JREF Homepage Swift Blog Events Calendar $1 Million Paranormal Challenge The Amaz!ng Meeting Useful Links Support Us
James Randi Educational Foundation JREF Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   JREF Forum » General Topics » USA Politics
Click Here To Donate

Notices


Welcome to the JREF Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.

Reply
Old 9th February 2013, 02:11 PM   #1
The Central Scrutinizer
Penultimate Amazing
 
The Central Scrutinizer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The White Zone
Posts: 45,686
Ron Paul Calls On UN (Which He Doesn’t Believe In) To Confiscate RonPaul.com

http://gawker.com/5983066/ron-paul-c...ate-ronpaulcom
__________________
If I see somebody with a gun on a plane? I'll kill him.

Lupus is Lupus tor central scrutineezer
The Central Scrutinizer is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 02:16 PM   #2
uke2se
Philosopher
 
uke2se's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 6,655
uke2se is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 02:23 PM   #3
ravdin
Illuminator
 
ravdin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 4,501
That's the thanks that he's giving to his grassroots supporters, now that he doesn't need them any more?

Wow. Just wow.
__________________
Take the risk of thinking for yourself. Much more happiness, truth, beauty, and wisdom will come to you that way. -Christopher Hitchens

Believe what you're told. There would be chaos if everyone thought for themselves. -Top Dog slogan
ravdin is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 02:27 PM   #4
Monketey Ghost
Body of Work
 
Monketey Ghost's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: I'm on your screen!
Posts: 17,334
Well, Libertarianism has always had joke-status with me anyways, like Communism: unworkable with humans who like to live in a society shared by others with different ideas.

Not shocked.
__________________
remembering pillory

SSKCAS, member in long standing
Monketey Ghost is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 02:30 PM   #5
ravdin
Illuminator
 
ravdin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 4,501
I don't know that this says anything about libertarianism, but it definitely confirms that Ron Paul is a joke.
__________________
Take the risk of thinking for yourself. Much more happiness, truth, beauty, and wisdom will come to you that way. -Christopher Hitchens

Believe what you're told. There would be chaos if everyone thought for themselves. -Top Dog slogan
ravdin is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 02:34 PM   #6
Monketey Ghost
Body of Work
 
Monketey Ghost's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: I'm on your screen!
Posts: 17,334
In the sense that libertarians are all about their philosophy except for this bit, and that bit...

But it goes for anyone who espouses a philosophy I suppose.
__________________
remembering pillory

SSKCAS, member in long standing
Monketey Ghost is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 02:43 PM   #7
ravdin
Illuminator
 
ravdin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Francisco, CA
Posts: 4,501
When any philosophy starts to be defined by a particular person (or group of people), then yes, this is exactly the sort of thing we should expect to happen. Political movements tend to become cultlike when they are less centered on ideas than the politicians who supposedly espouse them.

Oh well. I never cared much for Ron Paul anyhow.
__________________
Take the risk of thinking for yourself. Much more happiness, truth, beauty, and wisdom will come to you that way. -Christopher Hitchens

Believe what you're told. There would be chaos if everyone thought for themselves. -Top Dog slogan
ravdin is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 02:51 PM   #8
NWO Sentryman
Proud NWO Gatekeeper
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Quantum Gate to the NWO
Posts: 5,059
I can smell the rank hypocrisy from here.

If this doesn't get people realising that Ron Paul was a Demagogue, then nothing will.
__________________
If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you? - FireGarden on the Middle East
NWO Sentryman is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 05:28 PM   #9
Alareth
Expert Expertologist
 
Alareth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Florida
Posts: 7,417
I'm suffering from and unhealthy level of schadenfreude right now ...
__________________
Pixelated Reality | Alareth Does Art!

Light travels faster than sound, which is why some people appear bright, until you hear them speak
Alareth is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 05:34 PM   #10
Lisa Simpson
Evil Minion
Administrator
 
Lisa Simpson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: 123 Fake Street
Posts: 21,529
Originally Posted by Alareth View Post
I'm suffering from and unhealthy level of schadenfreude right now ...
Me too.
__________________
That's what the Internet does -- you get a free bonus prize of Stupid Lies with every box of Delicious Facts. - cracked.com

Facts are satanic litter on the heavenly highway to blind faith! - Betty Bowers
Lisa Simpson is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 07:00 PM   #11
tyr_13
Penultimate Amazing
 
tyr_13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Falconer, NY
Posts: 11,327
Remember that even if he owns it and it's in his name though, he still has nothing to do with it or anything it says.
__________________
Circled nothing is still nothing.
"Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel
Mumpsimus: a stubborn person who insists on making an error in spite of being shown that it is wrong
tyr_13 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 07:07 PM   #12
dudalb
Penultimate Amazing
 
dudalb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 24,631
Originally Posted by Monketey Ghost View Post
Well, Libertarianism has always had joke-status with me anyways, like Communism: unworkable with humans who like to live in a society shared by others with different ideas.

Not shocked.
Quoted for Truth. Both Communism and Libertarianism are based upon a total disregard for what human nature is like.

And the signs are that the great tradition of Ron Paul will be carried on by his son.....

Last edited by dudalb; 9th February 2013 at 07:08 PM.
dudalb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 08:16 PM   #13
KoihimeNakamura
Creativity Murderer
 
KoihimeNakamura's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: In 2.5 million spinning tons of metal, above Epsilion Eridani III
Posts: 7,653
Bwahahahahahahaha.

Man, that's AWESOME.
__________________
Don't mind me.
KoihimeNakamura is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 08:54 PM   #14
theprestige
Penultimate Amazing
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 11,027
I believe monarchy is a bankrupt institution. I would be ruled by a representative democracy.

Unfortunately, I find that I am ruled by a king. Very well, then: I will campaign tirelessly to replace the king with an elected government.

But meanwhile, charlatans operating under the governance of the king, are depriving me of what is rightfully mine--even the king's law should recognize this.

So, having no other recourse, I will appeal to the king to apply his own law, and give me the king's justice--such as it is--in this matter. Until the day that I am ruled by an elected government, I must make do as best I can, with the government I have.

I don't think Ron Paul disbelieves that the UN exists, nor that he disbelieves it exercises authority over some things. Rather, I think he believes that it should not exist, or at least should not have the authority it currently has. But until that day, he must appeal to the powers that be, not the powers he believes should be.

All that aside, it's still pretty dickish behavior on his part.
theprestige is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 9th February 2013, 09:06 PM   #15
tyr_13
Penultimate Amazing
 
tyr_13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Falconer, NY
Posts: 11,327
Originally Posted by theprestige View Post
I believe monarchy is a bankrupt institution. I would be ruled by a representative democracy.

Unfortunately, I find that I am ruled by a king. Very well, then: I will campaign tirelessly to replace the king with an elected government.

But meanwhile, charlatans operating under the governance of the king, are depriving me of what is rightfully mine--even the king's law should recognize this.

So, having no other recourse, I will appeal to the king to apply his own law, and give me the king's justice--such as it is--in this matter. Until the day that I am ruled by an elected government, I must make do as best I can, with the government I have.

I don't think Ron Paul disbelieves that the UN exists, nor that he disbelieves it exercises authority over some things. Rather, I think he believes that it should not exist, or at least should not have the authority it currently has. But until that day, he must appeal to the powers that be, not the powers he believes should be.

All that aside, it's still pretty dickish behavior on his part.
This would make sense if the recourse his own ideology dictates to be the correct one were not available or would put him at a competitive disadvantage. That's not the case. It's also the case that he doesn't need to acquire the site name and resources at all, which would also be consistent with his ideology.

He's chosen of his own volition to take a course which is inconsistent with his political positions even though courses which are consistent are not only available, but competitive.
__________________
Circled nothing is still nothing.
"Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel
Mumpsimus: a stubborn person who insists on making an error in spite of being shown that it is wrong
tyr_13 is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th February 2013, 01:39 AM   #16
Nihilianth
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,241
Do libertarians believe that they have intellectual property rights to their own names? If so, then this is not exactly inconsistent with his libertarian beliefs that he should "own" ronpaul.com.

However, appealing to the UN does not make any sense, especially if he doesn't believe it should exist. The "kings law" example given above would work, if the owners were not also Americans.

Considering that Ron Paul and the owners of ronpaul.com are both Americans, Ron Paul should be appealing to the U.S for his property rights, under American law. Not the UN, as this is not their jurisdiction.
__________________
Lowpro: Food is also a little more important than guns; you can't eat a gun.

(\ (\
( '_' )
o_(")(")
Nihilianth is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th February 2013, 04:58 AM   #17
SomedayGirl
Muse
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 548
The UN angle is a side hahaha. theprestige's "king's law" example follows but the juxtaposition of Paul appealing to his hated UN creates interesting optics to say the least.

The bigger issue is what tyr_13 points out - the owners of ronpaul dotcom have been running that site for several years. There's no way that thru the course of not one but two presidential campaigns, as well as three congressional runs, he was unaware that it existed. The owners have invested their money, time and expertise building the domain into a valuable property and instead of adhering to the free market principles he espouses and negotiating a fair market value to purchase that property, he's gone whining to an international bureaucracy to confiscate it for him.

Hypocrite.
__________________
I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do to their fellows, because it always coincides with their own desires.

--Susan B. Anthony
SomedayGirl is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 10th February 2013, 05:40 AM   #18
remirol
Senior Wrangler
 
remirol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Etlanna, Jawja
Posts: 8,100
Originally Posted by Monketey Ghost View Post
In the sense that libertarians are all about their philosophy except for this bit, and that bit....
That's odd. I always thought Libertarianism was about "I'm gonna get as much of mine as the law allows, and **** you." Which makes both ronpaul.com and Paul excellent Libertarians, as well as showing a perfect example of why there are no libertopian governments right now; nobody can agree on which "you" is going to get ******.

ETA: Oh, also, WRT the article:

__________________
Roguelike player? Info: http://sporkhack.com -- Public server: telnet://sporkhack.com
--
The church is near but the road is icy; the bar is far away but I will walk carefully. -- old Russian proverb

Last edited by remirol; 10th February 2013 at 05:41 AM.
remirol is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th February 2013, 09:02 PM   #19
Morrigan
Crone of War
 
Morrigan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 8,019
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


That is awesome. The best thing that would happen now, would be that the Ronpaul.com get alienated by Ron Paul and turn the site into an anti-Ron Paul site. One can only hope.

Edit: LMAO, that just might happen after all. A comment wrote:
Quote:
It’s hard to take you serious when the right side of my screen is plastered with merchandise you are using Ron Paul’s name to profit off.
The reply was:
Quote:
We were trying to achieve Ron Paul’s dream of making a living while supporting the cause of liberty. We failed. Rest assured that the merchandise will be gone shortly not just from our site but also from our lives. We will tear our bumper stickers off our cars, we will burn our hoodies and t-shirts and we will smash our mugs into a thousand pieces.
__________________
curi0us Many kids grow up in environments where if the worse thing they had to deal with was a pervy gym teacher wanting to **** them they would considere themselves to be privileged and living the good life.
bigred homophobes are not nearly as widespread or common as the oh-woe-are-the-poor-oppressed-gays whiners would have you believe.

Last edited by Morrigan; 12th February 2013 at 09:11 PM.
Morrigan is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th February 2013, 09:54 PM   #20
Sceptic-PK
Master Poster
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,919
Outstanding.
Sceptic-PK is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 12th February 2013, 11:32 PM   #21
Babbylonian
Philosopher
 
Babbylonian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Lake Oswego, OR
Posts: 5,389
Originally Posted by Nihilianth View Post
Do libertarians believe that they have intellectual property rights to their own names? If so, then this is not exactly inconsistent with his libertarian beliefs that he should "own" ronpaul.com.
Look at the very first sentence of the article:
Quote:
In 2008, a group of Ron Paul supporters founded RonPaul.com...
In other words, the address was clearly available at a point (or multiple points) long after it would have been an obvious move by Ron Paul to register it for himself. In fact, given the amount of self promotion he's engaged in over the years - even before the WWW was a force - he and his people must have consciously decided not to register those addresses.

No, he let the people running the site promote him and his ideas at no cost to him or his campaign(s), and when he was no longer going to run for office again he decided to lay claim to the address and pay the people who've worked hard on it for him nothing for their trouble.

If I owned the address(es), I'd find some thus-far-anonymous schlub also named Ron Paul (there must be a few of them), and hand them over to him while giving Pseudolibertarian Ron Paul the finger.

ETA: I'd be very surprised if his request went anywhere considering that one of the offers made to him was beyond fair - giving him ronpaul.org free of charge.
__________________
Where am I going to find a piece of metal? Here...in space...at this hour?

Last edited by Babbylonian; 12th February 2013 at 11:37 PM.
Babbylonian is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th February 2013, 10:29 AM   #22
TubbaBlubba
Knave of the Dudes
 
TubbaBlubba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Communist Kingdom of Sweden
Posts: 8,324
Originally Posted by Babbylonian View Post
No, he let the people running the site promote him and his ideas at no cost to him or his campaign(s), and when he was no longer going to run for office again he decided to lay claim to the address and pay the people who've worked hard on it for him nothing for their trouble.
Ron Paul being dishonest, having ulterior motives or using other people for his personal benefit?

Surely you jest!
__________________
There are two kinds of fact - the trivially true, and the technically correct.
TubbaBlubba is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th February 2013, 06:27 PM   #23
kellyb
Philosopher
 
kellyb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Tennessee. Ain't you jealous?
Posts: 5,457
This really is the best quote evar.

Quote:
RonPaul.com
February 12, 2013 at 5:26 pm | Permalink


We were trying to achieve Ron Paul’s dream of making a living while supporting the cause of liberty. We failed. Rest assured that the merchandise will be gone shortly not just from our site but also from our lives. We will tear our bumper stickers off our cars, we will burn our hoodies and t-shirts and we will smash our mugs into a thousand pieces.
http://www.ronpaul.com/2013-02-08/ro...s-ronpaul-com/
__________________
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts ~ Bertrand Russell
kellyb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 13th February 2013, 09:59 PM   #24
Checkmite
Skepticifimisticalationist
 
Checkmite's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Third in line
Posts: 17,240
Originally Posted by kellyb View Post
This really is the best quote evar.


http://www.ronpaul.com/2013-02-08/ro...s-ronpaul-com/
As of this post, all references to the "Ron Paul vs. RonPaul.com" matter seem to have been removed from RonPaul.com, including this article/blog entry and its comments.
__________________
"¿WHAT KIND OF BIRD?
¿A PARANORMAL BIRD?"
--- Carlos S., 2002
Checkmite is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 14th February 2013, 10:12 AM   #25
Donal
Master Poster
 
Donal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: NYC
Posts: 2,282
Quote:
we will burn our hoodies and t-shirts
I hope they remember to take them off first.

Honestly, I think this is where they have a problem. If they are in fact turning a profit, he has a case (not before the UN, mind you, but he can sue in US court). If they can prove all their money covers operating expenses or to RP's campaign, he's got nothing.

Of course, RP is still a hypocrite. They offered to sell it to him and he also could have sued them in a US court. Instead, he went right to the UN.
Donal is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 14th February 2013, 12:01 PM   #26
Ziggurat
Penultimate Amazing
 
Ziggurat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 28,040
Not directly relevant to this particular episode, but it's still my favorite Ron Paul-themed link:
YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the JREF. The JREF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE

"I'll haunt your prostate!"
__________________
"As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law
Ziggurat is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 14th February 2013, 12:04 PM   #27
TubbaBlubba
Knave of the Dudes
 
TubbaBlubba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Communist Kingdom of Sweden
Posts: 8,324
Originally Posted by Ziggurat View Post
Not directly relevant to this particular episode, but it's still my favorite Ron Paul-themed link:
YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the JREF. The JREF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I AGREE

"I'll haunt your prostate!"
"I'll ride the lightning! It happened to my kitty, and Elvis was part of it!"

Sounds like an authentic RP quote to me.
__________________
There are two kinds of fact - the trivially true, and the technically correct.
TubbaBlubba is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 14th February 2013, 01:26 PM   #28
kellyb
Philosopher
 
kellyb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Tennessee. Ain't you jealous?
Posts: 5,457
Originally Posted by Checkmite View Post
As of this post, all references to the "Ron Paul vs. RonPaul.com" matter seem to have been removed from RonPaul.com, including this article/blog entry and its comments.
How unfortunate.

__________________
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts ~ Bertrand Russell
kellyb is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 14th February 2013, 02:40 PM   #29
fuelair
Cythraul Enfys
 
fuelair's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 33,532
Originally Posted by The Central Scrutinizer View Post
What a maroon!!!
__________________
There is no problem so great that it cannot be fixed by small explosives carefully placed.

Wash this space!

We fight for the Lady Babylon!!!
fuelair is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

JREF Forum » General Topics » USA Politics

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:29 AM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 2001-2013, James Randi Educational Foundation. All Rights Reserved.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.