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Old 16th December 2012, 07:25 PM   #1
12AX7
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Sickening Christian apologetics

Making it across Facebook is this turd from a Christian group. And it has several thousand likes and shares. I literally want to be sick.

Quote:
Twas' 11 days before Christmas, around 9:38 when 20 beautiful children stormed through heaven's gate. Their smiles were contagious, their laughter filled the air. They could hardly believe all the beauty they saw there. They were filled with such joy; they didn't know what to say. They remembered nothing of what had happened earlier that day. “where are we?" asked a little girl, as quiet as a mouse. “This is heaven" declared a small boy. "We’re spending Christmas at God's house”. When what to their wondering eyes did appear, but Jesus, their savior, the children gathered near. He looked at them and smiled, and they smiled just the same. Then He opened His arms and He called them by name. And in that moment was joy, that only heaven can bring those children all flew into the arms of their King and as they lingered in the warmth of His embrace, one small girl turned and looked at Jesus' face. And as if He could read all the questions she had He gently whispered to her, "I'll take care of mom and dad. “then He looked down on earth, the world far below He saw all of the hurt, the sorrow, and woe, then He closed His eyes and He outstretched His hand, “Let My power and presence re-enter this land! “May this country be delivered from the hands of fools” “I’m taking back my nation. I'm taking back my schools! “Then He and the children stood up without a sound. “Come now my children let me show you around. “Excitement filled the space, some skipped and some ran. All displaying enthusiasm that only a small child can. And I heard Him proclaim as He walked out of sight, “in the midst of this darkness,” I AM STILL THE LIGHT."
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Old 16th December 2012, 07:39 PM   #2
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Just the thought of little children and pedophile priests makes me want to puke, after all that has happened within that church how can anyone of them want to stand up for the god they worship. It blows my mind
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Old 16th December 2012, 07:49 PM   #3
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Wow, that's just sickening.
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Old 16th December 2012, 07:50 PM   #4
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On its face it's understandable that someone would want desperately to pretend this senseless insanity is a good thing, but it's also just as senseless, if far, far less tragic.

If it's such a good thing, why not say that their murderer was just making sure they didn't mess anything up later in their lives and end up in Hell? Maybe since he prevented a potential infinity of torture he's going to celebrate Christmas with them in Heaven? It makes me want to scream. If it's such a good thing then what the **** is the problem?

Last edited by Dog Breakfast; 16th December 2012 at 07:58 PM.
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Old 17th December 2012, 03:40 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Dog Breakfast View Post
... If it's such a good thing, why not say that their murderer was just making sure they didn't mess anything up later in their lives and end up in Hell?
Later in their lives?
Quote:
John Calvin: "There are babies a span long in hell."
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:04 AM   #6
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So the basic message is - "dead children - yay!"

I wonder if they actually thought about what they were typing before they typed it?
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:19 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Squeegee Beckenheim View Post
So the basic message is - "dead children - yay!"

I wonder if they actually thought about what they were typing before they typed it?
Personally, the message I got was that the guy who killed them should be lauded for doing God's work. He was just helping out. He's a hero.
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:32 AM   #8
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It's not just a bizarre message, it's really bad poetry.
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:36 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by comixman View Post
It's not just a bizarre message, it's really bad poetry.
There's that.
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:39 AM   #10
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I was browsing through some of the replies and what sounds like a sincere religious woman was making queries along the lines of "How could God allow such a thing to happen. I have doubts about a loving God watching over us." No one addressed her concerns and her message was drowned out in a flood of praises for God's glory.
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:41 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by comixman View Post
It's not just a bizarre message, it's really bad poetry.
This may be the understatement of the year.
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:48 AM   #12
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I don't understand why the King is complaining about what's going on down on Earth, when it is providing him with such bountiful supplies of delicious children.
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Old 17th December 2012, 05:53 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by Dog Breakfast View Post
On its face it's understandable that someone would want desperately to pretend this senseless insanity is a good thing,
Trying to make sense of a tragedy in terms of one's own religious beliefs is perfectly understandable. I totally get that. What I don't get is that nonsense about "taking back the schools".

I suppose if they taught Creationism, then the schools would forever have divine protection against crazy people with rifles?

Blech.
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Old 17th December 2012, 06:24 AM   #14
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I suppose it's to be expected, perhaps as some sort of coping mechanism. The tragic death of any child is often accompanied by statements like "God wanted another little angel in Heaven" or something similar...
These statements are simply feel-good sops which are not examined critically.
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Old 17th December 2012, 07:40 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Elypsis44 View Post
Making it across Facebook is this turd from a Christian group. And it has several thousand likes and shares. I literally want to be sick.
If that pops up in my timeline, I will see to it that I do all I can to physically hurt the person who posts it.
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Old 17th December 2012, 07:45 AM   #16
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I literally do not understand why so many people are flocking to churches to praise their particular god at this time. I do not get it; I cannot seem to process it. WHY would you praise god at a time like this? Just because it wasn't YOU?
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Old 17th December 2012, 08:07 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Tiktaalik View Post
I literally do not understand why so many people are flocking to churches to praise their particular god at this time. I do not get it; I cannot seem to process it. WHY would you praise god at a time like this? Just because it wasn't YOU?
This is because you believe they are doing this to "praise their God". Could it be they are doing this just for peer support. Would you understand better if they went to a gymnasium?
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Old 17th December 2012, 08:11 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by SatansMaleVoiceChoir View Post
If that pops up in my timeline, I will see to it that I do all I can to physically hurt the person who posts it.
This.

SO this.
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Old 17th December 2012, 08:17 AM   #19
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Originally Posted by SatansMaleVoiceChoir View Post
If that pops up in my timeline, I will see to it that I do all I can to physically hurt the person who posts it.
Originally Posted by Elypsis44 View Post
This.

SO this.
At a bare minimum, such a person needs to be unfriended with extreme prejudice.
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Old 17th December 2012, 08:29 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by aggle-rithm View Post
Trying to make sense of a tragedy in terms of one's own religious beliefs is perfectly understandable. I totally get that. What I don't get is that nonsense about "taking back the schools".

I suppose if they taught Creationism, then the schools would forever have divine protection against crazy people with rifles?

Blech.
Well if Creationists were to succeed in their anti science goals we wouldn't have rifles.
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Old 17th December 2012, 08:42 AM   #21
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This is where skeptics are simply plain morons. Yeah the story is silly. But like it or not most of the world population believe the kids are in a better place.... As does I'm sure, every parent.

Man there are some seriously pathetic people on this board...
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Old 17th December 2012, 09:02 AM   #22
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I heard that one of the mothers, whose daughter was shot multiple times, actually believes her daughter is in heaven. Can you believe how evil this woman is?
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Old 17th December 2012, 09:04 AM   #23
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I think the only good thing we at JREF Forum can do is go do these funerals with signs that read.... "Your kids are being eaten by worms.... that is all" .... it's the only good thing we can do..... those evil awful people who believe their kids may actually live on after death.... pure evil.
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Old 17th December 2012, 09:14 AM   #24
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Yes, the poem is awful, and (as any perusal of the Glurge Gallery on Snopes.com will show) it and its ilk have a rather disturbing undercurrent if you look closely.

But I can't seem to begrudge people who are trying to find some comfort, any comfort, in the face of a tragedy like this, especially given the family-and-children-focused nature of this time of the year. It's what humans do, after all.
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Old 17th December 2012, 09:34 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Caper View Post
I think the only good thing we at JREF Forum can do is go do these funerals with signs that read.... "Your kids are being eaten by worms.... that is all" .... it's the only good thing we can do..... those evil awful people who believe their kids may actually live on after death.... pure evil.
Absolutely incredible extrapolation of what has been said. If the families quietly, on their own choose to believe that their kids are in heaven then so be it, though one wonders how they could possibly buy that myth under the circumstances. What is evil is the selling of a caring, loving god who, if it existed as sold, could have done something to prevent this awful tragedy yet sat by and watched, or even potentially made it happen for some greater 'good'.

Seems it is the god we are sold who is the really evil one!

I am sure many of us 'evil' atheists like me wept at the news. What I and others cannot grasp is the idea that on the one hand we are told there is an omnipotent all loving god and yet this sort of crap happens. Just doesn't add up, and it is fair play to call out those who continue to try to flog that particular dead horse. Why shouldn't we be angry at the purveyors of that particular piffle?
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Old 17th December 2012, 09:43 AM   #26
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I agree with many of the comments here about the OP.

It is of course understandable that religious belief will be a real comfort to (most of) the bereaved families, but I do so hope that the other children (and later on the siblings of the dead children) are not indoctrinated too deeply with the myth of being little angels and having eternity with god etc.
For those who, as they grow older, move towards more rational, scientific views, it will take that much longer to reach the truth.

I listened to the whole of the broadcast last night from the school, where various religious speakers offered thoughts and prayers and President Obama spoke. Some of the speakers were too cloyingly sentimental I think and instead of keeping it simple, went way over the top. I'm sure they were sincere but, oh dear ... ...
There were Moslem and Jewish speakers; I wonder if there might have been someone there who would have liked a non-religious word?
I thought the President struck just the right note in the circumstances.
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Old 17th December 2012, 09:48 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by Dubious Dick View Post
What is evil is the selling of a caring, loving god who, if it existed as sold, could have done something to prevent this awful tragedy yet sat by and watched, or even potentially made it happen for some greater 'good'.
I must have missed that day in Sunday school. (I wasn't in sales though).
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Old 17th December 2012, 09:58 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by Dubious Dick View Post
If the families quietly, on their own choose to believe that their kids are in heaven then so be it, though one wonders how they could possibly buy that myth under the circumstances.
OMG are you going to hate this.... some of the parents are ACTUALLY going public with their belief their children are gone to heaven...... WOWW... WOW... OMG WOW.
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Old 17th December 2012, 10:01 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by Caper View Post
This is where skeptics are simply plain morons. Yeah the story is silly. But like it or not most of the world population believe the kids are in a better place.... As does I'm sure, every parent.

Man there are some seriously pathetic people on this board...
The issue isn't with people turning to their faith to help them with their grief. After all, that's what faith is for. The issue is with complete strangers using this tragedy to promote their faith, in this case via bloody awful poetry.
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Old 17th December 2012, 10:01 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by caper View Post
omg are you going to hate this.... Some of the parents are actually going public with their belief their children are gone to heaven...... Woww... Wow... Omg wow.

I......HATE.....All... caps.

WOWW...WOW...OMG...WOW.

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Old 17th December 2012, 10:05 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by squealpiggy View Post
The issue isn't with people turning to their faith to help them with their grief. After all, that's what faith is for. The issue is with complete strangers using this tragedy to promote their faith, in this case via bloody awful poetry.
De-friend them. No need to advocate violence. This falls into general social tolerance (works both ways, I believe).
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Old 17th December 2012, 10:20 AM   #32
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That one's okay. I preferred this one:

Quote:
Please don`t cry, we're ok
We went on a field trip today
A secret place where there is fun to be had
And the principal's with us so we won`t be bad
It`s full of toys and rainbow slides
Cotton candy and high cloud rides
A funny zoo full of different things
I even saw a man with wings
We're not alone so don`t you fear
We're chaperoned by Jesus here
It`s really nice so I think I`ll stay
And hold your spot till your field trip day
I know Christmas is here and there are toys to be given
So please tell Santa I am in Heaven.
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Old 17th December 2012, 10:22 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by squealpiggy View Post
The issue isn't with people turning to their faith to help them with their grief. After all, that's what faith is for. The issue is with complete strangers using this tragedy to promote their faith, in this case via bloody awful poetry.
People grieve differently. I'm sure who ever wrote that awful poem... or what ever it was.... is as in as much pain as anyone else not directly affected. I don't care..... I find it simply pathetic people get upset over this.

Personally, I have fantasized that I was able to stop the shooter... It helps me cope.

If the only way certain people cope is to imagine these children in the arms of their dead grandparents... or an angel.... or Jesus.... or Mohammad.... the elephant guy with lots of arms or the flying spaghetti monster..... I don't care.
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Old 17th December 2012, 10:23 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by AvalonXQ View Post
That one's okay. I preferred this one:
I like that one.
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Old 17th December 2012, 10:30 AM   #35
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Makes me want to write a rip off of the Raven and happy-time aborted fetuses in heaven.

"Quoth the Jesus, Nevermore"

I'm just having trouble getting the right imagery. Is it OK to say fetuses were "gamboling" or would "skittering" or maybe "slithering" be better?

"And so they came with silent sucking, at His tunic gently plucking; seeking leaking teats and more.
Jesus now is gently holding, and the tunic now unfolding, showing glowing nipples at the fore.
And all the babes now feel no sorrow, filled with milk until the morrow, keening weaning, nevermore."

It goes on, but I'm struggling with a rhyme for umbilicus.
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Old 17th December 2012, 11:02 AM   #36
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High-octane nightmare stuff, marplots. Thanks for the imagery...

ETA: I heard this in curious mixture of Christopher Lee's and Vincent Price's voices.

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Old 17th December 2012, 11:34 AM   #37
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Originally Posted by Caper View Post
I heard that one of the mothers, whose daughter was shot multiple times, actually believes her daughter is in heaven. Can you believe how evil this woman is?
But if she believed that how can she not kill her kids? It is the best thing for them by her own beliefs?

Why is then Andrea Yates so reviled when all she did was improve her kids situation?
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Old 17th December 2012, 11:38 AM   #38
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Originally Posted by Caper View Post
This is where skeptics are simply plain morons. Yeah the story is silly. But like it or not most of the world population believe the kids are in a better place.... As does I'm sure, every parent.

Man there are some seriously pathetic people on this board...
As long as people believe this nonsense they will not work to prevent such things happening. At least, if these foolish people were logical about things.

And. PS. "most of the world population" believe no such thing.
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Old 17th December 2012, 11:41 AM   #39
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Originally Posted by ponderingturtle View Post
But if she believed that how can she not kill her kids? It is the best thing for them by her own beliefs?

Why is then Andrea Yates so reviled when all she did was improve her kids situation?
Can you explain how you came to this conclusion?
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Old 17th December 2012, 12:45 PM   #40
tsig
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Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Can you explain how you came to this conclusion?
If you believe that your children would be better off in heaven with god than suffering here of Earth then the logical thing to do is to kill them, preferably at birth so they can't sin at all.
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