Tupperware woo (really!)

[dissonance]

I guess I could have also called this 'Suburban Housewife Woo'.

Anyway, I was at a Tupperware party last night (the things a woman will do to maintain her friendships!), and between the goofy games, there was some definite woo going on.

The first thing may not be woo: Fridgesmart containers (http://order.tupperware.com/coe/app/tup_show_item.show_item_detail?fv_item_category_co de=25000) that will allegedly keep your fruit and vegetables fresher for longer. The Tupperware lady who gave the presentation was claiming that she'd kept lettuce fresh for 3 weeks, broccoli for months, etc, etc. Given how much produce we throw away because it goes bad before we can eat it, and my inability to resist the chance to do a little experiment, I ordered one. When it arrives in a couple of weeks I'm going to run some tests, because if it actually works I want a whole bunch.

The second thing, though, struck me as big time woo. Yep, it was time for The Evils of Plastic. Except, of course, for Tupperware, which allegedly is made from some sort of special plastic that won't leach into your food and...cause bad things. What exactly those bad things are wasn't ever specified. The Tupperware lady really got on a roll at this point, and I can't even remember half of what she said, but the thing that really stuck out was her claim that 'best before' dates on things like yogurt containers aren't dating the product inside - they actually represent the date when the plastic container starts to break down and emit dangerous levels of plastic evilness. Naturally, the only solution is to invest hundreds of dollars in Tupperware so that you can immediately repack everything that enters your house into 'safe' Tupperware plastic and get rid of all your unsafe other plastic.

A bit of googling led me to this National Geographic site (http://www.thegreenguide.com/reports/product.mhtml?id=44), which seems fairly reasonable. Note that in their shopping suggestions (http://www.thegreenguide.com/reports/product.mhtml?id=44&sec=3), they do list a number of Tupperware products - but unlike what the Tupperware representative was suggesting, there's a lot of other brands of plastic container listed as safe (including things like disposable Gladware, which she specifically named as unsafe in her presentation). And, in fact, one of the tupperware containers being touted last night as the safest for microwave use is listed on that page as one to avoid!

Anyone here more knowledgeable than I am on this plastic business? I have to admit, given that most of the anti-plastic stuff I've been able to find on google leads to places like Mothering.com, my instinct is to go melt some plastic direcly onto my pizza, just to be contrary. But on the other hand if there IS something to this, I'd like to know about it. For example, I have the impression that there are legitimate concerns with microwaving in plastic, but we hardly use our microwave anyway.

[Lensman]

'best before' dates on things like yogurt containers

How can you tell if yogurt has gone bad? It IS bad. ;) :D

[Fnord]

Of course a Tupperware salesperson is going to tout their product as better than the "wannabe" brands like Glad and so forth.

I have proven, even to my own wife, the wisdom of sealing leftovers inside a container during refrigeration -- the food just stays fresher longer.

It doesn't matter if I use a Tupperware bowl, a Glad storage container, or one of those "Zip-Loc" bags; as long as the food is kept from drying out, it will last a few days longer than something merely covered with a plate or bowl. It also doesn't get all blue and fuzzy as quickly, either.

It's not the product, it's the act of sealing the container.

Try this: Place equal portions of leftovers in two identical Tupperware containers. Seal one container and leave the lid off the other. Come back to them in three days and see which one you would want to eat.

Somewhat subjective, but it still proves the hypothesis that "Food in a sealed container lasts longer than food not in a sealed container."

Okay, send in the nit-pickers. I've said my piece, and now I'm abandoning this thread. Good Luck!

[Lisa Simpson]

Those "keep food fresher" type containers are all over the place right now. I saw some at Costco last week and The Sharper Image sells 'em too.

http://www.sharperimage.com/us/en/catalog/product/sku__ZN024

[JoeTheJuggler]

Definitely sounds like pseudoscience.

I also throw away obscene amounts of produce--especially lettuce. It really seems like I get one serving out of a head of lettuce before it goes bad (it's at least starting two brown within 2 days). With the pre-packaged salad mix, it seems to do a little better before opening, but once opened, it goes fast (even in their resealable bags). I've also tried keeping lettuce in a container full of water, and that seemed to do worse.

I was at my mom's house a couple of times not so long ago, and she pointed out that the very fresh-looking salad we had was the same we had the previous time (over a week earlier). I asked what she does, and she said she just uses ziplocks, but that she is careful to get as much of the air out of it as possible.

If this is so--then I'd think soft ziplocks would do better than rigid tupperware type of containers (which is what I've been using). Anyway, I just got some more lettuce and some ziplock bags.

I suppose getting one of those "as seen on TV" vacuum heat seal devices might be worth it--if air in the container is part of the problem. (I would think that anaerobic bacteria would be worse, but maybe there's something else going on?)

[JoeTheJuggler]

It's not the product, it's the act of sealing the container.

Try this: Place equal portions of leftovers in two identical Tupperware containers. Seal one container and leave the lid off the other. Come back to them in three days and see which one you would want to eat.

Somewhat subjective, but it still proves the hypothesis that "Food in a sealed container lasts longer than food not in a sealed container."


I appreciate your take, but it seems to me that the hypothesis that needs testing is "Food sealed in container Model A lasts longer than food sealed in container Model B," which is pretty much what Dissonance intends to test.

If one plastic is more porous than another, or if one style of seal is superior to another, then there could be a difference attributable to the container.

[qayak]

Why would you buy tupperware from a salesperson at full price?

Tupperware has a lifetime guarantee. Go to yard sales, flea markets and thrift stores, buy the stuff for $0.50 and return it for a brand new one.

If you buy one cup with the plastic peeling for $0.10 they will send you a new set because the cups have changed shape and/or colour.

Tupperware used to make browning plates for microwave ovens. They were around $75.00. You can get these for next to nothing because no one uses them anymore, especially if they are damaged. Ship the damaged ones back and tupperware sends you a cheque for what they used to cost. If they are not damaged, put them in the freezer overnight. In the morning take them out and drop them on the floor. They will break everytime. Send them in and get your cheque.

I have a friend who sells Tupperware and this is what she does. She says "What the hell, if a company is stupid enough to put an unlimited lifetime warranty on a product . . ." :D

[qayak]

I appreciate your take, but it seems to me that the hypothesis that needs testing is "Food sealed in container Model A lasts longer than food sealed in container Model B," which is pretty much what Dissonance intends to test.

If one plastic is more porous than another, or if one style of seal is superior to another, then there could be a difference attributable to the container.

And a Ziplock bag probably works best because you can get most of the air out of it no matter how small the portion.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Is it in the shape of a pyramid?

[casebro]

The worst component in plastics is ... Plasticiser! But the bad kind is only used in Saran Wrap type plastic shrink wraps. They put somehing else into other items.

I think that it's the moisture that condenses on food that makes staleness. A vacuum bag system ought to work the best.

Modern 'frost free' refrigerators go through warm-up-and-de-ice cycles twice a day. Every cycle allows water to move in and out of foods. Out lots, causing the condensation in the bag, and also freezer burn. Too bad I don't have both kinds of fridge to do a comparison, but I think it is important.

[casebro]

Here is a comparison of the oxygen transmissibilty of different plastics, by the recyle code.

<shttp://www.alphap.com/basics/compare.html>

The code 7 may be used for the possible multi-layered stuff, that is very impermeable. '7' means not economically recyclable, not any particualr plastic.

[Wolfman]

I think that, after putting your produce into the Tupperware container, and sealing it, you should then take about five minutes to concentrate intensely on the container and its contents, projecting feelings of health, happiness, etc. This will imbue it with those same feelings, which will help keep it fresh longer, and also will return those same feelings to you when you eat it later.

For those who may feel that this is too time consuming (or perhaps just aren't happy right now), I'd be happy to sell you Tupperware products that have already been infused with emotional energy by myself and my team of highly empathic employees. We have basic emotions, like "Happy", "Energetic", "Long Life", etc.; and can also do custom orders for an additional $25.00 fee.

Damn...this started out as an intention to mock this stuff...but now, I'm thinkin' that this has MAJOR market potential, I could make big bucks out of something like this!

[dissonance]

I appreciate your take, but it seems to me that the hypothesis that needs testing is "Food sealed in container Model A lasts longer than food sealed in container Model B," which is pretty much what Dissonance intends to test.

If one plastic is more porous than another, or if one style of seal is superior to another, then there could be a difference attributable to the container.

Yep, the claim was that the Tupperware containers have both a more airtight seal, allowing less air in, but also have special vents that you open or close depending on the type of fruit vegetable, to let in exactly the right amount of air, and that makes their product work the best. So I'm thinking I'll get some lettuce and put some in the Tupperware, some in a regular old Gladware container, some in the crisper, and heck, I'll try a ziploc bag, too. Then maybe try it with some other fruits and veggies. There was another person at the party who was very enthusiastic about the containers and said they worked great - but she was the party host and planning to become a tupperware seller herself, so not entirely trustworthy!

And if the Tupperware does work best, I'll get more off Craigslist or eBay - seems to be tons out there cheap (the one I ordered at the party had a steep discount applied, thanks to my 'winning' one of the goofy games). I have no intention of buying any at full price, the cost is just ridiculus. I have a few pieces of Tupperware picked up at yardsales kicking around, and to say the stuff is very good quality; it really does seem to seal more tightly. But the cost is just out of control if you buy it new.

It'll be fun to experiment with, anyway. And hey, maybe the ziplocs will work best - that'd be ideal, keep stuff fresh longer AND when I inevitably forget about something at the back of the fridge and it deteriorates into brown sludge, the ziploc can just be thrown away...

[dissonance]

Wolfman - that'll be test #2! :D Tell you what, I'll take lots of photos (after, of course, I figure out where exactly in the fridge things last the longest and put the 'happy' container there), and you'll have yourself some nice scientific proof that emotional containers work best.

[Just thinking]

I might be tempted to think that after-market containers will do a better job at both sealing and preservation of fresh taste compared to what the food product comes packaged in. If for nothing more than the fact that the packaging is secondary to the manufacturer as compared to the food, which is his primary selling point. Why spend more than he has to to keep it fresh? ... or fresh tasting? But I must also say that I have (for some foods) seen better freshness packaging in recent years than compared to what used to be used.

[cloudshipsrule]

This from the National Geographic site:


Most cling-wrapped meats, cheeses and other foods sold in delis and grocery stores are wrapped in PVC. To soften #3 PVC plastic into its flexible form, manufacturers add various toxic chemicals known as "plasticizers" during production. Traces of these chemicals, known as adipates and phthalates, can leak out of PVC when it comes in contact with foods.

It was my understanding that this doesn't happen except at high temperatures, and then mostly with foods containing high amounts of fat like fatty meats. Anyone have any additional info on this?

My concern is with these new microwave bags available, which are made from some type of plastic. The idea is baby bottles, nipples and pacifiers are put in the bag with a small amount of water, microwaved, and wallah, sterilized baby stuffs. Sound harmful to little junior to anyone else? My wife is currently using such bags in the name of convenience.

[ponderingturtle]

Definitely sounds like pseudoscience.

I also throw away obscene amounts of produce--especially lettuce. It really seems like I get one serving out of a head of lettuce before it goes bad (it's at least starting two brown within 2 days). With the pre-packaged salad mix, it seems to do a little better before opening, but once opened, it goes fast (even in their resealable bags). I've also tried keeping lettuce in a container full of water, and that seemed to do worse.
Here is what Alton Brown says on storing lettuce

This is how much carbon dioxide a 1 lb. head of lettuce can exhale while you're at work. That's right. Even after harvest, greens, especially lettuces, go on about their business metabolizing nutrients and breathing. So, if you want the greens you bought on Monday to make it through to see Sunday you're going to have to force them into a kind of suspended animation which, as anyone who's ever seen a science fiction movie can tell you, involves a few steps.
Bath time. Fill a sink with about as much cold water as it will hold. Now, remember, lettuce grows in dirt and believe it or not by the time you get it home its still got a lot of dirt with it. Filling the sink all the way will allow us to get the dirt off of the lettuce and let it sink to the bottom of the sink.
Most lettuces will last longer if the leaves are left intact. But some hearty heads like this radicchio and this romaine you can cut with a knife.

THE MAD CHEF: What are you doing? You should never cut zee greens with a knife. Tear zee greens. Do small {?}, gently.
AB: [cuts the greens with a knife]
TMC: Aaaaaaaaah!

Heh, heh. Well, this is what he's talking about. See, all the leaves or greens and lettuces are basically little cellulose boxes that are full of water. It's kind of like this bubble wrap. Just pretend these are full of water instead of air. When you cut a leave—well, besides looking like Norman Bates—you breach some of the cells. Now, on a softer more fragile leaf this would result in bruising, a kind of darkening along the edge of the cut which is ugly and gummy.
But, if you tear the same leaf, the leaves just split right along the cell boundary. So if you're prepping delicate stuff, either tear it or leave them whole until you serve them. Hearty leaves like romaine, go ahead and cut. Don't worry about what chef said. Just be sure you slice, don't hack.
Washing just isn't about coming clean. It's about rehydrating, loading up the leaves with plenty of moisture so they'll stay crisp during their long nap in the refrigerator. You're going to be surprised how even badly wilted greens can bounce back after a 20 minute cold soak. You might also be surprised at how much dirt there is in the bottom of the sink. I've heard of vitamins and minerals but that's ridiculous. So, give these about a 2 to 3 minute drain then take them for a spin.

And
Now that the spin cycle is finishing up, there's one last step to suspended lettuce animation and that's oxygen depravation. After all, greens won't rot so fast if they can't breathe and they can't breathe if, well, there's no air. So just spread the greens out on a single layer of paper towel and then roll them up loosely. Now we're going to pop this whole thing into a heavy, resealable kitchen bag. Now, the towel is going to wick away any surface moisture and then slowly give it back as the greens need it. Squeeze out as much air as you can without crushing the greens and then just use a regular straw to suck out the rest. Laminated lettuce. Perfect for holiday gift giving.


link (http://www.goodeatsfanpage.com/Season1/Salad/SaladTranscript.htm)

I will also state that the basic premise that there is one way to store food is wrong, especially with produce as each will last better in different conditions.

[Fengirl]

I also throw away obscene amounts of produce--especially lettuce. It really seems like I get one serving out of a head of lettuce before it goes bad (it's at least starting two brown within 2 days). With the pre-packaged salad mix, it seems to do a little better before opening, but once opened, it goes fast (even in their resealable bags). I've also tried keeping lettuce in a container full of water, and that seemed to do worse.

One thing I have noticed is the big difference between store-bought produce and home-grown. Store-bought lettuce rarely seems to stay fresh more than a day or two, no matter how I store it. In contrast, my neighbour gave me a lettuce freshly cut from her garden last Wednesday, which I washed and sealed in a Tupperware box. It is still beautifully crisp and fresh today, five days later. So, it makes me wonder how long the "fresh" store-bought stuff has actually been lurking in a refrigerated store or on the supermarket shelf.

[casebro]

One thing I have noticed is the big difference between store-bought produce and home-grown. Store-bought lettuce rarely seems to stay fresh more than a day or two, no matter how I store it. In contrast, my neighbour gave me a lettuce freshly cut from her garden last Wednesday, which I washed and sealed in a Tupperware box. It is still beautifully crisp and fresh today, five days later. So, it makes me wonder how long the "fresh" store-bought stuff has actually been lurking in a refrigerated store or on the supermarket shelf.

Store bought produce is washed in Chlorine, as a germicide. Garden fresh is not. Chlorine is an oxidiser- it makes metal rust. If oxygen is bad for veggies, chlorine won't help.

So Alton Brown agrees with me, vacuum packing is the way to go. Or sealed in with an oxygen absorber? Hmm, what soaks up oxygen? apple slices that turn brown? Anybody notice a combination that stays fresh? Mushroom slices keep the lettuce crisp? Aerobic fungus/mold? cheese? maybe that is why bleu cheese dressing?

[opqdan]

One thing I have noticed is the big difference between store-bought produce and home-grown. Store-bought lettuce rarely seems to stay fresh more than a day or two, no matter how I store it. In contrast, my neighbour gave me a lettuce freshly cut from her garden last Wednesday, which I washed and sealed in a Tupperware box. It is still beautifully crisp and fresh today, five days later. So, it makes me wonder how long the "fresh" store-bought stuff has actually been lurking in a refrigerated store or on the supermarket shelf.Yeah, think of the time it has got to take to pick, wash, package, transport and sell the lettuce before it even gets to your fridge. I suspect that the store bought lettuce actually would last longer (it is washed and refriegerated almost immediatly, right?), except that it is already 5 days old by the time you buy it.

When I know I'll have lettuce for a while without using it, I will use a modified Alton Brown method of soaking, spinning, and sealing in a vacuum canister. It seems to work well, though I haven't done formal tests. Hmm, I've got 5 hearts of romaine in the fridge right now... do I smell an experiment?

[parrotslave]

With the pre-packaged salad mix, it seems to do a little better before opening, but once opened, it goes fast (even in their resealable bags).

Bagged salads are packed in nitrogen to keep them fresh longer. The way it was explained to me was that exposure to oxygen makes the lettuce wilt faster so they pump out most of the air from the bags and fill them with nitrogen.

[casebro]

hmmm, how about using seltzer water? The CO2 bubbles might displace oxygen? I don't think most of you have a kegerator with a CO2 bottle.

OOoo, I know! Like what I do to keep a skin from forming on a can of oil based paint, I give it a blast with an unlit propane torch! The porpane displaces the oxygen. Ought to work on a bag of lettuce too! Freon would do it too.

[nw843x]

hmmm, how about using seltzer water? The CO2 bubbles might displace oxygen? I don't think most of you have a kegerator with a CO2 bottle.

OOoo, I know! Like what I do to keep a skin from forming on a can of oil based paint, I give it a blast with an unlit propane torch! The porpane displaces the oxygen. Ought to work on a bag of lettuce too! Freon would do it too.


Propane in its natural state is odorless - there is a chemical added to propane to make it smell. http://www.gasco-propane.com/Files/faq.html#odor

CO2 would be the better choice.

[skeptigirl]

Those "keep food fresher" type containers are all over the place right now. I saw some at Costco last week and The Sharper Image sells 'em too.

http://www.sharperimage.com/us/en/catalog/product/sku__ZN024If Sharper Image sells it, you are likely either seeing a woo product, or a price inflated for a woo reason. IE, they charge more for stuff you can get elsewhere for less.

My least favorite woo of theirs that my woo believing brother bought and still believes in, The Ionic Breeze. I'd link to it but don't want to derail the thread.

Personally it has always bothered me to scrape the margarine out of the soft plastic container with a hard butter knife. I doubt such a practice was included when the FDA approves product containers. The FDA does, however, approve food product containers and requires at least some evidence of safety. But besides the knife on plastic issue, heating some styrofoam containers as well as putting something like acidic lemon juice in your tea in one of those styrofoam cups does result in chemicals being released into the food. I believe some of the newer styrofoam containers melt at much higher temperatures and are probably safer.

[ponderingturtle]

Personally it has always bothered me to scrape the margarine out of the soft plastic container with a hard butter knife. I doubt such a practice was included when the FDA approves product containers. The FDA does, however, approve food product containers and requires at least some evidence of safety. But besides the knife on plastic issue, heating some styrofoam containers as well as putting something like acidic lemon juice in your tea in one of those styrofoam cups does result in chemicals being released into the food. I believe some of the newer styrofoam containers melt at much higher temperatures and are probably safer.

Get a ceramic butter bell, much better

[skeptigirl]

WOW! I just went looking for the nitrogen packaging thing and found there was a risk of botulism which grows in an O2 deficient environment.

Modified Atmosphere Packaging, MAP (http://www.chemistry.org/portal/a/c/s/1/feature_ent.html?id=6f7d463ebf4c11d6ffa56ed9fe8001 00)

Nitrites do inhibit microbial growth including botulism toxin producing bacteria, but nowhere did I find that the bacteria could NOT grow in nitrogen atmosphere.

I did find this site (http://www.dmaonline.org/fppublic/connect38.html).Safety Considerations
In general, industry experts consider MAP packaging to be very safe. However, because the packaging process does not flow from a single standard, there can be variations based on individual products and techniques. Researchers confirm that in an environment too low in oxygen, anaerobic bacteria such as Clostridium botulinum can flourish. One study focused on shredded cabbage and identified Clostridium botulinum in 0.3% of retail packages. Another study identified Clostridium spores (not the toxin) in about 36 of 1,000 packages of retail, MAP-packaged produce. Listeria bacteria have also been found in pre-packaged salad. Researchers say that Shigella bacteria and many others may potentially survive in a MAP environment. Experts point out that both Clostridium and Listeria can potentially grow (slowly), even under standard refrigeration temperatures.

MAP foods have been linked to only a few foodborne illness outbreaks. In 2001, an outbreak of Salmonella Newport was linked to ready-to-eat salad vegetables in the United Kingdom. In 1990, a coleslaw mix was also linked to foodborne illness (botulism) in the US. In the perspective of the volume of MAP foods distributed, these incidences appear rare.

Sound Control Measures
In all, the most important practice for foodservice operators and consumers alike is to refrigerate MAP foods. Cold holding (41°F or below) throughout the supply chain is absolutely critical in maintaining the safety of these foods. Furthermore, realize that once a MAP package has been opened, it no longer provides a modified atmosphere, and the product will no longer enjoy extended protection from spoilage. Thus, it makes sense to keep MAP packages sealed until ready for use. Another control important for foodservice is date management. As with all food products, FIFO (first in, first out) and careful attention to "sell-by" or "use-by" dates is useful. With a MAP product, it's clear that any potential risk builds over time.

Finally, one good acronym deserves another: MAP requires attention to POTTWA, the factors that favor bacterial growth (potentially hazardous food, oxygen, time,temperature, water, and slight acidity). Here, think about the two T's: time and temperature. These basic controls go a long way with MAP foods.This is disturbing. Do you see many food safety campaigns advertising the need to keep packaged salads and similar products in the fridge? Could potato chips packaged in nitrogen be a risk for botulism? The reason we haven't seen a lot of cases could just be because the risk of contamination after frying the chips is low. As more and more room temp foods are packaged without O2, it's only a matter of time before those pesky spores end up in something. Just like the e-coli in the Odwalla unpasteurized juices, no one at the company had a clue that pasteurizing juice was important.

If anyone finds out any more about this safety issue, I'd like to see it. I don't have time to keep looking right now.

[Roswell-Perseis]

The worst component in plastics is ... Plasticiser! But the bad kind is only used in Saran Wrap type plastic shrink wraps. They put somehing else into other items.

I think that it's the moisture that condenses on food that makes staleness. A vacuum bag system ought to work the best.

Modern 'frost free' refrigerators go through warm-up-and-de-ice cycles twice a day. Every cycle allows water to move in and out of foods. Out lots, causing the condensation in the bag, and also freezer burn. Too bad I don't have both kinds of fridge to do a comparison, but I think it is important.
I have both a modern freezer and an older model. My grandmother has a modern and older model fridges in addition to freezers. I know that food that is supposed to be moist should be stored in older models because they are less likely to dry out. Even if one uses the correct packaging the cyclical process of modern machines dries the food out over a period of time. I have seen this work with freezers, but I have no idea how this plays out with fridges.

I can also say that moisture that leaks out of the food and onto the inner packaging after freezing will melt and humidify food- although it will doubtfully be "fresh" it is closer than food that lets moisture out into the freezer because that moisture seems to be lost. Again, I don't know if that theory translates to refridgeration.

My lettuce motto: by romaine or green and eat it fast. Storing lettuce is futile.:)

[Wolfman]

I don't see why y'all don't just invest in a time stasis machine; sure, it costs a little more, but you pop your stuff in there, and it is suspended in time...when you take it out, it is no older than when you put it in. And you can keep stuff in there as long as you want.

Silly people.

[Hellbound]

I don't see why y'all don't just invest in a time stasis machine; sure, it costs a little more, but you pop your stuff in there, and it is suspended in time...when you take it out, it is no older than when you put it in. And you can keep stuff in there as long as you want.

Silly people.

It's just unfortunate we're limited by reality. ;)

[casebro]

There is a product called Bloxygen. It is a blend of inert gasses, actually CO2, nitrogen, and argon. All supposedly of medical quality. An offshoot of the wine industry, it is sold in paint and woodworking stores. About $10 for 150 seconds worth of blasts, at two seconds each, that ought to pay for itself in preserved veggies.

[noblecaboose]

Why would you buy tupperware from a salesperson at full price?

Tupperware has a lifetime guarantee. Go to yard sales, flea markets and thrift stores, buy the stuff for $0.50 and return it for a brand new one.

If you buy one cup with the plastic peeling for $0.10 they will send you a new set because the cups have changed shape and/or colour.

Tupperware used to make browning plates for microwave ovens. They were around $75.00. You can get these for next to nothing because no one uses them anymore, especially if they are damaged. Ship the damaged ones back and tupperware sends you a cheque for what they used to cost. If they are not damaged, put them in the freezer overnight. In the morning take them out and drop them on the floor. They will break everytime. Send them in and get your cheque.

I have a friend who sells Tupperware and this is what she does. She says "What the hell, if a company is stupid enough to put an unlimited lifetime warranty on a product . . ." :D

This is also true for CUTCO knives. They have a "FOREVER GUARANTEE" which means if you buy one at a yard sale they will replace it or sharpen it for you for free (which means, basically, they send a sales associate to your home to attempt to sell you more stuff). I think with these companies, since they don't sell in stores and rely on in-home sales techniques, they can afford to do this kind of thing. They also don't spend money on advertising and claime to value the personal relationships people have with their products.
I know when I used to sell CUTCO I hated the feeling of tricking my friends and neighbors into sitting through my sales shpiel, only to ask them if anyone else they knew would be interested in my products. But even now, I still stand by the product's quality and you've got to appreciate a company that actually honors their guarantee no matter what.

[skeptigirl]

I bought a Robotics robot at a thrift store. The controller didn't work. It had a lifetime guarantee. I contacted the company and since they no longer made that $200 model, they sent us $200 worth of substitutes, our pick, and we didn't need any original receipts. I was expecting a new controller at most. Pretty good for a $5 thrift store buy.

[dissonance]

Ok, so I have not yet received my Tupperware, but two weeks ago I decided to do a little pre-experiment. Basically, I went a little nuts at the farmer's market and came home with a dozen zuchinni. We like zuchinni, but damn. May have gone a bit overboard.

Anyway, I put half the zuchinni in the crisper loose, and half in large ziploc bags with as much air removed as possible (I used a straw, so they almost looked vacuum packed), and added them to the crisper as well.

As of today, the single remaining loose zuchinni is rapidly shrivelling and will have to be thrown out within a day or two, lest it turn into sludge. The 3 remaining zuchinni in the ziploc look and feel exactly like they did when I bought them.

I've also been keeping my lettuce in ziplocs with the air removed, and I think it's lasting longer, but I don't have any control lettuce to compare to.

I'm tempted to revive my blog and do some serious experimenting once I pick up my Tupperware tommorrow...

[skeptigirl]

I often suck the air out of ziplocks with food. You don't even need the straw if you don't mind putting your lips on the baggie.

[PrincessIneffabelle]

I have never sucked the air out of a baggie, I just press it between my hands and upper chest to get most of the air out. My husband teases me about hugging the food.

[Eos of the Eons]

I came across a good resource when looking up claims that plastics are bad to microwave or freeze food in. There is a lot of information on why some plastics can be used in microwaves, and what shouldn't, and why:

http://www.jhsph.edu/publichealthnews/articles/halden_dioxins.html

The microwave and cooking stuff is near the end.

Just remember that the tupperware seller is biased, and wants you to buy the stuff. She is probably just repeating what someone else said, and has not looked into why or if it is true, and doesn't even care.

And, in fact, one of the tupperware containers being touted last night as the safest for microwave use is listed on that page as one to avoid!


:cool: Like I said, and I wonder what the tuppeware lady would have to say about that :D

Basically, you can't trust sales people. They are good at saying anything to get you to buy something. It's impressive when folks like you check things out for yourself.

[Calee]

I suppose getting one of those "as seen on TV" vacuum heat seal devices might be worth it--if air in the container is part of the problem. (I would think that anaerobic bacteria would be worse, but maybe there's something else going on?)

I have a "Seal-a-Meal", and it is worth it. I have meat in my freezer that comes out looking like the day I packaged it 6 months earlier. I have CHEESE FROM CHRISTMAS THAT ISN'T GREEN.

I brined and smoked some chicken, then vacuum sealed it and put it in the freezer, it will most likely last longer that I will.

[skeptigirl]

Eos, "..She is probably just repeating what someone else said, and has not looked into why or if it is true, and doesn't even care.."

I think it is often one of those you don't know that you don't know something. Remember, not everyone is as "intellectually curious" as a skeptic. But I have to say, I run into this often. When people I work with call a distributor for information on a product, or the sales reps show up, they often spout out false facts.

Firefighter: "Can you use bleach on a rescue rope?"
Person answering the phone at the distributor's: "Sure, no problem."

I wouldn't unless you don't care if it becomes brittle and snaps the next time you use it.

Sales person demonstrating fit testing of new disposable HEPA masks, "Just clean the mask with alcohol and fit test the next person."

Not only illegal by worker safety law, also dangerous as it can spread infection.

Those are two examples that I witnessed. Those guys didn't know that they didn't know. People are not often aware when they are drawing conclusions from inadequate information.

[skeptigirl]

I have a "Seal-a-Meal", and it is worth it. I have meat in my freezer that comes out looking like the day I packaged it 6 months earlier. I have CHEESE FROM CHRISTMAS THAT ISN'T GREEN.

I brined and smoked some chicken, then vacuum sealed it and put it in the freezer, it will most likely last longer that I will.I have one of those I inherited when my Dad died. It's a hassle to use in my cluttered kitchen but I did seal up the silver coins to keep them from tarnishing and it works great. If I had a freezer I stored a lot of food in I would definitely use it.