Is hypnotism fake?

[c4ts]

I recently watched a hypnotist perform at my school, who claimed it could help you lose weight and stop smoking. But the performance itself looked more like relaxing speeches followed by role playing. How do I know the people being hypnotized weren't just playing along? I mean, he said the only way you can be hypnotized is if you want to be hypnotized. Sounds psychosomatic to me...

[A_Feeble_Mind]

I was selected to be onstage for a hypnosis demonstration once, and I thought I really wanted to be hypnotized. At any rate, I knew exactly what was going on and refused to just play along, so the guy let me go back to my seat. Everyone else seemed to be "under the spell," but it is sure hard to believe that when I experienced "nothing" firsthand.

On the other hand, some guys on the radio who I tend to hold as trustworthy ( they are the ones who helped interest me in Randi and JREF) thought it was a bunch of nonsense, until one of them was hypnotized, did a bunch of amusing stuff, and then couldn't remember it afterwards. I guess he could have been faking it, but since he was so convinced it was a load of crap that it wouldn't have made sense for him to go along with it.

So, I guess that I am saying that I don't know, but it didn't seem to work on me.

[arcticpenguin]

Mark Twain wrote about his experience with a hypnotist when he was young: http://www.btinternet.com/~a.ghinn/hypnotis.htm

[UKBoy1977]

I believe a large proportion of hypnotic displays rely on cooperation by the participants, by this I mean they feel pressured to 'play along' and not ruin it all.

However a lot of psychologists think it may be a genuine phenomenon for some people and attribute it to something called the 'hidden observer' in the brain.

If you do a search for 'hidden observer' you should find info on this theory.

[Jeff Corey]

Originally posted by UKBoy1977
However a lot of psychologists think it may be a genuine phenomenon for some people and attribute it to something called the 'hidden observer' in the brain.
Maybe a lot of cl.inical psychologists do, but not a majority of experimental psychologists, as far as I can tell.
The hidden observer was proposed by Hilgard.

[tracer]

Originally posted by c4ts
I recently watched a hypnotist perform at my school, who claimed it could help you lose weight and stop smoking.
Hmmm ... that sounds like something that ought to be testable.

Are there any studies comparing the long-term success rates of dieters or ex-smokers who use hypnosis with the success rates of those who don't?

[Brown]

Is hypnotism fake? Without getting into detail about what "fake" means, I would say yes, some of it is fake. It is mere roll-playing by the participants, who "go along" with the hypnotist. Ask them later whether they were "under," and they'll deny it.

But for some subjects, it is not fake. They genuinely get caught up in the process and honestly deny "going along." Many of them are surprised (and in some cases, thunderstruck) by what they did under hypnosis. (I have a tape of a friend being hynotized, and when I played it for him later, he had no recollection of doing any of the things on the tape.)

No one has ever been successful in hypnotizing me. I have, however, hynotized myself, by being caught up in a movie or play, or by writing a story. When I write stories, hours pass by and I am not aware of it, because my focus is on the story.

Many times I have driven across the state of Nebraska on Interstate 80, composing a detailed story as I drove. It makes that boring stretch of road seem much shorter. This kind of focus is a kind of hypnosis. At all times, I am wide awake, and I can adjust to all of the circumstances associated with driving an automobile. But nevertheless, development of a story while I drive focuses my mind onto something other than the tedious landscape of Nebraska, and makes the miles go by very quickly.Originally posted by tracer
Are there any studies comparing the long-term success rates of dieters or ex-smokers who use hypnosis with the success rates of those who don't? Excellent question. I don't know.

[reprise]

I'll have to drag out my old psychology texts, but I know that at least one of them reports studies of the brainwaves of hypnotised subjects showing that the brainwave patterns of those people under hypnosis differ from those of both "normal" consciousness and dreaming.

While hypnosis is essentially a tool for focusing attention, there remains a lot of disagreement about its therapeutic value and whether people can be hypnotised against their will. It is certainly possible to enter a hypnotic state unintentionally - and not at all uncommon for people to do so - but that it not the same as actively trying to resist hypnosis.

The "automatic writing" studies conducted with hypnotised subjects suggest not that there exists a "hidden observer", but that consciousness can be intentionally "split" by non-physical means.

[reprise]

Originally posted by tracer :
Are there any studies comparing the long-term success rates of dieters or ex-smokers who use hypnosis with the success rates of those who don't?

One problem with this is that hypnotic induction methods vary dramatically, as does the depth of hypnotic state achieved by each individual subject.

A study could be designed to compare success rates of hypnosis with other behavioural reinforcement methods, but you'd have to compare them over a specific period of time per subject or a set number of sessions per subject and ideally compare them to other methods which follow a set formula at each session.

[XRX]

Originally posted by arcticpenguin
Mark Twain wrote about his experience with a hypnotist when he was young: http://www.btinternet.com/~a.ghinn/hypnotis.htm


I fail to see how this is relevant. Can you not tell the difference between mesmerism and hypnotism?

[Jeff Corey]

Originally posted by reprise
I'll have to drag out my old psychology texts, but I know that at least one of them reports studies of the brainwaves of hypnotised subjects showing that the brainwave patterns of those people under hypnosis differ from those of both "normal" consciousness and dreaming.
A newer text says, "Although hypnotized subjects may feel as though they are in an altered state, their patterns of EEG activity cannot be distinguished from their EEG patterns in normal waking states(Dixon & Lawrence , 1992; Orne & Dinges, 1989)" (Weiten, 1998, p. 200)

[tracer]

Originally posted by XRX
I fail to see how this is relevant. Can you not tell the difference between mesmerism and hypnotism?
From what I can tell, the only difference between the two is the degree of showmanship involved.

[XRX]

The Twain story is about a mesmerist, despite what the URL may lead one to believe.

Consult the Skeptic's Dictionary, specifically
http://www.skepdic.com/mesmer.html
and
http://www.skepdic.com/hypnosis.html


Thank you.

[arcticpenguin]

Thanks for the links.

Mesmer did basically what today's hypnotists do in the showroom and the clinic, and what faith healers do in the circus tents and churches, only he did them together, making a great show out of his magnetic cures.

[XRX]

I was going to paste that bit myself, but then decided that some people are determined not to finish reading sentences.




edited to add

That bit: "Mesmer did basically what today's hypnotists do in the showroom and the clinic, and what faith healers do in the circus tents and churches, only he did them together, making a great show out of his magnetic cures."

just in case.

[XRX]

Oh, alright, I'll do more of your work for you...sheesh.

The key word is 'and' as in "...and what faith healers do..." (using tiny bits of sentences now). Another key word is 'together' implying that along with employing the techniques used by "today's hypnotists do in the showroom and the clinic" Mesmer did "what faith healers do in the circus tents and churches". Together. See? Two different things. One is hypnotism alone, one is extra-woo-woo hypnotism.




PS: The former is hypnotism and the latter is mesmerism.


PPS: Implying some 'difference'.