The prophecies of Ama - Page 9

jond · 16th December 2012, 05:51 AM

Not that it will do any good, but: PC do yourself a fair and read Festinger's "When Proohecy Fails." Then look in the mirror.

tsig · 16th December 2012, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by Astreja

Aristeo, that is complete and utter nonsense. There is absolutely no evidence that "previous lives" are even possible. Humans do not retain their sense of self when they are unconscious, and they can have no 'self' whatsoever when they die. The idea of a "soul" is pure mythology.

False. There is no evidence for the entity you call 'God'; therefore, we can "know" nothing about it. At most, you can believe; you cannot truly know.

There shall be no Judgment Day... Ever. I've cancelled it.

They were never there in the first place. There are just the living and the dead.

You mean that all those good works for Jesus went for nothing? Oh well, looks like I got some catching up to do.

(tsig dons sinful clothes and heads out for the nearest den of sin)

tsig · 16th December 2012, 09:45 AM

Originally Posted by fromdownunder

Jeez, who died and made you God?

Norm

Careful, she'll turn you into a newt and you won't get better.

Croak, croak.

Rincewind · 16th December 2012, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by tsig

Careful, she'll turn you into a newt and you won't get better.

Croak, croak.

Well, I got better...

tsig · 16th December 2012, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by Rincewind

Well, I got better...

So you say, no one knows you're a newt on the internet.

Rincewind · 16th December 2012, 02:03 PM

Originally Posted by tsig

So you say, no one knows you're a newt on the internet.

MIKILLINI · 16th December 2012, 07:37 PM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

Maria Liwayway Alvaran or Ka Apaz, according to Ama, has previous lives. She is reincarnated.

I think that is logically correct. We know that nothing is impossible to God. God can make a soul to be reborn in another human being. According to Ama, now, I think, most people will not be reincarnated. When they die, they will just wait until Judgment Day comes when they will receive their sentence. So change now for the better while still alive for there maybe no second chance anymore. Ama said that what is the purpose of a person being reborn if he is good now, he may become worse because of the environment. He asked whether the world is getting better (morally) or not wherein the listeners replied that it is getting worse. Just think, in Noah’s time, God annihilated everyone except Noah and his family. The population of this world will decline until there will be just a few people left on this earth. Imagine, from about seven billion people at present to just a handful in about two hundred years! Where have all the souls gone?

A "guess" is really a guess with claims like these. The only conclusion to be gathered here depicts Ama as a "guesstures" prophet.

Multivac · 17th December 2012, 04:58 AM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

Maria Liwayway Alvaran or Ka Apaz, according to Ama, has previous lives. She is reincarnated.

I think that is logically correct. We know that nothing is impossible to God.

How do we know this. God does not exist, so god can't do anything at all.

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

God can make a soul to be reborn in another human being.

Do you have any proof of this? I know it's a silly question, but the optimist in me thinks it's worth asking anyway.

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

According to Ama, now, I think, most people will not be reincarnated. When they die, they will just wait until Judgment Day comes when they will receive their sentence. So change now for the better while still alive for there maybe no second chance anymore. Ama said that what is the purpose of a person being reborn if he is good now, he may become worse because of the environment.

Why does there have to a purpose?

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

He asked whether the world is getting better (morally) or not wherein the listeners replied that it is getting worse. Just think, in Noah’s time, God annihilated everyone except Noah and his family.

You cannot seriously believe this? That every single human being on the planet is descended from Noah?

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

The population of this world will decline until there will be just a few people left on this earth. Imagine, from about seven billion people at present to just a handful in about two hundred years! Where have all the souls gone?

Can you prove that souls exist?

Akhenaten · 17th December 2012, 05:33 AM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

Originally Posted by Akhenaten

Links to your own past (and present) beliefs show nothing more than the long-term nature of the present Poe/delusion.

Do you really think, at this stage of the game, that people are going to take them any more serwiously than that?

Trust me, none of these people, nor the events involving them, were needed to demonstrate the current prevalence of insanity.

All of the evidence required to make such a case is much closer at hand.

This is quite obviously and demonstrably completely wrong.

And yet here you are referring to them without offering any background information because you believe that everyone knows exactly what you're talking about.

Your "if" seems to be lacking a "then".

As ever.

I wrote in the webpage that if the attacks by madmen happened to an ordinary person, most likely, they will not make into the international headlines. How is it “quite obviously and demonstrably completely wrong”?

Does it ever occur to you on any level and if so, having occurred to you, does it bother you at all that your disdain for paying us the courtesy of learning how to quote properly results in the daft responses that you provide being doubly meaningless due to there being no apparent link between them and the posts that you are purporting to answer?

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

I wrote quoting from the webpage:

There's your first problem.

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

But if it involves mass and indiscriminate killings which is extraordinary, they it could, like the ‘Hamburger Massacre’, ‘Dunblane Massacre’ and ‘Port Arthur Massacre’.”

You answered:
Your "if" seems to be lacking a "then".

As ever.

My reply:
Sorry but there was a typographical error. The ‘they’ should be ‘then’.

Cool.

We've progressed from meaningless drivel with a typo to just plain meaningless drivel.

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

Please read the webpage.

Please stop making ridiculous suggestions.

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

Do you believe that Jesus Christ ever existed here on earth?

See if you can figure it out.

halleyscomet · 17th December 2012, 06:21 AM

Originally Posted by LaurelHS

Why do you keep spamming these links to an audience who doesn't believe there is any truth in them?

More to the point, why is she or he continuing to spam links even when a good hunk of the forum has concluded she or he is a troll making this up?

This "Ama" doesn't even exist. It's a creative writing project, nothing more.

RatBoy · 17th December 2012, 07:19 AM

The prophecies of Ama... Ama what?

Will they eventually show us where is buried the treasure of amaweiner?

tsig · 17th December 2012, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by RatBoy

The prophecies of Ama... Ama what?

Will they eventually show us where is buried the treasure of amaweiner?

You'd have to be some kind of hot dog to find that.

halleyscomet · 17th December 2012, 09:35 AM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

There is a town in Laguna province called Pila. Please read http://aristean.org/wp085.htm titled “Taken from the Jews”.

Are any of the "sessions" on that site in English?

http://aristean.org/audioidx.htm

Astreja · 17th December 2012, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by halleyscomet

Are any of the "sessions" on that site in English?

Even if they were, it would be difficult to tell. I downloaded a few to attempt a voice analysis, but the recording quality was execrable. Try to imagine one person mumbling at the bottom of a barrel, followed by a group of people mumbling something else -- Darned near impossible to sort out the players on the field, let alone figure out what they're saying.

halleyscomet · 17th December 2012, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by Astreja

Even if they were, it would be difficult to tell. I downloaded a few to attempt a voice analysis, but the recording quality was execrable. Try to imagine one person mumbling at the bottom of a barrel, followed by a group of people mumbling something else -- Darned near impossible to sort out the players on the field, let alone figure out what they're saying.

So it sounded like a high quality RealAudio file.

godless dave · 17th December 2012, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

One of the 19 prophecies that Ama revealed on 1979-10-19 was “Disease of the brain, or insanity, will prevail in 1980, 1981 until 1988, especially in the three superpower countries.” Please read my write up on this at http://aristean.org/insanity.htm .

The latest is the killing of at least 27 people, including 20 children at Sandy Hook Elementary School, Newtown, Connecticut, USA, Friday morning, 2012-12-14.

2014. Not 1988.

PeaceCrusader · 17th December 2012, 09:18 PM

Originally Posted by godless dave

2014. Not 1988.

The prophecy of Ama said, “1980, 1981 until 1988.”

This is my answer to fromdownunder on 2012-12-15: ‘This is what I said If you only read the write up in http://aristean.org/insanity.htm , you would know that the end of insanity of man will not be until 1988 only. I wrote, “In about 1986, I asked the Holy Spirit if 1988 would be the ultimate, the final act of madness or insanity of man since the prophecy states ‘until 1988’. He replied in the negative. That is why even after 1988, we had cases of insanity committed by madmen. And we will continue to witness these.” ’

PeaceCrusader · 17th December 2012, 09:20 PM

Originally Posted by halleyscomet

Are any of the "sessions" on that site in English?

http://aristean.org/audioidx.htm

The sessions are in the Filipino language. But you may read the translation of some to English at http://aristean.org/sermon.htm .

Also, those in http://aristean.org/wpxxx.htm where xxx is from 001 to 119 are in English, some of them had info taken from the sessions with Ama, like when Jesus was 12 years old.

PeaceCrusader · 17th December 2012, 09:24 PM

Originally Posted by RatBoy

The prophecies of Ama... Ama what?

Will they eventually show us where is buried the treasure of amaweiner?

Ama is a spirit, a holy spirit. He uses the physical body of a woman in the Philippines. The name of the woman is Maria Liwayway Alvaran a.k.a. Ka Apaz. On 1979-10-19, Ama revealed the 19 prophecies that is being discussed here. More than 30 years have passed since they were revealed so we would know if they were fulfilled already or not.

What is that “treasure of amaweiner”? Ama said that nothing kept in secret that will not be revealed. For example, a person is murdered. Even though no human being witnessed the murder, God knows what happened. Even buried treasures.

gabeygoat · 17th December 2012, 10:41 PM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

What is that “treasure of amaweiner”?

I'm just glad that this thread led to this quote.

Astreja · 17th December 2012, 10:53 PM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

Ama is a spirit, a holy spirit.

There is no evidence whatsoever for spirits, "holy" or otherwise.

"Ama" is a proven failure as a prophet, too, as shown by a trail of dead and dying JREF threads. All of the extraordinary and time-specific prophesies failed utterly. Other pronouncements, such as those about insanity or disease, are simply too vague and open-ended to qualify as prophesies. I assert that, without a single exception, all of the prophesies spoken through the mouth of Maria Liwayway Alvaran were of 100% human origin, and that no gods or spirits had anything to do with them.

pakeha · 18th December 2012, 12:58 AM

Originally Posted by halleyscomet

So it sounded like a high quality RealAudio file.

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

...What is that “treasure of amaweiner”? ....

Originally Posted by gabeygoat

I'm just glad that this thread led to this quote.

Me, too.

Originally Posted by Astreja

There is no evidence whatsoever for spirits, "holy" or otherwise.

"Ama" is a proven failure as a prophet, too, as shown by a trail of dead and dying JREF threads. All of the extraordinary and time-specific prophesies failed utterly. Other pronouncements, such as those about insanity or disease, are simply too vague and open-ended to qualify as prophesies. I assert that, without a single exception, all of the prophesies spoken through the mouth of Maria Liwayway Alvaran were of 100% human origin, and that no gods or spirits had anything to do with them.

Of course you're right springyG.
The GOTACURAL prophecy is just the icing on the cake.

Maria Liwayway Alvaran is simply following a long tradition of con artists playing on the credulity and faith of their followers.
Check out the careers of 'psychic surgeons' both in the Philippines and in Mexico to see what they're capable of.

fromdownunder · 18th December 2012, 01:04 AM

Originally Posted by pakeha

Me, too.

Me three. This is one of the joys of responding to somebody who is totally innocent of humour.

Norm

pakeha · 18th December 2012, 01:10 AM

It's also why the antics of Maria Liwayway Alvaran are so obnoxious.
Her victims simply haven't a clue.

Resume · 18th December 2012, 04:44 AM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

Ama revealed the 19 prophecies that is being discussed here. More than 30 years have passed since they were revealed so we would know if they were fulfilled already or not.

The answer is not. So, are we done?

halleyscomet · 18th December 2012, 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

The sessions are in the Filipino language. But you may read the translation of some to English at http://aristean.org/sermon.htm .

Also, those in http://aristean.org/wpxxx.htm where xxx is from 001 to 119 are in English, some of them had info taken from the sessions with Ama, like when Jesus was 12 years old.

How do you reconcile your faith with the complete lack of predictions that have come true?

Dr.Sid · 18th December 2012, 08:05 AM

What does she says about December 21st, 2012 ? Just curious ..

Frank Merton · 18th December 2012, 08:11 AM

Originally Posted by Dr.Sid

What does she says about December 21st, 2012 ? Just curious ..

Gosh, that's right. Thanks for reminding me; three days to go.

jond · 18th December 2012, 08:15 AM

Originally Posted by Dr.Sid

What does she says about December 21st, 2012 ? Just curious ..

Or, for that matter, December 21st 1955. Here's a link to the wiki page about the book I mentioned before, "When Prophecy Fails." It's a fascinating book that details the circumstances around a doomsday prophecy from a UFO cult. The author had a few of his students infiltrate the group and document things. It's also the book that gave us the term "cognitive dissonance."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails

Tolls · 18th December 2012, 08:27 AM

Originally Posted by Resume

The answer is not. So, are we done?

We were supposed to be done months ago with the whole Olympics farago...so I'm guessing not.

MIKILLINI · 18th December 2012, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

The prophecy of Ama said, “1980, 1981 until 1988.”

This is my answer to fromdownunder on 2012-12-15: ‘This is what I said If you only read the write up in http://aristean.org/insanity.htm , you would know that the end of insanity of man will not be until 1988 only. I wrote, “In about 1986, I asked the Holy Spirit if 1988 would be the ultimate, the final act of madness or insanity of man since the prophecy states ‘until 1988’. He replied in the negative. That is why even after 1988, we had cases of insanity committed by madmen. And we will continue to witness these.” ’

Wait...what? Let me get this straight; Ama told you there would be people creating insane "high profile" crimes until 1988? But when you asked again in 1986 about this 1988 prophecy, he said no because it will continue? That's not prophet-like. Did Ama say "Just never mind that I told you 1988 was the end of insanity?"

Mojo · 18th December 2012, 11:48 AM

Originally Posted by MIKILLINI

Wait...what? Let me get this straight; Ama told you there would be people creating insane "high profile" crimes until 1988? But when you asked again in 1986 about this 1988 prophecy, he said no because it will continue? That's not prophet-like. Did Ama say "Just never mind that I told you 1988 was the end of insanity?"

Yes, even according to "Ama", the prophecy was wrong.

MIKILLINI · 18th December 2012, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Mojo

Yes, even according to "Ama", the prophecy was wrong.

So Maria Liwayway Alvaran is a fraud and Peace Crusader is her delusional enabler trying to push this crap on people.

pakeha · 18th December 2012, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by jond

Or, for that matter, December 21st 1955. Here's a link to the wiki page about the book I mentioned before, "When Prophecy Fails." It's a fascinating book that details the circumstances around a doomsday prophecy from a UFO cult. The author had a few of his students infiltrate the group and document things. It's also the book that gave us the term "cognitive dissonance."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails

Thanks for the link!

Quote:

After the failure of the prediction, she (Dorothy Martin) left Chicago after being threatened with arrest and involuntary commitment. She later founded the Association of Sananda and Samat Kumara. Under the name Sister Thedra, she continued to practice channeling and to participate in contactee groups until her death in 1992. The Association is active to this day.

Whew! Good old Sanat Kumara^WP is still going strong among the channelers.
Once people believe they have access to a special pipeline o spirituality, they'll swallow anything.
So sad.

jond · 18th December 2012, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by pakeha

Thanks for the link!

Whew! Good old Sanat Kumara^WP is still going strong among the channelers.
Once people believe they have access to a special pipeline o spirituality, they'll swallow anything.
So sad.

Yup. The parallels are quite stunning. As is the response from the committed believer. Textbook, so to speak.

gabeygoat · 18th December 2012, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by jond

Or, for that matter, December 21st 1955. Here's a link to the wiki page about the book I mentioned before, "When Prophecy Fails." It's a fascinating book that details the circumstances around a doomsday prophecy from a UFO cult. The author had a few of his students infiltrate the group and document things. It's also the book that gave us the term "cognitive dissonance."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails

Per your advice, I grabbed this book from work the other day. It is indeed, a good read! Very 2nd page describes PC to a tee.

Nay_Sayer · 18th December 2012, 05:43 PM

I wonder if somewhere Maria Liwayway Alvaran is counting all the money swindled and having a good laugh.

PeaceCrusader · 18th December 2012, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by pakeha

Thanks for the link!

Whew! Good old Sanat Kumara^WP is still going strong among the channelers.
Once people believe they have access to a special pipeline o spirituality, they'll swallow anything.
So sad.

In 1985, Ama said that the number of tempters and deceivers on earth will become many more and dense who will lead astray, misteach, deceive and blind many, many people. Many will spread the rumor that this is the beginning of the end. This will spread and many will claim that he is god, or God is in him, or he is inspired by God, or he is the messenger of God, and many will believe that will truly lead them astray. This is a warning or advice: beware of false prophets because we will not be saved by borrowed faith.

Remember, beware of false prophets who will give us borrowed faith, meaning, faith that did not come from within us but commanded to us, or told to or directed, imposed, dictated or compelled upon us by our fellowmen. We will not be saved this way. We must focus our faith in God, the only true God, who gave us our life, not through faith in Him as commanded by our fellowmen but believe and have faith in Him in our heart because of His being God and we are His creation.

The above came from http://aristean.org/sermon005.htm titled “Beware of false prophets”.

PeaceCrusader · 18th December 2012, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by Nay_Sayer

I wonder if somewhere Maria Liwayway Alvaran is counting all the money swindled and having a good laugh.

There are only about 60 members in my list from maybe 1970 to present, verified last 2012-05. A fourth, or 15 members, had already died. Seven are overseas, mostly in the US. Those who go regularly to Maria Liwayway Alvaran’s or Ka Apaz’ place in Baliwag on Sundays may only be about three. Those in the Philippines go to Baliwag during special occasions, such as Ka Apaz’ birthday, birth of Jesus on May 23, death of Jesus on August 17, and January 7, the anniversary of Ama’s first appropriation of Ka Apaz’ physical body in 1957. Some members also come for the “Pasyon” during Holy Week.

How much money do you think would be have been contributed by members? Did you know that Ka Apaz is blind in both eyes? Did you know that some glass panels in the jalousie windows of her room in the Session House are missing? Did you know that some of her children and their families still live in the old house? Did you know that electricity was cut-off from the Session House and the old house more than ten years ago? Until now, it has not been reconnected yet.

LaurelHS · 18th December 2012, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader

In 1985, Ama said that the number of tempters and deceivers on earth will become many more and dense who will lead astray, misteach, deceive and blind many, many people.

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black!

16th December 2012, 05:51 AM	#321
jond Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,410	Not that it will do any good, but: PC do yourself a fair and read Festinger's "When Proohecy Fails." Then look in the mirror.
jond Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,410

16th December 2012, 07:37 PM	#327
MIKILLINI Incromulent Logic Join Date: May 2007 Location: The Illini State Posts: 2,869	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader Maria Liwayway Alvaran or Ka Apaz, according to Ama, has previous lives. She is reincarnated. I think that is logically correct. We know that nothing is impossible to God. God can make a soul to be reborn in another human being. According to Ama, now, I think, most people will not be reincarnated. When they die, they will just wait until Judgment Day comes when they will receive their sentence. So change now for the better while still alive for there maybe no second chance anymore. Ama said that what is the purpose of a person being reborn if he is good now, he may become worse because of the environment. He asked whether the world is getting better (morally) or not wherein the listeners replied that it is getting worse. Just think, in Noah’s time, God annihilated everyone except Noah and his family. The population of this world will decline until there will be just a few people left on this earth. Imagine, from about seven billion people at present to just a handful in about two hundred years! Where have all the souls gone? A "guess" is really a guess with claims like these. The only conclusion to be gathered here depicts Ama as a "guesstures" prophet.
	__________________ Attempting to build a case without evidence is just another day spent with no use of common sense. The conspiracist is not merely illogical: he assaults logic.~ Pomeroo Sylvia Browne is not a medium, she's a mediocre. Last edited by MIKILLINI; 16th December 2012 at 07:39 PM.

17th December 2012, 05:33 AM	#329
Akhenaten Heretic Pharaoh Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Pi-Broadford, Australia Posts: 24,641	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader Originally Posted by Akhenaten Links to your own past (and present) beliefs show nothing more than the long-term nature of the present Poe/delusion. Do you really think, at this stage of the game, that people are going to take them any more serwiously than that? Trust me, none of these people, nor the events involving them, were needed to demonstrate the current prevalence of insanity. All of the evidence required to make such a case is much closer at hand. This is quite obviously and demonstrably completely wrong. And yet here you are referring to them without offering any background information because you believe that everyone knows exactly what you're talking about. Your "if" seems to be lacking a "then". As ever. I wrote in the webpage that if the attacks by madmen happened to an ordinary person, most likely, they will not make into the international headlines. How is it “quite obviously and demonstrably completely wrong”? Does it ever occur to you on any level and if so, having occurred to you, does it bother you at all that your disdain for paying us the courtesy of learning how to quote properly results in the daft responses that you provide being doubly meaningless due to there being no apparent link between them and the posts that you are purporting to answer? Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader I wrote quoting from the webpage: There's your first problem. Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader But if it involves mass and indiscriminate killings which is extraordinary, they it could, like the ‘Hamburger Massacre’, ‘Dunblane Massacre’ and ‘Port Arthur Massacre’.” You answered: Your "if" seems to be lacking a "then". As ever. My reply: Sorry but there was a typographical error. The ‘they’ should be ‘then’. Cool. We've progressed from meaningless drivel with a typo to just plain meaningless drivel. Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader Please read the webpage. Please stop making ridiculous suggestions. Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader Do you believe that Jesus Christ ever existed here on earth? See if you can figure it out.
	__________________ Life is mostly Froth and Bubble - Adam Lindsay Gordon The Australasian Skeptics Forum

17th December 2012, 07:19 AM	#331
RatBoy Thinker Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 125	The prophecies of Ama... Ama what? Will they eventually show us where is buried the treasure of amaweiner?
RatBoy Thinker Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 125

17th December 2012, 12:43 PM	#336
godless dave Great Dalmuti Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: St. Paul, Minnesota Posts: 6,123	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader One of the 19 prophecies that Ama revealed on 1979-10-19 was “Disease of the brain, or insanity, will prevail in 1980, 1981 until 1988, especially in the three superpower countries.” Please read my write up on this at http://aristean.org/insanity.htm . The latest is the killing of at least 27 people, including 20 children at Sandy Hook Elementary School, Newtown, Connecticut, USA, Friday morning, 2012-12-14. 2014. Not 1988.
	__________________ "If it's real, then it gets more interesting the closer you examine it. If it's not real, just the opposite is true." - aggle-rithm

16th December 2012, 09:43 AM	#322
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,671	Originally Posted by Astreja Aristeo, that is complete and utter nonsense. There is absolutely no evidence that "previous lives" are even possible. Humans do not retain their sense of self when they are unconscious, and they can have no 'self' whatsoever when they die. The idea of a "soul" is pure mythology. False. There is no evidence for the entity you call 'God'; therefore, we can "know" nothing about it. At most, you can believe; you cannot truly know. There shall be no Judgment Day... Ever. I've cancelled it. They were never there in the first place. There are just the living and the dead. You mean that all those good works for Jesus went for nothing? Oh well, looks like I got some catching up to do. (tsig dons sinful clothes and heads out for the nearest den of sin)

16th December 2012, 09:45 AM	#323
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,671	Originally Posted by fromdownunder Jeez, who died and made you God? Norm Careful, she'll turn you into a newt and you won't get better. Croak, croak.

16th December 2012, 12:08 PM	#324
Rincewind Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,161	Originally Posted by tsig Careful, she'll turn you into a newt and you won't get better. Croak, croak. Well, I got better...

16th December 2012, 12:34 PM	#325
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,671	Originally Posted by Rincewind Well, I got better... So you say, no one knows you're a newt on the internet.

16th December 2012, 02:03 PM	#326
Rincewind Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 1,161	Originally Posted by tsig So you say, no one knows you're a newt on the internet.

17th December 2012, 04:58 AM	#328
Multivac Graduate Poster Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 1,931	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader Maria Liwayway Alvaran or Ka Apaz, according to Ama, has previous lives. She is reincarnated. I think that is logically correct. We know that nothing is impossible to God. How do we know this. God does not exist, so god can't do anything at all. Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader God can make a soul to be reborn in another human being. Do you have any proof of this? I know it's a silly question, but the optimist in me thinks it's worth asking anyway. Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader According to Ama, now, I think, most people will not be reincarnated. When they die, they will just wait until Judgment Day comes when they will receive their sentence. So change now for the better while still alive for there maybe no second chance anymore. Ama said that what is the purpose of a person being reborn if he is good now, he may become worse because of the environment. Why does there have to a purpose? Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader He asked whether the world is getting better (morally) or not wherein the listeners replied that it is getting worse. Just think, in Noah’s time, God annihilated everyone except Noah and his family. You cannot seriously believe this? That every single human being on the planet is descended from Noah? Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader The population of this world will decline until there will be just a few people left on this earth. Imagine, from about seven billion people at present to just a handful in about two hundred years! Where have all the souls gone? Can you prove that souls exist?

17th December 2012, 06:21 AM	#330
halleyscomet Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 399	Originally Posted by LaurelHS Why do you keep spamming these links to an audience who doesn't believe there is any truth in them? More to the point, why is she or he continuing to spam links even when a good hunk of the forum has concluded she or he is a troll making this up? This "Ama" doesn't even exist. It's a creative writing project, nothing more.

17th December 2012, 09:24 AM	#332
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,671	Originally Posted by RatBoy The prophecies of Ama... Ama what? Will they eventually show us where is buried the treasure of amaweiner? You'd have to be some kind of hot dog to find that.

17th December 2012, 09:35 AM	#333
halleyscomet Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 399	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader There is a town in Laguna province called Pila. Please read http://aristean.org/wp085.htm titled “Taken from the Jews”. Are any of the "sessions" on that site in English? http://aristean.org/audioidx.htm

17th December 2012, 12:19 PM	#334
Astreja Springy Goddess Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Winnipeg, Canada Posts: 971	Originally Posted by halleyscomet Are any of the "sessions" on that site in English? Even if they were, it would be difficult to tell. I downloaded a few to attempt a voice analysis, but the recording quality was execrable. Try to imagine one person mumbling at the bottom of a barrel, followed by a group of people mumbling something else -- Darned near impossible to sort out the players on the field, let alone figure out what they're saying.

17th December 2012, 12:27 PM	#335
halleyscomet Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 399	Originally Posted by Astreja Even if they were, it would be difficult to tell. I downloaded a few to attempt a voice analysis, but the recording quality was execrable. Try to imagine one person mumbling at the bottom of a barrel, followed by a group of people mumbling something else -- Darned near impossible to sort out the players on the field, let alone figure out what they're saying. So it sounded like a high quality RealAudio file.

17th December 2012, 09:18 PM	#337
PeaceCrusader Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 955	Originally Posted by godless dave 2014. Not 1988. The prophecy of Ama said, “1980, 1981 until 1988.” This is my answer to fromdownunder on 2012-12-15: ‘This is what I said If you only read the write up in http://aristean.org/insanity.htm , you would know that the end of insanity of man will not be until 1988 only. I wrote, “In about 1986, I asked the Holy Spirit if 1988 would be the ultimate, the final act of madness or insanity of man since the prophecy states ‘until 1988’. He replied in the negative. That is why even after 1988, we had cases of insanity committed by madmen. And we will continue to witness these.” ’
PeaceCrusader Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 955

17th December 2012, 09:20 PM	#338
PeaceCrusader Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 955	Originally Posted by halleyscomet Are any of the "sessions" on that site in English? http://aristean.org/audioidx.htm The sessions are in the Filipino language. But you may read the translation of some to English at http://aristean.org/sermon.htm . Also, those in http://aristean.org/wpxxx.htm where xxx is from 001 to 119 are in English, some of them had info taken from the sessions with Ama, like when Jesus was 12 years old.
PeaceCrusader Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 955

17th December 2012, 09:24 PM	#339
PeaceCrusader Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 955	Originally Posted by RatBoy The prophecies of Ama... Ama what? Will they eventually show us where is buried the treasure of amaweiner? Ama is a spirit, a holy spirit. He uses the physical body of a woman in the Philippines. The name of the woman is Maria Liwayway Alvaran a.k.a. Ka Apaz. On 1979-10-19, Ama revealed the 19 prophecies that is being discussed here. More than 30 years have passed since they were revealed so we would know if they were fulfilled already or not. What is that “treasure of amaweiner”? Ama said that nothing kept in secret that will not be revealed. For example, a person is murdered. Even though no human being witnessed the murder, God knows what happened. Even buried treasures.
PeaceCrusader Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 955

17th December 2012, 10:41 PM	#340
gabeygoat Muse Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Hard Corvallis, Oregon Posts: 667	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader What is that “treasure of amaweiner”? I'm just glad that this thread led to this quote.

17th December 2012, 10:53 PM	#341
Astreja Springy Goddess Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Winnipeg, Canada Posts: 971	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader Ama is a spirit, a holy spirit. There is no evidence whatsoever for spirits, "holy" or otherwise. "Ama" is a proven failure as a prophet, too, as shown by a trail of dead and dying JREF threads. All of the extraordinary and time-specific prophesies failed utterly. Other pronouncements, such as those about insanity or disease, are simply too vague and open-ended to qualify as prophesies. I assert that, without a single exception, all of the prophesies spoken through the mouth of Maria Liwayway Alvaran were of 100% human origin, and that no gods or spirits had anything to do with them.

18th December 2012, 12:58 AM	#342
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,968	Originally Posted by halleyscomet So it sounded like a high quality RealAudio file. Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader ...What is that “treasure of amaweiner”? .... Originally Posted by gabeygoat I'm just glad that this thread led to this quote. Me, too. Originally Posted by Astreja There is no evidence whatsoever for spirits, "holy" or otherwise. "Ama" is a proven failure as a prophet, too, as shown by a trail of dead and dying JREF threads. All of the extraordinary and time-specific prophesies failed utterly. Other pronouncements, such as those about insanity or disease, are simply too vague and open-ended to qualify as prophesies. I assert that, without a single exception, all of the prophesies spoken through the mouth of Maria Liwayway Alvaran were of 100% human origin, and that no gods or spirits had anything to do with them. Of course you're right springyG. The GOTACURAL prophecy is just the icing on the cake. Maria Liwayway Alvaran is simply following a long tradition of con artists playing on the credulity and faith of their followers. Check out the careers of 'psychic surgeons' both in the Philippines and in Mexico to see what they're capable of.
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,968

18th December 2012, 01:04 AM	#343
fromdownunder Illuminator Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 3,091	Originally Posted by pakeha Me, too. Me three. This is one of the joys of responding to somebody who is totally innocent of humour. Norm

18th December 2012, 01:10 AM	#344
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,968	It's also why the antics of Maria Liwayway Alvaran are so obnoxious. Her victims simply haven't a clue.
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,968

18th December 2012, 04:44 AM	#345
Resume Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 8,015	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader Ama revealed the 19 prophecies that is being discussed here. More than 30 years have passed since they were revealed so we would know if they were fulfilled already or not. The answer is not. So, are we done?
Resume Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 8,015

18th December 2012, 07:57 AM	#346
halleyscomet Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 399	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader The sessions are in the Filipino language. But you may read the translation of some to English at http://aristean.org/sermon.htm . Also, those in http://aristean.org/wpxxx.htm where xxx is from 001 to 119 are in English, some of them had info taken from the sessions with Ama, like when Jesus was 12 years old. How do you reconcile your faith with the complete lack of predictions that have come true?

18th December 2012, 08:05 AM	#347
Dr.Sid Critical Thinker Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 398	What does she says about December 21st, 2012 ? Just curious ..
Dr.Sid Critical Thinker Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 398

18th December 2012, 08:11 AM	#348
Frank Merton Critical Thinker Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Ho Chi Minh City, Vietnam Posts: 310	Originally Posted by Dr.Sid What does she says about December 21st, 2012 ? Just curious .. Gosh, that's right. Thanks for reminding me; three days to go.

18th December 2012, 08:15 AM	#349
jond Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,410	Originally Posted by Dr.Sid What does she says about December 21st, 2012 ? Just curious .. Or, for that matter, December 21st 1955. Here's a link to the wiki page about the book I mentioned before, "When Prophecy Fails." It's a fascinating book that details the circumstances around a doomsday prophecy from a UFO cult. The author had a few of his students infiltrate the group and document things. It's also the book that gave us the term "cognitive dissonance." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails
jond Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,410

18th December 2012, 08:27 AM	#350
Tolls Graduate Poster Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,120	Originally Posted by Resume The answer is not. So, are we done? We were supposed to be done months ago with the whole Olympics farago...so I'm guessing not.
Tolls Graduate Poster Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,120

18th December 2012, 11:42 AM	#351
MIKILLINI Incromulent Logic Join Date: May 2007 Location: The Illini State Posts: 2,869	Originally Posted by PeaceCrusader The prophecy of Ama said, “1980, 1981 until 1988.” This is my answer to fromdownunder on 2012-12-15: ‘This is what I said If you only read the write up in http://aristean.org/insanity.htm , you would know that the end of insanity of man will not be until 1988 only. I wrote, “In about 1986, I asked the Holy Spirit if 1988 would be the ultimate, the final act of madness or insanity of man since the prophecy states ‘until 1988’. He replied in the negative. That is why even after 1988, we had cases of insanity committed by madmen. And we will continue to witness these.” ’ Wait...what? Let me get this straight; Ama told you there would be people creating insane "high profile" crimes until 1988? But when you asked again in 1986 about this 1988 prophecy, he said no because it will continue? That's not prophet-like. Did Ama say "Just never mind that I told you 1988 was the end of insanity?"
	__________________ Attempting to build a case without evidence is just another day spent with no use of common sense. The conspiracist is not merely illogical: he assaults logic.~ Pomeroo Sylvia Browne is not a medium, she's a mediocre. Last edited by MIKILLINI; 18th December 2012 at 11:44 AM.

18th December 2012, 11:48 AM	#352
Mojo Mostly harmless Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Nor Flanden Posts: 22,079	Originally Posted by MIKILLINI Wait...what? Let me get this straight; Ama told you there would be people creating insane "high profile" crimes until 1988? But when you asked again in 1986 about this 1988 prophecy, he said no because it will continue? That's not prophet-like. Did Ama say "Just never mind that I told you 1988 was the end of insanity?" Yes, even according to "Ama", the prophecy was wrong.
	__________________ "You got to use your brain." - McKinley Morganfield "The poor mystic homeopaths feel like petted house-cats thrown at high flood on the breaking ice." - Leon Trotsky

18th December 2012, 12:02 PM	#353
MIKILLINI Incromulent Logic Join Date: May 2007 Location: The Illini State Posts: 2,869	Originally Posted by Mojo Yes, even according to "Ama", the prophecy was wrong. So Maria Liwayway Alvaran is a fraud and Peace Crusader is her delusional enabler trying to push this crap on people.
	__________________ Attempting to build a case without evidence is just another day spent with no use of common sense. The conspiracist is not merely illogical: he assaults logic.~ Pomeroo Sylvia Browne is not a medium, she's a mediocre. Last edited by MIKILLINI; 18th December 2012 at 12:45 PM.

18th December 2012, 12:30 PM	#354
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,968	Originally Posted by jond Or, for that matter, December 21st 1955. Here's a link to the wiki page about the book I mentioned before, "When Prophecy Fails." It's a fascinating book that details the circumstances around a doomsday prophecy from a UFO cult. The author had a few of his students infiltrate the group and document things. It's also the book that gave us the term "cognitive dissonance." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/When_Prophecy_Fails Thanks for the link! Quote: After the failure of the prediction, she (Dorothy Martin) left Chicago after being threatened with arrest and involuntary commitment. She later founded the Association of Sananda and Samat Kumara. Under the name Sister Thedra, she continued to practice channeling and to participate in contactee groups until her death in 1992. The Association is active to this day. Whew! Good old Sanat Kumara^WP is still going strong among the channelers. Once people believe they have access to a special pipeline o spirituality, they'll swallow anything. So sad.
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,968

18th December 2012, 12:34 PM	#355
jond Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,410	Originally Posted by pakeha Thanks for the link! Whew! Good old Sanat Kumara^WP is still going strong among the channelers. Once people believe they have access to a special pipeline o spirituality, they'll swallow anything. So sad. Yup. The parallels are quite stunning. As is the response from the committed believer. Textbook, so to speak.
jond Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,410