Company prints its OWN currency [Archive]

This Guy

1st September 2007, 01:51 PM

Well, can't argue with *this* logic... :rolleyes:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/osceola/orl-funnymoney0107sep01,0,7473758.story?coll=orl_tab01 _layout

Nope!

Cause anyone this delusional wouldn't be able to offer a sound argument anyway I figure. ;)

fuelair

1st September 2007, 02:21 PM

Well, can't argue with *this* logic... :rolleyes:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/osceola/orl-funnymoney0107sep01,0,7473758.story?coll=orl_tab01 _layout
Well, Kissimmee is near FantasyLand - I guess it rubbed off on this incompetant. Sorry it is near where I live though!!!:jaw-dropp

Madalch

1st September 2007, 02:30 PM

I wonder what the exchange rate would be between those and Canadian Tire money.

Gord_in_Toronto

1st September 2007, 02:51 PM

I wonder what the exchange rate would be between those and Canadian Tire money.

Well at least Canadian Tire money is backed by tires! So I would guess no contest.

hgc

1st September 2007, 04:50 PM

...
He said he will be printing "real U.S. dollars," because he considers those issued by the Federal Reserve illegal, since they are not backed by gold, silver or any other tangible assets.
...
All was done using checks printed by United Cities. Those were backed by "The United States Private Dollar" that Cruz conceived. He said his currency is backed by undisclosed assets and the future earnings of his network's employees.
...

What's good for the goose is good for the gander, I always say. If this guy claims that real currency is backed by real stuff, then show me the money!

Charlie Monoxide

1st September 2007, 10:57 PM

The only thing I miss about Florida is their sincere wackiness ....

Charlie (might end up back there) Monoxide

webfusion

2nd September 2007, 06:57 AM

I took a magnifying glass and inspected the photo accompanying the article:

"What, Me Worry?"

http://home.comcast.net/~advent99/newmanmoney.jpg

Mobyseven

2nd September 2007, 07:13 AM

Fantastic. Because there weren't enough morons in jail already.

Mangafranga

2nd September 2007, 07:50 AM

Fantastic. Because there weren't enough morons in jail already.But the number of morons inside jail is directly related to the number outside of jail.

TragicMonkey

2nd September 2007, 08:10 AM

Fantastic. Because there weren't enough morons in jail already.

He'll just start printing his own prison currency. "This note is backed by a carton of cigarettes."

kmortis

2nd September 2007, 08:11 AM

Fantastic. Because there weren't enough morons in jail already.

Well, obviously not. They're still running amok outside, infecting us with their moronitude.

I used to work of a police department, and my Lt. once told me that the only reason she ever arrested anyone was for the crime of "criminal stupidity". Granted, it had various other names (e.g. illegal consumption of alcohol by a minor or drunk driving - did I mention that this was on camous?), but it all came down to "criminal stupidity".

fuelair

2nd September 2007, 09:36 AM

He'll just start printing his own prison currency. "This note is backed by a carton of cigarettes."Or, more likely"This note is backed by my backside".:D

SteveGrenard

2nd September 2007, 09:45 AM

There is hardly anything new about private currency printing and distribution. It was done in this country for hundreds of years, is still done overseas, mostly by banks, and during WW II our own soldiers in some locations were paid in fake money known as "scrip" I believe.

A case could be made that gift certificates, prepaid credit cards and coupons that can be used to acquire goods are private currency as well. Anyone of us can scribble out an IOU, decorate it any way we please and issue our own currency that way. Hotels in Florida that couldn't pay their ad bills routinely issued IOUs, called due bills, that were sold at a discount to insiders in the printing, ad and media industry who would then enjoy a half price stay.

Here is a more blatant example:

www.milleniumdollar.com

And our daily newspapers are filled with ads for fake coinage designed to look like real government issued coinage but produced by firms calling themselves private mints. They bear denominations on them but are designed to bilk people who think they are coin collectors or investors. Some of this junk money does end up being collector's items, maybe in a few hundred years.

Google "private currency." Go to Google images and enter "private currency" for a picture show of innumerable perfectly legal examples.

The Central Scrutinizer

2nd September 2007, 03:23 PM

He is also calling for the Department of Treasury's Office of the Comptroller of the Currency as well as the Federal Reserve System -- which he has called "Satan's banking system"-- "to prove or retract their false claims within 48 hours" about his company issuing "worthless" checks.

This guy is a nut. Everyone knows Satan banks at JP Morgan Chase.

Temporal Renegade

2nd September 2007, 05:24 PM

This guy is a nut. Everyone knows Satan banks at JP Morgan Chase.

Hmm. And here I was, thinking that it was Jesus who saved....

The Central Scrutinizer

2nd September 2007, 07:10 PM

Hmm. And here I was, thinking that it was Jesus who saved....

Nope, that was Gump Worsley.

fuelair

2nd September 2007, 09:12 PM

Hmm. And here I was, thinking that it was Jesus who saved....

Jesus Saves (but)

Moses Invests (but)

Cthulhu Ingests.:jaw-dropp

strathmeyer

2nd September 2007, 10:05 PM

This guy is a nut. Everyone knows Satan banks at JP Morgan Chase.

Evidence? It's clear that he banks at Bank of America: http://www.consumerist.com/search/boa/

TragicMonkey

2nd September 2007, 11:54 PM

Jesus Saves (but)

Moses Invests (but)

Cthulhu Ingests.:jaw-dropp

Reminds me of a joke. Jesus and Cthulhu were hanging out, and Jesus was explaining to the less-organized-religion Cthulhu about tithing. Jesus told him "I do pretty well off my worshippers. I just take ten percent."

So Cthulhu followed his advice, and started leaving ninety percent of each corpse behind.

Bob Klase

3rd September 2007, 07:28 AM

There is hardly anything new about private currency printing and distribution. It was done in this country for hundreds of years, is still done overseas, mostly by banks, and during WW II our own soldiers in some locations were paid in fake money known as "scrip" I believe.

There's a difference between printing 'private currency' and printing duplicates of US currency. The latter is called counterfeiting and it's illegal.

A case could be made that gift certificates, prepaid credit cards and coupons that can be used to acquire goods are private currency as well. Anyone of us can scribble out an IOU, decorate it any way we please and issue our own currency that way. Hotels in Florida that couldn't pay their ad bills routinely issued IOUs, called due bills, that were sold at a discount to insiders in the printing, ad and media industry who would then enjoy a half price stay.

Google "private currency." Go to Google images and enter "private currency" for a picture show of innumerable perfectly legal examples.

Then go to the link in the OP for a photo of what appears to be an illegal example.

SteveGrenard

3rd September 2007, 12:29 PM

It's too blurry and perhaps a bit too far for me to see the wording on the bills but if it is changed it is not counterfeiting. Certainly at a glance it looks
like actual copies, probably made on a scanner and color printed. Is the Alfred E. Neumann note an example of mad money?

www/prankplace.com/funnymoney.com

Ziggurat

3rd September 2007, 12:55 PM

Or, more likely"This note is backed by my backside".:D

Where do you think all those cigarettes are stored? :eek:

The Central Scrutinizer

3rd September 2007, 08:38 PM

It's too blurry and perhaps a bit too far for me to see the wording on the bills but if it is changed it is not counterfeiting.

Wrong (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000471----000-.html).

quixotecoyote

3rd September 2007, 08:50 PM

Wrong (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode18/usc_sec_18_00000471----000-.html).

I don't think your link supports your assertion.

If he prints money with a clear difference from normal currency, he is not altering "any obligation or other security of the United States" but creating his own currency. That is perfectly legal to do if all other factors are legitimate, which they don't appear to be in this case.

The Central Scrutinizer

3rd September 2007, 09:00 PM

I don't think your link supports your assertion.

If he prints money with a clear difference from normal currency, he is not altering "any obligation or other security of the United States" but creating his own currency. That is perfectly legal to do if all other factors are legitimate, which they don't appear to be in this case.

Whoever, with intent to defraud, falsely makes, forges, counterfeits, or alters any obligation or other security of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both.

This is the key passage. If I understand the article correctly, he intends to pass it off as real currency.

quixotecoyote

3rd September 2007, 09:05 PM

This is the key passage. If I understand the article correctly, he intends to pass it off as real currency.

If I understand it correctly, that particular law still wouldn't apply.

I believe that "obligation or other security of the United States" refers to US treasury bonds, official currency, and the like.

If I am correct, then he neither made, forged, or counterfeited any of it because it was explicitly and intentionally different. Neither did he alter any preexisting items. I think they can get him on fraud, passing bad checks, or something like that, but I don't think you'll get him on a chapter 25 issue.

Loss Leader

3rd September 2007, 10:26 PM

Oh yeah, this'll end well.

Temporal Renegade

4th September 2007, 01:05 PM

Reminds me of a joke. Jesus and Cthulhu were hanging out, and Jesus was explaining to the less-organized-religion Cthulhu about tithing. Jesus told him "I do pretty well off my worshippers. I just take ten percent."

So Cthulhu followed his advice, and started leaving ninety percent of each corpse behind.

I actually laughed at this a little. :D

Temporal Renegade

4th September 2007, 01:07 PM

Jesus Saves (but)

Moses Invests (but)

Cthulhu Ingests.:jaw-dropp

:D

dudalb

4th September 2007, 05:01 PM

Oh yeah, this'll end well.

I love the way this idiot notified the Treasury Department what he was up to.(Not that they would not have found out soon enough).
THE Secret Service is just waiting for them to actually print and distribute it to bust them for counterfeiting.
The company has a right to print it's own currency...although they would not find anybody willing to take it...but when they start printing "real" dollars they are begging for a heap of trouble and a long prison term.
And I have a feeling they will be facing Fraud charges on account of the phony checks as well.

Loss Leader

4th September 2007, 06:28 PM

The company has a right to print it's own currency...although they would not find anybody willing to take it...but when they start printing "real" dollars they are begging for a heap of trouble and a long prison term.

Yeah, I remember a story about a criminal who successfully passed and got change for a $200.00 bill. They couldn't even charge him with counterfeiting because there's no such thing as a $200.00 bill.

Madalch

5th September 2007, 10:43 AM

Yeah, I remember a story about a criminal who successfully passed and got change for a $200.00 bill. They couldn't even charge him with counterfeiting because there's no such thing as a $200.00 bill.
Wasn't that a $300 bill, with a picture of George W. Bush and a sign saying "I love broccoli"?

ETA: Sorry, it was a $200: http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/bushbill1.html

dudalb

5th September 2007, 10:58 AM

Loss Leader

5th September 2007, 11:08 AM

I am not a lawyer,but I would suspect he could get nailed for fraud.

Theft by deceit, actually. But not counterfeiting.

UserGoogol

5th September 2007, 02:23 PM

I love the way this idiot notified the Treasury Department what he was up to.(Not that they would not have found out soon enough).
THE Secret Service is just waiting for them to actually print and distribute it to bust them for counterfeiting.
The company has a right to print it's own currency...although they would not find anybody willing to take it...but when they start printing "real" dollars they are begging for a heap of trouble and a long prison term.
And I have a feeling they will be facing Fraud charges on account of the phony checks as well.

He says he's going to print "real" money, but there's no law against passing money off as being something as ambiguously defined as "real." The article seemed to give the impression that he won't be passing these off as "Federal Reserve Notes," (since the Federal Reserve is "Satan's banking system" and all that) and if his currency clearly marks that it isn't a Federal Reserve Note, then it might be in the clear, legally speaking. It's certainly a gray area, though, since it's so clearly designed to resemble the Federal Reserve Note. (IANAL.)

SteveGrenard

9th September 2007, 04:43 AM

Yeah, I remember a story about a criminal who successfully passed and got change for a $200.00 bill. They couldn't even charge him with counterfeiting because there's no such thing as a $200.00 bill.

About twenty years ago or so there was a guy who cashed (at a bank doing money exchange) in multi-thousand mark German inflation era money at the current rate of exchange at the time. He bought the genuine German currrency for mere pennies and turned them into thousands of dollars.

Madalch

9th September 2007, 12:22 PM

About twenty years ago or so there was a guy who cashed (at a bank doing money exchange) in multi-thousand mark German inflation era money at the current rate of exchange at the time. He bought the genuine German currrency for mere pennies and turned them into thousands of dollars.
So he bought pre-WWII currency, and exchanged them at a bank as if they were current (at the time) Deutchmarks?

Wow. Where was the bank he did this at?

SteveGrenard

9th September 2007, 01:05 PM

So he bought pre-WWII currency, and exchanged them at a bank as if they were current (at the time) Deutchmarks?

Wow. Where was the bank he did this at?

I don't honestly remember the bank, somewhere in the U.S. You can't pull this scam anymore since Germany now uses Euros. The reason I know about it is the guy got caught and afterwards banks and money exchangers equipped themselves with specimen books or pictures of legitimate/actively used currencies.

There is actually a website devoted to these notes including the 5 Billion Mark Scam (link):

http://www.germannotes.com/news/index.php/archives/14

Genuine German currency can be bought from collectors dealers such as:

http://www.kcshop.com/foreigncurrency/GermanyDemocraticRepublic.htm

DRBUZZ0

9th September 2007, 01:30 PM

Why would this guy go to prison? There's nothing illegal about printing and distributing your own currency, as long as it's not counterfit or represented to be that of a nation which it is not.

There are a few examples:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liberty_Dollar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Millennium_Dollar
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ithaca_Hours

Obviously you can't dictate who will accept it, and you can't be deceptive about the backing of the currency. IE: If you say it is a certificate toward gold, you had best have the gold you claim to or that is fraud.

One could make the case that travelers checks are a form of private currency.

Also the value of your currency is somewhat based on what others value it at, so if it's easy to counterfit then it will likely loose value due to the lack of faith in its integrity.

I once tried to circulate my own currency. I called it a "Buzz Buck" but I didn't have any comodity to back it in, so I backed it the same way that the US dollar and many other currencies are backed. It was backed in "Good Faith in the Issuing Institution." And on the gaurentee that *I* personally would accept it for services rendered or other debts, providing it was in line with the market value.

For some reason... unlike the US dollar and other currencies... um... it seems that people didn't have enough "faith in the institution" to make it worth very much... like any more than nothing :-(

LostAngeles

9th September 2007, 01:53 PM

Before I read the article, I looked at the title, the link and thought, "What the hell? Disney's been doing this for years. Why's everyone getting all uptight about their tourist-sucker now?"

The Central Scrutinizer

9th September 2007, 02:33 PM

DRBUZZ0

9th September 2007, 02:36 PM

You didn't read the article, did you?

Apparently I both did not read it thouroughly enough and went in with the assumption that what it claims is too stupid to actually be the case. It looked to me like he was printing a "Privately backed dollar" or something...

But it looks like... he thinks he can pass these off as legitimate us money?

Okay, well that's idiotic

Temporal Renegade

9th September 2007, 02:38 PM

Yeah, I remember a story about a criminal who successfully passed and got change for a $200.00 bill. They couldn't even charge him with counterfeiting because there's no such thing as a $200.00 bill.

My favourite 'Not Quite Legally Recognized Money' story, is the woman who went shopping in Wal*Mart, and tried to buy a few thousands of dollars worth of merchandise with a $1,000,000-dollar bill. It was a novelty one, and she actually thought she could get change for it.

The Central Scrutinizer

9th September 2007, 06:28 PM

Apparently I both did not read it thouroughly enough and went in with the assumption that what it claims is too stupid to actually be the case. It looked to me like he was printing a "Privately backed dollar" or something...

But it looks like... he thinks he can pass these off as legitimate us money?

Okay, well that's idiotic

And illegal.

Loss Leader

10th September 2007, 05:08 AM

And don't forget the greatest private currency of all time: the Schrute buck (http://www.flickr.com/photos/carrisablog/510748485/).

DRBUZZ0

10th September 2007, 08:46 AM

On that topic, anyone want to exchange some of their currency (dollars, euros, pounds) for a buzz buck? How much is it worth? Well... there aren't really enough in circulation to give a traditional exchange rate... so actually... it's worth whatever *you* value it at... yes, you, as the sole holder, aside from me, get to decide what your "faith in the institution" is

Seriously... doesn't anyone have faith in the issuing institution???