IS Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Non-USA & General Politics
 


Welcome to the International Skeptics Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.
Reply
Old 18th February 2011, 03:09 AM   #1
andyandy
anthropomorphic ape
 
andyandy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 8,377
What happens if the Bahrain Monarchy fall?

Carrying on the popular "what happens if...." threads on dissidence across the middle east, Bahrain is joining in on the action:

Quote:
Thousands of mourners are calling for the downfall of Bahrain's ruling monarchy as they begin burying those killed during an assault on pro-reform protesters that has brought army tanks into the streets of the west's most strategic Gulf ally.

The reaction against Bahrain's king and his inner circle reflects an escalation of protesters' initial demands for the Sunni monarchy's hold on top government posts to be diluted, and for discrimination by the Shia majority to be addressed.

The mood, however, appears to have turned towards defiance of the entire ruling system after the attack on a protest camp in Bahrain's capital, Manama, on Thursday left at least five dead and more than 230 injured. The country was placed on an emergency-like footing, with military forces in key areas and checkpoints on main roads.

"The regime has broken something inside of me ... All of these people gathered today have had something broken in them," said Ahmed Makki Abu Taki, whose 27-year-old brother Mahmoud was killed in the pre-dawn sweep through the protest camp in Pearl Square. "We used to demand for the prime minister to step down, but now our demand is for the ruling family to get out."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...nfall-monarchy

Seems like it's a long way from the monarchy actually being over-thrown - but what would happen if democracy allowed countries like Bahrain to vote for their own leaders? The US is in a particularly difficult spot - wanting to be seen to be supporting democracy, whilst doing everything they can to make sure that their interests in the region are maintained (ie that a benign ally remains in charge....)

Are these events driving each other, or are they disparate events caused by a confluence of similar factors? Indeed, is the media just focusing more on any dissent because the media loves nothing more than a good narrative?

Discuss....
__________________
"Contentment is found in the music of Bach, the books of Tolstoy and the equations of Dirac, not at the wheel of a BMW or the aisles of Harvey Nicks."
andyandy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2011, 05:37 AM   #2
andyandy
anthropomorphic ape
 
andyandy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 8,377
If the Bahrain Monarchy falls in a forest does anyone care?
__________________
"Contentment is found in the music of Bach, the books of Tolstoy and the equations of Dirac, not at the wheel of a BMW or the aisles of Harvey Nicks."
andyandy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2011, 05:55 AM   #3
FireGarden
Philosopher
 
FireGarden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 5,047
I care but don't feel like guessing. But since you insist...

Saudi Arabia says it's ready to help Bahrain's rulers
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...022002699.html

So I imagine they feel it's important Bahrain's king doesn't fall. If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you?
__________________
When Americans talk about freedom, it’s our secular code word for salvation. There’s no salvation outside the church; there’s no freedom outside the American way of life. -- James Carroll

B'tselem
Tony Karon's blog

Last edited by FireGarden; 22nd February 2011 at 06:00 AM.
FireGarden is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2011, 06:28 AM   #4
andyandy
anthropomorphic ape
 
andyandy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 8,377
Originally Posted by FireGarden;
I care but don't feel like guessing. But since you insist...

Saudi Arabia says it's ready to help Bahrain's rulers
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...022002699.html

So I imagine they feel it's important Bahrain's king doesn't fall. If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you?

After it is generally accepted historically that the 1960s domino effect fear of communism was ill placed, it's remarkable to see what appears to be a real manifestation of the domino effect in action.....we live in interesting times
__________________
"Contentment is found in the music of Bach, the books of Tolstoy and the equations of Dirac, not at the wheel of a BMW or the aisles of Harvey Nicks."
andyandy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2011, 11:43 AM   #5
GreyArea
Graduate Poster
 
GreyArea's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,004
Originally Posted by andyandy View Post
Seems like it's a long way from the monarchy actually being over-thrown - but what would happen if democracy allowed countries like Bahrain to vote for their own leaders?
Consider this quote from Bahraini opposition leader Ebrahim Sherrif:
Quote:
"We not saying to the royal family 'you're not part of this society'. We are saying 'you are welcome to be equal, but not to be above the law'. We don't want to overthrow the monarchy.

"We'd like to see a UK- or Spanish-style constitutional monarchy. A republic does not solve the problem - we had republics in Tunisia and Egypt and they were the first to be overthrown," he said.
"Day of transformation in Bahrain's 'sacred square'" -- February 19, 2011
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12515906

A constitutional monarchy with a figurehead royal head of state and an elected head of government sounds like a reasonable compromise with much good precedent.
__________________
I am the 0.0000000142857142857143%

Tradition is a murky and dangerous bog.
GreyArea is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 22nd February 2011, 04:34 PM   #6
NWO Sentryman
Proud NWO Gatekeeper
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,994
Originally Posted by FireGarden View Post
I care but don't feel like guessing. But since you insist...

Saudi Arabia says it's ready to help Bahrain's rulers
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...022002699.html

So I imagine they feel it's important Bahrain's king doesn't fall. If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you?
mind if i sig the bolded part?
__________________
If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you? - FireGarden on the Middle East
NWO Sentryman is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 23rd February 2011, 08:25 AM   #7
FireGarden
Philosopher
 
FireGarden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 5,047
100,000 protesting in Bahrain.
That's 1/5th the population.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/02/23/wo...n.html?_r=1&hp

Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman View Post
mind if i sig the bolded part?
I wouldn't mind.
__________________
When Americans talk about freedom, it’s our secular code word for salvation. There’s no salvation outside the church; there’s no freedom outside the American way of life. -- James Carroll

B'tselem
Tony Karon's blog
FireGarden is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 26th February 2011, 04:48 PM   #8
Darth Rotor
Salted Sith Cynic
 
Darth Rotor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 38,527
What happens if the Bahrain Monarchy fall?

The Fifth Fleet will become a floating HQ, for one.
__________________
Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission.
"Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton__"If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok__ "I only use my gun whenever kindness fails."-- Robert Earl Keen__"Sturgeon spares none.". -- The Marquis
Darth Rotor is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th March 2011, 05:42 AM   #9
FireGarden
Philosopher
 
FireGarden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 5,047
Are the Saudis merely willing to help, or does it go further?:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...t-2232928.html

Originally Posted by Independent
King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia is widely reported to have told the Bahraini authorities that if they do not crush their Shia revolt, his own forces will.
And that's against a background of a possible uprising in Saudi, with a 'day of rage' planned for March 11.

There were protests on the 4th, but their size isn't clear:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/63652c86-4...44feab49a.html
__________________
When Americans talk about freedom, it’s our secular code word for salvation. There’s no salvation outside the church; there’s no freedom outside the American way of life. -- James Carroll

B'tselem
Tony Karon's blog
FireGarden is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th March 2011, 05:52 AM   #10
andyandy
anthropomorphic ape
 
andyandy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 8,377
Originally Posted by FireGarden View Post
Are the Saudis merely willing to help, or does it go further?:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...t-2232928.html



And that's against a background of a possible uprising in Saudi, with a 'day of rage' planned for March 11.

There were protests on the 4th, but their size isn't clear:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/63652c86-4...44feab49a.html
and they will be equipped with nothing but the finest military equipment money can buy.....

I wonder if either the UK or the US would dare criticise the Saudis if they did intervene?
__________________
"Contentment is found in the music of Bach, the books of Tolstoy and the equations of Dirac, not at the wheel of a BMW or the aisles of Harvey Nicks."
andyandy is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 5th March 2011, 08:16 AM   #11
NWO Sentryman
Proud NWO Gatekeeper
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 6,994
the problem is that the Saudis control an artery of the world's oil supplies and could cut it off, making the Oil panic of 1973 look like an empty petrol tank.
__________________
If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you? - FireGarden on the Middle East
NWO Sentryman is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 14th March 2011, 06:31 AM   #12
FireGarden
Philosopher
 
FireGarden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 5,047
1000 Saudi troops, as part of a GGC force invited by Bahrain, are in Bahrain to guard key facilities:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12729786
http://english.aljazeera.net/news/mi...928850647.html
__________________
When Americans talk about freedom, it’s our secular code word for salvation. There’s no salvation outside the church; there’s no freedom outside the American way of life. -- James Carroll

B'tselem
Tony Karon's blog
FireGarden is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

International Skeptics Forum » General Topics » Non-USA & General Politics

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:40 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.

This forum began as part of the James Randi Education Foundation (JREF). However, the forum now exists as
an independent entity with no affiliation with or endorsement by the JREF, including the section in reference to "JREF" topics.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.