Were Obama's remarks after Fort Hood shooting insensitive? - Page 2

Unabogie · 6th November 2009, 08:49 PM

Modern conservatism. No nit too small to pick.

Seriously, don't you conservatives understand that by ginning up perpetual outrage you are destroying your credibility and your ability to be heard on valid criticisms?

Hyperbole for the sake of political gamesmanship doesn't help your cause, nor does it help the country.

In fact, I didn't even click the link. This nonsense just makes my head hurt.

applecorped · 6th November 2009, 08:51 PM

Originally Posted by Unabogie

In fact, I didn't even click the link.

Then by all means please comment on it.

Unabogie · 6th November 2009, 08:55 PM

Originally Posted by applecorped

Then by all means please comment on it.

I read all of your comments. It's plenty of information to decide that this is yet another Obama Outrage that I'm supposed to react to.

Am I supposed to think that President Obama heard about the shootings and was somehow happy? If not, am I supposed to think he was expected to act and didn't? If not, then why should I give a crap about yet another manufactured outrage when this one will be forgotten just in time for tomorrow's next manufactured outrage?

applecorped · 6th November 2009, 08:59 PM

Originally Posted by Unabogie

Am I supposed to think that President Obama heard about the shootings and was somehow happy? If not, am I supposed to think he was expected to act and didn't?

You want me to decide how you are supposed to think?

tyr_13 · 6th November 2009, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by GreNME

Did Glenn Beck rape and murder a young girl in 1990?

Really, guys, can we just have one ODS meta-thread, and have you guys just stick all of the spaghetti you toss in there?

Come on, don't be so hard. They're just asking questions.

Unabogie · 6th November 2009, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by applecorped

You want me to decide how you are supposed to think?

I'm asking you to explain what you think this nonsense means to you. Apparently you don't even know. It's just making you mad, so you are just all TEABAG SMASH!

willhaven · 6th November 2009, 09:12 PM

Leveraging a recent tragedy to bash Obama.

Classy.

LostAngeles · 6th November 2009, 09:22 PM

Originally Posted by Unabogie

Modern conservatism. No nit too small to pick.

Seriously, don't you conservatives understand that by ginning up perpetual outrage you are destroying your credibility and your ability to be heard on valid criticisms?

Hyperbole for the sake of political gamesmanship doesn't help your cause, nor does it help the country.

In fact, I didn't even click the link. This nonsense just makes my head hurt.

Or you could watch the link and determine for yourself that it simply a **** up on the PR team's fault.

GreNME · 6th November 2009, 09:27 PM

Originally Posted by tyr_13

Come on, don't be so hard. They're just asking questions.

Precisely. The past eight years it's been done to Bush, I'm sure that more than one of the folks starting threads like this rolled their eyes, accused the thread starter of Bush Derangement Syndrome, and wondered at how someone could be so obsessive at every minor thing that could possibly be spun in even a semi-negative light.

Turnabout? Hypocrisy? Depressing irony? Some combination of all three or more?

I propose an Obama Negative Nit-Picker subforum for the politics section until November of 2012, possibly 2016.

Dr Adequate · 6th November 2009, 09:41 PM

Originally Posted by willhaven

Leveraging a recent tragedy to bash Obama.

Classy.

Yeah, I'm trying to imagine the scene at Wingnut HQ.

"Some guy cut loose with a gun at an Army Base, killed twelve people."

"Great. How can we turn this into a whine about Obama!"

"Well ... er ..."

"Come on, everything's Obama's fault! Think! Think!"

"Actually, I do my best work when I'm not thinking."

"Wait, he's on TV now, maybe this'll give us some dumb ideas."

Ten minutes later ...

"Well, we've got him now."

"What do you mean?"

"You didn't spot it?"

"No, what?"

"He acknowledged the existence of his audience! And the reason why they were there in the first place!"

"That's ... er ... that's bad?"

"It will be."

daredelvis · 6th November 2009, 10:11 PM

Originally Posted by Puppycow

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the JREF. The JREF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

Beat me to it.

Originally Posted by SezMe

When you, applecorped, have something worth whining about, please let me know.

QFT. The wingers needs to get a life, or an issue, or something.

Daredelvis

Juniversal · 6th November 2009, 10:43 PM

He acknolwedged a medal of honor winner. I fail to see what the uproar is about.

And he sent his condolences to those that passed. What's the big deal?

MattusMaximus · 6th November 2009, 11:04 PM

This thread, and the b.s. flying around all over it (from both sides), is a perfect example of just how far down the rabbit hole U.S. politics & the media has gone. We cannot even take some time to let these fallen soldiers (and civvies) be respectfully buried before we turn it into some kind of damned game of political "gotcha!"

Gah, frak this... I'm outta here.

Swordsman · 7th November 2009, 12:14 AM

Originally Posted by Juniversal

He acknolwedged a medal of honor winner.

Joe Medicine Crow is not a Medal of Honor recipient.

Travis · 7th November 2009, 12:40 AM

Since I am a Liberal, and I never once criticized Bush for reading My Pet Goat, do I get to say that I think there is nothing really wrong going on here?

Redtail · 7th November 2009, 12:43 AM

Originally Posted by Travis

Since I am a Liberal, and I never once criticized Bush for reading My Pet Goat, do I get to say that I think there is nothing really wrong going on here?

Have you also criticized Clinton for "depends what your definition of is, is"?

Travis · 7th November 2009, 12:54 AM

Originally Posted by Redtail

Have you also criticized Clinton for "depends what your definition of is, is"?

Nope, I always knew what he was trying to say.

Redtail · 7th November 2009, 12:57 AM

Originally Posted by Travis

Nope, I always knew what he was trying to say.

Then no you commie!!!!!

BibleWelt · 7th November 2009, 01:26 AM

Why do people insist on calling the story "My Pet Goat", when it's actually "The Pet Goat"?

(Sorry - one of My Pet Peaves...)

Undesired Walrus · 7th November 2009, 03:47 AM

Originally Posted by The Painter

Yes, yes they were. He did a shout out to Dr. Joe Medicine Crow before addressing the tragedy. Is he kidding? What an a-hole. In 11 months he still has not made a decision on Afghanistan. I am really beginning to believe he does not like the military at all.

Didn't Obama recently fly out to honour the dead bodies coming home, something Bush never did and infact banned from being broadcast?

Tricky · 7th November 2009, 06:07 AM

Bush was not criticized for reading a book to children, he was criticized for his slow reaction to an ongoing national emergency. The Fort Hood shootings were hardly a national emergency, but the act of a lone madman. As far as I know, the shooting was mostly over with by the time Obama got the news. Any attempt to paint these two events as equal would demonstrate a degree of partisanship that would pretty much preclude objective commentary.

Darth Rotor · 7th November 2009, 06:24 AM

Originally Posted by Swordsman

Joe Medicine Crow is not a Medal of Honor recipient.

Can we get some clarity on this? JMC won a Congressional Medal of Freedom.

He was awarded same by President Obama. What's wrong with him acknowledging someone of note, someone who is an example of excellence?

As to the Fort Hood Shooting, it isn't the only thing that happened in the world that day -- though it has certainly been my focus -- and I find the assessments of "PR team screw up" very likely.

Tempest over a teapot.

DR

leftysergeant · 7th November 2009, 06:47 AM

Originally Posted by Darth Rotor

Can we get some clarity on this? JMC won a Congressional Medal of Freedom.

During WWII, he also recieved the Bronze Star and the French Legione d'honnuer, their highest honor. He also accomplished all of the acts that qualify him in the Crow tradition to be a war chief, stealing enemy horses, touching a live enemy, disarming an enemy, capturing and enemy. At 90+ years, he is still a leading professor and lecturer on the history and culture of the Crow Nation.

You want the President to slight a man like that because a shrink went off his rocker?

Darth Rotor · 7th November 2009, 06:57 AM

Originally Posted by leftysergeant

During WWII, he also recieved the Bronze Star and the French Legione d'honnuer, their highest honor. He also accomplished all of the acts that qualify him in the Crow tradition to be a war chief, stealing enemy horses, touching a live enemy, disarming an enemy, capturing and enemy. At 90+ years, he is still a leading professor and lecturer on the history and culture of the Crow Nation.

You want the President to slight a man like that because a shrink went off his rocker?

No, why do you presume I did? How about you understand who is saying what here. Read what I said.

Quote:

He was awarded same by President Obama. What's wrong with him acknowledging someone of note, someone who is an example of excellence?

I also wrote

Quote:

Tempest in a teapot.

Read before you knee jerk, Lefty, and you won't look like silly. Your beef is with somebody else, not me.

DR

leftysergeant · 7th November 2009, 07:08 AM

Originally Posted by Darth Rotor

No, why do you presume I did? How about you understand who is saying what here. Read what I said.

I also wrote

Read before you knee jerk, Lefty, and you won't look like silly. Your beef is with somebody else, not me.

DR

My apologies. I just got off work and am a little O.D.ed on reality. I was addressing those who thought Obama was insensitive.

I could have made that clearer, were I more alert and focused.

applecorped · 7th November 2009, 07:37 AM

Originally Posted by Unabogie

I'm asking you to explain what you think this nonsense means to you. Apparently you don't even know. It's just making you mad, so you are just all TEABAG SMASH!

Guess you didn't read all the posts:

Originally Posted by gtc

The only explanation I can think of is that whoever were handling the speech weren't informed that the media were led to believe he was going to address the shootings first and forget to make the the rest of his speech appropriately sombre and Obama just did what he was told without wondering whether it was appropriate in light of the events.

My response:

This sounds reasonable.^^^^

But don't let that stand in your way of painting any comment on Obama as a TEABAG SMASH!

leftysergeant · 7th November 2009, 08:06 AM

Originally Posted by applecorped

But don't let that stand in your way of painting any comment on Obama as a TEABAG SMASH!

It sounds as though you are agreeing with the OP that it is reasonable to criticize Obama for not first dealing with the fact that a shrink went off his rocker before honoring a real war hero.

Had he gone first to the shooting, you would probably criticize him for trying to paint the troops as loonies about to go off on each other.

Can't win with your kind.

Peephole · 7th November 2009, 08:16 AM

Originally Posted by Dr Adequate

Wow. The bodies have barely had time to get cold and someone's already thought of a way to politicize it. I'm impressed.

I guess we can add "congratulating Presidential Medal of Freedom winners," to the list of offenses comitted by Obama according to right-wingers:

-Having too few female golf partners.
-Giving encouraging speeches to children.
-Reading prepared speeches.
-Fistbumping people.
-Bowing for people.
-Appointing executive branch officials.
-Trying to help American cities win their olympic bids.
-Having a Kenyan father.
-Accepting a Nobel Peace Prize.
-Giving out DVD's with the wrong region code.
-...

JihadJane · 7th November 2009, 08:25 AM

Promising change but carrying on with business as usual.

WildCat · 7th November 2009, 08:38 AM

Originally Posted by JihadJane

Promising change but carrying on with business as usual.

So you think the Ft. Hood shooting was an inside job Jane?

Darth Rotor · 7th November 2009, 08:50 AM

Originally Posted by leftysergeant

My apologies. I just got off work and am a little O.D.ed on reality. I was addressing those who thought Obama was insensitive.

I could have made that clearer, were I more alert and focused.

Accepted without reservation.

I am glad that we can agree on some things, as often as we disagree.

DR

Darth Rotor · 7th November 2009, 08:51 AM

Originally Posted by JihadJane

Promising change but carrying on with business as usual.

I miss the meat cake avatar.

Your comment may not be related to the topic of this thread, though it may be a reasonably accurate summary of months 1-10 of Obama's term.

Swordsman · 7th November 2009, 09:57 AM

Originally Posted by Darth Rotor

Can we get some clarity on this? JMC won a Congressional Medal of Freedom.

He was awarded same by President Obama. What's wrong with him acknowledging someone of note, someone who is an example of excellence?

As to the Fort Hood Shooting, it isn't the only thing that happened in the world that day -- though it has certainly been my focus -- and I find the assessments of "PR team screw up" very likely.

Tempest over a teapot.

DR

There's nothing wrong with him acknowledging a Medal of Freedom winner. There is something wrong with him referring to that Medal of Freedom winner as a Medal of Honor winner when he (Obama) is the one who awarded him the Medal of Freedom.
There is also something wrong with a POTUS calling a media conference to address a domestic tragedy and giving light-hearted "shout outs" in his opening comments like he's accepting a Grammy.

leftysergeant · 7th November 2009, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by Swordsman

There is also something wrong with a POTUS calling a media conference to address a domestic tragedy and giving light-hearted "shout outs" in his opening comments like he's accepting a Grammy.

Dude, get the facts straight. He did not do that at a news conference. He made the remarks about the shooting at an unrelated event.

ODS.

hgc · 7th November 2009, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by Swordsman

There's nothing wrong with him acknowledging a Medal of Freedom winner. There is something wrong with him referring to that Medal of Freedom winner as a Medal of Honor winner when he (Obama) is the one who awarded him the Medal of Freedom.

Slip of the tongue! Time for a tea party!

Quote:

There is also something wrong with a POTUS calling a media conference to address a domestic tragedy and giving light-hearted "shout outs" in his opening comments like he's accepting a Grammy.

If that is what happened, which of course it is not. He didn't call a "media conference" to address the tragedy. He was there to speak to that group anyway, and added remarks about the tragedy at the end of his talk.

sugarb · 7th November 2009, 10:49 AM

Do I think the way he handled this was inappropriate? Given his position, and truly how powerful the words of the President are when things like this happen, yeah...I think it was inappropriate and insensitive. However, I don't think that President Obama himself is insensitive to what happened. We tend to place expectations on our President that are unrealistic. People did it to Bush on 9/11, and people will do it to Obama. No one is really wrong or right in their opinions on those things, because there is no solid wrong or right. People react to bad things, horrible things, differently. When we reach the point of having non-human beings as Presidents, then I'll be more disturbed.

Now, is this a tragedy? Of course it is, of course it is. I respect our military, and I respect life in general...so...to *me*...this is no more a tragedy than dying in a war overseas, or being shot going to the grocery store in a bad neighborhood, or any number of things that happen every day, all over the globe, but specifically here within our borders, that we for some reason don't expect the President to address. Everyone deserves respect, and in particular, all people deserve respect when they have lost loved ones. Most? Never get it. The world never knows about their pain.

Did this make me sad? Yes, it did. Was I shocked? Yes, I was. Still am, actually. But there are times I wonder why we don't consider every individual murdered by a madman/woman as a tragedy, as well. I sometimes wonder who gets to decide (the media of course) which tragedies matter and why. Not a job I'd want to have. And I also have to wonder why there would be any kind of outrage politically over this. I see two things that make this odd. When people make the point of all the tragedy involved in the wars, all the deaths, they are criticized and told 'this is war! that's what happens'. When people make the point of all the tragedy involved under dictatorships, some people will say 'that's not our business', while others will say it is perfectly fine to lose our soldiers to end a tragedy for others.

It is sometimes odd, to me, to understand how people differentiate between tragedies. They happen. Life happens. It is always sad. It is always tragic. We're surrounded by tragedy each and every day that we aren't even always aware of. We should never use tragedies for political purposes...but...I'm sorry, those on the right with complaints aren't being half as disturbing in their complaints as the left was regarding Bush.

Obama is human. But you know what? When we have tragedies in our own family, we try, so very hard, to find positive things in them. We all weep privately. Together, we find as much humor and goodness as we can. I hate it when Presidents act all somber and sad just because they're expected to. I hate that. I'd much prefer they all just be themselves when bad things happen. Or...do we want our President to be an actor?

applecorped · 7th November 2009, 10:55 AM

Originally Posted by leftysergeant

It sounds as though you are agreeing with the OP that it is reasonable to criticize Obama for not first dealing with the fact that a shrink went off his rocker before honoring a real war hero.

strike one.

Quote:

Had he gone first to the shooting, you would probably criticize him for trying to paint the troops as loonies about to go off on each other.

strike two.

Quote:

Can't win with your kind.

strike three. You're out.

leftysergeant · 7th November 2009, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by applecorped

strike one.

strike two.

strike three. You're out.

Erm....Whiskey, Tango, Foxtrot.

Do you have a point?

Darth Rotor · 7th November 2009, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by Swordsman

There's nothing wrong with him acknowledging a Medal of Freedom winner. There is something wrong with him referring to that Medal of Freedom winner as a Medal of Honor winner when he (Obama) is the one who awarded him the Medal of Freedom.

Yes, that was a mistake. He ought to know better.

Quote:

There is also something wrong with a POTUS calling a media conference to address a domestic tragedy and giving light-hearted "shout outs" in his opening comments like he's accepting a Grammy.

I was not under the impression that this press event was specifically called for the Fort Hood shootings. See posts elsewhere in this thread.

DR

daredelvis · 7th November 2009, 02:52 PM

The use of the patented Bill O'Reilly "some say" style accusation in in the OP is getting a little old. But as an added benefit we have the lame accusation that Obama was insensitive is quickly morphed into a variant of the tired and ironic Dick Cheney "Amateur hour" critique. Pathetic.

Daredelvis

6th November 2009, 08:49 PM	#41
Unabogie Muse Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 617	Modern conservatism. No nit too small to pick. Seriously, don't you conservatives understand that by ginning up perpetual outrage you are destroying your credibility and your ability to be heard on valid criticisms? Hyperbole for the sake of political gamesmanship doesn't help your cause, nor does it help the country. In fact, I didn't even click the link. This nonsense just makes my head hurt.
Unabogie Muse Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 617

6th November 2009, 08:51 PM	#42
applecorped Rotten to the core Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 5,487	Originally Posted by Unabogie In fact, I didn't even click the link. Then by all means please comment on it.
	__________________ It's all in the mind.

6th November 2009, 08:55 PM	#43
Unabogie Muse Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 617	Originally Posted by applecorped Then by all means please comment on it. I read all of your comments. It's plenty of information to decide that this is yet another Obama Outrage that I'm supposed to react to. Am I supposed to think that President Obama heard about the shootings and was somehow happy? If not, am I supposed to think he was expected to act and didn't? If not, then why should I give a crap about yet another manufactured outrage when this one will be forgotten just in time for tomorrow's next manufactured outrage?
Unabogie Muse Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 617

6th November 2009, 08:59 PM	#44
applecorped Rotten to the core Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 5,487	Originally Posted by Unabogie Am I supposed to think that President Obama heard about the shootings and was somehow happy? If not, am I supposed to think he was expected to act and didn't? You want me to decide how you are supposed to think?
	__________________ It's all in the mind.

6th November 2009, 09:04 PM	#45
tyr_13 Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2,512	Originally Posted by GreNME Did Glenn Beck rape and murder a young girl in 1990? Really, guys, can we just have one ODS meta-thread, and have you guys just stick all of the spaghetti you toss in there? Come on, don't be so hard. They're just asking questions.
tyr_13 Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2,512	__________________ Circled nothing is still nothing. "Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel Look at the puppy...the puppy is good.

6th November 2009, 09:04 PM	#46
Unabogie Muse Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 617	Originally Posted by applecorped You want me to decide how you are supposed to think? I'm asking you to explain what you think this nonsense means to you. Apparently you don't even know. It's just making you mad, so you are just all TEABAG SMASH!
Unabogie Muse Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 617

6th November 2009, 09:12 PM	#47
willhaven Thinker Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Raleigh, NC Posts: 245	Leveraging a recent tragedy to bash Obama. Classy.

6th November 2009, 09:22 PM	#48
LostAngeles Anti-WM Jihadist Join Date: May 2004 Location: Having a cup of tea. Posts: 9,781	Originally Posted by Unabogie Modern conservatism. No nit too small to pick. Seriously, don't you conservatives understand that by ginning up perpetual outrage you are destroying your credibility and your ability to be heard on valid criticisms? Hyperbole for the sake of political gamesmanship doesn't help your cause, nor does it help the country. In fact, I didn't even click the link. This nonsense just makes my head hurt. Or you could watch the link and determine for yourself that it simply a **** up on the PR team's fault.
	__________________ "There is also a likelihood that the settlement will fall between two biomes, potentially hazardous if the player expects a peaceful oceanside meadow, without realizing the ocean is full of amphibious zombie whales." - Dwarf Fortress Wik

6th November 2009, 09:27 PM	#49
GreNME Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Folsom Prison Posts: 5,954	Originally Posted by tyr_13 Come on, don't be so hard. They're just asking questions. Precisely. The past eight years it's been done to Bush, I'm sure that more than one of the folks starting threads like this rolled their eyes, accused the thread starter of Bush Derangement Syndrome, and wondered at how someone could be so obsessive at every minor thing that could possibly be spun in even a semi-negative light. Turnabout? Hypocrisy? Depressing irony? Some combination of all three or more? I propose an Obama Negative Nit-Picker subforum for the politics section until November of 2012, possibly 2016.
	__________________ _{Like love, criminals will always find a way. -- foxholeatheist The kind of pacifism I endorse is brought about by eliminating one enemy combatant at a time.-- JoeyDonuts}

6th November 2009, 09:41 PM	#50
Dr Adequate Professor Of The Bleedin' Obvious Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Waiting Long Enough By The River Posts: 17,601	Originally Posted by willhaven Leveraging a recent tragedy to bash Obama. Classy. Yeah, I'm trying to imagine the scene at Wingnut HQ. "Some guy cut loose with a gun at an Army Base, killed twelve people." "Great. How can we turn this into a whine about Obama!" "Well ... er ..." "Come on, everything's Obama's fault! Think! Think!" "Actually, I do my best work when I'm not thinking." "Wait, he's on TV now, maybe this'll give us some dumb ideas." Ten minutes later ... "Well, we've got him now." "What do you mean?" "You didn't spot it?" "No, what?" "He acknowledged the existence of his audience! And the reason why they were there in the first place!" "That's ... er ... that's bad?" "It will be."
	__________________ "It is a mark of insincerity of purpose to spend one's time in looking for the sacred Emperor in low-class teashops."

6th November 2009, 10:43 PM	#52
Juniversal CIA + FBI + NWO Employee Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Cincinnati, USA Posts: 379	He acknolwedged a medal of honor winner. I fail to see what the uproar is about. And he sent his condolences to those that passed. What's the big deal?
	__________________ Speaking the universal language of common sense and rationality.

6th November 2009, 11:04 PM	#53
MattusMaximus Intellectual Gladiator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In the midst of a vast, beautiful & uncaring universe Posts: 6,460	This thread, and the b.s. flying around all over it (from both sides), is a perfect example of just how far down the rabbit hole U.S. politics & the media has gone. We cannot even take some time to let these fallen soldiers (and civvies) be respectfully buried before we turn it into some kind of damned game of political "gotcha!" Gah, frak this... I'm outta here.
	__________________ Visit my blog: The Skeptical Teacher Critical Thinking Education Group (CTEG) "Are you good without God? Millions are." - Chicago Coalition of Reason

7th November 2009, 12:14 AM	#54
Swordsman New Blood Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2	Originally Posted by Juniversal He acknolwedged a medal of honor winner. Joe Medicine Crow is not a Medal of Honor recipient.
Swordsman New Blood Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2

7th November 2009, 12:40 AM	#55
Travis Misanthrope of the Mountains Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Tuolumne City, CA Posts: 6,262	Since I am a Liberal, and I never once criticized Bush for reading My Pet Goat, do I get to say that I think there is nothing really wrong going on here?
	__________________ "Because WE ARE IGNORANT OF 911 FACTS, WE DEMAND PROOF" -- Douglas Herman on Rense.com Don't forget to nominate November Stundies and vote in the October Stundie Finals.

7th November 2009, 12:43 AM	#56
Redtail Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 4,434	Originally Posted by Travis Since I am a Liberal, and I never once criticized Bush for reading My Pet Goat, do I get to say that I think there is nothing really wrong going on here? Have you also criticized Clinton for "depends what your definition of is, is"?
Redtail Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 4,434	__________________ MOVE!!!! SCIENCE IS COMING!!!!! I like yelling that as if science is a rampaging monster because it makes the Christians scatter... I'm kidding! I'm a christian! Shakes head while mouthing "No I'm not." ~Dr. KaBoom!

7th November 2009, 12:54 AM	#57
Travis Misanthrope of the Mountains Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Tuolumne City, CA Posts: 6,262	Originally Posted by Redtail Have you also criticized Clinton for "depends what your definition of is, is"? Nope, I always knew what he was trying to say.
	__________________ "Because WE ARE IGNORANT OF 911 FACTS, WE DEMAND PROOF" -- Douglas Herman on Rense.com Don't forget to nominate November Stundies and vote in the October Stundie Finals.

7th November 2009, 12:57 AM	#58
Redtail Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 4,434	Originally Posted by Travis Nope, I always knew what he was trying to say. Then no you commie!!!!!
Redtail Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 4,434	__________________ MOVE!!!! SCIENCE IS COMING!!!!! I like yelling that as if science is a rampaging monster because it makes the Christians scatter... I'm kidding! I'm a christian! Shakes head while mouthing "No I'm not." ~Dr. KaBoom!

7th November 2009, 01:26 AM	#59
BibleWelt New Blood Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 9	Why do people insist on calling the story "My Pet Goat", when it's actually "The Pet Goat"? (Sorry - one of My Pet Peaves...)
BibleWelt New Blood Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 9

7th November 2009, 03:47 AM	#60
Undesired Walrus Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 6,685	Originally Posted by The Painter Yes, yes they were. He did a shout out to Dr. Joe Medicine Crow before addressing the tragedy. Is he kidding? What an a-hole. In 11 months he still has not made a decision on Afghanistan. I am really beginning to believe he does not like the military at all. Didn't Obama recently fly out to honour the dead bodies coming home, something Bush never did and infact banned from being broadcast?
	__________________ "Life is tragic simply because the earth turns and the sun inexorably rises and sets, and one day, for each of us, the sun will go down for the last, last time. Perhaps the whole root of our trouble, the human trouble, is that we will sacrifice all the beauty of our lives, will imprison ourselves in totems, taboos, crosses, blood sacrifices, steeples, mosques, races, armies, flags, nations, in order to deny the fact of death, which is the only fact we have." ~James Baldwin

7th November 2009, 06:07 AM	#61
Tricky Radical centrist Moderator Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: The Group W bench Posts: 25,982	Bush was not criticized for reading a book to children, he was criticized for his slow reaction to an ongoing national emergency. The Fort Hood shootings were hardly a national emergency, but the act of a lone madman. As far as I know, the shooting was mostly over with by the time Obama got the news. Any attempt to paint these two events as equal would demonstrate a degree of partisanship that would pretty much preclude objective commentary.

7th November 2009, 06:24 AM	#62
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 25,014	Originally Posted by Swordsman Joe Medicine Crow is not a Medal of Honor recipient. Can we get some clarity on this? JMC won a Congressional Medal of Freedom. He was awarded same by President Obama. What's wrong with him acknowledging someone of note, someone who is an example of excellence? As to the Fort Hood Shooting, it isn't the only thing that happened in the world that day -- though it has certainly been my focus -- and I find the assessments of "PR team screw up" very likely. Tempest over a teapot. DR
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is some one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton____"Atheism is no safeguard against stupidity."--The Atheist____If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok____ "Your onus is aimed in the wrong direction." -- Cleon

7th November 2009, 06:47 AM	#63
leftysergeant Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spanaway WA Posts: 5,842	Originally Posted by Darth Rotor Can we get some clarity on this? JMC won a Congressional Medal of Freedom. During WWII, he also recieved the Bronze Star and the French Legione d'honnuer, their highest honor. He also accomplished all of the acts that qualify him in the Crow tradition to be a war chief, stealing enemy horses, touching a live enemy, disarming an enemy, capturing and enemy. At 90+ years, he is still a leading professor and lecturer on the history and culture of the Crow Nation. You want the President to slight a man like that because a shrink went off his rocker?
	Last edited by leftysergeant; 7th November 2009 at 06:49 AM. Reason: typos

7th November 2009, 06:57 AM	#64
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 25,014	Originally Posted by leftysergeant During WWII, he also recieved the Bronze Star and the French Legione d'honnuer, their highest honor. He also accomplished all of the acts that qualify him in the Crow tradition to be a war chief, stealing enemy horses, touching a live enemy, disarming an enemy, capturing and enemy. At 90+ years, he is still a leading professor and lecturer on the history and culture of the Crow Nation. You want the President to slight a man like that because a shrink went off his rocker? No, why do you presume I did? How about you understand who is saying what here. Read what I said. Quote: He was awarded same by President Obama. What's wrong with him acknowledging someone of note, someone who is an example of excellence? I also wrote Quote: Tempest in a teapot. Read before you knee jerk, Lefty, and you won't look like silly. Your beef is with somebody else, not me. DR
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is some one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton____"Atheism is no safeguard against stupidity."--The Atheist____If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok____ "Your onus is aimed in the wrong direction." -- Cleon

7th November 2009, 07:08 AM	#65
leftysergeant Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spanaway WA Posts: 5,842	Originally Posted by Darth Rotor No, why do you presume I did? How about you understand who is saying what here. Read what I said. I also wrote Read before you knee jerk, Lefty, and you won't look like silly. Your beef is with somebody else, not me. DR My apologies. I just got off work and am a little O.D.ed on reality. I was addressing those who thought Obama was insensitive. I could have made that clearer, were I more alert and focused.

7th November 2009, 07:37 AM	#66
applecorped Rotten to the core Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 5,487	Originally Posted by Unabogie I'm asking you to explain what you think this nonsense means to you. Apparently you don't even know. It's just making you mad, so you are just all TEABAG SMASH! Guess you didn't read all the posts: Originally Posted by gtc The only explanation I can think of is that whoever were handling the speech weren't informed that the media were led to believe he was going to address the shootings first and forget to make the the rest of his speech appropriately sombre and Obama just did what he was told without wondering whether it was appropriate in light of the events. My response: This sounds reasonable.^^^^ But don't let that stand in your way of painting any comment on Obama as a TEABAG SMASH!
	__________________ It's all in the mind.

7th November 2009, 08:06 AM	#67
leftysergeant Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spanaway WA Posts: 5,842	Originally Posted by applecorped But don't let that stand in your way of painting any comment on Obama as a TEABAG SMASH! It sounds as though you are agreeing with the OP that it is reasonable to criticize Obama for not first dealing with the fact that a shrink went off his rocker before honoring a real war hero. Had he gone first to the shooting, you would probably criticize him for trying to paint the troops as loonies about to go off on each other. Can't win with your kind.

7th November 2009, 08:16 AM	#68
Peephole Graduate Poster Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Belgium Posts: 1,037	Originally Posted by Dr Adequate Wow. The bodies have barely had time to get cold and someone's already thought of a way to politicize it. I'm impressed. I guess we can add "congratulating Presidential Medal of Freedom winners," to the list of offenses comitted by Obama according to right-wingers: -Having too few female golf partners. -Giving encouraging speeches to children. -Reading prepared speeches. -Fistbumping people. -Bowing for people. -Appointing executive branch officials. -Trying to help American cities win their olympic bids. -Having a Kenyan father. -Accepting a Nobel Peace Prize. -Giving out DVD's with the wrong region code. -...
	__________________ 911science The Field

7th November 2009, 08:25 AM	#69
JihadJane Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 9,106	Promising change but carrying on with business as usual.
JihadJane Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 9,106	__________________ THE END of the recession IS NIGH

7th November 2009, 08:38 AM	#70
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 23,599	Originally Posted by JihadJane Promising change but carrying on with business as usual. So you think the Ft. Hood shooting was an inside job Jane?
	__________________ "My opinion is not uninformed there are just many things I have no clue about." -atavisms "Iran DOES have the right and good reason to attack Israel." -parky76

7th November 2009, 08:50 AM	#71
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 25,014	Originally Posted by leftysergeant My apologies. I just got off work and am a little O.D.ed on reality. I was addressing those who thought Obama was insensitive. I could have made that clearer, were I more alert and focused. Accepted without reservation. I am glad that we can agree on some things, as often as we disagree. DR
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is some one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton____"Atheism is no safeguard against stupidity."--The Atheist____If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok____ "Your onus is aimed in the wrong direction." -- Cleon

7th November 2009, 08:51 AM	#72
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 25,014	Originally Posted by JihadJane Promising change but carrying on with business as usual. I miss the meat cake avatar. Your comment may not be related to the topic of this thread, though it may be a reasonably accurate summary of months 1-10 of Obama's term.
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is some one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton____"Atheism is no safeguard against stupidity."--The Atheist____If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok____ "Your onus is aimed in the wrong direction." -- Cleon

7th November 2009, 09:57 AM	#73
Swordsman New Blood Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2	Originally Posted by Darth Rotor Can we get some clarity on this? JMC won a Congressional Medal of Freedom. He was awarded same by President Obama. What's wrong with him acknowledging someone of note, someone who is an example of excellence? As to the Fort Hood Shooting, it isn't the only thing that happened in the world that day -- though it has certainly been my focus -- and I find the assessments of "PR team screw up" very likely. Tempest over a teapot. DR There's nothing wrong with him acknowledging a Medal of Freedom winner. There is something wrong with him referring to that Medal of Freedom winner as a Medal of Honor winner when he (Obama) is the one who awarded him the Medal of Freedom. There is also something wrong with a POTUS calling a media conference to address a domestic tragedy and giving light-hearted "shout outs" in his opening comments like he's accepting a Grammy.
Swordsman New Blood Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2

7th November 2009, 10:11 AM	#74
leftysergeant Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spanaway WA Posts: 5,842	Originally Posted by Swordsman There is also something wrong with a POTUS calling a media conference to address a domestic tragedy and giving light-hearted "shout outs" in his opening comments like he's accepting a Grammy. Dude, get the facts straight. He did not do that at a news conference. He made the remarks about the shooting at an unrelated event. ODS.

7th November 2009, 10:15 AM	#75
hgc Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 8,778	Originally Posted by Swordsman There's nothing wrong with him acknowledging a Medal of Freedom winner. There is something wrong with him referring to that Medal of Freedom winner as a Medal of Honor winner when he (Obama) is the one who awarded him the Medal of Freedom. Slip of the tongue! Time for a tea party! Quote: There is also something wrong with a POTUS calling a media conference to address a domestic tragedy and giving light-hearted "shout outs" in his opening comments like he's accepting a Grammy. If that is what happened, which of course it is not. He didn't call a "media conference" to address the tragedy. He was there to speak to that group anyway, and added remarks about the tragedy at the end of his talk.
hgc Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 8,778	__________________ "Swine breath is an atmosphere stabilizer." - PA, The Village

7th November 2009, 10:49 AM	#76
sugarb Muse Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 791	Do I think the way he handled this was inappropriate? Given his position, and truly how powerful the words of the President are when things like this happen, yeah...I think it was inappropriate and insensitive. However, I don't think that President Obama himself is insensitive to what happened. We tend to place expectations on our President that are unrealistic. People did it to Bush on 9/11, and people will do it to Obama. No one is really wrong or right in their opinions on those things, because there is no solid wrong or right. People react to bad things, horrible things, differently. When we reach the point of having non-human beings as Presidents, then I'll be more disturbed. Now, is this a tragedy? Of course it is, of course it is. I respect our military, and I respect life in general...so...to me...this is no more a tragedy than dying in a war overseas, or being shot going to the grocery store in a bad neighborhood, or any number of things that happen every day, all over the globe, but specifically here within our borders, that we for some reason don't expect the President to address. Everyone deserves respect, and in particular, all people deserve respect when they have lost loved ones. Most? Never get it. The world never knows about their pain. Did this make me sad? Yes, it did. Was I shocked? Yes, I was. Still am, actually. But there are times I wonder why we don't consider every individual murdered by a madman/woman as a tragedy, as well. I sometimes wonder who gets to decide (the media of course) which tragedies matter and why. Not a job I'd want to have. And I also have to wonder why there would be any kind of outrage politically over this. I see two things that make this odd. When people make the point of all the tragedy involved in the wars, all the deaths, they are criticized and told 'this is war! that's what happens'. When people make the point of all the tragedy involved under dictatorships, some people will say 'that's not our business', while others will say it is perfectly fine to lose our soldiers to end a tragedy for others. It is sometimes odd, to me, to understand how people differentiate between tragedies. They happen. Life happens. It is always sad. It is always tragic. We're surrounded by tragedy each and every day that we aren't even always aware of. We should never use tragedies for political purposes...but...I'm sorry, those on the right with complaints aren't being half as disturbing in their complaints as the left was regarding Bush. Obama is human. But you know what? When we have tragedies in our own family, we try, so very hard, to find positive things in them. We all weep privately. Together, we find as much humor and goodness as we can. I hate it when Presidents act all somber and sad just because they're expected to. I hate that. I'd much prefer they all just be themselves when bad things happen. Or...do we want our President to be an actor?
sugarb Muse Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 791