A terrorist speaks

[Brown]

A terrorist speaks, but he's not a Muslim. From KCCI and AP: (http://www.theiowachannel.com/news/2450513/detail.html)Paul Hill will be given a lethal injection Wednesday in Florida for killing an abortion doctor and his escort in 1994.

The former minister said he doesn't feel remorse but is looking forward to "glory" and "a great reward in heaven."

Hill suggested Tuesday during a jail house interview that the government will turn him into a martyr by executing him.This sounds so much like the rhetoric used by those following another religion to justify acts like exploding motor vehicles in crowded places, or flying airplanes into buildings.

Some people get upset because Muslims don't protest acts of terrorism performed by other Muslims. But it seems to me that not too many fundamentalist Christians went out of their way to protest the despicable acts that this *ssh*le performed.

[Yahweh]

"I'm offended by the idea of abortion... I think I'll level with my inner extremist and blow the place up... I bet I'll get big reward in Heaven..."

Sorry, that's no way to justify an action, especially one of terrorism.

[Lord Kenneth]

What would Jesus do? Kill an abortion doctor.

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by Lord Kenneth
What would Jesus do? Kill an abortion doctor.
Exactly. (http://www.theonion.com/onion3417/abortion_clinic_attack.html)

[UnrepentantSinner]

Gee, he sounds a lot like Karla Faye Tucker. I wonder if he orgasmed when he killed as well.

Thanks for bringing this up Brown, I was just getting ready to do a search for extant threads. This is an issue that warrents attention.

[elliotfc]

A few things...

- I'd like to one day do an actual scientific poll of this, but I suspect that the average American thinks a hell of a lot more abortion doctors have been killed, since Roe v. Wade, than three. Casual discussion back in my Ann Arbor days indicated to me that a perception is that violence and murder of abortion related personnel is reaching epidemic proportions. Any violence is too much violence. And the total number of abortion-related killings adds up to three doctors and four clinic workers, which are seven needless acts of murder that should be deplored. But the perception, I think, is that abortion supporters are being killed left and right, and that is not accurate.

- How should we judge John Brown?

- I've been involved with pro-life groups in four different cities, and I insist that people like Paul Hill are just not the type of people who get involved in the pro-life movement. In fact the pro-life movement is, on a grassroots level, primarily driven by women who would never even think about hurting another human being.

-Elliot

[Brown]

Originally posted by elliotfc
I'd like to one day do an actual scientific poll of this, but I suspect that the average American thinks a hell of a lot more abortion doctors have been killed, since Roe v. Wade, than three. Casual discussion back in my Ann Arbor days indicated to me that a perception is that violence and murder of abortion related personnel is reaching epidemic proportions. Any violence is too much violence. And the total number of abortion-related killings adds up to three doctors and four clinic workers, which are seven needless acts of murder that should be deplored. But the perception, I think, is that abortion supporters are being killed left and right, and that is not accurate.What is said here is that the actual number of killings of doctors is less than many people think. There are some who might conclude from what is said, however, that the author thinks that the threat of violence against doctors is not a serious problem.

In fact, the threat of violence against doctors is a very big problem (and I doubt that the author intended to say otherwise).

I have known doctors who have had their lives threatened, their property vandalized, their spouses intimidated, their children harrassed and their clinics defaced by anti-abortion activists. These doctors were not killed. But make no mistake: their lives were threatened by terrorists.

One of those terrorists was, for a while, a neighbor of mine. The guy was a nut. He had dozens of restraining orders filed against him, many of which he ignored. He had no job, but he received financial support from out-of-state activist groups. He was such a loony that he actually drove people out of the local anti-abortion groups, because they didn't want to be associated with him. He never killed any doctors, but there was a concern, even among those in the local anti-abortion movement, that he (or one of his disciples) might do that very thing.

Many obstetricians (even some doctors that don't perform abortions) have been threatened by guys just like this.

Even if doctors are not being killed left and right, they are being terrorized all the time.

Nuts like Paul Hill (and my former neighbor) do not represent the vast majority of folks who oppose abortion, but these are the kind of folks that you really have to worry about.

[UnrepentantSinner]

While Paul Hill might not be looking forward to his 72 virgins... the rapt exstacy on his face as he describes receiving his eternal reward for murdering someone makes him no different from Mohammed Atta and the other 18 f***ers who committed the attrocities of 9/11.

Guys like him make me wish there was a hell.

[Skeptical Greg]

Originally posted by elliotfc
A few things...


- I've been involved with pro-life ....
-Elliot

Just one.. ( thing )


I guess if one is not ' pro-life ', they are somehow ' pro - death '?:confused:

[Roadtoad]

Paul Hill was a cowardly scumbag, a gutless loser, and ultimately, a blight on the Christian faith. I agree wholeheartedly with US, and hope he's enjoying his eternity in misery for what he did. He took an innocent life for what purpose? It sure as hell wasn't to stop abortion.

The Christian Church has little effective voice in the debate about abortion, and for good reason. Take a drive through the downtown section of any city in the United States, and look at the street corners, the back alleys, the slums, and anywhere else the weak or destitute hide. The Church may not be the cause of this, but I defy you to show me where they've done much to alleviate the misery that exists. Your average fundamentalist church in this nation will bleat about women's hemlines, but they won't do a damn thing to feed a hungry family, or shelter a stranger. They'll decry smoking or drinking, but they won't give five minutes to help someone find a job, or help someone home from the hospital get around their own home. They'll cry about secularism in our public schools, but I'll be damned if I know of many Christian organizations that are going into our nation's prisons, teaching basic literacy to those incarcerated there.

In other words, they have no legitimacy. If you cannot be trusted with those who are already here, how in the Hell can you expect ANYONE to entrust to you those lives yet to be?

*(Are you listening, Billiefan?)

Want to stop abortion? It's actually pretty simple. First, start with your own kids. Teach them they're value to you, and show them. Don't ever let up letting them know how much you love an cherish them. Make them your priority, and you've done the first, most important job possible. (Paul Hill is dead. His kids will never know this. The man is a FAILURE.)

Second, get involved in your kids lives, both at home and at school. You might actually be surprised to learn that the rotten kid you don't want your kids hanging out with could actually use a friend. The great thing about that is you not only become a friend to this kid, but your kids see that there's a better way of treating other people. Kids don't do what you tell them. They do what you do.

Third, get involved in your community. Got skills? Pass them on. Teach someone something they can use. And don't just do it for those who can afford it, but teach it to those who really need it.

Got an extra ten bucks? Pick up a few extra items at the store, and drop them off a the local food bank. Can't do that? Send the extra ten. Your help is welcome, and appreciated.

Learn what you can to help prisoners. You can't go in blind; learn how to work with these people, and offer genuine assistance. Teach them to read. (Most prisoners are illiterate.) Help them to find jobs when they get out. Volunteer. You can make a change in someone else's life.

Help out an unwed mother. Got an extra bedroom? Offer it to a young woman with nowhere to go. Or at least volunteer to drive her to her medical appointments. Got extra baby clothes? Pass them on. Pick up an extra box of Pampers and pass those on, too, as well as extra formula. (That stuff isn't cheap, and it might help her make ends meet.)

And then, once you've done that, you've begun to make a dent in the abortion statistics. You have street cred, now.

Paul Hill? He's nothing like a martyr at all. He's a gutless, whiny coward, and he's rotting in a Hell of his own making. And he damn well deserves it.

And now, I'm going to stop. If I go on, Hal is going to ban me, and frankly, he doesn't need the headaches after all the difficulties he's dealt with this past week. I'm going to have a beer, smoke a stogie, and kick back a bit with the old lady. (Maybe she'll wear something with a high hemline.)

Geez, I miss Ruby.

[Skeptical Greg]

Originally posted by Roadtoad


:clap::clap::clap::clap:

[UnrepentantSinner]

Great post Roadtoad.

note to self, don't get Roadtoad fired up at you

[Brown]

I don't agree with every detail of what Roadtoad wrote, but the main message is a good one.

Talk is cheap. Anybody can talk about a problem. But not too many actually do anything about solving the problem.

If people had made as much of a fuss about feeding the hungry as they did about that damned Ten Commandments monument, there would be a lot less hunger in this country right now. People were all worked up about "acknowledging God" with their words, but they were not all that interested in "acknowledging God" by their deeds.

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by Brown
I don't agree with every detail of what Roadtoad wrote, but the main message is a good one.

Talk is cheap. Anybody can talk about a problem. But not too many actually do anything about solving the problem.

If people had made as much of a fuss about feeding the hungry as they did about that damned Ten Commandments monument, there would be a lot less hunger in this country right now. People were all worked up about "acknowledging God" with their words, but they were not all that interested in "acknowledging God" by their deeds.

Amigo, you just hit my hot button...

How much did that damn rock cost? What, maybe $1,200? $1,500?

Do you realize just how many people in the Sacramento area that could have fed for a week?

And we have that Fumb Duck judge, who cannot figure out that he swore to UPHOLD the law, not REINTERPRET it to his liking...

You want to acknowledge God? HOW ABOUT GETTING OFF YOUR FRIGGING @$$ AND MAKING SURE SOMEONE CAN EAT TONIGHT!

That would go a long way towards making sure God was even RELEVANT.

[UnrepentantSinner]

Originally posted by Brown
If people had made as much of a fuss about feeding the hungry as they did about that damned Ten Commandments monument, there would be a lot less hunger in this country right now. People were all worked up about "acknowledging God" with their words, but they were not all that interested in "acknowledging God" by their deeds.

That was the primary sentiment I got from Roadtoad's post.

Spending a lot of energy and money trying to get creationism taught in schools, protesting abortion clinics and trying to put 10 Commandment monuments in federal courthouses isn't feeding the hungry and healing the lame - it's taking resources which could be used for those purposes away.

I realize that even groups like the 700 Club do good in helping to feed and clothe those who don't have food or clothes, but imagine how much more they could do if they spent less time on their political agenda and more on their charity efforts.

Of course we're getting away from whether Paul Hill's decision to offer to adopt an unwanted child would have been more productive in stopping a single abortion than murdering two men.

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by UnrepentantSinner
Of course we're getting away from whether Paul Hill's decision to offer to adopt an unwanted child would have been more productive in stopping a single abortion than murdering two men.

I don't think so. I think this is entirely relevant.

What if Hill had adopted an unwanted child? A child of mixed race, older, (7-12 years old), possibly with a medical condition? Would that not have set a positive example? Would that not have encouraged others to adopt such children?

But no, that would have required Hill to possess COURAGE.

He had none.

May he rot in his own, personal Hell.

[UnrepentantSinner]

Anti-abortion activits, masters of bad logic.

http://www.crosswalk.com/news/1217823.html

Spitz said Hill would become a martyr when Florida executes him by lethal injection Wednesday. As director of Pro-Life Virginia, Spitz has long been an advocate for using force to stop abortions. He chided groups that call themselves pro-life but don't share his views.

"They're absolute hypocrites," Spitz said. "If an abortionist walked into their house and was going to murder their children, they're not going to take a human life to protect their own children? I think they would. Yet they don't feel the lives of those 32 babies were worth protecting.

"They prefer dead babies to the dead abortionist. If you have to choose between live babies or a live abortionist, I'd choose the live babies. They choose dead babies and a live abortionist," he added. "They seem to have a total disregard for the babies they're trying to protect."

Spitz contends that Hill's actions saved the lives of 32 unborn babies who would have been aborted on the day he carried out the murder.

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by UnrepentantSinner
Anti-abortion activits, masters of bad logic.

Not to mention mental midgets, and spiritual dwarves.

So others are distancing themselves from the extremists? Whoopdie-sh**. I'd prefer they start taking action to shut these animals down.

[jimlintott]

Kids don't do what you tell them. They do what you do.

Parenting 101 summed up neatly in two simple sentences. Nice work.

The abortion rate could also be reduced by having sex education in schools at a young age. It has to be before they reach puberty.