Mars is nearER...

[King of the Americas]

...can anyone say there has been a notable increase in War and Chaos?

[CFLarsen]

Actually, no.

For anyone with even the most superficial knowledge of history, these are actually pretty peaceful times.

Sure, no peace on Earth. Never has been.

But please point to a time in history that was more peaceful than now.

I dare you, Albert.

[King of the Americas]

Hummm...

In the last few years, 'school shootings' have seemingly been on the rise. However, a closer look at the actual statistics, show that the Columbine thing was nothing out of the ordinary, but the COVERAGE of the event was...

What is going on right now, and what our media outlets tell us is happening are 2 very different things at times.

Is there, or was there a time in our nation's history when were were at a greater level of Peace than we are in right now...?

Well, I am not sure exactly how you'd go about measuring that, but at present I can state that the U.S. have over 60% of its forces deployed. I don't think this has happened since WWII, but I may be wrong.

So, YOU CFL don't see any increase "War", but can you say the same of "Chaos"?

[Frostbite]

It's them damn aliens I tells ya.

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Hummm...

In the last few years, 'school shootings' have seemingly been on the rise. However, a closer look at the actual statistics, show that the Columbine thing was nothing out of the ordinary, but the COVERAGE of the event was...

That only proves that we have more media, that covers a lot more ground. It's actually very good.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
What is going on right now, and what our media outlets tell us is happening are 2 very different things at times.

That has always been the case.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Is there, or was there a time in our nation's history when were were at a greater level of Peace than we are in right now...?

Well, I am not sure exactly how you'd go about measuring that, but at present I can state that the U.S. have over 60% of its forces deployed. I don't think this has happened since WWII, but I may be wrong.

Why don't you check it, then?

Originally posted by King of the Americas
So, YOU CFL don't see any increase "War", but can you say the same of "Chaos"?

I asked you to give me a time in history where the world was more peaceful. Are you going to do that or not?

You claim the world has more war and chaos now. You must know what you are talking about.

(.......wtf am I saying??? :D)

[Nyarlathotep]

Originally posted by CFLarsen
Actually, no.

For anyone with even the most superficial knowledge of history, these are actually pretty peaceful times.

Sure, no peace on Earth. Never has been.

But please point to a time in history that was more peaceful than now.

I dare you, Albert.

I'll second that. It really bugs me when I hear religious nuts talking about how all the wars around the world are a sign of the end times. I have to laugh because, tragic though any war is, when looked at compared to the wars of the past, not one of our current crop of wars is even a blip when compared to WWI for example. I think people are a lot more averse to war and have a lot less tolerance for it. The US has lost 300 or so (I don't have exact figures handy) soldiers in Iraq since the war began severl months ago. This is a terrible tragedy for those families but if you compare it to the invasion of Normandy in WWII, merely a single battle of a larger war, the amount of time it took to lose 300 men would be measured in minutes, if not seconds. Somewhere around 30,000 US soldiers died in that single battle, and I have no idea how many Germans and British. In the modern day I don't think casualty numbers that high would be tolerated for an entire war, much less a single battle.

[King of the Americas]

1994...that I was a pretty Peaceful year. No major Wars or Warring, and less than 40% of our nation's military was actively deployed.

I'd like to make a destinction here. I find there to be a difference in times with military conflict, which almost always occur somewhere in the world at some time, and times marked with global Warring & Invasion of massive numbers of troops.

It seems to me, that these days are frought with violence and chaos, in most parts of the world.

Of course this is JUST 'my perception' of the events at hand.

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
1994...that I was a pretty Peaceful year. No major Wars or Warring, and less than 40% of our nation's military was actively deployed.

Hmmm....let's see.

1994:

Civil war in Rwanda. Half a million people killed in perhaps the biggest genocide since WWII.
North Korea is suspected of nuclear violations.
Whitewater investigation scandal is begun.
Mass suicide by Order of the Solar Temple. 55 dead.
Shoemaker-Levy Comet hits Jupiter.
Los Angeles suffers massive earthquake.


Yeah. Real peaceful! Half a million dead, Albert!

Originally posted by King of the Americas
I'd like to make a destinction here. I find there to be a difference in times with military conflict, which almost always occur somewhere in the world at some time, and times marked with global Warring & Invasion of massive numbers of troops.

How about the genocide of half a million people? Does that register on your scale?

Originally posted by King of the Americas
It seems to me, that these days are frought with violence and chaos, in most parts of the world.

Pah. You need to start learning about history.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Of course this is JUST 'my perception' of the events at hand.

Indeed. A fundamentally flawed, incredibly lacking in substance, "perception" of the events at hand.

Half a million murdered? You call that "pretty peaceful"?

[MRC_Hans]

Excuse me. No matter if this year is more or less peaceful than other years.

King of the Americas: Are you seriously suggesting that the regular mevements of a millions of miles distant planet has ANYTHING to do with how history unfolds here on Earth? If even a reluctant yes, then on whatever function of the universe, scientific or philosophical do you base such an assumption? Mars and the Earth are following their orbits on a mathematical basis, governed by gravity forces within the Solar System.

Before we even begin to evaluate events here, you must provide at least a shadow of a thesis on how these things might be connected.

Hans

[The Mad Linguist]

Does potential havoc count? Because as of the last decade or two, we are no longer in great danger of an all-out nuclear exchange between two superpowers rendering large parts of the earth uninhabitable.

That's gotta weigh in on the "not all-that-much war and chaos these days, actually" side of the equation.

[King of the Americas]

...even given the half a million you noted, there were less people fighting and or deployed to fight in 1994 compared to today.

How was the Clinton Investigation the cause or the result of increased levels of War and Chaos?

[The Mad Linguist]

KotA, you mean fewer AMERICANS.

Unless you have the stats to prove "fewer people"?

[King of the Americas]

"Mars" is the Roman God of War. MANY military invasions have been altered so that their timing was more closely intune with Mars' arrival.

Alexander the Great was noted for having fought under the light of Mars, as was Napapoleon. The Normandy Invasion was also put off for the arrivial of Mars.

Men follow the Stars.

A simple look at emergency room statistics show that there are significantly increased levels of injuries during full moons. Is there something ELSE influencing people on full moon nights, besides the moon? Maybe, but my point is that it is easy to corrilate men's actions and the stars, or planets as it were.

Men are affected by 'everything', especially the movement of heavenly bodies.

[Psiload]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...can anyone say there has been a notable increase in War and Chaos?
What's your theory, Darwin? The proximity of a specific planet in our solar system somehow effects the level of "chaos" on Earth? That's just plain silly. Astrology is bulls*it. Didn't you get the memo?

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...even given the half a million you noted, there were less people fighting and or deployed to fight in 1994 compared to today.

Albert,

Please. Are you saying that the number of deployed soldiers is more important than half a million people dead?

Do you know how these people were killed? In combat? No. Executed in front of a neat squad, like you see in the movies, last cig and final wish? No.

They were slaughtered, beaten to death, massacred. Left to rot, eaten by animals, casually buried in shallow graves.

Get your head out of your rectum, Albert. And come up with a more peaceful year.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
How was the Clinton Investigation the cause or the result of increased levels of War and Chaos?

Hey, you are the one who starts with silly claims....

Originally posted by King of the Americas
"Mars" is the Roman God of War. MANY military invasions have been altered so that their timing was more closely intune with Mars' arrival.

What are you talking about??? "Arrival" of what??

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Alexander the Great was noted for having fought under the light of Mars, as was Napapoleon. The Normandy Invasion was also put off for the arrivial of Mars.

Wrong. The Normandy Invasion was put off because of WEATHER!!! Read ANY book on the invasion.

What makes you say that Napoleon and Alexander the Great changed their military plans according to Mars?

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Men follow the Stars.

Men have followed fools, Albert. What does that prove?

Originally posted by King of the Americas
A simple look at emergency room statistics show that there are significantly increased levels of injuries during full moons. Is there something ELSE influencing people on full moon nights, besides the moon? Maybe, but my point is that it is easy to corrilate men's actions and the stars, or planets as it were.

Wrong. There is absolutely no evidence of that claim. Read Charlie Cotterman's essay (http://www.skepticreport.com/mystics/maninthemoon.htm), as well as other studies.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Men are affected by 'everything', especially the movement of heavenly bodies.

Male bovine manure. Prove it.

[Nyarlathotep]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
"Mars" is the Roman God of War. MANY military invasions have been altered so that their timing was more closely intune with Mars' arrival.

Alexander the Great was noted for having fought under the light of Mars, as was Napapoleon. The Normandy Invasion was also put off for the arrivial of Mars.

Men follow the Stars.

A simple look at emergency room statistics show that there are significantly increased levels of injuries during full moons. Is there something ELSE influencing people on full moon nights, besides the moon? Maybe, but my point is that it is easy to corrilate men's actions and the stars, or planets as it were.

Men are affected by 'everything', especially the movement of heavenly bodies.

The Normandy invasion was put off for reasons having to do with weather and the tides (I could be wrong on this, I am at work and don't have a history book handy, but I am pretty sure)

As for the full moon, statistics show no such correlation.
http://skepdic.com/fullmoon.html

[Psiload]

KotA wrote:

"Mars" is the Roman God of War. MANY military invasions have been altered so that their timing was more closely intune with Mars' arrival.

Even if this is true, it would represent examples of self-fulfilling prophecy, not evidence of astrological influence.


A simple look at emergency room statistics show that there are significantly increased levels of injuries during full moons.

Urban myth. Right up there with the dead skin diver in the forest fire yarn.

Men are affected by 'everything', especially the movement of heavenly bodies.

Prove it, and win yourself the kewpie doll... not to mention a cool million smackers.

[MRC_Hans]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
"Mars" is the Roman God of War. MANY military invasions have been altered so that their timing was more closely intune with Mars' arrival.

This may be so, but that only attests to human stupidity.

Alexander the Great was noted for having fought under the light of Mars, as was Napapoleon. The Normandy Invasion was also put off for the arrivial of Mars.

No, it was put off by bad weather. It WAS, however, influenced by the moon, since it needed moonlight and certain tidal conditions.

Men follow the Stars.

No. If they follow anything, they follow women.

A simple look at emergency room statistics show that there are significantly increased levels of injuries during full moons.

No. A simple look at urban legends shows this. Statistics, however, show no connection.

Is there something ELSE influencing people on full moon nights, besides the moon?

Not even the moon. The arrival of payday, however, has quite an influence.

Maybe, but my point is that it is easy to corrilate men's actions and the stars, or planets as it were.

Your point is wrong. Try to show such correlations, and you will fail.

Men are affected by 'everything', especially the movement of heavenly bodies.

Nonsense.

I'm a bit sharp tonite. Something about bashing homeopaths has eroded my patience with idiots. So sorry.

Hans

[King of the Americas]

...it has been a while since I hung out here, but the responses have really picked up!

I could usually keep up, pretty easily but yesterday I didn't have the entire day, and the really piled up on me...

My bad, guys. I'll try not to let it happen again.

To Psiload:

What's your theory, Darwin? The proximity of a specific planet in our solar system somehow effects the level of "chaos" on Earth? That's just plain silly. Astrology is bulls*it. Didn't you get the memo?

*The Placebo Effect IS real, didn't YOU get the memo?

'Some Men', think that they study and movement of the stars and planets and Men's Actions throughout history ARE sugnificant. 'Some Men' do chart their actions by the heavens, I see offerings of such information in media all over! Now, does this mean that ALL Men are affected is such ways? Well No, of course not. 'I' for one DON'T read my horiscope daily, weekly, or even monthly. But, that doesn't mean I have never done so. In fact, I have...and even seen similarities in my doings and dis-similiaries. Most of them are so broad that the believer could fit almost anything in, that would give them some symbiosis with the piece.

The point my friend, is that 'Some Men' do move in cordination with the heavens. The question is who are they, and what affect will they have?

---

To CFL:Albert,

Please. Are you saying that the number of deployed soldiers is more important than half a million people dead?

Do you know how these people were killed? In combat? No. Executed in front of a neat squad, like you see in the movies, last cig and final wish? No.

They were slaughtered, beaten to death, massacred. Left to rot, eaten by animals, casually buried in shallow graves.

Get your head out of your rectum, Albert. And come up with a more peaceful year.

*What I am saying is that TODAY there are MORE armies with guns in hand, deployed to 'front lines' positions, than there has been in in quite a while.


Hey, you are the one who starts with silly claims....

*Ah, no, that was YOUR silly claim. 'I' asked what it was doing here.


What are you talking about??? "Arrival" of what??

*"Mars" in the sky, you dope. Mars will ARRIVE when it actually gets to Earth on August 27th, when it will be closer to Earth than it has been in some 60,000 years.


Wrong. The Normandy Invasion was put off because of WEATHER!!! Read ANY book on the invasion.

*I think you are wrong, in part. The Normandy invasion WAS put off by 'a heavenily body', if at least to wait for the Moon. By the by, where WAS Mars when the actual invasion occured?

What makes you say that Napoleon and Alexander the Great changed their military plans according to Mars?

*It was just some random fact, I read in a dusty old book. I posted some several days ago that had a bunch of links to read about Mars, but it must be more than a few pages back...


Men have followed fools, Albert. What does that prove?

*That those in office seem rather 'foolish', and THEY are the ones leading us! I guess, fools follow the stars, and other fools follow them... Men follow all sorts of leaders and signs.



Wrong. There is absolutely no evidence of that claim. Read Charlie Cotterman's essay, as well as other studies.

*Well, I guess I can't argue with an Essay... My 'stats' have come from police officers and emergency room workers, themselves. After MY accident, I visited and spoke with many such workers, and asked them what 'things' cause accidents. Drinking, irresponsible drug use, driver failure, and weather were some common claims. However, almost every one of them noted a specific night of noted increase in violence and chaos on nights were people were out in number, like on full moon nights. The more people were out, the more incidents there were to occure. Moreover, Friday the 13th was also a day noted as being speficially busy.

I thought I had a pretty good bead on what were some of the causes associated with car accidents...


Male bovine manure. Prove it.

*Well, bull butter I think I just did.

[Mr Manifesto]

The period 469 BC-303 BC were actually the most peaceful years on Earth. It holds the record for the least wars.

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
What I am saying is that TODAY there are MORE armies with guns in hand, deployed to 'front lines' positions, than there has been in in quite a while.

And??

Please come up with a more peaceful year.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Ah, no, that was YOUR silly claim. 'I' asked what it was doing here.

No, you started this thread with a silly claim, which you have been completely unable to back up.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
"Mars" in the sky, you dope. Mars will ARRIVE when it actually gets to Earth on August 27th, when it will be closer to Earth than it has been in some 60,000 years.

Albert, I hate to be the one who breaks this to you, but Mars is visible most nights. It doesn't "ARRIVE" anywhere else than it usually goes.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
I think you are wrong, in part. The Normandy invasion WAS put off by 'a heavenily body', if at least to wait for the Moon. By the by, where WAS Mars when the actual invasion occured?

You tell me. You are the one arguing that the invasion was put off by "a heavenily (sic) body".

Read your history.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
It was just some random fact, I read in a dusty old book. I posted some several days ago that had a bunch of links to read about Mars, but it must be more than a few pages back...

No reference, then.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
That those in office seem rather 'foolish', and THEY are the ones leading us! I guess, fools follow the stars, and other fools follow them... Men follow all sorts of leaders and signs.

Hey, ever heard of the Reagan's astrologer? Why don't you complain about that?

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Well, I guess I can't argue with an Essay... My 'stats' have come from police officers and emergency room workers, themselves. After MY accident, I visited and spoke with many such workers, and asked them what 'things' cause accidents. Drinking, irresponsible drug use, driver failure, and weather were some common claims. However, almost every one of them noted a specific night of noted increase in violence and chaos on nights were people were out in number, like on full moon nights. The more people were out, the more incidents there were to occure. Moreover, Friday the 13th was also a day noted as being speficially busy.

Please provide the data. Not the anecdotes.

Just a quick one to think about: Why do you think a friday is busy in ER?

Originally posted by King of the Americas
I thought I had a pretty good bead on what were some of the causes associated with car accidents...

Try again.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Well, bull butter I think I just did.

You "proved" it by referring to what you have heard? Try again.

[King of the Americas]

Even if this is true, it would represent examples of self-fulfilling prophecy, not evidence of astrological influence.

*But what is the difference? I say "Mars is coming and will cause greater levels of War & Chaos.", BECAUSE I am aware of Men and their beliefs in the stars and how they react to what they see.

Urban myth. Right up there with the dead skin diver in the forest fire yarn.

*Well, it is a 'myth' that a great many emergency first responders live with daily, from their mouth to me.

Prove it, and win yourself the kewpie doll... not to mention a cool million smackers.

*I could prove that 'Some Men' are NOW actively following the stars, but I could never prove that all men are or do...

I said some time ago what Mars might bring. All that I am asking now is can YOU see any of it?

-Las Vegas gets flooded
-12 States go black
-Iraq is not 'at Peace'
-A global War on Terrorism is VERY active
-leaders are actively plotting against us, and we don't know where they are
-the circus of an election in California

Now I know, this is VERY subjective and if you looked hard enough you could find like times in almost any era. However, I would like to add, that there is a bright orange star int he sky, and 'Some Men', think it is a sign to pick up a weapon and go fight someone, and or just cause havoc for peoples.

I think this is about assigning, or ignoring motive.

[WildCat]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
[B*Well, I guess I can't argue with an Essay... My 'stats' have come from police officers and emergency room workers, themselves. After MY accident, I visited and spoke with many such workers, and asked them what 'things' cause accidents. Drinking, irresponsible drug use, driver failure, and weather were some common claims. However, almost every one of them noted a specific night of noted increase in violence and chaos on nights were people were out in number, like on full moon nights. The more people were out, the more incidents there were to occure. Moreover, Friday the 13th was also a day noted as being speficially busy.

I thought I had a pretty good bead on what were some of the causes associated with car accidents...


Male bovine manure. Prove it.

*Well, bull butter I think I just did. [/B]
Anecdotal evidence is not proof. Please find some statistics to support your ridiculous assertions, King of the Woo-Woos.

[hgc]

Hi KOA,

Nice to see you hanging out again. You are a real treat.

I won't pick apart each and every ridiculous statement you've made above, since others have already started in. I'll just take this little exchange...What makes you say that Napoleon and Alexander the Great changed their military plans according to Mars?

*It was just some random fact, I read in a dusty old book. I posted some several days ago that had a bunch of links to read about Mars, but it must be more than a few pages back...
... to illustrate what little regard you seem have for a rational examination of reality. Can't you even begin to imagine that the provenence of this "random fact" may be that someone made it up out of thin air? Don't you even care to know what the supporting evidence is for this?

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by King of the Americas

-Iraq is not 'at Peace'


For a change.




(Sorry. My bad. Will try to stop trolling.)

[WildCat]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Even if this is true, it would represent examples of self-fulfilling prophecy, not evidence of astrological influence.

*But what is the difference? I say "Mars is coming and will cause greater levels of War & Chaos.", BECAUSE I am aware of Men and their beliefs in the stars and how they react to what they see.

Urban myth. Right up there with the dead skin diver in the forest fire yarn.

*Well, it is a 'myth' that a great many emergency first responders live with daily, from their mouth to me.

Prove it, and win yourself the kewpie doll... not to mention a cool million smackers.

*I could prove that 'Some Men' are NOW actively following the stars, but I could never prove that all men are or do...

I said some time ago what Mars might bring. All that I am asking now is can YOU see any of it?

-Las Vegas gets flooded
-12 States go black
-Iraq is not 'at Peace'
-A global War on Terrorism is VERY active
-leaders are actively plotting against us, and we don't know where they are
-the circus of an election in California

Now I know, this is VERY subjective and if you looked hard enough you could find like times in almost any era. However, I would like to add, that there is a bright orange star int he sky, and 'Some Men', think it is a sign to pick up a weapon and go fight someone, and or just cause havoc for peoples.

I think this is about assigning, or ignoring motive.

This is one of the funniest posts since Muscleman went away. Oh, apparently there's one more "Mars Effect" you missed, the inability of woo-woos to use the "quote" tool on message boards or write a coherent sentence. Why is it that woo-woos never seem to be able to write clearly?

[PygmyPlaidGiraffe]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
[BMars' arrival.


"Mars is coming..."

[/B]

?:confused:

What do you mean by arrival?

Where did it come from? Where did it go? Where did it come from Cotten eye Joe?

It's my understanding that Mars has been orbiting the sun for more than 4 billion years, possibly more than 5, in an elliptical orbit (my understanding is limited though). Mars has neither left the system, nor vacated its orbit. Mars has not returned nor is it coming from anywhere as it hasn't gone anywhere.

If Mars is "coming" it would have to have left for somewhere.

Perhaps it will send us post cards, or show us souvineers. Perhaps the souvineer moons (Phobos and Deimos) that orbit Mars were collected on Mars' travels when it left its orbit. Perhaps Mars can be asked to make a presentation on how planetary bodies can achieve sentience and choose to leave their orbits at will (though I wonder what kind of venue would be suitable/practicle for this presentation).

[Psiload]

King of the Americas wrote:

*The Placebo Effect IS real, didn't YOU get the memo?

My point exactly, "the Mars effect" is nothing more than human delusion.

'Some Men', think that they study and movement of the stars and planets and Men's Actions throughout history ARE sugnificant. 'Some Men' do chart their actions by the heavens, I see offerings of such information in media all over! Now, does this mean that ALL Men are affected is such ways? Well No, of course not. 'I' for one DON'T read my horiscope daily, weekly, or even monthly. But, that doesn't mean I have never done so. In fact, I have...and even seen similarities in my doings and dis-similiaries. Most of them are so broad that the believer could fit almost anything in, that would give them some symbiosis with the piece.

Exactly my point again. It's called the Barnum effect: http://www.skepdic.com/forer.html. It's purely a psychological phenomenon, it's not astrological or paranormal in any way.

The point my friend, is that 'Some Men' do move in cordination with the heavens. The question is who are they, and what affect will they have?

Who are they?- Superstitous ignoramuses. What effect do they have?- Thanks to science, not nearly as much as they used to.

Well, I guess I can't argue with an Essay... My 'stats' have come from police officers and emergency room workers, themselves. After MY accident, I visited and spoke with many such workers, and asked them what 'things' cause accidents. Drinking, irresponsible drug use, driver failure, and weather were some common claims. However, almost every one of them noted a specific night of noted increase in violence and chaos on nights were people were out in number, like on full moon nights. The more people were out, the more incidents there were to occure. Moreover, Friday the 13th was also a day noted as being speficially busy.

The problem being that your 'stats', are not stats at all. They are merely a product of your confirmation bias. Real stats paint a different picture:

http://faculty.washington.edu/chudler/moon.html

[King of the Americas]

And??

Please come up with a more peaceful year.

*That other guy already did.


No, you started this thread with a silly claim, which you have been completely unable to back up.

*Regardless of MY claim, you ADDED that clinton crap with no reasoning whatsoever.


Albert, I hate to be the one who breaks this to you, but Mars is visible most nights. It doesn't "ARRIVE" anywhere else than it usually goes.

*Does it change position? Does it get closer to us, and then move away? When do YOU 'arrive' at a party? When you are furtherest away, or when you are at the front door? Mars is not always visible, and hasn't not been this 'close' on some 60,000 years.


You tell me. You are the one arguing that the invasion was put off by "a heavenily (sic) body".

*I am saying that 'Some Men' put great faith in the stars,a nd the movement of the planets.

Read your history.

*I have, and these are some of the most interesting finding I stumbled over...



No reference, then.

*No, not yet. I am kind half assed waiting for some astronomer to step in and sya "Hey, I know were Mars has been during each and every major military battle." I am but an amature astronomer, and a novice historian

Give me a day or two, and I'll try to link something good, again.


Hey, ever heard of the Reagan's astrologer? Why don't you complain about that?

*I thought THAT was a myth. If it isn't, then it just help proves my point, 'Some Men'- like Reagan (*A SITTING U.S. PRESIDENT*) put great weight in the stars and the planets.


Please provide the data. Not the anecdotes.

Just a quick one to think about : Why do you think a friday is busy in ER?

*Because it is a Party Day, the beginning of the weekend! As I said, these workers noted that it was days or nights that MORE people were out, the MORE accident occured. Sorry, I didn't keep any raw data during my research. I did it more for myself, than to share with other people.


Try again.

*Hey, I AM a work in progress...


You "proved" it by referring to what you have heard? Try again.

*No, you helped me prove it, by noted Reagan's interest int he stars. Look, I didn't say ALL people were afected by the stars is such ways. I said 'Some Men' are.

What is it that you suggest, exactly?

That NO ONE believes in the things I have spoke about here?

OR

That those who DO believe are in the minority, and are unable to affect their environment?

[King of the Americas]

Invoking terms like troll, woo-woo, and pointing out my grammical errors will not get my attention, hereafter.

If you wish to engage and or make an exchange with me, attack the accuracy of that which I post, not the manner or character in which YOU think I do it in.

I could call you a name, the nasty 'namecaller' that you are.

But I won't, because I think most people of some intelligence, can see you for who and what you are.

[King of the Americas]

Thanks for the welcome back!

---

Actually, I remember reading this in several different publications about the influence Mars has had on Wars and Warring Peoples.

Specifically, I remember reading that different cultures took different views on the stars, but that 'Some Men' sought to sacrafice the blood of other Men to this 'red/orange star'...

Moreover, that this has been a sustained attitude throughotu the ages toward the arrivial of this planet into a very visible position.

I posted several links to some of this material days ago, but it is pages back now.

[PygmyPlaidGiraffe]

Originally posted by King of the Americas

*Does it change position? Does it get closer to us, and then move away? When do YOU 'arrive' at a party? When you are furtherest away, or when you are at the front door? Mars is not always visible, and hasn't not been this 'close' on some 60,000 years.




Relative to planet Earth, the distance can vary between Earth and Mars.

Mars does not literally "get closer to us and then move away". Rather both bodies are in an eliptical orbit around our star, (the sun, you may have heard about this object?) and pass near each other on the same side of the sun (opposition) depending on several variables.

Orbital Parameters (http://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/factsheet/marsfact.html)

Variables of note are Perihelion and Aphelion; siderial orbit period; orbit eccentricity: in this case, a measure of how far a body's orbit around the Sun is from being circular compared to Earth. The larger the eccentricity, the more elongated is the orbit, an eccentricity of 0 means the orbit is a perfect circle. There are no units for eccentricity.; and orbital velocities.

Phil Plait (http://www.physics.ucla.edu/~huffman/mars.html) can demonstrate and explain favourable oppositions better than I can.

[CFLarsen]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
That other guy already did.

Over 2000 years ago?? Since you yourself used 1994 (but were shot down by reality), and have been pointing to the US military, I was kinda hoping you were aiming for something related to that....


Originally posted by King of the Americas
Regardless of MY claim, you ADDED that clinton crap with no reasoning whatsoever.

Sure. Your claim is crap, too.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Does it change position? Does it get closer to us, and then move away? When do YOU 'arrive' at a party? When you are furtherest away, or when you are at the front door? Mars is not always visible, and hasn't not been this 'close' on some 60,000 years.

(give me strength...) I didn't say that Mars was ALWAYS visible, did I? Are you defining "arrival" as the closest position?

How about the other planets? The Moon??

Originally posted by King of the Americas
I am saying that 'Some Men' put great faith in the stars,a nd the movement of the planets.

Who are these "some men"? Do you deny that superstition has always existed?

Originally posted by King of the Americas
I have, and these are some of the most interesting finding I stumbled over...

How can you possibly claim to have read the history of the Invasion, and NOT realized why it was postponed??

Originally posted by King of the Americas
No, not yet. I am kind half assed waiting for some astronomer to step in and sya "Hey, I know were Mars has been during each and every major military battle." I am but an amature astronomer, and a novice historian

Give me a day or two, and I'll try to link something good, again.

(groan) So, you went off on a half-baked idea and are now scrambling to find evidence for it??

Originally posted by King of the Americas
I thought THAT was a myth. If it isn't, then it just help proves my point, 'Some Men'- like Reagan (*A SITTING U.S. PRESIDENT*) put great weight in the stars and the planets.

Actually, it disproves your point that these times are worse.

And no, it's not a myth. You, who are so fond of myths, should know that.


Originally posted by King of the Americas
Because it is a Party Day, the beginning of the weekend! As I said, these workers noted that it was days or nights that MORE people were out, the MORE accident occured. Sorry, I didn't keep any raw data during my research. I did it more for myself, than to share with other people.

You. Didn't. Keep. Any. Raw. Data. :rolleyes:


Originally posted by King of the Americas
Hey, I AM a work in progress...

You are certainly a piece of work, Albert.... :rolleyes:

Originally posted by King of the Americas
No, you helped me prove it, by noted Reagan's interest int he stars. Look, I didn't say ALL people were afected by the stars is such ways. I said 'Some Men' are.

Actually, I proved you wrong.

Originally posted by King of the Americas
What is it that you suggest, exactly?

That NO ONE believes in the things I have spoke about here?

OR

That those who DO believe are in the minority, and are unable to affect their environment?

No, I am suggesting that before you start a thread like this, you do some real homework. As it is, you come across as a complete airhead.

[PygmyPlaidGiraffe]

.

[King of the Americas]

Regardless of the 'path' I travel to and from your home, or the path YOU travel to get yo your home. The 'distance' between us flucuates. At times we are VERY close, and at other times we are far apart.

If I am coming toward you, it is when I get the 'closest' that I would have ARRIVED. When I bgein to leave, then I am departing.

Mars will ARRIVE at its closest point to earth in some 60,000 years, on August 27th.

Even with a pair of tripod mounted binoculars, one can easily decipher the sphere of the red planet.

[King of the Americas]

"I come across as an airhead."

Got it, chief.

I don't guess I need to tell you how YOU come across, do I?

I mean a snide comment isn't exactly a quality retort, now is it?

[Psiload]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Regardless of the 'path' I travel to and from your home, or the path YOU travel to get yo your home. The 'distance' between us flucuates. At times we are VERY close, and at other times we are far apart.

If I am coming toward you, it is when I get the 'closest' that I would have ARRIVED. When I bgein to leave, then I am departing.

Mars will ARRIVE at its closest point to earth in some 60,000 years, on August 27th.

Even with a pair of tripod mounted binoculars, one can easily decipher the sphere of the red planet. I checked all the media articles I could find from 60,000 years ago, and I couldn't find a single one that mentioned anything about war and chaos. I have to agree with Aoidoi, I think the ramifications of the close proximity of the planet Mars to the Earth on August 27th will most likely manifest themselves as...

wednesday.

Too bad Law & Order is in repeats, or I'd be stoked for the occasson.

[Crossbow]

Sorry guys, but after reading that KOA claim about how the Normandy Invasion was astrologically timed to coincide with the moon I just had to respond and set the record straight.

First off, if anyone would like a better idea of what went into and what occurred during the Normandy Invasion, then I highly recommend the book The Longest Day by C. Ryan. The movie was pretty good too, but unfortunately movies being what they are have to leave out much detail. By the way, I expect that if the below data was in the movie version of this book, then KOA would not be making the claim that he did.

Unfortunately, I do not have a copy of this book with me at this moment, however I will attempt to recall as many of the details as I can regarding the timing of the Normandy Invasion (so I apologize in advance if I get any of these details wrong). Once the Allied leaders were satisfied that they had the resources to make a successful invasion (because no one wanted a repeat of Dunkirk) and found a suitable location for the invasion, they had to come up with a date and time of this invasion:

-The invasion would have to be in the spring or early summer to ensure that there would be at least three months of good fighting weather,
-It would have to be early in the morning so that the troops would have several hours of daylight to secure a beach head,
-It would have to be during a time when there would be at least three days of decent weather,
-It would have to be during low tide to expose as many of the German beach obstacles as possible,
-It would have to be during a time when the moon was about one-quarter full. Any less and the airborne troops (who would be going in at night) would have problems hitting their drop zones, any more and it would make it much easier for the Germans to destroy them as they were floating down.

So the planners plowed through the almanac and found very few dates in 1944 that met the conditions of season, low-tide timing, and lunar phase: mid-May (too early), early June (the favored time), and late July (acceptable, but less desirable given the June date). Incidentally, the original date was to be June 4, 1944 as opposed to June 6, 1944, but poor weather forced a 48 hour delay.

Thus, one could argue that the moon did indeed factor into the Normandy Invasion, but this factoring had nothing to do with astrology or urban legends about full moon activities.

[NightG1]

Originally posted by King of the Americas

Mars will ARRIVE at its closest point to earth in some 60,000 years, on August 27th.

Replace the word "ARRIVE" with the word "BE" and you will just about have a clue.

[NightG1]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Does it change position? Does it get closer to us, and then move away? When do YOU 'arrive' at a party? When you are furtherest away, or when you are at the front door? Mars is not always visible, and hasn't not been this 'close' on some 60,000 years.
KOA:
Mars is ALWAYS visible from the earth except during the very brief moments during occultation by the sun and the Moon. The orbit of Mars is in actuality a straight path that is being warped into an ellipse by the gravitational influence of the sun. Mars is continually moving in a straight path - it can not "arrive" anywhere. Your "party" analogy is wrong in that the party is presumably a stationary, fixed point in space. If we were to apply reality to your party analogy, we would have to relocate the party to the bed of a flatbed truck with instructions to the driver to never get any closer than a specified distance to your car. You and the party never "arrive" anywhere because you are constantly in motion and never occupy the same approximate point in space as the "destination".

Let me ask you a question: If a 737 is flying at 30,000 feet over St. Louis, do you refer to the plane as "arriving" in St. Louis?

[Luke T.]

KOA, the size of your penis is more likely to influence the number of robberies at the local grocery store than Mars affecting the state of affairs of the world. So keep that in mind the next time you get hard when surfing a conspiracy nut website.

[Nyarlathotep]

Originally posted by Luke T.
KOA, the size of your penis is more likely to influence the number of robberies at the local grocery store than Mars affecting the state of affairs of the world. So keep that in mind the next time you get hard when surfing a conspiracy nut website.

This is true?


I thought I just lived in a crime infested neighborhood.:D

[Luke T.]

Originally posted by Nyarlathotep


This is true?


I thought I just lived in a crime infested neighborhood.:D

Kinda gives new meaning to "watch where you point that thing....."

[AlH]

Since Mars is in opposition with the Earth every 26 months, it seems to me to be quite easy to find some major military happening when Mars "arrives" at Earth.

Here is a list of opposition dates from 1900 on.

(Data from http://www.uapress.arizona.edu/online.bks/mars/appends.htm)

<center>
<table border cellspacing = 2 width = "80%">
<tr><th>Opposition date</th> <th>RA</th> <th>Declination</th> <th>Disk
(seconds of arc)</th> <th>Distance
(a.u.)</th><th>Event that happens
somewhat near date</th></tr>
<tr><td>1901 Feb 22</td> <td>10h 26m</td> <td>+14x 32'</td> <td> 13.8"</td> <td>0.678</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1903 Mar 29</td> <td>12h 32m</td> <td>-00x 05'</td> <td> 14.8"</td> <td>0.640</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1905 May 8</td> <td> 15h 00m</td> <td>-16x 57'</td> <td> 17.3"</td> <td>0.543</td><td>destruction of the Russian fleet under Rozhdestvenski at Tsushima by Admiral Togo's fleet</td></tr>
<tr><td>1907 July 6</td> <td>19h 01m</td> <td>-27x 59'</td> <td> 22.7"</td> <td>0.411</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1909 Sept 24</td> <td> 00h 10m</td> <td>-04x 13'</td> <td> 23.8"</td> <td>0.392</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1911 Nov 25</td> <td>03h 58m</td> <td>+21x 43'</td> <td> 18.0"</td> <td>0.517</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1914 Jan 5</td> <td> 07h 05m</td> <td>+26x 33'</td> <td> 15.1"</td> <td>0.625</td><td>Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated</td></tr>
<tr><td>1916 Feb 10</td> <td>09h 36m</td> <td>+19x 08'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.675</td><td>Battle of Jutland</td></tr>
<tr><td>1918 Mar 15</td> <td>11h 44m</td> <td>+05x 55'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.662</td><td>Ludendorff Offensive
Tsar assasinated</td></tr>
<tr><td>1920 Apr 21</td> <td>13h 57m</td> <td>-10x 21'</td> <td> 15.8"</td> <td>0.588</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1922 June 10</td> <td> 17h 11m</td> <td>-25x 55'</td> <td> 20.1"</td> <td>0.462</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1924 Aug 23</td> <td>22h 19m</td> <td>-17x 40'</td> <td> 25.1"</td> <td>0.373</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1926 Nov 4</td> <td> 02h 36m</td> <td>+14x 26'</td> <td> 20.2"</td> <td>0.465</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1928 Dec 21</td> <td>05h 58m</td> <td>+26x 39'</td> <td> 15.8"</td> <td>0.589</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1931 Jan 27</td> <td>08h 42m</td> <td>+22x 54'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.663</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1933 Mar 1</td> <td> 10h 59m</td> <td>+11x 26'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.675</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1935 Apr 6</td> <td> 13h 03m</td> <td>-03x 52'</td> <td> 15.1"</td> <td>0.624</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1937 May 19</td> <td>15h 43m</td> <td>-20x 39'</td> <td> 18.0"</td> <td>0.515</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1939 July 23</td> <td> 20h 13m</td> <td>-26x 24'</td> <td> 24.1"</td> <td>0.389</td><td>Germany invades Poland</tr>
<tr><td>1941 Oct 10</td> <td>01h 07m</td> <td>+03x 29'</td> <td> 22.7"</td> <td>0.414</td><td>General Hideki Tojo made Prime Minister of Japan
Germans advance in Russia</td></tr>
<tr><td>1943 Dec 5</td> <td> 04h 44m</td> <td>+24x 24'</td> <td> 17.3"</td> <td>0.545</td><td>Churchill, Roosevelt and Stalin meet in Teheran
Soviet troops begin an offensive against Finland</td></tr>
<tr><td>1946 Jan 14</td> <td>07h 44m</td> <td>+25x 35'</td> <td> 14.8"</td> <td>0.641</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1948 Feb 17</td> <td>10h 07m</td> <td>+16x 25'</td> <td> 13.8"</td> <td>0.678</td><td>Israeli War of Independance</td></tr>
<tr><td>1950 Mar 23</td> <td>12h 13m</td> <td>+02x 20'</td> <td> 14.4"</td> <td>0.651</td><td>Korean War</td></tr>
<tr><td>1952 May 1</td> <td> 14h 34m</td> <td>-14x 17'</td> <td> 16.6"</td> <td>0.564</td><td>Korean War</td></tr>
<tr><td>1954 June 24</td> <td> 18h 12m</td> <td>-27x 41'</td> <td> 21.6"</td> <td>0.433</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1956 Sept 10</td> <td> 23h 26m</td> <td>-10x 07'</td> <td> 24.8"</td> <td>0.379</td><td>Arab Israeli Sinai War</td></tr>
<tr><td>1958 Nov 16</td> <td>03h 25m</td> <td>+19x 08'</td> <td> 19.1"</td> <td>0.494</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1960 Dec 30</td> <td>06h 39m</td> <td>+26x 49'</td> <td> 15.5"</td> <td>0.610</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1963 Feb 4</td> <td> 09h 15m</td> <td>+20x 42'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.671</td><td>OMG They shot JFK!
Those bastards</td></tr>
<tr><td>1965 Mar 9</td> <td> 11h 25m</td> <td>+08x 08'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.669</td><td>Viet Nam</td></tr>
<tr><td>1967 Apr 15</td> <td>13h 35m</td> <td>-07x 43'</td> <td> 15.5"</td> <td>0.605</td><td>Six Day War</td></tr>
<tr><td>1969 May 31</td> <td>16h 32m</td> <td>-23x 56'</td> <td> 19.4"</td> <td>0.486</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1971 Aug 10</td> <td>21h 27m</td> <td>-22x 15'</td> <td> 24.8"</td> <td>0.376</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1973 Oct 25</td> <td>02h 00m</td> <td>+10x 17'</td> <td> 21.2"</td> <td>0.441</td><td>Yom Kippur War</td></tr>
<tr><td>1975 Dec 15</td> <td>05h 29m</td> <td>+26x 02'</td> <td> 16.2"</td> <td>0.570</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1978 Jan 21</td> <td>08h 20m</td> <td>+24x 06'</td> <td> 14.4"</td> <td>0.654</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1980 Feb 25</td> <td>10h 37m</td> <td>+13x 27'</td> <td> 13.8"</td> <td>0.677</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1982 Mar 31</td> <td>12h 43m</td> <td>-01x 21'</td> <td> 14.8"</td> <td>0.637</td><td>Israel in Lebanon</td></tr>
<tr><td>1984 May 11</td> <td>15h 13m</td> <td>-18x 05'</td> <td> 17.3"</td> <td>0.537</td><td>Israel in Lebanon</td></tr>
<tr><td>1986 Jul 10</td> <td>19h 20m</td> <td>-27x 44'</td> <td> 23.0"</td> <td>0.406</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1988 Sep 28</td> <td>00h 27m</td> <td>-02x 06'</td> <td> 23.8"</td> <td>0.396</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1990 Nov 27</td> <td>04h 13m</td> <td>+22x 28'</td> <td> 18.0"</td> <td>0.523</td><td>1st Gulf War</td></tr>
<tr><td>1993 Jan 7</td> <td> 07h 19m</td> <td>+26x 16'</td> <td> 14.8"</td> <td>0.628</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1995 Feb 12</td> <td>09h 47m</td> <td>+18x 11'</td> <td> 13.8"</td> <td>0.676</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1997 Mar 17</td> <td>11h 54m</td> <td>+04x 41'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.661</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>1999 Apr 24</td> <td>14h 09m</td> <td>-11x 37'</td> <td> 16.2"</td> <td>0.583</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2001 Jun 13</td> <td>17h 28m</td> <td>-26x 30'</td> <td> 20.5"</td> <td>0.456</td><td>9/11</td></tr>
<tr><td>2003 Aug 28</td> <td>22h 38m</td> <td>-15x 48'</td> <td> 25.1"</td> <td>0.373</td><td>2nd Gulf War</td></tr>
<tr><td>2005 Nov 7</td> <td> 02h 51m</td> <td>+15x 53'</td> <td> 19.8"</td> <td>0.470</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2007 Dec 28</td> <td>06h 12m</td> <td>+26x 46'</td> <td> 15.5"</td> <td>0.600</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2010 Jan 29</td> <td>08h 54m</td> <td>+22x 09'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.664</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2012 Mar 3</td> <td> 11h 52m</td> <td>+10x 17'</td> <td> 14.0"</td> <td>0.674</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2014 Apr 8</td> <td> 13h 14m</td> <td>-05x 08'</td> <td> 15.1"</td> <td>0.621</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2016 May 22</td> <td>15h 58m</td> <td>-21x 39'</td> <td> 18.4"</td> <td>0.509</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2018 Jul 27</td> <td>20h 33m</td> <td>-25x 30'</td> <td> 24.1"</td> <td>0.386</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2020 Oct 13</td> <td>01h 22m</td> <td>+05x 26'</td> <td> 22.3"</td> <td>0.419</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2022 Dec 8</td> <td> 04h 59m</td> <td>+25x 00'</td> <td> 16.9"</td> <td>0.550</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2025 Jan 16</td> <td>07h 56m</td> <td>+25x 07'</td> <td> 14.4"</td> <td>0.643</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2027 Feb 19</td> <td>10h 18m</td> <td>+15x 23'</td> <td> 13.8"</td> <td>0.678</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2029 Mar 25</td> <td>12h 23m</td> <td>+01x 04'</td> <td> 14.4"</td> <td>0.649</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2031 May 4</td> <td> 14h 46m</td> <td>-15x 29'</td> <td> 16.9"</td> <td>0.559</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2033 Jun 27</td> <td>18h 30m</td> <td>-27x 50'</td> <td> 22.0"</td> <td>0.427</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>2035 Sept 15</td> <td> 23h 43m</td> <td>-08x 01'</td> <td> 24.5"</td> <td>0.382</td><td></td></tr>
</table>
</center>

Close approaches in the last 400 years

<center>
<table border width = "50%">
<tr><th>Opposition date</th> <th>Distance (a.u.) </th><th>Wars</th></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 3, 1608</td><td>0.376</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 22, 1625</td><td>0.397</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 21, 1640</td><td>0.373</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>July 21, 1655</td><td>0.385</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 8, 1672</td><td>0.382</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 8, 1687</td><td>0.374</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 26, 1704</td><td>0.400</td><td>Great Northern War</td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 27, 1719</td><td>0.374</td><td>Great Northern War</td></tr>
<tr><td>July 26, 1734</td><td>0.382</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 14, 1751</td><td>0.385</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 13, 1766</td><td>0.373</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>July 12, 1781</td><td>0.397</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 30, 1798</td><td>0.375</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>July 31, 1813</td><td>0.380</td><td>Napoleon does something
at Leipzig (loses)</td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 19, 1830</td><td>0.388</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 18, 1845</td><td>0.373</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>July 17, 1860</td><td>0.393</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 5, 1877</td><td>0.377</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 4, 1892</td><td>0.378</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 24, 1909</td><td>0.392</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 23, 1924</td><td>0.373</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>July 23, 1939</td><td>0.390</td><td>WWII breaks out</td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 10, 1956</td><td>0.379</td><td>Sinai War</td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 10, 1971</td><td>0.376</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 28, 1988</td><td>0.396</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Aug. 28, 2003</td><td>0.373</td><td>2nd Gulf War</td></tr>
<tr><td>July 27, 2018</td><td>0.386</td><td></td></tr>
<tr><td>Sept. 15, 2035</td><td>0.382</td><td></td></tr>
</table>
</center>

Wars that happen at times other than Mars' close "arrivals" to Earth:

English Civil War 1742-1751
Seven Years War 1754-1763
American Civil War 1861-1865
Franco Prussian War 1870-1871
Spanish American War 1898-1902
World War I 1914-1918

It is probably fairly easy to find a significant event for each date and a significant event that occurs midway between each pair of dates.

[King of the Americas]

WOW, great job guy!

It looks as if Wars are happening regardless of where Mars is or is not. However, that 'some' major conflicts have started and or continued to occur during a Martian encounter is suspect to me.

Moreover, t hints at the possibility that other people will use the 'arrivial' of Mars to start some *****.

[Psiload]

KotA wrote:

Moreover, t hints at the possibility that other people will use the 'arrivial' of Mars to start some *****.

Just exactly what, pray tell, hints at the possibility that other people will use the 'arrivial' of Mars to "start some *****"?

[Nyarlathotep]

Originally posted by King of the Americas


Moreover, t hints at the possibility that other people will use the 'arrivial' of Mars to start some *****.

So far, just you

[King of the Americas]

THAT 'Some Men' have done so in the past, leads me to believe that others might use the arrivial of the God of War & Chaos as an omen to start some War & Chaos.

[WildCat]

Those dates are not even close! Just a few examples (I certainly don't have time to go through that whole list, these are from the top of my head):

1914 Jan 5 07h 05m +26x 33' 15.1" 0.625 Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated
Actually, this happened on June 28, 1914.

1939 July 23 20h 13m -26x 24' 24.1" 0.389 Germany invades Poland
Wrong again, this was Sept. 1, 1939.

1963 Feb 4 09h 15m +20x 42' 14.0" 0.671 OMG They shot JFK!
Those bastards
try Nov. 22, 1963 instead.

1965 Mar 9 11h 25m +08x 08' 14.0" 0.669 Viet Nam
Are you kidding? The Vietnam War lasted more than 10 years (at least w/ American involvement). What's so special about that date?

1967 Apr 15 13h 35m -07x 43' 15.5" 0.605 Six Day War
Actually started June 5, 1967. Tensions dated to May 15.

1973 Oct 25 02h 00m +10x 17' 21.2" 0.441 Yom Kippur War
Began Oct. 6, 1973

1990 Nov 27 04h 13m +22x 28' 18.0" 0.523 1st Gulf War
Hostilities started Jan. 16, 1991

2001 Jun 13 17h 28m -26x 30' 20.5" 0.456 9/11
:dl:

2003 Aug 28 22h 38m -15x 48' 25.1" 0.373 2nd Gulf War
Look at your calendar,dude.

Doesn't take much to convince you, eh King of the Woo-Woos?

[hgc]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
THAT 'Some Men' have done so in the past, leads me to believe that others might use the arrivial of the God of War & Chaos as an omen to start some War & Chaos. Just a cotton-pickin' minute there! We haven't even established that anyone even did it in the past, but for your claim to have come across that "fact" in some dusty old book, as you put it. I, for one, find it unlikely that anyone, other than your street corner loon with a decent knowledge of astronomy, ever started a confrontation based on the position of Mars reletive to the Earth. I mean Alexander and Napoleon had so many real and present considerations and motivations for when and where to move the troops that I have no reason to believe that Mars played any part.

But I await the evidence.

[AlH]

Originally posted by WildCat
Those dates are not even close! Just a few examples (I certainly don't have time to go through that whole list, these are from the top of my head):

1914 Jan 5 07h 05m +26x 33' 15.1" 0.625 Archduke Franz Ferdinand assassinated
Actually, this happened on June 28, 1914.

1939 July 23 20h 13m -26x 24' 24.1" 0.389 Germany invades Poland
Wrong again, this was Sept. 1, 1939.

1963 Feb 4 09h 15m +20x 42' 14.0" 0.671 OMG They shot JFK!
Those bastards
try Nov. 22, 1963 instead.

1965 Mar 9 11h 25m +08x 08' 14.0" 0.669 Viet Nam
Are you kidding? The Vietnam War lasted more than 10 years (at least w/ American involvement). What's so special about that date?

1967 Apr 15 13h 35m -07x 43' 15.5" 0.605 Six Day War
Actually started June 5, 1967. Tensions dated to May 15.

1973 Oct 25 02h 00m +10x 17' 21.2" 0.441 Yom Kippur War
Began Oct. 6, 1973

1990 Nov 27 04h 13m +22x 28' 18.0" 0.523 1st Gulf War
Hostilities started Jan. 16, 1991

2001 Jun 13 17h 28m -26x 30' 20.5" 0.456 9/11
:dl:

2003 Aug 28 22h 38m -15x 48' 25.1" 0.373 2nd Gulf War
Look at your calendar,dude.

Doesn't take much to convince you, eh King of the Woo-Woos?

The heading is events somewhat near to the "arrival" since the woo-woos can always claim that Oswald/CIA/Mob/FBI/Russian/Cubans planned the assasination in Feb or Germany "decided" to invade Poland in July. Plus or minus 6 months gives one a very good chance of finding proof that Mars has an effect. A window of +/-12 months gives you just a 4 month period where Mars has no effect. If Mars did have a noticable effect that varied with distance, then it should be relatively easy to fill in the events spot in the chart. If Mars has no effect, or it has an effect that remains constant regardless of the distance, then it should be more difficult to pick out events that cluster around the dates. This is my findings in spending about half an hour googling and trying to place events with the specific dates.

KOA threw out there (without supporting data) that Napoleon, Alexander the Great and the Normandy invasion used Mars in their planning. Napoleon lost a major battle near a time of closest approach and the other date is in 1798 - what was Napoleon doing in 1798 (attacking in Egypt) but then he was militarily active from 1796 to 1815 with a short break in 1814, Normandy occurs midway between two close approaches (presumably to minimize chaos & destruction of the landing forces) and the data doesn't go back to Alexander's time. He also missed the April 20, 1999 Columbine shooting/April 24, 1999 close approach, implying that he is not too interested in validating his hypothesis and just throwing things out there. BTW, the Beltway sniper fell midway between two close approaches.


In the table of closest Mars' approaches, I couldn't come up with any really major events other than the iffy July vs Sept European-centric start of WWII with the Germans invading Poland and Lepzig. Such lack of significant events (only 2 out of more than 2 dozen occurances) with the hypothesis that the effect is greatest, thus military happenings are greatest, when Mars is closest should indicate that the hypothesis is wrong and should be discarded.

[King of the Americas]

One- Mars is a light orange/red looking light in the sky. At time it appears to be much brighter. In the past, 'Some Men' sought to sacrafice the blood of other Men to this God of War & Chaos.

*Where did THAT come from? Who named this planet this, and why? What affect was the arrvial of this sight in the sky cause? Historically Speaking, I mean. Where did this characterization come from?

Two- Not all War & Chaos is caused my Mars, that was never my contention. I said 'Some Men' have given greater weight to the movement of heavenly bodies, and it is whether or not these Men are in the majority or only in a small minority that decides if their sentiments will have a large influence on their environment, or not.

*That a sitting U.S. President consulted astrologers troubles me. TODAY, who has heard this characterization of Mars? Who believes it, and how will these beliefs manifest themselves?

Three- THIS EVENT/'Arrivial' is quite special, and can't really be compared to anything that has happened in the past, because 60,000 is the last time THIS happened... The Moon, in New Moon phase, Mars is going to be THE brightest thing in the sky. In a time of great global instability, I can think of no good coming of this Martian encounter.

*'Some Men' look to the stars and the planets for guidence, direction, and inspiration. I fear that with the God of War & Chaos ruling the night's sky on the 27th, this may result in some kind of climatic military conflict or insurgence.

What has happened, what IS happening, and what WILL happen are so often NOT the same thing...

[MRC_Hans]

Ancient people, having absolutely no idea of what Mars and all the other things they saw in the sky were, and attributed all sorts of tales to them. Of course the relatively bright objects were found more inspiring than the others.

Now, however, we know what they are and we realize that they can have no influence on matters here on Earth.

That some idiot might start some sh*t at some time guided by Mars does not show that Mars have an influence on Earth, it just shows that all kinds of idiots exist.

Hans

[King of the Americas]

"All things are connected."

What influences one man, will in turn influence his environment (earth).

Revolutions have been begun by handfuls of men.

There is no way to know WHAT final affect Mars will have on earth, on or near the 27th.

'I' am just saying I wouldn't be surprised if this encounter marked a HUGE military battle.

[The Mad Linguist]

But would you be surprised if it didn't?

KotA, will you agree, if there is no HUGE military battle on the 27th, to apologise to us all for wasting our time with this thread?

[WildCat]

Originally posted by The Mad Linguist
But would you be surprised if it didn't?

KotA, will you agree, if there is no HUGE military battle on the 27th, to apologise to us all for wasting our time with this thread?
I'd be happy if he just learned how to use the quote commands, I'm dizzy trying to figure out what he's saying.

[AlH]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
'I' am just saying I wouldn't be surprised if this encounter marked a HUGE military battle.


Past opporitions of Mars that fell within ~100,000 km of the current approach of Mars:

Aug. 21, 1640 0.373 Au distant
Aug. 13, 1766 0.373 Au distant
Aug. 18, 1845 0.373 Au distant
Aug. 23, 1924 0.373 Au distant

Aug. 28, 2003 0.373 Au distant

What HUGE military battles marked these past approaches?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Men are affected by 'everything', especially the movement of heavenly bodies.

I certainly am affected by the movement of heavenly bodies. That's why I go to the nudie bars!

[MRC_Hans]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
"All things are connected."

What influences one man, will in turn influence his environment (earth).

Revolutions have been begun by handfuls of men.

There is no way to know WHAT final affect Mars will have on earth, on or near the 27th.

'I' am just saying I wouldn't be surprised if this encounter marked a HUGE military battle. You are turning things upside down. MARS will have no effect on Earth. Stupid people inspired by Mars might have an effect, but that is not an influence from Mars, that is an influence from stupidity. Anything might inspire an idiot to do something stupid.

Hans

[AlH]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
"All things are connected."

What influences one man, will in turn influence his environment (earth).

Revolutions have been begun by handfuls of men.

There is no way to know WHAT final affect Mars will have on earth, on or near the 27th.

'I' am just saying I wouldn't be surprised if this encounter marked a HUGE military battle.

Okay, the 27th is past. What happened that you believe was caused by Mars and why?

[King of the Americas]

...this wacko across the street got evicted by force by law enforcement officials.

He claimed that he was waiting for Mars to be in the right place before he 'made his move'.

THAT is what I know to have been the result of Mars...or maybe not. He was a trouble maker to begin with, this guy who got thrown out. However, I wouldn't say he was strange or uncommon.

Mars is leaving, and he is already gone.

I understand that 'globally speaking', the sky didn't fall, and that sets me at ease.

However, that U.S. Troops are still dying in Iraq, and we are unwilling to allow the U.N. any leadership in the endeavor. We have and are although willing to accept other countries' troop support. We do NOT have enough troops incountry, now.


:wink8:

I am not sure what that emo-con is supposed to mean, I just wanted to use it once.

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
[BI understand that 'globally speaking', the sky didn't fall, and that sets me at ease.

However, that U.S. Troops are still dying in Iraq, and we are unwilling to allow the U.N. any leadership in the endeavor. We have and are although willing to accept other countries' troop support. We do NOT have enough troops incountry, now.[/B]
These things were happening weeks and months ago. How could it have anything to do with Mars?

[King of the Americas]

...to be honest, I half ass expected for there to be a marked increase in invasion of armies onto a sincere battlefield with last night's peak nearness of Mars & Earth.

Given that We, the Public aren't really privy to real time battlefield information, I can't say here now today that this didn't in fact happen.

Therefore, I guess we will have to wait and let History decide what did or did not happen on or near the 27th, that could have been because this God of War & Chaos was near.

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...to be honest, I half ass expected for there to be a marked increase in invasion of armies onto a sincere battlefield with last night's peak nearness of Mars & Earth.

Given that We, the Public aren't really privy to real time battlefield information, I can't say here now today that this didn't in fact happen.

Therefore, I guess we will have to wait and let History decide what did or did not happen on or near the 27th, that could have been because this God of War & Chaos was near.
Are you serious? There are reporters covering everyplace in the world a huge battle like you're talking about might happen. What did you think the embedded reporters in Iraq were doing if they weren't providing us with real-time battlefield information?

[Grammatron]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...to be honest, I half ass expected for there to be a marked increase in invasion of armies onto a sincere battlefield with last night's peak nearness of Mars & Earth.

Given that We, the Public aren't really privy to real time battlefield information, I can't say here now today that this didn't in fact happen.

Therefore, I guess we will have to wait and let History decide what did or did not happen on or near the 27th, that could have been because this God of War & Chaos was near.

You know "I was wrong and you people were right" is so much easier and faster to type.

[King of the Americas]

...I don't mind conceeding that there wasn't a Normandy that happened without my knowing.

So, indeed I dont know about any 'large invasion and or attack' happening to coincide with the Martian encounter.

However, what I DON'T know and am unsettled about is that there are right NOW people from other nations converging on Iraq in order to engage the U.S. Military. How many came in last night under the nose of Mars? I don't know, and I don't think I will know for a while, if ever.

It is clear there was no 'major attack' that I was predicting or extracting from my historical lessons. My conclusions were inaccurate, at best.

HOWEVER, I DO have some neat pictures from the Hubble Telescope:

http://hubblesite.org/db/2003/22/images/f/formats/web_print.jpg

[Psiload]

King of the Americas wrote:

...to be honest, I half ass expected for there to be a marked increase in invasion of armies onto a sincere battlefield with last night's peak nearness of Mars & Earth.

When your theories are half-baked, I guess it's only fitting that your expectations should be half-assed.

Given that We, the Public aren't really privy to real time battlefield information, I can't say here now today that this didn't in fact happen.

Yeah, it sucks that we have to rely on written reports delivered by carrier pigeon from "embedded" war reporters. Wouldn't it be cool if someone invented some sort of gizmo that you stuck up in space that relayed real time images from the actual battlefield? :rolleyes:

Therefore, I guess we will have to wait and let History decide what did or did not happen on or near the 27th, that could have been because this God of War & Chaos was near.

So it's "on or near the 27th" now, is it? You're a regular Texas sharpshooter... drawing the bullseyes around the bullet holes.

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
[BHowever, what I DON'T know and am unsettled about is that there are right NOW people from other nations converging on Iraq in order to engage the U.S. Military. How many came in last night under the nose of Mars? I don't know, and I don't think I will know for a while, if ever.[/B]

But, again, they've been doing that for months. Besides, sneaking into Iraq while Mars is that bright is stupid. It's so bright it will cause you to cast a shadow if you're someplace with no artificial light. You'd be a sitting duck.

[King of the Americas]

...so what didn't happen?

Well, the God of War & Chaos saw a 'monumental' suprem court decision, take God out of a court house...metaphorically speaking.

[Graham]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...so what didn't happen?

Well, the God of War & Chaos saw a 'monumental' suprem court decision, take God out of a court house...metaphorically speaking.

A court decision that was utterly insignificant to the vast majority of the world's population and only mildly significant to a tiny minority . . . not all that monumental really except as a very, very bad pun.

Do you talk like that in real life, btw?

Graham

[NoZed Avenger]

Mars came all that way to remove a statue?

Couldn't the monument be swallowed up into a giant crack opened by a mighty earthquake? Where are the flames and screaming? Where are the special effects?

Hmmm. Have modern blockbuster movies ruined our appreciation for miracles?

[King of the Americas]

..."To Kill a Mockingbird", last weekend.

I believe I HAVE been ruined by modern blockbuster movies.

Our expectations just keep getting bigger and broader.

I wonder how disappointed we will be when we meet God?

[Graham]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
..."To Kill a Mockingbird", last weekend.

I believe I HAVE been ruined by modern blockbuster movies.

Our expectations just keep getting bigger and broader.

I wonder how disappointed we will be when we meet God?

I'm guessing "very" . . . .but probably not for the reason you mean.

Graham

[Nyarlathotep]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...so what didn't happen?

Well, the God of War & Chaos saw a 'monumental' suprem court decision, take God out of a court house...metaphorically speaking.

That's the best you could do?

You make such a broad, open ended prediction and THAT was the best thing you could find to fit it. Nostradamus you're not, heck you aren't even up to Sylvia Brown status.

[King of the Americas]

Then I am glad I never put on the robes of a prophet..

[Graham]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Then I am glad I never put on the robes of a prophet..

I think he'd probably be asking for them back if you had..