Illegals.....Born or Made?

[Tmy]

Theres been ongoing talk about sealing our borders in order to stem the tide of illegals. I live in the Nth east, and every illegal Ive ever ran into had the same story, they ENTERED the US legally and later became illegal after their visas ran out.

Does anyone have stats on the % of illegals that enter illegally. I would guess that its less than those who came in wh the OK. (Of course i dont live in the southwest US.) I think its quite difficult to enter illegally unless your coming across the Canadian or Mex border.

That being said, wouldnt it be a waste of money to seal the boarders since it wont stop the #'s of illegals who waltz in wh papers in hand. For examples the 911 terrorists. Didnt they all enter legally?

[Mr Manifesto]

I can only provide a comparison. The majority of illegals here aren't boaties, they're poms who came over and have overstayed their visas. Naturally, we don't lock the poms up pending processing. Though maybe a few of them could stand a stint in Woomera...

[Michael Redman]

I have heard that most illegals enter legally, but I don't have any statistics to prove it. If true that would obviously hurt the effectiveness of trying to seal the border, unless they mean to seal it against all visitors.

[Jon_in_london]

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto
I can only provide a comparison. The majority of illegals here aren't boaties, they're poms who came over and have overstayed their visas. Naturally, we don't lock the poms up pending processing. Though maybe a few of them could stand a stint in Woomera...

Are you an abo? If not then you are a white Australian and its pretty rich of you to call British people 'illegals' since you are all decended from criminals in the first place.

And by the way, the word 'pom' when used in such a context is derogatory and deeply offensive to me.

[aerocontrols]

There is another dynamic here that might have escaped you. I've known several people who entered legally and then became illegals. (Mostly students) Of perhaps 5 such people, all were students and 4 were legal again within about a month or so(overstaying one's visa merely requires getting a new one) The 5th person was my roomate of mine from Germany, whose visa expired at the end of his graduating semester - he stayed an extra few weeks past his visa deadline to attend a conference and to finish a pilot certification.

I think rather than asking how most illegals started out, we should be asking how most illegals who attempt to stay started out.

aerocontrols

[shanek]

According to Fix and Passel, 60% of all illegal aliens entered the US legally and became illegal when their visas expired.

[MoeFaux]

I've got two words to say on illegal immigrants:

Open borders.

That's what I think.

[Jon_in_london]

Originally posted by MoeFaux
I've got two words to say on illegal immigrants:

Open borders.

That's what I think.

So you basically disagree with the entire concept of the nation-state?

[Michael Redman]

Originally posted by Jon_in_london
So you basically disagree with the entire concept of the nation-state? Why would you assume that? Open borders doesn't imply open citizenship, does it?

[MoeFaux]

I suppose that I do.
I'd like to see the Free State project in effect.

It just seems terribly prejiduced how America as a people turn up their noses at the thought of other people coming here.
I'm all for people coming up from Mexico. I'm all for folks seeking refuge from Cuba coming here.
News stations did a lot of things that I hate by laughing at the people who tried to make it to the States in a truck that had been modified to be a boat. It was a little "funny story" that they wrapped up their noon broadcast with. It's not funny, people are risking their lives to try and get here. Why won't we let them in?

[Jon_in_london]

Originally posted by Michael Redman
Why would you assume that? Open borders doesn't imply open citizenship, does it?

Yes it does.

[Grammatron]

Originally posted by MoeFaux
I suppose that I do.
I'd like to see the Free State project in effect.

It just seems terribly prejiduced how America as a people turn up their noses at the thought of other people coming here.
I'm all for people coming up from Mexico. I'm all for folks seeking refuge from Cuba coming here.
News stations did a lot of things that I hate by laughing at the people who tried to make it to the States in a truck that had been modified to be a boat. It was a little "funny story" that they wrapped up their noon broadcast with. It's not funny, people are risking their lives to try and get here. Why won't we let them in?

Oh sure USA is all evil and does not want to let any Mexicans in, but you should see how Mexico treats illegals who try to enter to enter it from other Latin American countries (Mexico is quite prosperous compared to most of Latin America). Hypocrisy does not even begin to describe it.

[Tony]

Originally posted by MoeFaux
I
It just seems terribly prejiduced how America as a people turn up their noses at the thought of other people coming here.
I'm all for people coming up from Mexico. I'm all for folks seeking refuge from Cuba coming here.
News stations did a lot of things that I hate by laughing at the people who tried to make it to the States in a truck that had been modified to be a boat. It was a little "funny story" that they wrapped up their noon broadcast with. It's not funny, people are risking their lives to try and get here. Why won't we let them in?


I dont have a problem with them being here either as long as they dont get tax payer money in the form of welfare, medicare ect..

[Tony]

Ohh and, no offense John, but whats a pom?

[MoeFaux]

Oh, of course they shouldn't recieve government handouts. I'm against anyone revieving them. It's not the governments business or responsibility to financially support it's people, only to look out for their safety and well being.

[Jon_in_london]

Originally posted by Tony
Ohh and, no offense John, but whats a pom?

An English/British person.

dictionary.com

pom

n : (Australian and New Zealand) a disparaging term for English immigrants to Australia or New Zealand


pom·my or pom·mie ( P ) Pronunciation Key (pm)
n. Australian & New Zealand Offensive Slang pl. pom·mies
Used as a disparaging term for a British person, especially a recent immigrant.

[Tony]

well it seems that we are in agreement.

[Jon_in_london]

The dictionary def of 'pom' relates quite nicely to the n-word:

n*g·ger ( P ) Pronunciation Key (ngr)
n. Offensive Slang

Used as a disparaging term for a Black person: “You can only be destroyed by believing that you really are what the white world calls a n*gger” (James Baldwin).
Used as a disparaging term for a member of any dark-skinned people.

[MoeFaux]

Oh, of course they shouldn't recieve government handouts. I'm against anyone revieving them. It's not the governments business or responsibility to financially support it's people, only to look out for their safety and well being.

[ZeeGerman]

Originally posted by Jon_in_london


Yes it does.

No it doesn't. I can travel into e.g. GB and stay as long as I want - as a EU citizen of course - and still I'm not a citizen of GB, am I?

Zee

[Cleopatra]

Originally posted by MoeFaux
I've got two words to say on illegal immigrants:

Open borders.

That's what I think.

Hi MoeFaux ( shall I separate the words?)

Some years ago, 7 or 8 I think, a french journalist Guy Sorman wrote a very interesting book: En attendant les barbares.

"Waiting for the barbarians".

In this book he was trying to analyze two problems: Drugs and illegal immigration.

He managed to show that a series of people; from policemen to lawyers profited from the laws of prohibition and so, he suggested regarding immigration what you posted in two line : Open borders.

As you probably know, Europe is currently experiencing this problem and I belong to those that they think that restrictions won't solve the problem but they will end up in the rising of the criminality rates.

I totally agree with you. The only reasonable solution is to open the borders.