JREF Challenge FAQ

RemieV · 16th October 2007, 02:24 PM

If you are considering applying for the JREF Challenge, or have general queries regarding it, check out the new JREF Challenge FAQ. If you have additional questions or would like more information, feel free to write in to: challenge@randi.org.

Michael C · 20th October 2007, 11:04 AM

Is this linked from the JREF home page? I can't find it for the moment: from the link on the Million Dollar Challenge page I get directed to this page, which just tells me that questions for the FAQ are welcomed.

RemieV · 21st October 2007, 12:41 PM

You're in the new site...

You can find the FAQ linked from here:

http://www.randi.org/joom/content/view/38/31/

rjh01 · 21st October 2007, 08:39 PM

No RemieV, that answer is no good. On the top right hand side of most pages in the forum is JREF Homepage. Click on that link and you go to here http://www.randi.org/. So far, so good. One of the links on that page is Million Dollar Challenge. On link on that page is Randi's Personal FAQ. That takes us to an empty FAQ. My last link needs to be re-directed to the link on the OP.

RemieV · 23rd October 2007, 03:32 AM

Jeff has been informed, and has said he will update the site. Until then, the FAQ is available at the link I supplied.

Jyera · 13th January 2009, 05:35 PM

I came in here to look for the FAQ. But as of this posting (14 Jan 2009), many of the links provided in this thread above leads to a page saying.

"Joomla. James Randi Educational Foundation
This is the old site. Please update your bookmark to http://www.randi.org. Thanks!"

This includes "http://www.randi.org/joom/content/view/38/31/ "
Also the "JREF Challenge FAQ" as provided by RemieV is also linked as " http://www.randi.org/joom/content/view/47/37/" as of this posting.

The direct link to the FAQ as of this post seems to be...
http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...lenge-faq.html

jimtron · 13th January 2009, 06:25 PM

I just read the new FAQ, and then I took a look at the rules on the application page (http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...plication.html). After participating in a couple recent seemingly endless discussions here regarding applications and protocols, I sure wish applicants would read the first rule:

Quote:

1. This is the primary and most important of these rules: Applicant must state clearly in advance, and applicant and JREF will agree upon, what powers and/or abilities will be demonstrated, the limits of the proposed demonstration (so far as time, location and other variables are concerned) and what will constitute both a positive and a negative result.

If every applicant read and abided by that rule, it would save so much needless discussion...

Roma · 13th March 2010, 03:48 PM

I have been following Dr. Colin Ross' Million Dollar Challenge thread
and it appears he has been discredited by the posters
but it is not clear whether or not he is still in the game or if he has dropped out.

Could you please tell me if Dr. Colin Ross is still applying for the MDC,
or re-applying,
or re-submitting his test protocol,
or something else,
or has he dropped out ?

thank-you
Roma

Miernik Wieslaw · 20th May 2011, 10:35 PM

I wrote to challenge@randi.org, but nobody answered me not. I've been writing about important issues and important discovery.

Pixel42 · 21st May 2011, 12:22 AM

Originally Posted by Miernik Wieslaw

I wrote to challenge@randi.org, but nobody answered me not. I've been writing about important issues and important discovery.

Have you applied for the challenge, stating what paranormal ability you have and how you propose to demonstrate it? Because you're unlikely to get a reply otherwise.

If you have something to discuss prior to applying for the challenge you'd be better off starting a thread. There are plenty of people here who can help you design a test protocol, for example.

snuffkin · 22nd August 2011, 02:17 AM

what would you say to psychics and believers who say that the test is set up so that its impossible to pass, or that they won't be able to 'perform' in a cold, stark testing room. etc. ? Why do they repeatedly make such lame excuses? I know nothing about the tests or how they would measure the abilities? But I'm sure it would be fair. As I have pointed out to many so called 'mediums' during discussions and debates, the Randi Prize is genuine and I have directed them to the site. They choose to ignore the challenge though.

GrandMasterFox · 22nd August 2011, 02:47 AM

Originally Posted by snuffkin

what would you say to psychics and believers who say that the test is set up so that its impossible to pass, or that they won't be able to 'perform' in a cold, stark testing room. etc. ?

Simple, if they have agreed to the protocol, then they are saying they can pass it.

There were all sorts of people who took the test and failed it claiming the test itself wasn't fair, like Ms.Putt saying that "all she could see was blobs", but one might ask then why did she agree to the protocol?
Or better yet, why did she not do a rehersal of the test in her own environment with friends\random people of the street?

Even athelits who go to competions to do the same things they do constantly still practice before the major event.

If she had the ability she claims and was acting rationally more likely she would have made a previous test and simply told the JREF she can't perform under those conditions.

Of course for those who claim the test is dishonest and the JREF is cheating, why not simply take the test and expose the cheating? If a psychic takes the test and fails and then repeats the test with a sanction of his own choosing that would raise a lot of concerns.

To this day, not a single one has done so.

SkepticScott · 22nd August 2011, 08:28 AM

Originally Posted by GrandMasterFox

Simple, if they have agreed to the protocol, then they are saying they can pass it

I'd go further and point out that they helped design the protocol and didn't have to be tested. They could have said "No, I can't do this under those conditions." and walked away. Instead, they agreed with the conditions and showed up expecting to pass the test. The excuses come out only after they learn that they failed.

snuffkin wrote "I know nothing about the tests or how they would measure the abilities?" Each protocol has to be custom-designed for the claimant. Claims of dowsing, mind-reading, and telekinesis have to be tested differently. In each case, however, there would be an objective pass/fail criteria.

16th October 2007, 02:24 PM	#1
RemieV Lostie, Pirate, Snape Lover Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,217	JREF Challenge FAQ If you are considering applying for the JREF Challenge, or have general queries regarding it, check out the new JREF Challenge FAQ. If you have additional questions or would like more information, feel free to write in to: challenge@randi.org.
	__________________ Visit me at Unbridled Chaos. For funsies. There's Watson pix involved. Aime la vérité, mais pardonne à l'erreur. Last edited by Jeff Wagg; 1st May 2009 at 10:55 PM.

21st October 2007, 12:41 PM	#3
RemieV Lostie, Pirate, Snape Lover Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,217	You're in the new site... You can find the FAQ linked from here: http://www.randi.org/joom/content/view/38/31/
	__________________ Visit me at Unbridled Chaos. For funsies. There's Watson pix involved. Aime la vérité, mais pardonne à l'erreur. Last edited by RemieV; 19th August 2008 at 03:50 PM.

21st October 2007, 08:39 PM	#4
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 17,164	No RemieV, that answer is no good. On the top right hand side of most pages in the forum is JREF Homepage. Click on that link and you go to here http://www.randi.org/. So far, so good. One of the links on that page is Million Dollar Challenge. On link on that page is Randi's Personal FAQ. That takes us to an empty FAQ. My last link needs to be re-directed to the link on the OP.
	__________________ dddffffpppqqqq Want to use your computer for something that will make society better? See this thread for details Folding@home

23rd October 2007, 03:32 AM	#5
RemieV Lostie, Pirate, Snape Lover Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 4,217	Jeff has been informed, and has said he will update the site. Until then, the FAQ is available at the link I supplied.
	__________________ Visit me at Unbridled Chaos. For funsies. There's Watson pix involved. Aime la vérité, mais pardonne à l'erreur.

13th January 2009, 05:35 PM	#6
Jyera Muse Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 736	I came in here to look for the FAQ. But as of this posting (14 Jan 2009), many of the links provided in this thread above leads to a page saying. "Joomla. James Randi Educational Foundation This is the old site. Please update your bookmark to http://www.randi.org. Thanks!" This includes "http://www.randi.org/joom/content/view/38/31/ " Also the "JREF Challenge FAQ" as provided by RemieV is also linked as " http://www.randi.org/joom/content/view/47/37/" as of this posting. The direct link to the FAQ as of this post seems to be... http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...lenge-faq.html
Jyera Muse Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 736

20th October 2007, 11:04 AM	#2
Michael C Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: N 49° 52' 3" E 8° 40' 21" Posts: 1,849	Is this linked from the JREF home page? I can't find it for the moment: from the link on the Million Dollar Challenge page I get directed to this page, which just tells me that questions for the FAQ are welcomed.

13th January 2009, 06:25 PM	#7
jimtron Master Poster Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Chicago Posts: 2,965	I just read the new FAQ, and then I took a look at the rules on the application page (http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...plication.html). After participating in a couple recent seemingly endless discussions here regarding applications and protocols, I sure wish applicants would read the first rule: Quote: 1. This is the primary and most important of these rules: Applicant must state clearly in advance, and applicant and JREF will agree upon, what powers and/or abilities will be demonstrated, the limits of the proposed demonstration (so far as time, location and other variables are concerned) and what will constitute both a positive and a negative result. If every applicant read and abided by that rule, it would save so much needless discussion...
	__________________

13th March 2010, 03:48 PM	#8
Roma Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Winnipeg, Canada Posts: 2,059	I have been following Dr. Colin Ross' Million Dollar Challenge thread and it appears he has been discredited by the posters but it is not clear whether or not he is still in the game or if he has dropped out. Could you please tell me if Dr. Colin Ross is still applying for the MDC, or re-applying, or re-submitting his test protocol, or something else, or has he dropped out ? thank-you Roma
	__________________ I only know what I want to know.

20th May 2011, 10:35 PM	#9
Miernik Wieslaw Banned Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 36	I wrote to challenge@randi.org, but nobody answered me not. I've been writing about important issues and important discovery.
Miernik Wieslaw Banned Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 36

21st May 2011, 12:22 AM	#10
Pixel42 Schrödinger's cat Join Date: May 2004 Location: Wiltshire, UK Posts: 4,218	Originally Posted by Miernik Wieslaw I wrote to challenge@randi.org, but nobody answered me not. I've been writing about important issues and important discovery. Have you applied for the challenge, stating what paranormal ability you have and how you propose to demonstrate it? Because you're unlikely to get a reply otherwise. If you have something to discuss prior to applying for the challenge you'd be better off starting a thread. There are plenty of people here who can help you design a test protocol, for example.
	__________________ "The correct scientific response to anything that is not understood is always to look harder for the explanation, not give up and assume a supernatural cause". David Attenborough.

22nd August 2011, 02:17 AM	#11
snuffkin Scholar Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 88	testing set up? what would you say to psychics and believers who say that the test is set up so that its impossible to pass, or that they won't be able to 'perform' in a cold, stark testing room. etc. ? Why do they repeatedly make such lame excuses? I know nothing about the tests or how they would measure the abilities? But I'm sure it would be fair. As I have pointed out to many so called 'mediums' during discussions and debates, the Randi Prize is genuine and I have directed them to the site. They choose to ignore the challenge though.
snuffkin Scholar Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 88

22nd August 2011, 02:47 AM	#12
GrandMasterFox Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 1,315	Originally Posted by snuffkin what would you say to psychics and believers who say that the test is set up so that its impossible to pass, or that they won't be able to 'perform' in a cold, stark testing room. etc. ? Simple, if they have agreed to the protocol, then they are saying they can pass it. There were all sorts of people who took the test and failed it claiming the test itself wasn't fair, like Ms.Putt saying that "all she could see was blobs", but one might ask then why did she agree to the protocol? Or better yet, why did she not do a rehersal of the test in her own environment with friends\random people of the street? Even athelits who go to competions to do the same things they do constantly still practice before the major event. If she had the ability she claims and was acting rationally more likely she would have made a previous test and simply told the JREF she can't perform under those conditions. Of course for those who claim the test is dishonest and the JREF is cheating, why not simply take the test and expose the cheating? If a psychic takes the test and fails and then repeats the test with a sanction of his own choosing that would raise a lot of concerns. To this day, not a single one has done so.

22nd August 2011, 08:28 AM	#13
SkepticScott TAM Volunteer Guy Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: North of Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 2,885	Originally Posted by GrandMasterFox Simple, if they have agreed to the protocol, then they are saying they can pass it I'd go further and point out that they helped design the protocol and didn't have to be tested. They could have said "No, I can't do this under those conditions." and walked away. Instead, they agreed with the conditions and showed up expecting to pass the test. The excuses come out only after they learn that they failed. snuffkin wrote "I know nothing about the tests or how they would measure the abilities?" Each protocol has to be custom-designed for the claimant. Claims of dowsing, mind-reading, and telekinesis have to be tested differently. In each case, however, there would be an objective pass/fail criteria.
	__________________ -- Scott If mho, the unit of conductance, is in units of ¹/_ohm, are IQ and qi similarly inversely related? "I love that you nerds turned a thread about a party into a debate over currency aerodynamics." -- Rebecca