"Tomorrow is zero hour."

[Oliver]

On 9/10/2001, two messages in Arabic were intercepted by the NSA.

One statet "The match is about to begin" and the other stated that
"Tomorrow is zero hour." Later reports [Reuters, 9/9/02 (http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/2002/reuters090902.html)] translated the
first message as "The match begins tomorrow." They were sent between
someone in Saudi Arabia and someone in Afghanistan.

Do we know who these "someones" are? Any Names?

Sources: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&sa=X&oi=spell&resnum=0&ct=result&cd=1&q=%22tomorrow+is+zero+hour%22&spell=1

[Hyperviolet]

I'm unsure, Oliver.

But it's a good question.
I, myself, would like to know more on this issue.
If there is more, that is.

[BenBurch]

Here is the trouble; It is likely that such messages are sent all the time.

So, even if this one was sent, and even if we can figure out who sent it, we still cannot connect it to 9/11. Smart covert operators in fact send messages all the times that mean exactly nothing. This is to defeat attempts at traffic analysis. A real message would only be distinguishable to the recipient who knows what time to listen, or what codebook to use.

[Undesired Walrus]

On 9/10/2001, two messages in Arabic were intercepted by the NSA.

One statet "The match is about to begin" and the other stated that
"Tomorrow is zero hour." Later reports [Reuters, 9/9/02] translated the
first message as "The match begins tomorrow." They were sent between
someone in Saudi Arabia and someone in Afghanistan.

Do we know who these "someones" are? Any Names?



Two football fans in the Middle East?

[Oliver]

I'm unsure, Oliver.

But it's a good question.
I, myself, would like to know more on this issue.
If there is more, that is.


Did the commission report mentioned anything of it?
ETA: I will look it up...

[Oliver]

Two football fans in the Middle East?

Source: http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/main/timelinecomplete1.html

September 10, 2001 (L): At least two messages in Arabic are intercepted by the NSA. One states "The match is about to begin" (bin Laden apparently uses football metaphors in many messages) and the other states "Tomorrow is zero hour." Later reports [Reuters, 9/9/02 (http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/2002/reuters090902.html)] translate the first message as "The match begins tomorrow." They were sent between someone in Saudi Arabia and someone in Afghanistan. The NSA claims that they weren't translated until September 12, and that even if they were translated in time, "they gave no clues that authorities could have acted on." [ABC News, 6/7/02 (http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/911conversation020607.html), Reuters, 6/19/02 (http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/2002/reuters061902.html)] These turn out to be only two of about 30 pre-9/11 communications from suspected al-Qaeda operatives or other militants referring to an imminent event. An anonymous official says of these messages, including the "Tomorrow is zero hour" message, "You can't dismiss any of them, but it doesn't tell you tomorrow is the day." [Reuters, 9/9/02 (http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/2002/reuters090902.html)] There is a later attempt to explain them away by suggesting they refer to the killing of Afghani opposition leader Ahmed Shah Massoud the day before (see September 9, 2001 (http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/main/timelinebefore911.html#a090901massoud)). [Reuters, 10/17/02 (http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/2002/reuters101702.html)] Couldn't they at least have issued an urgent security warning?

[qarnos]

Couldn't they at least have issued an urgent security warning?

It wasn't until after 9/11 that people started paying attention to "security warnings" anyway.

There was an interesting debate about Tsunami warnings after the Boxing Day Tsunami. Some people advanced that issuing warnings too often, when incomplete evidence was available, would immunise people against them, so when the "real" warning came, people would ignore it (ie: Not another tsunami warning!)

[Oliver]

ETA: Mhmm, looks like there is nothing about "Tomorrow is Zero Hour"
on ANY government site...

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22tomorrow+is+zero+hour%22+site%3A*.gov+&btnG=Search

[Oliver]

It wasn't until after 9/11 that people started paying attention to "security warnings" anyway.

There was an interesting debate about Tsunami warnings after the Boxing Day Tsunami. Some people advanced that issuing warnings too often, when incomplete evidence was available, would immunise people against them, so when the "real" warning came, people would ignore it (ie: Not another tsunami warning!)


It isn't the warning itself I'm interested in - I wonder who those
alleged terror-suspects were in Afghanistan and Saudi Arabia. Or
who leaked the story to the Media. Or who made it up.

[Undesired Walrus]

Source: http://s3.amazonaws.com/911timeline/main/timelinecomplete1.html

September 10, 2001 (L): At least two messages in Arabic are intercepted by the NSA. One states "The match is about to begin" (bin Laden apparently uses football metaphors in many messages)

Well I'll be. I wonder if Flight 93 would qualify as 'offside'.

and the other states "Tomorrow is zero hour."

Maybe Mr Hayet was warning his mother about daylight saving hours and got the dates confused?

[Gravy]

Couldn't they at least have issued an urgent security warning?I think you're missing that they weren't translated until Sept. 12. And if they had been translated on the 10th (it doesn't say at what time on the U.S. coast the messages were intercepted), what security warning would you issue, Oliver, and to what countries and agencies?

"Attention residents of planet Earth! Be on the lookout for something!"

With thousands of such messages to deal with, almost none of which amount to anything, the world would quickly grow tired of such alerts.

Edit: I didn't realize that the above was Paul Thompson's comment, not Oliver's.

[Undesired Walrus]

What is most curious Oliver, is that you consistently lambast your dear friend George Bush for putting out security alerts like his much ridiculed 'blanket alert', calling him a fear monger who prays on the terror threat.

Or is he only to be commended if he travels forward in time with the aid of Doctor Who? After all, he's the president of United States, and is more interested in Oil for his greedy friends than advanced space and time travel in a converted police box. Curse those United States!

[Oliver]

I think you're missing that they weren't translated until Sept. 12. And if they had been translated on the 10th (it doesn't say at what time on the U.S. coast the messages were intercepted), what security warning would you issue, Oliver, and to what countries and agencies?

"Attention residents of planet Earth! Be on the lookout for something!"

With thousands of such messages to deal with, almost none of which amount to anything, the world would quickly grow tired of such alerts.

Edit: I didn't realize that the above was Paul Thompson's comment, not Oliver's.


That Statement you quoted weren't my own words.

The question of this thread is: "Who were the guys in
Afghanistan and Saudi Arabia?"

Do you know more about it? Is there a reference in the
commission bible?

[Oliver]

What is most curious Oliver, is that you consistently lambast your dear friend George Bush for putting out security alerts like his much ridiculed 'blanket alert', calling him a fear monger who prays on the terror threat.

Or is he only to be commended if he travels forward in time with the aid of Doctor Who? After all, he's the president of United States, and is more interested in Oil for his greedy friends than advanced space and time travel in a converted police box. Curse those United States!


Whining much? Put up something useful about the
OP-Question - or shut up. Thanks in advance.

[Oliver]

Anyone who knows more about it?

[Undesired Walrus]

Whining much? Put up something useful about the
OP-Question - or shut up. Thanks in advance.

No no no, because we all know what you are attempting to do Oliver. At least start one thread that has a non Anti-American bias. Or, get better at hiding it.

You started this thread, or at least developed it as an excuse to accuse the Bush Administration as incompetent in preventing the loss of life on 9/11.

You have a great tendency to call Bush a 'fear monger' who exploits small threats (Threats you percieve as null and void) and issues blanket alerts to terrify his people, and you want him to warn the entire United States, East coast to West after some talk about Islamabad United Versus Beruit Rovers?

[Dog Town]

Whining much? Put up something useful about the
OP-Question - or shut up. Thanks in advance.

Priceless, Woolie gets called on his BS, then claims the other to be "whining"!
Grow up!

[chillzero]

Keep it civil here please. Also, please keep to the topic of the OP:

Do we know who these "someones" are? Any Names?

[firecoins]

I know for a fact that my friend Charlie from Saudia Arabia and Bob from Afghanistan were talking about the upcoming NY Yankees game.

[Oliver]

*lol* At least the "debunkers" have a sense of humor,
even if the term doesn't seem to be appropriate anymore.

So even if most people in here heard about the warning
that wasn't translated until 9/12 - nobody ever looked
into this issue???

[Shrinker]

Anyone who knows more about it?

Your links show that the calls were picked up from random payphone intercepts, so the speakers at least can never be known with certainty. The CNN story near the top of the list has the government claiming that in June 2002 they weren't sure who made the calls, which seems plausible in the circumstances.

[Shrinker]

*lol* At least the "debunkers" have a sense of humor,
even if the term doesn't seem to be appropriate anymore.

So even if most people in here heard about the warning
that wasn't translated until 9/12 - nobody ever looked
into this issue???

What's to look into Ollie? Terrorists using phones ain't that shocking. Neither is it shocking to discover that the NSA works a little slower that Hollywood would have us believe. Random payphone taps is a little disturbing though...

[Oliver]

Your links show that the calls were picked up from random payphone intercepts, so the speakers at least can never be known with certainty. The CNN story near the top of the list has the government claiming that in June 2002 they weren't sure who made the calls, which seems plausible in the circumstances.


So you think they didn't wiretap those calls based on
suspicions regarding those peoples intentions - and
picked up the call by accident?

Because if they wiretapped specific calls, they knew
which group of people was communicating with another,
even if the person on both ends of the lines may have
been unknown.

ETA: Oh, I see. So we know for sure it was intercepted
randomly, right?

[Oliver]

Why isn't it mentioned anywhere on a Gov-Domain,
including the commission report Websites?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22tomorrow+is+zero+hour%22+site%3A*.gov+&btnG=Search

[Shrinker]

So you think they didn't wiretap those calls based on
suspicions regarding those peoples intentions - and
picked up the call by accident?

Because if they wiretapped specific calls, they knew
which group of people was communicating with another,
even if the person on both of the lines may have been
unknown.

The stories state that they were randomly tapping payphones in an area where Al-Q were known to operate. That would explain translation delays if the phones were popular.

[Oliver]

The stories state that they were randomly tapping payphones in an area where Al-Q were known to operate. That would explain translation delays if the phones were popular.


But we don't know which AQ-cells we're talking about
in Afghanistan or Saudi-Arabia since there isn't any
additional released info about the incident - as far
I see it. Or does someone know more about it?

[Shrinker]

Why isn't it mentioned anywhere on a Gov-Domain,
including the commission report Websites?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22tomorrow+is+zero+hour%22+site%3A*.gov+&btnG=Search

Do the intelligence services regularly publish all their findings on the internet?

[Oliver]

Do the intelligence services regularly publish all their findings on the internet?


I see no reason to hide a 6 years old story - especially
since the 9/11 Commission should have known about
this incident - and probably knew about it since it's a
widespread, popular story.

[Oliver]

Oh wait - here's more about it...

Leaking classified information

In 2004, a federal investigation concluded that Shelby revealed classified information to the media when he was a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee. [2] (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A40886-2004Aug4.html) Specifically, Shelby revealed classified information on June 19 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/June_19), 2002 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002) to Carl Cameron, the chief political correspondent on Fox News (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_News). This information had been given to Shelby only minutes before at a closed intelligence committee meeting. This information consisted of two messages intercepted by the National Security Agency (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Security_Agency) on September 10 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_10), 2001 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2001), but translated only after the attacks the next day — "the match is about to begin" and "tomorrow is zero hour."

Both the U.S. attorney's office and the Federal Bureau of Investigation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Bureau_of_Investigation) (FBI) investigated the case, and a grand jury (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grand_jury) empaneled. In July 2004, the Department of Justice (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Department_of_Justice) declined to file criminal charges against Shelby and transferred the case to the Senate Ethics Committee.....

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Shelby

[Shrinker]

I see no reason to hide a 6 years old story - especially
since the 9/11 Commission should have known about
this incident - and probably knew about it since it's a
widespread, popular story.

Intelligence services probably prefer not to break with standard secrecy procedures just to satisfy the curiosity of internet forumites. They probably have better things to be doing. Have you considered that maybe that the persons may be still at large, not realising that they are suspects and being monitored?

Regarding the 9/11 Commision, why would they have to focus on this one, materially irrelevant detail? We don't need a commision to tell us that terrorists use phones, and that they may talk amongst themselves.

[Disbelief]

I see no reason to hide a 6 years old story - especially
since the 9/11 Commission should have known about
this incident - and probably knew about it since it's a
widespread, popular story.

Unless they still wiretap those areas and don't want all the information they have out on the net.

[T.A.M.]

as others have said, NON SPECIFIC Chatter was not only common, but at the time had almost hit another crescendo (the first in July 2001). EVEN IF it were translated the moment it was intercepted, it WOULD NOT have changed ANYTHING.

It is of academic, 20/20 hindsight interest only.

TAM:)

[Oliver]

Unless they still wiretap those areas and don't want all the information they have out on the net.


Quite frankly - I don't believe this "soopersecret national security"-BS
anymore. Anything that would complete the picture about 9/11, like
the blackened names regarding the Saudis in the "Joint Inquiry into
Intelligence Community Activities before and after the Terrorist Attacks
of September 11, 2001 (http://www.gpoaccess.gov/serialset/creports/911.html)"-report, confirms that.

That's why the Report is incomplete in my opinion - even if I don't
see a conspiracy in that - but rather an attempt to sweep the dirt
of a lousy defence on 9/11 under the carpet.

[T.A.M.]

Please be aware that the report is just that a "REPORT" a summary of the overall findings of the 9/11 commission. Their investigation, along with the evidence they looked at, was much, much larger than the final report itself.

TAM:)

[GT/CS]

Oliver, apparently none of us know who placed or received the calls. We don't know if the US government does or not. You can submit a FOIA request for that information if you wish.

[MikeW]

The 9/11 Commission said this:

Signals intelligence is a source of measuring “chatter,” which is an indicator of terrorist activity. Interpreting chatter is difficult. For example, the press reported that the Congressional Joint Inquiry was told about intercepted communications collected on September 10, 2001, saying “tomorrow is zero hour,” and about the imminent beginning of “the match.” Additional information later came to light within the Intelligence Community, however, that suggested this information was connected with the opening of the Taliban and al Qaeda military offensive in Afghanistan against the Northern Alliance, following on the September 9 al Qaeda assassination of the Northern Alliance’s leader rather than the 9/11 attacks.
http://www.9-11commission.gov/staff_statements/staff_statement_11.pdf

They don't reference what that "additional information" was, unfortunately.

[CptColumbo]

Is "Zero Hour" at 9am, because then I think I know where this is going. Hint: it involves rockets.

[Jonnyclueless]

A close friend of mine worked for the NSA at the time of 9/11. He said that there was a lot of warnings captured about 9/11, but the problem is the turn around time it takes the gatherers to process all the data. Bye the time they got the warnings it was too late. And the resources needed to gather such intel at that speed is simply impossible.

[Bell]

Isn't it still a problem today? That there are to few Arabic translators working for intelligence?

[gumboot]

Quite frankly - I don't believe this "soopersecret national security"-BS
anymore.


Of course you wouldn't. It's not your nation being secured. If three thousand of your fellow citizens had been murdered by terrorist you might be a bit more supportive of national security efforts.

As to the "identity" of random people who used a payphone, perhaps you can provide the following speculative answers:

1) By what method should intelligence agencies identify an individual who used a random payphone in a foreign country?

2) What is the significance of these phone calls, in these places?

Frankly I'd find it highly suspicious if the identity of the callers was known. It is only in fabricated situations that all of the dots are connected.

-Gumboot

[GT/CS]

Of course you wouldn't. It's not your nation being secured. If three thousand of your fellow citizens had been murdered by terrorist you might be a bit more supportive of national security efforts.

As to the "identity" of random people who used a payphone, perhaps you can provide the following speculative answers:

1) By what method should intelligence agencies identify an individual who used a random payphone in a foreign country?

2) What is the significance of these phone calls, in these places?

Frankly I'd find it highly suspicious if the identity of the callers was known. It is only in fabricated situations that all of the dots are connected.

-Gumboot

As in movies and TV CSI dramas. Too many people watching way too many of those.

[Corsair 115]

As in movies and TV CSI dramas. Too many people watching way too many of those.Now there's nothing wrong with watching such programs as long as one remembers they are for entertainment purposes only and that any resemblance to reality in them is most likely purely coincidental.

[Sabrina]

Hey Oliver; the reason they wouldn't have been fully released after all this time is that typically items are classified for at least 25 years. IF these items are still classified, then it is perfectly understandable why no one's said anything. Granted, it has been briefly mentioned in the 9/11 Commission report as referenced by people here, but there are elements of classified reports that are unclassified, and that is likely the case with this situation. The fact that we had the messages may not have been classified, but I'm fairly certain the investigation into the messages would be, and therefore the details would not have been released. I hope that answers your question about the "soopersekrit national security" issue.