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Tags atheism , Atheism Plus

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Old 7th December 2012, 07:24 AM   #2161
zeggman
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Originally Posted by Edx View Post
She then discusses how men are more likely to be victims of violence but seem less concerned with it even if they have experienced it while women are the safest demographic in society but feel more victimised.
Men are probably more likely to escalate a disagreement with a stranger until violence erupts. Then, whoever gets the butt-whipping becomes the victim.

Violence by strangers against women is more likely to be unsolicited.
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Old 7th December 2012, 08:57 AM   #2162
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
I love where this conversation is heading.

http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3178

Someone brought up the idea of putting together some demographics and apparently no one knows how the software works, so they can't ask a techie for some basics, so they're proposing to do it by poll. Anonymous and totally voluntary, of course. Would anyone who works with statistics like to go explain to them just how bad an idea that is.

But then it trends towards humor, although they don't know it. One concerned citizen (they specialize in being concerned, remember) suggested that they make it clear to people that they were not required to answer questions they wanted to opt out of and also make it clear that it's a "safe" poll.

I'm waiting for someone to propose that they put a Trigger Warning on it. That's coming up; I'm sure.
Funny, I thought it was how something was set up that made it safe not someone "making it clear" that it is a safe that does it.

So, I guess when someone says "your money is safe with me" I should just hand over my cash because no one intending to steal from me would ever try to reassure me.

[rhetorical]Can people really be this naive/stupid/socially inept? [/rhetorical]
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Old 7th December 2012, 12:02 PM   #2163
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They already tried that. First they had a map that you could pin your location to then they had that thread where they all whined about how difficult they had it. Remember ? Boo Hoo, I'm gifted, Waaaaa, the buttons on my blouse make it easier for men to undress me.

Anybody see how they took down uncomplicatedblossom ? First, possibly the stupidest mod action I've ever seen then a pile on defending the mod action. It triggered the heck out SF yet, the SJWs, soldiered on to thread lock.

What a bunch of alpha hotels
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Old 7th December 2012, 12:35 PM   #2164
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
They already tried that. First they had a map that you could pin your location to then they had that thread where they all whined about how difficult they had it. Remember ? Boo Hoo, I'm gifted, Waaaaa, the buttons on my blouse make it easier for men to undress me.

Anybody see how they took down uncomplicatedblossom ? First, possibly the stupidest mod action I've ever seen then a pile on defending the mod action. It triggered the heck out SF yet, the SJWs, soldiered on to thread lock.

What a bunch of alpha hotels
Wow. That's vicious. I'm trying to put my finger on exactly what it's reminding me of; Animal Farm, possibly.
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Old 8th December 2012, 02:25 PM   #2165
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
They already tried that. First they had a map that you could pin your location to then they had that thread where they all whined about how difficult they had it. Remember ? Boo Hoo, I'm gifted, Waaaaa, the buttons on my blouse make it easier for men to undress me.

Anybody see how they took down uncomplicatedblossom ? First, possibly the stupidest mod action I've ever seen then a pile on defending the mod action. It triggered the heck out SF yet, the SJWs, soldiered on to thread lock.

What a bunch of alpha hotels
I've seen children behave verbally like that. A flash of temper and sometimes tears but adults? Especially as they have to pause and compose their texts. If somebody had described that thread, I wouldn't believe it.
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Old 8th December 2012, 07:01 PM   #2166
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Originally Posted by zooterkin View Post
Wow. That's vicious. I'm trying to put my finger on exactly what it's reminding me of; Animal Farm, possibly.
That's a pretty good analogy. They wait to get behind a leader, so if a mod had showed up and said, "That's a great idea. Let's make this a universal hug thread", I bet not one of them would've taken the low road. But since the mod that started it went into Concern Troll mode, they all went that way.

Why hasn't that Cipher person been made a mod? It would seem that she has all the attributes.... mean streak, imagined self-importance, not much knowledge, big mouth...
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Old 8th December 2012, 07:23 PM   #2167
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Originally Posted by zeggman View Post
Men are probably more likely to escalate a disagreement with a stranger until violence erupts..
Evidence?

From my Friday/Saturday nights out, I would question this.
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Old 8th December 2012, 07:36 PM   #2168
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Originally Posted by devnull View Post
Evidence?

From my Friday/Saturday nights out, I would question this.
"Men are generally more likely than women to get involved in bar fights. According to a University of Buffalo study, 96 percent of men who reported having experienced bar violence were attacked by a male opponent. By contrast, 1/3 of physical aggression reported by women is sexual assault from a member of the opposite sex. According to a Department of Justice report, men are 50 percent more likely than women to be involved in a bar fight."

http://www.ehow.com/info_8473161_gen...-violence.html

Maybe you're spending your Friday/Saturday nights out with pussies.
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Old 8th December 2012, 07:39 PM   #2169
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Why hasn't that Cipher person been made a mod? It would seem that she has all the attributes.... mean streak, imagined self-importance, not much knowledge, big mouth...
Probably an old white man.
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Old 8th December 2012, 08:01 PM   #2170
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Originally Posted by zeggman View Post
"Men are generally more likely than women to get involved in bar fights. According to a University of Buffalo study, 96 percent of men who reported having experienced bar violence were attacked by a male opponent. By contrast, 1/3 of physical aggression reported by women is sexual assault from a member of the opposite sex. According to a Department of Justice report, men are 50 percent more likely than women to be involved in a bar fight."

http://www.ehow.com/info_8473161_gen...-violence.html

Maybe you're spending your Friday/Saturday nights out with pussies.
I must have just witnessed an extraordinary number of scrag fights.
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Old 8th December 2012, 08:41 PM   #2171
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
They already tried that. First they had a map that you could pin your location to then they had that thread where they all whined about how difficult they had it. Remember ? Boo Hoo, I'm gifted, Waaaaa, the buttons on my blouse make it easier for men to undress me.

Anybody see how they took down uncomplicatedblossom ? First, possibly the stupidest mod action I've ever seen then a pile on defending the mod action. It triggered the heck out SF yet, the SJWs, soldiered on to thread lock.

What a bunch of alpha hotels
Originally Posted by zooterkin View Post
Wow. That's vicious. I'm trying to put my finger on exactly what it's reminding me of; Animal Farm, possibly.

Yes, Wow!, was my reaction as well. By the way, do they have Animal Farms in Berkshire, mostly?

Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
That's a pretty good analogy. They wait to get behind a leader, so if a mod had showed up and said, "That's a great idea. Let's make this a universal hug thread", I bet not one of them would've taken the low road. But since the mod that started it went into Concern Troll mode, they all went that way.

Why hasn't that Cipher person been made a mod? It would seem that she has all the attributes.... mean streak, imagined self-importance, not much knowledge, big mouth...

It seems as though every link to an A+theism thread includes Cipher freaking out on some poster.

Originally Posted by zeggman View Post
Probably an old white man.

Nice.
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Old 9th December 2012, 07:57 AM   #2172
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post

Why hasn't that Cipher person been made a mod? It would seem that she has all the attributes.... mean streak, imagined self-importance, not much knowledge, big mouth...
Personally, my vote is with Setar for moderator.

Anybody who could float the idea that, in order to avoid getting hit by cars, pedestrians may want to take some steps to minimize their risk, is "victim blaming" and actually get some traction with it, deserves to wear the green.

The argument is, of course, drivers are among the privileged and powerful while the poor downtrodden pedestrian is but a mere proletariat who, in a "just" society should not have to be aware of their surroundings at all. Or something like that.

Sometimes the logic of the whole social justice schtick eludes me.

Thread here
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Old 9th December 2012, 08:18 AM   #2173
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
Sometimes the logic of the whole social justice schtick eludes me.
I think I see where you may be going wrong.
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Old 9th December 2012, 08:24 AM   #2174
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
The argument is, of course, drivers are among the privileged and powerful while the poor downtrodden pedestrian is but a mere proletariat who, in a "just" society should not have to be aware of their surroundings at all. Or something like that.

Sometimes the logic of the whole social justice schtick eludes me.

Makes perfect sense. Of course, by the same reasoning, municipal buses should be allowed to pay no heed to any pedestrians who get in the way, especially near colleges.
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Old 9th December 2012, 09:19 AM   #2175
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Originally Posted by Myriad View Post
Makes perfect sense. Of course, by the same reasoning, municipal buses should be allowed to pay no heed to any pedestrians who get in the way, especially near colleges.
hummm yes, this could be problematic. On one hand we have a unionized employee of a public utility transporting non privileged non drivers in an environmentally friendly fashion vs pedestrians.

On the other we have someone operating tons of steel and therefore in a position of power over both the pedestrians and the bus passengers.

I'll have to think on this and come up with a way to pin any conflict on old white guys.
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Old 9th December 2012, 09:28 AM   #2176
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Holy crap, I fear my head may explode from reading the pretentious twaddle over there. Oy veh.
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Old 12th December 2012, 01:23 AM   #2177
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
They already tried that. First they had a map that you could pin your location to then they had that thread where they all whined about how difficult they had it. Remember ? Boo Hoo, I'm gifted, Waaaaa, the buttons on my blouse make it easier for men to undress me.

Anybody see how they took down uncomplicatedblossom ? First, possibly the stupidest mod action I've ever seen then a pile on defending the mod action. It triggered the heck out SF yet, the SJWs, soldiered on to thread lock.

What a bunch of alpha hotels
Aw man. Apparently that thread's gone down the memory hole.
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Old 12th December 2012, 11:12 AM   #2178
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Originally Posted by UnrepentantSinner View Post
Aw man. Apparently that thread's gone down the memory hole.
Hopefully somebody on the Slymepit caught it before it vanished - it was a classic. But I perused a few threads while looking to see if that one had been shifted again, and I have to say: though the Aplussers accuse everybody else of being "haters", I have never seen such a concentration of bile, furious resentment, and downright endemic hatred as on that forum.
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Old 12th December 2012, 01:00 PM   #2179
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Originally Posted by zooterkin View Post
Wow. That's vicious. I'm trying to put my finger on exactly what it's reminding me of; Animal Farm, possibly.
Speaking of, All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others, check this out.

Quote:
Subterfuge wrote:What does my being here a long or a short time have to do with my equal right as a member to discuss an issue of "politics and current affairs?"


That's a very admirable misinterpretation, right there. What you were told is that you're a newcomer, so you don't have any say in whether you're an insider or an outsider in the community here. Sorry, that's just not how social dynamics work. Your "rights" are entirely irrelevant.
From their No Labels thread, where they're getting their collective asses kicked by a poster named subterfuge and responding in the only way they know how when they're wrong.

Respect My Authoritah!
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Old 12th December 2012, 01:06 PM   #2180
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Originally Posted by UnrepentantSinner View Post
Aw man. Apparently that thread's gone down the memory hole.
It appears it has and......I'm wondering.....if a nurse can commit suicide over a prank call, what are the chances that someone could act in a similar fashion after being tortured by "allies" in a supposed "safe space".
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Old 12th December 2012, 05:59 PM   #2181
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Originally Posted by Stout View Post
It appears it has and......I'm wondering.....if a nurse can commit suicide over a prank call, what are the chances that someone could act in a similar fashion after being tortured by "allies" in a supposed "safe space".
That is a whole other level of dodgy.

The google cache (can't post urls but google "Great letter Kassiane" and look at the cached version) shows that at least one (and I know there were more as I read the thread) of simpleflower's posts have been removed from that thread and the whole thing neatly "airbrushed" so that the thread was simply split into a support thread for simpleflower. Despite the fact that it was placed in "forum matters", rather than "help and support." And then deleted anyway.

This kerfuffle was simpleflower's last post on the forum.
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Old 12th December 2012, 06:03 PM   #2182
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Originally Posted by Hillbert View Post
That is a whole other level of dodgy.

The google cache (can't post urls but google "Great letter Kassiane" and look at the cached version) shows that at least one (and I know there were more as I read the thread) of simpleflower's posts have been removed from that thread and the whole thing neatly "airbrushed" so that the thread was simply split into a support thread for simpleflower. Despite the fact that it was placed in "forum matters", rather than "help and support." And then deleted anyway.

This kerfuffle was simpleflower's last post on the forum.

Here's the link to the cached copy, while it's still up:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...9%26start%3D25
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Old 12th December 2012, 06:07 PM   #2183
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
Here's the link to the cached copy, while it's still up:

*snip*
Thanks, the very last post there is the one which kicked it all off. Simpleflower accepting a hug on someone else's support page.

That post is the first among many removed from current version of that page.
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Old 12th December 2012, 06:29 PM   #2184
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Originally Posted by Hillbert View Post
That is a whole other level of dodgy.

The google cache (can't post urls but google "Great letter Kassiane" and look at the cached version) shows that at least one (and I know there were more as I read the thread) of simpleflower's posts have been removed from that thread and the whole thing neatly "airbrushed" so that the thread was simply split into a support thread for simpleflower. Despite the fact that it was placed in "forum matters", rather than "help and support." And then deleted anyway.

This kerfuffle was simpleflower's last post on the forum.
It was originally in H&S, but they moved it when it things blew up. Dunno why they deleted it. Maybe so they could deny anything like that ever happened should they need to ?
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Old 12th December 2012, 11:38 PM   #2185
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Originally Posted by Hillbert View Post
That is a whole other level of dodgy.

The google cache (can't post urls but google "Great letter Kassiane" and look at the cached version) shows that at least one (and I know there were more as I read the thread) of simpleflower's posts have been removed from that thread and the whole thing neatly "airbrushed" so that the thread was simply split into a support thread for simpleflower. Despite the fact that it was placed in "forum matters", rather than "help and support." And then deleted anyway.

This kerfuffle was simpleflower's last post on the forum.
Ooh, I know you. You're the poster wot dared to tone police a mod. I loved that response to your post. Didn't it just reek of "Oooooh, I'm telling!", just in case the mods missed it?
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Old 12th December 2012, 11:53 PM   #2186
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Here's something else:

Perhaps, Dillahunty has some 'splainin to do. I was listening to nonprophets (http://www.nonprophetsradio.com/audi...ets%2011.2.mp3) and Matt questioned the wisdom of calling the party "the atheist party" since it implies that atheists are all aligned when it comes to politics.

And yet, Atheism+ is ok?

I dont understand. Im sure Matt has some sort of reasoning, but I cant see it.
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Old 12th December 2012, 11:58 PM   #2187
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Originally Posted by devnull View Post
Here's something else:

Perhaps, Dillahunty has some 'splainin to do. I was listening to nonprophets (http://www.nonprophetsradio.com/audi...ets%2011.2.mp3) and Matt questioned the wisdom of calling the party "the atheist party" since it implies that atheists are all aligned when it comes to politics.

And yet, Atheism+ is ok?

I dont understand. Im sure Matt has some sort of reasoning, but I cant see it.

Wait, wasn't Matt banned from the A+ forum? Is he back in?

ETA: Or are you saying that he still supports whatever "Atheism+" is supposed to stand for, in which case I agree his statements may be contradictory.
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Old 13th December 2012, 12:01 AM   #2188
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And what's with all the "Hugs, if you want them". I guess they are so sensitive and inclusive that they have taken into consideration that not everyone wants a hug, or that some people might actually have hugaphobia or hug immuno-deficiency and could be upset by or even physically harmed by a virtual hug.

Now if someone was still a member there, it'd probably be a good idea to post a thread suggesting that "Hugs, Tricky!" be put in TW tags in case some members are hug intolerant.
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Old 13th December 2012, 12:01 AM   #2189
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
Wait, wasn't Matt banned from the A+ forum? Is he back in?
I dont know, but he did a video afterwards (from memory) that basically said that the forum wasnt the movement, and the movement is AOK with him.

I dont know how you get from atheism to, for example, feminism. Matt made a similar point about the Atheist Party.

Meh.
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Old 13th December 2012, 12:08 AM   #2190
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Originally Posted by devnull View Post
I dont know, but he did a video afterwards (from memory) that basically said that the forum wasnt the movement, and the movement is AOK with him.

I dont know how you get from atheism to, for example, feminism. Matt made a similar point about the Atheist Party.

Meh.
OK, got it, thanks. I'm a fan, so I'd like to have him clarify his position as well.
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Old 13th December 2012, 01:28 AM   #2191
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
OK, got it, thanks. I'm a fan, so I'd like to have him clarify his position as well.
Oh, dont get me wrong - I love Matt.

I wish he'd stop saying "supposably" though
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Old 13th December 2012, 01:58 AM   #2192
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
Here's the link to the cached copy, while it's still up:

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...9%26start%3D25
That links to the original thread, that simpleflower's post was split from.

What struck me as ironic was that, from memory, the thread split was ostensibly to enable it to be a support thread for simpleflower, yet everyone continued to attack him/her/zie/zir/xie.


ETA: Pretty much what Hilbert said, already.
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Old 13th December 2012, 05:31 AM   #2193
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Ooh, I know you. You're the poster wot dared to tone police a mod. I loved that response to your post. Didn't it just reek of "Oooooh, I'm telling!", just in case the mods missed it?
shhh, they'll hear

anyway, apparently questioning the actions of a mod, in a thread created for that specific purpose, is tone trolling.

That whole thing was a bit odd, a one week ban for a first post which wasn't abusive, obscene or spam. It seemed excessive so it's obvious it was done because they thought the poster was going to be a problem and on that basis I can understand why they did it. Don't necessarily agree with it, but understandable. It's just the dishonesty behind the explanations for it.

It's quite frustrating as I'm fairly left wing myself and I agree with a lot of the objectives of Atheism+ (probably all to be honest) but the whole language and culture of social justice as a group is just off putting, needlessly divisive, opaque and does not lend itself to discussion.

I disagree on a fundamental level more with libertarians but I find it just as easy to debate with them as I do with people whose politics are very similar to my own.
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Old 13th December 2012, 08:22 AM   #2194
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Originally Posted by zooterkin View Post
That links to the original thread, that simpleflower's post was split from.

What struck me as ironic was that, from memory, the thread split was ostensibly to enable it to be a support thread for simpleflower, yet everyone continued to attack him/her/zie/zir/xie.


ETA: Pretty much what Hilbert said, already.
Wow! You are so August, man! The Pronoun of the Month: Xe

Xe is not just gender neutral, but it is also "Trans Inclusive".
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Old 13th December 2012, 08:54 AM   #2195
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
Wow! You are so August, man! The Pronoun of the Month: Xe

Xe is not just gender neutral, but it is also "Trans Inclusive".

This just makes me wonder what is wrong with "them".
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Old 13th December 2012, 09:06 AM   #2196
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Originally Posted by UnrepentantSinner View Post
Aw man. Apparently that thread's gone down the memory hole.
If you mean the split one where the mods pile up on simpleflower someone on the anti-A+ reddit page has screencapped it here.

Originally Posted by Stout View Post
Speaking of, All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others, check this out.

From their No Labels thread, where they're getting their collective asses kicked by a poster named subterfuge and responding in the only way they know how when they're wrong.

Respect My Authoritah!
Linky to the thread mentioned.

On topic argument wise I think neither side is doing a good job. The part of the argument you highlighted, the one about subterfuge specifically, does reflect badly on the more popular A+ers. But then as time has shown, that's not hard to do.
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Old 13th December 2012, 11:51 PM   #2197
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Originally Posted by Wildy View Post
If you mean the split one where the mods pile up on simpleflower someone on the anti-A+ reddit page has screencapped it here.



Linky to the thread mentioned.

On topic argument wise I think neither side is doing a good job. The part of the argument you highlighted, the one about subterfuge specifically, does reflect badly on the more popular A+ers. But then as time has shown, that's not hard to do.
What's amazing about that thread is that Subterfuge has managed to actually not-quite-convert Wind, but at least get xe ( ) away from trying to pigeonhole a debating opponent and discuss things that are actually said rather than assumptions, and the thread actually proceeded to a rather unsophisticated* political conversation. It seems that Ceepolk (a Global Moderator - probably because xe (sic) was the first one silly enough to ask for the job) hasn't quite noticed that and is still back on page two wanting to belittle Subterfuge, and looks like itching to bring down the ban hammer... for having a differing political stance/affiliation than Ceepolk and the other cool kids!!! (Credit to SubMor who seems to have figured it out. Ceepolk is acting like a total douche, though and still has a couple of sycophants in line.)

It's a farkin' political thread. Ceepolk wants to moderate his (Subterfuge has identified HIMself as a male) beliefs and thoughts? Do they not recognize what this is all about?

*Subterfuge is 34 and is pretty wrong-headed about a few things, e.g. seems unable to separate fiscal liberalism/conservatism from socio-political. What's more surprising is that there's no one on the more left side who actually seems to know what they're (xe're?) talking about. We have better-informed conversations about politics in the Forum Community section here than they have in the Politics section!
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Old 14th December 2012, 08:51 AM   #2198
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I always find interesting that a group of people create such an innate set of new words (xe, xor, axxhole, etc) that so few people know the meaning in order to create a social justice movement that will take over the world. The level of self importance and political correctness is astounding.

This seems more and more like one of those "clubs" that anyone can create on any subject in university. I'd bet that most of the mods in A+ forum are either university students with small course loads or certainly no one with a mortgage, kids and a life.

Following the schism on twitter, now Shermer has piped in which put PZ and Ophilia in a tizzy. It would be funny if it was not so sad.
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Old 16th December 2012, 02:24 AM   #2199
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Originally Posted by Foolmewunz View Post
What's amazing about that thread is that Subterfuge has managed to actually not-quite-convert Wind, but at least get xe ( ) away from trying to pigeonhole a debating opponent and discuss things that are actually said rather than assumptions, and the thread actually proceeded to a rather unsophisticated* political conversation. It seems that Ceepolk (a Global Moderator - probably because xe (sic) was the first one silly enough to ask for the job) hasn't quite noticed that and is still back on page two wanting to belittle Subterfuge, and looks like itching to bring down the ban hammer... for having a differing political stance/affiliation than Ceepolk and the other cool kids!!! (Credit to SubMor who seems to have figured it out. Ceepolk is acting like a total douche, though and still has a couple of sycophants in line.)

It's a farkin' political thread. Ceepolk wants to moderate his (Subterfuge has identified HIMself as a male) beliefs and thoughts? Do they not recognize what this is all about?

*Subterfuge is 34 and is pretty wrong-headed about a few things, e.g. seems unable to separate fiscal liberalism/conservatism from socio-political. What's more surprising is that there's no one on the more left side who actually seems to know what they're (xe're?) talking about. We have better-informed conversations about politics in the Forum Community section here than they have in the Politics section!
What's funny about gender-neutral pronouns when referring to gender-neutral people?

I'm wind over there, btw.
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Old 16th December 2012, 02:41 AM   #2200
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I think it's because the invented pronouns look stupid.
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