrorism resides here. I'd say British citizens are an extreme threat to America.

[Darth Rotor]

Well, that may be an exaggeration, but think about it. 10 Airliners were within days of being destroyed by Extremist Londoners, British citizens can get into America without having to use different passports. A trip to Pakistan is seem as quite normal, and a very prominent and extremist hub of Western Islamic terrorism resides here. I'd say British citizens are an extreme threat to America.
"A small subset of British citizens are a potential threat to America."

I am not sweating Arsenal fans as the next wave of suicide bombers. Are you?

DR

[Ziggurat]

As I understand it, and please correct me if I am wrong, but some of the suspects in the JFK airport plot are homegrown or at least US citizens are they not?

Only one (Russell Defreitas) was a US citizen, and he was not born a citizen.

[Undesired Walrus]

"A small subset of British citizens are a potential threat to America."

I am not sweating Arsenal fans as the next wave of suicide bombers. Are you?

DR

I'm more worried about West Ham supporters.

But seriously, the trans-atlantic liquid bomb plot is by far the most serious and potentially devastating plot since 11th September. It was only days away from being carried out. It was well organised. And all of the plotters were born and bred in London. In my non-expert opinion, I think it to be a real, credible threat.

[marksman]

Well, the were Americans in that they were all born in the "Americas". None of them were born in the United States and only one was a citizen. It hasn't been reported how long he has been a citizen.

[IXP]

Well, that may be an exaggeration, but think about it. 10 Airliners were within days of being destroyed by Extremist Londoners, British citizens can get into America without having to use different passports. A trip to Pakistan is seem as quite normal, and a very prominent and extremist hub of Western Islamic terrorism resides here. I'd say British citizens are an extreme threat to America.
It is not entirely clear that their plot was likely to succeed. Check out this article.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/17/flying_toilet_terror_labs/print.html

I am no expert on chemistry, and cannot verify the truth of this. Anyone else care to comment?

IXP

[Undesired Walrus]

It is not entirely clear that their plot was likely to succeed. Check out this article.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/17/flying_toilet_terror_labs/print.html

I am no expert on chemistry, and cannot verify the truth of this. Anyone else care to comment?

IXP

When are these guys going on trial?

[fuelair]

It is not entirely clear that their plot was likely to succeed. Check out this article.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/08/17/flying_toilet_terror_labs/print.html

I am no expert on chemistry, and cannot verify the truth of this. Anyone else care to comment?

IXP
Basically correct in all important ways - most of the binaries that are useful are nerve/related gases not explosives - which is why I was laughing when I first heard this and then stopped laughing (fortunately I do not fly) when I heard the dipsoid responses (made me even happier I do not fly)about banning stuff.